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Thread: Carl Eller shrugs off taser 4 times in arrest

  1. #1

    Carl Eller shrugs off taser 4 times in arrest

    http://www.twincities.com/allheadlines/ci_8869779

    Trouble returns to Carl Eller
    Police say Vikings great assaulted cops after chase
    By Mara H. Gottfried
    mgottfried@pioneerpress.com
    Article Last Updated: 04/10/2008 12:30:32 AM CDT

    Two Minneapolis police officers found themselves "in the fight of their lives" Wednesday against a man who fled from them, hit them and threw one on a car. They didn't realize at first that the man was Minnesota Vikings legend Carl Eller, and they were "crushed" when they found out.

    Police Inspector Mike Martin said Eller sped through a stop sign in his neighborhood near Theodore Wirth Park, led police on a chase that reached more than 60 mph and assaulted officers when they tried to arrest him.

    Officers smelled alcohol on Eller's breath, but they won't know how much he was drinking because Eller refused to take breath or blood tests, Martin said.

    Police used Tasers on Eller four times and put him in a neck hold to restrain him.

    He was arrested on suspicion of fourth-degree assault, fleeing police in a motor vehicle and refusing to take an alcohol test. He was being held Wednesday in the Hennepin County Jail and hadn't been charged.

    Officers Gil Antaya and Seth Porras were treated at Hennepin County Medical Center for minor injuries suffered in the scuffle and released.

    The officers, who are in their 20s, "are not small" — Antaya is about 6 feet tall and 200 pounds; Porras is about 6 feet 2 inches tall and 230 pounds — but they described Eller as "being extremely strong," Martin said.

    Eller, 66, is about 6 feet 6 and 270 pounds. He played 16 seasons in the NFL, including the first 15 with the Vikings from 1964-78 as a member of the famed Purple People Eaters defensive line.
    Eller, who was inducted into the Pro Football Hall of Fame in 2004, has said he began drinking alcohol when he was in high school and, by the time he left football, he was abusing other substances, including cocaine.

    Eller sought treatment, helped set up the NFL's first drug program and worked for the state of Minnesota to counsel young people about substance abuse. In 2006, he pleaded guilty to driving while impaired after he was arrested for

    driving 97 mph in a 55 mph zone.
    Police hope Wednesday's incident will lead Eller to "get the help he apparently needs," Martin said.

    Martin gave this account of the confrontation:

    Antaya, a Minneapolis officer for about six years, and Porras, an officer for just under one year, spotted a silver Mercedes SUV speed through a stop sign at Eighth and Russell avenues north at 12:57 a.m.

    The SUV appeared to swerve toward the squad car, and officers believed the driver was trying to hit them.

    The officers gave chase. Eller fled for about a half-mile to his home in the 1000 block of Washburn Avenue North.

    Police ordered him to get out of the vehicle, but Eller drove into his garage, got out and tried to enter his home. He screamed at the officers to get out of his garage and threatened to assault and kill them.

    Eller struck the two officers several times. He threw one of them onto the hood of his SUV.

    One tried to use a Taser on Eller, but he ripped the prongs out of the device. An officer who arrived as backup used his Taser three times. It had little or no effect.

    When officers called for backup, Eller could be heard screaming as the police shouted, "We need help here," Martin said.

    The officers restrained Eller in a neck hold until backup arrived.

    The incident lasted four or five minutes.

    Martin said that when investigators questioned him, Eller didn't ask for a lawyer, had "selective memory of what occurred" and denied "any of the events that led up to this."

    The Hennepin County Attorney's Office has until noon today to charge Eller or release him.

    The assault and fleeing police offenses are felonies, while the test refusal is a gross misdemeanor. Under Minnesota law, Eller is subject to having his driver's license revoked for a year for refusing to take the test.

    On March 20, 2006, when Eller pleaded guilty to fourth-degree DWI, he was put on probation for two years, fined $1,000 and ordered to complete five years of community service.

    People fleeing police and fighting with officers "isn't necessarily unusual," Martin said, but they tend to be younger than Eller. "He's old enough to know better," he said.

    The Vikings had no official reaction.

    Eller spent more than an hour Tuesday afternoon at a gate at Minneapolis-St. Paul International Airport, where Northwest Airlines kicked off its new nonstop service from the Twin Cities to Paris. Northwest dressed up the gate for the launch and held a news conference before the first departure.

    Eller, wearing a purple sports coat, chatted with waiting passengers and posed for photos with several people. It's unclear whether he had been invited to the launch or just stopped by.

    Rhoda Fukushima, Don Seeholzer and John Welbes contributed to this report. Mara H. Gottfried can be reached
    more freedom, less government. Go Sarah!

  2. #2
    This just in... Carl Eller will be introduced as the Bengals new DT tomorrow afternoon.

    This is obviously sad and disturbing, but at some level you have to a little impressed. He might be 66, but his wallet still says "Bad Motherfucker" on it.
    #14

  3. #3
    Talk about going in opposite directions, his fellow member of the Purple Gang, Allan Page, was what? Chief Justice of the state supreme court?

  4. #4
    Fried Rat HOFer KYPack's Avatar
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    Big Carl.

    Still a stone badass after all these years.

    Hammered or not, I wudda said, "Now you better be on your way, Mr Eller".

    He's been driving around all fucked up for years, He wouldn't have hit anybody.

    And you finish your shift without all them knots on your head.

    (Did he get that snazzy lookin' orange gettup in the can, or did he go out like that?)

  5. #5
    Senior Rat HOFer oregonpackfan's Avatar
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    A very sad story. It appeared that Eller, at one point, was turning his life around after seeking treatment and even acting as a counselor.

    Hopefully, he can get back into treatment and get his life back on track.

  6. #6
    ya, sad and stuff...but holy geez, how the heck did he withstand 4 tasers? Did they get landed properly? Was he wearing a rubber suit or something?

    Those things are supposed to scramble your neurons to the point that your muscles don't respond to commands from your brain. One properly applied should work unless the guy's not some pretty resistant skin!
    --
    Imagine for a moment a world without hypothetical situations...

    "He was mocked in the third, but after the combine they'll mock him into the first, for sure." - Fritz

  7. #7
    Listen, NO ONE just shakes off a taser. If both probes struck him (and stayed in) he would have had the most electrifying 5 seconds of his life. Now, it is possible to pull out the probes after the 5 seconds or resist if one of the probes didn't connect correctly. Also, the cops could have been "drive stunning" him. Which means they just pressed the taser against him and gave him 1 or 2 second bursts. But if you have been tased, or know anything about tasers and how they work, you would know that a correct tase with probe deployment locks up every muscle in your body. You're not shaking that shit off for the 5 seconds you're lit up.

  8. #8
    ya, kind of along the lines I was thinking gbpackfan. They likely realized he was an old man and despite his size, were trying to just give him a little shot.

    Anyways, that's OT. Too bad for him - her was certainly a great player - and has tried to help others. I hope someone extends a hand to him and he gets the help he needsto straighten out from this.
    --
    Imagine for a moment a world without hypothetical situations...

    "He was mocked in the third, but after the combine they'll mock him into the first, for sure." - Fritz

  9. #9
    Wolf Pack Rat HOFer Deputy Nutz's Avatar
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    Can you scramble nerons that are already currently scrambled?
    "You know what a smart ass is?
    Someone who can sit on a ice cream cone and tell you what flavor it is."

    Brett Favre

  10. #10
    Postal Rat HOFer Joemailman's Avatar
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    Those cops now know what NFL Offensive Tackles used to go through.

    Just glad this didn't turn into a real tragedy.

  11. #11
    Smart Ass Rat HOFer sheepshead's Avatar
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    Sadly, many of these guys are on the sauce. I've met Willie Wood a few times and his current health problems I believe are from his lifestyle. Sad to see this kind of thing at their age, but you can see how it can happen.

    (i need to freshen up my bloody mary, I'll be right back)
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  12. #12
    Fried Rat HOFer KYPack's Avatar
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    A month ago I went to dinner with some people I know. Two of the people I was out with were younger cops. Somehow the subject of tasers came up. One cop was adamant that the taser was the greatest invention since the beer bottle and was more powerful than a death star. The other cop stated that some people aren't affected by tasers at all when they are screwed up on various drugs.

    These two argued for quite some time, and the debate was never resolved.

    I was gonna google the answer, until I realized that I didn't give a shit.

    What is the answer here?

  13. #13
    Wolf Pack Rat HOFer Deputy Nutz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KYPack
    A month ago I went to dinner with some people I know. Two of the people I was out with were younger cops. Somehow the subject of tasers came up. One cop was adamant that the taser was the greatest invention since the beer bottle and was more powerful than a death star. The other cop stated that some people aren't affected by tasers at all when they are screwed up on various drugs.

    These two argued for quite some time, and the debate was never resolved.

    I was gonna google the answer, until I realized that I didn't give a shit.

    What is the answer here?
    Like I said, is it possible to scramble neurons that are already currently scrambled?
    "You know what a smart ass is?
    Someone who can sit on a ice cream cone and tell you what flavor it is."

    Brett Favre

  14. #14
    Megalomaniac Rat All-Pro MadScientist's Avatar
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    From Wikipedia:
    A Taser fires two small dart-like electrodes, connected to the main unit by conductive wire and propelled by small compressed nitrogen charges similar to some air gun or paintball marker propellants. The air cartridge contains a pair of electrodes and propellant for a single shot and is replaced after each use. There are a number of cartridges designated by range, with the maximum at 35 feet (10.6 meters).[8] Cartridges available to non-law enforcement consumers are limited to 15 feet (4.5 meters).[9] The electrodes are pointed to penetrate clothing and barbed to prevent removal once in place. Earlier Taser models required the electrodes' barbs to penetrate the skin, but newer versions (X26, C2) use a "shaped pulse" that increases effectiveness in the presence of barriersEarly models had difficulty in penetrating thick clothing, but the 'pulse' models are designed to bring down a subject wearing up to a Level III body armor vest.
    Some Taser models, particularly those used by police departments, also have a "Drive Stun" capability, where the Taser is held against the target without firing the projectiles, and is intended to cause pain without incapacitating the target. Taser defines "Drive Stun" as "the process of using the EMD weapon [Taser] as a pain compliance technique. This is done by activating the EMD and placing it against an individual’s body. This can be done without an air cartridge in place or after an air cartridge has been deployed."

    A Las Vegas police document says "The Drive Stun causes significant localized pain in the area touched by the Taser, but does not have a significant effect on the central nervous system. The Drive Stun does not incapacitate a subject but may assist in taking a subject into custody."[10] "Drive Stun" was used in the UCLA Taser incident and the University of Florida Taser incident.

    It is also known as "dry tasing", "contact tasing", or "drive tasing
    It sounds like they use the 'Drive stun' is less likely to produce an unintended death, but not as effective on a totally whacked-out suspect as it produces pain and not the full stun effect.

  15. #15
    All i know is that if you have a mean spirited cop the taser is deadly.

    People have been killed by them.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by KYPack
    A month ago I went to dinner with some people I know. Two of the people I was out with were younger cops. Somehow the subject of tasers came up. One cop was adamant that the taser was the greatest invention since the beer bottle and was more powerful than a death star. The other cop stated that some people aren't affected by tasers at all when they are screwed up on various drugs.

    These two argued for quite some time, and the debate was never resolved.

    I was gonna google the answer, until I realized that I didn't give a shit.

    What is the answer here?

    The cop that argued that some people aren't phased is full of shit. It isn't only "pain compliance," like DAAT moves are intended for. Tasers lock up your muscles and your entire body locks up. With proper probe deployment, you're going to the ground. No matter who you are. I have seen videos of the biggest bad asses in the world getting tased. They locked up and fell over like a bowling pin.

    And for the record, I have been tased. And yes, the pain is like no other.

  17. #17
    Looks like MadScientest has the answer with the 'Dry Stun' that you also mentioned earlier, gbpackfan. Also makes sense that that they tased him 4 time, which they couldn't do if they'd fired the darts (single use cartridge) unless they had multiple units.

    I think the answer here is that they grossly underestimated CE's ability to withstand pain. I'm not surprised - and I would guess that many NFL lineman (and a certain QB) would be able to 'shake off' a dry tasing a lot more quickly than the cops would expect!
    --
    Imagine for a moment a world without hypothetical situations...

    "He was mocked in the third, but after the combine they'll mock him into the first, for sure." - Fritz

  18. #18
    Fried Rat HOFer KYPack's Avatar
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    Well, thanks, I guess. Can't say I realyy understand tasing other than I need to avoid it.

    Both cops agreed that a taser can be lethel. There was a case in cincy a year ago. A guy (5'7" 350) was out of his mind on dope, by his friends account. The cops tased him once, no effect. Twice, nothin'. The third dose was a charm and the guy died on the way to the hospital of a massive heart attack.

    So, it's a neat thing to avoid.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by KYPack
    Well, thanks, I guess. Can't say I realyy understand tasing other than I need to avoid it.

    Both cops agreed that a taser can be lethel. There was a case in cincy a year ago. A guy (5'7" 350) was out of his mind on dope, by his friends account. The cops tased him once, no effect. Twice, nothin'. The third dose was a charm and the guy died on the way to the hospital of a massive heart attack.

    So, it's a neat thing to avoid.
    It's a step up from pepper spray, I guess. I've been sprayed (part of training I had to take!!!) and it was something else. IIRC there have been some cases of people going into a pretty massive shock over that as well. Don't know if anyone's died, however.

    Without getting into too much of a discussion about it, those that are against tasing always point to the people getting killed, and say that the cops are too willing to use it - but I've seen proponents of it say that compared to the number of 'detainies' that die from other means of being subdued (choke holds, batons...) it's not as bad as it's made out to be.
    --
    Imagine for a moment a world without hypothetical situations...

    "He was mocked in the third, but after the combine they'll mock him into the first, for sure." - Fritz

  20. #20
    Kinky Rat HOFer Freak Out's Avatar
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    I think I would rather be tasered than chocked by a cop. I seen cops put some ugly chokes on people with their batons and it's very dangerous. Adrenaline or anger kick in and people die.
    C.H.U.D.

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