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GoPackGo
06-10-2006, 12:37 PM
Counter measures
The wolves began to circle and howl even before the Vince Lombardi Trophy had been wiped clean of prints -- and they struck as soon as the free-agent period began, pouncing on anyone separated from the herd.

Seahawks wide receiver Joe Jurevicius was the first prominent player to go -- snapped up by Cleveland on March 11. That began a rapid-fire series of raids on the two Super Bowl 40 teams. Over the next 11 days, the Seahawks also lost guard Steve Hutchinson (who received a sneaky offer -- the wording made it impossible for the Seahawks to match -- from the Vikings) and safety Marquand Manual (Packers) while the champion Steelers bade farewell to wide receiver Antwaan Randle El (Redskins), safety Chris Hope (Titans) and defensive end Kimo von Oelhoffen (Jets). The Jets also struck the Seahawks, signing cornerback Andre Dyson.

"After winning the Super Bowl, you feel you want to keep everybody," Steelers director of football operations Kevin Colbert says.


"In reality, that wasn't going to happen."

It's common, even expected, for other teams in the league to poach Super Bowl teams during the free-agent period. More interesting were the responses of this year's conference champions.

The Seahawks struck back. In addition to retaining running back Shaun Alexander with an eight-year contract worth a potential $62 million, they shelled out $18.5 million in guaranteed money to land 49ers linebacker Julian Peterson, one of the most coveted defenders on the market.

"We decided that during the first frenzied week of free agency, we were not going to jump in and spend a lot of money," Seahawks coach Mike Holmgren says. "Yet we went out and got Julian Peterson, which was a huge signing for us. After that, you try to fill specific spots."

Seattle did that by re-signing defensive tackle Rocky Bernard and fullback Mack Strong and bringing in free agents such as offensive lineman Tom Ashworth and wide receiver Nate Burleson.

In comparison, the Steelers were immobile. They signed 11 of their potential free agents and a few guys from other teams, but there weren't a lot of recognizable names on the list. From a distance, the approach looked passive. But anyone familiar with the system built by the Rooney family and refined by coach Bill Cowher knows it's just part of the plan.

Whereas some teams -- the Redskins and Raiders are recent examples -- attempt to reload every year with veteran newcomers, the Steelers rely on a more organic model. One AFC personnel director describes the formula this way: "Don't overpay; don't mortgage your future; draft correctly; maintain a core of players; and let a few guys go."

The Steelers adopted the model out of necessity when they had an older stadium and couldn't compete in the open market. They continue to apply it to near perfection.

"You have to be a little forward-thinking," Cowher says. "What will your roster be like in three years, four years? Even some guys we bring in through free agency, we like guys who are on their second contract. (Wide receiver) Cedrick Wilson, (linebacker) James Farrior -- guys who had been with their first team. You still have a chance to develop them as players."

So when Randle El left, the Steelers had Wilson to take his place and drafted Ohio State's Santonio Holmes to take Wilson's place as the third wideout. And when von Oelhoffen skipped town, they had Brett Keisel, a former seventh-round pick who had learned their system and was ready to move into the position.

Of course, the Steelers' system would fall to pieces if the organization weren't so stable. The Rooneys have owned the franchise since its founding in 1933, and Cowher, entering his 15th season, is the longest-tenured coach in the league. Colbert, whom Cowher calls "a breath of fresh air," is beginning his seventh season in Pittsburgh. Everyone from chairman Dan Rooney to strength coach Chet Fuhrman knows precisely the type of player that fits the system.

Despite their spending, the Seahawks seem to be building a similar foundation and recently extended Holmgren's contract through 2008.

Every team, not just Pittsburgh and Seattle, maneuvered through a competitive offseason. From the Dolphins and Lions (both A's) to the Patriots (F), our grades were based on a team's level of improvement or decline.

Dolphins:The whopper was the trade for Daunte Culpepper, who likely will be the Dolphins' best quarterback since Dan Marino. Perhaps more important, the volume of serviceable newcomers -- guys such as tackle L.J. Shelton, linebacker Keith Newman and cornerback Will Allen -- gives coach Nick Saban a much deeper roster. Grade: A

Lions: The new quarterback combo (Jon Kitna and Josh McCown) is a lot better than the old one (Joey Harrington and Jeff Garcia), and the Lions retained a few of their important free agents, such as left tackle Jeff Backus and defensive end Kalimba Edwards. Grade: A

Giants: The best protection for Eli Manning is a stout defense, and the Giants likely will be formidable after acquiring linebackers LaVar Arrington and Brandon Short, cornerback Sam Madison and safety Will Demps. The team also lost some defenders, but the balance is positive. Grade: A-

Seahawks: Determined to avoid two recent curses -- Super Bowl loser and Madden computer game packaging -- the Seahawks opened their wallets wide. They re-signed reigning league MVP Shaun Alexander and added linebacker Julian Peterson and offensive lineman Tom Ashworth. The negative was losing guard Steve Hutchinson. Grade: A-

Texans: They're still taking hits for their decision to bypass Reggie Bush in the draft, but they shone in acquiring veterans. None of their defections will be too painful, and veteran pickups such as wide receiver Eric Moulds, linebacker Sam Cowart and center Mike Flanagan will add some stability to a downtrodden franchise. Grade: A-

Buccaneers: They didn't bring in much new talent, but they retained the players they needed most: right tackle Kenyatta Walker, defensive tackle Chris Hovan and fullback Mike Alstott. OK, they might miss safety Dexter Jackson. Grade: B+

Browns: Receiver Joe Jurevicius won't make up for Antonio Bryant's speed. On the other hand, the Browns snagged a couple of wily old-timers, linebacker Willie McGinest and defensive tackle Ted Washington, who know all about Romeo Crennel's defense. And they have solid new O-linemen, center LeCharles Bentley and left tackle Kevin Shaffer. Grade: B+

Redskins: The arrival of wideouts Antwaan Randle El and Brandon Lloyd will take some pressure off Santana Moss. But the defensive changes -- safety Adam Archuleta and linebacker Andre Carter in; LaVar Arrington, cornerback Walt Harris and safety Ryan Clark out -- are pretty much a wash. Grade: B

Cardinals: You can say they overpaid for a back with almost 2,200 carries, but Edgerrin James gives the Cards the type of skill player who can help them turn the corner. That's assuming quarterback Kurt Warner stays healthy because Josh McCown now is in Detroit and it's no certainty Matt Leinart will be ready. Grade: B

Jaguars: They improved incrementally on defense, re-signing cornerback Terry Cousin and adding linebacker Nick Greisen and cornerback Brian Williams to offset the departures of Akin Ayodele and Deke Cooper. Grade: B

Panthers: The offense will get boosts from receiver Keyshawn Johnson and center Justin Hartwig. But you have to wonder whether adding linebacker Keith Adams and tackle Maake Kemoeatu will be enough to offset the losses of linebackers Will Witherspoon and Brandon Short and safety Marlon McCree. Grade: B-

Jets: They forfeited quality (defensive end John Abraham, center Kevin Mawae, left tackle Jason Fabini) and gained quantity (at least seven players who are likely to make contributions). The best of the additions is defensive end Kimo von Oelhoffen. Grade: B-

Cowboys: Dallas got rid of one mercurial wide receiver (Keyshawn Johnson) and gained a surreal one (Terrell Owens). The kicking game climbed two notches with the signing of Mike Vanderjagt, and the departure of guard Larry Allen is balanced by getting tackle Jason Fabini. Grade: B-

Falcons: If they can coax a couple of good years out of safety Lawyer Milloy, 32, and get speed-rushing end John Abraham to play hard every down, this grade might end up looking too low. Grade: B-

Bills: They lost experience by letting safety Lawyer Milloy, wide receiver Eric Moulds and defensive tackle Sam Adams go. But they got a good defensive tackle in Larry Tripplett and wrapped up arguably the best player on the team, cornerback Nate Clements, with their franchise tag. Grade: B-

Bengals: It was a fairly quiet offseason for the Bengals, who lost one backup quarterback (Jon Kitna), gained another (Anthony Wright) and picked up a couple of Super Bowl rings on the fingers of defensive tackle Sam Adams and safety Dexter Jackson. Grade: C+

49ers: They added experience on the offensive line (guard Larry Allen), speed at receiver (Antonio Bryant) and stability on the corner (Walt Harris). They probably needed a lot more, especially after getting picked for linebackers Julian Peterson and Andre Carter. Grade: C+

Broncos: The Broncos had a big draft day, trading for wide receiver Javon Walker and moving up to select quarterback Jay Cutler. But defensive end Trevor Pryce will be missed, and we're not really buying Ron Dayne as the next rags-to-riches Denver running back. Grade: C+

Steelers: You can almost disregard this grade. The Steelers always seem to compensate for free-agent losses with astute drafts and development of talent. This year, they locked up most of their own free agents (cornerback Deshea Townsend probably was the most notable), although they lost defensive end Kimo von Oelhoffen, wideout Antwaan Randle El and safety Chris Hope. Grade: C

Titans: They replaced safety Tank Williams with Chris Hope, linebackers Brad Kassell and Rocky Boiman with David Thornton and center Justin Hartwig with Kevin Mawae. Hmmm. They do get a bump up for signing wide receiver David Givens. Grade: C

Bears: The Bears are the least-altered team in the league. Their biggest acquisition was backup quarterback Brian Griese. They lost nobody of substance. Grade: C

Saints: They drafted Reggie Bush and nailed one of the offseason's prize jewels: quarterback Drew Brees. On the downside, departures carved up an already-thin roster. Particularly ravaged were the offensive line (center LeCharles Bentley, tackle Wayne Gandy) and the defensive front seven (end Darren Howard and linebacker Sedrick Hodge). Grade: C

Raiders: There weren't any Moss-like splashes this offseason -- just the addition of a talented but inconsistent quarterback (Aaron Brooks) and a pass rusher (Lance Johnstone) to complement Derrick Burgess. Cornerback Charles Woodson finally made his exit. Grade: C-

Eagles: The best move was re-signing right tackle Jon Runyan. They're hoping the flight of Terrell Owens is addition by subtraction, but they can't say that about linebacker Keith Adams. Grade: C-

Packers: The secondary looks stronger with the additions of corner Charles Woodson and safety Marquand Manuel. But the Pack will lack one quality blocker (Mike Flanagan), one big-time receiver (Javon Walker) and one solid kicker (Ryan Longwell). Grade: C-

Rams: The defense will look substantially different, especially along the line, where Ryan Pickett, Damione Lewis and Tyoka Jackson all used to reside. Safety Adam Archuleta also is gone, but middle linebacker Will Witherspoon and safety Corey Chavous were good pickups. Grade: C-

Ravens: They poached Denver for end Trevor Pryce and running back Mike Anderson, who will back up Jamal Lewis. Defensive losses include Will Demps and Maake Kemoeatu. Grade: C-

Chiefs: About the only thing that stands out among a lackluster group of transactions is the loss of fullback Tony Richardson -- a valued blocker and receiver. Grade: D+

Colts: The Colts replaced kicker Mike Vanderjagt with Adam Vinatieri and kept linebacker Cato June. But this roster was just too tempting to teams with spending money. The defections included Edgerrin James, David Thornton and Larry Tripplett -- all significant. Grade: D

Chargers: Safety Marlon McCree likely will become the best player in the secondary immediately. But that doesn't nearly compensate for the loss of Drew Brees. Grade: D

Vikings: They loaded up on offense, welcoming Steve Hutchinson, Tony Richardson and halfback Chester Taylor. At the same time, they watched the breakup of the defense they worked so hard to build last year. Linebackers Sam Cowart and Keith Newman, end Lance Johnstone, safety Corey Chavous and corner Brian Williams all left. Grade: D

Patriots: Coach Bill Belichick and vice president of personnel Scott Pioli have long since proved their ability to find replacement parts, but this is starting to look like a dismantling. The offense lost wideout David Givens and lineman Tom Ashworth, the defense lost linebacker Willie McGinest and cornerback Duane Starks, and the special teams lost kicker Adam Vinatieri and returner Tim Dwight. Besides wide receiver Reche Caldwell, who is expected to start, the Patriots have little to show on the other side of the ledger. Grade: F

Charles Woodson
06-10-2006, 09:35 PM
I dont agree with this. we shoulda been ranked higher. i mean with javon its not like he was gana play anyways. and he didnt add in the aquistion of pickett.

Anti-Polar Bear
06-10-2006, 10:06 PM
We (the Pack) should be graded worse then that, something around the realm of D. Thompson started with the 2nd most cash available, and can only hit on ONE and ONLY one pro bowl caliber player (Woodson).

After everything Ahman Green has given the Pack, thompson merely gave him a 1 yr contract. No wonder Wahle bolted and Walker told thompson to go screw himself.

Folks, we have the worst GM in the NFL running our team.

MJZiggy
06-10-2006, 10:18 PM
I bet if he makes a bet he honors it when he loses.

Charles Woodson
06-10-2006, 10:26 PM
We (the Pack) should be graded worse then that, something around the realm of D. Thompson started with the 2nd most cash available, and can only hit on ONE and ONLY one pro bowl caliber player (Woodson).

After everything Ahman Green has given the Pack, thompson merely gave him a 1 yr contract. No wonder Wahle bolted and Walker told thompson to go screw himself.

Folks, we have the worst GM in the NFL running our team.


Tank just curious, what would u say if the pack won the SB this year??

And im guessing when walker told him to screw himself, he really did?

Anti-Polar Bear
06-10-2006, 10:34 PM
Tank just curious, what would u say if the pack won the SB this year??

And im guessing when walker told him to screw himself, he really did?

To win the SB is a long shot, given Thompson's dismantling of the team, but if the Pack indeed win the SB, I'll give Thompson some credits (although I will also say Mike Sherman has much to do with the win).

As for your second question, I guess Thompson literally didn't went and screw himself after Walker told him to; Thompson has Mike McCarthy to do it for him.

MJZiggy
06-10-2006, 10:38 PM
I'll give Thompson some credits

Where have I heard that before? You can't be trusted.


(although I will also say Mike Sherman has much to do with the win)

Doesn't work that way. If Sherman has no culpability for the bad, he gets no credit for the good.
[/quote]

Anti-Polar Bear
06-10-2006, 10:49 PM
I'll give Thompson some credits

Where have I heard that before? You can't be trusted.


MJ, that was excusable because anybody with $35M should be able to sign multiple "marquee" free agents (other teams'). There is nothing to brag about. Thompson failed because he could only land 1.

Anti-Polar Bear
06-10-2006, 10:54 PM
Doesn't work that way. If Sherman has no culpability for the bad, he gets no credit for the good.


Give Sherman credit for sustaining Ron Wolf's foundation. Pack were only 3-4 players away on defense from winning the SB. Remember, Pack had a top 3 offense the year before Sherman was demoted.

Thompson came along and dismantled the Pack. The rest is 4-12.

MJZiggy
06-10-2006, 10:56 PM
The bet was ONE. I don't care what else he should have done or how much money he had to do it. The bet was ONE. You made the bet, now pay it.

Anti-Polar Bear
06-10-2006, 11:01 PM
The bet was ONE. I don't care what else he should have done or how much money he had to do it. The bet was ONE. You made the bet, now pay it.

I am a man of considerable virtue. I refuse to praise anybody who gives birth to crap like 4-12, at least not until that person gives rise to excellency.

MJZiggy
06-10-2006, 11:03 PM
Their record was 4-12 when you made that bet. That would indicate that you made a bet with no intention of ever paying it--which is not exactly virtuous. My recommendation is that you just pay off this debt as you have no credibility until you do.

Anti-Polar Bear
06-10-2006, 11:07 PM
Their record was 4-12 when you made that bet. That would indicate that you made a bet with no intention of ever paying it--which is not exactly virtuous. My recommendation is that you just pay off this debt as you have no credibility until you do.

Again, my virtue prevents me from doing such.

MJZiggy
06-10-2006, 11:09 PM
A boy who makes bets he will not keep has no virtue. Neither does a boy who claims to be on such a girl chase. Nor does a boy who attacks another man's sexuality (very low blow if you ask me). I see no virtue worth protecting here.

RashanGary
06-10-2006, 11:16 PM
Tank is a damn homo.... :smile:

Anti-Polar Bear
06-10-2006, 11:20 PM
A boy who makes bets he will not keep has no virtue. Neither does a boy who claims to be on such a girl chase. Nor does a boy who attacks another man's sexuality (very low blow if you ask me). I see no virtue worth protecting here.

A boy? According to the philosophical ideology of say, Aristotle, boys lack virtue, much like an infant having no soul. Boys are merely animals who survive through instincts and selfishness.

Men are capable of virtue. I have been a man since I first got laid to a girl at the tender age of 17. I am a man of virtue.

"All virtue is summed up in dealing justly."

MJZiggy
06-10-2006, 11:23 PM
Men keep their promises. Honesty is a virtue. You seem to lack that. You have no virtue. Don't toss your shit at me--it ain't gonna stick. Pay up.

Harlan Huckleby
06-10-2006, 11:25 PM
A boy? According to the philosophical ideology of say, Aristotle, boys lack virtue, much like an infant having no soul. Boys are merely animals who survive through instincts and selfishness.

Do you know how they seperated the men from the boys in ancient greece?

Bretsky
06-10-2006, 11:27 PM
ALL THINGS CONSIDERED, C IS A FAIR RANKING. THIS WOULD BE MY BLOG

Green Bay improved the secondary by making the Woodson splash, and the additions of AJ Hawk and Abdul Hodge makes our LBing core faster, more athletic, and deeper. They also added a lot of depth in the draft and added DL Free Agent Ryan Pickett, who should be a healthier and more reliable option than Grady Jackson.

But Green Bay lost their starting Center and needed to replace three starters. Rather than signing any veteran help, Ted Thompson may pay for being content going into the season with three new OL on the interior of the line. No matter how you spin it, the loss of Javon Walker will hurt this team and whether Green Bay did the right thing or not, they did not get fair market value for a near healthy Javon Walker.

C+

Anti-Polar Bear
06-10-2006, 11:30 PM
Honesty is a virtue

The philosophical ideology of Peter Griffin seems to contradict your statement. According to Griffin, honesty and virtue are two different things.

Here's Griffin's most famous quote:

"One can be dishonest and yet remain virtuous."
Chap. 1, Verse 4, from the book of the Church of the Fonz

Anti-Polar Bear
06-10-2006, 11:39 PM
A boy? According to the philosophical ideology of say, Aristotle, boys lack virtue, much like an infant having no soul. Boys are merely animals who survive through instincts and selfishness.

Do you know how they seperated the men from the boys in ancient greece?

How?

Harlan Huckleby
06-10-2006, 11:43 PM
With a crowbar.

Tank, i think that joke came out of the old testament, right after "why did the chicken cross the road?" I didn't think I had to tell the answer.

Anti-Polar Bear
06-10-2006, 11:45 PM
With a crowbar.

Tank, i think that joke came out of the old testament, right after "why did the chicken cross the road?" I didn't think I had to tell the answer.

Excuse me for my unfamiliarity. I've read the Bible before, but may have missed the part about the chicken.

Travbrew
06-11-2006, 07:03 AM
This is turning out to be one of my favorite threads!
MJ, keep it up. I enjoy watching the boy squirm.
Tank, pay up biatch!!!!

MJZiggy
06-11-2006, 07:14 AM
With a crowbar.

Tank, i think that joke came out of the old testament, right after "why did the chicken cross the road?" I didn't think I had to tell the answer.

Excuse me for my unfamiliarity. I've read the Bible before, but may have missed the part about the chicken.

Then you weren't paying proper attention. I did not make a bet to argue philosophy and I don't care about your definition of virtue. The lesson here is 'don't make bets you don't want to pay.' You made the bet. You have to pay it.

SkinBasket
06-11-2006, 07:48 AM
Tank's assfuckery aside, this list sucks. Any idiot who ranks the Lions an A for picking up a duo of amazingly average QBs, then gives Arizona a B for what they did this offseason, can lick my balls. Twice. Once to clean, once for conditioning.

GoPackGo
06-11-2006, 10:21 AM
These grades are off in my opinion...

example:
Giants: The best protection for Eli Manning is a stout defense, and the Giants likely will be formidable after acquiring linebackers LaVar Arrington and Brandon Short, cornerback Sam Madison and safety Will Demps. The team also lost some defenders, but the balance is positive. Grade: A-

could read like this,

Packers: The best protection for Brett Favre is a stout defense, and the Packers likely will be formidable after acquiring linebackers AJ Hawk, Abdul Hodge,and Ben Taylor, cornerback Charles Woodson and safety Marquand Manual. The team also lost some defenders, (Grady Jackson and Nail Diggs)but the balance is positive. Grade: A-

red
06-11-2006, 10:27 AM
wow, flanny was one of the main reasons the texans got such a good grade, and one of the main reasons we got such a bad grade.

someone needs to inform the rest of the football world that flanny is far from the player he once was

and i agree Jpoop

Harlan Huckleby
06-11-2006, 10:36 AM
Packers: The best protection for Brett Favre is a stout defense, and the Packers likely will be formidable after acquiring linebackers AJ Hawk, Abdul Hodge,and Ben Taylor, cornerback Charles Woodson and safety Marquand Manual. The team also lost some defenders, (Grady Jackson and Nail Diggs)but the balance is positive. Grade: A-

Hodge and Manual may not even be starters, let alone difference makers!

packerpete
06-11-2006, 11:09 AM
MJ, you might as well give up, individuals with severe mental disorders (liberalism) are incapable of coherent mental processes.

The understanding of concepts such as honesty and virtue require mental stability in the sense that the characteristics of virtue and honesty can only be acquired through consistent actions, something the mentally unstable are incapable of.

I have been lurking here for a while, posting infrequently, and for the life of me I cannot figure out why anyone here would ever respond to APB, aka Tank, postings. You all give this individual way too much credit, iggy serves this one best.

GoPackGo
06-11-2006, 11:38 AM
Packers: The best protection for Brett Favre is a stout defense, and the Packers likely will be formidable after acquiring linebackers AJ Hawk, Abdul Hodge,and Ben Taylor, cornerback Charles Woodson and safety Marquand Manual. The team also lost some defenders, (Grady Jackson and Nail Diggs)but the balance is positive. Grade: A-

Hodge and Manual may not even be starters, let alone difference makers!

oh yeah right....right :roll:

Packers: The best protection for Brett Favre is a stout defense, and the Packers likely will be formidable after acquiring linebackers AJ Hawk and Ben Taylor, cornerback Charles Woodson and defensive tackle Ryan Pickett. The team also lost some defenders, (Grady Jackson and Nail Diggs)but the balance is positive. Grade: A-

Bossman641
06-11-2006, 11:46 AM
I'd grade the Packers' offseason a C+ or B-

This article, and the NFl in general, seem to give Flanagan too much credit . Losing him won't be a big deal. The thing that really hurts, and drags our grade down, is losing Walker. No matter how you feel about him, he is a difference maker. You don't acquire players like him often. That whole situation sucked.

Bretsky
06-11-2006, 12:18 PM
MJ, you might as well give up, individuals with severe mental disorders (liberalism) are incapable of coherent mental processes.

The understanding of concepts such as honesty and virtue require mental stability in the sense that the characteristics of virtue and honesty can only be acquired through consistent actions, something the mentally unstable are incapable of.

I have been lurking here for a while, posting infrequently, and for the life of me I cannot figure out why anyone here would ever respond to APB, aka Tank, postings. You all give this individual way too much credit, iggy serves this one best.

LMAO; I fall victim to believing that if I map out facts for Tank he can conform his views. But every time I think I'm doing it, he plays his generalization trump card and states, Sherman was never 4-12 as a GM

Charles Woodson
06-11-2006, 03:31 PM
Packers: The best protection for Brett Favre is a stout defense, and the Packers likely will be formidable after acquiring linebackers AJ Hawk, Abdul Hodge,and Ben Taylor, cornerback Charles Woodson and safety Marquand Manual. The team also lost some defenders, (Grady Jackson and Nail Diggs)but the balance is positive. Grade: A-

Hodge and Manual may not even be starters, let alone difference makers!

U sure about Manual? i heard reviews that he was doin amazing in OTA's he was making changes and was becoming a leader. I also heard roman was doin 2nd team so...

Patler
06-11-2006, 03:41 PM
I have been lurking here for a while, posting infrequently, and for the life of me I cannot figure out why anyone here would ever respond to APB, aka Tank, postings. You all give this individual way too much credit, iggy serves this one best.

I have decided that as well a short time back. I seldom read threads he starts, and I generally just skip over his comments in the threads I am following. He has only one tune, and sings it over and over and over.

Anti-Polar Bear
06-11-2006, 04:01 PM
I have decided that as well a short time back. I seldom read threads he starts, and I generally just skip over his comments in the threads I am following. He has only one tune, and sings it over and over and over.

Right back at ya, Patler. :wink:

Anti-Polar Bear
06-11-2006, 04:04 PM
MJ, you might as well give up, individuals with severe mental disorders (liberalism) are incapable of coherent mental processes.

The understanding of concepts such as honesty and virtue require mental stability in the sense that the characteristics of virtue and honesty can only be acquired through consistent actions, something the mentally unstable are incapable of.

I have been lurking here for a while, posting infrequently, and for the life of me I cannot figure out why anyone here would ever respond to APB, aka Tank, postings. You all give this individual way too much credit, iggy serves this one best.

Pete, thou dull moor. Where hath thee sense of humor gone? :mrgreen:

I guess only Harlan Huckleby knew I was joking about the virtue stuff on previous pages. Dont anybody notice I made reference to Peter Griffin. Peter Griffin?

MJZiggy
06-11-2006, 04:36 PM
Great it was a joke. So pay up already.

woodbuck27
06-11-2006, 04:55 PM
Honesty is a virtue

The philosophical ideology of Peter Griffin seems to contradict your statement. According to Griffin, honesty and virtue are two different things.

Here's Griffin's most famous quote:

"One can be dishonest and yet remain virtuous."
Chap. 1, Verse 4, from the book of the Church of the Fonz

Heavens Tank you really are an example of what it means to be an enlightened man, and yet it's my fairest observation that so few on this forum understand you for your special genious.

Tank. It's alarming sometimes, that many don't get a real grip on you. A virtual modern day Plato ,with so much to teach all members here, and a man of virtue no less, that should never be underminded or judged as inferior in any way, in your stances and fair and honest insight.

You have so much Tank . . . to teach so many. The question that begs to be answered is:

Do you really have enough time for those who misunderstand you so.

May I encourage your strength.

Anti-Polar Bear
06-11-2006, 05:51 PM
Heavens Tank you really are an example of what it means to be an enlightened man, and yet it's my fairest observation that so few on this forum understand you for your special genious.

Tank. It's alarming sometimes, that many don't get a real grip on you. A virtual modern day Plato ,with so much to teach all members here, and a man of virtue no less, that should never be underminded or judged as inferior in any way, in your stances and fair and honest insight.

You have so much Tank . . . to teach so many. The question that begs to be answered is:

Do you really have enough time for those who misunderstand you so.

May I encourage your strength.

Woodbuck, thank you very much for the kind words. :mrgreen:

packerpete
06-11-2006, 05:59 PM
Heavens Tank you really are an example of what it means to be an enlightened man, and yet it's my fairest observation that so few on this forum understand you for your special genious.

Tank. It's alarming sometimes, that many don't get a real grip on you. A virtual modern day Plato ,with so much to teach all members here, and a man of virtue no less, that should never be underminded or judged as inferior in any way, in your stances and fair and honest insight.

You have so much Tank . . . to teach so many. The question that begs to be answered is:

Do you really have enough time for those who misunderstand you so.

May I encourage your strength.

Woodbuck, thank you very much for the kind words. :mrgreen:

Wow, talk about not understanding sarcasm...

Anti-Polar Bear
06-11-2006, 06:05 PM
Wow, talk about not understanding sarcasm...

Talk about not understanding the forum. Woodbuck and I go all the way back to the days when Scott Campbell was waging war on words.

But, new guy, i never got the chance to say it so i;ll say it here. Welcome to the forum. I'll add you to the list of most likely to get pissed off. Your second on the list next to the the old man, what his name again, oh yeah the Kentucky. Welcome! :)

Harlan Huckleby
06-11-2006, 06:09 PM
Wow, talk about not understanding sarcasm...

Read Woody's words with a Canadian accent and it is easier to realize he is being sincere.

woodbuck27
06-11-2006, 06:30 PM
Wow, talk about not understanding sarcasm...

Read Woody's words with a Canadian accent and it is easier to realize he is being sincere.


Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahah!!!!!!

woodbuck27
06-11-2006, 06:37 PM
Heavens Tank you really are an example of what it means to be an enlightened man, and yet it's my fairest observation that so few on this forum understand you for your special genious.

Tank. It's alarming sometimes, that many don't get a real grip on you. A virtual modern day Plato ,with so much to teach all members here, and a man of virtue no less, that should never be underminded or judged as inferior in any way, in your stances and fair and honest insight.

You have so much Tank . . . to teach so many. The question that begs to be answered is:

Do you really have enough time for those who misunderstand you so.

May I encourage your strength.

Woodbuck, thank you very much for the kind words. :mrgreen:

Tank. It's a wealthy man indeed that is privaleged to understand the TRUTH and the VALUE , all the rewards . . .of virtuosity.

So you lost your virginity at 17 years of age Eh ! Only an honest man can insight the conditions to make that possible, at such a virtuous age.

:shock: + :idea: :arrow: :oops: or :cool:

That was a jumping high five moment ,you'll certainly being you, truly cherish and respect Tank.

Noodle
06-12-2006, 04:28 PM
Bretsky, I think you nailed it. I'm enthusiastic about the season, and I'm hopeful good things will happen this season, but when you break it down, a C+ is probably fair and accurate, for the reasons Bretsky states.

Tank, this ain't my battle, but when a woman tells a man he lost a bet to her, then a man cheerfully pays up, regardless of merits. This is one of the basics of Man Law -- Peter Griffin would immediately understand.