"Idiot Kicker" returns to pro football

[oregonpackfan]

Vanderjagt returns to Canada following nine-year NFL career
19 hours ago

MISSISSAUGA, Ontario (AP) — Mike Vanderjagt's kicking career has come full circle.

The former Indianapolis Colts and Dallas Cowboys player who was the most accurate in NFL history and was once called an ``idiot kicker'' by Peyton Manning for comments he made on Canadian TV took part in the first Toronto Argonauts practice of the season Sunday.

The day before, he signed with the team that helped propel him to stardom in 1996. More than a decade after leaving the Argos for the fame and fortune of the NFL, Vanderjagt was thrilled to be back.

``Toronto was the front-runner, regardless of what NFL team called,'' said Vanderjagt, who won back-to-back Grey Cup championships in his only two full CFL seasons. ``I really wanted to come to Toronto, more than anything else.''

Vanderjagt wasn't ready to leave the sport despite an ignominious departure from the NFL in November 2006. He was cut from the Dallas Cowboys after missing a pair of field goals against the Colts.

``When you fish and golf enough and you're only 38 years old and you feel you can still do it,'' Vanderjagt said. ``I miss the area and I miss my family and friends. It became a good opportunity, assuming Toronto wanted me, to be able to kick for a few more years.''

Vanderjagt led the NFL in scoring in 1999 and kicked 42 consecutive field goals in 2003-04, the longest streak in league history. Vanderjagt made 86.5 per cent of his field goals - tops in the NFL among kickers with at least 100 attempts - and made the Pro Bowl in 2004.

Vanderjagt also lashed out at head coach Tony Dungy and quarterback Peyton Manning following a 41-0 playoff loss to the New York Jets in 2002.

Manning fired back at Vanderjagt, calling him ``our idiot kicker who got liquored up and ran his mouth off a lot.''

After spending the 2007 season on the sidelines, Vanderjagt recently worked out with the Denver Broncos and the Kansas City Chiefs.

``Years ago if you were to say `you had nine great years in the NFL and you're the most accurate kicker,' I would take that in a heartbeat,'' said Vanderjagt. ``Certainly I feel like I can kick in the NFL, but I am in no means using Toronto as a stepping stone there.

``From an NFL standpoint, sure, I wish I was there. But from a life standpoint, I feel this is the place I should be.''

The Associated Press

[Guiness]

Is he really all washed up? I figured he'd land somewhere this year...

[packers11]

Is he really all washed up? I figured he'd land somewhere this year...

He is just a cocky SOB that has choked latley...

If he had a better attitude, I think a lot more teams would have looked at him ...

[woodbuck27]

Michael John "Mike" Vanderjagt (born March 24, 1970 in Oakville, Ontario), played in both the Canadian and National Football Leagues.

** He was once the most accurate field goal kicker in NFL history (229 of 265, 86.4% as of November 20, 2006).

On May 31, 2008, Vanderjagt went back to the CFL and signed on with the Toronto Argonauts as their kicker.

woodbuck27: ** mmmmm. :)

[neil38133]

Anybody would rather play for the CFL and make a third or less of the money they would make in the NFL.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Michael John "Mike" Vanderjagt (born March 24, 1970 in Oakville, Ontario), played in both the Canadian and National Football Leagues.

** He was once the most accurate field goal kicker in NFL history (229 of 265, 86.4% as of November 20, 2006).

On May 31, 2008, Vanderjagt went back to the CFL and signed on with the Toronto Argonauts as their kicker.

woodbuck27: ** mmmmm. :)

Like most canucks, doesn't know when to shut his mouth. Heard he also was badmouthing TT.

[Guiness]

Michael John "Mike" Vanderjagt (born March 24, 1970 in Oakville, Ontario), played in both the Canadian and National Football Leagues.

** He was once the most accurate field goal kicker in NFL history (229 of 265, 86.4% as of November 20, 2006).

On May 31, 2008, Vanderjagt went back to the CFL and signed on with the Toronto Argonauts as their kicker.

woodbuck27: ** mmmmm. :)

Like most canucks, doesn't know when to shut his mouth. Heard he also was badmouthing TT.

Nothing like that reverse racism.

Canadian are violent (cut to scene of hockey fight) /Canadian Bacon

I assume you're being facetious, or have you actually seen something saying he was dissing the turtle?

[Zool]

Michael John "Mike" Vanderjagt (born March 24, 1970 in Oakville, Ontario), played in both the Canadian and National Football Leagues.

** He was once the most accurate field goal kicker in NFL history (229 of 265, 86.4% as of November 20, 2006).

On May 31, 2008, Vanderjagt went back to the CFL and signed on with the Toronto Argonauts as their kicker.

woodbuck27: ** mmmmm. :)

Like most canucks, doesn't know when to shut his mouth. Heard he also was badmouthing TT.

Nothing like that reverse racism.

Canadian are violent (cut to scene of hockey fight) /Canadian Bacon

I assume you're being facetious, or have you actually seen something saying he was dissing the turtle?

Again WTF is reverse racism?

[hoosier]

Michael John "Mike" Vanderjagt (born March 24, 1970 in Oakville, Ontario), played in both the Canadian and National Football Leagues.

** He was once the most accurate field goal kicker in NFL history (229 of 265, 86.4% as of November 20, 2006).

On May 31, 2008, Vanderjagt went back to the CFL and signed on with the Toronto Argonauts as their kicker.

woodbuck27: ** mmmmm. :)

Like most canucks, doesn't know when to shut his mouth. Heard he also was badmouthing TT.

Nothing like that reverse racism.

Canadian are violent (cut to scene of hockey fight) /Canadian Bacon

I assume you're being facetious, or have you actually seen something saying he was dissing the turtle?

I think Ty was alluding to another Canuck's history of TT bashing.

[Guiness]

Again WTF is reverse racism?

I've always defined RR as the practice of discriminating against the majority. Generally seen when companies/organizations have 'quota' systems wrt hiring,

[Zool]

Racism is a person or group of people discriminating against another person or group of people based on race. There is no reverse unless you assume racism is white to black specifically.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Racism is a person or group of people discriminating against another person or group of people based on race. There is no reverse unless you assume racism is white to black specifically.

Zool,

I'm afraid your wrong here. Have you seen canadians? They are definitely a different race. They are geometrically-figured with small beady eyes and Pac Man-like heads which flap up and down whenever they speak.

Certainly not black or white.

It seems that everything's gone wrong
Since Canada came along

[MJZiggy]

Racism is a person or group of people discriminating against another person or group of people based on race. There is no reverse unless you assume racism is white to black specifically.

Reverse racism is racism against the race that holds the most power. Doesn't matter what race holds that power and it varies in different parts of the world.

[Guiness]

Racism is a person or group of people discriminating against another person or group of people based on race. There is no reverse unless you assume racism is white to black specifically.

Reverse racism is racism against the race that holds the most power. Doesn't matter what race holds that power and it varies in different parts of the world.

Exactly. And RR is usually hidden behind the guise of 'affirmative action'.

When I was living in Nepean, a primarily white commuter suburb of Ottawa, they looking for police officers. They got a lot of applicants, pretty much all white males - no surprise, there was a bit of an asian population there, but that was about it.

They had to re-advertise outside of the area, and essentially accept any minority who applied because of the size of the city, the law dictated they had to have so many visible minorities on the force. The paper printed a huge headline titled 'White Males Need Not Apply'.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Racism is a person or group of people discriminating against another person or group of people based on race. There is no reverse unless you assume racism is white to black specifically.

Reverse racism is racism against the race that holds the most power. Doesn't matter what race holds that power and it varies in different parts of the world.

Exactly. And RR is usually hidden behind the guise of 'affirmative action'.

When I was living in Nepean, a primarily white commuter suburb of Ottawa, they looking for police officers. They got a lot of applicants, pretty much all white males - no surprise, there was a bit of an asian population there, but that was about it.

They had to re-advertise outside of the area, and essentially accept any minority who applied because of the size of the city, the law dictated they had to have so many visible minorities on the force. The paper printed a huge headline titled 'White Males Need Not Apply'.

Sorry, but that ain't reverse..and the word is discrimination..not racism.

In order to prove your point you would have to show that they deliberately hired less qualified minorities than white applicants...to the exclusion of any white candidates, even if the latter had seniority or were better qualified by reason of education, expertise, or temperament.

Not hiring white males because you want a diversified staff isn't reverse discrimination.

[Zool]

Racism is a person or group of people discriminating against another person or group of people based on race. There is no reverse unless you assume racism is white to black specifically.

Reverse racism is racism against the race that holds the most power. Doesn't matter what race holds that power and it varies in different parts of the world.

Exactly. And RR is usually hidden behind the guise of 'affirmative action'.

When I was living in Nepean, a primarily white commuter suburb of Ottawa, they looking for police officers. They got a lot of applicants, pretty much all white males - no surprise, there was a bit of an asian population there, but that was about it.

They had to re-advertise outside of the area, and essentially accept any minority who applied because of the size of the city, the law dictated they had to have so many visible minorities on the force. The paper printed a huge headline titled 'White Males Need Not Apply'.

Sorry, but that ain't reverse..and the word is discrimination..not racism.

In order to prove your point you would have to show that they deliberately hired less qualified minorities than white applicants...to the exclusion of any white candidates, even if the latter had seniority or were better qualified by reason of education, expertise, or temperament.

Not hiring white males because you want a diversified staff isn't reverse discrimination.

Exactly. Its either racism or it isnt. Its either discrimination or it isnt. Its doesnt matter who's on which side. If a black guy says something derrogatory about a white guy based on the amount of pigmentation of the skin, thats racism. Referring to reverse racism means that the white people are the only ones who can be racist. Everyone else is a reverse racist.

Thats discriminating against whites. Fuck it, I'm starting a straight white male parade. We need a pride month. I'm going with September.

September is straight white male month. Spread the word.

[neil38133]

I can't believe we're arguing about what label to put on it when people treat each other badly or unfairly. How about just not doing it?

[the_idle_threat]

This Neil guy is onto something. Is he a pragmatist, or a reverse pragmatist?

[woodbuck27]

Michael John "Mike" Vanderjagt (born March 24, 1970 in Oakville, Ontario), played in both the Canadian and National Football Leagues.

** He was once the most accurate field goal kicker in NFL history (229 of 265, 86.4% as of November 20, 2006).

On May 31, 2008, Vanderjagt went back to the CFL and signed on with the Toronto Argonauts as their kicker.

woodbuck27: ** mmmmm. :)

Like most canucks, doesn't know when to shut his mouth. Heard he also was badmouthing TT.

Nothing like that reverse racism.

Canadian are violent (cut to scene of hockey fight) /Canadian Bacon

I assume you're being facetious, or have you actually seen something saying he was dissing the turtle?

I think Ty was alluding to another Canuck's history of TT bashing.

** ``Years ago if you were to say `you had nine great years in the NFL and you're the most accurate kicker,' I would take that in a heartbeat,'' said Vanderjagt. ``Certainly I feel like I can kick in the NFL, but I am in no means using Toronto as a stepping stone there.

``From an NFL standpoint, sure, I wish I was there. But from a life standpoint, I feel this is the place I should be.''

** read that ''just that'' please.

How could any fair and normally intelligent person leap fr. **, to anything to do with Ted Thompson? Then associate the opinion of P. Manning and Mike Vanderjagt ''as an idiot '' and further. Lump all Canucks in ''as loud mouthed idiots''.

Such a person may certainly be wide open, to being called out as prejudiced. Therefore, simply ignorant and excused or not. Just an opionion based in observation of this thread.

Criticism has little to do with anything of nationality, race,color or creed but more to do with observation and follow-up, for '' the better good ''.

When P. Manning deemed Mike Vanderjagt ''an idiot '', PM demonstrated immaturity in terms of being brash / harsh. Furthermore he used his position on ''the Colts'' to unjustly criticise or undermine '' just, the most accurate kicker '' in NFL history to that time.

It just happens that Mike Vanderjagt is Canadian and none of the above should be dragged in or associated with human rights issues or skills. :D

woodbuck27

[Patler]

Racism is discrimination based on race, just as sexism is discrimination based on sex.

Discrimination, generally, is simply distinguishing based on a given characteristic or quality. In selecting a starting QB, the head coach discriminates based on various QB qualities (leadership, knowledge, physical abilities, etc.). Sellers of high end goods advertise their products to be for "the discriminating buyer" It is an evaluation process. It is neither inherently bad, nor inherently good. It can be either, or neither.

Discrimination in the social/legal setting to which most of you are referring has come to mean the prejudicial treatment AGAINST a group based on the distinguishing characteristic, such as race, gender, religion, etc. which is irrelevant to the decision being made. For example, a person is not hired because of race or sex, even though qualified for the job.

Reverse discrimination has come to mean the prejudicial treatment FOR a group based on the distinguishing characteristic, such as race, sex, religion, etc. which is irrelevant to the decision being made. For example, a person is hired because of race, even though race is not a factor in the performance of the job.

Since discrimination in the social/legal setting has generally been against minorities, reverse discrimination has also come to mean the perceived prejudicial treatment against majority members as well as the prejudicial treatment in favor of minorities.

Since racism is simply a type of discrimination, in the social/legal setting it has come to mean the prejudicial treatment AGAINST individuals because of race. Reverse racism in the social/legal setting has come to mean the prejudicial treatment FOR individuals because of race. Since racism has generally been applied against minority races by majority races, reverse racism has also come to mean the perceived prejudicial treatment against individuals of the majority race.

And, yes, "reverse racism" is a term used in many articles about discrimination based on race, just as "reverse discrimination" is used for the broader discussions not limited to race.

[Zool]

I think I'll use White Power as my slogan.

[woodbuck27]

Racism is discrimination based on race, just as sexism is discrimination based on sex.

Discrimination, generally, is simply distinguishing based on a given characteristic or quality. In selecting a starting QB, the head coach discriminates based on various QB qualities (leadership, knowledge, physical abilities, etc.). Sellers of high end goods advertise their products to be for "the discriminating buyer" It is an evaluation process. It is neither inherently bad, nor inherently good. It can be either, or neither.

Discrimination in the social/legal setting to which most of you are referring has come to mean the prejudicial treatment AGAINST a group based on the distinguishing characteristic, such as race, gender, religion, etc. which is irrelevant to the decision being made. For example, a person is not hired because of race or sex, even though qualified for the job.

Reverse discrimination has come to mean the prejudicial treatment FOR a group based on the distinguishing characteristic, such as race, sex, religion, etc. which is irrelevant to the decision being made. For example, a person is hired because of race, even though race is not a factor in the performance of the job.

Since discrimination in the social/legal setting has generally been against minorities, reverse discrimination has also come to mean the perceived prejudicial treatment against majority members as well as the prejudicial treatment in favor of minorities.

Since racism is simply a type of discrimination, in the social/legal setting it has come to mean the prejudicial treatment AGAINST individuals because of race. Reverse racism in the social/legal setting has come to mean the prejudicial treatment FOR individuals because of race. Since racism has generally been applied against minority races by majority races, reverse racism has also come to mean the perceived prejudicial treatment against individuals of the majority race.

And, yes, "reverse racism" is a term used in many articles about discrimination based on race, just as "reverse discrimination" is used for the broader discussions not limited to race.

Educate them Patler. :)

[Patler]

Racism is (redacted for the sake of brevity!)

Educate them Patler. :)

I try,......and I try; ......but its a never-ending battle! :lol:

[the_idle_threat]

Racism is (redacted for the sake of brevity!)

Educate them Patler. :)

I try,......and I try; ......but its a never-ending battle! :lol:

You're not the only one fighting the good fight, Patler.

http://www.straightdope.com/

For the answers to all the world's important questions, see http://www.straightdope.com/columns/

[Patler]

You're not the only one fighting the good fight, Patler.

http://www.straightdope.com/

For the answers to all the world's important questions, see http://www.straightdope.com/columns/

One can easily become hooked on reading those types of sites. Some are truly informative, the others truly funny!

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Michael John "Mike" Vanderjagt (born March 24, 1970 in Oakville, Ontario), played in both the Canadian and National Football Leagues.

** He was once the most accurate field goal kicker in NFL history (229 of 265, 86.4% as of November 20, 2006).

On May 31, 2008, Vanderjagt went back to the CFL and signed on with the Toronto Argonauts as their kicker.

woodbuck27: ** mmmmm. :)

Like most canucks, doesn't know when to shut his mouth. Heard he also was badmouthing TT.

Nothing like that reverse racism.

Canadian are violent (cut to scene of hockey fight) /Canadian Bacon

I assume you're being facetious, or have you actually seen something saying he was dissing the turtle?

I think Ty was alluding to another Canuck's history of TT bashing.

** ``Years ago if you were to say `you had nine great years in the NFL and you're the most accurate kicker,' I would take that in a heartbeat,'' said Vanderjagt. ``Certainly I feel like I can kick in the NFL, but I am in no means using Toronto as a stepping stone there.

``From an NFL standpoint, sure, I wish I was there. But from a life standpoint, I feel this is the place I should be.''

** read that ''just that'' please.

How could any fair and normally intelligent person leap fr. **, to anything to do with Ted Thompson? Then associate the opinion of P. Manning and Mike Vanderjagt ''as an idiot '' and further. Lump all Canucks in ''as loud mouthed idiots''.

Such a person may certainly be wide open, to being called out as prejudiced. Therefore, simply ignorant and excused or not. Just an opionion based in observation of this thread.

Criticism has little to do with anything of nationality, race,color or creed but more to do with observation and follow-up, for '' the better good ''.

When P. Manning deemed Mike Vanderjagt ''an idiot '', PM demonstrated immaturity in terms of being brash / harsh. Furthermore he used his position on ''the Colts'' to unjustly criticise or undermine '' just, the most accurate kicker '' in NFL history to that time.

It just happens that Mike Vanderjagt is Canadian and none of the above should be dragged in or associated with human rights issues or skills. :D

woodbuck27

Your post just confirms that canadians are loudmouthed idiots.

[Guiness]

Reverse racism is racism against the race that holds the most power. Doesn't matter what race holds that power and it varies in different parts of the world.

Exactly. And RR is usually hidden behind the guise of 'affirmative action'.

When I was living in Nepean, a primarily white commuter suburb of Ottawa, they looking for police officers. They got a lot of applicants, pretty much all white males - no surprise, there was a bit of an asian population there, but that was about it.

They had to re-advertise outside of the area, and essentially accept any minority who applied because of the size of the city, the law dictated they had to have so many visible minorities on the force. The paper printed a huge headline titled 'White Males Need Not Apply'.

Sorry, but that ain't reverse..and the word is discrimination..not racism.

In order to prove your point you would have to show that they deliberately hired less qualified minorities than white applicants...to the exclusion of any white candidates, even if the latter had seniority or were better qualified by reason of education, expertise, or temperament.

Not hiring white males because you want a diversified staff isn't reverse discrimination.

Well, they did exactly what you said - they deliberately hired less qualified minorities rather than white applicants who had better credentials, more seniority etc. You're right, I didn't 'prove' it, I just related the situation.

Re: was it discrimination or racism? Well, it was discrimination based on race/skin colour. I consider that racism.

As far as whether it was reverse or not, that term is certainly not well defined. Where I'm from, it's come to mean what MJZ said...racism practiced against the group that is most often blamed for practicing it. Maybe it means something different where you are - certainly Patler's well stated definition is different than mine - so maybe what I'm describing is just plain old racism, i.e. excluding one based on a racial characteristic, even when it has no bearing on the performance of the job.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Reverse racism is racism against the race that holds the most power. Doesn't matter what race holds that power and it varies in different parts of the world.

Exactly. And RR is usually hidden behind the guise of 'affirmative action'.

When I was living in Nepean, a primarily white commuter suburb of Ottawa, they looking for police officers. They got a lot of applicants, pretty much all white males - no surprise, there was a bit of an asian population there, but that was about it.

They had to re-advertise outside of the area, and essentially accept any minority who applied because of the size of the city, the law dictated they had to have so many visible minorities on the force. The paper printed a huge headline titled 'White Males Need Not Apply'.

Sorry, but that ain't reverse..and the word is discrimination..not racism.

In order to prove your point you would have to show that they deliberately hired less qualified minorities than white applicants...to the exclusion of any white candidates, even if the latter had seniority or were better qualified by reason of education, expertise, or temperament.

Not hiring white males because you want a diversified staff isn't reverse discrimination.

Well, they did exactly what you said - they deliberately hired less qualified minorities rather than white applicants who had better credentials, more seniority etc. You're right, I didn't 'prove' it, I just related the situation.

Re: was it discrimination or racism? Well, it was discrimination based on race/skin colour. I consider that racism.

As far as whether it was reverse or not, that term is certainly not well defined. Where I'm from, it's come to mean what MJZ said...racism practiced against the group that is most often blamed for practicing it. Maybe it means something different where you are - certainly Patler's well stated definition is different than mine - so maybe what I'm describing is just plain old racism, i.e. excluding one based on a racial characteristic, even when it has no bearing on the performance of the job.

Not that i don't trust you, but until you post that they found unqualified candidates..well, it is just the usual rhetoric.

[Guiness]

Not that i don't trust you, but until you post that they found unqualified candidates..well, it is just the usual rhetoric.

Fair enough - with these types of arguments, so much is heresay. The situation I was talking about was around 2000...so 8 yrs ago. Tough to drag anything up.

Anyways...we bitch and main here...but I work overseas, and have heard some stories. Right now, South Africa is just a flat out mess, but before the stuff that's going on now, over the past couple of years I've talked to a fair few young white South Africans who have had to leave their country because they can't get work there. Companies are told they have to hire blacks or coloureds.

Again, I know, unsupported claims...

[Tarlam!]

Companies are told they have to hire blacks or coloureds.

Again, I know, unsupported claims...

Not this time Guin. I can support this claim as I have been to South Africa. Indeed, upon taking power, the first non Apartheid government made laws that called for equality, but in practice favoured the "previously discriminated against". This is a commonday term.

In essence, all government jobs are out of reach for white males.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Not that i don't trust you, but until you post that they found unqualified candidates..well, it is just the usual rhetoric.

Fair enough - with these types of arguments, so much is heresay. The situation I was talking about was around 2000...so 8 yrs ago. Tough to drag anything up.

Anyways...we bitch and main here...but I work overseas, and have heard some stories. Right now, South Africa is just a flat out mess, but before the stuff that's going on now, over the past couple of years I've talked to a fair few young white South Africans who have had to leave their country because they can't get work there. Companies are told they have to hire blacks or coloureds.

Again, I know, unsupported claims...

Hard for me to feel sympathy for some white guys in S.A. who can't get jobs.

I guess 42 years of apartheid will do that to a fellow.

[neil38133]

"Hard for me to feel sympathy for some white guys in S.A. who can't get jobs.

I guess 42 years of apartheid will do that to a fellow."

It almost sounds like you are saying that the discrimination/racism is OK here?

[Tarlam!]

Hard for me to feel sympathy for some white guys in S.A. who can't get jobs.

I guess 42 years of apartheid will do that to a fellow.

You dipstick. If you were 26 and white in RSA, how old were you when the Apartheid system collapsed? What part did you have in suppressing blacks and "coloureds"?

You just disqualified yourself for any past and future posts. You may be well read, but you have no experience. You fucking wanker. How dare you. And, it's RSA, not S.A. Ignorent.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Hard for me to feel sympathy for some white guys in S.A. who can't get jobs.

I guess 42 years of apartheid will do that to a fellow.

You dipstick. If you were 26 and white in RSA, how old were you when the Apartheid system collapsed? What part did you have in suppressing blacks and "coloureds"?

You just disqualified yourself for any past and future posts. You may be well read, but you have no experience. You fucking wanker. How dare you. And, it's RSA, not S.A. Ignorent.

Fuck off.

Who said they had any part? Not i.

I said it was hard for me to have sympathy. 42 years of white people (see..it isn't inviduals..it is a group) fucking over another will do that.

After 42 years of blacks fucking over whites..karma is achieved..and, i will feel sympathy.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

"Hard for me to feel sympathy for some white guys in S.A. who can't get jobs.

I guess 42 years of apartheid will do that to a fellow."

It almost sounds like you are saying that the discrimination/racism is OK here?

Where is "here?"

I am referring to R.S.A.

Am i in favor of racism/discrimination..no. But, i find boo hoo stories about whites having problems in that country..well, they fall on unsympathetic ears.

Their worst days now...a thousand times better than what the blacks experienced under apartheid.

[woodbuck27]

Hard for me to feel sympathy for some white guys in S.A. who can't get jobs.

I guess 42 years of apartheid will do that to a fellow.

You dipstick. If you were 26 and white in RSA, how old were you when the Apartheid system collapsed? What part did you have in suppressing blacks and "coloureds"?

You just disqualified yourself for any past and future posts. You may be well read, but you have no experience. You fucking wanker. How dare you. And, it's RSA, not S.A. Ignorent.

Fuck off.

Who said they had any part? Not i.

I said it was hard for me to have sympathy. 42 years of white people (see..it isn't inviduals..it is a group) fucking over another will do that.

After 42 years of blacks fucking over whites..karma is achieved..and, i will feel sympathy.

Hey !!

CUT OUT the bad and distastful language TB.

We have women ( other's ) on this forum that deserve better, more proper respect.

Your manners need to be address'd in yourself Tyrone. Your disgusting ways put a bad blemish on the overall outstanding quality of manners here.

Clean up.

[Guiness]

It almost sounds like you are saying that the discrimination/racism is OK here?

Where is "here?"

I think it's obvious that Tarlam was refering to RSA when he said 'here'


Their worst days now...a thousand times better than what the blacks experienced under apartheid.

I see TB is from the 'two wrongs make a right' school of thought.

Were the blacks horribly mistreated during apartheid? Yes, without a doubt. Is it right that now that the pendulum of power has swung the other way, that they are exerting undue control over the whites? No. Not to mention how they are treating the coloureds (and aboriginees). Instead of realizing that they had no part in the former situation, they are lumped as being 'not black'.

They are quickly heading to become a country like Nigeria.

obSigh: somewhere (in Arizona, apparently) some white kid in a suburb is giggling over the fact that he's got us all riled up here. Oh well, congrats.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Hard for me to feel sympathy for some white guys in S.A. who can't get jobs.

I guess 42 years of apartheid will do that to a fellow.

You dipstick. If you were 26 and white in RSA, how old were you when the Apartheid system collapsed? What part did you have in suppressing blacks and "coloureds"?

You just disqualified yourself for any past and future posts. You may be well read, but you have no experience. You fucking wanker. How dare you. And, it's RSA, not S.A. Ignorent.

Fuck off.

Who said they had any part? Not i.

I said it was hard for me to have sympathy. 42 years of white people (see..it isn't inviduals..it is a group) fucking over another will do that.

After 42 years of blacks fucking over whites..karma is achieved..and, i will feel sympathy.

Hey !!

CUT OUT the bad and distastful language TB.

We have women ( other's ) on this forum that deserve better, more proper respect.

Your manners need to be address'd in yourself Tyrone. Your disgusting ways put a bad blemish on the overall outstanding quality of manners here.

Clean up.

Shut the fuck up you idiot.

The women of this forum don't need your patronizing attitude, they dont' need you to protect them...they can post their feelings.

Manners: LOL. Try some yourself. And, try learning how to post. Their is netiquette as well as etiquette.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

It almost sounds like you are saying that the discrimination/racism is OK here?

Where is "here?"

I think it's obvious that Tarlam was refering to RSA when he said 'here'


Their worst days now...a thousand times better than what the blacks experienced under apartheid.

I see TB is from the 'two wrongs make a right' school of thought.

Were the blacks horribly mistreated during apartheid? Yes, without a doubt. Is it right that now that the pendulum of power has swung the other way, that they are exerting undue control over the whites? No. Not to mention how they are treating the coloureds (and aboriginees). Instead of realizing that they had no part in the former situation, they are lumped as being 'not black'.

They are quickly heading to become a country like Nigeria.

obSigh: somewhere (in Arizona, apparently) some white kid in a suburb is giggling over the fact that he's got us all riled up here. Oh well, congrats.

1. So, you think Neil is in R.S.A.? I dont' think he was referring to here as that country.

2. No, TB isn't of the two wrongs make a right. I know it is hard, but try to find where i said it. I never said the whites deserved poor treatment. I said it is hard for me to have sympathy. And, i quite sure you feel the same way about certain things. For example, if i told you a rapist and murder was being abused in prison and his civil rights were being violated...i highly doubt you or most of the forum would be up in arms..or have much sympathy.

If you don't like the way i feel..i'm sure you and your jackbooted friends could come over and convince me how wrong i am. Last time i checked, it wasn't against the law to have a lack of sympathy.

3. No. It isn't right. But, is is Karma. And, if things were perfect and equal..then who got the better deal...WHITES. It is always funny how the people who lose power complain about inequality after they have perpetrated it on others. Suddenly, they want the laws to work...but, had no problem abusing the system prior.

4. suburbs of AZ. Not really possible...as to have a sub..you need an urb. Also, i'm far from being a teenager.

My purpose isn't to rile you up..nor do i have that power. That would be great if i did, but only you control your emotions.

[Charles Woodson]

Shut the fuck up you idiot.



I think this is why no one respect you on this forum

[woodbuck27]

Hard for me to feel sympathy for some white guys in S.A. who can't get jobs.

I guess 42 years of apartheid will do that to a fellow.

You dipstick. If you were 26 and white in RSA, how old were you when the Apartheid system collapsed? What part did you have in suppressing blacks and "coloureds"?

You just disqualified yourself for any past and future posts. You may be well read, but you have no experience. You fucking wanker. How dare you. And, it's RSA, not S.A. Ignorent.

Fuck off.

Who said they had any part? Not i.

I said it was hard for me to have sympathy. 42 years of white people (see..it isn't inviduals..it is a group) fucking over another will do that.

After 42 years of blacks fucking over whites..karma is achieved..and, i will feel sympathy.

Hey !!

CUT OUT the bad and distastful language TB.

We have women ( other's ) on this forum that deserve better, more proper respect.

Your manners need to be address'd in yourself Tyrone. Your disgusting ways put a bad blemish on the overall outstanding quality of manners here.

Clean up.

Shut the fuck up you idiot.

The women of this forum don't need your patronizing attitude, they dont' need you to protect them...they can post their feelings.

Manners: LOL. Try some yourself. And, try learning how to post. Their is netiquette as well as etiquette.

I promise you Tyrone Bigguns and whoever else you are. I'll see the day your absent as Tyrone Bigguns fr. this board. That's because your too far over the top to be anything even approaching sense and sensabilty. So, unreal.

From my view:

Your 'an open and poisonous puss boil' Tyrone Biggins. On the otherwise fine ass of this forum.

It's unlikely you have existed as only Tyrone Biggins on this board. Why hotshot? No human being but you ( in your sick psyche) could create such a stiinking and grossly outrageous personaliy, as you so proudly display here @ Packerrats as Tyone Biggins. and..... Have the balls to be "a real man''.

Your worse than a very bad distastful joke.Your pathetically messed up whoever you are. Come to grips with that fact on your next post to ''only me'' woodbuck27. Want to try too rip on real people? Unreal Vs REAL. Unreal = Tyrone Bigguns = LOSER. Your way over the top, worse than a very bad distastful joke.Your pathetically messed up and a phoney counterfeit, whoever you are today Tyrone.

[Zool]

After 42 years of blacks fucking over whites..karma is achieved..and, i will feel sympathy.

Holy shit was this a stupid statement. You're on quite a roll lately.

[MJZiggy]

Hard for me to feel sympathy for some white guys in S.A. who can't get jobs.

I guess 42 years of apartheid will do that to a fellow.

You dipstick. If you were 26 and white in RSA, how old were you when the Apartheid system collapsed? What part did you have in suppressing blacks and "coloureds"?

You just disqualified yourself for any past and future posts. You may be well read, but you have no experience. You fucking wanker. How dare you. And, it's RSA, not S.A. Ignorent.

Fuck off.

Who said they had any part? Not i.

I said it was hard for me to have sympathy. 42 years of white people (see..it isn't inviduals..it is a group) fucking over another will do that.

After 42 years of blacks fucking over whites..karma is achieved..and, i will feel sympathy.

The problem in your theory, Ty, is that we're not talking about the same whites 84 years later. The group is not the same so even the group theory doesn't work. And don't mess with Tar.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Shut the fuck up you idiot.



I think this is why no one respect you on this forum

Plenty respect.

But, more importantly, do you think i need to feel respected from anonymous people i don't know?

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Hard for me to feel sympathy for some white guys in S.A. who can't get jobs.

I guess 42 years of apartheid will do that to a fellow.

You dipstick. If you were 26 and white in RSA, how old were you when the Apartheid system collapsed? What part did you have in suppressing blacks and "coloureds"?

You just disqualified yourself for any past and future posts. You may be well read, but you have no experience. You fucking wanker. How dare you. And, it's RSA, not S.A. Ignorent.

Fuck off.

Who said they had any part? Not i.

I said it was hard for me to have sympathy. 42 years of white people (see..it isn't inviduals..it is a group) fucking over another will do that.

After 42 years of blacks fucking over whites..karma is achieved..and, i will feel sympathy.

The problem in your theory, Ty, is that we're not talking about the same whites 84 years later. The group is not the same so even the group theory doesn't work. And don't mess with Tar.

The problem with your thoughts is that you conflate individuals with the white race. As, i've said..i realize the individuals now are being screwed. But, i don't look at them..i'm talking whites and blacks.

When whites are sufficiently screwed over..karma is achieved. Now, i'm not saying that i desire that..but, that is how karma works.

More to the point....i will feel sympathy for the white complaints.

I can't believe how you people can even try to argue or convince me to change how i feel regarding sympathy. That is my feelings. I'm not trying to make you or others change theirs. I just don't have much sympathy for white people in R.S.A.

"The sins of the father are to be laid upon the children." - Shakespeare, "The Merchant of Venice," act III, sc. V, l. 1

And, for those of you with FAITH:

(Exodus 34:6-7) - "Then the Lord passed by in front of him and proclaimed, "The Lord, the Lord God, compassionate and gracious, slow to anger, and abounding in lovingkindness and truth; who keeps lovingkindness for thousands, who forgives iniquity, transgression and sin; yet He will by no means leave the guilty unpunished, visiting the iniquity of fathers on the children and on the grandchildren to the third and fourth generations."

[Fritz]

Anybody would rather play for the CFL and make a third or less of the money they would make in the NFL.

"Toronto was the front-runner, regardless of what NFL team called,'' said Vanderjagt, who won back-to-back Grey Cup championships in his only two full CFL seasons. ``I really wanted to come to Toronto, more than anything else.'' "

Raise your hand if you believe this. Anybody? Bueller? Anybody?

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Anybody would rather play for the CFL and make a third or less of the money they would make in the NFL.

"Toronto was the front-runner, regardless of what NFL team called,'' said Vanderjagt, who won back-to-back Grey Cup championships in his only two full CFL seasons. ``I really wanted to come to Toronto, more than anything else.'' "

Raise your hand if you believe this. Anybody? Bueller? Anybody?

Woody believes it..after all a canadian said it...and a canadian wouldn't lie would he?