More Banjo: Week 4 vs. New Orleans

[bobblehead]

This is an 8-8 team at the end of the season (at best) if Hundley progresses. Before that, the offense is below average so your looking at 4-12 to 6-10.

That would be solid for a first year starter. ARod was 6-10 his first year starting off of a 13-3 season. I hope he progresses and we finish 4-4 with him as starter. That would be a win and a feather in MMs cap in my book.

[bobblehead]

The Saints offense was very mediocre today and still gained 485 yards.

Correct. That happens when your own offense has a lot of 3 and outs and gives a TON of time to the other team.

[pbmax]

I'll have to look again too. Seems like your mixing together two types of options. The QB/RB option actually worked a little - probably would work even better with Kaepernick in there at QB, but maybe Hundley is faster at this point.

What I was taking about is play action passing from under center. I know the Packers run play action off pistol as well, but they were running off single running back look and Hundley under center. Seems like play action would work there and open things up a bit, in the passing game, especially if they aren't going to be able to run the Rodgers offense - especially extended plays and looking for receivers to come open after running primary pattern.

I get it. He wasn't under center much at all.

But I think had they stuck with that QB/RB mesh run option, they would have been better than dropping back out of the gun like they did in the second half. Even faking that mesh was sucking linebackers up. The problem was that New Orleans began to stuff that run. They faked the offense's left DE out of his shoes and Jones/Monty lost a yard because the dual double teams got buried on the right.

If you could block the optioned defender, I think passing out of it could have helped more.

[pbmax]

Apropos of nothing, this story about Steve Spurrier at Duke explains a lot about his college and pro career.

[mraynrand]

[Joemailman]

Randall Cobb:

“It’s going to be important for us to continue to build confidence in him to throw it to us in different situations. There were opportunities. Jordy and Davante got on top all day. There were a few inside as well with myself. We just have to continue to build that chemistry with Brett.”

Mike McCarthy:

“It was a challenge that I didn’t meet today,” McCarthy said. “He didn’t get comfortable in the pocket, and that’s my responsibility. So I did a poor job coaching.’

So was this the case of Hundley not seeing guys downfield because he was worried about the pressure? Do the Packers need to go with more protection?

[Cheesehead Craig]

My thoughts from being at Lambeau on Sunday:

- Crowd was real loud when Hundley was introduced before the game.
- Jones is fantastic. He really sees the field.
- On the Saints first TD run, the crowd knew that the Packers only had 10 players on the field.
- The Packers defense subbed players rather late and there seemed to be a lot of confusion rather often.
- Brees had all day to throw and the Packers played very soft off the LOS. They are just so afraid of being beat deep. The pass rush was brutal.
- Something is very wrong with Ha-Ha, there were several times he just held up from contact.
- Everybody loves Martinez
- On the play or two before the Pack settled for that awful 59 yd FG try, Cobb had his man beat by 3-4 yds on a post route for an easy TD, but the pressure didn't allow Hundley to see him.
- Quite often the WRs were blanketed. Nobody plays off of them at the LOS. Need to be a lot more picks and double moves.
- Hundley was late on a couple of throws where guys were open but he held the ball too long.
- Rain stopped mid way through the first quarter and there was some drizzle right before half.
- I'm now 0-3 at Lambeau. Someday I'll see that W.

[pbmax]

Randall Cobb:



Mike McCarthy:



So was this the case of Hundley not seeing guys downfield because he was worried about the pressure? Do the Packers need to go with more protection?

Someone wrote that Hundley is likely more familiar with Davis, Allison (not a coincidence he went in and got targeted twice quickly) and Janis.

Its going to take a little time to learn what is going to be open with each guy. But M3 can send one of Hundley's guys out there to help. Then call Adams/Jordy/Cobb's number.

[pbmax]

Heard this on radio about Defense:

26 points on 11 Saints possessions. It sounds reasonable. But its pretty poor. If you were to average this over the year, you would be in bottom sixth of League at 2.36 points per drive.

The data here isn't clean, so its an approximation. Things like end of half and kneel downs affect the numbers and when we get year end stats, all this gets sorted.

Its not a tire fire, but its flammable.

[call_me_ishmael]

The Packers will be looking better when they have Brooks, Matthews and Perry all rushing the passer on 3rd down. It's pretty clear pass rusher is the #1 need of this team in my opinion. I would not object to spending a #1 and a #2 on a pass rusher in the 2018 draft and shoe horning them in to fit on the rest of the plays.

[mraynrand]

- I'm now 0-3 at Lambeau. Someday I'll see that W.

You drew the wrong conclusion. You don't get to go to any more games.

[Pugger]

You drew the wrong conclusion. You don't get to go to any more games.

GMTA

[MadScientist]

Do we really want to end up 8-8? If we aren't gonna go deep into the playoffs what good is 8-8? I'm not saying let's tank but it wouldn't be the worst thing to have highish draft pick for a change to inject more talent in this team for when Rodgers returns in 2018.

The NO game made the Packers look like they would struggle to win any more games this season. The one reason going 8-8 or 9-7 would be good for the Packers even if they don't make the playoffs is that it would mean that Hundley starts playing at a high level. If he finishes the season hot, he will be very hot property during the off season. If a crappy team in need of a QB gets shut out of the top college QB's, the Packers may be able to turn Hundley into a very high pick and fill one the big holes they have.

[denverYooper]

Someone wrote that Hundley is likely more familiar with Davis, Allison (not a coincidence he went in and got targeted twice quickly) and Janis.

Its going to take a little time to learn what is going to be open with each guy. But M3 can send one of Hundley's guys out there to help. Then call Adams/Jordy/Cobb's number.

IIRC, Rodgers had chemistry with Jennings and James Jones from playing with them on the scout team when he stepped into that Cowboys game in 2007. I thought he mentioned at the time that he had spent a lot of time working with those guys and was comfortable throwing to them.

[denverYooper]

I thought the backbreaker yesterday was the holding call that negated Davis's 45 yard return. After that, the offense got backed up and then the Saints got the ball at midfield to set up the winning score. There's still a good chance they would have lost at the end, but the game likely would have remained close until then.

The penalty to take them out of FG range at the end of the 2nd half didn't help either.

All of these little things get magnified without Rodgers to make up for them.

[pbmax]

I thought the backbreaker yesterday was the holding call that negated Davis's 45 yard return. After that, the offense got backed up and then the Saints got the ball at midfield to set up the winning score. There's still a good chance they would have lost at the end, but the game likely would have remained close until then.

The penalty to take them out of FG range at the end of the 2nd half didn't help either.

All of these little things get magnified without Rodgers to make up for them.

Twitter is yelling about having a TO left at the end of the half and not throwing again when (with the TO) you could throw to the middle of the field. What do you think?

http://www.nfl.com/liveupdate/gamece...B_Gamebook.pdf

1-10-GB 19 (1:23) (Shotgun) B.Hundley pass short right to A.Jones to GB 21 for 2 yards (A.Klein).
Timeout #2 by NO at 01:17.

2-8-GB 21 (1:17) (Shotgun) B.Hundley pass short left to A.Jones to GB 25 for 4 yards (K.Vaccaro, A.Okafor).
Timeout #3 by NO at 01:01.

3-4-GB 25 (1:01) (Shotgun) B.Hundley pass short middle to G.Allison to GB 39 for 14 yards (M.Williams, C.Robertson). P10

1-10-GB 39 (:32) (No Huddle, Shotgun) B.Hundley pass incomplete short right to G.Allison.

2-10-GB 39 (:29) (Shotgun) B.Hundley pass incomplete deep left to M.Bennett.
PENALTY on NO-V.Bell, Defensive Pass Interference, 25 yards, enforced at GB 39 - No Play. X11

1-10-NO 36 (:24) (No Huddle, Shotgun) B.Hundley pass incomplete short right to R.Cobb.
PENALTY on NO-K.Crawley, Defensive Holding, 5 yards, enforced at NO 36 - No Play. X12

1-10-NO 31 (:18) (Shotgun) B.Hundley pass incomplete short left to R.Rodgers.
PENALTY on GB-R.Rodgers, Offensive Pass Interference, 10 yards, enforced at NO 31 - No Play.

1-20-NO 41 (:13) (Shotgun) B.Hundley pass incomplete short left to A.Jones.

2-20-NO 41 (:06) M.Crosby 59 yard field goal is No Good, Short, Center-T.Pepper, Holder-J.Vogel.


Maybe? Hell of a thing to hang your hat on though. 1 second to pay with. Plus look at Hundley during this drive. 8 passes, 3 complete for 20 yards, two misses got them in field position for FG with 30 yards of penalties. One of those incompletions gave 10 of those back on RichRod's penalty.

I see a lot of ways that goes bad on 3rd down.

[mraynrand]

IIRC, Rodgers had chemistry with Jennings and James Jones from playing with them on the scout team when he stepped into that Cowboys game in 2007. I thought he mentioned at the time that he had spent a lot of time working with those guys and was comfortable throwing to them.

I watched Rodgers throw to Jennings before the Detroit game that year for almost half an hour. Did the whole tree three time then a lot of special stuff like the side line 'toes in' throws and a lot of back shoulder throws. They looked totally in synch. That's when I first thought Rodgers would be good.

Stubby may have to give Geronimo and Rich Rod or whomever Hundley is more comfy with a few more touches. (But no drops Geronimo!)

[denverYooper]

I watched Rodgers throw to Jennings before the Detroit game that year for almost half an hour. Did the whole tree three time then a lot of special stuff like the side line 'toes in' throws and a lot of back shoulder throws. They looked totally in synch. That's when I first thought Rodgers would be good.

Stubby may have to give Geronimo and Rich Rod or whomever Hundley is more comfy with a few more touches. (But no drops Geronimo!)

I was hoping we might see a shot or two to Davis but I don't recall him being on the field on offense. Heck, maybe they should look at how NO uses Ginn and steal some of those plays.

[King Friday]

Let's face it. In this game, Hundley was not ready for prime time. Jones, on the other hand, looks to be the real deal.

To me, both of these items are critical indictments on McCarthy's ability as a head coach.

Hundley was supposed to be a great young QB who could step in and do just as well as Matt Flynn used to. If you have to dial up a game plan that looked more like one from 100 years ago for your #2 QB, then you have the wrong #2 QB. I don't give a crap about the OL or anything else...the Packers are playing to win, and it is basically impossible to win in the modern NFL with only a handful of throws more than 10-15 yards downfield. So McCarthy set the team up for failure.

Jones started the season stashed way down the depth chart, yet he clearly is the best RB we have on the roster. McCarthy wasn't able to see that before injuries finally gave Jones a chance on the field? Either Jones only shows up to play on Sundays (doubtful) or McCarthy does not have the ability to identify talent very well at the RB position.

I think the rest of this season is going to be very poor...because McCarthy really isn't that good of a coach. Rodgers may only get 1 SB appearance in his entire career...and if that happens, I put the entire blame on Stubby.

[denverYooper]

To me, both of these items are critical indictments on McCarthy's ability as a head coach.

Hundley was supposed to be a great young QB who could step in and do just as well as Matt Flynn used to. If you have to dial up a game plan that looked more like one from 100 years ago for your #2 QB, then you have the wrong #2 QB. I don't give a crap about the OL or anything else...the Packers are playing to win, and it is basically impossible to win in the modern NFL with only a handful of throws more than 10-15 yards downfield. So McCarthy set the team up for failure.

Jones started the season stashed way down the depth chart, yet he clearly is the best RB we have on the roster. McCarthy wasn't able to see that before injuries finally gave Jones a chance on the field? Either Jones only shows up to play on Sundays (doubtful) or McCarthy does not have the ability to identify talent very well at the RB position.

I think the rest of this season is going to be very poor...because McCarthy really isn't that good of a coach. Rodgers may only get 1 SB appearance in his entire career...and if that happens, I put the entire blame on Stubby.