Official Super Bowl XLIX Thread

[smuggler]

New England didn't call a timeout after the first down carry because they were not going to even contest a rushing attempt. If Lynch had been given the ball on second down, the line would have allowed Lynch to score. The timeout is worth more than the time to New England at that point.

Think about it, why was New England in a 4-3 look 2nd and goal from the 1-yard line? They were playing pass all the way because they didn't want anything other than a TD/turnover/incompletion. Had the Seahawks scored a TD, the Pats would have had the ball with 24ish seconds left and all three timeouts, needing only a FG to tie.

[woodbuck27]

New England didn't call a timeout after the first down carry because they were not going to even contest a rushing attempt. If Lynch had been given the ball on second down, the line would have allowed Lynch to score. The timeout is worth more than the time to New England at that point.

Think about it, why was New England in a 4-3 look 2nd and goal from the 1-yard line? They were playing pass all the way because they didn't want anything other than a TD/turnover/incompletion. Had the Seahawks scored a TD, the Pats would have had the ball with 24ish seconds left and all three timeouts, needing only a FG to tie.

That's good analysis.

Seattle's on the 1 yard line and the world was looking for a handoff to Marshawn Lynch.

I wonder if we'll ever know what Bill Belichick's thoughts were on that down/play?

[Bossman641]

New England didn't call a timeout after the first down carry because they were not going to even contest a rushing attempt. If Lynch had been given the ball on second down, the line would have allowed Lynch to score. The timeout is worth more than the time to New England at that point.

Think about it, why was New England in a 4-3 look 2nd and goal from the 1-yard line? They were playing pass all the way because they didn't want anything other than a TD/turnover/incompletion. Had the Seahawks scored a TD, the Pats would have had the ball with 24ish seconds left and all three timeouts, needing only a FG to tie.

How are you coming to this conclusion? The DL fired off the ball on 2nd down. There was no let up in their play. On top of that, NE stayed in a big package and didn't match Seattle's 3 WR look.

I think both Belicheck and Carroll screwed up the ending of that game. Belicheck should have been using the 2 remaining TO to ensure NE had some time remaining. Seattle should have run a safer play. I hate when we run slants from in close. There is too much traffic in there.

[woodbuck27]

How are you coming to this conclusion? The DL fired off the ball on 2nd down. There was no let up in their play. On top of that, NE stayed in a big package and didn't match Seattle's 3 WR look.

I think both Belicheck and Carroll screwed up the ending of that game. Belicheck should have been using the 2 remaining TO to ensure NE had some time remaining. Seattle should have run a safer play. I hate when we run slants from in close. There is too much traffic in there.

Good observations Bossman641.

Here's exactly how New England defended on 2nd and goal @ 0:28 in the game:

'Out of the horses mouth' what Bill Belichick said about that game clinching play ...See 3:25 of this video:

http://www.si.com/nfl/2015/02/02/new...dad-super-bowl

[pbmax]

I think both Belicheck and Carroll screwed up the ending of that game. Belicheck should have been using the 2 remaining TO to ensure NE had some time remaining. Seattle should have run a safer play. I hate when we run slants from in close. There is too much traffic in there.

I think the problem was tendency and film study. Because for the briefest of moments, it was open, the DB was well off the LOS. That DB had to crash hard at the snap to be in position. No hesitation at all. When he saw the WR cross to run a slant/flat combo, he took off.

He had to see that on previous Seattle double red zone plays.

[ThunderDan]

I think the problem was tendency and film study. Because for the briefest of moments, it was open, the DB was well off the LOS. That DB had to crash hard at the snap to be in position. No hesitation at all. When he saw the WR cross to run a slant/flat combo, he took off.

He had to see that on previous Seattle double red zone plays.

On the radio this morning they said NE notices that SEA tended to run that play in short yardage formation and had actually run the play in practice this week with the O scoring a TD. They were ready for it during the Super Bowl.

[mraynrand]

On the radio this morning they said NE notices that SEA tended to run that play in short yardage formation and had actually run the play in practice this week with the O scoring a TD. They were ready for it during the Super Bowl.

It doesn't surprise me that Belicheat knew Seattle was running this play in practice. Probably a hidden camera in a deflated ball.

[ThunderDan]

It doesn't surprise me that Belicheat knew Seattle was running this play in practice. Probably a hidden camera in a deflated ball.

Oops, probably need a comma there. NE had run the play against their own D in practice this week because they know that SEA liked to run that pass play in short yardage situations. The Pat's O scored on the Pat's D but the D was ready for the play come Super Bowl time.

[Bossman641]

I think the problem was tendency and film study. Because for the briefest of moments, it was open, the DB was well off the LOS. That DB had to crash hard at the snap to be in position. No hesitation at all. When he saw the WR cross to run a slant/flat combo, he took off.

He had to see that on previous Seattle double red zone plays.

I agree it was open for a split second. If Wilson had thrown the ball a touch earlier Lockette probably catches it and, at worst, gets tackled just short of the end zone. I just can't believe the Seahawks didn't take advantage of Wilson's legs or Lynch in that situation.

[pbmax]

New England didn't call a timeout after the first down carry because they were not going to even contest a rushing attempt. If Lynch had been given the ball on second down, the line would have allowed Lynch to score. The timeout is worth more than the time to New England at that point.
.

Then why did they tackle him on first down?

And why not call a TO then let them score?

[woodbuck27]

Then why did they tackle him on first down?

And why not call a TO then let them score?

Yup.

1-5-NE 5 (1:06) 24-M.Lynch left tackle to NE 1 for 4 yards (54-D.Hightower).

That 'stop and hack' on Marshawn Lynch by New England's MLB Akeem Ayers was something else. Ayers played very well this season.

[yetisnowman]

Then why did they tackle him on first down?

And why not call a TO then let them score?

It was a super ballsy move by Belicheck to psych them out, Seattle I am sure expected them to call a timeout. When they didn't, all of a sudden 30 seconds ran off the clock. And with one timeout, Seattle really didn't have time to run 3 times without getting in the endzone. I didn't understand it at all at first. But as you said he most certainly wasn't not calling his timeouts to let them score on purpose, that makes zero sense.

[Bossman641]

It was a super ballsy move by Belicheck to psych them out, Seattle I am sure expected them to call a timeout. When they didn't, all of a sudden 30 seconds ran off the clock. And with one timeout, Seattle really didn't have time to run 3 times without getting in the endzone. I didn't understand it at all at first. But as you said he most certainly wasn't not calling his timeouts to let them score on purpose, that makes zero sense.

So Belichick didn't call a timeout in the hopes that Seattle would be psyched out and would botch the next play? Sorry but I'm not buying it. Lynch got tackled with 1:02 left. Seattle changes their personnel from a 2 TE I formation to the 3 WR formation and gets to the LOS at a normal pace. Seattle purposefully ran 30 seconds off the clock to leave as little time as possible remaining.

If Lynch plunges the ball in, Hauschka most likely kicks into the end zone and NE is left with 20 seconds and 2 TO to get in field goal range. Belichick is then left answering questions this morning about why he only left Brady with 20 seconds and 2 TO instead of 55-58 seconds and 1 TO.

[Pugger]

So Belichick didn't call a timeout in the hopes that Seattle would be psyched out and would botch the next play? Sorry but I'm not buying it. Lynch got tackled with 1:02 left. Seattle changes their personnel from a 2 TE I formation to the 3 WR formation and gets to the LOS at a normal pace. Seattle purposefully ran 30 seconds off the clock to leave as little time as possible remaining.

If Lynch plunges the ball in, Hauschka most likely kicks into the end zone and NE is left with 20 seconds and 2 TO to get in field goal range. Belichick is then left answering questions this morning about why he only left Brady with 20 seconds and 2 TO instead of 55-58 seconds and 1 TO.

I think Belicheat screwed up there. Let's say Lynch does score and there is only a dozen seconds left. BB would be roasted just like Carroll is today.

[pbmax]

So Belichick didn't call a timeout in the hopes that Seattle would be psyched out and would botch the next play? Sorry but I'm not buying it. Lynch got tackled with 1:02 left. Seattle changes their personnel from a 2 TE I formation to the 3 WR formation and gets to the LOS at a normal pace. Seattle purposefully ran 30 seconds off the clock to leave as little time as possible remaining.

If Lynch plunges the ball in, Hauschka most likely kicks into the end zone and NE is left with 20 seconds and 2 TO to get in field goal range. Belichick is then left answering questions this morning about why he only left Brady with 20 seconds and 2 TO instead of 55-58 seconds and 1 TO.

Did Patriots have one or two TOs remaining?

[woodbuck27]

Did Seattle have one or two TOs remaining?

Seattle had ONE TO remaining when the ball was turned over on the Malcolm Butler pick.

Seattle took time outs at:

Timeout #1 by SEA at 01:50 remaining in the 4th Qtr.

and

Timeout #2 by SEA at 01:06 remaining in the 4th Qtr.

[pbmax]

I believe it was one.

Yeah, I mean to ask about the Patriots. I edited the original while you answered.

[yetisnowman]

So Belichick didn't call a timeout in the hopes that Seattle would be psyched out and would botch the next play? Sorry but I'm not buying it. Lynch got tackled with 1:02 left. Seattle changes their personnel from a 2 TE I formation to the 3 WR formation and gets to the LOS at a normal pace. Seattle purposefully ran 30 seconds off the clock to leave as little time as possible remaining.

If Lynch plunges the ball in, Hauschka most likely kicks into the end zone and NE is left with 20 seconds and 2 TO to get in field goal range. Belichick is then left answering questions this morning about why he only left Brady with 20 seconds and 2 TO instead of 55-58 seconds and 1 TO.

Ultimately I think the smart decision would have been to be ready to burn a timeout after every play. I didn't mean psych out in terms of making them screw up a play and turn the ball over. Just in that they were expecting them to take a timeout. By calling a timeout with a minute left, while you do give yourself more wiggle room if Seattle scores, you also stop the clock for them and keep the entire playbook open for them on all 3 plays if necessary. I think that was his logic, I could be wrong. Other than that him letting the clock run doesn't make a lot of sense. It struck me as similar to when the kicker is expecting a timeout to freeze him, yet one doesn't come.

[Bossman641]

Ultimately I think the smart decision would have been to be ready to burn a timeout after every play. I didn't mean psych out in terms of making them screw up a play and turn the ball over. Just in that they were expecting them to take a timeout. By calling a timeout with a minute left, while you do give yourself more wiggle room if Seattle scores, you also stop the clock for them and keep the entire playbook open for them on all 3 plays if necessary. I think that was his logic, I could be wrong. Other than that him letting the clock run doesn't make a lot of sense. It struck me as similar to when the kicker is expecting a timeout to freeze him, yet one doesn't come.

Seattle already had the entire playbook open. They semi-closed it on themselves. Once Lynch got tackled with 1:02 they could have easily hurried up and snapped the ball with 40 seconds or so left. They dragged things out too much. Actually that entire drive was a pretty poor use of time.

1st and 10 at SEA 20 (2:02) (Shotgun) R.Wilson pass deep left to M.Lynch to NE 49 for 31 yards (J.Collins).
Two-Minute Warning
1st and 10 at NE 49 (1:55) (Shotgun) R.Wilson pass incomplete deep right to J.Kearse (M.Butler).
Timeout #1 by SEA at 01:50.
2nd and 10 at NE 49 (1:50) (Shotgun) R.Wilson pass incomplete deep right to C.Matthews (B.Browner).
3rd and 10 at NE 49 (1:41) (Shotgun) R.Wilson pass short right to R.Lockette to NE 38 for 11 yards (L.Ryan).
1st and 10 at NE 38 (1:14) (No Huddle, Shotgun) R.Wilson pass deep right to J.Kearse pushed ob at NE 5 for 33 yards (M.Butler).
Timeout #2 by SEA at 01:06.
1st and 5 at NE 5 (1:06) M.Lynch left tackle to NE 1 for 4 yards (D.Hightower).
2nd and 1 at NE 1 (:26) (Shotgun) R.Wilson pass short right intended for R.Lockette INTERCEPTED by M.Butler at NE -1. M.Butler to NE 2 for 3 yards (R.Lockette). PENALTY on NE, Unsportsmanlike Conduct, 1 yard, enforced at NE 2.

Why did they take TO #1 after the incompletion to Kearse? I can't remember. Was there an injured player?

[pbmax]

Seattle already had the entire playbook open. They semi-closed it on themselves. Once Lynch got tackled with 1:02 they could have easily hurried up and snapped the ball with 40 seconds or so left. They dragged things out too much. Actually that entire drive was a pretty poor use of time.



Why did they take TO #1 after the incompletion to Kearse? I can't remember. Was there an injured player?

Late substitutions and then needed an adjustment/audible. This has happened to the Packers numerous times.

I think the switch from a 40 second clock, after a normal non-incompletion play to a 25 second clock (after a TO, injury, official measurement) screws up some teams. They are used to being able to call a personnel group and then get the play to the QB with time to huddle or move people around or audible all the while the coach can talk until 15 seconds are left on the clock.

On the 25 second clock, the sideline management is more compressed. Play call and personnel have to happen at same time and be done quickly. The coach only has 10 seconds to talk. If you huddle there isn't much time to audible or move people around. If you line up immediately you cannot communicate with the sideline and half the team are far away from the sideline so second adjustment isn't possible.

I am sure they work on this, but if something goes wrong, there isn't enough time to reset on a 25 second clock.