ARE WE GIVING AROD A FREE PASS ??????????????????

[pbmax]

Its almost as if something beside injury and talent stands in the way of an offensive player excelling in a given football game. If only we could put our finger on it.

[mraynrand]

Its almost as if something beside injury and talent stands in the way of an offensive player excelling in a given football game. If only we could put our finger on it.

one possibility:

[ThunderDan]

This is where the injury excuse immediately loses traction. He had better, more efficient games when his calf was worse. Yes of course his mobility would have come in handy, but come on the guy missed a bunch of throws.
Some he made some he didn't, the ones he didn't were costly. The pick was a really poor throw. Was late and to the inside, essentially making it a jump ball between an all pro and a rookie receiver. Also a play few are talking about, when seattle jumped off early, jordy had is man beat deep and inside and a rod again threw late and short and it was broken up. Should have been a TD or at least a big gain. A lot of his slants were short and the screen passes were sloppy. He choked.....period. The points left on the field were just too much. The defense created 5 turnovers and held a shutout til the 3rd quarter. Wilson with his worst career game as a pro.
Bostick, fake fg, play calling, all that doesn't matter if a rod and the offense is just average. He deserves ample blame.

Please tell when ARod learned to be a choker between the 2010 Super Bowl Run and the Conference Championship game this year?

[yetisnowman]

Please tell when ARod learned to be a choker between the 2010 Super Bowl Run and the Conference Championship game this year?

Maybe you can elaborate on what you are asking exactly.....Since the super bowl run his clutchness and efficiency in playoff games has sorely been lacking. He was average against San Fran last year, we lose by 3. He was way below average in Seattle, we lose in OT. If he plays anywhere near the elite level we win both of those games. The game last weekend we win handedly. He missed easy throws, missed deep throws, and was pedestrian all game.

[mraynrand]

Maybe you can elaborate on what you are asking exactly.....Since the super bowl run his clutchness and efficiency in playoff games has sorely been lacking. He was average against San Fran last year, we lose by 3. He was way below average in Seattle, we lose in OT. If he plays anywhere near the elite level we win both of those games. The game last weekend we win handedly. He missed easy throws, missed deep throws, and was pedestrian all game.

where does Arod's average come from?

[yetisnowman]

where does Arod's average come from?

My eyeballs? The laws of mathematics? What do you mean? He didn't have a good game , 170 yds passing 1 TD, two picks ,55% completions and he didn't capitalize on 4 first half turnovers from the opposing team to put the game away. In what way did have an average or an above average game? Seattle was beatable, their defense was beatable. His throws were late and off target and his decision making was bad. What other metrics should I use?

[denverYooper]

Yes, let's get rid of Rodgers. He's nothing but a problem. And with the money we'd save we could buy a real gamechanger like Rex Grossman.

[yetisnowman]

Yes, let's get rid of Rodgers. He's nothing but a problem. And with the money we'd save we could buy a real gamechanger like Rex Grossman.

No one said that. I'm noticing a ton of guys on this board that blindly apologize for the dude when he doesn't step up in clutch situations. I'll say it again, if he has an average game Sunday we are comfortably cruising to the super bowl. Truth hurts. If you didnt see An offense that couldn't get out of its own way Sunday, I don't know what to tell you.

[woodbuck27]

My eyeballs? The laws of mathematics? What do you mean? He didn't have a good game , 170 yds passing 1 TD, two picks ,55% completions and he didn't capitalize on 4 first half turnovers from the opposing team to put the game away. In what way did have an average or an above average game? Seattle was beatable, their defense was beatable. His throws were late and off target and his decision making was bad. What other metrics should I use?

It's really as Mike McCarthy might say:

'Fun' to observe.

The Packer Homers here. They have no simple dignity. They'll come up with any number of lame lame excuses for something that's too obvious in their face clear. The responses are over the top hilarious.

I'm certain that certain members of this board put on their stupid hats on the week of an important Packer play off game. Toss another one on top of that when the Packers collapse and lose that game.

Like a bunch a school boys. Yet not exhausting rather incredibly hilarious.

Every year since the last Super Bowl win...it's the same here. "Well .... we won the NFCN !"

That's NOT good enough Homers !

I don't mean to pile on. You've got them now.

Their too easy to handle until you realize what 'Homerism' really does to them.

[Noodle]

No one said that. I'm noticing a ton of guys on this board that blindly apologize for the dude when he doesn't step up in clutch situations. I'll say it again, if he has an average game Sunday we are comfortably cruising to the super bowl. Truth hurts. If you didnt see An offense that couldn't get out of its own way Sunday, I don't know what to tell you.

There's something to this. For example, why do we assume the pick on the throw to Cobb was Cobb's fault; maybe it was A-Rod who misread the coverage or threw the wrong route.

A lot of us did this with Favre -- no pick was his fault, it was usually the receiver's fault for running the wrong route or not selling out to make the catch. Until he went to the Jets/Vikes.

Playing QB in that stadium must suck balls, but there's no way an objective fan (oxymoron, I know) can say that A-Rod had a good game Sunday.

[mraynrand]

My eyeballs? The laws of mathematics? What do you mean? He didn't have a good game , 170 yds passing 1 TD, two picks ,55% completions and he didn't capitalize on 4 first half turnovers from the opposing team to put the game away. In what way did have an average or an above average game? Seattle was beatable, their defense was beatable. His throws were late and off target and his decision making was bad. What other metrics should I use?

You say he was below average in performance, but his 'average' is collected against all the teams he plays, including a lot of tragically terrible defenses which yield hundreds of yards, offer no pass rush, and have porous secondaries. His average is kept lower by teams with fierce pass rushes, and great secondaries, for example. Not to mention the limitations of his injury. So, if Rodgers plays exactly the same, you would EXPECT much worse results against a team that has been #1 in defense the past two years running (#1 in yards allowed points allowed, and passing yards allowed) than against teams with awful defenses. This isn't a secret. Rodgers didn't have a 'bad game' so much as he played against the best defense.

[mraynrand]

There's something to this. For example, why do we assume the pick on the throw to Cobb was Cobb's fault; maybe it was A-Rod who misread the coverage or threw the wrong route.

A lot of us did this with Favre -- no pick was his fault, it was usually the receiver's fault for running the wrong route or not selling out to make the catch. Until he went to the Jets/Vikes.

Playing QB in that stadium must suck balls, but there's no way an objective fan (oxymoron, I know) can say that A-Rod had a good game Sunday.

Cobb admitted it was his fault and was summarily flogged

[yetisnowman]

You say he was below average in performance, but his 'average' is collected against all the teams he plays, including a lot of tragically terrible defenses which yield hundreds of yards, offer no pass rush, and have porous secondaries. His average is kept lower by teams with fierce pass rushes, and great secondaries, for example. Not to mention the limitations of his injury. So, if Rodgers plays exactly the same, you would EXPECT much worse results against a team that has been #1 in defense the past two years running (#1 in yards allowed points allowed, and passing yards allowed) than against teams with awful defenses. This isn't a secret. Rodgers didn't have a 'bad game' so much as he played against the best defense.

Utter nonsense. I watched the game. He had a bad game. Good qbs make it happen against tight coverage. The pass rush was not an issue , the o line was spectacular.So the defense , that barely pressured him, caused him to be inaccurate and sloppy, gotcha. Homerism up in this place. Anybody nationally would agree he underperformed

[Rutnstrut]

It's really as Mike McCarthy might say:

'Fun' to observe.

The Packer Homers here. They have no simple dignity. They'll come up with any number of lame lame excuses for something that's too obvious in their face clear. The responses are over the top hilarious.

I'm certain that certain members of this board put on their stupid hats on the week of an important Packer play off game. Toss another one on top of that when the Packers collapse and lose that game.

Like a bunch a school boys. Yet not exhausting rather incredibly hilarious.

Every year since the last Super Bowl win...it's the same here. "Well .... we won the NFCN !"

That's NOT good enough Homers !

I don't mean to pile on. You've got them now.

Their too easy to handle until you realize what 'Homerism' really does to them.

Great post woodbuck, but it will be misconstrued by most here. It's really not their fault, the Packer tinted glasses and kool aid do that to them.

[ThunderDan]

Great post woodbuck, but it will be misconstrued by most here. It's really not their fault, the Packer tinted glasses and kool aid do that to them.

So now we have two theories out there:
1. TT is wasting ARod's window by not bringing in enough talent to have us win it all. Sign every FA available.
2. ARod isn't clutch in important games any more and choked.

Which is it?

[ThunderDan]

Maybe you can elaborate on what you are asking exactly.....Since the super bowl run his clutchness and efficiency in playoff games has sorely been lacking. He was average against San Fran last year, we lose by 3. He was way below average in Seattle, we lose in OT. If he plays anywhere near the elite level we win both of those games. The game last weekend we win handedly. He missed easy throws, missed deep throws, and was pedestrian all game.

Was Roger's clutch in the DET game? Was Roger's clutch in the DAL game?

I agree that ARod didn't play as well as I would have liked in the SEA game. But even then with the whole team collapsing, when ARod had the ball in his hands he drove us to a FG to tie the game in the last minute of regulation.

[Bossman641]

I'm not even sure what the argument is here. Nobody has claimed Rodgers had a good game. I'd say most every agreed he had a below average to average game. On the list of problem areas going forward, he is probably at the bottom of the list though.

[mraynrand]

Utter nonsense. I watched the game. He had a bad game. Good qbs make it happen against tight coverage. The pass rush was not an issue , the o line was spectacular.So the defense , that barely pressured him, caused him to be inaccurate and sloppy, gotcha. Homerism up in this place. Anybody nationally would agree he underperformed

It's not just pressure, it's coverage. And if you've watched Seattle at all other than against the Packers, you'd see them shut down very good passing teams (like the 55 TD broncos last year - did you see that one? Did Manning have a 'bad game'?) And, if you've been watching, since the injury, Rodgers hasn't been throwing quite as well. Nor has he been running much - both of which are essential to his game. So, as I said before, it's not just the defense, but the defense and the injury. Did he otherwise have a sub par game? Hard to say, but I did see him miss a few receivers he could have hit. Probably, but I don't know.

[mraynrand]

I'm not even sure what the argument is here. Nobody has claimed Rodgers had a good game. I'd say most every agreed he had a below average to average game. On the list of problem areas going forward, he is probably at the bottom of the list though.

the argument is whether the results from the QB position were due to intrinsic bad play by Rodgers (bad preparation, nerves, too much Olivia, etc.) or whether they were due to defense and injury. I say the latter were far more significant, and I offer the performance of other great QBs against Seattle over the past two years as my evidence.

[wist43]

This is just amazing. We only give McCarthy and Capers a little dab of credit for the good and 100% of the bad. What exactly should they have done differently when the balls hits Bostick in the damn head? Or on the play that Pepper and Burnett decide that 6 more points aren't necessary? Did Clinton-Dix think Capers was going to throw his toupée at the ball and break up the 2 point conversion?
McCarthy is a choker? He only has the 15th best winning percentage of any coach in NFL history (.003 behind Belichick). He's #39 all time in playoff winning percentage (.004 behind Holmgren) and a better playoff winning percentage than Don Shula, Mike Ditka, Paul Brown, and Tony Dungy.
I'm sure just about all of us live and die with the Packers, so I differently get the frustration you have because I have it too. But I just don't see any logic in this.

Yes, McCarthy is a choker - he's proven that more times than not. He's proven exactly 1 time that he could get it done, he's failed every other time.

And this particular fail was epic. He, and dunderdummy, essentially tried to run out the hourglass from the 5:00 minute mark on - that's not playing to win, that's hoping the other team doesn't do enough to win. It's the difference between being proactive and being passive. Passive will get you beat every time.

Did some of the players make stupid plays?? Yes they did... but that flows from the Head Coach on down. If the Head Coach is going to stick his head in the sand, what choice do the players have but to join him?? It puts everyone on their back foot, it introduces doubt and hope, as opposed to aggression and taking hope away from you opponent.

Sun tsu... in the end, responsibility always falls to the General.