OFFICIAL BRETT THE LIVING LEGEND THREAD

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Originally Posted by gex

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Originally Posted by Bretsky

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Originally Posted by Fritz

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Originally Posted by Partial

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Originally Posted by Fritz

What amazes me, I guess, is that now that the season is over and the dust has settled, some people - like Jason Whitlock - are still saying the Pack made a mistake in not keeping Favre.

I can't see that reasoning, not at all. Favre played on what was supposedly a more talented team, yet had, statistically, a much lousier season than Aaron Rodgers, who had a darn good season.

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More talented? Our team was extremely talented. I don't buy that for a second.

The four year look is eye opening to be sure, but I'm not sure how much I buy it. This year he is obviously hurt. 2005 was bad all around. the 2007 could show a bad trend, but he played lights out against Seattle so that sort of bucks that.

2006, the 8-8 year seems like an anomaly.

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Faneca, Jenkins, Woody. The Jets did what so many posters here bitch about TT not doing - bring in the free agents! Spend! Ted won't do what it takes!

So the Jets spent, spent, spent. They got the big names.

And they got the QB so many people wanted to have here in GB again.

And they collapsed. They now have an old, cap-heavy team with a fired coach. I think the Packers' future is brighter now than the Jets'. The Jets went for it all in one year. They mortgaged the future for a shot, and they didn't even make the playoffs.

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Favre aside, the Jets improved at several positions and improved by five wins. Faneca..........love to have him in GB........Woody........I'd take him.......Jenkins........I'd take him.

How much better do you think the Packers would have done with those three players ?

Their best FA is young enough to have several more solid years. They gave up a late 3rd round pick for Favre. I don't agree they mortgaged their future.

They gave it a shot, and their improvement was obvious.

None of those guys are busts and I doubt they regret any of the signings.

They may regret the Favre deal........but it cost them a late 3rd round pick so I don't think they lost much.

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100

HAPPY NEW YEAR!!!!!

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Originally Posted by Bretsky

They gave it a shot, and their improvement was obvious.

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I don't disagree with much that you posted, but was it obvious? For the last several seasons, the Jets have been a 10-6 team when Pennington was healthy and the opposite when he wasn't. Did they really improve that much or was it just that they didn't have to start the likes of Kellen Clemens at QB?

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Originally Posted by HarveyWallbangers

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Originally Posted by Bretsky

They gave it a shot, and their improvement was obvious.

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I don't disagree with much that you posted, but was it obvious? For the last several seasons, the Jets have been a 10-6 team when Pennington was healthy and the opposite when he wasn't. Did they really improve that much or was it just that they didn't have to start the likes of Kellen Clemens at QB?

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The running game appeared to be greatly improved with the addition of the two free agents. Thomas Jones was junk with the Cardinals, was alright with the Bears, and my NY fantasy squad thanks him this year for being one of the top backs in the NFL this year.

If this team had top games from the QB on a somewhat consistent basis I think they'd be a threat

I give Favre a lot of credit for playing this season with the JEts. There were no guarantees, the team was 4-12 last year, big media pressure. It was a real risk and challenge, Favre went for it just for the love of the game. Winning 9 games ain't bad.

I simply won't buy that Favre played with a "bicep tear" like we've seen with packer defensive linemen. Those injuries are killers, you lose all strength and use of your arm, they are unbelievably painful. Favre had an injury all season, and he was still winging the ball hard. When you get a "pulled muscle" or "sprain", that is actually a tearing of the muscle tissue. (And that's why a strained back, say, often starts hurting a day or two after you strain it, the nerves get inflamed when the torn fibers try to reconnect.)

enough dubious medical information.

Well, one more theory. Favre was throwing the ball this season just as hard as he did as a young man. That must put a hell of a lot of strain on his arm.

If there is/was a tear, I think it happened in the last game, after one of those INT's, when Brett tried to reach out and make the tackle, that looked brutal..........before that.......who knows.

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Originally Posted by digitaldean

Hey, now the New Yorkers will know what it's like to go through that soap opera!

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THe big difference being that the NY papers won't kiss Favre's ass like the Milwaukee Urinal-Garbage and the GB snot rags did.

Yeah , Like this. Turns out not everyone is a Favre Fan!




By BRIAN COSTELLO
NEVER MIND: Forget all the Bill Cowher-to-the-Jets talk: The jut-jawed former Steeler coach last night removed his name from contention to succeed Eric Mangini, leaving Gang Green with no clear favorite.
Last updated: 7:17 am
December 31, 2008
Posted: 7:10 am
December 31, 2008

There will be no Cowher Power for the Jets.

Bill Cowher informed the team last night he is not interested in their head-coaching job, and it could be because he doesn't want to coach Brett Favre.

The former Steeler coach was the clear-cut favorite to replace Eric Mangini among Jets fans, and the team's ownership. Now, Woody Johnson must move on to Plan B.

Talks between the Jets and Cowher never advanced past the preliminary stage. The Jets hoped to interview him for the job sometime later this week, but late last night the team released a statement that Cowher had rebuffed their overtures.

"After reaching out to Coach Cowher's representatives, we were informed tonight that he is not a candidate for the position," Jet spokesman Bruce Speight said in an e-mail.

While the Jets hoped to woo Cowher with a boatload of money, the marriage appeared to be unlikely from the outset. Sources close to Cowher said he did not want to have Favre as his quarterback, and that he also wanted to bring in people he was familiar with to handle personnel.

A source familiar with Cowher's thinking said before last night's decision came down that the former Steeler boss would have to receive assurances from the Jets that the 39-year-old Favre no longer was in the picture before agreeing to take control.

"There's no way he's taking Brett Favre as his quarterback," said one person close to Cowher.

Favre was not the only hurdle in the Jets' way. A team source said discussions never got to the point of the team's front-office structure, but indications are that Cowher would have wanted more control over personnel decisions than Mangini had, or at least someone he was familiar with in charge of the personnel.

Johnson decided to keep general manager Mike Tannenbaum when he fired Mangini on Monday. The owner also emphasized he does not want one person doing both the coach and GM jobs.

An ESPN report early yesterday said Cowher was not interested in the Jet job because he wanted full personnel control, but a team source said he never told the team that.

There was talk of Tannenbaum scaling back his duties in order to appease Cowher, but discussions never got that far.

Cowher has not commented publicly on his plans for 2009, but the Jets are the second team he turned down before even getting an offer. He also told the Browns that he was not interested in their head-coaching position.

The 51-year-old Cowher told friends he does not plan on returning to coaching until 2010. He recently extended his contract as a studio analyst with CBS.

With Cowher out of the picture, the coaching search has no favorite. The team is scheduled to interview Giant defensive coordinator Steve Spagnuolo on Saturday. The Jets also have reached out to veteran coach Marty Schottenheimer, but no interview has been scheduled.

An interesting wild card that was added to the mix yesterday is Mike Shanahan. The Broncos fired the two-time Super Bowl winner, and he may now jump onto the Jets' short list.

Spagnuolo is the darling assistant coach of the NFL right now. Jet fans might revolt at the thought of another unproven assistant taking over their team after the failure of Mangini. But Spagnuolo is known to area fans, and his attacking style on defense probably would excite them.

Schottenheimer is an intriguing candidate. The 65-year-old is a big name with a proven track record who would not come to the Jets with a list of demands. His son, Brian, is the team's offensive coordinator, which would provide continuity and give Marty familiarity with the team.

Marty Schottenheimer would be the second person in his family to interview for the job. In-house candidates Brian and offensive line coach Bill Callahan have both interviewed for the job, but neither is seen as having a strong chance.

brian.costello@nypost.com

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Originally Posted by sheepshead

Yeah , Like this. Turns out not everyone is a Favre Fan!




By BRIAN COSTELLO
NEVER MIND: Forget all the Bill Cowher-to-the-Jets talk: The jut-jawed former Steeler coach last night removed his name from contention to succeed Eric Mangini, leaving Gang Green with no clear favorite.
Last updated: 7:17 am
December 31, 2008
Posted: 7:10 am
December 31, 2008

There will be no Cowher Power for the Jets.

Bill Cowher informed the team last night he is not interested in their head-coaching job, and it could be because he doesn't want to coach Brett Favre.

The former Steeler coach was the clear-cut favorite to replace Eric Mangini among Jets fans, and the team's ownership. Now, Woody Johnson must move on to Plan B.

Talks between the Jets and Cowher never advanced past the preliminary stage. The Jets hoped to interview him for the job sometime later this week, but late last night the team released a statement that Cowher had rebuffed their overtures.

"After reaching out to Coach Cowher's representatives, we were informed tonight that he is not a candidate for the position," Jet spokesman Bruce Speight said in an e-mail.

While the Jets hoped to woo Cowher with a boatload of money, the marriage appeared to be unlikely from the outset. Sources close to Cowher said he did not want to have Favre as his quarterback, and that he also wanted to bring in people he was familiar with to handle personnel.

A source familiar with Cowher's thinking said before last night's decision came down that the former Steeler boss would have to receive assurances from the Jets that the 39-year-old Favre no longer was in the picture before agreeing to take control.

"There's no way he's taking Brett Favre as his quarterback," said one person close to Cowher.

Favre was not the only hurdle in the Jets' way. A team source said discussions never got to the point of the team's front-office structure, but indications are that Cowher would have wanted more control over personnel decisions than Mangini had, or at least someone he was familiar with in charge of the personnel.

Johnson decided to keep general manager Mike Tannenbaum when he fired Mangini on Monday. The owner also emphasized he does not want one person doing both the coach and GM jobs.

An ESPN report early yesterday said Cowher was not interested in the Jet job because he wanted full personnel control, but a team source said he never told the team that.

There was talk of Tannenbaum scaling back his duties in order to appease Cowher, but discussions never got that far.

Cowher has not commented publicly on his plans for 2009, but the Jets are the second team he turned down before even getting an offer. He also told the Browns that he was not interested in their head-coaching position.

The 51-year-old Cowher told friends he does not plan on returning to coaching until 2010. He recently extended his contract as a studio analyst with CBS.

With Cowher out of the picture, the coaching search has no favorite. The team is scheduled to interview Giant defensive coordinator Steve Spagnuolo on Saturday. The Jets also have reached out to veteran coach Marty Schottenheimer, but no interview has been scheduled.

An interesting wild card that was added to the mix yesterday is Mike Shanahan. The Broncos fired the two-time Super Bowl winner, and he may now jump onto the Jets' short list.

Spagnuolo is the darling assistant coach of the NFL right now. Jet fans might revolt at the thought of another unproven assistant taking over their team after the failure of Mangini. But Spagnuolo is known to area fans, and his attacking style on defense probably would excite them.

Schottenheimer is an intriguing candidate. The 65-year-old is a big name with a proven track record who would not come to the Jets with a list of demands. His son, Brian, is the team's offensive coordinator, which would provide continuity and give Marty familiarity with the team.

Marty Schottenheimer would be the second person in his family to interview for the job. In-house candidates Brian and offensive line coach Bill Callahan have both interviewed for the job, but neither is seen as having a strong chance.

brian.costello@nypost.com

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WOW!!!
THe reputation of a once great QB takes another hit. Why , why why didnt he just stay retired!!!

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Originally Posted by packinpatland

If there is/was a tear, I think it happened in the last game, after one of those INT's, when Brett tried to reach out and make the tackle, that looked brutal..........before that.......who knows.

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I don't know about that PIP. There is a poster somewhere on this board (not me, this isn't an arm breaking pat on the back) who mentioned earlier this year that in a couple games it seemed like Favre did not have his usual arm strength and his motion had changed. It doesn't mean a ton, as everyone speculates about a QBs arm whenever they struggle, but it was an observation made before the Jets and Favre fell off the wagon. And there were earlier reports that he had done something to his arm or shoulder.

The only odd thing is why wait until after the season to diagnose with an MRI? Even if you bury the injury info and tell the public he is probable - ear lobe, at least you know how to treat the player. Its weird timing unless they are now confirming what was already known to them.

I noticed Favre's diminished arm strength early in the year. I chalked up to age or the fact he wasn't committed in the offseason.

I don't know about Cowher not wanting to coach Brett. On the NFL Network yesterday it was reported that Cowher only talked to the Jets out of respect for the organization and that Cowher is not interested in any HC job openings right now.

No, Bretsky, et al, I do think the Jets have mortgaged their future.

The following link reveals that as of around Dec. 20th, the Jets have just under 2 million in cap space: http://www.nyjetscap.com/salary.html.

Favre of course has a monster contract should he come back - 13 million next year. Faneca (one of those FA's you all like) will be at 8 mill, Woody at 6.5, and Jenkins at 6.4.

Of course, the sal cap will go up, but how much is unclear. Certainly the Jets will be constrained. In addition, all the above FA's are long in the tooth, so young players are not able to develop as these oldsters played their way to a 9-7 season. On top of that, the coach is fired. Sure, a new coach could conceivably come in and turn it around just like that, but the Baltimores of the world are still rarer than the San Frans.

Finally, the Jets now are in the process of hiring that new coach while not knowing who the QB will be. If it's Favre, then the pattern of the past five years indicates you can count on a great first half and a terrible second half. Okay. And if Favre doesn't come back, or he's not your QB, you're looking at Kellen Clements or some rookie or some hack who gets cut from some other team. Or maybe you trade some more draft picks for a young guy.

So, in sum: you face a full cap on a roster peppered with aging, expensive vets. This is headed by a 39 year old QB who is about to put you through his annual offseason retirement or not retirement extravaganza. You don't have a head coach. You aren't developing many young players. You're missing a third round pick.

I'd say they mortgaged their future. Yep.

How ironic would it be if Favre played for Shanny?

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Originally Posted by Pugger

I don't know about Cowher not wanting to coach Brett. On the NFL Network yesterday it was reported that Cowher only talked to the Jets out of respect for the organization and that Cowher is not interested in any HC job openings right now.

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This seems more in keeping with the way Cowher is....pretty classy guy. I can't imagine any coach saying they don't want the job because of a certain player.......that's media crap.

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Originally Posted by packinpatland

This seems more in keeping with the way Cowher is....pretty classy guy. I can't imagine any coach saying they don't want the job because of a certain player.......that's media crap.

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I have no idea if he feels this way, but would it be that shocking? He wouldn't say it publicly, but I'm sure this happens. There are coaches that have stayed away from a team because of the QB situation. It's possible that a coach doesn't want one year of Favre (and his late season struggles) and then the prospect of having to go find a good QB to replace him a year down the line.

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Originally Posted by imscott72

How ironic would it be if Favre played for Shanny?

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Are we sure Shenanigans will be coaching anywhere next year? Unless I'm misunderstanding his contract situation, Shanahan will get paid $20 million to sit at home and do nothing for the next three years (or work in TV, etc.).

It would be the rare coaching job that would convince me to give up on that, assuming I'm in his boots.

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Originally Posted by Lurker64

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Originally Posted by imscott72

How ironic would it be if Favre played for Shanny?

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Are we sure Shenanigans will be coaching anywhere next year? Unless I'm misunderstanding his contract situation, Shanahan will get paid $20 million to sit at home and do nothing for the next three years (or work in TV, etc.).

It would be the rare coaching job that would convince me to give up on that, assuming I'm in his boots.

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I hate the Broncos for obvious reasons, but I think Shanny is a great coach and will be in high demand, especially if Cowher doesn't want to coach anywhere next year. I'm surprised Jerry Jones doesn't give him a call and boot Philips.

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Originally Posted by Lurker64

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Originally Posted by imscott72

How ironic would it be if Favre played for Shanny?

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Are we sure Shenanigans will be coaching anywhere next year? Unless I'm misunderstanding his contract situation, Shanahan will get paid $20 million to sit at home and do nothing for the next three years (or work in TV, etc.).

It would be the rare coaching job that would convince me to give up on that, assuming I'm in his boots.

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Just saw his last Broncos PC today on the local news. It sounded like he was planning on looking for another gig.

Apparently Favre was not popular in the Jets locker room. Several (anonymous) veterans apparently don't want him back.

If the sentiment in the article is at all accurate, the Jets would probably be better off starting the Kellen Clemens era in 2009.

I find something disturbing....as well as funny. Two months ago the people that were posting about Favre were criticized and ridiculed. Even when the Favre thread was created, there were those that were critical of that. Just wondering why, after Favre under performed at the end of the season it's all OK for everyone to post Favre info and to an extent ridicule him? 6-7 pages since the last game. You all wonder why people referred to you as "Favre haters"? Well, seems you never wanted to discuss him during this season until he was not doing well. SAD!

I wish Favre had stayed retired. But when he proclaimed he still wanted to play there was NO WAY I was not going to support him. I supported him as a Jet.

I guess I'm just sad that people are so eager to dog on him, hate him after everything he did for the Packer organization. Least you can do is show some respect. I have a feeling some of you have no idea what that means.