Samkon Gado - a starter at RB ? An Article.

[woodbuck27]

Does Samkon Gado have what it takes to be a legit starter?

Written by Rick Cina - PackerChatters Staff
Wednesday, 14 June 2006

I know this opinion probably isn't popular here, and I am hoping I'm dead wrong about this, but I'm still unsold on Samkon Gado, and am not necessarily surprised that Noah Herron has recently been getting reps with the first unit instead of him in these voluntary practices.

From everything I've seen, read, and heard, Gado hasn't struck me as a guy who "gets it" naturally, who has the instincts to do the right thing at the right time, such as to cut back when he should or hit a hole that he should or to have the patience to anticipate when the linemen will shift in front of him like he should.

To me, it's not about intelligence or the ability to learn as much as it's about vision and instincts, and I do believe that those things aren't something that can be significantly improved with reps and coaching and teaching. I'm afraid that those few really good games he had last year will turn out to be flukes, not signs of things to come. I'm also worried about his fumbling from last year, and that in the heat of the moment he won't just naturally grip the ball where or how he should again this year.

Gado is a feel-good story and I really like the guy, but I still don't think he has the It that it takes to play at a high level in the NFL.

Again, hope I'm wrong. I've already been wrong about Donald Driver. I thought his 2002 season was a fluke, as good players usually flash more than he did early, or from '99 to '01. I was also wrong about Al Harris, as I thought he was a penalty-prone, mediocre cover corner with 4.6 speed as of the end of '03 (well, he does have only 4.6 speed).

We'll see how '06 goes at the RB position. I've just been a little retentive with my usual optimism with regard to Gado.


Comment fr. woodbuck27: I believe with his intelligence and work ethic that Samkon can be OUR starter, as he certainly showed us alot last season. Is this just another matter of trying desperetly to find something to write about ?

[Patler]

No. It's a legitimate concern. It must be legitimate, because I've been saying the same thing all off season! :lol:

I, too, hope that I am wrong, but being a topflight runningback has very little to do with intelligence (as long as you have enough to understand the playbook). I truly believe for backs it is more of a god-given instinct than a learned skill.

Don't get me wrong on this. Even if I'm right in what I think about Gado, it doesn't mean he won't be an asset to the team as a backup. I think he can be. I'm just not convinced there is enough in his game to be the featured back in an offense that wants to emphasize running.

[pbmax]

woodbuck, its way too early to draw a conclusions as the author implies, but its a legit concern. Gado struggled with a zone scheme at Liberty in college, so this could be year 2, 3 or 4 with these types of reads and he is still learning.

Normally I wouldn't agree with the author that you can't learn something that may be instinctive to another by repetition. But Gado has had a lot of reps.

It might snap for him when he starts to see it live, but for now, you'd have to say he is still a project in this scheme.

[Polaris]

One good game can be a fluke. Maybe even two.

But Samkon Gado had a string of pretty good games last year. If you extrapolate his numbers from 8 games last year to a full season, he 'd have had nearly 1200 yards which is a pretty solid number.

Running back is unique among all the positions on offense because when it gets right down to it, it's a reactive position. You are reacting to what you see in front of you. Cut right, cut left, lower your head and ram it forward.

Samkon Gado is a man of intelligence and character with an unquestioned work ethic. And he's big and fast, which doesn't hurt. Right now, in shorts, he's maybe thinking too much, but once the pads go on I believe we'll see the real Samkon Gado.

As an aside, if Ahman Green is healthy then Gado is not our #1 back. That means that he'll only be called upon to carry the ball 8-10 times/game while Ahman is resting. And if Ahman isn't healthy, and we're relying on Gado/Davenport/Herron to carry the mail, then we're probably in a bad situation anyway.

At this point, I'm not concerned about Samkon Gado because I believe that once the pads go on he'll demonstrate that he's more than adequate to be a backup RB for the Packers this year. As for the question that Rick Cina posited in his article..."Does He Have What it Takes to Be a Starter"?, I'm afraid that's an open question at this time and one that may not be answered this year. I could ask the same question about all of our running backs: Does Ahman Green (still) have what it takes? Does Najeh Davenport? Does Noah Herron?

It is apparent that Ted Thompson's plan for rebuilding this team is to fix the offensive line BEFORE he invests a lot of resources in a running back. Although that makes sense on a couple of levels, it does mean that we're going to have an uncertain running back situation this year, and that as a result we could easily struggle on offense this year, because uncertain running back situation + inexperienced line = trouble moving the ball and an overreliance on the pass.

But I suspect that we won't start to get answers to any of this until the exhibition season starts.

[woodbuck27]

"It might snap for him when he starts to see it live, but for now, you'd have to say he is still a project in this scheme." pbmax

The way I see it. Adopting the ZBS, and with the NFL inexperience we have in the middle of OUR OL, makes it a project for the entire offence.

What I saw from Gado last season was a RB that had a tendency to :

1. fumble the ball.

2. Have some difficulty waiting for a hole to open up for him. He certainly showed us a burst once he found that hole, thus he had some impressive gains running the ball.

I feel that with the effort he'll put into it, he will show us more of what we saw last season.Will he at least, be a better #3 RB than we saw in Tony Fischer? I think he will.

I'm looking forward to seeing Najeh Davenport utilized some at FB, to back up William Henderson in that spot. I see little promise from Vonta Leach @ FB. Leach simply struggles alot to make a catch, which isn't acceptable.

[woodbuck27]

One good game can be a fluke. Maybe even two.

But Samkon Gado had a string of pretty good games last year. If you extrapolate his numbers from 8 games last year to a full season, he 'd have had nearly 1200 yards which is a pretty solid number.

Running back is unique among all the positions on offense because when it gets right down to it, it's a reactive position. You are reacting to what you see in front of you. Cut right, cut left, lower your head and ram it forward.

Samkon Gado is a man of intelligence and character with an unquestioned work ethic. And he's big and fast, which doesn't hurt. Right now, in shorts, he's maybe thinking too much, but once the pads go on I believe we'll see the real Samkon Gado.

As an aside, if Ahman Green is healthy then Gado is not our #1 back. That means that he'll only be called upon to carry the ball 8-10 times/game while Ahman is resting. And if Ahman isn't healthy, and we're relying on Gado/Davenport/Herron to carry the mail, then we're probably in a bad situation anyway.

At this point, I'm not concerned about Samkon Gado because I believe that once the pads go on he'll demonstrate that he's more than adequate to be a backup RB for the Packers this year. As for the question that Rick Cina posited in his article..."Does He Have What it Takes to Be a Starter"?, I'm afraid that's an open question at this time and one that may not be answered this year. I could ask the same question about all of our running backs: Does Ahman Green (still) have what it takes? Does Najeh Davenport? Does Noah Herron?

It is apparent that Ted Thompson's plan for rebuilding this team is to fix the offensive line BEFORE he invests a lot of resources in a running back. Although that makes sense on a couple of levels, it does mean that we're going to have an uncertain running back situation this year, and that as a result we could easily struggle on offense this year, because uncertain running back situation + inexperienced line = trouble moving the ball and an overreliance on the pass.

But I suspect that we won't start to get answers to any of this until the exhibition season starts.



Solid post! You hit the nail on the head Polaris. Once the pads go on and Samkon can really do it he'll demonstrate that power and quickness again. He's out there thinking and playing in slow motion now.

[Scott Campbell]

Gado was finding holes behind the same line that Green struggled with last year. He can't be that bad.

[Patler]

One good game can be a fluke. Maybe even two.

But Samkon Gado had a string of pretty good games last year. If you extrapolate his numbers from 8 games last year to a full season, he 'd have had nearly 1200 yards which is a pretty solid number.



Well if by "a string" you mean 3, maybe you are correct. Let's look at Gados season in more detail:

Cin. 1/8
Pitt. 26/62 (2.4 avg.)
Atl. 25/103 (4.1)
Min 10/7 (0.07)
Phil. 26/111 (4.3)
Chi. 20/75 (3.8)
Det. 29/171 (5.9)
Balt. 6/45 (7.5)

So, he rolled up yardage against Atlanta, Philadelphia, and Detroit, which had the 26th, 21st 24th ranked rushing defenses. Philadelphia, the best of the bunch gave up 118 yards/game. Detroit and Atlanta gave up 128 and 129, respectively. Gado had good games against bad defenses.

I'm not putting it all on Gado, obviously if the line doesn't block (and there is evidence they did not!) no back will do well against better defenses.. My only point is that Gado still has to demonstrate he can be a featured back.

As far as being a "3rd down back" I'm not sure he is better than Fisher was. Generally you want a few things out of your third down back. He must be assignment-sure (recognition as the play developes), he must be solid in pass protection and he should be a good receiver. Running ability is almost secondary. Fisher was pretty good at the first three. He didn't give much as a runner. While Gado showed improvement even in his short stay last year, he did not look to be particularly talented in pass protection or as a receiver.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Gado was finding holes behind the same line that Green struggled with last year. He can't be that bad.

Yes, and what's more you could see him getting dramatically better as the year went along.

I don't believe much of what people say in preseason, at least not until after a couple preseason games.

[Patler]

Gado was finding holes behind the same line that Green struggled with last year. He can't be that bad.

Not exactly. When Gado started playing, Wells replaced Klemm, Ruegamer was playing more in place of Whittaker, and Flanagan was back from surgery and seemingly was playing better than early in the season.

Plus, Green simply wasn't healthy, he had a gimpy leg. After he was done for the season, one article pointed out that they actually contemplated the surgery during the off season, but because of the seriousness and uncertainty of it, they agreed to give the season a try first. When it let go completely the decision was made for them.

[MJZiggy]

So many people want to remind us that Gado had a fumbling problem last year. Have we all forgotten that someone named Ahman Green had a horrible fumbling problem his first couple of years and had a reputation around the league for laying it on the turf? He turned out pretty well. Do we also remember that Herron averaged (!) 2.7 yards per carry last year after Sam got hurt? That would be behind the same line at the same time of year as Samkon was running so the argument that the o-line was worse doesn't hold. I've always had a good feeling about young Samkon and that feeling has not wavered. He will be fine this season.

[Patler]

So many people want to remind us that Gado had a fumbling problem last year. Have we all forgotten that someone named Ahman Green had a horrible fumbling problem his first couple of years and had a reputation around the league for laying it on the turf? He turned out pretty well. Do we also remember that Herron averaged (!) 2.7 yards per carry last year after Sam got hurt? That would be behind the same line at the same time of year as Samkon was running so the argument that the o-line was worse doesn't hold. I've always had a good feeling about young Samkon and that feeling has not wavered. He will be fine this season.

Well, nobody is saying Herron is starting material either. Lets look at his year:

Balt 8/27 (3.4)
Chi 14/33 (2.4)
Sea. 23/61 (2.7)

Both played against Baltimore. Gado broke one long one, Herron didn't.

Both played against Chicago. Gado was better, but not great and had almost 50% more carries than Herron (20/14 carries).

Seattle was 5th in the league in rushing defense. Herron was 23/61 (2.7)
Pittsburgh was 3rd in rushing defense. Gado was 26/62 (2.4)

Fumbles - gado had 4 in 153 touches or one every 38.25. Green has averaged one fumble every 59.75 touches over his career.. Now granted, you can pick 8 game stretches when Green probably fumbled even more, but just as it has always been a concern with Green, it is with Gado too. If he can consistently put up numbers like Green in rushing and receiving, his fumbles will be overlooked too.

[The Leaper]

One good game can be a fluke. Maybe even two.

But Samkon Gado had a string of pretty good games last year. If you extrapolate his numbers from 8 games last year to a full season, he'd have had nearly 1200 yards which is a pretty solid number.

I don't consider a handful of good games against very mediocre run defenses who were clearly targeting the containment of Favre and the passing game as a barometer of what Gado is going to do long term.


Running back is unique among all the positions on offense because when it gets right down to it, it's a reactive position. You are reacting to what you see in front of you. Cut right, cut left, lower your head and ram it forward.

IMO, it is mostly about vision and instinct. All of the great RBs have these two qualities in common, even if their size and speed is not comparable. That is why you always hear them talk about "feel" when discussing how they run. That is really the combination of vision and instinct...you see something and you know how to react to it without thinking. I suppose repetition can somewhat produce that quality over a long period of time...but by and large it is something you either are born with or will never really develop fully.

Gado probably can be a very serviceable reserve RB in the NFL. I highly doubt he will ever be a high quality full-time starter. Expecting as much is really ridiculous considering this kid's level of experience and training.

[pbmax]

Just remember, Logan Mankins would have solved all our problems. If you had once shut down Darren Charles in a high school football game, you would understand this.

[Polaris]

It has been pointed out that Gado's achievements did not come against the upper-echelon run defenses in the NFL, and that is true. And it certainly means that it would be sensible to take what he did with a grain of salt, because he may well not be able to duplicate that over a full season against premiere defenses.

But I don't like the "weak opponent" argument to diminish an individual's accomplishments. You can only play the opponent which is scheduled and half of your opponents, on average, are going to be below average.

For example, Brett Favre has thrown 396 TD passes, but if somebody said "yeah, but 249 of them were against below average pass defenses", would it diminish his accomplishment? I don't think so.

Samkon Gado's rookie season is the second best of any Packer running back ever (John Brockington, in 1971, had more carries and more yards). I think that's an auspicious debut made even more auspicious by the fact that he accomplished it in only 8 games.

But back to the POINT made by the author of the original article, Rick Cina. He's asking the question "Does Gado have what it takes to be a starting RB?" I don't believe that's the role he's being considered for by the coaching staff. If Green is healthy enough to go.....and all indications are that he's going to be....then he'll be our starter and Gado will be the backup.

The whole question about Gado falls into the same bucket as a bunch of other questions:

Will our line be OK?
Will McCarthy be a good coach?
Will Favre play under control and return to his form of a few years ago?
Will Ryan Pickett be a suitable replacement for Grady?
Will we have a credible threat opposite Driver?
Will we replace Longwell with a comparable alternative?

At this point in time, regardless of how you feel on any of these questions, it's just something that you're taking on faith. There is very little empirical evidence that would support a conclusion either way. In the end, you simply choose to believe what you want to believe.

So.....I choose to believe that Samkon Gado is going to be just fine once the pads go on. We'll know soon enough one way or another if I'm just engaging in wishful thinking.

[woodbuck27]

Just remember, Logan Mankins would have solved all our problems. If you had once shut down Darren Charles in a high school football game, you would understand this.

Jeeee . . . a deja vu experience.

[The Leaper]

But back to the POINT made by the author of the original article, Rick Cina. He's asking the question "Does Gado have what it takes to be a starting RB?" I don't believe that's the role he's being considered for by the coaching staff. If Green is healthy enough to go.....and all indications are that he's going to be....then he'll be our starter and Gado will be the backup.

I think it is a valid question because of the uncertainties surrounding our RBs. At this point, Gado has just about as much chance of securing the starting RB role as anyone else on the roster...so figuring out if he can carry that burden over 16 games is a valid question IMO. Sure...Green and Davenport probably will be higher on the depth chart if healthy. However, neither is at 100%...and still might not be by Labor Day. Gado's ability to potentially carry the load is a key question heading into training camp.

[Partial]

Just remember, Logan Mankins would have solved all our problems. If you had once shut down Darren Charles in a high school football game, you would understand this.

hey, you have to give tank credit that he sure was right on that one. Mankins is a good, good player and would have helped us a ton last year.

[CaptainKickass]

Just remember, Logan Mankins would have solved all our problems. If you had once shut down Darren Charles in a high school football game, you would understand this.

Jeeee . . . a deja vu experience.

Hey - I've been to DejaVu in 12 different cities and not once have I ever had any football discussions!

[retailguy]

thanks Shamrock for pointing out the obvious - Gado had a different line to run behind, and he had the benefit of not running behind it until the middle of the season.

One of the reasons that Denver is always finding quality running backs is because the OL is always solid. If the OL is opening holes and the back can find them, the team does well. Case in point, Atlanta - Warrick Dunn and TJ Duckett are good backs, but don't put fear into any DC, yet the team led the league in rushing last year (With Vick's Help).

Point is, Gado doesn't need to be a star, he just needs to follow directions. Hell he's Doctor material, he ought to be able to follow orders. Point is, if Green can't go, we've got bigger problems then whether or not Gado can.

Odds would be against both Green & Davenport making it back from injuries and both making the roster. I think the look at Noah Herron does not bode well for Vonta Leach. Quite honestly, if both Davenport and Herron make the roster, both have fullback experience, why do you need Leach? It wouldn't be unreasonable to assume that the backs could be:

Green, Davenport, Gado, Herron & Henderson, with Davenport and Herron splitting the backup fullback role.

If the reports we're reading are sincere, and not some offseason digging for ANYTHING to write about, this might not be a bad deal. I'm still concerned that both Davenport and Green make it back though....

[packrulz]

Gado was fine as a runner but it's the blocking, running routes, and catching I'm concerned about. I disagree with the writer about the reps though, I think he'll get better and better with more reps. Plus, even he admits he was wrong about Driver & Harris.

[CaptainKickass]

Didn't anyone besides me see that sahweeeeeeeet sideline grab from Favre that Gado made down the sideline for like 25+yards. The kid can catch, and catch from #4.

[Patler]

Whats the concern about Davenport? He just cracked a bone is all, wasn't it? No other damage that I recall. No reason he shouldn't recover from that. The biggest question is, how soon before he gets hurt AGAIN!

[Partial]

How old is Najeh now? He's gotta be gettin' up there.

He's a really good backup if he's healthy, probably one of the best in the league. Thats a big if, though.

[Noodle]

So far, it's been a big never.

Not his fault, but somebody laid a voodoo curse on that guy.

Or maybe the closet gods were not amused.

[KYPack]

Just remember, Logan Mankins would have solved all our problems. If you had once shut down Darren Charles in a high school football game, you would understand this.

hey, you have to give tank credit that he sure was right on that one. Mankins is a good, good player and would have helped us a ton last year.

Sure, Tank is a real Nostradamus. He "picked" Mankins AFTER the draft.

I'm a super scout one year after the draft.

Any idiot can look at last years draft and come up with the guys we SHOULD'VE drafted.

Also, props to PB for busting Tank for his bullshit.

[retailguy]

Whats the concern about Davenport? He just cracked a bone is all, wasn't it? No other damage that I recall. No reason he shouldn't recover from that. The biggest question is, how soon before he gets hurt AGAIN!


So Shamrock, if it's just a broken bone, why can't he pass the physical and practice? It has to be more serious than just that....

And, all the critiques are true, the guy has always been messed up, hell he was messed up when he was drafted too....

How can you be 6 foot tall, 250 lbs, bench press 400+ pounds and be fragile. Sheesh.....

[retailguy]

Or maybe the closet gods were not amused.


This is really very funny..... :razz:

[packerpete]

I always look in the Lambeau end zone for a fan with a laundry basket and a sign that says, Lambeau Leap Here Najeh!!

[woodbuck27]

How old is Najeh now? He's gotta be gettin' up there.

He's a really good backup if he's healthy, probably one of the best in the league. Thats a big if, though.

Najeh will be 27 in August.

Considering that Green and Davenport are both coming off serious injury at this point - I rank OUR RBs:

1. Gado 2. Green 3. Davenport 4. Henderson 5. Herron

Looking at the numbers and comparing Gado to Davenport and their starts in the NFL is difficult, as Najeh didn't get a single start in his first two seasons dressing for 23 games. In 116 carries he had a very solid ( 5.1 yard avg.) compared to Samkon's 4.1 yard avg. last season.

Davenport didn't get the quality starts or wasn't pressed into service as Samkon was last season.

Overall I believe that we may be in serious shape at RB with new coaching ,a new ZBS, inexperience in the middle of OUR OL and Green coming off a serious injury, as all major factors.

If Samkon comes through we will all be extremely pleased but it will be because Green isn't ready but OUR OL is doing remarkably well.There has to be trade off's.

Anyone expecting a perfect Packer World in 2006 is blessed with supreme optimism.

I'm pulling for all you fans.I'm also pulling for Samkon Gado.

[Polaris]

[Overall I believe that we may be in serious shape at RB with new coaching ,a new ZBS, inexperience in the middle of OUR OL and Green coming off a serious injury, as all major factors.

If Samkon comes through ......it will be because Green isn't ready but OUR OL is doing remarkably well.There has to be trade off's.

Anyone expecting a perfect Packer World in 2006 is blessed with supreme optimism.



This is my opinion as well, woodbuck27.

[Patler]

So Shamrock, if it's just a broken bone, why can't he pass the physical and practice? It has to be more serious than just that....



Actually, I ead in two different articles that he could practice, but they decided to hold him out until the start of training camp as a precaution.

Have you heard ANYTHING about any injury beside the broken bone?

As I wrote earlier, I don't worry about him recovering from this injury, I just wonder how soon before the next.

[retailguy]

Have you heard ANYTHING about any injury beside the broken bone?




No, but who takes 10 months to recover from a broken ankle? Something is not being talked about.....

[Patler]

Have you heard ANYTHING about any injury beside the broken bone?




No, but who takes 10 months to recover from a broken ankle? Something is not being talked about.....

Well he is running through plays, he's not just standing on the sidelines. At least some photos have shown him running with the ball.

I looked up a couple articles. Apparently he did have a pin or plate put in. Nothing else was mentioned.

[packerpete]

He played in Favres charity softball game, his ankle is fine, they are just not taking any "chances" on getting it rolle dup on too soon.

[mmmdk]

In week one 2006 I'll take those Gado 20/75 (3.8) vs. da Bears yet on carry # 21 Samkon will break one for a 35 yard TD. I'll take it :lol:

I think V. Leach is as good as gone. N. Herron is splitting time at FB too and I believe Noah fits the zone run scheme well. He'll get those 4 yards.

I'm happy to hear that Green is on track to get back but coaches should go easy all the same. Davenport is injury prone but he can plough the pigskin. I hope he stays healthy 'cos he'll be an asset. Oh lastly, Samkon Gado can catch the ball - he showed me plenty natural ability last season plus add reports on Gado's catching. Gado need pads then the thinking will take a backseat to his run instincts.

Plough the pigskin. I love that sentence!

[pittstang5]

I think V. Leach is as good as gone. N. Herron is splitting time at FB too and I believe Noah fits the zone run scheme well. He'll get those 4 yards.



I think you're right (Leach on the way out). From the various reports I've read, the offense doesn't require the bulldozer FB that they used to use. I'm not sure who they'll end up keeping, but I think Noah's chances are improving everyday.

[Patler]

If MM is returning to a more traditional WC approach, the fullback will actually carry the ball some. People forget that Dorsey Levens and Edgar Bennett were in the backfield together in 1995, with Levens at fullback, and before that, for several years Bennett would line up at fullback with several different halfbacks, like Cobb and Thompson. Harry Sidney was a "pure" fullback, but had 50 carries in Holmgren's first year. When Henderson became the starter, he had 39, 31 and 23 rushing attempts his first three seasons while Holmgren was there. Under Rhodes and Sherman he rarely carried.

I could very easily see Davenport, Herron, or someone like that in the backfield with Green or Gado.

[woodbuck27]

"I could very easily see Davenport, Herron, or someone like that in the backfield with Green or Gado." shamrockfan

The question mark there is whether or not their blocking will be adequate. On passing downs, that is where W. Henderson's skills will be needed and a main reason why I feel that William will make OUR 53 - man, come the end of TC.

[Patler]

"I could very easily see Davenport, Herron, or someone like that in the backfield with Green or Gado." shamrockfan

The question mark there is whether or not their blocking will be adequate. On passing downs, that is where W. Henderson's skills will be needed and a main reason why I feel that William will make OUR 53 - man, come the end of TC.

I have no doubt that Henderson will make the final roster, unless there is a tremendous drop off in his play from last year. Green, Gado, Davenport, Henderson and Herron could be the 5 backs.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Packers enter the season with all question marks at running back. They are not particularly dependent on Gado, but SOMEBODY better come through.

I think Thompson would have loved to trade-down, pick-up a blue-chip RB in lower half of first round. But Hawk was too good to pass on. Team has too many holes to upgrade everywhere. We got to hope for best at RB.