THAT DAM SCREEN PASS

[Bretsky]

I keep having flashbacks to that pathetic excuse for a screen pass that could clearly have kept the momentum in Green Bay's favor. Watching the replay angers me more.

To me that play mirrored this teams greatest weakness...the interior OL.

Spitz,Wells, Colledge

It's quite easy to point out the duck Favre threw to essentially end our season.

There was a less noticed play in quarter 2 that was just as bad and could have changed the miserable outcome we all unfortunately witnessed.

On a screen pass under 2:00 left in the first half, Green Bay appeared to have the perfect play set up with about 900lbs of its interior OL set up with only one MLB to block. From the stands it looked like a gimme TD; the perfect call against that defense.

But Colledge and Wells appeared to block nothing but air, and frickin Spitz let a 238lb linebacker blow up the play and stop Brandon Jackson in his tracks......killing any momentum we were trying to establish and making us settle for another lousy field goal.

To add to the incompetence, Brandon Jackson looked again unsure of where to go and instead of boldly cutting inside he hesitated and the play turned to crap.

If Favre has lost any sleep over that last duck, I sure hope that Wells, Colledge, and Spitz lose sleep over that pathetic excuse for an attempt at being NFL offensive lineman on that play.


Still Angry



Cheers,
B

[BF4MVP]

It was Jackson's fault..Spitz had Pierce blocked, and Jackson ran right where the guy was being blocked..A little cutback would have worked quite nicely. Grant would have scored on that play.

[Bretsky]

It was Jackson's fault..Spitz had Pierce blocked, and Jackson ran right where the guy was being blocked..A little cutback would have worked quite nicely. Grant would have scored on that play.


Hard for me to call that a block; he had 70lbs on that guy; knock him on his ass.

[b bulldog]

That was all jackson as posted. he doesn't screw it up, he gets a TD.

[KYPack]

Wait a minute.

Spitz just had to get in the way. He missed his block 7 ways to Sunday

Like our old line coach used to say, "Don't get F'n fancy, get his ass on the ground"!

Colledge and Wells, they should've at least checked the pursuit before they headed up field.

And yeah, Jackson didn't exactly look like Emmitt Smith or anything, but Antonio Pearce got HIS rookie ass on the ground. Great play by the LB

[Jimx29]

Every damned one of the screens they tried over the past month failed miserably :?

[HarveyWallbangers]

I'd put most of the blame on the blockers. With two or three OL out blocking, there shouldn't have been a LB close to Jackson when he caught the ball. Watch the replay. He looks unsure, but the guy was on him immediately.

[Bretsky]

I'd put most of the blame on the blockers. With two or three OL out blocking, there shouldn't have been a LB close to Jackson when he caught the ball. Watch the replay. He looks unsure, but the guy was on him immediately.


Completely agree; those OL should have put him on his ass. If it was to Grant IMO it would have been a TD; but it should have been anyways

[GrnBay007]

It was a team loss. Refresh my memory....did anyone other than Driver look like they gave it their ALL that day?

[Bretsky]

It was a team loss. Refresh my memory....did anyone other than Driver look like they gave it their ALL that day?


Taushcher played ok
Bigby played ok
Poppinga played ok
Crosby played ok

[GrnBay007]

It was a team loss. Refresh my memory....did anyone other than Driver look like they gave it their ALL that day?


Taushcher played ok
Bigby played ok
Poppinga played ok
Crosby played ok

Yep, they played ok. But Driver really put himself out there.

Of course I'm talking from memory of a game that made me feel kinda sick....and I haven't seen it a 2nd time.

[digitaldean]

Tauscher kept Strahan at bay the WHOLE game.

By the way, who was the one who hustled downfield and jumped on the ball that Grant stripped from McQuarters? Tauscher.

All that one a shredded ankle (which has been that way for the tail end of the season).

I'd say he gave it his all. Our guards... that's a different story. Credit the Giants all you want, the guards stunk like a pile of pig manure in the middle of August. They must have forgotten how to block for screens, otherwise Pierce NEVER even gets a whiff of Grant on that screen pass.

[woodbuck27]

I'd put most of the blame on the blockers. With two or three OL out blocking, there shouldn't have been a LB close to Jackson when he caught the ball. Watch the replay. He looks unsure, but the guy was on him immediately.

Yes. He was stuck again in his shoes. He has to move and think after.

[GBRulz]

It was a team loss. Refresh my memory....did anyone other than Driver look like they gave it their ALL that day?


Taushcher played ok
Bigby played ok
Poppinga played ok
Crosby played ok

Yep, they played ok. But Driver really put himself out there.

Of course I'm talking from memory of a game that made me feel kinda sick....and I haven't seen it a 2nd time.

I agree with you there. I have no desire to put myself through the agony of watching it again!

[Bretsky]

It was a team loss. Refresh my memory....did anyone other than Driver look like they gave it their ALL that day?


Taushcher played ok
Bigby played ok
Poppinga played ok
Crosby played ok

Yep, they played ok. But Driver really put himself out there.

Of course I'm talking from memory of a game that made me feel kinda sick....and I haven't seen it a 2nd time.

I agree with you there. I have no desire to put myself through the agony of watching it again!


I did and I ended up more angry than I was the first time when I was there

[GBRulz]

Perhaps you should stick to Cinemax, B !

[Bretsky]

Perhaps you should stick to Cinemax, B !


Yes, it's been quite some time since I've seen a chick on chick scene; maybe that explains the moodiness lately :idea:

[Patler]

On screen passes the runner has to give the linemen time and space to make the block. If they run up the backs of their blockers you get exactly what you got on that play. Successful screens require timing between the back and the linemen. It often requires patience by the back.

That one was mostly Jackson's fault.

[ND72]

It was Jackson's fault..Spitz had Pierce blocked, and Jackson ran right where the guy was being blocked..A little cutback would have worked quite nicely. Grant would have scored on that play.

You're kidding right? I can send you the tape if you dont' have it. That was completely and totally on Spitz, Wells, & Colledge, mostly spitz though. 1 guy, and he totally ate spitz up. As a former OL guy, the #1 thing you do on screens no matter what is cut the SHIT out of anyone coming in your direction unless you already have him tied up, which Spitz didn't. He blew it. Should Jackson have stopped and let him go by? Maybe, but he caught the ball and turned right into the tackle, and had little chance.


People are so quick to blame everything on Brandon Jackson...how bout you watch the facts before you blame the kid.

[The Leaper]

I think there is enough blame to go around on that play.

[KYPack]

It was Jackson's fault..Spitz had Pierce blocked, and Jackson ran right where the guy was being blocked..A little cutback would have worked quite nicely. Grant would have scored on that play.

You're kidding right? I can send you the tape if you dont' have it. That was completely and totally on Spitz, Wells, & Colledge, mostly spitz though. 1 guy, and he totally ate spitz up. As a former OL guy, the #1 thing you do on screens no matter what is cut the SHIT out of anyone coming in your direction unless you already have him tied up, which Spitz didn't. He blew it. Should Jackson have stopped and let him go by? Maybe, but he caught the ball and turned right into the tackle, and had little chance.


People are so quick to blame everything on Brandon Jackson...how bout you watch the facts before you blame the kid.

ND's 100% right. You guys need to listen to the 'ol lineman. But some of you guys sound like lineman the way you blame the back for fucking up the play. Jackson had no cards to play, if he cut back, he ran right into Pearce. He took it wide, which was all he could do. Pearce fought thru Spitz's phantom block and made the tackle on Jackson.

All you can "blame" Jackson for is not being Barry Sanders or Emmitt Smith. I'm sure those two guys would've pulled something out of their asses and made somthing out of it, but Jackson did what he could.

Spitz HAD to find a way to slow Pearce. And he did zilch. I've now watched the play several times. At least Colledge did keep his head on a swivel and check that Jackson was clear. When Daryn saw the play was in trouble, he tried to come back and help. Unfortunately, Spitz's block was so bad, there was nothing 73 could do. Wellsy kept heading downfield, but he had to assume somebody was gonna get the play blocked up.

This play is a microcosm of our poor guard play. Both of our kiddie guards are woefully inconsistent and they suck in space.

This play also shows the agony of coaching. It was a perfect call for that down and distance. With even below average execution, that screen gets us to first and goal. But the perfect play goes nowhere with horrible blocking by a mediocre player.

[Deputy Nutz]

On screen passes the runner has to give the linemen time and space to make the block. If they run up the backs of their blockers you get exactly what you got on that play. Successful screens require timing between the back and the linemen. It often requires patience by the back.

That one was mostly Jackson's fault.

I agree that Spitz didn't lock on and hold his block, and I also agree that Jackson didn't know where to run the football after he caught it. He just sort of stood behind the line. The other thing, he didn't set up with enough depth behind his offensive line, he was too close to them when he caught the ball.

the bottom line why our screen pass has been terrible all year it is because of inexperience both at running back, and on the offensive line. The Packers could have had Grant back there and I am sure not a whole else would have changed. The Packers are simply not a good screen team because the people count on to run it are too green to perform it well. There is no Vince Workman, Edgar Bennett, Doresy Levens, or Ahman Greens on this roster. Just young inexperienced running backs.

[The Leaper]

Just young inexperienced running backs.

And interior OL. The only guy with any smudgeon of experience is Wells. That's a far cry from having Flanagan, Rivera, Wahle, and Green operating a screen.

The fact our guys looked that lost on a screen play after 2 full seasons of play gives me little confidence these guys are suddenly going to have the light come on this offseason.

Without a major upgrade on the interior OL in the way of experience (meaning free agency, not draft) this team will not have any real aspriations to a title in 2008.

[KYPack]

I buy the experience idea. Our roster is top heavy with kids. Good kids, but some of 'em will probably never help us. We could use some old hands who know how to execute some of the more sophisticated situations.

That same screen with Flanagan, Rivera, Wahle, and Tony Fisher has Fish scoring standing up. Our younguns get a little jumpy on some plays. They haven't learned the finess plays, yet.

Look at the Pats. They have great youth, but they also keep Troy Brown, Rodney Harrison, and Junior Seau around to provide experience and show the youngbloods the way.

We could use a Kevin Faulk type back for our 3rd and long problems

[Patler]

We could use a Kevin Faulk type back for our 3rd and long problems

That's what Noah Heron was for. :)

In all honesty, some backs have a natural "feel" for those situations. Tony Fisher did. Heron seems to a little bit. Jackson was reputed to have very good skills as a receiver. If he can become a solid blocker, he could be a nice 3rd down back.

[denverYooper]

It was a team loss. Refresh my memory....did anyone other than Driver look like they gave it their ALL that day?


Taushcher played ok
Bigby played ok
Poppinga played ok
Crosby played ok


Poppinga has played ok both times that the team has played in "extreme" weather conditions--in Chicago and vs. the Jinz. He seems to be able to handle weather better than most.

[BF4MVP]

Just because he didn't "knock him on his ass" doesn't mean he didn't have him blocked..I saw the play, Spitz had Pierce blocked. Jackson should know not to run right where Pierce was being blocked..Like I said, Grant would have scored on that play.

[packiowa]

There is plenty of blame to go around on that play, but the fact remains that Spitz was too slow to get a good angle on Pierce. My initial thought on gameday was "I really wish Coston was playing" b/c there is no doubt in my mind that he makes that block. Wells coulda helped and Jackson coulda done something, but Spitz missed the bock because he was too slow to square his man up.

[KYPack]

Just because he didn't "knock him on his ass" doesn't mean he didn't have him blocked..I saw the play, Spitz had Pierce blocked. Jackson should know not to run right where Pierce was being blocked..Like I said, Grant would have scored on that play.

OK, we need about six beers and some shots, 'cause this is a barroom football argument.

Have you guys watched this play or are you all just talkin' shit?

1stly, this was a quick screen. Two big lineman were pouring in on Brett & he had to get off a quick pass right now. Which the HOFer did, right to Jackson. Jackson wasn't "sorta standing around", Nutz. He was running the quick screen like he should. If ya wanna bitch at Jackson, he briefly bobbled the toss and tried to take off up field.

Spitz NEVER blocked Pierce. He tried to engage him, but failed. Pierce fought thru Spitz's ghost block and grabbed hold of Jackson right from the jump. Jackson couldn't "cut back off Spitz's block" cause there was no block. Pierce at one point had 'em both and controlled the whole play. Which was now totally blown up.

Spitz earned around 90% of the blame for missing his block and I guess Jackson gets the rest for being tackled.

[Scott Campbell]

When is Mad getting you guys a telestrator?

[woodbuck27]

It was a team loss. Refresh my memory....did anyone other than Driver look like they gave it their ALL that day?


Taushcher played ok
Bigby played ok
Poppinga played ok
Crosby played ok

Yep, they played ok. But Driver really put himself out there.

Of course I'm talking from memory of a game that made me feel kinda sick....and I haven't seen it a 2nd time.

I agree with you there. I have no desire to put myself through the agony of watching it again!


I did and I ended up more angry than I was the first time when I was there

Yup.

It was one of those games and your watching it, and thinking how bad we stunk, but also well maybe. . .

we'll still win and from that. . .

nawwwww we stink, and finally that pick by FAVRE and that's all she wrote. .

but wait. . . . such a long FG attempt and he missed the last two (Hahaha choked because of the really bad weather conditions) . . .

and PLEASE JUST END THIS STINKING GAME and get FAVRE and his frozen BODY in the Locker room and us right where we are now.

but Noooo !! you'll never make a 47 yarder and we'll get the last shot and . . . . . . . . .

and there's still Packerrats. :)

[woodbuck27]

Just because he didn't "knock him on his ass" doesn't mean he didn't have him blocked..I saw the play, Spitz had Pierce blocked. Jackson should know not to run right where Pierce was being blocked..Like I said, Grant would have scored on that play.

OK, we need about six beers and some shots, 'cause this is a barroom football argument.

Have you guys watched this play or are you all just talkin' shit?

1stly, this was a quick screen. Two big lineman were pouring in on Brett & he had to get off a quick pass right now. Which the HOFer did, right to Jackson. Jackson wasn't "sorta standing around", Nutz. He was running the quick screen like he should. If ya wanna bitch at Jackson, he briefly bobbled the toss and tried to take off up field.

Spitz NEVER blocked Pierce. He tried to engage him, but failed. Pierce fought thru Spitz's ghost block and grabbed hold of Jackson right from the jump. Jackson couldn't "cut back off Spitz's block" cause there was no block. Pierce at one point had 'em both and controlled the whole play. Which was now totally blown up.

Spitz earned around 90% of the blame for missing his block and I guess Jackson gets the rest for being tackled.

Brandon Jackson has to get a lot stronger and think quicker or he's playing in the CFL.

[KYPack]

When is Mad getting you guys a telestrator?

Best Mad could do was an old Etch-A-Sketch and some WalMart Crayons.

[pbmax]

I've seen it three times and no one acquitted themselves well. Spitz blocked next to nothing, but the spacing on that play stunk out loud.

Whether it was the throw, route of the back OR the timing of the blockers, when the back turned around he was right on top of the O lineman. That left them with very little angle on the backer. Even had the RB chosen a better direction after the catch, the linebacker already had a path to him.

Should Spitz have cut him? Sure. But if he doesn't expect the back to be one step behind him, the clock in his head was wrong.

[Deputy Nutz]

Just because he didn't "knock him on his ass" doesn't mean he didn't have him blocked..I saw the play, Spitz had Pierce blocked. Jackson should know not to run right where Pierce was being blocked..Like I said, Grant would have scored on that play.

OK, we need about six beers and some shots, 'cause this is a barroom football argument.

Have you guys watched this play or are you all just talkin' shit?

1stly, this was a quick screen. Two big lineman were pouring in on Brett & he had to get off a quick pass right now. Which the HOFer did, right to Jackson. Jackson wasn't "sorta standing around", Nutz. He was running the quick screen like he should. If ya wanna bitch at Jackson, he briefly bobbled the toss and tried to take off up field.

Spitz NEVER blocked Pierce. He tried to engage him, but failed. Pierce fought thru Spitz's ghost block and grabbed hold of Jackson right from the jump. Jackson couldn't "cut back off Spitz's block" cause there was no block. Pierce at one point had 'em both and controlled the whole play. Which was now totally blown up.

Spitz earned around 90% of the blame for missing his block and I guess Jackson gets the rest for being tackled.

I am simply blaming both Spitz and Jackson. Spitz failed to block the one guy that could make a play, and Jackson for simply not making a play, lack of football instincts if you will. I just thought more could have been made out of the play even with missed block by Spitz.

[KYPack]

Just because he didn't "knock him on his ass" doesn't mean he didn't have him blocked..I saw the play, Spitz had Pierce blocked. Jackson should know not to run right where Pierce was being blocked..Like I said, Grant would have scored on that play.

OK, we need about six beers and some shots, 'cause this is a barroom football argument.

Have you guys watched this play or are you all just talkin' shit?

1stly, this was a quick screen. Two big lineman were pouring in on Brett & he had to get off a quick pass right now. Which the HOFer did, right to Jackson. Jackson wasn't "sorta standing around", Nutz. He was running the quick screen like he should. If ya wanna bitch at Jackson, he briefly bobbled the toss and tried to take off up field.

Spitz NEVER blocked Pierce. He tried to engage him, but failed. Pierce fought thru Spitz's ghost block and grabbed hold of Jackson right from the jump. Jackson couldn't "cut back off Spitz's block" cause there was no block. Pierce at one point had 'em both and controlled the whole play. Which was now totally blown up.

Spitz earned around 90% of the blame for missing his block and I guess Jackson gets the rest for being tackled.

I am simply blaming both Spitz and Jackson. Spitz failed to block the one guy that could make a play, and Jackson for simply not making a play, lack of football instincts if you will. I just thought more could have been made out of the play even with missed block by Spitz.

Well, OK.

I'm done here. Obviously, the play was a fuck-up. I don't think the kid did that much wrong on his route, & if Spitz does a bit of his job, the goddamned thing mighta scored.

It also depends on who is holding the chalk. A Giant D coach might point out what an out of this world job Pierce did. That was a sick play on his part.

[ND72]

Just because he didn't "knock him on his ass" doesn't mean he didn't have him blocked..I saw the play, Spitz had Pierce blocked. Jackson should know not to run right where Pierce was being blocked..Like I said, Grant would have scored on that play.


actually that does mean he didn't have him blocked. When we ran quick screens like that at a D-2 Football school, if I didn't cut my guy or have him pancaked, #1, I'd get an ear full on the sideline for not doing my job, and #2, I probably am YANKED out of the game. Just a reminder, this is the NFL, not a College team...he should have had him on the ground.

How can you blame Jackson for not running where Pierce was being block,w hen Pierce exploded the block (aka NOT BLOCKED).

Spitz did NOT have pierce blocked, and for anyone who thinks he did does not understand how to run that kind of play.

[packiowa]

Spitz didn't really miss the block b/c he never even got there. He had a chance to dive at Pierce's legs but didn't. He was simply too slow for that particular play and that's a big reason he hasn't earned a solid starting spot.