TE problem

[pbmax]

[url]
I saw a quote about Backman today that was a bit of a damning-with-faint-praise chuckle:

That's called damning with Hawk praise on the Packers.

Bostick had Mike McCarthy and Ted Thompson give up on him. That's not easy to come back from. I'm not saying they don't make mistakes, but they had at least two (three?) years to watch the kid not develop. He doesn't come back unless something else happens.

I don't agree that RichRod is less than decent at TE. He's picked up his blocking and Rodgers clearly trusts him. He does need to take making yourself open classes from Jones though.

McCarthy downplayed Q's prognosis, speaking only about this week. But I am doubt they add Guion and a TE this week.

[hoosier]

I thought about that. It really doesn't matter how valuable the player is that you use the IR-DR on. It is 100% about maximizing # of roster spots. All that matters is that the player deserves a roster spot, and Q meets that threshold. If Clay Matthews gets hurt, there is no particular advantage to IR-DR rather than having him on inactive list.

The valid reason to not IR-DR Q is that he may only be out for 4 weeks. You really want to get the full 8-week roster bonus out of deal. Parking a healthy guy on IR-DR is a waste.

I like the IR-DR for Q because he is not a premium player. 8 weeks of a replacement guy might be OK.

My point is that they could probably IR Quarless, sign a replacement off the street and not see much of a decline. Who, you ask? It doesn't matter.

[Patler]

Q might be an ideal candidate for IR-DR. As mentioned above, it is all about maximizing roster spots, and the Packers are getting close to having problems with active players. Bulaga, Adams, Burnett, Richardson, Goodson, Jones, all could be out in addition to Quarless. It would free up a spot for Guion, or someone else. In a few weeks the designation becomes irrelevant anyway. If it seems clear that Quarless will be out at least six weeks, you might as well use the designation.

[mraynrand]

My point is that they could probably IR Quarless, sign a replacement off the street and not see much of a decline. Who, you ask? It doesn't matter.

I agree. It's Perillo time. Perillo probably knows enough of the schemes and can put his beer barrel weight in there to block for the fatmobile.

[Maxie the Taxi]

I agree. It's Perillo time. Perillo probably knows enough of the schemes and can put his beer barrel weight in there to block for the fatmobile.

Well, Perillo is the same SIZE as Ron Kramer.

[mraynrand]

"Ron Kramer is murdering the Giants from his TE spot"

He's like a Ray Lewis out there!

[Patler]

My point is that they could probably IR Quarless, sign a replacement off the street and not see much of a decline. Who, you ask? It doesn't matter.

I agree. It's Perillo time. Perillo probably knows enough of the schemes and can put his beer barrel weight in there to block for the fatmobile.

If another tight end is injured somewhere down the road, it might be nice to have an experienced guy, like Quarless, available. Nothing requires you to bring them back. Anyone really valuable they will want back as soon as possible, 6 or 7 instead of 8 weeks. I doubt they will use it for a starter, unless they really expect him to be out 10 or 12 weeks, but have hope that he might get back sooner.

Regardless of the player, since they will have at least four games in the books by the time another player might be injured, the usefulness of the designation will be gone very soon.

[Maxie the Taxi]

"Ron Kramer is murdering the Giants from his TE spot"

He's like a Ray Lewis out there!

Kramer was the original "Gronk."

[Not the best highlight film for Maxie the Taxi's punting though. Check it out at about 1:39. I blame the sloppy, slippery field. ]

[Patler]

Kramer was the original "Gronk."

Then John Mackey came along, and everyone forgot Ron Kramer.

[Maxie the Taxi]

Then John Mackey came along, and everyone forgot Ron Kramer.

John who?

[Tony Oday]

4th round Pick to the Bears for Martellus Bennet.

[pbmax]

Kramer was the original "Gronk."

[Not the best highlight film for Maxie the Taxi's punting though. Check it out at about 1:39. I blame the sloppy, slippery field. ]

That game film must be where Mike Stock and Derrick Frost must have learned their trade.

I don't think anyone outside of Green Bay forgot about Ron Kramer directly. If they were like me and had to learn the from history, the only Packers that counted were Lombardi and Jerry Kramer. Maybe Bart Starr, but mostly because he was a coach at the time. When you got older and learned about Kenny Stabler, you heard about Paul Hornung. Browns fans knew who Jim Taylor was because they had to be ready at all times to defend Jim Brown as the greatest from that era.

Everyone then went about confusing Ron with Jerry Kramer because Jerry was all Dick Schaap could talk about.

You had to read Zimmerman or someone more steeped in actual football to learn about TE Kramer.

[hoosier]

Perillo probably knows enough of the schemes and can put his beer barrel weight in there to block for the fatmobile.

Nice image.

[Maxie the Taxi]

That game film must be where Mike Stock and Derrick Frost must have learned their trade.

I don't think anyone outside of Green Bay forgot about Ron Kramer directly. If they were like me and had to learn the from history, the only Packers that counted were Lombardi and Jerry Kramer. Maybe Bart Starr, but mostly because he was a coach at the time. When you got older and learned about Kenny Stabler, you heard about Paul Hornung. Browns fans knew who Jim Taylor was because they had to be ready at all times to defend Jim Brown as the greatest from that era.

Everyone then went about confusing Ron with Jerry Kramer because Jerry was all Dick Schaap could talk about.

You had to read Zimmerman or someone more steeped in actual football to learn about TE Kramer.

Hard for me to see these guys from a younger person's prospective, because I lived and died with the Pack during the Glory Years. At the time there was a lot of "who is the greater" type arguments: Taylor or Brown, Starr or Unitas, Adderley or Lem Barney, Nitschke or whoever, etc. Kramer was ahead of his time, the best tight end in his day IMO. It's hard to argue against the Packer players being the greatest. The best arguments against them was "they're great because the players surrounding them were great." Really? Maybe Taylor, Starr, Adderley, Robinson and Nitschke made the players around them great.

All I know is that at the time I wouldn't have traded ANY Packer star for their counterpart in the league.

By the way, McGee was actually a pretty good punter. He was famous for his freelanced fake punts, but he rarely made mistakes. One hell of an athlete who was probably the smartest guy on the team next to Starr.

[Patler]

Then John Mackey came along, and everyone forgot Ron Kramer.

John who?

Spoken like a true Packer fan!
(I think he played with another John or Johnny somebody at QB.)

[Bossman641]

I'd hate to use the IR-designation on Quarless. I believe the guy you use it on has to be out 8 weeks before he can return.

1 - Quarless isn't that good
2 - who knows who will get injured in the next few weeks. You could lose somebody week 7 and still bring them back at the end of the year.

Time for the FB to prove their worth.

[Patler]

Hard for me to see these guys from a younger person's prospective, because I lived and died with the Pack during the Glory Years. At the time there was a lot of "who is the greater" type arguments: Taylor or Brown, Starr or Unitas, Adderley or Lem Barney, Nitschke or whoever, etc. Kramer was ahead of his time, the best tight end in his day IMO. It's hard to argue against the Packer players being the greatest. The best arguments against them was "they're great because the players surrounding them were great." Really? Maybe Taylor, Starr, Adderley, Robinson and Nitschke made the players around them great.

All I know is that at the time I wouldn't have traded ANY Packer star for their counterpart in the league.

By the way, McGee was actually a pretty good punter. He was famous for his freelanced fake punts, but he rarely made mistakes. One hell of an athlete who was probably the smartest guy on the team next to Starr.

I agree with everything you wrote, and would add a number of other names to the "who is better" arguments that were common: the "Willies" on defense, Davis & Wood, as well as Henry Jordan and Forrest Gregg. What set the Packers apart is that the same Packers were in those debates for years, but the players against whom they were compared changed several times. For example, early in his career Adderley was compared to Lane, later in his career it was Barney. In the middle of his career guys like Fisher and LeBeau were compared to Adderley, but Adderley's greatness stood the test of time. The one Packer I remember who was compared to only one other for his entire career was Jim Taylor. The debate was Taylor vs Brown, with various occasional interlopers from time to time.

I agree that Ron Kramer was ahead of his time, and the best there was for a number of years; but when John Mackey got going, I think he took it to yet another level for TEs. As Kramer's career began winding down, about the time he went to Detroit, I remember admitting to myself that as good as Kramer had been, Mackey was/would be even better. (That was quite an admission for a Packer fan to make regarding a Colt, and one I have never made in the Unitas/Starr debate.)

[deake]

McGee was there before the glory years, it was 3 incomplete passes and "McGee in to punt". He didn't have to punt as much as in the glory years.

[Maxie the Taxi]

I agree with everything you wrote, and would add a number of other names to the "who is better" arguments that were common: the "Willies" on defense, Davis & Wood, as well as Henry Jordan and Forrest Gregg. What set the Packers apart is that the same Packers were in those debates for years, but the players against whom they were compared changed several times. For example, early in his career Adderley was compared to Lane, later in his career it was Barney. In the middle of his career guys like Fisher and LeBeau were compared to Adderley, but Adderley's greatness stood the test of time. The one Packer I remember who was compared to only one other for his entire career was Jim Taylor. The debate was Taylor vs Brown, with various occasional interlopers from time to time.

I agree that Ron Kramer was ahead of his time, and the best there was for a number of years; but when John Mackey got going, I think he took it to yet another level for TEs. As Kramer's career began winding down, about the time he went to Detroit, I remember admitting to myself that as good as Kramer had been, Mackey was/would be even better. (That was quite an admission for a Packer fan to make regarding a Colt, and one I have never made in the Unitas/Starr debate.)

I am still not willing to make that admission.

I think Mackey benefited greatly from the pass-oriented offense of Unitas and company. The Packers were more rush first and pass second. Kramer was a blocker first. If Mackey played for the Pack and Kramer for the Colts, their stats might be reversed and today's John Mackey Award might be the Ron Kramer Award.

At least that's my story and I'm sticking to it.

[Patler]

McGee was the punter when teams had few if any specialists. When rosters expanded to 40 in the mid '60s, there was room for a punting specialist, a kicking specialist, etc. But, in his time, McGee was a pretty good punter, as was Boyd Dowler for a few years.