More Banjo: Week 9 vs. Detroit

[beveaux1]

I watched the game late last night.
My thoughts on the game:

1. It looked like Jones got away with a minor OPI on Detroit's first TD.
2. On the second punt, Janis's speed was evident. That boy can fly. Too bad he can't catch.
3. The first half did not look like a good game for Aaron Jones, Blake Martinez, or Kenny Clark. Of course, they could've been playing fine, but none of them jumped off the screen like they've been doing all year. Only Martinez started flashing in the second half, but still subpar vs prior games.
4. Back to back non calls of obvious DPIs against Slay after the fumble. Those were both terrible. I qualify that by imagining if the situations were reversed (i.e. GB defending). If I saw Randall doing that, I'd've been furious he caused us those penalties.
5. Stafford was pinpoint tonight. It was a very accurate night for him. He completed so many passes in really tight coverage.
5. When Hundley started throwing the ball down the field, he made some good passes. Too bad the D couldn't help him.

And to those who are complaining about the tire fire on defense, the only thing missing is pass rush. It's vastly superior than the years when the Packers couldn't even stop Fritz's grandma from running wild (God rest her soul). Maybe Capers isn't the answer. I don't know, but I suspect people are just tired of the devil they know and assume the devil they don't know will be better. The run defense is more consistent, the defensive backs are young and improving (Randall has been consistent since his benching, King flashes enough to think he's Big Time, Jones just needs seasoning).

I suspect next week the offense will be even better. The last time Rodgers was out for an extended period, the Packers didn't win for five weeks. They went from 5-2 to 5-6-1. This time they don't have their backup out for the season after one series, they're third string is still on the bench, and they don't have to go to a retread (yet) to show an offense that can move the ball. They just need consistency which requires experience to build.

The biggest disappointment to me was the absence of Aaron Jones. Can he not run it against a stacked box at all? Monty did more than him, but Monty has demonstrated he is not as skilled in space. Maybe timing of opportunities.

I, too, see the same thing you do on defense. Our run D is decent, our coverage is much better than last year, but our pass rush is hopeless. The best outside pass rusher we have is Matthews and he only comes to play a couple of times a game. Perry has shown next to nothing rushing, although he is a good run defender. Fackrell's number is never called. Brooks may have been the best edge rusher, but he's only played a couple of games after having very little injury history.

I'm not even seeing a push from the inside. Last year, Jones, Pepper, and Daniels got some inside rush and pushed the pocket a little allowing Perry and Matthews to pick up sacks. This year, Daniels, Clark, and Lowry get very little push although they play the run well.

I suspect that the lack of inside pressure is the biggest difference in our pass rush.

[ThunderDan]

Yes. I predict the offense will look better next week. Even the Packers offense with Rodgers looks that bad sometimes (the first half reminded me a lot of late 2015/early 2016). I don't think the D is as bad overall as many people on here claim. I think they had a bad game. I don't think the O is as permanently bad as it appeared yesterday. I think Hundley will keep improving, but yesterday was not all on him. Far from it.

Trubisky might outplay Hundley (Top 5 pick vs Round 5 pick), but we'll see (I haven't watched any Bears games, so I have no idea how quickly Trubi is picking up the NFL pace).

Just thinking of the games we saw at Lambeau this year. The first half of the CIN game and the first half of the DET the offensive production was about the same. The Packers got booed off the field at halftime against CIN.

[Smidgeon]

I watched the game late last night.
My thoughts on the game:

1. It looked like Jones got away with a minor OPI on Detroit's first TD.
2. On the second punt, Janis's speed was evident. That boy can fly. Too bad he can't catch.
3. The first half did not look like a good game for Aaron Jones, Blake Martinez, or Kenny Clark. Of course, they could've been playing fine, but none of them jumped off the screen like they've been doing all year. Only Martinez started flashing in the second half, but still subpar vs prior games.
4. Back to back non calls of obvious DPIs against Slay after the fumble. Those were both terrible. I qualify that by imagining if the situations were reversed (i.e. GB defending). If I saw Randall doing that, I'd've been furious he caused us those penalties.
5. Stafford was pinpoint tonight. It was a very accurate night for him. He completed so many passes in really tight coverage.
5. When Hundley started throwing the ball down the field, he made some good passes. Too bad the D couldn't help him.

And to those who are complaining about the tire fire on defense, the only thing missing is pass rush. It's vastly superior than the years when the Packers couldn't even stop Fritz's grandma from running wild (God rest her soul). Maybe Capers isn't the answer. I don't know, but I suspect people are just tired of the devil they know and assume the devil they don't know will be better. The run defense is more consistent, the defensive backs are young and improving (Randall has been consistent since his benching, King flashes enough to think he's Big Time, Jones just needs seasoning).

I suspect next week the offense will be even better. The last time Rodgers was out for an extended period, the Packers didn't win for five weeks. They went from 5-2 to 5-6-1. This time they don't have their backup out for the season after one series, they're third string is still on the bench, and they don't have to go to a retread (yet) to show an offense that can move the ball. They just need consistency which requires experience to build.

The biggest disappointment to me was the absence of Aaron Jones. Can he not run it against a stacked box at all? Monty did more than him, but Monty has demonstrated he is not as skilled in space. Maybe timing of opportunities.

6.
their

[beveaux1]

I watched the game late last night.
My thoughts on the game:

1. It looked like Jones got away with a minor OPI on Detroit's first TD.
2. On the second punt, Janis's speed was evident. That boy can fly. Too bad he can't catch.
3. The first half did not look like a good game for Aaron Jones, Blake Martinez, or Kenny Clark. Of course, they could've been playing fine, but none of them jumped off the screen like they've been doing all year. Only Martinez started flashing in the second half, but still subpar vs prior games.
4. Back to back non calls of obvious DPIs against Slay after the fumble. Those were both terrible. I qualify that by imagining if the situations were reversed (i.e. GB defending). If I saw Randall doing that, I'd've been furious he caused us those penalties.
5. Stafford was pinpoint tonight. It was a very accurate night for him. He completed so many passes in really tight coverage.
5. When Hundley started throwing the ball down the field, he made some good passes. Too bad the D couldn't help him.

And to those who are complaining about the tire fire on defense, the only thing missing is pass rush. It's vastly superior than the years when the Packers couldn't even stop Fritz's grandma from running wild (God rest her soul). Maybe Capers isn't the answer. I don't know, but I suspect people are just tired of the devil they know and assume the devil they don't know will be better. The run defense is more consistent, the defensive backs are young and improving (Randall has been consistent since his benching, King flashes enough to think he's Big Time, Jones just needs seasoning).

I suspect next week the offense will be even better. The last time Rodgers was out for an extended period, the Packers didn't win for five weeks. They went from 5-2 to 5-6-1. This time they don't have their backup out for the season after one series, they're third string is still on the bench, and they don't have to go to a retread (yet) to show an offense that can move the ball. They just need consistency which requires experience to build.

The biggest disappointment to me was the absence of Aaron Jones. Can he not run it against a stacked box at all? Monty did more than him, but Monty has demonstrated he is not as skilled in space. Maybe timing of opportunities.

The offense may well be better next week. The passing attack improved over their last game even though a lot of improvement may have been caused by slack, late game defense on Detroit's part.

I suspect that we'll make a game of it in Chicago. We'll be facing a rookie QB who won't be far along on his progressions and reads, but we'll still have to put some pressure on him. That will be easier said than done. This is much closer to an even match up, although I'd probably say Chicago will be favored because of a better defense and home field.

[beveaux1]

I just don't think we had reasonable expectations for this team after Rodgers went down. We ended last year in the NFC championship game with a defense that had Gunter as our top CB, an aging Peppers as our 2nd leading pass rusher, and one of the most atrocious pass defenses I've ever seen. We couldn't cover ANY receiver with our collection of street CBs and beat-up draft pick CBs.

Drafting at the end of the first round, we made a decision to add speed to our DBs with King and Jones. We took Biegel as a pass rusher and Adams as a DL. We signed House, didn't sign Peppers, and let D. Jones go. I can't remember anybody on this board saying that we needed to keep Peppers and D. Jones. Better to let them leave one year early than one year late. Unfortunately, Biegel and Adams got hurt either before or during training camp.

When it was obvious in training camp that Fackrell and Elliott couldn't replace Peppers, we signed Brooks who was not normally injury prone. Two games into the season, he got injured.

Our CBs have actually covered much better than they did last year, even with the sometimes bone-headed play of King and Randall. King looks like he might turn out to be a player and Randall has definitely improved the past 4 games. House has been steady most of the year. J. Jones has been hot and cold but has shown flashes. Our DBs, with the exception of Dix, looks much improved over last year.

Martinez has taken the jump at ILB and may be the best we've had at that position since Barnett. DL has been steady against the run. Clark looks like a keeper, Lowry has been better than most thought, and Daniels has been great in run D.

We all knew we had a weakness in our pass rush. Maybe we should have taken Watt, but as bad as our secondary was, I don't fault us for taking King. We had two glaring holes to address and our pass rush was much better than our CB play in 2016. I certainly didn't think the loss of Peppers and D. Jones would affect us like it has. Our pass rush makes us a below average to poor defense even with the overall improvement in our DB play.

With this defense and a 5th round QB with little to no experience, how could we reasonably expect to win more than half of our remaining games and stay in the playoff race. I think it would be reasonable for us to play competitively against teams in the same shape we're in...teams that have young, inexperienced QBs and teams that were not built around their defense.

With Rodgers, in a weak NFC, we may have gone to a Super Bowl. This year, without Rodgers, we may have a top 10 draft pick. I think it's unreasonable to think otherwise.

[Smidgeon]

I just don't think we had reasonable expectations for this team after Rodgers went down. We ended last year in the NFC championship game with a defense that had Gunter as our top CB, an aging Peppers as our 2nd leading pass rusher, and one of the most atrocious pass defenses I've ever seen. We couldn't cover ANY receiver with our collection of street CBs and beat-up draft pick CBs.

Drafting at the end of the first round, we made a decision to add speed to our DBs with King and Jones. We took Biegel as a pass rusher and Adams as a DL. We signed House, didn't sign Peppers, and let D. Jones go. I can't remember anybody on this board saying that we needed to keep Peppers and D. Jones. Better to let them leave one year early than one year late. Unfortunately, Biegel and Adams got hurt either before or during training camp.

When it was obvious in training camp that Fackrell and Elliott couldn't replace Peppers, we signed Brooks who was not normally injury prone. Two games into the season, he got injured.

Our CBs have actually covered much better than they did last year, even with the sometimes bone-headed play of King and Randall. King looks like he might turn out to be a player and Randall has definitely improved the past 4 games. House has been steady most of the year. J. Jones has been hot and cold but has shown flashes. Our DBs, with the exception of Dix, looks much improved over last year.

Martinez has taken the jump at ILB and may be the best we've had at that position since Barnett. DL has been steady against the run. Clark looks like a keeper, Lowry has been better than most thought, and Daniels has been great in run D.

We all knew we had a weakness in our pass rush. Maybe we should have taken Watt, but as bad as our secondary was, I don't fault us for taking King. We had two glaring holes to address and our pass rush was much better than our CB play in 2016. I certainly didn't think the loss of Peppers and D. Jones would affect us like it has. Our pass rush makes us a below average to poor defense even with the overall improvement in our DB play.

With this defense and a 5th round QB with little to no experience, how could we reasonably expect to win more than half of our remaining games and stay in the playoff race. I think it would be reasonable for us to play competitively against teams in the same shape we're in...teams that have young, inexperienced QBs and teams that were not built around their defense.

With Rodgers, in a weak NFC, we may have gone to a Super Bowl. This year, without Rodgers, we may have a top 10 draft pick. I think it's unreasonable to think otherwise.

I also don't think it's an indictment against the Packers coaches (or even the GM). It was a bad game, but like I said before, the Packers have those with Rodgers too. And Hundley--though still a work in progress--was not the reason they lost yesterday. Regarding the coaches and GM, let the greater body of work be what they're measured on.

[Teamcheez1]

Burnett already ruled out Sunday against the Bears.

Expect more "communication" issues as receivers run free.

[Rutnstrut]

Why did Aaron Jones disappear last night?

Rushing ATT YDS TD LG

T. Montgomery 5 33 0 9
B. Hundley 4 22 1 12

A. Jones 5 12 0 4

T. Davis 1 9 0 9
R. Cobb 1 1 0 1
J. Williams 1 1 1 1T

Was it because he missed a BLOCK?

The O-line sucked and stubby got nervous and didn't let him get lathered up.

[Rutnstrut]

I also don't think it's an indictment against the Packers coaches (or even the GM). It was a bad game, but like I said before, the Packers have those with Rodgers too. And Hundley--though still a work in progress--was not the reason they lost yesterday. Regarding the coaches and GM, let the greater body of work be what they're measured on.

Wow, you buy the Kool-aid in bulk don't you?

[pbmax]

From PFT:

Unlike the Packers defense, the Green Bay cops actually stopped some people Monday night.

ZING!

[Pugger]

I just don't think we had reasonable expectations for this team after Rodgers went down. We ended last year in the NFC championship game with a defense that had Gunter as our top CB, an aging Peppers as our 2nd leading pass rusher, and one of the most atrocious pass defenses I've ever seen. We couldn't cover ANY receiver with our collection of street CBs and beat-up draft pick CBs.

Drafting at the end of the first round, we made a decision to add speed to our DBs with King and Jones. We took Biegel as a pass rusher and Adams as a DL. We signed House, didn't sign Peppers, and let D. Jones go. I can't remember anybody on this board saying that we needed to keep Peppers and D. Jones. Better to let them leave one year early than one year late. Unfortunately, Biegel and Adams got hurt either before or during training camp.

When it was obvious in training camp that Fackrell and Elliott couldn't replace Peppers, we signed Brooks who was not normally injury prone. Two games into the season, he got injured.

Our CBs have actually covered much better than they did last year, even with the sometimes bone-headed play of King and Randall. King looks like he might turn out to be a player and Randall has definitely improved the past 4 games. House has been steady most of the year. J. Jones has been hot and cold but has shown flashes. Our DBs, with the exception of Dix, looks much improved over last year.

Martinez has taken the jump at ILB and may be the best we've had at that position since Barnett. DL has been steady against the run. Clark looks like a keeper, Lowry has been better than most thought, and Daniels has been great in run D.

We all knew we had a weakness in our pass rush. Maybe we should have taken Watt, but as bad as our secondary was, I don't fault us for taking King. We had two glaring holes to address and our pass rush was much better than our CB play in 2016. I certainly didn't think the loss of Peppers and D. Jones would affect us like it has. Our pass rush makes us a below average to poor defense even with the overall improvement in our DB play.

With this defense and a 5th round QB with little to no experience, how could we reasonably expect to win more than half of our remaining games and stay in the playoff race. I think it would be reasonable for us to play competitively against teams in the same shape we're in...teams that have young, inexperienced QBs and teams that were not built around their defense.

With Rodgers, in a weak NFC, we may have gone to a Super Bowl. This year, without Rodgers, we may have a top 10 draft pick. I think it's unreasonable to think otherwise.

Another great post!

I agree, having a poor pass rush is what is killing this defense. You can't expect to win many games when you can't force your opposition to punt. Let's hope this lost season isn't all for naught and we can get a real difference maker on the EDGE this spring. Fix that and a lot of our defensive issues disappear. I hope Capers disappears too.

[esoxx]

If only we had realized going in to the season the pass rush needed to be improved. And improved by a lot.

Not exactly groundbreaking stuff here.

[mraynrand]

If only we had realized going in to the season the pass rush needed to be improved. And improved by a lot.

Not exactly groundbreaking stuff here.

OK let's look back. What should have been done differently?

[esoxx]

OK let's look back. What should have been done differently?

The problem is systemic and goes back some time now. The larger point is for any one now just coming to the conclusion our pass rush is anemic and we really need to address that this offseason....well no shit.

[pbmax]

Homegrown pass rush has been very hard to come by. Even Clark and Lowry, who broke the poor big man draft streak, aren't QB hunters.

So you have to find them elsewhere. Fackrell hasn't stepped up and Brooks has been hurt and pedestrian.

I think drafting freaks like Fackrell is the future, Ted went all in on tall, athletic traits on defense this year and KF fits that bill. You keep digging that mine or you tank and get one in the top 8 of the draft.