THE INTERCEPTION BY BURNETT

[Freak Out]

That Arizona game seems like an eternity ago.

[mraynrand]

Fuck you guys.

point taken

[mraynrand]

[mraynrand]

[mraynrand]

[mraynrand]

[Freak Out]

Thank you.....I feel much better. That catch by Dorsey was one of the greatest I think I've ever seen.

[mraynrand]

[Freak Out]

That Raider game was AWESOME! Ice cold and a complete domination.

[mraynrand]

[mraynrand]

[mraynrand]

[Freak Out]

By that point in the SB I was wasted and some hippy chick with dreads was trying to take my pants off....with my wife standing right there. Whooops!

[Strange Brew]

In honor of Burnett and Coach Peppers

[Maxie the Taxi]

If Green Bay would have been up only one score, not two, at the 5 minute mark, I'd agree with the need to open it up to get a first down there. Had they been up by only one score at that same point, I have no doubt McCarthy would have thrown the ball in trying to move it rather than running it, because they would more desperately need a first down to win at that point. Running in that situation showed confidence in his team, not a lack of it.

The only reason to lack confidence at that point, and therefore take more risks, was if you feared your team would fall apart by allowing Seattle to get a quick score, successfully execute an onside kick and then score a second quick TD - all without the benefit of possessing the ball again.

Well, we know what happened. The Bostick Botch single-handedly undermined the faith McCarthy had in his guys, and changed the complexion of all the other plays and calls before it that until that point had contributed to their success. Now they became instrumental in their failure.

The field goals in the first quarter that should have added enough to the final tally for victory (as they did vs. New England) all of a sudden should have been 4th down touchdowns. Burnett's interception to seal the game became a premature celebration. HaHa's inexplicable failure to break up the two point conversion wouldn't even have happened. McCarthy's confidence in his team to finish Seattle off and play as they had for the entire game up to that point (3 for 7 for 32 yards passing isn't exactly lighting it up passing) - and as they had done in numerous wins prior - became "playing not to lose," "tightening up" and more.

Everything that happened before the botch changed, and suddenly, before we could get our heads around it, everything after it actually happened. It wasn't a dream, but at the same time none of it was real either - until one moment - a moment brought on entirely by a mental lapse of reason - changed it all into the opposite of what it was before.

You were right Maxie to fear what to me was an unbelievable series of events. Obviously all that happened was possible and could possibly have been avoided had they passed rather than ran. There is no guarantee that passing the ball would have secured a first down but we know running didn't.

If you want to say he should have had less confidence in his guys and protected the team against themselves, then there's nothing and noone who can deny that's right because they screwed the pooch at every turn from that point on.

I can't blame McCarthy for having confidence in his guys.

Vince, first of all, thanks for the reasoned dialog.

Rehashing this game is getting old fast. The only reason I'm still in the conversation is that I find your point of view fascinating. McCarthy obviously shares your point of view so understanding it is key to my estimation of what the future will bring in Green Bay.

The essence of your argument is that McCarthy did nothing wrong. Players play the game, not coaches. If the players had not made mistakes and had done their jobs properly, the Packers would have won the game and would be in the Super Bowl. The job of the Head Coach is to have "confidence in his guys," and McCarthy did that job well last Sunday.

The problem with that argument is that it is unrealistic and, hence, untrue. Yes, the players play the game, but the Head Coach controls what the players may and may not do in certain, key situations. That was the case Sunday.

For the sake of this discussion, let's agree to forget how the game ended and all that transpired on the field after Burnett's interception. Green Bay has the ball on it's own 43 yard line. There is 5:04 left on the clock. GB has the lead 19-7.

Answer this question: What happens next, i.e., what do the players playing the game do next, RUN or PASS?

If this was a sandlot game, you couldn't answer that question because the players themselves decide what they're going to do. However, in the NFL that is not the case. In the NFL the coach decides what the players will do in that situation and Mike McCarthy decided the players would RUN the ball into the teeth of a stacked defense.

The truth is, that at that moment in the game, Mike McCarthy directly affected play in a way that the players could not. Furthermore, McCarthy decided that the Packers would RUN into the teeth of the Seattle defense on the next two plays and then punt on 4th down.

McCarthy owns those decisions and must explain and defend those decisions to his players and to GB fans. So far, to my knowledge, he has not done so.

Here is how Eric Baranczyk and Pete Dougherty of Packernews.com described McCarthy's series of decisions at that point of the game:

On the ensuing series the Packers lost four yards on three runs, and punted. There were execution errors on each run, but the biggest mistake was McCarthy's decision to play it safe, to play not to lose.

The Packers' offensive line might be the best pass blocking group in the NFL. It had a fantastic game protecting Aaron Rodgers on Sunday against one of the best pass-rushing lines in the NFL. Really impressive. But it's middle of the road as a run-blocking unit, and the Seahawks were looking run all the way. Getting a first down on the ground probably was asking too much.

Also, Seahawks cornerback Richard Sherman was obviously playing one-armed because of an injured elbow. He was ripe for targeting. The Packers have a booth full of assistant coaches and spotters upstairs. They had to know it.

You have Rodgers, the presumptive league MVP and a guy who protects the ball as well as anyone. Put the game in his hands to keep the clock moving.

On the first play the Seahawks had 10 men in the box and the 11th only seven yards deep. They were selling out against the run. On second down, even against three wide receivers, it was seven in the box, press coverage and a single safety 10 yards deep. Match up Nelson with Sherman and throw him a jump ball. Nelson would have a huge edge.

In fact, on third-and-16, Nelson was matched against Sherman on the outside. You would have had to have liked Nelson's chances of coming down with the catch against a one-armed player. But McCarthy called a run instead.

Vince, as you say correctly, deciding on a PASS play does not guarantee first down yardage or a different outcome to the game, but it certainly is a debatable decision, subject to criticism.

Moreover, the importance of that decision cannot be dismissed by tired canards like "players play the game" or by red herrings like head coaches are to be held blameless because they must show "confidence in their guys."

[mraynrand]

Maxi, Stubby blew it too. They all did. Vince makes a compelling argument, but even if Bostick blocks and Nelson recovers, the Packers still have to get a first down so as not to return the ball with about 1:20 on the clock. From The Slide on, the entire team, Stubby included thought it was in the bag. And/or Stubby was being extremely stubby to think that he could go 4 minute offense with run only and get a first down, ESPECIALLY when he knew he couldn't based on his 4th and goal decisions. Did he really think they would do better against 9-10 in the box in the middle of the field versus the goal line. Stubby should accept his share of the blame, and I am betting regardless of the what he says publicly, he knows he cocked it up.

[Strange Brew]

Simple as this...Burnett runs at worst to the Sea Hags 45. Packers play for the FG, Get the FG, none of that other shit takes place, Packers win!

[Maxie the Taxi]

Ayn, I changed my sig in your honor. Immediately after the game, when everybody else was ranting, you concisely put your finger on the reason for the debacle. Football is about emotions as much as it is about anything else. After Burnett's interception our emotional state flat-lined while Seattle's began to ascend.

End of story.

[Patler]

I think as the play unfolded, Hawk made the right decision, since House was out to lunch on the play and stood there watching Ryan run past him.

House could have done what Hawk did, allowing Hawk to go with the receiver.

That's just it. House was on the end, took a few steps at the snap, then stopped standing up as Ryan started to get up. House did nothing until Ryan was well outside of him when he finally turned to follow. Since House clearly was not firing off in an attempt to disrupt the kick, I can only assume he had some responsibility in the event of a fake or botch. Otherwise, he was serving no earthly purpose on the play at all.

I just watched it a couple more times. On the other side, Hayward (I think) was lined up the same as House. Each took only about two steps up field and stopped. The difference was that Hayward kept his feet and shoulders square, House turned his shoulders inward. Hayward was able to turn and run back must faster than House reacted to Ryan right in front of him.

If that is the design, its another in a long line of bad Slocum plans.

Sounds like it was by design, at least according to Daugherty at the Green Bay Press Gazzette. . He saw the same thing I did, House having, and being casual about contain responsibilities on his side, while Bush (I mistakenly said Hayward) played differently and correctly on the opposite side:

House was too casual on Seattle's fake field goal pass for a touchdown. He had outside contain at right end, but he turned the corner and stood. If he'd flared outside after a couple of steps, as Jarrett Bush did on the other side, he would have blown up the fake.

http://www.packersnews.com/story/spo...ired/22141019/

[pbmax]

Well I hope this gets mentioned at House's exit interview before they shoot him out of a cannon to Chicago.