ARE WE GIVING AROD A FREE PASS ??????????????????

[woodbuck27]

Yes, McCarthy is a choker - he's proven that more times than not. He's proven exactly 1 time that he could get it done, he's failed every other time.

And this particular fail was epic. He, and dunderdummy, essentially tried to run out the hourglass from the 5:00 minute mark on - that's not playing to win, that's hoping the other team doesn't do enough to win. It's the difference between being proactive and being passive. Passive will get you beat every time.

Did some of the players make stupid plays?? Yes they did... but that flows from the Head Coach on down. If the Head Coach is going to stick his head in the sand, what choice do the players have but to join him?? It puts everyone on their back foot, it introduces doubt and hope, as opposed to aggression and taking hope away from you opponent.

Sun tsu... in the end, responsibility always falls to the General.

Ironically in the Green Bay Packer culture and after this last disappointing playoff loss '; and ' after the dust settles ' this:

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/11...en-bay-packers

Packer Nation gets Mike McCarthy for 'likely' another four seasons.

Mike McCarthy gets to pound his chest for more NFCN Titles. Has some fun losing in the playoffs.

Rah ! Rah !! Rah !!! All is good.

[wist43]

Ironically in the Green Bay Packer culture and after this last disappointing playoff loss '; and ' after the dust settles ' this:

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/11...en-bay-packers

Packer Nation gets Mike McCarthy for 'likely' another four seasons.

Mike McCarthy gets to pound his chest for more NFCN Titles. Has some fun losing in the playoffs.

Rah ! Rah !! Rah !!! All is good.

I don't want to fire MM, I keep hoping he'll the lesson... but to date, he hasn't.

I do want to fire dunderdummy of course... he is utterly hopeless. That 3rd and 21?? I knew it was coming, b/c I know dunderdummy - he'll do that every stinking time. It's a fine way to let a team off the hook, give them hope, and get you beat.

[pbmax]

Yes, McCarthy is a choker - he's proven that more times than not. He's proven exactly 1 time that he could get it done, he's failed every other time.

Technically, that would be 3 games, so 3 times in 2010 if we are just counting playoffs and not season end clinching victories in the Division.

[yetisnowman]

It's not just pressure, it's coverage. And if you've watched Seattle at all other than against the Packers, you'd see them shut down very good passing teams (like the 55 TD broncos last year - did you see that one? Did Manning have a 'bad game'?) And, if you've been watching, since the injury, Rodgers hasn't been throwing quite as well. Nor has he been running much - both of which are essential to his game. So, as I said before, it's not just the defense, but the defense and the injury. Did he otherwise have a sub par game? Hard to say, but I did see him miss a few receivers he could have hit. Probably, but I don't know.

Yes manning had a bad game, I would venture to say he had a terrible game. I would throw an even harsher criticism towards Peyton , he is a regular playoff bed wetter . A rod is supposed to be better than Shaun hill, Sanchez, cam, kaepernick though. He is a great regular season qb, and he had one sick super bowl run. But if his lackluster performances in playoff games aren't at least on your mind moving forward as somewhat of a concern, ,I think there is some denial there. When I look at that game I see a wounded animal in Seattle that was begging be put down. The offensive execution failed us, we should have been up by 30 at half. All the other nonsense in the last 5 minutes is irrelevant if the offense does their job, that falls on the coaching of course but it falls heavier on the qb in this situation.

[woodbuck27]

It was so much like the fight game. I mean the way it seemed watching this stranger than just weird game.

I couldn't be but it sure looked like this:

Just before game time Aaron Rodgers was informed:

"Sorry Aaron but the word just came down from above...and we're throwing this one.

They want Seattle in to try to repeat Vs New England." Fiction

[Pugger]

The reason why I'm giving AR a pass on this last game is he wasn't 100%. His mobility and throwing on the run is a big part of his game and what makes him the most dangerous QB in the league to defend. But he couldn't do any of that since the Tampa game. If Rodgers was his normal self on Sunday we win that game and are preparing for NE in the desert.

[Patler]

This is where the injury excuse immediately loses traction. He had better, more efficient games when his calf was worse. Yes of course his mobility would have come in handy, but come on the guy missed a bunch of throws.
Some he made some he didn't, the ones he didn't were costly. The pick was a really poor throw. Was late and to the inside, essentially making it a jump ball between an all pro and a rookie receiver. Also a play few are talking about, when seattle jumped off early, jordy had is man beat deep and inside and a rod again threw late and short and it was broken up. Should have been a TD or at least a big gain. A lot of his slants were short and the screen passes were sloppy. He choked.....period. The points left on the field were just too much. The defense created 5 turnovers and held a shutout til the 3rd quarter. Wilson with his worst career game as a pro.
Bostick, fake fg, play calling, all that doesn't matter if a rod and the offense is just average. He deserves ample blame.

Your second sentence negates your entire argument. You have absolutely no way of knowing when his calf was better or worse. In the days leading up to the Seattle game, some reported Packer comments that it was maybe a little better, some that it was no better, and some that it was a little worse. One Dr. who was interviewed said the injury needs almost total rest in order to really heal, and any aggressive use can cause a set back. He said he would expect it to be no better and probably a little worse against Seattle because Rodgers had basically two weeks of rest before Dallas, almost certainly set himself back because of playing the game, and then had only one week of rest before the Seattle game.

Rodgers was not that much better against Dallas, but his results were better. His accuracy has been lacking in all games since the injury. Even against Dallas, his throws were often late and a bit off target. However, many were still completed because Dallas' secondary is now where near as good as Seattles' and their DBs were not there to contest the poorer throws as much. Against better defensive coverage, you can't get away with poor timing and off target throws, against worse coverage you often can.

[denverYooper]

Your second sentence negates your entire argument. You have absolutely no way of knowing when his calf was better or worse. In the days leading up to the Seattle game, some reported Packer comments that it was maybe a little better, some that it was no better, and some that it was a little worse. One Dr. who was interviewed said the injury needs almost total rest in order to really heal, and any aggressive use can cause a set back. He said he would expect it to be no better and probably a little worse against Seattle because Rodgers had basically two weeks of rest before Dallas, almost certainly set himself back because of playing the game, and then had only one week of rest before the Seattle game.

Rodgers was not that much better against Dallas, but his results were better. His accuracy has been lacking in all games since the injury. Even against Dallas, his throws were often late and a bit off target. However, many were still completed because Dallas' secondary is now where near as good as Seattles' and their DBs were not there to contest the poorer throws as much. Against better defensive coverage, you can't get away with poor timing and off target throws, against worse coverage you often can.

See Peyton Manning last year.

Seattle's game on the backend thrives not on interceptions but on immediately harassing the receivers. If the QB's accuracy is off even a bit and is not leading his receivers away from coverage and making tight throws, they're immediately pasting the receiver. If the QB floats his throws even a little, the balls are contested and often batted away. Rodgers, while still very good at finding open receivers, did not have his usual drive on the ball. The team was the reason the Packers almost won this game... particularly the OL and the defense... but if Rodgers is healthy the Packers probably score 35 points.

I was disappointed that Lacy was not more successful in the passing game... on the failed screen and the miscommunication, he had a lot of grass in front of him. I thought Jordy had a poor game for him also. He had the ball in the endzone that Rodgers deserves some blame for but that he usually goes after and he had another drop on a first down play that hurt.

[wist43]

Wrong thread, lol... sorry

[woodbuck27]

The reason why I'm giving AR a pass on this last game is he wasn't 100%. His mobility and throwing on the run is a big part of his game and what makes him the most dangerous QB in the league to defend. But he couldn't do any of that since the Tampa game. If Rodgers was his normal self on Sunday we win that game and are preparing for NE in the desert.

Was what we saw in Aaron Rodgers play Vs Dallas an illusion? No ... Aaron Rodgers was outstanding Vs Dallas.

As fans we should have expected more from the NFL MVP vs Seattle. Is that trophy tarnished with that Seattle defeat? Did his poor play emphasize just how valuable decent play is for any chance of a Green Bay Packer win?

Suddenly it's the calf injury as an excuse. Some want to make it about conditions such as wind.

I saw a QB that didn't have enough 'FIRE" in him to ensure he was all there to get the job done.

Is this where his legacy will be defined? A QB that simply can't do it in the clutch. Wasn't that a criticism of Brett Favre!? Will the same stand as a description of Aaron Rodgers?

A deemed 'Greatest QB in NFL History'... That QB didn't exist in Seattle; until his last efforts in regulation to get in position for the game tieing FG he seemed far too casual to me.

Aaron Rodgers was a big reason for the worst 2nd half flop for any NFC team in history.

** He can blame officiating on his first pick but he threw that pick.

** Aaron Rodgers may be clearly justified in any annoyance in terms of play calling. Aaron Rodgers is stuck with Mike McCarthy.

[mraynrand]

Yes manning had a bad game, I would venture to say he had a terrible game. I would throw an even harsher criticism towards Peyton , he is a regular playoff bed wetter . A rod is supposed to be better than Shaun hill, Sanchez, cam, kaepernick though. He is a great regular season qb, and he had one sick super bowl run. But if his lackluster performances in playoff games aren't at least on your mind moving forward as somewhat of a concern, ,I think there is some denial there. When I look at that game I see a wounded animal in Seattle that was begging be put down. The offensive execution failed us, we should have been up by 30 at half. All the other nonsense in the last 5 minutes is irrelevant if the offense does their job, that falls on the coaching of course but it falls heavier on the qb in this situation.

This seems nonsensical to me. Rodgers didn't cause Nelson to stumble out of his break, and he didn't call the running plays at the goal line. You have a lot to complain about, but I will just say that I disagree with you about the main reasons for a less than average performance by Rodgers. Again, my evidence is the performance of other good/great QBs against Seattle, and Rodgers' injuries.

[Pugger]

There's something to this. For example, why do we assume the pick on the throw to Cobb was Cobb's fault; maybe it was A-Rod who misread the coverage or threw the wrong route.

A lot of us did this with Favre -- no pick was his fault, it was usually the receiver's fault for running the wrong route or not selling out to make the catch. Until he went to the Jets/Vikes.

Playing QB in that stadium must suck balls, but there's no way an objective fan (oxymoron, I know) can say that A-Rod had a good game Sunday.

I thought I heard Cobb later admitted he ran the wrong route on that INT? The first pick was Aaron's fault because he threw it late. Unfortunately the zebras didn't notice Bennett was offsides on the play and why Rodgers threw it in the first place. Rodgers isn't infallible but I'm not going to throw him under the bus. I suspect had he been 100% our offense doesn't sputter.

[mraynrand]

Aaron Rodgers was outstanding Vs Dallas.

not really. He had a couple of stretches of pretty good play, with some ragged play in the middle.

[mraynrand]

I thought I heard Cobb later admitted he ran the wrong route on that INT?

I think that's right. But Rodgers also missed Cobb later, for what might have broken into a long gain or TD. Too bad. Rodgers did not have great game, and some of it was his fault. How much of that was due to injury is unknowable.

[Pugger]

You say he was below average in performance, but his 'average' is collected against all the teams he plays, including a lot of tragically terrible defenses which yield hundreds of yards, offer no pass rush, and have porous secondaries. His average is kept lower by teams with fierce pass rushes, and great secondaries, for example. Not to mention the limitations of his injury. So, if Rodgers plays exactly the same, you would EXPECT much worse results against a team that has been #1 in defense the past two years running (#1 in yards allowed points allowed, and passing yards allowed) than against teams with awful defenses. This isn't a secret. Rodgers didn't have a 'bad game' so much as he played against the best defense.

I can only think of one game in his career that he's had a truly bad game and that was the Buffalo game several weeks ago. Otherwise he's been very good since he became our starter.

[Pugger]

Was what we saw in Aaron Rodgers play Vs Dallas an illusion? No ... Aaron Rodgers was outstanding Vs Dallas.

As fans we should have expected more from the NFL MVP vs Seattle. Is that trophy tarnished with that Seattle defeat? Did his poor play emphasize just how valuable decent play is for any chance of a Green Bay Packer win?

Suddenly it's the calf injury as an excuse. Some want to make it about conditions such as wind.

I saw a QB that didn't have enough 'FIRE" in him to ensure he was all there to get the job done.

Is this where his legacy will be defined? A QB that simply can't do it in the clutch. Wasn't that a criticism of Brett Favre!? Will the same stand as a description of Aaron Rodgers?

A deemed 'Greatest QB in NFL History'... That QB didn't exist in Seattle; until his last efforts in regulation to get in position for the game tieing FG he seemed far too casual to me.

Aaron Rodgers was a big reason for the worst 2nd half flop for any NFC team in history.

** He can blame officiating on his first pick but he threw that pick.

** Aaron Rodgers may be clearly justified in any annoyance in terms of play calling. Aaron Rodgers is stuck with Mike McCarthy.

How can anyone observing watching on television tell if Rodgers didn't have enough "fire" inside him to get the job done? I'm with mraynrand. I suspect his injury and playing the best defense in the league contributed to his sub par play in Seattle.

[Pugger]

not really. He had a couple of stretches of pretty good play, with some ragged play in the middle.

Yes, against Dallas in the first half of the game Rodgers didn't play up to his usual standards.

[woodbuck27]

How can anyone observing watching on television tell if Rodgers didn't have enough "fire" inside him to get the job done? I'm with mraynrand. I suspect his injury and playing the best defense in the league contributed to his sub par play in Seattle.

I can observe Aaron Rodgers as he was in that game. I can measure from an observable standpoint and compare his performance based in other games that I've watched 'LIVE" and over again in recordings countless times.

I've watched it now three times. I'll watch it again and again and I'll not see anything different.

Aaron Rodgers had 'no Fire in him' in that game. Aaron Rodgers had excellent protection for by far the most part in that game to make plays and his QBR describes 'in part' just how off he was.

I have experience as a Leader...a Coach... a competitive athlete .... a Teacher...a Supervisor.

I can see without prejudice. I can report what I see.

[Pugger]

I can observe Aaron Rodgers as he was in that game. I can measure from an observable standpoint and compare his performance based in other games that I've watched 'LIVE" and over again in recordings countless times.

I've watched it now three times. I'll watch it again and again and I'll not see anything different.

Aaron Rodgers had 'no Fire in him' in that game. Aaron Rodgers had excellent protection for by far the most part in that game to make plays and his QBR describes 'in part' just how off he was.

I have experience as a Leader...a Coach... a competitive athlete .... a Teacher...a Supervisor.

I can see without prejudice. I can report what I see.

I've been in competitive situations where I had the fire but I was off my game. Some days you can't miss and on others you can't hit the broad side of a barn.

[Smidgeon]

How can anyone observing watching on television tell if Rodgers didn't have enough "fire" inside him to get the job done? I'm with mraynrand. I suspect his injury and playing the best defense in the league contributed to his sub par play in Seattle.

Don't fret too much. This is woody's tired old cliche. Rodgers didn't have a perfect game? Not enough fire. Obviously.