Who was the best mediocre GB coach?

[motife]

hard to decide, I know.

as for the most entertaining teams :

Bart Starr with Lynn Dickey, Lofton, Coffman, Ivery, Ellis, Jefferson
Dan Devine with John Brockington, McArthur Lane, Ted Hendricks, Fred Carr, Willie Buchananon, Chester Marcol, Gale Gillingham, DT Bob Brown
Lindy Infante with Majik and Sterling Sharpe
Phil Bengston with the remnants of the Super Bowl teams
Forrest Gregg with Ken Stills, Charles Martin
Ray Rhodes team was just boring, even with Favre

[BallHawk]

Ray Rhodes on benefit of the doubt?

[Lurker64]

Am I voting for the coach who I thought was the most mediocre? Or am I voting for the mediocre coach I liked the best?

[red]

Ray Rhodes on benefit of the doubt?

maybe, one year is hard to base anything on

that list is very sucktacular

[hoosier]

Great poll. :lol: Voted for Devine because I think his dog deserves a second chance. My only quibble is with the classification of Forrest Gregg as "mediocre." What would he have to do to qualify as "putrid"?

[gbgary]

i voted Bart. just when he was becoming a good coach they let him go.

[motife]

Am I voting for the coach who I thought was the most mediocre? Or am I voting for the mediocre coach I liked the best?

I think you'd probably get the same result record wise either way. Who was your favorite?

[motife]

My only quibble is with the classification of Forrest Gregg as "mediocre." What would he have to do to qualify as "putrid"?

Remember Gregg took the Bengals to the Super Bowl. He had a TERRIBLE personality and communication style though. His DL coach Dick Modzolewski said when he quit, he just left town. He didn't tell any of the assistants, who he left high and dry, or attempt to soften the blow later.

I do think Devine was the best coach. Had a 10-4 season with the worst passing game in the history of the NFL and went to the playoffs. I still think the 72 season was one of my favorites. The GB defense that year was just dominant. It shut down teams, especially in the 2nd half of the season. They lost to the Redskins 16-3 when George Allen played a 5 man DL to stop the run and DARED GB to pass. Brockington had a horrible day. Of what little offense they had, I don't think it was 100 yards, most of it came from McArthur Lane.

[Joemailman]

Starr took over a bad team, and an organization that was hamstrung by the John Hadl trade. Put together a first-rate offense, and gave Dallas a run for their money in a playoff game in Dallas.

[motife]

Starr took over a bad team, and an organization that was hamstrung by the John Hadl trade. Put together a first-rate offense, and gave Dallas a run for their money in a playoff game in Dallas.

how 'bout that Bob Schnelker?

http://66.132.211.220/images/1818.jpg

[texaspackerbacker]

Right, Bart Starr, inexperienced as he was, was establishing a solid foundation, and would have done even better if not for a bad run of luck and an unfortunate lack of patience with him.

[motife]

Right, Bart Starr, inexperienced as he was, was establishing a solid foundation, and would have done even better if not for a bad run of luck and an unfortunate lack of patience with him.

I think what sunk Starr in '83, his last season, were the losses to the Falcons (41-47) which was a horrible boneheaded game by GB, and the final loss to the Bears, which would have either won the division outright or got them in as a wild card. I forget which. I think Detroit won the division.

I know it was a HORRIBLE feeling. The Pack missed such a great opporunity after many good wins that season and a tremendous offense. The disappointment was CRUSHING, almost unbearable. Then almost immediately, I think the next day the great Bart Start, our beloved Bart, was fired. It was really a low point as a Packer fan for me. I could taste ashes in my mouth. Wasn't it Bob Parins that fired him?

[LL2]

I voted Infante. I was too young in the 70's to remember the Devine years, but I do remember how my dad could not stand the guy. He would say that Devine wasn't mediocre, but that he was horrible.

[oregonpackfan]

I voted for Starr primarily for the same reasons that Joe and Texas cited.

Starr's character as a player and coach was impeccable. What really impressed me about Starr was an interview with him about 15 years after he was let go. Rather than blame circumstances like previous trades, injuries, etc., he came right out and said that his inexperience as an NFL coach led to his downfall. He came right out and said he simply was unqualified and overwhelmed.

It takes quite a man to admit that.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

The choice is easy....bullet to my head.

I can't go back to that kind of living.

[jmbarnes101]

I voted for Lindy based almost exclusively on that's when I really started watching the Packers play. I was in 6th grade and I loved Majik. I was extremely sad when I found out he was hurt. I still remember that Bears game with the over-the-line non-call for the TD.

[MJZiggy]

The choice is easy....bullet to my head.

I can't go back to that kind of living.

You don't have to go back to that kind of living. We have M3 now.

By the way, I voted for Bart. I think he'd have gotten a grip on it with just a little more time.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

The choice is easy....bullet to my head.

I can't go back to that kind of living.

You don't have to go back to that kind of living. We have M3 now.

By the way, I voted for Bart. I think he'd have gotten a grip on it with just a little more time.

I know, but if we had to..i'd kill myself. Life is tough enough when you live in a cardboard box, anyone one of those would push me over the edge.

Bart: Can't agree. Bart, like a lot of women...was a tease. Seemed like you were getting somewhere...but, it always ended in frustration.

[BF4MVP]

Isn't being the best mediocre coach like being the tallest person at a midget conference?

[LL2]

Isn't being the best mediocre coach like being the tallest person at a midget conference?

:lol: :lol: :lol:

[Patler]

By the way, I voted for Bart. I think he'd have gotten a grip on it with just a little more time.

A little MORE time? You ARE kidding I hope, aren't you?

[motife]

By the way, I voted for Bart. I think he'd have gotten a grip on it with just a little more time.

A little MORE time? You ARE kidding I hope, aren't you?

Vince Lombardi 1959-1967 : 9 years, 89-29-4, .754, 6 NFL championship games, 5 wins, playoffs 9-1, 6 division crowns, 2-2nd place, 1-3rd place finish, NFL Hall of Fame, Super Bowl trophy named after him.

Phil Bengston : 1968-1970 : 3 years, 20-21-1,.488. no playoffs, 3 straight 3rds place finishes in NFC Central (it was REALLY the black & blue division those 3 years though. Green Bay, Detroit, Chicago and Minnesota all had championship defenses.)

Dan Devine : 1971-1974 : 4 years, 25-27-4, .481, 0-1 in playoffs with one division crown, 2-3rd. 1-4th place finish.

Bart Starr : 1975-1983 : 9 years (tied with Lombardi), 52-76-3, .406, 1-1 in playoffs, one division crown (strike year), one tie for division crown, 4 times last place, 1- 3rd, 2-2nd place.

Forrest Gregg : 1984-1987 : 4 years, 25-37-1, .403, no playoffs, 2-2nds, 1-3rd, and a 4th place finish.

Lindy Infante : 1988-1991 : 4 years, 24-40-0, .375, no playoffs, 1 tie for first, 1-2nd, 2-4th place finishes.

Mike Holmgren : 1992-1998 : 7 years, 75-37-0, .670, 9-5 in playoffs, 2 Super Bowl appearances, 1 win, 3 division crowns, 4-2nd place finishes.

Ray Rhodes, 1999, 1 year, 8-8-0, .500, no playoffs, 3rd place.

Mike Sherman : 2000-2005 : 6 years : 57-39-0, .594, 2-4-0 in playoffs, 3 division crowns, 1-2nd, 1-3rd, 1-last place finish.

Mike McCarthy : 2006-2007 : 2 years*, 21-11-0, .656, 1-1 in playoffs, 1 NFC Charmpionship appearance (loss), 1 divsion crown, 1 -2nd place finish.

[motife]

btw, Mike McCarthy's 2007 team for the only time in all these years 1959-2007, finished as high as 2nd in offensive yards gained, (with the exception of Bart Starr's 1983 team).

Here's one interesting stat, the years GB ranked in the top 5 in opponent points allowed. The 2007 defense ranked 6th in the NFL in points allowed. :

........ Pts allwd
1962 ………… 1
1965 ………… 1
1966 ………… 1
1996 ………… 1
1960 ………… 2
1961 ………… 2
1963 ………… 2
1964 ………… 2
1967 ………… 3
1969 ………… 3
1968 ………… 4
1972 ………… 4
1995 ………… 4
1974 ………… 5
1994 ………… 5
1997 ………… 5
2001 ………… 5

[Carolina_Packer]

Unfortunately, the 1983 team's other side of the ball should have been called the efense, because there was no D.

[Fritz]

That '72 team with Brockington and Lane was one of my favorites - it was when I was becoming old enough to understand more about the game. I thought that defense might carry the team to the Super Bowl. But they had an awful passing game.

Starr's Lynn Dicky team toward the end was fun on offense, but as noted, the defense was non-existent. In the Dallas playoff game, every time the Pack scored, the defense seemed to lay limp and let Dallas go right back down the field. It was deflating.

And though sometimes I fantasize that Starr almost had them there, and only needed a bit more time, I remember how long he was the coach and how terribly mediocre the teams were.

Starr gets my vote, then. He was the most mediocre of them all.

[Patler]

I do think that Starr was a much better coach at the end of his time in GB than at the start, but he had a longer opportunity than anyone could ever hope for. Yes he had to deal with the repercussions of mistakes that were made before him, but he was there for nine seasons, more than enough to get beyond those difficulties. He coached as many years as Lombardi, and more than any other GB HC except Lambeau. Even if you give him 3 or 4 years to learn his craft, he had 5 or 6 years to make something happen. Today, coaches get about 3 years.

[MJZiggy]

Today they might not have hired someone with Starr's resume.

[motife]

Today they might not have hired someone with Starr's resume.

You mean like hiring Favre as Head Coach?? ;)

The really, really special thing about Bart Starr is he is simply a ONE of a kind Southern gentleman. I have never met anyone as gracious, kind and honorable throughout his whole life as Bart Starr. (That may have been to his detriment actually, as coach anyway.)

At one point, Starr was writing Brett weekly during the season and calling him. I don't know how long that kept up, but I know Brett appreciated it. Who would not appreciate taking a call with Bart Starr on the other end of the phone for any reason?

Max McGee when doing the radio on WTMJ would call Brett : "Bart Favre". I find myself doing that. They share a legacy, that's for sure.

[Fritz]

And Forrest Gregg was the worst. Hands down. I cringed when I saw they'd hired another Glory-days Packer. One was enough. That sh_t don't work, in my opinion. Not often, anyway.

He was mean and surly and just a lousy coach. Don't know how he got the Bengals to the SB.

[KYPack]

And Forrest Gregg was the worst. Hands down. I cringed when I saw they'd hired another Glory-days Packer. One was enough. That sh_t don't work, in my opinion. Not often, anyway.

He was mean and surly and just a lousy coach. Don't know how he got the Bengals to the SB.

The Bengals had a very talented team and needed the stern hand on the tiller to pilot 'em.

Forrest was a lousy judge of talent and not much of a teacher. He was basically just an autocrat. He was the perfect guy to take over the Bengals and the worst guy to take over the pack. He was the same guy in both places.

One place it clicked, in the other it was a disaster.

[woodbuck27]

I believe it's Lindy Infante. He was disappointing but studying the list of candidates sure makes me ill again. Tough to be a Packer fan with pride for about 25 years.

Some of us survived it all. :D Not a lot happening with any consistency between Vince Lombardi and Mike Holmgren.

fr. this LINK:

http://www.packers.com/history/birth_of_a_team_and_a_legend/

Nineteen days later (Feb. 3), Cleveland Browns offensive coordinator Lindy Infante, recognized throughout the NFL as a brilliant innovator, signed a five-year contract. Plagued by turnovers and kicking problems, Infante's first team, in 1988, was 4-12, but left fans with hopes for the future by winning its last two games.

Building on that positive note, Infante in 1989 led the Packers to a 10-6 record -- their best in 17 years -- and within one game of the playoffs, spicing that turnabout with a league-record four one-point victories.

In 1990, subsequent high hopes for the team's first postseason berth in a non-strike year since 1972, evaporated when the Packers -- with a contending, 6-5 record after 11 games -- ended the year with five straight losses.

The Packers' continued to decline in 1991 (4-12). New executive vice president/general manager Ron Wolf dismissed Infante Dec. 22. Green Bay had hired Wolf, Nov. 27, with full football operations authority.

Packers Forever!

[Badgerinmaine]

The question wasn't whether the Packers gave Starr enough years, but who you'd take now. He was hired too early, had to deal with the plundered cupboard Dan Devine left him, and was improving at the end. His teams also lacked the thugs of the Gregg era. I don't think Rhodes had a chance to prove much and would pick him second.