Did Brett's waffling cost us the Super Bowl?

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Last year we were 13-3, and clearly close to going to the Superbowl.

When Brett retired, that changed the nature of our draft and perhaps the attitude of management towards free agents.

Regardless whether Brett comes back and starts for us now, the team on the field is undoubtedly different than the one that would have been assembled if he hadn't announced his retirement.

I think it is fairly obvious we wouldn't have drafted a QB in the second round. I can't begin to think who we woulda picked.

Who would we have picked? Would we have traded that 2nd for JT? Questions abound without answers.

[3irty1]

We'll have to revisit this after the season.

I do think however that not seriously pursing Randy Moss cost us a superbowl.

[Pacopete4]

Agree

[Harlan Huckleby]

We'll have to revisit this after the season.

I do think however that not seriously pursing Randy Moss cost us a superbowl.

we sure could have used a big reciever in that Giants playoff game. Our little squirts don't work so hot on a cold, slippery surface.

[Pacopete4]

Ya, thats kinda a seperate topic but where did Jennings go? He was the man all year and then that game, no where. Driver came thru like usualy though..

[Gunakor]

We'll have to revisit this after the season.

I do think however that not seriously pursing Randy Moss cost us a superbowl.


I strongly disagree. Randy Moss would not have helped one iota in the NFC Championship game. And he didn't help New England win a super bowl either.

[PlantPage55]

Ya, thats kinda a seperate topic but where did Jennings go? He was the man all year and then that game, no where. Driver came thru like usualy though..

If you watch the game again, Jennings was open all day. Brett was not finding him. When did find him, he was not hitting him. I'm not worried about Jennings.

[Bretsky]

Last year we were 13-3, and clearly close to going to the Superbowl.

When Brett retired, that changed the nature of our draft and perhaps the attitude of management towards free agents.

Regardless whether Brett comes back and starts for us now, the team on the field is undoubtedly different than the one that would have been assembled if he hadn't announced his retirement.

I think it is fairly obvious we wouldn't have drafted a QB in the second round. I can't begin to think who we woulda picked.

Who would we have picked? Would we have traded that 2nd for JT? Questions abound without answers.


I don't see how it changed out attitude toward free agents
Last year we signed next to nothing in Frank Walker so I doubt TT had the let's go for the gusto mentality with Favre coming back.

This year we actually signed a decent LB in Chillar; certainly a better player IMO than Walker. Bottom line is TT is not a fan of free agents.

The 2nd round pick may be valid; although with TT's BPA strategy one might argue he'd have drafted Brohm as well.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

First, this thread isn't about moss, so don't threadjack.


Bretsky,

YOu honestly think we woulda drafted a QB in the second round?

What about Nelson? Maybe tt takes players that don't need as much development time like Lee

YOu think that Taylor might have been traded for if we had brett?

More cap space because brett retired certainly affects decision making.

Maybe we dont' trade Corey. The team with brett isn't the same team as one with arod.

[Bretsky]

First, this thread isn't about moss, so don't threadjack.


Bretsky,

YOu honestly think we woulda drafted a QB in the second round?

What about Nelson? Maybe tt takes players that don't need as much development time like Lee

YOu think that Taylor might have been traded for if we had brett?

More cap space because brett retired certainly affects decision making.

Maybe we dont' trade Corey. The team with brett isn't the same team as one with arod.


Hmm; it is a very valid consideration. I'm probably 50-50. TT has always drafted the BPA regardless of need and he loved Brohm. I didn't like the Harrell pick as we were stacked on the DL. TT did it knowing that there was a good chance we would lose C Williams. I don't think TT wanted to pay C Williams regardless.

Regarding that first round pick, that is trickier. TT clearly wanted to stack weapons for Rodgers. Brandon Flowers, a nice CB, was there and maybe TT takes him rather than trading down in round one. If that occurs he might pass on Lee. But if he still goes with Jordy then Lee was about the best CB there in round two. It's fun to speculate; on the other hand TT has never went out of his way to draft for now as opposed to long term so it's hard to tell either way

[RashanGary]

Eli Manning won the SB last year. I see no reason Rodgers can't win one.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I don't see how it changed out attitude toward free agents
Last year we signed next to nothing in Frank Walker so I doubt TT had the let's go for the gusto mentality with Favre coming back.

This year we actually signed a decent LB in Chillar; certainly a better player IMO than Walker. Bottom line is TT is not a fan of free agents.

Wood and Pickett, man, Wood and Pickett.

[Bretsky]

Eli Manning won the SB last year. I see no reason Rodgers can't win one.


Alex Smith has sucked so far; I see no reason why Rodgers would not suck too

We have little evidence to justify either view

Time will tell

[Partial]

Eli Manning won the SB last year. I see no reason Rodgers can't win one.

You're comparing a family of two of the greatest quarterbacks and one of much higher acclaim and a much better prospect coming out to an A-Rod? Really?

[Zool]

Eli Manning won the SB last year. I see no reason Rodgers can't win one.

You're comparing a family of two of the greatest quarterbacks and one of much higher acclaim and a much better prospect coming out to an A-Rod? Really?

So you think either Archie Manning or Eli Manning are one of the greatest QB's ever? Really?

[Harlan Huckleby]

archie manning might have been as good as peyton. it was an era before parity, and he played on the 'aints.

[Pacopete4]

As annoying as the Mannings are, they are 3 good qbs, with 1 being great. Eli still has time to get there... he's just becoming the person he is IMO

[Zool]

archie manning might have been as good as peyton. it was an era before parity, and he played on the 'aints.

125/175 career TD/INT ratio. I dont give a shit who your teammates are, thats just an inaccurate statement you made there HH. Guy had 3 good seasons. Completed 55% of his passes and avg 6.6/att. I think even Peyton would be pissed about that one and thats his dad.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Man, you fuckers just can't stay on topic.

the issue is how brett's waffling potentially changed the free agent acquisitions and draft.

[Zool]

Man, you fuckers just can't stay on topic.

the issue is how brett's waffling potentially changed the free agent acquisitions and draft.

How many times can this BS be rehashed? This isn't your iPhone discussion. Some people like to change subjects once in a while.

[GBRulz]

Eli Manning won the SB last year. I see no reason Rodgers can't win one.

You're comparing a family of two of the greatest quarterbacks and one of much higher acclaim and a much better prospect coming out to an A-Rod? Really?

So you think either Archie Manning or Eli Manning are one of the greatest QB's ever? Really?

Well, he could be talking about Cooper. 8-)

[Deputy Nutz]

First, this thread isn't about moss, so don't threadjack.


Bretsky,

YOu honestly think we woulda drafted a QB in the second round?

What about Nelson? Maybe tt takes players that don't need as much development time like Lee

YOu think that Taylor might have been traded for if we had brett?

More cap space because brett retired certainly affects decision making.

Maybe we dont' trade Corey. The team with brett isn't the same team as one with arod.

I honestly don't think that any second round pick is going to make or break a run to the Super Bowl.

[Zool]

Eli Manning won the SB last year. I see no reason Rodgers can't win one.

You're comparing a family of two of the greatest quarterbacks and one of much higher acclaim and a much better prospect coming out to an A-Rod? Really?

So you think either Archie Manning or Eli Manning are one of the greatest QB's ever? Really?

Well, he could be talking about Cooper. 8-)

Ha...good call. Where did he end up going to school?

[Pacopete4]

It would be uncomfy being Cooper when everyone keeps mentioning his brothers and dad being good at football

[Pacopete4]

http://www.serioussportsnewsnetwork.com/2008/01/cooper-manning-id-have-four-rings-by-now.html

MEMPHIS, TN — Cooper Manning, the out-of-the-spotlight older brother of Peyton and Eli Manning, made a rare public statement Friday.

“I’d have four Super Bowl rings by now,” Cooper Manning said. “Maybe five. I mean, how hard can it be to win the Super Bowl?”


on a more sad note:

Cooper was heavily recruited by Division I schools Texas, Virginia and Ole Miss. He enrolled at Ole Miss, but as a freshman in 1992 he was diagnosed with spinal stenosis, thus ending his NFL aspirations.

[GBRulz]

I didn't know that about Cooper. Good find, Paco.

[NewsBruin]

Tyrone, for a smart man, you've got a short-sighted theory.

I think TT would likely have gone for a QB, as I think he didn't expect Brett to come back in 08, and likely not in 09. He drafted Rogers while Favre was active, and it fanned the flames, but I think he was thinking about 2-4 years down the road.

Brohm is not Favre's replacement. Brohm is Rogers' replacement, and Brohm was drafted because we didn't have much behind Rogers. If there's a possibility the first-stringer could be gone during this off-season, and the incumbent the year after, then now's a good time to get someone invested in the system.

I haven't seen much from Thompson that would indicate he thinks about winning overnight. All of Favre's weapons (minus Koren) came from rookies or the draft.

Honestly, I don't think TT wanted to encourage Favre to come back, and had Brett not retired, things wouldn't look a damn bit different.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Tyrone, for a smart man, you've got a short-sighted theory.

I think TT would likely have gone for a QB, as I think he didn't expect Brett to come back in 08, and likely not in 09. He drafted Rogers while Favre was active, and it fanned the flames, but I think he was thinking about 2-4 years down the road.

Brohm is not Favre's replacement. Brohm is Rogers' replacement, and Brohm was drafted because we didn't have much behind Rogers. If there's a possibility the first-stringer could be gone during this off-season, and the incumbent the year after, then now's a good time to get someone invested in the system.

I haven't seen much from Thompson that would indicate he thinks about winning overnight. All of Favre's weapons (minus Koren) came from rookies or the draft.

Honestly, I don't think TT wanted to encourage Favre to come back, and had Brett not retired, things wouldn't look a damn bit different.

I am a smart man..smart enough to know that TT wouldn't have used a 2nd on a QB if Arod was going to be the backup. Maybe a QB in a later round, but certainly not a 2nd.

Weapons: you mean like DD, Ahman or Grant, or Donald Lee or Bubba? :roll:

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Man, you fuckers just can't stay on topic.

the issue is how brett's waffling potentially changed the free agent acquisitions and draft.

How many times can this BS be rehashed? This isn't your iPhone discussion. Some people like to change subjects once in a while.

Then create your own thread.

[mraynrand]

Man, you fuckers just can't stay on topic.

the issue is how brett's waffling potentially changed the free agent acquisitions and draft.

That's what make you love him - that classy, endearing manner.

[Zool]

Man, you fuckers just can't stay on topic.

the issue is how brett's waffling potentially changed the free agent acquisitions and draft.

How many times can this BS be rehashed? This isn't your iPhone discussion. Some people like to change subjects once in a while.

Then create your own thread.

Oops forgot, in addition to being an expert on all subjects, you're also the forum police. My bad.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Man, you fuckers just can't stay on topic.

the issue is how brett's waffling potentially changed the free agent acquisitions and draft.

How many times can this BS be rehashed? This isn't your iPhone discussion. Some people like to change subjects once in a while.

Then create your own thread.

Oops forgot, in addition to being an expert on all subjects, you're also the forum police. My bad.

Don't think twice. It's understanding that makes it possible for people like me to tolerate a person like yourself.

[Zool]

What are your views on voodoo and ice cream parlors?

[Tyrone Bigguns]

What are your views on voodoo and ice cream parlors?

Sound very liberal...i'm inclined to like them.

[motife]

http://wednesdaychef.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/waffles.jpg

[The Leaper]

mmm...waffles

[KYPack]

Gotta put a chicken leg on top of that stack and drown it in syrup.

[cpk1994]

Gotta put a chicken leg on top of that stack and drown it in syrup.You frequent Roscoe's Chicken & Waffles, don't you?

[KYPack]

Gotta put a chicken leg on top of that stack and drown it in syrup.You frequent Roscoe's Chicken & Waffles, don't you?

It's a hood joke.

Had to make a chicken reference and help jack Ty's thread.

When a thread stampedes, it's hard to herd 'em back on the trail, Tyrone.

[cpk1994]

Gotta put a chicken leg on top of that stack and drown it in syrup.You frequent Roscoe's Chicken & Waffles, don't you?

It's a hood joke.

Had to make a chicken reference and help jack Ty's thread.

When a thread stampedes, it's hard to herd 'em back on the trail, Tyrone.I understand, but when you mentioned chicken with the waffles, that was the first thing that popped into my head :wink:

[KYPack]

Gotta put a chicken leg on top of that stack and drown it in syrup.You frequent Roscoe's Chicken & Waffles, don't you?

It's a hood joke.

Had to make a chicken reference and help jack Ty's thread.

When a thread stampedes, it's hard to herd 'em back on the trail, Tyrone.I understand, but when you mentioned chicken with the waffles, that was the first thing that popped into my head :wink:

Roscoe's Chicken & Waffles?

You want some good chicken?

Come to KFC.

"Only the rooster gets a better piece".

[NewsBruin]

I haven't seen much from Thompson that would indicate he thinks about winning overnight. All of Favre's weapons (minus Koren) came from rookies or the draft.

I am a smart man..smart enough to know that TT wouldn't have used a 2nd on a QB if Arod was going to be the backup. Maybe a QB in a later round, but certainly not a 2nd.

Weapons: you mean like DD, Ahman or Grant, or Donald Lee or Bubba? :roll:

D'oh! I meant all of the weapons Thompson aquired. Them and Mark Boerigter.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Gotta put a chicken leg on top of that stack and drown it in syrup.You frequent Roscoe's Chicken & Waffles, don't you?

It's a hood joke.

Had to make a chicken reference and help jack Ty's thread.

When a thread stampedes, it's hard to herd 'em back on the trail, Tyrone.

Hey, the waffles thing is at least related to the thread title...fuck manning.

I can appreciate a good joke.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

I haven't seen much from Thompson that would indicate he thinks about winning overnight. All of Favre's weapons (minus Koren) came from rookies or the draft.

I am a smart man..smart enough to know that TT wouldn't have used a 2nd on a QB if Arod was going to be the backup. Maybe a QB in a later round, but certainly not a 2nd.

Weapons: you mean like DD, Ahman or Grant, or Donald Lee or Bubba? :roll:

D'oh! I meant all of the weapons Thompson aquired. Them and Mark Boerigter.

TT keeping players and not cutting them/trading them is providing weapons.

When a new manager comes onboard, be it football or any other biz, they evaluate talent and decide who to keep. That counts as much as new acquisitions. IF you keep the right guys and let the losers or going to be losers go..that is key.

Or would you have preferred TT to resign Green? YOu don't count that as a coup for TT.

BTW, Lee and grant were acquired. Herron was a free agent. Morency was traded for. Humphrey was a free agent. Ruvell free agent.

Finally, your premise about winning overnite...is exactly right. But, TT has been here and built the team..so, doing something this year isn't akin to overnite...it is the finishing touch, if he believes that we are close.

[NewsBruin]

Yeah, that's more of what I meant. You're right about the acquisitions. I just meant that the guys Thompson picked up were small potatoes or low-risk pickups, and that I didn't expect him to pick a potential gamebreaker in the draft.

I was perfectly fine with Ahman moving on to Houston. He was decreasing in productivity and his track record with women was appalling. Really, I've been fine with most of Thompson's roster moves.

[MJZiggy]

Gotta put a chicken leg on top of that stack and drown it in syrup.You frequent Roscoe's Chicken & Waffles, don't you?

It's a hood joke.

Had to make a chicken reference and help jack Ty's thread.

When a thread stampedes, it's hard to herd 'em back on the trail, Tyrone.

Hey, the waffles thing is at least related to the thread title...fuck manning.

I can appreciate a good joke.

I'm not sure why, but I give you guys waffles with chicken (http://www.mosaiccuisine.com/)

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Yeah, that's more of what I meant. You're right about the acquisitions. I just meant that the guys Thompson picked up were small potatoes or low-risk pickups, and that I didn't expect him to pick a potential gamebreaker in the draft.

I was perfectly fine with Ahman moving on to Houston. He was decreasing in productivity and his track record with women was appalling. Really, I've been fine with most of Thompson's roster moves.

Well, i dont think you usually find gamebreakers in the draft...maybe RBs. Nor do you find many in free agency..this aint the 90s any more.

But, if brett was onboard...who knows if TT decides to trade Williams. Maybe he thinks we are close..as opposed to rogers where he might think..this year is get him acclimated...next two years are the big push for the SB.

Or, if trades williams and uses 2nd to trade for Taylor. Or maybe he uses picks to get guys ready to get on the field on defense...guys more ready to play with lesser upside. Maybe TT decides he HAS TO BUILD A DOMINANT defense because with brett you can't count on him not improvising and costing us points. But, with Arod..maybe they know you don't get the crazy great play, but he also doesn't beat himself...all conjecture.

I'm not saying that is what woulda happened...but, i certainly think the team is different with brett at the helm. And, therefore decisions made regarding the team are as well.

[woodbuck27]

We'll have to revisit this after the season.

I do think however that not seriously pursing Randy Moss cost us a superbowl.

No Randy Moss.

That was a major error when all is considered, missing a GOLDEN OPPORTUNITY to acquire the top rated WR now in the NFL. Very sad.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

We'll have to revisit this after the season.

I do think however that not seriously pursing Randy Moss cost us a superbowl.

No Randy Moss.

That was a major error when all is considered, missing a GOLDEN OPPORTUNITY to acquire the top rated WR now in the NFL. Very sad.

How many times do we need to spell it out for you..moss didn't want to come to GB.