Watch Frontline this week

[Freak Out]

Of course it is a lefty show so you know it will be all lies.

Healthcare around the world.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/sickaroundtheworld/

[falco]

sorry, i only watch shows that tell me how bad muslims are

[Freak Out]

I apologize....there really was no need for me to make the comment political. I am interested in what the reporter has to show/say for his research in the countries studied and am interested what you all have to say about what is revealed. This is one of the issues we all face as Americans.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

sorry, i only watch shows that tell me how bad muslims are

Classic! :lol:

[Harlan Huckleby]

sorry, i only watch shows that tell me how bad muslims are

:lol:

I think this world healthcare doc will be fantastic. Of course we can expect it to be biased in favor of public healthcare. But no matter, it will open people's eyes to possibilities, even if you don't accept this doc as the final word.

[SkinBasket]

even if you don't accept this doc as the final word.

Which of course we should. It's on TV after all.

[Freak Out]

even if you don't accept this doc as the final word.

Which of course we should. It's on TV after all.

...and the internet.

[texaspackerbacker]

I'll withhold judgment until I watch it--just to be fair and balanced. That will be after New Amsterdam and Medium. First things first.

[Deputy Nutz]

I am on the fence about our health care, on one hand I don't think doctors need to be penalized by national health care system. They are up to their asses in debt coming out of Medical school and if a national health care system is put in place that will have a negotiated price upfront the doctors are going to be screwed. Sure maybe med school will be cheaper, or debt will be forgiven, but why punish the doctors?

Insurance companies need to be put in check. National Health Care could do that if they lean towards the Swiss method. Basic health care needs should not lead to Insurance companies to profit.

Malpractice is out of control. Doctors have to protect themselves with malpractice insurance and it costs a bundle. Malpractice claims have gone through the roof and people are trying to cheat us all by submitting false claims. This some how needs to be checked as well.

[MJZiggy]

Nutz, the doctors have negotiated rates now, they're just negotiating with the insurance companies.

The rest I agree with.

[Deputy Nutz]

Nutz, the doctors have negotiated rates now, they're just negotiating with the insurance companies.

The rest I agree with.

they have, but don't expect that they will make the same when they are paid by Uncle Sam.

[MJZiggy]

I'm curious as to why you say that. The government pays its higher end professionals quite well. It's the lackeys that suffer for pay, though the bennies are great.

[Harlan Huckleby]

My first reaction to the doc is that every system has problems.

The argument that we can't make fundamental changes because the new system will have problems is just fear mongering by people happy with the status quo.

[Deputy Nutz]

I'm curious as to why you say that. The government pays its higher end professionals quite well. It's the lackeys that suffer for pay, though the bennies are great.

For instance under medacare a Radiologist can only charge 13.00 bucks for an x-ray, an HMO pays 57.00 dollars. You do the math.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

I'm curious as to why you say that. The government pays its higher end professionals quite well. It's the lackeys that suffer for pay, though the bennies are great.

For instance under medacare a Radiologist can only charge 13.00 bucks for an x-ray, an HMO pays 57.00 dollars. You do the math.

Are you sure about that?

I can verify the amount in a about 2 minutes with one call.

[the_idle_threat]

I'm curious as to why you say that. The government pays its higher end professionals quite well. It's the lackeys that suffer for pay, though the bennies are great.

For instance under medacare a Radiologist can only charge 13.00 bucks for an x-ray, an HMO pays 57.00 dollars. You do the math.

Are you sure about that?

I can verify the amount in a about 2 minutes with one call.

Well then do it.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

I'm curious as to why you say that. The government pays its higher end professionals quite well. It's the lackeys that suffer for pay, though the bennies are great.

For instance under medacare a Radiologist can only charge 13.00 bucks for an x-ray, an HMO pays 57.00 dollars. You do the math.

Are you sure about that?

I can verify the amount in a about 2 minutes with one call.

Well then do it.


The rate for medicare for an x-ray is low. Not sure the exact amount, nor do most radiologist know the amount...the guess was anywhere from 13-25. What they do know is that it is a loss leader. In the sourced referenced, the firm loses 3 mill a year on x-ray, but actually will recoup that as they are moving to digital.

I can tell you this right off the top of my head from many conversations.

First, medicare doesn't set any sort of national reimbursement..it is done regionally. Different zones get different fees. It basically comes down that the gov't pays X amount of dollars per region. If the region is high pop then you get a lower per person reinbursement. If the region is sparsely populated, you get more person. Basic biz...the doc gets the "same" amount of money..high volume at lower rates or low volume at higher rate.

Second, the HMO amount..disparity between medicare and HMO isn't correct. Generally, HMO's pay 5% less then medicare to 10-15% above. Radiologists would orgasm over the disparity suggested by Nutz. Now, i'm not going to say that his figure is 100% incorrect as their may be some wacko situation out there, but it isn't close to the norm.

And, it only makes sense. Why would an HMO pay that much more. Bad biz decision. They would if they had to, but since doctors can't refuse medicare patients...no need for HMO's to pay this high.

To look at an x-ray and view it by dollars only is foolish. For example in any given day 50% of patients will be plainfilm. The rest are petscan, catscan, mri, ultrasound, etc. Those make dollars for the company.

Now, outta of those x-ray patients, most will not just get an x-ray. A low percentage of doctors refer a patient to a radiologist and just ask for an x-ray. Conversely, doctors won't send patients to imaging centers that only do the profitable procedures.

I'm not saying that every person sent has multiple procedures, but after the x-ray, a great percentage come back for follow up tests. For example, you get a spinal plainfilm. It shows abnormalities..boom, you got more tests coming.

In Nutz's example, the radiologist charges X amount of dollars. But, that kinda makes it out like the radiologist makes a determination of which customer to see. Wrong. They get no choice as they are referred patients.

Radiologists are, to make an example, like car techs. If you bring in your car and the service manager/lead mech determines the work..it goes to the tech to work on it. The tech doesn't determine what work is to be done. Now, the tech certainly can relate information back..your hoses are going. But, the tech can't just say...i'm going to fix these and charge you for them..well, they can, but then you scream at them for unauthorized work. this may not be a perfect analogy, but i think you see where i'm going.

Now, the dealership may charge X amount for work done for guys like you and me, but another X amount with the local taxi company. But, the tech isn't involved in charging.

Essentially an x-ray is like the 19 oil change. Somehow we always seem to pay more for it..coolant, etc.

Hope this helps.

[the_idle_threat]

You see ... now we learned something. Didn't know a guy who lives in the alley in a box would know so much about HC. 8-)

[Tyrone Bigguns]

You see ... now we learned something. Didn't know a guy who lives in the alley in a box would know so much about HC. 8-)

Just becauase Tyrone lives in a box and has no insurance doesn't mean he isn't down with the issues.

Tyrone wasn't always homeless. Tyrone did had a mother and father and siblings.