Another child dies in Faith Healing Church

[oregonpackfan]

Yesterday, a 16 year old boy in Oregon City died as a result of complications from a simple blockage in his urinary tract. Because of the blockage, he was unable to urinate, and he died from the buildup of toxins in his urine.

A medical examiner determined a simple, out-patient, medical procedure would have cleared up the blockage and saved his life. Because he is a member of the Followers of Christ Church, he and his parents declined any type of medical help. Instead, 60 members of the church gathered around him in group faith healing through prayer.

Last month, a 15 month old girl from the same church died from pneumonia when her parents refused medical care. They insisted that prayer alone would heal her. Doctors maintain that simple antibiotics would have cleared up her pneumonia.

There are dozens of children buried in the church's cemetery since 1950. In a study done in '98, reporters concluded 21 of the children would have survived through simple medical practices.

This begs the question: Should state protective services intervene in the church or should it observe the freedom of religion clause in our government and just stay away?

http://www.oregonlive.com/news/orego...l=7&thispage=1

[BallHawk]

If it's something as simple as antibiotics or a quick surgery then the state should be able to intervene. However, if it's something more complex and the chances of success are less certain than the state should leave that decision in the hands of the parents.

[hoosier]

Yesterday, a 16 year old boy in Oregon City died as a result of complications from a simple blockage in his urinary tract. Because of the blockage, he was unable to urinate, and he died from the buildup of toxins in his urine.

A medical examiner determined a simple, out-patient, medical procedure would have cleared up the blockage and saved his life. Because he is a member of the Followers of Christ Church, he and his parents declined any type of medical help. Instead, 60 members of the church gathered around him in group faith healing through prayer.

Last month, a 15 month old girl from the same church died from pneumonia when her parents refused medical care. They insisted that prayer alone would heal her. Doctors maintain that simple antibiotics would have cleared up her pneumonia.

There are dozens of children buried in the church's cemetery since 1950. In a study done in '98, reporters concluded 21 of the children would have survived through simple medical practices.

This begs the question: Should state protective services intervene in the church or should it observe the freedom of religion clause in our government and just stay away?

http://www.oregonlive.com/news/orego...l=7&thispage=1

"Freedom of religion", in my understanding, has first and foremost meant no official state religion. It also implies a minimal amount of interference between government and religion, but in this case it seems to me that there's a pretty clearcut argument that the risk of endangerment outweighs religious freedom. This sect has the freedom to practice whatever it wants only so long as it doesn't put others at risk or compromise their liberty, and since minors aren't considered full legal subjects capable of making decisions in their best interests, the parents or guardians would be responsible for ensuring their health. If they fail to do so, the state can step in.

[Deputy Nutz]

Well, at least these bastards are killing themselves off before it gets out of hand.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Yesterday, a 16 year old boy in Oregon City died as a result of complications from a simple blockage in his urinary tract. Because of the blockage, he was unable to urinate, and he died from the buildup of toxins in his urine.

A medical examiner determined a simple, out-patient, medical procedure would have cleared up the blockage and saved his life. Because he is a member of the Followers of Christ Church, he and his parents declined any type of medical help. Instead, 60 members of the church gathered around him in group faith healing through prayer.

Last month, a 15 month old girl from the same church died from pneumonia when her parents refused medical care. They insisted that prayer alone would heal her. Doctors maintain that simple antibiotics would have cleared up her pneumonia.

There are dozens of children buried in the church's cemetery since 1950. In a study done in '98, reporters concluded 21 of the children would have survived through simple medical practices.

This begs the question: Should state protective services intervene in the church or should it observe the freedom of religion clause in our government and just stay away?

http://www.oregonlive.com/news/orego...l=7&thispage=1

"Freedom of religion", in my understanding, has first and foremost meant no official state religion. It also implies a minimal amount of interference between government and religion, but in this case it seems to me that there's a pretty clearcut argument that the risk of endangerment outweighs religious freedom. This sect has the freedom to practice whatever it wants only so long as it doesn't put others at risk or compromise their liberty, and since minors aren't considered full legal subjects capable of making decisions in their best interests, the parents or guardians would be responsible for ensuring their health. If they fail to do so, the state can step in.

I would have to agree. Especially since we don't have freedom of religion. I think the mormons or anyone that wants a plural marriage would agree.

And, there is no good reason against it...or rather, no good legal reason against plural marriage.

[Bretsky]

send the parents to jail for stupidity

[red]

isn't this a clear case a child neglect?

i said the same thing in the last thread. the parents and pastor should be sent to jail

and how are these people that dumb? all those kids since the 50's have died, yet they still believe prayer will heal them.

i almost agree with nuts, at least they're doing it to there own to help stop the spread of stupidity

[MJZiggy]

When are these people going to realize that perhaps God's way of saving these kids is to give the doctors the tools and knowledge to do it for Him?

I think they should plug the parents so they can know how their child died needlessly.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

When are these people going to realize that perhaps God's way of saving these kids is to give the doctors the tools and knowledge to do it for Him?

I think they should plug the parents so they can know how their child died needlessly.

God called this special child to heaven. Who are you to question his ways?

[mraynrand]

God called this special child to heaven. Who are you to question his ways?

Mr. Bigguns: the reliable source for discerning the will of God.

[MJZiggy]

Especially since he keeps offering to show me what he's compensating for...

[Tyrone Bigguns]

God called this special child to heaven. Who are you to question his ways?

Mr. Bigguns: the reliable source for discerning the will of God.

Are you questioning the will of god. If their is a god, then didn't what transpire because that is how god wanted it?

Perhaps god imbued tyrone with the ability to see his role in our lives. Are you suggesting that god couldn't do that?

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Especially since he keeps offering to show me what he's compensating for...

God made my body. Everything god makes is beautiful. I want you to see god's beauty.

Don't shun what god has created.

[MJZiggy]

Thanks, if I wanna see what God created, I'll go take that Grand Canyon/Yosemite trip I've always wanted to do.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Thanks, if I wanna see what God created, I'll go take that Grand Canyon/Yosemite trip I've always wanted to do.

Perfect. I live in AZ..i'll meet you there...show you the 15th wonder of the world (a little modesty).

[mraynrand]

God called this special child to heaven. Who are you to question his ways?

Mr. Bigguns: the reliable source for discerning the will of God.

Are you questioning the will of god. If their is a god, then didn't what transpire because that is how god wanted it?

Perhaps god imbued tyrone with the ability to see his role in our lives. Are you suggesting that god couldn't do that?

Why ask me? You already seem to have the answer, Mr. 'Fifteenth Wonder.'

[MJZiggy]

Thanks, if I wanna see what God created, I'll go take that Grand Canyon/Yosemite trip I've always wanted to do.

Perfect. I live in AZ..i'll meet you there...show you the 15th wonder of the world (a little modesty).

So you're bringing Victoria Falls with you? That's quite a feat...

http://www.hillmanwonders.com/

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Thanks, if I wanna see what God created, I'll go take that Grand Canyon/Yosemite trip I've always wanted to do.

Perfect. I live in AZ..i'll meet you there...show you the 15th wonder of the world (a little modesty).

So you're bringing Victoria Falls with you? That's quite a feat...

http://www.hillmanwonders.com/

Well, my "output" does seem to flow like the falls.

Forgive me.

[MJZiggy]

I think that one might have been unforgivable. TMI. Blech.

[mraynrand]

I think that one might have been unforgivable. TMI. Blech.

Agreed. With stuff like this from Tyrone "Mr. Fifteenth Wonder" Bigguns, one wonders if he shouldn't change his avatar and name to Herbert Marcuse and completely entertain his 'Polymorphous Perversity' in pursuit of the 'Pleasure Principle.'