HOW GOOD IS RYAN GRANT ?

[Bretsky]

LET'S GET TO SOME DEEP FOOTBALL TALK

He was wonderful for Green Bay last season once he was given his shot. Some compared him to Dorsey Levins right off the bat.

Some still feel that is valid, but Grant looks to be faster and better.

Some think he was a product of teams having to focus on an effective pass first offense led by a great season by Brett Favre

Some feel like he is on the verge of stardom.
Give your take.

I looked over each team and tried to look at comparable running backs to Ryan Grant and list them. RB's not listed I'd clearly rate Grant over right now. Here is what I came up with. Let me know if I clearly missed any

Addai, Jones Drew, Maroney, Lynch, L Johnson, Willie Parker, La Tomlinson
M Barber, A Peterson, B Jacobs, M Westbrook, F Gore, S Jackson, Portis


At this point I'd probably rate the following RB's to be better than Grant

L Tomlinson
A Peterson
J Addai
M Jones Drew
W Parker
M Barber
M Westbrook
F Gore
S Jackson
C Portis

That would put Ryan Grant in the 11-14 range (great for a 6th round pick)
along with Brandon Jacobs, Lawrence Maroney, Lynch, and Larry Johnson

To me Lynch is probably 14th and I'm not sure about the other three.

[TennesseePackerBacker]

No way Parker is top 10, Maroney, Jacobs, Grant, and L. Johnson are all better.

[Bretsky]

No way Parker is top 10, Maroney, Jacobs, Grant, and L. Johnson are all better.


Parker seems to be one of those often overlooked guys; he tore it up last year. So how high would you rate Grant ?

[MJZiggy]

I think Grant is an exceptional back--he has vision, speed and timing. He has a feel for where the hole is, beyond where it's supposed to be and some pretty sweet moves.

We did better with our 6th than NO did with their first.

[TennesseePackerBacker]

No way Parker is top 10, Maroney, Jacobs, Grant, and L. Johnson are all better.


Parker seems to be one of those often overlooked guys; he tore it up last year. So how high would you rate Grant ?

More needs to be seen obviously, but i think you hit it on the head with 11-14.

Give Grant last year's Pittsburgh line and I think he might've done better than Parker actually.

[DannoMac21]

LET'S GET TO SOME DEEP FOOTBALL TALK

He was wonderful for Green Bay last season once he was given his shot. Some compared him to Dorsey Levins right off the bat.

Some still feel that is valid, but Grant looks to be faster and better.

Some think he was a product of teams having to focus on an effective pass first offense led by a great season by Brett Favre

Some feel like he is on the verge of stardom.
Give your take.

I looked over each team and tried to look at comparable running backs to Ryan Grant and list them. RB's not listed I'd clearly rate Grant over right now. Here is what I came up with. Let me know if I clearly missed any

Addai, Jones Drew, Maroney, Lynch, L Johnson, Willie Parker, La Tomlinson
M Barber, A Peterson, B Jacobs, M Westbrook, F Gore, S Jackson, Portis


At this point I'd probably rate the following RB's to be better than Grant

L Tomlinson
A Peterson
J Addai
M Jones Drew
W Parker
M Barber
M Westbrook
F Gore
S Jackson
C Portis

That would put Ryan Grant in the 11-14 range (great for a 6th round pick)
along with Brandon Jacobs, Lawrence Maroney, Lynch, and Larry Johnson

To me Lynch is probably 14th and I'm not sure about the other three.

No way Clinton Portis or Maurice Jones-Drew are better than Grant, absolutely no way.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I'm still skeptical. I wonder if increased scouting will expose his limited running style.

At worst he will still be pretty good. Not sure if he will remain #1 back for several years.

[DonHutson]

I think he's a very good fit for the system. He hits the hole and finds the cutback lane. I think he benefitted from the OL playing much more consistently in the second half. Jackson looked much better in the last few games than he did at the start, largely due to better blocking.

I think he probably looks faster than he really is because the misdirection gives him a bit of a head start.

He seems durable so far, but that's through half a season. He hasn't offered much as a receiver. He puts the ball on the ground not quite to the extent that its a major problem, but he needs to watch that. He exhibited great mental toughness in the Seattle game, and he comes across as a good teammate. I don't recall him allowing Favre to get smacked around too often as a pass blocker.

All in all, he's very productive in the Green Bay offense. He's a great example of Ted investing wisely on a cheap player who fits the system. I don't know where to rank him in a general sense, but he's probably a better fit for us than some "better" backs would be.

Having said all that, I'd love to find a complimentary RB that can offer some of the skills that Grant lacks - mainly receiving and elite speed. If Felix Jones was sitting there and #30, he and Grant would be dynamic.

[Joemailman]

One thing that impressed me about him was that even on days where he wasn't finding much running room, he still managed to break off a long run (until the NFC Title Game when he didn't get the ball much).

The immediate improvement in the Packer running game when he was inserted in the starting lineup was so striking that he has to be considered pretty good. To be elite, he'll have to improve his pass-receiving skills.

[BallHawk]

Parker is a top 5 back, IMO. He doesn't get the press of other backs, but he racks up yards like the best of them.

[Scott Campbell]

L Tomlinson
A Peterson
J Addai
M Westbrook

After these 4 I think its too close to call, and Grant could fit into that bunch. Unless I was watching a mirage last season.

[ND72]

I would put Grant top 15, like #15, but not top 10. I saw someone put Grant ahead of Parker....no. Right now I would say we have the 2nd best RB in the North, and MAYBE the #7-9 RB in the NFC. I would put Portis, Westbrook, Barber, Peterson, Jackson, and Gore are all easily better than Grant in the NFC. After that, I'd say the Giants RB corps are better, and even potentially Edge is still better than Grant, but probably not.

In the AFC, Johnson, LT, Addai, Fred Taylor AND Jones Drew, Parker, McGahee, R. Johnson, & Lynch are all better than Grant.

So officially I would rank him, in my opinion, #17 in the NFL.

Personally, I still think he's only gonna be a 1-2 year guy. His running style will damage him. I hope he does well and lasts longer, but I'm still skeptical.

[3irty1]

The best backs in the league are versatile like Westbrook or Tomlinson. They can play much longer and be an entire offense on their own. This is what Bush is supposed to be and what McFadden will be.

Grant is not one of those guys you can line up anywhere and can run routes like a receiver, but he seems to be as effective a runner as anyone else in the league. He's fast, he's decisive and he's got good instincts.

[wist43]

I don't put him anywhere yet...

He only played in what??? 8/9 games???

To be ranked among the top 10/15 players at a given position I think you have to prove it over at least a couple of seasons... there are always guys that flash ability, but either can't take the pounding or don't have what it takes intestinally to succeed over the long haul.

Beyond that, Grant does have an upright running style that has exposed him to some pretty good shots in the limited amount of time that we've seen him - those kinds of hits add up and take a toll. His running style is a concern.

Haven't looked at his number of fumbles... the two in the Seattle game stand out, but since all ended happily there, they are all but forgotten. Still, I'm not to the point where I completely trust him.

He still needs a lot of work in the passing game and blitz pick-up; however, even with a lot of reps I doubt he'll ever be a natural in the passing game.

Those things said, he did show good vision, good burst, good instincts, and long speed. He also ran tough.

Bottom line: If he can effectively lower his pad level, show improvement in the passing game and blitz pick-up, prove it over the course of a full season, and stay healthy - then we can begin to talk about ranking him.

[Freak Out]

Grant has shown that he has potential in the type of offense M3 runs but 08/09 will give us a better picture of his long term role in GB. Is he that much better than the other RBs on the roster or are they they that bad? We saw that he can do it in the zone scheme when they give him the chance...but if Rogers stinks it up can Grant carry the load? Color me puce.

[Bretsky]

I don't put him anywhere yet...

He only played in what??? 8/9 games???




Exactly why this is fun to project; because we don't know yet. But I'd still like to get your list of which RB's you'd rather have starting for Green Bay next year :lol:

[Partial]

No way Clinton Portis or Maurice Jones-Drew are better than Grant, absolutely no way.

What players are you watching? Portis showed this year that he is really, really good when healthy. Jones Drew is the back-up and change of pace back who could start for more than half the teams in the NFL. The reason he isn't starting is because they have one of the best runner ever in front of him.

Both of those players are leaps and bounds ahead of Grant to this point. Maybe not when all is said and done, but they have shown they can produce on their own without great quarterbacks and they have done it over a longer period of time.

[Bretsky]

My presentation of this topic was poor; in reality I wanted to list the RB's I'd take over Grant next year. At this point he could be a one year wonder or the real deal.

[Partial]

The best backs in the league are versatile like Westbrook or Tomlinson. They can play much longer and be an entire offense on their own. This is what Bush is supposed to be and what McFadden will be.

Grant is not one of those guys you can line up anywhere and can run routes like a receiver, but he seems to be as effective a runner as anyone else in the league. He's fast, he's decisive and he's got good instincts.

Not to say I told you so, but I did tell all of you guys that Bush would be average at best and called it out even after the Fresno game that'd Lendale would be better. Gotta rub that one in every now and again :lol:

I don't think McFadden is a similar type of player. He isn't nearly as quick. McFadden is the best back in the draft, but I don't think he is anywhere near either of those guys listed above in versatility, and not close to Tomlinson at being a singleback.

As for my thoughts on Grant to address Bretsky's post, I am in the undecided camp in that it is far too soon to tell. He hasn't shown that he can produce without a stud quarterback yet, nor has he shown he can hold up to the pounding. I think he'll be a very good player for us if A-Rod turns into Tony Romo.

I don't think he'll be half as effective as he could be if Rodgers is a dud.

I don't think he has the skill set to be a 1500+ rusher and tote the rock 275 times or so.

If I'm Coach MM, these are the guys I want ahead of Grant if the scope is one year. Over the long term, it'd be very different of course.
Peterson
Bush
McCalister
Barber
Bradshaw
Ward
Jacobs
Westbrook
Portis
James
Gore
Jackson
Tomlinson
Johnson
Maroney
Brown
Lynch
Taylor
Jones Drew
Addai
Parker
McGahee
Mendenhall
Stewart
McFadden

[b bulldog]

I'd take Grant over the most overrated player in the NFL, Reggie Bush!

[Lurker64]

I'd take Grant over the most overrated player in the NFL, Reggie Bush!

You got it wrong. Bush is the most overrated player in NFL History, not just the most overrated player in the NFL.

[Partial]

I'd take Grant over the most overrated player in the NFL, Reggie Bush!

I maintain they don't use him right. He has a lot of untapped potential still.

[The Leaper]

If you view his running skills alone, Grant is easily one of top ten RBs in the league IMO. He has incredible vision and shows the patience and knowledge critical to setting up and utilizing his blockers and has enough speed to make big plays happen. This is important, because these aspects of being a RB really can't be taught or improved on very much.

However, he is below average in terms of pass blocking and as a receiver out of the backfield. That is where I feel that guys like Parker and Portis are more of a complete package than Grant at this point. The good news is that these areas are ones where Grant can improve if he works at it.

If I had to rank him overall right now...he'd be in the 15-20 range, but with potential to be a top 8 back if he becomes solid in the areas he currently is subpar.

[GBRulz]

I'd take Grant over the most overrated player in the NFL, Reggie Bush!

You got it wrong. Bush is the most overrated player in NFL History, not just the most overrated player in the NFL.

I disagree, that title should not be taken away from Michael Vick.

[ND72]

If you view his running skills alone, Grant is easily one of top ten RBs in the league IMO. He has incredible vision and shows the patience and knowledge critical to setting up and utilizing his blockers and has enough speed to make big plays happen. This is important, because these aspects of being a RB really can't be taught or improved on very much.



I read the rest of what was said here, and I agree with that, but I totally disagree with this part. I love Ryan Grant. I liked him a lot when he was in college, but he is NOT a top 10 RB in any conversation. Let me state again that a LOT of the improvement in the runnign game came from the OL getting downfield better through the year. I buddy of mine who HATES Brandon Jackson even said that in the Detroit finale game, Brandon Jackson was even making the same reads and cuts as Grant, the biggest difference being that Grant just runs a lot more down hill and with more power.

I honestly struggle ranking him in the top 10 in the NFC, putting him around #8 or 9 to be kind.

[Scott Campbell]

I'd take Grant over the most overrated player in the NFL, Reggie Bush!

You got it wrong. Bush is the most overrated player in NFL History, not just the most overrated player in the NFL.


Brian Bosworth.
KiJana Carter.
Tony Mandrich.

[The Leaper]

I read the rest of what was said here, and I agree with that, but I totally disagree with this part. I love Ryan Grant. I liked him a lot when he was in college, but he is NOT a top 10 RB in any conversation.

I'm saying he is a top 10 runner...not RB. In terms of his vision, power and speed, I think he is a top 10 runner. However, he is average at best in other areas that are crucial for a RB, such as blocking and receiving.


I buddy of mine who HATES Brandon Jackson even said that in the Detroit finale game, Brandon Jackson was even making the same reads and cuts as Grant, the biggest difference being that Grant just runs a lot more down hill and with more power.

I don't think it can be attributed entirely to blocking ND. To some extent, I agree...the coaches had to pound heavily on the OL last year due to their mediocre play.

However, the reason things opened up more in the 2nd half of the year IMO was because Favre had so much success passing during the first half of the year that defenses were forced to pull back and defend the pass...especially as McCarthy moved toward more multiple WR sets as the year wore on. It reduced the number of defensive players in the box, and left more openings on the backside of the play when we did run the ball.

That is why I think we will struggle in 2008. Rodgers is not Favre, and teams will stuff the run until he proves he can torch them with the pass. I'm not holding my breath.

The difference between Grant and Jackson all comes down to vision...and I think Jackson's improvement toward the end of the year has to do with the amount of experience he gained sitting on the sidelines and watching tape of Grant's decision-making in action. The guy was a rookie...he SHOULD improve a lot during his first couple years as his experience increases. However, saying Jackson did well against DETROIT is hardly a sign that the guy has really turned the corner.

[StPaulPackFan]

The difference between Grant and Jackson all comes down to vision...and I think Jackson's improvement toward the end of the year has to do with the amount of experience he gained sitting on the sidelines and watching tape of Grant's decision-making in action. The guy was a rookie...he SHOULD improve a lot during his first couple years as his experience increases. However, saying Jackson did well against DETROIT is hardly a sign that the guy has really turned the corner.

I agree 100%. No doubt, Jackson had a great day against Detroit. But Grant was posting career numbers before he got pulled. We all knew he wouldn't play the whole game because our playoff seed was already locked in, but he had 57 yard on just 6 carries.

IMO, the major difference between Grant and Jackson is decisiveness. Grant surveys the play, decides on his running path and then explodes into it. At the beginning of the year Jackson seemed to always be hopping around in the backfield and this resulted in many negative runs. In the Detroit game his best runs were when he hit the hole hard. At the end of the year he still hopped around at times but not as much as he did earlier in the year. Hopefully he continues to progress during the offseason.