ARE WE GIVING AROD A FREE PASS ??????????????????

[mraynrand]

I can observe Aaron Rodgers as he was in that game. I can measure from an observable standpoint and compare his performance based in other games that I've watched 'LIVE" and over again in recordings countless times.

I've watched it now three times. I'll watch it again and again and I'll not see anything different.

Aaron Rodgers had 'no Fire in him' in that game. Aaron Rodgers had excellent protection for by far the most part in that game to make plays and his QBR describes 'in part' just how off he was.

I have experience as a Leader...a Coach... a competitive athlete .... a Teacher...a Supervisor.

I can see without prejudice. I can report what I see.

and you can be wrong. again.

[Joemailman]

I've watched it now three times. I'll watch it again and again and I'll not see anything different.

Replays do tend to have a certain sameness to them.

[Bossman641]

Rodgers looked pretty pumped up after throwing the TD to Cobb.

Ask yourself this WB, was Rodgers not playing well because he didn't have enough fire? Or was he not fiery because he didn't have much to get excited about?

[Smidgeon]

Rodgers looked pretty pumped up after throwing the TD to Cobb.

Ask yourself this WB, was Rodgers not playing well because he didn't have enough fire? Or was he not fiery because he didn't have much to get excited about?

Or is "playing with fire" entirely unidentifiable from a viewer's perspective?

[woodbuck27]

Rodgers looked pretty pumped up after throwing the TD to Cobb.

Ask yourself this WB, was Rodgers not playing well because he didn't have enough fire? Or was he not fiery because he didn't have much to get excited about?

His reaction after that TD pass was all Aaron Rodgers.

Andrew Quarless 'got the look' when he dropped that perfect pass 'right' to his numbers for a critical 3rd down play for naught.

Irregardless of the fact that he only threw for one TD I looked for more emotion from him.

[mraynrand]

Or is "playing with fire" entirely unidentifiable from a viewer's perspective?

[mraynrand]

I looked for more emotion from him.

Works for the Jaguars

[yetisnowman]

[QUOTE=mraynrand;825520]This seems nonsensical to me. Rodgers didn't cause Nelson to stumble out of his break, and he didn't call the running plays at the goal line. You have a lot to complain about, but I will just say that I disagree with you about the main reasons for a less than average performance by Rodgers. Again, my evidence is the performance of other good/great QBs against Seattle, and Rodgers' injuries.[/QUOT

What's nonsensical to me is that the A-rod apology camp talks about the game as though my eyeballs deceived me. He missed a td to jordy on the goal line. He missed him deep(likely a td) on a free play. And he threw a dumb pick to Sherman, and I dont care if he "thought" it was a penalty. If you throw a jump ball you better make sure its a free play and you physically saw the yellow flag. All inaccurate throws. And that is just the first quarter. If you want to argue that a leg injury makes him sporadically accurate, then i cant disprove that i guess. I still think it is silly and a cop out. the guy did not have a good game and Seattle was begging to be beat. Again you had a opposing qb having the worst game of his life, and you couldn't outplay him.

[mraynrand]

What's nonsensical to me is that the A-rod apology camp talks about the game as though my eyeballs deceived me.

actually, no one is trying to deceive you or make apologies for Rodgers. There was poor production from the QB position. The QB rating was low for a reason - 1 TD, 2INTs, less than 200 yards. That's not good. So now that we've (hopefully) dispensed with these straw men, if you'd like I can repeat what I think were the main reasons for poor QB productivity (I won't elaborate - that's all above):

1) The defense
2) The injury
3) ? Nerves, weakness of character, too much Olivia, intestinal gas, other.


1 and 2 should be unarguable. If you want to propose other causes, feel free, but I'm not going to answer unless they have some good argument/evidence behind them. For example, The miss to Jordy on the short end zone pass resulted from a stumble out of his break, possibly due to some PI. I argue it's not Rodger's fault. The miss on the free play to Nelson was due to 1) good coverage by the defense limiting where the ball could be thrown and 2) poor pass due to (2) or (3) above - you tell me. The INT to Adams seemed like bad judgment, but it may have just been a bad throw.

It seems to me what you're looking for is someone to say emotively that Rodgers sucks - or sucked in the game, and to a certain extent, he did. But further, I think you want to blame some mystical, unknowable force from category (3) above. If so, go for it, enjoy, knock yourself out, it's fun!

[yetisnowman]

actually, no one is trying to deceive you or make apologies for Rodgers. There was poor production from the QB position. The QB rating was low for a reason - 1 TD, 2INTs, less than 200 yards. That's not good. So now that we've (hopefully) dispensed with these straw men, if you'd like I can repeat what I think were the main reasons for poor QB productivity (I won't elaborate - that's all above):

1) The defense
2) The injury
3) ? Nerves, weakness of character, too much Olivia, intestinal gas, other.


1 and 2 should be unarguable. If you want to propose other causes, feel free, but I'm not going to answer unless they have some good argument/evidence behind them. For example, The miss to Jordy on the short end zone pass resulted from a stumble out of his break, possibly due to some PI. I argue it's not Rodger's fault. The miss on the free play to Nelson was due to 1) good coverage by the defense limiting where the ball could be thrown and 2) poor pass due to (2) or (3) above - you tell me. The INT to Adams seemed like bad judgment, but it may have just been a bad throw.

It seems to me what you're looking for is someone to say emotively that Rodgers sucks - or sucked in the game, and to a certain extent, he did. But further, I think you want to blame some mystical, unknowable force from category (3) above. If so, go for it, enjoy, knock yourself out, it's fun!

Fair enough....no i don't think A-rod sucks nor do I want someone to say that he does. He is my favorite player in the NFL to watch on my favorite team. That being said I just don't believe that his injury or the defense caused his inaccuracy and poor performance, they may have been some contributing factors but I saw a lot of plays and throws left on the field. I didn't see a suffocating pass defense in which no one could get open. I saw a good pass defense that was on its heels and an o line that gave an MVP quarterback time to find those holes. He wasn't accurate and he didn't make good decisions. PERIOD.
I guess what I want is for people to stop letting their fandom get in the way of logical criticism. Rodgers is mediocre at best in the playoffs. There i said it. Yeah they are good defenses but guess what? that's who you face in the playoffs. And that's not going to change. I want people to acknowledge that the poor quarterback play is a big part of why we have come up short in the playoffs since the super bowl run. The elephant in the room is that we have a hall of fame quarterback that underperforms in the clutch. He had a great opportunity last week to put his stamp on a game that was begging for him to do it. You can say it was his calf, but I have seen to many other examples of him crumbling in big games, under adverse conditions, to buy that.

[mraynrand]

He wasn't accurate and he didn't make good decisions. PERIOD.

I take it you don't want a response.

[yetisnowman]

I take it you don't want a response.

By all means go ahead.....

I am surprised since joining this forum, at just how many people are not willing to put appropriate blame on Rodgers in general. I assumed it was a fringe-ish kind of thing, but apparently it is a vast majority.

[mraynrand]

By all means go ahead.....

I am surprised since joining this forum, at just how many people are not willing to put appropriate blame on Rodgers in general. I assumed it was a fringe-ish kind of thing, but apparently it is a vast majority.

I think that's where the difference is - we don't agree on what's 'appropriate.' But in my time here, I've seen plenty of criticism directed at Rodgers. The 'does he hold the ball too long?' discussions were epic.

[pbmax]

What would you do if Rodgers can be no more accurate on the bad wheel? Have him take a seat and put Flynn in? How do we judge how injured he was?

Precisely what was to be done differently? You win with the players you have on the field, not their Platonic ideal. Not enough made enough plays.

The antidote is not to insist, somehow, that Rodgers play better when injured or that Bostick, Peppers or Burnett get smarter in the offseason. Its to choose a strategy to maximize leverage when you have it. They at least should have valued a first down more than a negative run that drains clock at the end. And they should have valued another shot at a TD on at least one of their first two trips down to the 1 yard line.

[Pugger]

http://www.sportsgrid.com/nfl/how-aa...pionship-game/

[woodbuck27]

[QUOTE=yetisnowman;826181]

This seems nonsensical to me. Rodgers didn't cause Nelson to stumble out of his break, and he didn't call the running plays at the goal line. You have a lot to complain about, but I will just say that I disagree with you about the main reasons for a less than average performance by Rodgers. Again, my evidence is the performance of other good/great QBs against Seattle, and Rodgers' injuries.[/QUOT

What's nonsensical to me is that the A-rod apology camp talks about the game as though my eyeballs deceived me. He missed a td to jordy on the goal line. He missed him deep(likely a td) on a free play. And he threw a dumb pick to Sherman, and I dont care if he "thought" it was a penalty. If you throw a jump ball you better make sure its a free play and you physically saw the yellow flag. All inaccurate throws. And that is just the first quarter. If you want to argue that a leg injury makes him sporadically accurate, then i cant disprove that i guess. I still think it is silly and a cop out. the guy did not have a good game and Seattle was begging to be beat. Again you had a opposing qb having the worst game of his life, and you couldn't outplay him.

Yes the way that Russell Wilson played the Packers should have crushed Seattle.

Good analysis on missing the pass to Jordy Nelson. That was an easy six blown.

On the pick to Richard Sherman he threw the ball where 'only' Richard Sherman (a former WR) could catch that ball. Aaron Rodgers threw it inside directly to coverage and an easy pick for Richard Sherman. The Aaron Rodgers excuse of it should have been a free throw because of a Seattle penalty at the LOS doesn't wash after his poor throw.

On that day except for the TD pass to Randall Cobb and the late game tying FG drive that wasn't the Aaron Rodgers we usually see and expect or hope to see.

I know that the offense was trying some new stuff. I know the hurry up offense was out because of the 12th man issue but Aaron Rodgers looked different.

I really wonder if he was medicated? Did he have a head cold? Was he properly rested?

Something was abnormally wrong with Aaron Rodgers in the NFC Championship game.

[woodbuck27]

Aaron Rodgers Photo Stream NFC Championship Game - Seattle.

36 Photos.

http://www.zimbio.com/pictures/cSnyE...prev_next=prev

[woodbuck27]

http://www.sportsgrid.com/nfl/how-aa...pionship-game/

Seahawks DB Earl Thomas Hops On The ‘Aaron Rodgers Is Basically Black’ Bandwagon

http://www.sportsgrid.com/nfl/seahaw...ack-bandwagon/

[yetisnowman]

What would you do if Rodgers can be no more accurate on the bad wheel? Have him take a seat and put Flynn in? How do we judge how injured he was?

Precisely what was to be done differently? You win with the players you have on the field, not their Platonic ideal. Not enough made enough plays.

The antidote is not to insist, somehow, that Rodgers play better when injured or that Bostick, Peppers or Burnett get smarter in the offseason. Its to choose a strategy to maximize leverage when you have it. They at least should have valued a first down more than a negative run that drains clock at the end. And they should have valued another shot at a TD on at least one of their first two trips down to the 1 yard line.

I don't have a problem with McCarthy being conservative on the goal line. Just my opinion. He didn't feel comfortable because Seattle was getting such great penetration in those situations. You are right we don't know how Rodgers injury affected his accuracy, but I would bet if you asked him honestly he would say he missed a lot of plays that he should have made, injured or not. My insistance is that he needs to play better in the playoffs. That is the one consistent thing I have taken away from our playoff losses since 2010. He has underperformed. i don't see us having a shutdown defense any time soon, so we need to be able to win games by scoring over 20 points. Yes the coaching staff needs to revamp their schemes and strategies, but your MVP quarterback has to maximize the opportunities presented to him. He has failed to do that too often in my opinion. If he doesn't step up and play better in the playoffs we will continue to lose. That is the one variable that I feel is certain.

[pbmax]

Under performed just covers too much ground.

He had difficulty with the 49ers and their Cover 2 taking away what they do best. So is the solution to change the QB performance or do something with the offense? M3's answer was to lean heavier on the run game to make the team pay for playing Cover 2. Outside of running short crossing stuff like the Patriots and Broncos, that might be the Packers best answer until they find a TE who can also extract a price from a Cover 2.

Prior to Lacy, if you were a team that plays Cover 2 and can't rush the passer (recent Bears or current Bucs) then Rodgers will just move and wait for Cobb or Nelson to find a hole in the zone.

Last year with screens and this year with shakedowns, we began to see the old Holmgren WCO answer to tight coverage.

The Seahawks are another matter entirely. The Packers can run on them, but not when they leverage against it. However, this Packers team can pass block them, and in single safety, someone will be open. A healthy Rodgers puts 30 on this year's banged up Seahawks defense.