The Draft. Corey Williams. The Draft. Uhhh, the draft.

[Fritz]

This is the crappiest time of year for me. Baseball is two and a half months away, basketball doesn't matter until the tournament/playoffs, hockey doesn't do it for me any more.

When can we start talking about the draft? When can Bretsky and I pound the pulpit for Odell Thurman, then sheepishly admit, two years later, we were wrong? When can we start scouring draft sites for info on that up-cand-coming corner from Rhode Island State Tech and Bible School?

April! The draft! Re-sign Corey Williams, no matter what it costs! No, wait, don't re-sign that under-acheiving bastard!

I'm a junkie without a fix.

[b bulldog]

From what the local sports stations are saying, TT will not resign 99 and Jarred Allen wants to visit the Packers.

[RashanGary]

I'd be excited if we somehow landed Jared Allen. If Corey Williams wants 5, give Allen 8.5 per year.

[Freak Out]

Here is Bulldogs draft site.

http://www.nfldraftdog.com/Mock_Drafts/2008_nfl_mock_draft.htm

[MJZiggy]

This is the crappiest time of year for me. Baseball is two and a half months away, basketball doesn't matter until the tournament/playoffs, hockey doesn't do it for me any more.

When can we start talking about the draft? When can Bretsky and I pound the pulpit for Odell Thurman, then sheepishly admit, two years later, we were wrong? When can we start scouring draft sites for info on that up-cand-coming corner from Rhode Island State Tech and Bible School?

April! The draft! Re-sign Corey Williams, no matter what it costs! No, wait, don't re-sign that under-acheiving bastard!

I'm a junkie without a fix.

You forgot about free agency...

by the way, if you need something to do...

[MTPackerfan]

From what the local sports stations are saying, TT will not resign 99 and Jarred Allen wants to visit the Packers.


That would be a nice pickup, then move Jenkins to tackle and we can lose Williams without too much pain

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Here is Bulldogs draft site.

http://www.nfldraftdog.com/Mock_Drafts/2008_nfl_mock_draft.htm

Impossible. Every single player in the first round isn't from UM.

[packers11]

When can we start scouring draft sites for info on that up-cand-coming corner from Rhode Island State Tech and Bible School?

Are you talking about Will Blackmon or me??? :lol:

[b bulldog]

Actually tyrone, I am usually pretty hrd on UM players coming out of school. The only players I've liked in the last 4 years or so are David Harris and I like Crable this year. I think most in here would agree that although I like UM, I'm not coveting TT to jump all over them. I like Long also, forgot him. I have huge red flags for manningham and Arrington.

[b bulldog]

Please copy my post that say otherwise

[Tyrone Bigguns]

There is a little button called EDIT.

It is your friend.

[b bulldog]

Good reply, I thought you'd actually have some stuff from real writers, not a bunch of BS that you posted :lol: Like I said in the badger forum, I'm done with you. Man, I feel sorry for you, you seem very small.

[RashanGary]

Good spot on David Harris, bulldog. He turned out to be a hell of a player.

[b bulldog]

Every blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while. If I was good, I'd be getting paid for it.

[DannoMac21]

Baseball starts in a month and a half, not two and a half.

[twoseven]

Take in a good cockfight, maybe.

[LL2]

Jarred Allen wants to visit the Packers.

That would be awesome to land Allen. KC will likely tag Allen, but I read at SI that Allen stated he will not sign a long term contract with KC if he is tag. Allen could help the Pack make the SB next year. He's going to want a mega deal though. GB can afford him, but Kampan's stats are nearly as good and he might want a bigger deal if the Packers sign Allen to a mega deal.

[Deputy Nutz]

Jarred Allen wants to visit the Packers.

That would be awesome to land Allen. KC will likely tag Allen, but I read at SI that Allen stated he will not sign a long term contract with KC if he is tag. Allen could help the Pack make the SB next year. He's going to want a mega deal though. GB can afford him, but Kampan's stats are nearly as good and he might want a bigger deal if the Packers sign Allen to a mega deal.

Kampman isn't like that. Kampman had to realize that he signed his deal without ever recording double digit sack totals. Sure TT will give Kampman a raise like he does everyone else.

If the Packers sign Allen do they part ways with KGB? I say yes, that still leaves only two legitimate pass rushers on the roster although KGB doesn't really need to come in for Allen or Kampman and he certainly couldn't play inside. Maybe Kampman goes down to a 3 technique tackle on passing downs with KGB coming off the left side, but I doubt it.

[MadtownPacker]

If Allen is interested in the Packers he is a must sign. Keep KGB and let Williams go. Allen is worth showing the money too like TT did with Woodson.

[PaCkFan_n_MD]

Jarred Allen wants to visit the Packers.

That would be awesome to land Allen. KC will likely tag Allen, but I read at SI that Allen stated he will not sign a long term contract with KC if he is tag. Allen could help the Pack make the SB next year. He's going to want a mega deal though. GB can afford him, but Kampan's stats are nearly as good and he might want a bigger deal if the Packers sign Allen to a mega deal.

Kampman isn't like that. Kampman had to realize that he signed his deal without ever recording double digit sack totals. Sure TT will give Kampman a raise like he does everyone else.

If the Packers sign Allen do they part ways with KGB? I say yes, that still leaves only two legitimate pass rushers on the roster although KGB doesn't really need to come in for Allen or Kampman and he certainly couldn't play inside. Maybe Kampman goes down to a 3 technique tackle on passing downs with KGB coming off the left side, but I doubt it.

I say keep KGB if we get Allen. We should cut someone that doesn't have much value and who is making to much money, like Babba. And if we do decide to let KGB go, am sure he has some trade value. I bet they could get at least a 3rd from some team in need of a pass rusher.

[b bulldog]

kgb IS SCHEDULED TO count 7.7mil against the cap this year, don't know if he is worth this but he is 31 years old and his speed may be slowing.

[the_idle_threat]

Costs half as much as Dwight Freeney, and is every bit as effective for what we use him for. Maybe more so, now that Freeney is almost washed up.

[Patler]

And if we do decide to let KGB go, am sure he has some trade value. I bet they could get at least a 3rd from some team in need of a pass rusher.

I would be surprised if the Packers got even a fourth round pick for KGB in a trade. I doubt any team will give up a high draft pick for him and pick up his salary for the season.

[pbmax]

Freeney is four times the player KGB ever was. After this latest injury, Freeney may decline, but it has never been close.


Costs half as much as Dwight Freeney, and is every bit as effective for what we use him for. Maybe more so, now that Freeney is almost washed up.

[Patler]

Freeney is four times the player KGB ever was. After this latest injury, Freeney may decline, but it has never been close.


How serious was his last injury?

I agree, no comparison between the two, when healthy. Freeney is heavier than KGB, and was more effective against the run. Also younger.

[mission]

God Allen tore us up this year!! I'd love that!

[Partial]

Jarred Allen wants to visit the Packers.

That would be awesome to land Allen. KC will likely tag Allen, but I read at SI that Allen stated he will not sign a long term contract with KC if he is tag. Allen could help the Pack make the SB next year. He's going to want a mega deal though. GB can afford him, but Kampan's stats are nearly as good and he might want a bigger deal if the Packers sign Allen to a mega deal.

Kampman isn't like that. Kampman had to realize that he signed his deal without ever recording double digit sack totals. Sure TT will give Kampman a raise like he does everyone else.

If the Packers sign Allen do they part ways with KGB? I say yes, that still leaves only two legitimate pass rushers on the roster although KGB doesn't really need to come in for Allen or Kampman and he certainly couldn't play inside. Maybe Kampman goes down to a 3 technique tackle on passing downs with KGB coming off the left side, but I doubt it.

I don't think they'll sign him because he is one substance abuse violation away from a year suspension. Remember how Travis Henry burned the Broncos this year? I'd love it if it happened, but I don't think it will.

[pbmax]

Didn't Travis skate by on a second hand smoke (contact buzz) plea? Its a good thing too, with all those little mouths to feed.





Jarred Allen wants to visit the Packers.

That would be awesome to land Allen. KC will likely tag Allen, but I read at SI that Allen stated he will not sign a long term contract with KC if he is tag. Allen could help the Pack make the SB next year. He's going to want a mega deal though. GB can afford him, but Kampan's stats are nearly as good and he might want a bigger deal if the Packers sign Allen to a mega deal.

Kampman isn't like that. Kampman had to realize that he signed his deal without ever recording double digit sack totals. Sure TT will give Kampman a raise like he does everyone else.

If the Packers sign Allen do they part ways with KGB? I say yes, that still leaves only two legitimate pass rushers on the roster although KGB doesn't really need to come in for Allen or Kampman and he certainly couldn't play inside. Maybe Kampman goes down to a 3 technique tackle on passing downs with KGB coming off the left side, but I doubt it.

I don't think they'll sign him because he is one substance abuse violation away from a year suspension. Remember how Travis Henry burned the Broncos this year? I'd love it if it happened, but I don't think it will.

[pbmax]

Its was a Lisfranc injury and last I heard he was weighing the option of surgery.

CBS Sportsline says, "Freeney is expected to make a full recovery for 2008."

However, other reports about the history of this injury in the league make it seem less than certain it will be a straight road to recovery. Some players have rehabbed, others needed surgery. Success rate for surgery has gotten better, but the fact that some need the surgery would suggest there is a question about his recovery timeline.



Freeney is four times the player KGB ever was. After this latest injury, Freeney may decline, but it has never been close.


How serious was his last injury?

I agree, no comparison between the two, when healthy. Freeney is heavier than KGB, and was more effective against the run. Also younger.

[Guiness]

Costs half as much as Dwight Freeney, and is every bit as effective for what we use him for. Maybe more so, now that Freeney is almost washed up.

Wow idle, where did that come from?

DF was just as effective as ever right up until his injury, IMO. Sure, you could argue that he'll slow down with the surgery, but that's a guess, not a certainty...

[b bulldog]

KGB I think had around one sack in the last 5 games. the thought that he is any way comparable to freeney is simply crazy. I think KGB still actually only has a speed rush, he has no moves and stinks in containment and against the run.

[HarveyWallbangers]

KGB I think had around one sack in the last 5 games. the thought that he is any way comparable to freeney is simply crazy. I think KGB still actually only has a speed rush, he has no moves and stinks in containment and against the run.

I won't compare KGB to Freeney, but you sure are a stats man when it benefits you. How many sacks has Freeney had the last 2 years (in 25 games)? Try 8 sacks total. In 2 years. Playing roughly the equivalent of 1 1/2 seasons.

[twoseven]

KGB may not be worth all the money he gets, but how worthwhile is it to get rid of him when there isn't a replacement that you can count on to provide the sacks that he does? Signing Allen or Hayensworth seems a pipe dream at this point as both look as locks for the franchise tag. Entertaining the signing of a franchised player seems foolish considering what it would cost us by way of picks and dollars.

Some think it might be better to trade KGB for whatever or release him and clear his cap dollars (?). But, how much more money under the cap do we want to be anyway, considering it's unlikely much of the $25 mil will be spent to begin with? We certainly won't get even close to fair value in a trade for him. KGB may not be Kampman in overall production, but who is a better replacement that we can get for less?

[Tony Oday]

My god we are almost a billion dollars under the cap! lol ok not that much but damn KGB is worth it for just the handful of times at the end of the game him and Kamp met at the QB and ended the game.

[LL2]

KGB may not be worth all the money he gets, but how worthwhile is it to get rid of him when there isn't a replacement that you can count on to provide the sacks that he does? Signing Allen or Hayensworth seems a pipe dream at this point as both look as locks for the franchise tag. Entertaining the signing of a franchised player seems foolish considering what it would cost us by way of picks and dollars.

Some think it might be better to trade KGB for whatever or release him and clear his cap dollars (?). But, how much more money under the cap do we want to be anyway, considering it's unlikely much of the $25 mil will be spent to begin with? We certainly won't get even close to fair value in a trade for him. KGB may not be Kampman in overall production, but who is a better replacement that we can get for less?

Good point. The Pack would not get much in return for KGB and they can't get rid of him until they find a better replacement. I thought Jenkins was going to come on strong and be that guy, and finish with 12-14 sacks. The Pack are not going to get a dominant DE in this years draft so they might as well keep KGB for another year.

[Deputy Nutz]

You don't cut a player unless you have a viable replacement, or your totally fucked with the cap. the Packers are/have neither.

No replacement for KGB and his 10 sacks, nor do they have a cap problem where the need to reduce or cut 7.7 million. If I was a player and a team came to me and asked me to take a pay cut when the franchise was 25 million under would piss me off.

[pbmax]

Wow, that was impressive, four posts in a row channeling Mike Sherman! And I thought public sentiment on the board had all gone over to T2.

KGB at his cap number is, I believe, ludicrous. The only reservation I have is that in a recent chat, McGinn claimed the four man pass rush suffered when KGB got injured. I barely remember him being injured and I don't recall it reducing his effectiveness as it was already close to nil. But I give McGinn credit, he re-watches all the games and I don't always see every play. I thought Kampman got progressively less effective, even one on one.

But T2 has shown that he won't mind discarding an expensive vet if he has anything behind him that he would rather get playing time. I doubt Montgomery is that player, maybe Hunter.

But if he lands a pass rusher in the draft that has a good camp, or finds a value DE in FA, then KGB could be gone at the end of camp.

What did Herm Edwards call it? His tolerance box? Not a good place to be, he said, because he will tolerate you only until he can replace you. And it T2's case, that might mean you get replaced by a committee of rookies.

[Patler]

KGB at his cap number is, I believe, ludicrous. The only reservation I have is that in a recent chat, McGinn claimed the four man pass rush suffered when KGB got injured. I barely remember him being injured and I don't recall it reducing his effectiveness as it was already close to nil. But I give McGinn credit, he re-watches all the games and I don't always see every play. I thought Kampman got progressively less effective, even one on one.



KGB, Cole and Jolly all got hurt about the same time. Jolly missed his first game against Detroit. Cole broke his arm in the Detroit game, and KGB also was injured against Detroit. The following week KGB did not play against Dallas. So in two weeks they lost Jolly and Cole for the season, and KGB for a week, and slowed thereafter. Three weeks later, Pickett was injured and missed the last two games. All of a sudden, everyone was playing more snaps, and some who had not been playing were forced to. With 3 guys getting hurt at the same time, and Pickett a few weeks after that, I think it is pretty hard to attribute the decline in play by the DL to the injury to just one of them.

[Patler]

I thought Kampman got progressively less effective, even one on one.


I thought he did, too, but some of it might have had to do with the decline by others, making Kampman easier to avoid.

Interesting stat - while Kampman's sack numbers were down, he broke Reggie White's record for QB knockdowns in a season with 31. The record was 29. KGB was second this season with 11 knockdowns.

Sacks:
Kampman - 12
KGB - 9.5
Jenkins - 1

Knockdowns:
Kampman - 31
KGB - 11
Jenkins - 9.5

Hurries:
Kampman - 15.5
KGB - 16
Jenkins - 18.5

Pressures (the above combined):
Kampman - 58.5
KGB - 36.5
Jenkins - 29

Kampman had three more "pressures" than he had last year.[/u]

[Deputy Nutz]

I just don't think knockdowns are a legit statistic. What do you do when you knock a QB down and get roughing the passer penalty?

[Patler]

I just don't think knockdowns are a legit statistic. What do you do when you knock a QB down and get roughing the passer penalty?

You don't get a knockdown when you get a roughing penalty.
It's an indication of pressure that hopefully forces mistakes. Knockdowns can "knock" a QB off his rhythm. It's a "hurry", but a little sooner still, or a sack just a fraction late.

[b bulldog]

Hurries are as important as sacks