More Banjo: @ Saints Week Oh Who the *$%&! Cares

[Patler]

All said above is true, but the key, I think, was when Rodgers tweaked his hamstring.

Tie game at half with the teams matching each other TD for TD and FG for FG.
NO takes possession with the 2nd half kickoff to a first down, but then the Packer "D" holds on 4th down for a huge change of possession without a score in a puntless game.
Packers drive down field quickly, have 1st and goal from the 6, but with Rodgers clearly a bit hobbled.
With Rodgers out of sync, the expected run on 1st goes no where, Rodgers quickly gets rid of the 2nd down pass on a play he would normally have extended, then tries another quick, no movement pass that is intercepted.

A chance to go up by 7, or at least 3 evaporates, and the Packers can no longer keep up without Rodgers at his best.

Not saying they would have won, but until Rodgers' injury, I think the game looked like a classic shoot-out with teams matching score for score, but with the Packers looking to be in the leadership role and NO playing catchup, at least for a while. Up to that point, there was no evidence that the NO defense could stop the Packers any more than there was evidence GB could stop NO.

[Cheesehead Craig]

All said above is true, but the key, I think, was when Rodgers tweaked his hamstring.

Tie game at half with the teams matching each other TD for TD and FG for FG.
NO takes possession with the 2nd half kickoff to a first down, but then the Packer "D" holds on 4th down for a huge change of possession without a score in a puntless game.
Packers drive down field quickly, have 1st and goal from the 6, but with Rodgers clearly a bit hobbled.
With Rodgers out of sync, the expected run on 1st goes no where, Rodgers quickly gets rid of the 2nd down pass on a play he would normally have extended, then tries another quick, no movement pass that is intercepted.

A chance to go up by 7, or at least 3 evaporates, and the Packers can no longer keep up without Rodgers at his best.

Not saying they would have won, but until Rodgers' injury, I think the game looked like a classic shoot-out with teams matching score for score, but with the Packers looking to be in the leadership role and NO playing catchup, at least for a while. Up to that point, there was no evidence that the NO defense could stop the Packers any more than there was evidence GB could stop NO.

Now you're starting to sound like Collinsworth and his broken record last night. Too much was made about it, IMO. Just a whole load of bad play/luck turned the game.

* INT on a deflected pass, not on the hammy just bum luck. Stopped GB from going up at least 3 as you said. Not the hammy.
* Defense simply couldn't slow down, let alone stop NO on the next drive. Not on the hammy.
* Rodgers looked fine the next drive but Adams loses where the first down marker is and then the OL completely botches the 4th down run blocking. Not on the hammy.
* Defense again gets plastered by the NO offense. Not on the hammy.
* Next drive, the Packers are moving down the field and magically the hammy isn't mentioned by Collinsworth. Adams then stops running his route and Rodgers assumes he's going to keep running and another deflected ball is intercepted. Not on the hammy.

Boom. There's your game. Defense was putrid. The offense came up short too often in the red zone in getting TDs. They score one on 2 of those drives instead of FGs and they could have afforded some bad luck turnovers.

[denverYooper]

Now you're starting to sound like Collinsworth and his broken record last night. Too much was made about it, IMO. Just a whole load of bad play/luck turned the game.

* INT on a deflected pass, not on the hammy just bum luck. Stopped GB from going up at least 3 as you said. Not the hammy.
* Defense simply couldn't slow down, let alone stop NO on the next drive. Not on the hammy.
* Rodgers looked fine the next drive but Adams loses where the first down marker is and then the OL completely botches the 4th down run blocking. Not on the hammy.
* Defense again gets plastered by the NO offense. Not on the hammy.
* Next drive, the Packers are moving down the field and magically the hammy isn't mentioned by Collinsworth. Adams then stops running his route and Rodgers assumes he's going to keep running and another deflected ball is intercepted. Not on the hammy.

Boom. There's your game. Defense was putrid. The offense came up short too often in the red zone in getting TDs. They score one on 2 of those drives instead of FGs and they could have afforded some bad luck turnovers.

What you say is true, and points to several moments where the team could have rallied but before the hammy, Rodgers was pretty well in the driver's seat. He can play from inside the pocket, and still play like a top 5 QB, but there was clearly a bit of adjustment for him and for the offense during which the Saints just took over.

[Patler]

* INT on a deflected pass, not on the hammy just bum luck. Stopped GB from going up at least 3 as you said. Not the hammy.
* Defense simply couldn't slow down, let alone stop NO on the next drive. Not on the hammy.
* Rodgers looked fine the next drive but Adams loses where the first down marker is and then the OL completely botches the 4th down run blocking. Not on the hammy.
* Defense again gets plastered by the NO offense. Not on the hammy.
* Next drive, the Packers are moving down the field and magically the hammy isn't mentioned by Collinsworth. Adams then stops running his route and Rodgers assumes he's going to keep running and another deflected ball is intercepted. Not on the hammy.

Boom. There's your game. Defense was putrid. The offense came up short too often in the red zone in getting TDs. They score one on 2 of those drives instead of FGs and they could have afforded some bad luck turnovers.

Rodgers at full speed extends the play on 2nd down instead of quickly throwing it away without even moving. Rodgers on the move is his most dangerous. A TD on 2nd down with Rodgers on the move, and you don't even get to the play resulting in the first interception.

After the hamstring tweak, Rodgers was not as accurate, nor were things as in sync in the passing game as they had been. The first interception wasn't a bad throw, but it could have been better, and if better maybe not tipped by the DB for the interception. We have all seen Rodgers deadly accurate many, many times. He was early in the game, but not after the hamstring.

No, the defense could not stop NO after that, but the NO defense showed no signs of being able to stop GB until the injury and watered down passing game thereafter.

Rodgers didn't look right for the remainder of the game. Adams didn't lose awarenes of where the first down was, he had to shift his momentum backward to catch the pass that was just a bit off. Rodgers at his best makes a better throw for the 1st down.

Rodgers made some plays work the rest of the game, but it wasn't the Rodgers of the first half + the drive before the injury, and therefore a different passing offense.

The complexion of the game changed with the tweaked hamstring. Maybe the result didn't change, but the run-away victory would not have been as dramatic, in my opinion.

[PaCkFan_n_MD]

Rodgers at full speed extends the play on 2nd down instead of quickly throwing it away without even moving. Rodgers on the move is his most dangerous. A TD on 2nd down with Rodgers on the move, and you don't even get to the play resulting in the first interception.

After the hamstring tweak, Rodgers was not as accurate, nor were things as in sync in the passing game as they had been. The first interception wasn't a bad throw, but it could have been better, and if better maybe not tipped by the DB for the interception. We have all seen Rodgers deadly accurate many, many times. He was early in the game, but not after the hamstring.

No, the defense could not stop NO after that, but the NO defense showed no signs of being able to stop GB until the injury and watered down passing game thereafter.

Rodgers didn't look right for the remainder of the game. Adams didn't lose awarenes of where the first down was, he had to shift his momentum backward to catch the pass that was just a bit off. Rodgers at his best makes a better throw for the 1st down.

Rodgers made some plays work the rest of the game, but it wasn't the Rodgers of the first half + the drive before the injury, and therefore a different passing offense.

The complexion of the game changed with the tweaked hamstring. Maybe the result didn't change, but the run-away victory would not have been as dramatic, in my opinion.

Everything you said is spot on. If the Rodgers that started the game would have finished the game the score would have been something like 38-35. But by your same argument that means they would have scored 60 points if Rodgers say missed the whole game. Brees hasn't played amazing for most of the year. Even in the two home wins before our game hes made bad throws and big mistakes at times. We made him look stoppable last night. All I'm saying is that what happened to Rodgers in the second half doesn't change how the defense always folds when facing elite qbs. I'm not looking for a shutout. But a few punts would be nice.

[pbmax]

Rodgers didn't look right for the remainder of the game. Adams didn't lose awarenes of where the first down was, he had to shift his momentum backward to catch the pass that was just a bit off. Rodgers at his best makes a better throw for the 1st down.

This. He was short on several balls including that 3rd down completion to Adams included. Poor replay spotting of ball aside, if they hit it clean, its a first down. As it turned out, 4th down run got stuffed.

[Bossman641]

This. He was short on several balls including that 3rd down completion to Adams included. Poor replay spotting of ball aside, if they hit it clean, its a first down. As it turned out, 4th down run got stuffed.

Rodgers wasn't stepping into throws like normal. Even the ones that got there didn't have the normal zip on them.

[pbmax]

Questionable (mental lapse).

[Cheesehead Craig]

Questionable (mental lapse).

You sure have had some of those.

[Bossman641]

All said above is true, but the key, I think, was when Rodgers tweaked his hamstring.

Tie game at half with the teams matching each other TD for TD and FG for FG.
NO takes possession with the 2nd half kickoff to a first down, but then the Packer "D" holds on 4th down for a huge change of possession without a score in a puntless game.
Packers drive down field quickly, have 1st and goal from the 6, but with Rodgers clearly a bit hobbled.
With Rodgers out of sync, the expected run on 1st goes no where, Rodgers quickly gets rid of the 2nd down pass on a play he would normally have extended, then tries another quick, no movement pass that is intercepted.

A chance to go up by 7, or at least 3 evaporates, and the Packers can no longer keep up without Rodgers at his best.

Not saying they would have won, but until Rodgers' injury, I think the game looked like a classic shoot-out with teams matching score for score, but with the Packers looking to be in the leadership role and NO playing catchup, at least for a while. Up to that point, there was no evidence that the NO defense could stop the Packers any more than there was evidence GB could stop NO.

I agree with a lot of what you said. It's not hard to imagine a situation where the Packers would have been up 10-14 points in the third quarter.
- Better red zone production early on, Peppers not dropping the TD
- The tip drill pass to Cooks that somehow fell between 3 Packers directly into Cook's chest
- If Rodgers doesn't tweak his hamstring, he most likely steps up into the pocket and hits Adams running across the back of the end zone

Oh well, it is what it is. 6-2 sounds a whole lot better than 5-3 but the Packers still control their destiny. Detroit still has to play at NE, AZ, and GB and they are extremely lucky to be 6-2 right now.

[Patler]

I agree with a lot of what you said. It's not hard to imagine a situation where the Packers would have been up 10-14 points in the third quarter.
- Better red zone production early on, Peppers not dropping the TD
- The tip drill pass to Cooks that somehow fell between 3 Packers directly into Cook's chest
- If Rodgers doesn't tweak his hamstring, he most likely steps up into the pocket and hits Adams running across the back of the end zone

Oh well, it is what it is. 6-2 sounds a whole lot better than 5-3 but the Packers still control their destiny. Detroit still has to play at NE, AZ, and GB and they are extremely lucky to be 6-2 right now.

I'm even willing to take the 1st half as it was, dropped pass by Peppers, missed onside attempt and all. 16-16 at half was fine with me, because NO had their missed opportunities as well Someone needed to steal a possession, and GB did it first with the stop on 4th down. It could have moved them into the drivers seat for the second half, and who knows where it might have gone from there.

Pro games change on a few plays. The last 4 plays of the Packers 1st possession in the 2nd half changed the game.

[Guiness]

Pro games change on a few plays. The last 4 plays of the Packers 1st possession in the 2nd half changed the game.

Agreed, and I think those last two passes I mentioned in my last post were very key. Those, and that whack-a-doodle interception on the pass that bounced off Quarless's chest.

[Pugger]

All said above is true, but the key, I think, was when Rodgers tweaked his hamstring.

Tie game at half with the teams matching each other TD for TD and FG for FG.
NO takes possession with the 2nd half kickoff to a first down, but then the Packer "D" holds on 4th down for a huge change of possession without a score in a puntless game.
Packers drive down field quickly, have 1st and goal from the 6, but with Rodgers clearly a bit hobbled.
With Rodgers out of sync, the expected run on 1st goes no where, Rodgers quickly gets rid of the 2nd down pass on a play he would normally have extended, then tries another quick, no movement pass that is intercepted.

A chance to go up by 7, or at least 3 evaporates, and the Packers can no longer keep up without Rodgers at his best.

Not saying they would have won, but until Rodgers' injury, I think the game looked like a classic shoot-out with teams matching score for score, but with the Packers looking to be in the leadership role and NO playing catchup, at least for a while. Up to that point, there was no evidence that the NO defense could stop the Packers any more than there was evidence GB could stop NO.

I don't think any of us can say truthfully we thought our D was gonna stop Brees and company. I'm with you, NO couldn't stop us either. The main reason IMO of why we had to settle for FGs and not TDs before Aaron got hurt was we were screwing up more than anything NO did. Once AR hurt his hammy all bets were off. Most teams with elite QBs like Brees and Rodgers will suffer when their guy goes down or isn't playing well.