Interracial Relationship/Marriage: Are you for or against it

[bobblehead]

Harlen, I know you are a fairly smart dude.

I liked the sound of that, thought I'd emphasize it.

but the numbers and facts don't lie...only the perception that has been portrayed every since does.

when I said "conservatives" opposed civil rights in the 60's, I was including the southern Dixiecrats.

well don't, they were rascists, not conservatives. and remember, byrd was the big filibuster king of the movement and he was a democrat then and he is a democrat now...tyrone says he has had a change of heart, but not a change of party affiliation.

You can't just label a rascist behavior as consrvative behavior and then pretend they are interchangeable. One has absolutely nothing to do with the other. Rascist behavior is just that rascist....not conservative and not liberal. Clear your mind, disassociate the two, they are not one in the same. The MSM has tied the two together for so long it is sticking, but it is still just inflamatory bullshit.

Say it with me everyone....rascism is NOT conservative behavior, its rascist. Conservative behavior is believing in smaller gov't (economically) and believing in moral behavior usually based on religion (socially). Believing blacks are inferior is rascist, NOT conservative. Believing anything about race is not a consevative/liberal issue anymore than believing the sky is frickin blue.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Which President was most responsible for ending slavery?

Which President was most responsible for ending Jim Crow? (The one that appointed the Supreme Court justice most responsible for ending it.)

Which party supported civil rights by a larger percentage?

Now, what has the Democratic party brought to black folks? In all sincerity, please name them. I mostly see a party that has brought a sense of entitlement (not just to African-Americans though). I honestly would like to know what Democrats feel their party has done for black folks.

[Harlan Huckleby]

when I said "conservatives" opposed civil rights in the 60's, I was including the southern Dixiecrats.

well don't, they were rascists, not conservatives. and remember, byrd was the big filibuster king of the movement and he was a democrat

Let me get this straight: Is your position that civil rights were opposed by Southern Democrats, and that Conservative Republicans had an admirable record on Civil Rights in the 60's?

What was the Republican position on the Civil Rights Act of 1964?

[Harlan Huckleby]

Some might also call it racist to take for granted the vote of a particular minority--delivered at about a 90% rate wrapped up and tied with a pink bow by the black leaders/overseers of the liberal plantation, and then for that party to blatantly fly in the face of that minority population on moral issues--not to mention taxation, defense, and security.

Harlan was all for that gift until it went to the black dude instead of the wife of the first black president. Now he's outraged.

I've never expressed negativity towards black people for voting for Obama. I just want people to discuss it honestly.

I don't think it is a good thing that blacks vote for one party , it shows the country is not healed.

[HarveyWallbangers]

What was the Republican position on the Civil Rights Act of 1964?

You can find it right here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_Rights_Act_of_1964

The original House version:

* Democratic Party: 152-96 (61%-39%)
* Republican Party: 138-34 (80%-20%)

The Senate version:

* Democratic Party: 46-21 (69%-31%)
* Republican Party: 27-6 (82%-18%)

The Senate version, voted on by the House:

* Democratic Party: 153-91 (63%-37%)
* Republican Party: 136-35 (80%-20%)

Umm... they supported it by a far greater margin than Democrats.

EDIT: Man, the Democrats had a huge edge in Congress back then (67-33 in the Senate, 244-171 in the House). Then also had the Presidency.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Umm... they supported it by a far greater margin than Democrats.

Right, because of Democrats in the South. (And the South by and large is Republicans now largely because of such legislation.)

The Conservative wing of the Republican Party was against civil rights in the 60's. Do you dispute this?

Conservatives of both parties fought civil rights. Who cares if conseratives were in the DEm party in the 60's.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Conservatives of both parties fought civil rights. Who cares if conseratives were in the DEm party in the 60's.

Again, it depends on what you mean by Conservative. Are you telling me that only 20% of the Republican Party was Conservative in 1964?

[Harlan Huckleby]

Newt Gingrich is a historian and conservative champion who has spoken honestly about the damage conservatives did to their cause by opposing civil rights. I will try and find something in writing.....

[Harlan Huckleby]

Conservatives of both parties fought civil rights. Who cares if conseratives were in the DEm party in the 60's.

Again, it depends on what you mean by Conservative. Are you telling me that only 20% of the Republican Party was Conservative in 1964?

I really don't know. Conservatives certainly went into the wilderness after Goldwater.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I don't equate Conservatives with bigots and racists. I think you are mistaking Conservatives with right-wing fringe. I don't lump Liberals in with the left-wing fringe of their party. I think Liberals are misguided, but I don't think of them as vegetarian, gun hating, environmental terrorists.

[Harlan Huckleby]

In the 1964 Presidential campaign, a big wedge issue between Rockefeller & Goldwater was Civil Rights. Goldwater opposed the Civil Rights Act and won the nomination.

Does this accurately indicate the feelings of conservatives of that era? Probably.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I don't equate Conservatives with bigots and racists. I think you are mistaking Conservatives with right-wing fringe.

Lets just stay away from these stereotypes. I'm not making these generalities. I think its a historical fact that conservatives opposed civil rights in the 1960's.

I'm vaguely old enough to remember the grown-ups discussing these issues at the time. Conservative republicans weren't for the civil rights movement, believe me.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I think it's important to discuss this--because Democrats have done a great job of branding Republicans racists for the better part of three decades--mainly because their lack of support for entitlement programs. I've said it before, but it's intellectually dishonest. You know as well as I do that when somebody basically states Conservatives are racists, they are trying to implicitly say Republicans are racists.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I think you are fighting a battle from about 20 years ago.

Maybe there are some people who still assoicate conservative thinking with racism, but they are living in the past too.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I think you are fighting a battle from about 20 years ago.

That may be true since I started having these discussions about 20 years ago, but I don't think the fight ever ended.

[Harlan Huckleby]

One 60's anecdote: My dad was active in the Republican party. He played Abraham Lincoln in some parade, and for some reason was carrying a torch. His hat caught on fire, and he was so embarassed by the affair that the story was hushed-up. I need to get some more details, I sorta forgot about it.

[bobblehead]

Umm... they supported it by a far greater margin than Democrats.

Right, because of Democrats in the South. (And the South by and large is Republicans now largely because of such legislation.)

The Conservative wing of the Republican Party was against civil rights in the 60's. Do you dispute this?

Conservatives of both parties fought civil rights. Who cares if conseratives were in the DEm party in the 60's.

Again, you are equating conservative with rascist. Conservatives of both parties?? what kind of crap is that...if conservative and liberal aren't defined by party, what defines it....oh yea, if you are rascist and oppose civil rights you are conservative, regardless of party, and if you support civil rights you are liberal....regardless of party(but now in the 2000's if you are a republican you are a rascist).

I want you to say it with me....THERE IS NO CORRELATION BETWEEN POLITICAL CONSERVATISM AND RASCISM.

I don't know how much more clear I can be on this, you say conservative=rascism, not in those exact words, but its what you are saying. It just ain't so.

Tyrone says most rascists are conservative, I say most gays are liberal...but I don't define liberal as gay in any way shape or form. There are gay republicans, there are rascist democrats, there are gay conservatives, there are gay liberals, these kind of things can not simply be equated.

How about I put it this way, maybe you will get it. You reading about a rascist and assuming he is a conservative is no different than me reading about a rapist and assuming the perpetrator is black. Both are gross displays of bigotry and for some reason its ok to have such preconcieved notions about conservatives or rascists, but not blacks.....IT'S NOT OK IN EITHER CASE!! Its bigoted in both cases and wrong. And just as a black would be pissed off in the latter case, I get pissed off in the former.

[PackFan#1]

I have met several black people who think blacks are a superior race...Dennis Rodman comes to mind immediately.

Wow, you met Dennis Rodman? Did you ask for his autograph?

WTF? Rodman is not racist. He likes white women and his favorite band is Pearl Jam! You probably--note, I wrote probably as in I am only guessing--think Rodman is racist because you think he sometimes act like a "punk."

Yeah, anyone who acts beyond the "norm" of a conservative's narrow-mind is a punk. Those punk ass hippies. Those punk ass homosexuals. Those punk ass anti-war anti-Americans. Punk ass liberals.

[Zool]

I have met several black people who think blacks are a superior race...Dennis Rodman comes to mind immediately.

I could be wrong, but arent there groups of whites who think they are the superior race too? Ridiculous.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Umm... they supported it by a far greater margin than Democrats.

Right, because of Democrats in the South. (And the South by and large is Republicans now largely because of such legislation.)

The Conservative wing of the Republican Party was against civil rights in the 60's. Do you dispute this?

Conservatives of both parties fought civil rights. Who cares if conseratives were in the DEm party in the 60's.

Again, you are equating conservative with rascist.

I never mentioned "racist" or "racism", let alone equated it to conservative.
It is only you thinking in this simple-minded way.

Conservatives of both parties?? what kind of crap is that...if conservative and liberal aren't defined by party, what defines it..

You are stuck thinking in current stereotypes about Dems and Republicans. Southern Democrats in the 1960's had many conservative attributes: socially conservative, resistance to change, distrustful of federal government. In response the Civil Rights Movement, these former CONSERVATIVES in the Democratic party became CONSERVATIVES in Republican party. Are you not aware that the South switched from solid Democratic to solid Republican? Do you argue that these people switched from liberal to conservative beliefs? The very conservative, republican people of the south today are the same folks who were dems prior to the civil rights era.

I want you to say it with me....THERE IS NO CORRELATION BETWEEN POLITICAL CONSERVATISM AND RASCISM.

Why do you keep bringing up racism? Me thinks you protest too much.

We were discussing the recent history of conservatives in America. The modern conservative movement was founded by Barry Goldwater. HE WAS THE CHAMPION OF OPPOSITION TO THE CIVIL RIGHTS ACT OF 1964! This is a fact, and an indication of how many conservatives were thinking during that era. I can tell you from my own anecdotal experience that conservatives opposed the civil rights movement nervously and furiously.

How about I put it this way, maybe you will get it. You reading about a rascist and assuming he is a conservative is no different than me reading about a rapist and assuming the perpetrator is black.

Man, you are the Reverand Wright of the conservative side. there's a conservative-basher behind every rock.