official 2014 nfl draft thread

[red]

how nice would it be to trade down a few spots, pick up an extra 3rd or 4th, draft a falling mosely (better instincts) or shazier (better athletic ability) then take our second and third, and /or the pick we got in the trade down to move back up to the top of the second and grab ward

like the raji, mathews draft. two major needs addressed with two great talents

[Fritz]

Maybe the Lions are more worried about Megatron's knee than people realize.

This could be, although the Detroit reporters have not sniffed this out yet, if it is the case.

As for the top safeties, here's what the GBPG said today about teams in front of the Packers who need a safety:

"The teams in the market for a starting safety and picking ahead of the Packers are Detroit at No. 10, St. Louis at No. 13, Chicago at No. 14 and Baltimore at No. 17."

This is not entirely true. Detroit has that FA they signed from Baltimore (Idhegibo?) and the other safety they signed from Houston last year (can't remember his name). They both project as starters.

They likely will be looking for a safety, but my guess is that it won't come with the first round pick. They are in "win now" mode, and getting a player with the first pick who may not start immediately, after throwing FA money at the position two years running, is not part of that plan.

Likely they'd draft someone in the third round, if they still have that pick when it comes around.

[pbmax]

This could be, although the Detroit reporters have not sniffed this out yet, if it is the case.

As for the top safeties, here's what the GBPG said today about teams in front of the Packers who need a safety:

"The teams in the market for a starting safety and picking ahead of the Packers are Detroit at No. 10, St. Louis at No. 13, Chicago at No. 14 and Baltimore at No. 17."

This is not entirely true. Detroit has that FA they signed from Baltimore (Idhegibo?) and the other safety they signed from Houston last year (can't remember his name). They both project as starters.

They likely will be looking for a safety, but my guess is that it won't come with the first round pick. They are in "win now" mode, and getting a player with the first pick who may not start immediately, after throwing FA money at the position two years running, is not part of that plan.

Likely they'd draft someone in the third round, if they still have that pick when it comes around.

There is a lot of assuming going on about safety needs. Lions, Eagles and Bears all signed bodies there and that may ratchet down pressure to pick a safety in the first round.

[red]

hmmm

here's shaziers game tape against clemson from this year

someone tell me whats "special" about this guy. he put up freak numbers at his combine, but i don't see those combine skills being used on the field. i see a guy who has a problem getting off blocks, a guy thats taking a lot of bad angles and missing tackles, and a guy that makes his tackles 8 yards down field

don't we already have a white version of the same player already on the team (put up big numbers at OSU, put up freak numbers in pre draft workouts, has troubles getting off blocks and makes a lot of plays way down field?

hell, hawk might actually look better because he doesn't miss tackles or take horrible angles, and he finishes plays and goes all out on every single snap. i don't see that with shazier

[Joemailman]

hmmm

here's shaziers game tape against clemson from this year

someone tell me whats "special" about this guy. he put up freak numbers at his combine, but i don't see those combine skills being used on the field. i see a guy who has a problem getting off blocks, a guy thats taking a lot of bad angles and missing tackles, and a guy that makes his tackles 8 yards down field

don't we already have a white version of the same player already on the team (put up big numbers at OSU, put up freak numbers in pre draft workouts, has troubles getting off blocks and makes a lot of plays way down field?

hell, hawk might actually look better because he doesn't miss tackles or take horrible angles, and he finishes plays and goes all out on every single snap. i don't see that with shazier

That tape is not impressive. Didn't see him really willing to take on contact. It also bring up a concern I've expressed about him previously, which is his weight. He weighed 237 at the Combine, but played in the 220's. He looks more like a safety out there. I wonder if the can keep the weight on during the season.

One think I will say in his defense is that the Ohio St. DL was getting dominated, and that always makes it tough on a linebacker. The same thing happened to Manti Teo against Alabama, but he had a pretty good rookie year for San Diego.

[smuggler]

We know he is going to be small and quick. He will more often than not go around blocks of anyone except a WR. That's true of most rangey ILBs. The ones that are both strong AND fast get taken in the top 10 picks. There isnt one of those this year. If Shazier can run with a TE and has decent coverage abilities to go along with his Joker capabilities, he is worth the pick. If he cannot, then... well, not so much.

[Brandon494]

hell, hawk might actually look better because he doesn't miss tackles or take horrible angles, and he finishes plays and goes all out on every single snap. i don't see that with shazier

Just stop talking

[red]

and heres something to backup what i've been saying for months

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...group-overall/

At a press conference Thursday, Eagles G.M. Howie Roseman told reporters safety was not a particularly deep position in this year’s draft.

“In terms of the safety class, I don’t think it’s a good group overall,” Roseman said, according to Sheil Kapedia of PhillyMag.com. “I think you’re talking about a dropoff certainly when you get into Saturday.

Four safeties — Alabama’s Ha Ha Clinton-Dix, Northern Illinois’ Jimmie Ward, Florida State’s Terrence Brooks and Louisville’s Calvin Pryor — rank in the top third of Rotoworld draft expert Josh Norris’ list of the top 150 draft prospects.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I generally agree about the safeties, but their are a couple midround safeties that I like in Vereen and Reynolds, and there are a number of corners that project to safety in the NFL who I think could be pretty good (Breeland, Huff, Johnson).

[pbmax]

Shazier was willing, I didn't see him ole many blocks and he was willing to use his hands to shield, but he doesn't deliver much of a punch to stop the blocker. He actually gets off several blocks better than current Packers. Tackling is up and down. Saw him finish a few, no kill shots, but also whiffed a couple of times.

Hard to judge how he would look versus a more traditional offense because all the run action of Clemson was off spread concepts. He was always five yards deep to protect against pass first when he was inside. Hoped to see his speed play more of a factor. He did chase two guys outside and forced them OOB.

[Zool]

I like that Shazier is always around the play. He does miss some tackles and not a big hitter. As PB said, he looks better than some Packer guys at shedding blocks currently. Looks a little stiff in coverage.

[RashanGary]

I've settled in on a guy I want most. CJ Mosley, ilb, Alabama. Hawk won't be around too much longer. Mosley is a man, not a boy playing football. He's a leader and a guy who can be the heart of the defense for years to come. His skill and awareness is off the charts and is a hell of an athlete too. To me, he's a special piece, especially with the makeup of our team. He's bishop with coverage ability and speed.

[Bretsky]

I've settled in on a guy I want most. CJ Mosley, ilb, Alabama. Hawk won't be around too much longer. Mosley is a man, not a boy playing football. He's a leader and a guy who can be the heart of the defense for years to come. His skill and awareness is off the charts and is a hell of an athlete too. To me, he's a special piece, especially with the makeup of our team. He's bishop with coverage ability and speed.

don't think he's there for us at 21

I think we might be choosing for Shazier...if he makes it...and some DL Slugs and WR's

My three I'm at peace with are Mosley.....Prior....and Shazier in that order

[Bretsky]

Shazier was willing, I didn't see him ole many blocks and he was willing to use his hands to shield, but he doesn't deliver much of a punch to stop the blocker. He actually gets off several blocks better than current Packers. Tackling is up and down. Saw him finish a few, no kill shots, but also whiffed a couple of times.

Hard to judge how he would look versus a more traditional offense because all the run action of Clemson was off spread concepts. He was always five yards deep to protect against pass first when he was inside. Hoped to see his speed play more of a factor. He did chase two guys outside and forced them OOB.

The numbers don't lie

39 Tackles for Loss the last two years
4 Forced Fumbles last year

And he's able to move around and play different roles at LB

That has value

[Bretsky]

I generally agree about the safeties, but their are a couple midround safeties that I like in Vereen and Reynolds, and there are a number of corners that project to safety in the NFL who I think could be pretty good (Breeland, Huff, Johnson).

Dear Harvey......are you still a fan of the Douchebag Colleage in OSU ? You should have a good take on Shazier...what is it ?

[red]

don't think he's there for us at 21

I think we might be choosing for Shazier...if he makes it...and some DL Slugs and WR's

My three I'm at peace with are Mosley.....Prior....and Shazier in that order

ward, pryor, mosley, shazier for me, in that order

when i watch them, i think mosley and pryor and haha can all be very good players. shazier could be a decent starter (very hawk like, but i'm one of the few who thinks that would be ok). but ward, to me, is the only one that looks like he could be special. and his size is really the only problem i can find with him

[Bretsky]

ward, pryor, mosley, shazier for me, in that order

when i watch them, i think mosley and pryor and haha can all be very good players. shazier could be a decent starter (very hawk like, but i'm one of the few who thinks that would be ok). but ward, to me, is the only one that looks like he could be special. and his size is really the only problem i can find with him

I need to go find some more film on Ward; I"m not on board with him and think he's going in the 32-45 range. he's truly a guy i'd want to deal down for and not grab at 21

[red]

I need to go find some more film on Ward; I"m not on board with him and think he's going in the 32-45 range. he's truly a guy i'd want to deal down for and not grab at 21

against FSU last year. this is where you see shades of woodson. ward is there on every play,lines up everywhere



i believe its this game vs toledo where you'll see him make one of the better int's you'll see in your life





those are the three games i can find on youtube. when you look at pryor and mosely and shazier, you see guys playing well on good defenses. when you watch ward yousee a guy who IS his teams defense. and these are full games, every snap he played, not just a highlight reel

and did i mention that even though he's "small" and missed the combine due to a minor foot injury, and he seems to throw his body all over the place on every single play, i believe he's only missed one game in his 4 year college career due to injury

[HarveyWallbangers]

Dear Harvey......are you still a fan of the Douchebag Colleage in OSU ? You should have a good take on Shazier...what is it ?

I like him. My final ILB board may have him at the top. Tough though because Mosley is a just a solid all-around player. He has a high floor. I'm not 100% positive that Shazier's game will translate to the NFL though. I think he has more upside than Mosley, and he might be the right fit for the Packers because our LBs have lacked coverage skills.

[HarveyWallbangers]

against FSU last year. this is where you see shades of woodson. ward is there on every play,lines up everywhere

those are the three games i can find on youtube. when you look at pryor and mosely and shazier, you see guys playing well on good defenses. when you watch ward yousee a guy who IS his teams defense. and these are full games, every snap he played, not just a highlight reel

and did i mention that even though he's "small" and missed the combine due to a minor foot injury, and he seems to throw his body all over the place on every single play, i believe he's only missed one game in his 4 year college career due to injury

I likes me some Jimmie Ward. Perhaps the closest thing you'll find to Nick Collins in this draft--although not at that elite level. I've read that the drills that some tend to ignore at the combine (vertical and broad jump) are good indicators for success for safeties at the NFL level. The best safeties in the draft for combined SAA (speed, acceleration, and agility) + explosion (vertical and broad) are Jimmie Ward, Kenny Ladler, Dezman Southward, and Dontae Johnson (if he moves from CB). Buchanan is pretty close. Ward and Buchanan combine good tackling ability with those traits--although Buchanan looks stiff in coverage to me. Ward also has ball skills. His film looks good too. I'm very close to having him as my top rated safety.