Georgia TE Darnell Washington will go in the first round. I would like to see him bend a little better but his lead blocking, kick out blocks, and even his pass blocking is so damn good you don't even care what you get out of him as a pass catcher
Georgia TE Darnell Washington will go in the first round. I would like to see him bend a little better but his lead blocking, kick out blocks, and even his pass blocking is so damn good you don't even care what you get out of him as a pass catcher
HOFer
Not much to add to "my guys" list after watching off ball LBs. I like a guy that is projected to go undrafted, Isaiah Moore. Jeremy Banks had solid tape too, but he has HUGE character concerns. Kyle Soelle is one of the few LBs that are 6'3" 230+ in the draft with a RAS score of 9.25. I'm only adding Moore to the list though.
QB Clayton Tune
RB Roschon Johnson
FB/TE/RB Hunter Luepke
WR Jonathan Mingo
WR Grant DuBose
WR Matt Landers
TE Luke Schoonmaker
OT/OG Peter Skoronski
OT Nick Saldiveri
OT Earl Bostick
IOL Ricky Stromberg
IOL Jon Gaines
IOL Braeden Daniels
DT Mazi Smith
DT Keeanu Benton
LB Jack Campbell
LB Isaiah Moore
CB D.J. Turner
S Jason Taylor
"There's a lot of interest in the draft. It's great. But quite frankly, most of the people that are commenting on it don't know anything about what they are talking about."--Ted Thompson
Packers list of official visits so far. Last year Packers drafted 6 players they visited with.
1. TE Darnell Washington, Georgia
2. OLB Will McDonald IV, Iowa State
3. S Jordan Howden, Minnesota
4. DB Jammie Robinson, Florida State
5. WR Dontayvion Wicks, Virginia
6. RB Keaton Mitchell, East Carolina
7. S/LB Marte Mapu, Sacramento State
8. QB Hendon Hooker, Tennessee
9. OT Darnell Wright, Tennessee
10. OLB/DL Keion White, Georgia Tech
11. RB Lew Nichols III, Central Michigan
12. QB Sean Clifford, Penn State
13. RB Evan Hull, Northwestern
14. DL Jaquelin Roy, LSU
15. TE Dalton Kincaid, Utah
16. OLB/DL Adetomiwa Adebawore, Northwestern
17. TE Ben Sims, Baylor
Ring the bells that still can ring
Forget your perfect offering
There is a crack, a crack in everything
That's how the light gets in - Leonard Cohen
and an additional 3 players spent time on the roster/practice squad. Definitely worth watching to see who they bring in.Packers list of official visits so far. Last year Packers drafted 6 players they visited with.
HOFer
The Packers have years like that and then other years when they draft very few of the guys from their official visits. Daniel Jeremiah said that teams don't really play games with their visits though (i.e. bringing guys that they are not interested in to throw off who they really are interested in). He said teams will bring in about 10 guys they don't have medicals on, 10-15 guys they really haven't gotten to talk to a lot (many are guys that were off their radar, but they had big Pro Days), and maybe 5 guys that have character concerns. Basically, they bring in guys that they need more information about--filling in their scouting reports.
"There's a lot of interest in the draft. It's great. But quite frankly, most of the people that are commenting on it don't know anything about what they are talking about."--Ted Thompson
Agree. I think a lot of times it's players they didn't know much (or enough about) and they're gathering information. Devonte Wyatt, Sam Williams and George Pickens (all visits last year) had some off-field or character concerns and they likely wanted to get a feel for them in the building. They talk to a lot of the players at the bowl games or combine but it's not a lot of time -- IIRC they get 15 minutes and that's it. I'd expect if you're going to draft someone you want to make sure they love the game and the money won't turn them into Cletidus , but also that they aren't a dirtbag who makes GB look like they employ criminal idiots. Locker room chemistry/fit plays a big part, as well as any additional medical or on-field testing they might want to do. Basically like any job interview - bringing them in for a closer look to determine if they're a good fit.Originally Posted by HarveyWallbangers
I know TT used them more for subterfuge, and occasionally they still do, but I think that's a waste of everyone's time.
Packers supposedly brought/bringing in Michael Mayer for a visit.
https://packerswire.usatoday.com/202...-michael-mayer
Updated (not sure how up to date) list of Packers pre-draft visits. 5 TE's so far.
1. TE Darnell Washington, Georgia
2. OLB Will McDonald IV, Iowa State
3. S Jordan Howden, Minnesota
4. DB Jammie Robinson, Florida State
5. WR Dontayvion Wicks, Virginia
6. RB Keaton Mitchell, East Carolina
7. S/LB Marte Mapu, Sacramento State
8. QB Hendon Hooker, Tennessee
9. OT Darnell Wright, Tennessee
10. OLB/DL Keion White, Georgia Tech
11. RB Lew Nichols III, Central Michigan
12. QB Sean Clifford, Penn State
13. RB Evan Hull, Northwestern
14. DL Jaquelin Roy, LSU
15. TE Dalton Kincaid, Utah
16. OLB/DL Adetomiwa Adebawore, Northwestern
17. TE Ben Sims, Baylor
18. TE Michael Mayer, Notre Dame
19. OL Atonio Mafi, UCLA
20. CB Tyrique Stevenson, Miami
21. WR Cole Tucker, NIU
22. TE Josh Whyle, Cincinnati
Ring the bells that still can ring
Forget your perfect offering
There is a crack, a crack in everything
That's how the light gets in - Leonard Cohen
List of attendees to NFL draft night:
WR Jordan Addison, USC
EDGE Will Anderson Jr., Alabama
S Brian Branch, Alabama
DL Jalen Carter, Georgia
WR Zay Flowers, Boston College
CB Christian Gonzalez, Oregon
OT Paris Johnson Jr., Ohio State
QB Will Levis, Kentucky
CB Joey Porter Jr, Penn State
QB Anthony Richardson, Florida
RB Bijan Robinson, Texas
WR Jaxon Smith-Njigba, Ohio State
QB C.J. Stroud, Ohio State
EDGE Keion White, Georgia Tech
EDGE Tyree Wilson, Texas Tech
CB Devon Witherspoon, Illinois
QB Bryce Young, Alabama
Not a TE among them. Interesting.
Also, Keion White? I know GB brought him in for a visit, but I'm sort-of hoping he's not their pick at 15. Dude is a very raw prospect...and he's already 24.
One of the great sources of tension on that night is watching to see which one of those guys doesn't get picked . . . doesn't get picked . . . doesn't get picked . . . and suddenly you can see the anguish in the guy's face as the other guys are celebrating being chosen so high in the draft. It's a really uncomfortable yet compelling part of the entertainment.
"The Devine era is actually worse than you remember if you go back and look at it."
KYPack
Agree it can be good drama, but after a while you feel for some of these kids who have to sit all night. I'm not sure some of these guys should be R1 picks, but the NFL does their homework to avoid inviting guys who aren't getting sufficient interest or back-channel guarantees they'll be picked.
What I've been hearing is that by the middle of the first round, you're basically picking a Round 2 caliber player this year...so who knows.
Is it just me, or has that been the case the last couple of years? Scouts or insiders saying that the first round doesn't actually have thirty-two guys with first-round grades?
I'm waiting for the day when some GM comes out and says his team has, say, thirty-nine guys with first round grades.
"The Devine era is actually worse than you remember if you go back and look at it."
KYPack
It's usually the case. I'd laugh if someone said they had that many.
I've heard this is one of the weakest drafts in recent history, but there are still areas of strength within it (EDGE, TE, CB). I think it's got some decent depth in the R2-4 range, but don't think it's a strong/deep draft.
HOFer
Interesting post on reddit.
https://www.reddit.com/r/GreenBayPac..._30_visits_as/
Every Packers Predraft Visit AND Top 30 Visits (As of 4/17/23)
East-West Shrine Bowl:
Toledo DL Desjuan Johnson
Michigan State TE Daniel Barker
Hula Bowl:
Oregon State WR Tyjon Lindsey
Lane College Edge Andrew Farmer II
Senior Bowl:
TCU QB Max Duggan
Princeton WR Andrei Iosivas
Chattanooga OL McClendon Curtis
Florida OL Richard Gouraige
Michigan C Olusegun Oluwatimi
TCU LB Dee Winters
Central Michigan EDGE Thomas Incoom
Tropical Bowl:
Oklahoma DB Justin Broiles
Vanderbuilt S Maxwell Worship
NFLPA Bowl:
ECU QB Holton Ahlers (3x)
NFL Combine:
BYU QB Jaren Hall
TCU WR Quentin Johnson
Michigan State WR Jayden Reed
Ohio State WR Jaxon Smith-Njigba (multiple visits)
Boston College WR Zay Flowers
Houston WR Tank Dell (informal)
Tennessee WR Jalin Hyatt (Formal)
Alabama WR Jalen Wayne
Notre Dame TE Michael Mayer
Utah TE Dalton Kincaid (Formal)
Georgia TE Darnell Washington (Formal)
Oregon State TE Luke Musgrave (Formal)
Michigan TE Luke Schoonmaker (Formal)
SDSU TE Tucker Kraft
Northwestern OT Peter Skoronski (Formal)
Ohio State OT Paris Johnson Jr (Formal)
Ohio State OT Dawand Jones
NDSU OL Cody Mauch
Auburn LB Derick Hall
Alabama S Jordan Battle
Alabama S Brian Branch (Formal)
Boise State JL Skinner
Oregon State DB Rezjohn Wright (Informal)
Iowa DB Riley Moss
Georgia CB Kelee Ringo
Alabama CB Eli Ricks (Formal)
Oregon CB Christian Gonzalez
Kansas State CB Julius Brents
Iowa EDGE Luke Van Ness
Michigan DT Mazi Smith
Northwestern DL Adetomiwa Adebawore
Texas DL Keondre Coburn
Players Pro Day:
Utah State QB Luke Bonner
Appalachian State LB Nick Hamton
Mississippi State Edge Randy Charlton
Pittsburg Edge Habakkuk Baldonado
Pittsburg DL Deslin Alexandre
Iowa State DL MJ Anderson
Unspecified:
Tennessee QB Hendon Hooker
Stanford QB Tanner McKee
USC RB Travis Dye
Langston RB Tahj Davidson (Informal)
Northern Colorado RB Elijah Dotson
Northwestern RB Evan Hull (Informal)
Southeast Missouri State C Shyron Rodgers
Hawaii OL Ilm Manning
Florida LB Ventrell Miller
Florida S Trey Dean
Virtual Visits:
Arkansas WR Jadon Haselwood
North Dakota WR Garett Maag
Iowa TE Sam LaPorta
Penn State C Juice Scruggs
Minnesota C John Michael Schmitz
Maryland OT Jaelyn Duncan
Mississippi State DL Cameron Young
Top 30 Visits:
Offense:
QB Hendon Hooker - Tennessee
QB Sean Clifford - Penn State
RB Keaton Mitchell - ECU
RB Lew Nichols III - CMU
RB Evan Hull - Northwestern
WR Donatayvion Wicks - Virginia
WR Tank Dell - Houston
WR Cole Tucker - NIU
TE Darnell Washington - Georgia
TE Dalton Kincaid - Utah
TE Michael Mayer - Notre Dame
TE Josh Whyle - Cincinnati
TE Zach Kuntz - Old Dominion
TE Ben Sims - Baylor
OT Darnell Wright - Tennessee
OG Atonio Mafi - UCLA
Defense:
LB/S Marte Mapu - Sacramento State
DB Tyrique Stevenson - Miami
Safety Jordan Howden - Minnesota
Safety Jammie Robinson - Florida State
EDGE Keion White - Georgia Tech
EDGE Will McDonald IV - Iowa State
DL Adetomiwa Adebawore - Northwestern
DT Jaquelin Roy - LSU
Total: 24/30
"There's a lot of interest in the draft. It's great. But quite frankly, most of the people that are commenting on it don't know anything about what they are talking about."--Ted Thompson
Love this draft
https://www.acmepackingcompany.com/2...source=twitter
It's pretty good, except for no EDGE rusher. Not sure where that pass rush will come from without Gary, and I don't trust Barry to be clever enough to scheme something up.
I think it would be better if they traded down to 19 -20 and picked up another 2nd rounder to address that issue, but I love the draft and would not be unhappy with that haul and the extra 2nd fr a edge rusher
When I try to pin point this draft or any draft for the matter with the view point from the Packers front office, I look at players currently on the roster or former players that were productive their offensive and defensive systems. I also compare the size and athletic attributes of former athletes drafted or on the roster. This is the best I could come up with
QB - Athletic players, that look to throw the ball down field and that have the ability to break down defenses. Ideal measurables are 6'2" or greater, 215 lbs. Love was the exception in terms of arm accuracy especially his senior year. Love was drafted more for his potential than his numbers in college.
RB - High RAS score. Measurable are all over the place. Probably their most flexible position in terms of size
OT - Interesting because I think in the Wide Zone scheme of LaFluer they value very high RAS scores in their offensive linemen. I don't think height factors in unless a player is shorter than 6'4". They have to be able to move and be able to reach defenders outside of them. The Packers will fill a need early in the draft if they have a hole. Currently the Packers have some big dudes on the roster listed at tackle with 7 dudes 6'5" or taller. Bak and Toms are the only ones that are 6'4".
IOL - Same for offensive tackles. RAS scores above almost anything else. Centers have to be the second smartest player on the field for the Packers and they put an added value on this, but will not reach on a guy just because he went to Princeton but has a Fred Flintstone build. Again they will look to early rounds to fill a hole but they will wait and try to find a diamond in the rough that they can polish. Measurable again will determine on RAS scores but they will rarely take a player under 6'3" and under 300 pounds.
WR - RAS and size is key. They use their receivers a lot in the run game to block and mess with the defensive personnel. Doubs is 6'2", and Watson is 6'4". Even though Amari Rodgers was 5'9" he was 215 pounds, I think the Packers thought they could turn him into a poor man's Debo Samuels. Watson doesn't seem to be much of a blocker but look for the Packers to covet big strong receivers with high RAS scores in the later rounds. In the 2023 draft look for the Packers to draft an early slot type receiver and then look to add depth in the form of an Allen Lazard type.
TE - They have held on to Mercedes Lewis for a long time because they require their inline TEs to block like a 6th offensive lineman. Size and RAS score are the key. IF a TE can't make hay downfield in the pass game they better be able to block. Packers require versatility in their TE position, so to be exact in their measurables might be a bit difficult, Deguara was drafted in the 3rd round and is 6'2" 238 pounds. I think they see him more as an H-Back type in their offense. I would say the Packers prototypical pick would be 6'5" 250 pounds.
DT - Athletic and 300 pounds. If you can't move they don't want you at this point. Things could change but they rarely draft a big run stuffer type like BJ Raji. Raji was a freak and its too bad his career ended early. They want guys that win with leverage and rarely go after DTs taller than 6'4". Long arms should be a value but I don't see them giving too many cares about this.
Edge/OLB - Happy to use super athletic defensive ends as their stand up edges and outside linebackers. minimum of 6'3" and 250 pounds. I think they would prefer guys that are 6'5" and 265 pounds and can run silly times in their underwear. They don't do a lot of dropping into coverage, Barry's defense doesn't seem very complicated for these guys.
LB - Again its seems redundant, but the Packers want optimal size and RAS scores, sure they want instincts but they don't want to overvalue instincts because I think it requires expert eyes while watching game tape and for some reason they would rather put more trust in the RAS score. Quay Walker is one of the least instinctive LBs I have seen in a while but it didn't matter to the Packers when drafting him over the likes of Nakobi Dean or Devin Lloyd. Quay made some bone headed decision but I don't think he is a bad guy and he was second in the NFL for tackles by a rookie. 6'3" 240 pounds would be their ideal. They will only play with two at the most.
Saf - If I sound like a broken record I apologize, but they prefer high RAS scores. I wish they would prefer high intellect and instincts at safety but not sure if they will go this route. The real truth is they don't seem to really value this position in the draft. The highest drafted safety was Savage under Gute in the first round but you really can't find another one drafted until basically the late rounds if at all. Outside of Savage the Packer's safety position is mostly all guys that are over 6'0" and 200 pounds.
CB - RAS SCORE!!! Alexander is obviously one of the best selections the Packers have made in the first round in quite a while. Alexander is 5'10" on a good day, so that would seem the minimum of the height standards in Green Bay, and Stokes was 6'0" so that is only a matter of inches. Stokes's RAS score was 9.38, and Alexander's was 9.54. so really their is your connection. Packers want athletic corners, that they also expect to be physical.
Last edited by Deputy Nutz; 04-18-2023 at 09:31 AM.
HOFer
I forgot LBs. They used to have a 233 min lb threshold, but they went under that for McDuffie in 2021 at 227 lbs. They haven't drafted a LB over 4.71 in the 40 and 4.32 in the shuttle since D.J. Smith in 2011. You'd think there are some more thresholds, but Blake Martinez in 2016 was a huge outlier in most other measurables.
"There's a lot of interest in the draft. It's great. But quite frankly, most of the people that are commenting on it don't know anything about what they are talking about."--Ted Thompson
HOFer
Good post, Nuts! I do have some thoughts on what GB looks for in players.
QB Solid mobility and accuracy. They have not drafted a QB under 6'2' 220 since TT took over. They have not drafted a QB with hands smaller than 9 1/4".
RB They draft mostly bigger RBs. Franklin was drafted in 2013 at 205 pounds. Jones was drafted in 2017 at 208 pounds. That's as small as they've gone. 40 doesn't seem that important, but they generally stay with RBs better than 7.33 in the 3 cone and better than 120" in the broad jump. Scheme fit would be RBs that are good in the zone scheme.
WR They mostly like bigger WRs. The only WRs under 6' that they've drafted are Jennings, Cobb, and Amari Rodgers. Jennings was almost 200 pounds. Rodgers was 212 pounds. Cobb is the big outlier at 5'10" 191 pounds. They seem to be particular about the 3 cone. They stay under 7.19.
TE 3 Cone and Broad seem to be important. Threshold seems to be about 7.23 on the 3 cone and 111" on the broad. I've read that 32" min vertical and 110" min broad indicate NFL success.
OT They like athletes. GB will draft smaller OTs (Bakh, Kyle Murphy, Van Lanen, and Tom were all on the smaller side). They haven't drafted an OT with sub 33" arm length, but they have moved guys inside that had smaller arms (Madison, Stepaniak, Rhyan). Bulaga, Murphy, and Tom were the shortest arms at 33 1/4" that stuck at OT. GB has generally stayed under 5.32 in the 40, 4.75 in the 3 cone, and 7.71 shuttle. I've read that 5.09 40, 4.65 3 cone, and 7.84 shuttle indicate NFL success.
IOL Again, athletes. They will draft smaller IOLs. Linsley, Colledge, Moll, Barbre were all 300 lbs or less. Runyan (306), Hanson (303), and Amichia (302) were also smaller. GB doesn't seem to have a 40 threshold, but they do seem to have a 4.68 shuttle and 7.93 3 cone threshold. I've read that 7.84 3 cone indicates NFL success.
DE They look for size, length, and athleticism. 6'3" with 32 1/2" arm length is the norm. T-Rex Dean Lowry was the outlier. 7.65 3 Cone seems to be the threshold. The last DE above 7.55 3 cone was C.J. Wilson back in 2010. Everbody since Wilson also were 4.46 or less in the shuttle.
DT Most have been 6'3" or taller and 310+ lbs. All have had at least 32" arms. All have had 102"+ broad. There doesn't seem to be a noticeable threshold in the other measurements. They've drafted a guy with 5.00 shuttle (Ford), 7.94 3 cone (Pennel), 26.5" vert (Boyd).
OLB Size. Clay Matthews is the outlier at 6"3 240, but that was back in 2009. Since then, their edges have generally been 6'3"+ 255+ pound. Vince Biegel was the outlier, but that didn't turn out well. They actually don't seem to care about 40 time much. Enagbare ran 4.87. Garvin ran 4.82. They generally draft big edges with a bit of explosiveness (speed to power). Ricky Elmore was an outlier, but the other guys have all jumped at least 117" in the broad since Elmore.
CB Size. They almost always draft CBs that are 5'11"+ and 192+ lbs. They haven't drafted a CB with arms shorter than 30 1/4" since TT took over. Jaire was an outlier, but he tested off the charts in the measurables. Shermar Jean-Charles was the HUGE outlier. He was short and unathletic. I wonder if he was drafted primarily for special teams. Otherwise, his selection made little sense. The rest have had a 7.10- in 3 cone (generally less than 7.00), 34" vert. I've read that 7.00 max 3 cone, 36" min vert, and 4.54 max 40 indicate NFL success.
S Darnell Savage was the smallest they've drafted since they went to a 3-4 at 5'11" 198 lbs. I think they generally like 4.22- for shuttle, 7.16- for 3 cone, 33"+ vert, and 118"+ broad. I've read that 4.59 max 40, 4.05 max shuttle, 7.10 max 3 cone, and 36" min vert indicate NFL success.
This was really getting into the weeds, but these are some thresholds that I look for to see if a player meets the Packers thresholds.
Last edited by HarveyWallbangers; 04-18-2023 at 01:02 PM.
"There's a lot of interest in the draft. It's great. But quite frankly, most of the people that are commenting on it don't know anything about what they are talking about."--Ted Thompson
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