ARE WE GIVING AROD A FREE PASS ??????????????????

[pbmax]

For what it is worth I have issues with the schematics at times too. To me questioning a play call or game management decision is always so convenient when it doesn't work. If the opposite decision was made, (ie throwing instead of running the clock down and going for it on 4th and goal) with a negative outcome, there would be just as much criticism. That's why I have to look at execution first and foremost, with the opportunities the scheme presented. And the opportunities were ample, and enough to win that game. Even if you want to blame 100% of the accuracy issues on the calf, (which I find absurd but let's say that for arguments sake), the decision making and mental focus was poor. I'm not sure how you can argue that. Both interceptions were easily avoidable, and were momentum killers. There are other examples through out the game, but just omit those 2 bonehead decisions and we win that game. The scheme and coaching will never be perfect and will always be subject to the criticism of hindsight. Aaron will also never be perfect, but he needs to be much more smart and efficient for us to win more championships.

Saying decision making by the QB is poor is just the same hindsight as questioning the play calling.

Cobb has said he made the wrong adjustment on his, so we can bypass the problem with Rodgers execution on that one.

I would love to learn how you are able to deduce a players "focus" level from watching on TV. Is it the same method as determining their "fire"?

[Maxie the Taxi]

Saying decision making by the QB is poor is just the same hindsight as questioning the play calling.

Cobb has said he made the wrong adjustment on his, so we can bypass the problem with Rodgers execution on that one.

I would love to learn how you are able to deduce a players "focus" level from watching on TV. Is it the same method as determining their "fire"?

It's easy to dismiss criticism as "hindsight." I would love to learn how one deduces that critical comments are motivated by "hindsight" rather than an honest difference of opinion on tactics or strategy.

[mraynrand]

It's easy to dismiss criticism as "hindsight." I would love to learn how one deduces that critical comments are motivated by "hindsight" rather than an honest difference of opinion on tactics or strategy.

so would I. Any ideas?

[yetisnowman]

so would I. Any ideas?

If you can tell me with a straight face you wouldn't have criticized different decisions that also resulted in negative outcomes then ok.

You guys act like it's a no brainer to have your gimpy sloppy qb throwing the ball up by 12 with 5 minutes left. Again if he had thrown incomplete passes on all 3 downs you would have bitched about the ridiculous coaching. Or God forbid an interception with 5 minutes left! And if on several of the 4th and short plays had we been stuffed and turned the ball over instead of getting fgs you would have bitched about that too.

I see a lot of circular logic here. Aaron had a bad game because of of his calf and the defense, causing him to be inaccurate and make bad decisions. YET, McCarthy is an idiot for not trusting him to convert first downs and complete passes without making mistakes when the clock running was our best friend.. ????? Can't have it both ways.

[woodbuck27]

It's easy to dismiss criticism as "hindsight." I would love to learn how one deduces that critical comments are motivated by "hindsight" rather than an honest difference of opinion on tactics or strategy.

Does this apply?

“When you are up to your ass in alligators, it’s easy to forget you came to drain the swamp.”

[pbmax]

It's easy to dismiss criticism as "hindsight." I would love to learn how one deduces that critical comments are motivated by "hindsight" rather than an honest difference of opinion on tactics or strategy.

That would depend entirely on the quality of the objection and the nature of how its applied.

In this case, there is an argument being made that Rodgers must ID the flag being thrown before taking such a risk with a deep ball. But since that is very unlikely to be possible (flags of offside or encroachment come from the sideline and can be delayed), such shot plays would disappear as would the benefits. And that cost is quite high, the Packers have made a living on them. It very much helps their pass pro.

So we have an error and the identified solution is to essentially never risk it again because of the one bad outcome. That is just hindsight telling you there was one worst case outcome. No analysis that demonstrates the effect of the one outcome on the balance of the advantage or leverage the play accrues to the offense over the course of the season.

[yetisnowman]

Saying decision making by the QB is poor is just the same hindsight as questioning the play calling.

Cobb has said he made the wrong adjustment on his, so we can bypass the problem with Rodgers execution on that one.

I would love to learn how you are able to deduce a players "focus" level from watching on TV. Is it the same method as determining their "fire"?

He was looking right at that group of players, you should watch some of the detailed replays...he didn't have to throw the ball just because Cobb ran the wrong break. I get that is is snap second timing, but he could have not thrown the ball. And the pick to Sherman was an awful decision. Throwing up a jumpball banking on Davante freaking Adams vs arguably the best corner in the game is stupid. Also on the last drive he throws a back shoulder to Richard Rodgers and a long sideline route to James Starks(low percentage plays), missing open Nelson and Adams underneath for first down yardage.

Basically what you are saying is you can't critique any of Aaron's performance form the NFC championship game. All of it was out of his hands. Accuracy, execution, and decision making are not his fault. It's silly. Really I expect Aaron to step up, and some of you come up with one excuse after another. First it was the calf, then the defense, now the calf , and the coaching, and the receivers, and his sandy vagina. HE COULDN'T OUTPLAY A QB HAVING A CAREER WORST DAY HANDING HIM A TRIP TO THE SUPER BOWL! He wet the bed. Sorry.

You have an agenda, and that is the coaching is bad and that's what needs to change. Therefore removing any accountability from the qb is absolutely necessary.

[mraynrand]

You have an agenda, and that is the coaching is bad and that's what needs to change. Therefore removing any accountability from the qb is absolutely necessary.

I love that you've left room for compromise

[yetisnowman]

I love that you've left room for compromise

Touche.....

This debate is just frustrating to me. I've never heard someone say that both accuracy and decision making are not the quarterbacks fault.

[mraynrand]

Touche.....

This debate is just frustrating to me. I've never heard someone say that both accuracy and decision making are not the quarterbacks fault.

I don't think that's what's going on - I think people are just not agreeing with yours - and others' assessment of levels of inaccuracy or specific decisions being 'wrong' versus being either a 'less worse' decision than another or just a reasonable decision gone wrong.

[pbmax]

He was looking right at that group of players, you should watch some of the detailed replays...he didn't have to throw the ball just because Cobb ran the wrong break. I get that is is snap second timing, but he could have not thrown the ball. And the pick to Sherman was an awful decision. Throwing up a jumpball banking on Davante freaking Adams vs arguably the best corner in the game is stupid. Also on the last drive he throws a back shoulder to Richard Rodgers and a long sideline route to James Starks(low percentage plays), missing open Nelson and Adams underneath for first down yardage.

Basically what you are saying is you can't critique any of Aaron's performance form the NFC championship game. All of it was out of his hands. Accuracy, execution, and decision making are not his fault. It's silly. Really I expect Aaron to step up, and some of you come up with one excuse after another. First it was the calf, then the defense, now the calf , and the coaching, and the receivers, and his sandy vagina. HE COULDN'T OUTPLAY A QB HAVING A CAREER WORST DAY HANDING HIM A TRIP TO THE SUPER BOWL! He wet the bed. Sorry.

You have an agenda, and that is the coaching is bad and that's what needs to change. Therefore removing any accountability from the qb is absolutely necessary.

If a player doesn't do what is expected, then looking at him while throwing doesn't help. See the pass late to Lacy. Same with any back shoulder throw. Most pro passes are thrown before the break.

I don't pretend Rodgers played particularly well. Its a dangerous and tough secondary and he was clearly limited by injury. As Patler has noted, it has been affecting his accuracy since it happened. He was good enough to get into FG range, but not good enough to push it into the end zone. He also missed Cobb on a slant that, if not for stumbling trying to reach low to catch it, would have been a first down rather than short by a yard, resulting in a punt earlier in the game (never saw if he just missed or had to throw around an obstruction).

But I have no agenda on Rodgers. If you travel back in time one full year, I was one of the few harping on the offense's inability to deal with the San Fran defense in their playoff game and not just criticizing Bush for a bad blitz decision or Hyde's poorly timed jump for a possible INT.

I do think the coaches have some share of blame in this game. I would hold Rodgers to a higher standard (and blame him more) if he was healthy and played like this. But its very difficult to grade an injured QB except to say it wasn't good enough.

[yetisnowman]

If a player doesn't do what is expected, then looking at him while throwing doesn't help. See the pass late to Lacy. Same with any back shoulder throw. Most pro passes are thrown before the break.

I don't pretend Rodgers played particularly well. Its a dangerous and tough secondary and he was clearly limited by injury. As Patler has noted, it has been affecting his accuracy since it happened. He was good enough to get into FG range, but not good enough to push it into the end zone. He also missed Cobb on a slant that, if not for stumbling trying to reach low to catch it, would have been a first down rather than short by a yard, resulting in a punt earlier in the game (never saw if he just missed or had to throw around an obstruction).

But I have no agenda on Rodgers. If you travel back in time one full year, I was one of the few harping on the offense's inability to deal with the San Fran defense in their playoff game and not just criticizing Bush for a bad blitz decision or Hyde's poorly timed jump for a possible INT.

I do think the coaches have some share of blame in this game. I would hold Rodgers to a higher standard (and blame him more if he was healthy and played like this). But its very difficult to grade an injured QB except to say it wasn't good enough.

well I apologize for making assumptions I have only been around a few months. I am just going to be smarting from this loss for a long time. You just don't get a lot of opportunities gift wrapped for you like that. I will not absolve the coaching completely. However no one has told me earnestly they would have not criticized McCarthy had he made different decisions that resulted in a negative outcome. The scheme and strategy was in place, and the defense played out of their minds. The offense and Aaron failed the most in my opinion, for failing to render the last 5 minutes irrelevant.
And by the way Aaron has been healthy and played just as poorly in Seattle two other times. That's a big reason why I can't buy into the idea that it was all his calf.

[mraynrand]

And by the way Aaron has been healthy and played just as poorly in Seattle two other times. That's a big reason why I can't buy into the idea that it was all his calf.

Well that opens a whole can of worms, because I thought Rodgers played better in the playoff game than those other two games. Of course I also believe that he played worse in 2012 because of an absolutely absurd game plan up until halftime; the point being that there's a lot to look at in those other games besides Rodgers that affected his play including weather conditions.

[yetisnowman]

Well that opens a whole can of worms, because I thought Rodgers played better in the playoff game than those other two games. Of course I also believe that he played worse in 2012 because of an absolutely absurd game plan up until halftime; the point being that there's a lot to look at in those other games besides Rodgers that affected his play including weather conditions.

week 1 23-33 189 yds 1 td 1 pick. He completed more passes but basically the same number of yards. So we still werent getting chunk plays and first down when we needed to. The difference is our defense was beat up especially in the second half. And Seattle didn't turn the ball over. So I guess we should just expect aaron and the offense to put up 15-20 pts and pass for 180 whenever we play seattle, which we will likely have to moving forward.