Stick a fork in this moron.

[bobblehead]

This is...crap

Care to elaborate or is this the best you've got?

read my above post...but it is crap that wasn't worthy of the response I gave it.

[mraynrand]

Hoosier...my stereotype that blacks stick together...recent polls show obama winning 94-1 in the black vote...your right, i'm flawed..

The Cleveland Plain dealer reported that 98% of Blacks are voting Obama and zero percent McCain. 2% still think Kucinich is running.

[HowardRoark]

Hoosier...my stereotype that blacks stick together...recent polls show obama winning 94-1 in the black vote...your right, i'm flawed..

The Cleveland Plain dealer reported that 98% of Blacks are voting Obama and zero percent McCain. 2% still think Kucinich is running.

......"A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover they can vote themselves largess out of the public treasury." Alexis de Tocqueville

"From that time on the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits" Unattributed, various

.....and Gerald Ford too:

"A government big enough to give you everything you want is a government big enough to take from you everything you have."

[bobblehead]

Hoosier...my stereotype that blacks stick together...recent polls show obama winning 94-1 in the black vote...your right, i'm flawed..

The Cleveland Plain dealer reported that 98% of Blacks are voting Obama and zero percent McCain. 2% still think Kucinich is running.

......"A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover they can vote themselves largess out of the public treasury." Alexis de Tocqueville

"From that time on the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits" Unattributed, various

.....and Gerald Ford too:

"A government big enough to give you everything you want is a government big enough to take from you everything you have."

isn't the last one thomas jefferson?? I haven't looked it up in a long time.

[HowardRoark]

Hoosier...my stereotype that blacks stick together...recent polls show obama winning 94-1 in the black vote...your right, i'm flawed..

The Cleveland Plain dealer reported that 98% of Blacks are voting Obama and zero percent McCain. 2% still think Kucinich is running.

......"A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover they can vote themselves largess out of the public treasury." Alexis de Tocqueville

"From that time on the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits" Unattributed, various

.....and Gerald Ford too:

"A government big enough to give you everything you want is a government big enough to take from you everything you have."

isn't the last one thomas jefferson?? I haven't looked it up in a long time.

There seems to be some debate on this subject, but from what Ihave read, I think it's ford.

[texaspackerbacker]

It's not so much "blacks sticking together" as it is"blacks displaying subservience" to so-called black leaders--those I refer to as the "overseers of the liberal plantation".

We all know black people. Ask yourself, do ALL of them or even 90%+ seem hung up on getting a black candidate elected? Probably not.

Do they seem ideologically similar to Obama--disdainful of America? in favor of surrender in Iraq? opposed to harsh treatment of terrorist prisoners? Pro-abortion? Pro-homosexuality? Does that sound like the black people you know?

Decent well-meaning people who blindly follow the recommendation of their pastor or local NAACP or other black leader? Yeah, that sounds a whole lot more like the black people I know.

THAT is the reason for the bloc voting of black population--not sticking together like co-conspirators, not being ideologically committed to the sick leftist cause, just dutifully following their local and national "leadership".

[mraynrand]

It's not so much "blacks sticking together" as it is"blacks displaying subservience" to so-called black leaders--those I refer to as the "overseers of the liberal plantation".

We all know black people. Ask yourself, do ALL of them or even 90%+ seem hung up on getting a black candidate elected? Probably not.

Do they seem ideologically similar to Obama--disdainful of America? in favor of surrender in Iraq? opposed to harsh treatment of terrorist prisoners? Pro-abortion? Pro-homosexuality? Does that sound like the black people you know?

Decent well-meaning people who blindly follow the recommendation of their pastor or local NAACP or other black leader? Yeah, that sounds a whole lot more like the black people I know.

THAT is the reason for the bloc voting of black population--not sticking together like co-conspirators, not being ideologically committed to the sick leftist cause, just dutifully following their local and national "leadership".

What I see is kind of an OJ effect. A lot of us didn't think OJ was innocent, but it was like payback for all the times the cops pulled over a black man for just being black, being followed by cops on a mostly all white peninsula campus in CA because you're the only black, seeing only blacks on the nightly news only when being put on trial or in an orange jump suit. I know the demographics of crime, but still, the idea of having a person of your same color finally getting the same breaks as whites, getting into the top position of power. That idea trumps everything else. And the long term result for the black community may actually be really good for race relations (as in maybe the benefit would be a lot less talk about race). You have to admit, the second time around for OJ, nobody but OJ was playing the race card.

[mraynrand]

And, here comes the hypocrisy...etc...

At least you tangentially admit it's a non-story.

Which is 100% more than you do.

Your intellectual dishonesty has been noted. Again.

I admitted it was a non-story.

[th87]

It's not so much "blacks sticking together" as it is"blacks displaying subservience" to so-called black leaders--those I refer to as the "overseers of the liberal plantation".

We all know black people. Ask yourself, do ALL of them or even 90%+ seem hung up on getting a black candidate elected? Probably not.

Do they seem ideologically similar to Obama--disdainful of America? in favor of surrender in Iraq? opposed to harsh treatment of terrorist prisoners? Pro-abortion? Pro-homosexuality? Does that sound like the black people you know?

Decent well-meaning people who blindly follow the recommendation of their pastor or local NAACP or other black leader? Yeah, that sounds a whole lot more like the black people I know.

THAT is the reason for the bloc voting of black population--not sticking together like co-conspirators, not being ideologically committed to the sick leftist cause, just dutifully following their local and national "leadership".

So you're saying Black people are being brainwashed somehow by the leadership? Why would that be?

[MJZiggy]

This is...crap

Care to elaborate or is this the best you've got?

read my above post...but it is crap that wasn't worthy of the response I gave it.

I wasn't speaking to you, dear. I was talking to the one who likes to shit in people's threads without adding anything of substance on his own. At least when you call something crap, you add the response whether you think it deserves it or not.

And when Powell talked about steadiness, maybe he was talking about the last debate in which McCain did everything he could think of to rattle and piss off Obama short of punching him in the nose, and he just held calm...

[texaspackerbacker]

It's not so much "blacks sticking together" as it is"blacks displaying subservience" to so-called black leaders--those I refer to as the "overseers of the liberal plantation".

We all know black people. Ask yourself, do ALL of them or even 90%+ seem hung up on getting a black candidate elected? Probably not.

Do they seem ideologically similar to Obama--disdainful of America? in favor of surrender in Iraq? opposed to harsh treatment of terrorist prisoners? Pro-abortion? Pro-homosexuality? Does that sound like the black people you know?

Decent well-meaning people who blindly follow the recommendation of their pastor or local NAACP or other black leader? Yeah, that sounds a whole lot more like the black people I know.

THAT is the reason for the bloc voting of black population--not sticking together like co-conspirators, not being ideologically committed to the sick leftist cause, just dutifully following their local and national "leadership".

So you're saying Black people are being brainwashed somehow by the leadership? Why would that be?

Are you kidding?

To win elections and inflict rotten leftist views, positions, and programs on good normal American people.

Combine these three loathsome ingredients:

The 10-12% edge coming from black racism--90-95% of the 12-14% of the population which is black

The horrendous and undeniable leftward bias of the mainstream media

And something Aynrand alluded to in his earlier O.J. post--the weird psychological defect causing many white people to feel a need to "compensate" for perceived past racism, and vote for blacks--or find O.J. not guilty,

And what do you get? The recipe for success for the Democrat Party in winning elections, even though literally everything they stand for is sickly out of tune with the views, values, and desires of the vast majority of good normal Americans.

[arcilite]

It's not so much "blacks sticking together" as it is"blacks displaying subservience" to so-called black leaders--those I refer to as the "overseers of the liberal plantation".

We all know black people. Ask yourself, do ALL of them or even 90%+ seem hung up on getting a black candidate elected? Probably not.

Do they seem ideologically similar to Obama--disdainful of America? in favor of surrender in Iraq? opposed to harsh treatment of terrorist prisoners? Pro-abortion? Pro-homosexuality? Does that sound like the black people you know?

Decent well-meaning people who blindly follow the recommendation of their pastor or local NAACP or other black leader? Yeah, that sounds a whole lot more like the black people I know.

THAT is the reason for the bloc voting of black population--not sticking together like co-conspirators, not being ideologically committed to the sick leftist cause, just dutifully following their local and national "leadership".

So you're saying Black people are being brainwashed somehow by the leadership? Why would that be?

Are you kidding?

To win elections and inflict rotten leftist views, positions, and programs on good normal American people.

Combine these three loathsome ingredients:

The 10-12% edge coming from black racism--90-95% of the 12-14% of the population which is black

The horrendous and undeniable leftward bias of the mainstream media

And something Aynrand alluded to in his earlier O.J. post--the weird psychological defect causing many white people to feel a need to "compensate" for perceived past racism, and vote for blacks--or find O.J. not guilty,

And what do you get? The recipe for success for the Democrat Party in winning elections, even though literally everything they stand for is sickly out of tune with the views, values, and desires of the vast majority of good normal Americans.


Or maybe you and the rightwingers are out of touch with the majoirty of Americans?

Last I checked Obama is leading the popular vote.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Corrections have yet to appear at USS Neverdock, Atlas Shrugs, Clayton Cramer, American Power, Sweetness & Light, Flopping Aces, and a million other rightwing citizen journalist outlets where the story was disseminated. But don't worry, it'll all be forgotten as soon as they get those new Michelle Obama tapes!

Game, Set, Match.


You might want to check your own sources before you post incorrect items. I only looked to one site. I suspect you're wrong about many of the others. It is your way

http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/atlas_shrugs/2008/10/the-audacity-of.html (Dated Monday Oct 20)

At the time of the post retraction they hadn't. Now, they have. I can't be expected to wallow thru shit all the time.

More to the point, i didn't see you castigating the poster for this type of worthless story. Ooops.

Guess that only works when a liberal does it. :oops:

I didn't have to, because you took care of it. I also didn't know it had been shown to be false. You were incorrect in your facts. Wallow through your own shit sometime so we don't have to.

Wrong again. Their were numerous posts regarding Edwards, Obama, etc..and not one of yours saying that haircuts or food choices aren't important. Nor did i ever comment on Obama and the waldorf. :oops:

false: Of course not. You wouldn't want to actually try and learn. You are perfectly content with the lies being sold to you.

Facts: Not at the time of the postings. Nor were the sites factual or verified. And, they didn't immediately retract.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

And, here comes the hypocrisy...etc...

At least you tangentially admit it's a non-story.

Which is 100% more than you do.

Your intellectual dishonesty has been noted. Again.

I admitted it was a non-story.

Yet, didn't do the same for Edwards hair or Obama's meal.

Intellectual dishonesty.

[texaspackerbacker]

It's not so much "blacks sticking together" as it is"blacks displaying subservience" to so-called black leaders--those I refer to as the "overseers of the liberal plantation".

We all know black people. Ask yourself, do ALL of them or even 90%+ seem hung up on getting a black candidate elected? Probably not.

Do they seem ideologically similar to Obama--disdainful of America? in favor of surrender in Iraq? opposed to harsh treatment of terrorist prisoners? Pro-abortion? Pro-homosexuality? Does that sound like the black people you know?

Decent well-meaning people who blindly follow the recommendation of their pastor or local NAACP or other black leader? Yeah, that sounds a whole lot more like the black people I know.

THAT is the reason for the bloc voting of black population--not sticking together like co-conspirators, not being ideologically committed to the sick leftist cause, just dutifully following their local and national "leadership".

So you're saying Black people are being brainwashed somehow by the leadership? Why would that be?

Are you kidding?

To win elections and inflict rotten leftist views, positions, and programs on good normal American people.

Combine these three loathsome ingredients:

The 10-12% edge coming from black racism--90-95% of the 12-14% of the population which is black

The horrendous and undeniable leftward bias of the mainstream media

And something Aynrand alluded to in his earlier O.J. post--the weird psychological defect causing many white people to feel a need to "compensate" for perceived past racism, and vote for blacks--or find O.J. not guilty,

And what do you get? The recipe for success for the Democrat Party in winning elections, even though literally everything they stand for is sickly out of tune with the views, values, and desires of the vast majority of good normal Americans.


Or maybe you and the rightwingers are out of touch with the majoirty of Americans?

Last I checked Obama is leading the popular vote.

Arcilte, I don't know if you're really black, or if you're just some sick fuck like Tyrone pretending to be--and frankly, I don't care.

But I ask you, looking at it as objectively as possible, going down the issues one by one, do most black people you know:

Have disdain and disrespect for the American military--like Obama?

Want America to lose in Iraq--like Obama?

Oppose all the things that have protected us from repeats of 9/11--enhanced security, harsh interrogation and confinement of probable terrorists, and taking the War on Terror to the enemy's region of the world--like Obama?

Favor the promotion of homosexuality as a morally equivalent alternative--like Obama?

Favor abortion at all times of the pregnancy--even to the point of withholding care for botched aborted fetuses that come out alive--like Obama? (He actually voted for that in the Illinois legislature.)

Favor higher taxes on incomes all the way down to $42,000 a year--like Obama? (He voted for that, too.)

Excuse association with an unrepentant terrorist who bombed the Pentagon and NYC police station, killed cops, and STILL expressed America-hate and claimed he wished he'd done more terrorist acts, as recently as 1999 well after he helped Obama get his start in politics?

Excuse association with a rabble rousing minister spewing America-hate--like Obama? I don't think more than a tiny minority of blacks have the vile America-hating attitude of Wright--and by proxy, Obama. Do you think that's a majority view among blacks?

Brainwashed is pretty strong language, but the bottom line is that hell yeah, 90-95% of blacks allow their to be delivered by their liberal overseers on the liberal plantation to leftist politicians--white more often than black--whose views, values, and positions are contrary to the majority of blacks. Would you actually DISPUTE that?

[Zool]

Arcilte, I don't know if you're really black, or if you're just some sick fuck like Tyrone pretending to be--and frankly, I don't care.

Name caller.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Actually, quite correct.

Many women have told me i'm a sick fuck as they smoked a cig post coital!

[mraynrand]

And, here comes the hypocrisy...etc...

At least you tangentially admit it's a non-story.

Which is 100% more than you do.

Your intellectual dishonesty has been noted. Again.

I admitted it was a non-story.

Yet, didn't do the same for Edwards hair or Obama's meal.

Intellectual dishonesty.

Yes I did. And just because they aren't stories of substance doesn't mean they aren't funny (except if false). I didn't need to know about Edwards' hair cut to know he was a scoundrel. Didn't matter, but it was funny as hell. I didn't need to 'know about the Lobster and caviar' to know that Obama is an elitist, but it would have been ironic/funny if true. Etc. etc. about Clinton.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

More of your spinning.

I'm sure you were able to discern Michelle Obama was an elitist from exactly...what again?

You have no shame.

[arcilite]

That michelle obama story about her ordering room service was fake.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

That michelle obama story about her ordering room service was fake.

We know that.

[HowardRoark]

That michelle obama story about her ordering room service was fake.

We know that.

Elitist.

[arcilite]

That michelle obama story about her ordering room service was fake.

We know that.

i like to point out the obvious.

it makes me feel smart.

[mraynrand]

More of your spinning.

I'm sure you were able to discern Michelle Obama was an elitist from exactly...what again?

You have no shame.

Spinning, Shame. Good rebuttals.

Michelle Obama? I was talking about good old "Clinging to their guns and religon" Barack. But OK Michele:

“Barack is one of the smartest people you will ever encounter who will deign to enter this messy thing called politics.”

"That is why I am here, because Barack Obama is the only person in this who understands that. That before we can work on the problems, we have to fix our souls. Our souls are broken in this nation."

“Iowa will make the difference. If Barack
doesn’t win Iowa, it is just a dream. If we win Iowa, then we can move to the world as it should be.”

"Let me tell you something. For the first time in my adult lifetime, I am really proud of my country, and not just because Barack has done well, but because I think people are hungry for change.”

America is "just downright mean." and "guided by fear"


Hmmm... from someone whose salary went from $121,910 to $316,962 (2004 to 2005) after Barack started in the Senate and as a family made $1.67 million allowing them to hire a full time housekeeper and Michele to get a personal trainer. Nope, no elitism there.

[SkinBasket]

I put one of those political signs in my yard today because I want to see if my black neighbors will attack it.

[packinpatland]

More of your spinning.

I'm sure you were able to discern Michelle Obama was an elitist from exactly...what again?

You have no shame.

Spinning, Shame. Good rebuttals.

Michelle Obama? I was talking about good old "Clinging to their guns and religon" Barack. But OK Michele:

“Barack is one of the smartest people you will ever encounter who will deign to enter this messy thing called politics.”

"That is why I am here, because Barack Obama is the only person in this who understands that. That before we can work on the problems, we have to fix our souls. Our souls are broken in this nation."

“Iowa will make the difference. If Barack
doesn’t win Iowa, it is just a dream. If we win Iowa, then we can move to the world as it should be.”

"Let me tell you something. For the first time in my adult lifetime, I am really proud of my country, and not just because Barack has done well, but because I think people are hungry for change.”

America is "just downright mean." and "guided by fear"


Hmmm... from someone whose salary went from $121,910 to $316,962 (2004 to 2005) after Barack started in the Senate and as a family made $1.67 million allowing them to hire a full time housekeeper and Michele to get a personal trainer. Nope, no elitism there.

No tanning bed????? :lol:

[packinpatland]

"Hmmm... from someone whose salary went from $121,910 to $316,962 (2004 to 2005) after Barack started in the Senate and as a family made $1.67 million allowing them to hire a full time housekeeper and Michele to get a personal trainer. Nope, no elitism there."


35 years ago, just out of college, my husband and I made a combined income of $15,000. WhooHooo. We've come a long way since then. Worked hard for what we've got.........should I still take the bus, sew my own clothes, wear shoes way past their prime? We have gone back to driving a car the size of our first one (which was a Gremlin).
You need a different definition of elitism.....even Palin wouldn't agree with yours.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I put one of those political signs in my yard today because I want to see if my black neighbors will attack it.

you have black neighbors!?

i'm guessing more tan or brown. Most cities in WI are pretty segregated.

[SkinBasket]

I put one of those political signs in my yard today because I want to see if my black neighbors will attack it.

you have black neighbors!?

i'm guessing more tan or brown. Most cities in WI are pretty segregated.

The house across the street. They sport a giant Hummer with big ass rims in the driveway. The house down the street has less stereotypical blacks in it. They still have an Obama sign out though, so they haven't forgotten their roots.

We also have a couple Hindus and an Asian family withing walking distance. Our neighborhood is a model for the rest of the world in how to get along by ignoring each other. At least until Nutz rolls in and starts freaking out the neighbors by trying to get in the wrong house.

I almost forgot, some Arabs just moved out too. We all feel safer now.

[Deputy Nutz]

I am the boogy man.

Black people steal things, you should hook up tiny jumper cables to the sign so when they go to steal it, they get a shock of a life time. Not just black people though that would be a hate crime so use good judgement, you can't just choose to shock the theiving black, you have to shock the stealing hindu as well, even a liberal ass cracker needs to be shocked, then you are ok, no hate crime.



proceed.

[Cheesehead Craig]

All politicans are eliteists. They all make a ton of money and look down on everyone else.

Now, off to hook up those jumper cables...

[mraynrand]

"Hmmm... from someone whose salary went from $121,910 to $316,962 (2004 to 2005) after Barack started in the Senate and as a family made $1.67 million allowing them to hire a full time housekeeper and Michele to get a personal trainer. Nope, no elitism there."


35 years ago, just out of college, my husband and I made a combined income of $15,000. WhooHooo. We've come a long way since then. Worked hard for what we've got.........should I still take the bus, sew my own clothes, wear shoes way past their prime? We have gone back to driving a car the size of our first one (which was a Gremlin).
You need a different definition of elitism.....even Palin wouldn't agree with yours.

You really read through the quotes, didn't you. It's the totality. And yes, sew your clothes, you lazy....

[packinpatland]

All signs show your party is not doing well......house seats as well as the presidential race. If attacking me makes you feel better, that's fine.

[texaspackerbacker]

Arcilite. I didn't have you pegged as an all out WUSS like most of our forum leftists. Yet I didn't get a response from you.

I ask again, whether or not you personally are really black, does being on the wrong/leftist side of all the issue here sound like most black people you know? Or is it true that 90-95% of black voters really ARE being kept "down on the liberal plantation" by their overseers--the so-called black leadership--that dutifully deliver their votes to the leftist candidates?







It's not so much "blacks sticking together" as it is"blacks displaying subservience" to so-called black leaders--those I refer to as the "overseers of the liberal plantation".

We all know black people. Ask yourself, do ALL of them or even 90%+ seem hung up on getting a black candidate elected? Probably not.

Do they seem ideologically similar to Obama--disdainful of America? in favor of surrender in Iraq? opposed to harsh treatment of terrorist prisoners? Pro-abortion? Pro-homosexuality? Does that sound like the black people you know?

Decent well-meaning people who blindly follow the recommendation of their pastor or local NAACP or other black leader? Yeah, that sounds a whole lot more like the black people I know.

THAT is the reason for the bloc voting of black population--not sticking together like co-conspirators, not being ideologically committed to the sick leftist cause, just dutifully following their local and national "leadership".

So you're saying Black people are being brainwashed somehow by the leadership? Why would that be?

Are you kidding?

To win elections and inflict rotten leftist views, positions, and programs on good normal American people.

Combine these three loathsome ingredients:

The 10-12% edge coming from black racism--90-95% of the 12-14% of the population which is black

The horrendous and undeniable leftward bias of the mainstream media

And something Aynrand alluded to in his earlier O.J. post--the weird psychological defect causing many white people to feel a need to "compensate" for perceived past racism, and vote for blacks--or find O.J. not guilty,

And what do you get? The recipe for success for the Democrat Party in winning elections, even though literally everything they stand for is sickly out of tune with the views, values, and desires of the vast majority of good normal Americans.


Or maybe you and the rightwingers are out of touch with the majoirty of Americans?

Last I checked Obama is leading the popular vote.

Arcilte, I don't know if you're really black, or if you're just some sick fuck like Tyrone pretending to be--and frankly, I don't care.

But I ask you, looking at it as objectively as possible, going down the issues one by one, do most black people you know:

Have disdain and disrespect for the American military--like Obama?

Want America to lose in Iraq--like Obama?

Oppose all the things that have protected us from repeats of 9/11--enhanced security, harsh interrogation and confinement of probable terrorists, and taking the War on Terror to the enemy's region of the world--like Obama?

Favor the promotion of homosexuality as a morally equivalent alternative--like Obama?

Favor abortion at all times of the pregnancy--even to the point of withholding care for botched aborted fetuses that come out alive--like Obama? (He actually voted for that in the Illinois legislature.)

Favor higher taxes on incomes all the way down to $42,000 a year--like Obama? (He voted for that, too.)

Excuse association with an unrepentant terrorist who bombed the Pentagon and NYC police station, killed cops, and STILL expressed America-hate and claimed he wished he'd done more terrorist acts, as recently as 1999 well after he helped Obama get his start in politics?

Excuse association with a rabble rousing minister spewing America-hate--like Obama? I don't think more than a tiny minority of blacks have the vile America-hating attitude of Wright--and by proxy, Obama. Do you think that's a majority view among blacks?

Brainwashed is pretty strong language, but the bottom line is that hell yeah, 90-95% of blacks allow their to be delivered by their liberal overseers on the liberal plantation to leftist politicians--white more often than black--whose views, values, and positions are contrary to the majority of blacks. Would you actually DISPUTE that?

[HowardRoark]

I ask again, whether or not you personally are really black, does being on the wrong/leftist side of all the issue here sound like most black people you know?

I have a feeling he is not black....I think I'm the only black person here.

[Cheesehead Craig]

I ask again, whether or not you personally are really black, does being on the wrong/leftist side of all the issue here sound like most black people you know?

I have a feeling he is not black....I think I'm the only black person here.
I thought I was the only black guy here.

[MJZiggy]

No, that's me.

[packinpatland]

I ask again, whether or not you personally are really black, does being on the wrong/leftist side of all the issue here sound like most black people you know?

I have a feeling he is not black....I think I'm the only black person here.

You mean 'Black Sheep'.......... :lol:

[Tyrone Bigguns]

I'm SPARTACUS!!!

[texaspackerbacker]

Hopefully, arcilite, leftist that he is, is NOT as SHALLOW as a lot of pathetic individuals in here, whehter they show up once in a while as lefties or righties.

The INCIPID merit less respect even than those sincerely on the wrong side of the spectrum.

[MJZiggy]

Well, this should just about finish him off...

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/the-trail/2008/10/24/john_elways_helps_mccain_kick.html?hpid=topnews

[MJZiggy]

Maybe we need a different fork?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/10/23/AR2008102302869.html?tid=informbox

[arcilite]

Hopefully, arcilite, leftist that he is, is NOT as SHALLOW as a lot of pathetic individuals in here, whehter they show up once in a while as lefties or righties.

The INCIPID merit less respect even than those sincerely on the wrong side of the spectrum.

Don't be too quick to call me a leftist.

I prefer the term independent.

I own lots of guns and love going hunting and i like to be fiscally conservative.

but i also support abortion.

I also supported Bush in 2000 and 2004. I thought Kerry was a dweeb.

[HowardRoark]

Hopefully, arcilite, leftist that he is, is NOT as SHALLOW as a lot of pathetic individuals in here, whehter they show up once in a while as lefties or righties.

The INCIPID merit less respect even than those sincerely on the wrong side of the spectrum.

Don't be too quick to call me a leftist.

I prefer the term independent.

I own lots of guns and love going hunting and i like to be fiscally conservative.

but i also support abortion.

I also supported Bush in 2000 and 2004. I thought Kerry was a dweeb.

Support abortion?

I think they have found the words "Pro-Choice" to be more palatable for the sheep.

[mraynrand]

Hopefully, arcilite, leftist that he is, is NOT as SHALLOW as a lot of pathetic individuals in here, whehter they show up once in a while as lefties or righties.

The INCIPID merit less respect even than those sincerely on the wrong side of the spectrum.

Don't be too quick to call me a leftist.

I prefer the term independent.

I own lots of guns and love going hunting and i like to be fiscally conservative.

but i also support abortion.

I also supported Bush in 2000 and 2004. I thought Kerry was a dweeb.

Support abortion?

I think they have found the words "Pro-Choice" to be more palatable for the sheep.

I've got an extra blender if you need it.

[arcilite]

i like killin babies. gives me a rush i can't get anywhere else, what can i say

[HowardRoark]

i like killin babies. gives me a rush i can't get anywhere else, what can i say

Hillary? Is that you? Who knew you were a Packer fan.

[arcilite]

Well, there are statistics to back up this theory:

Abortion reduces crime.

Which is another reason i like it.

[Deputy Nutz]

Hopefully, arcilite, leftist that he is, is NOT as SHALLOW as a lot of pathetic individuals in here, whehter they show up once in a while as lefties or righties.

The INCIPID merit less respect even than those sincerely on the wrong side of the spectrum.

Don't be too quick to call me a leftist.

I prefer the term independent.

I own lots of guns and love going hunting and i like to be fiscally conservative.

but i also support abortion.

I also supported Bush in 2000 and 2004. I thought Kerry was a dweeb.

Support abortion?

I think they have found the words "Pro-Choice" to be more palatable for the sheep.

I've got an extra blender if you need it.

A little baby burger on the barb.

[MJZiggy]

Well, there are statistics to back up this theory:

Abortion reduces crime.

Which is another reason i like it.

I'm not completely sold on the Freakonomics take on that one, though I found it completely fascinating. I lean a little bit toward the Broken Window philosophy there.

[HowardRoark]

Abortion reduces crime.

I suppose you could use the same logic with nuclear bombs. I would bet there wasn't much crime (by humans at least) here for awhile:

http://www.japanfocus.org/images/UserFiles/Image/2642.kuznick.tibbets.abomb/hiroshima_afterbomb.jpg

[arcilite]

lol

I also like it because I have too many one night stands and I always want that option available to me.

[HowardRoark]

I support thermonuclear warfare because it reduces crime.

[HowardRoark]

lol

I also like it because I have too many one night stands and I always want that option available to me.

Thank you. You are an honest man.

[Deputy Nutz]

I can't say I like abortion I mean, it isn't a good thing, but it seems we certainly can't preach safe, and protected sex, god forbid!

[arcilite]

I can't say I like abortion I mean, it isn't a good thing, but it seems we certainly can't preach safe, and protected sex, god forbid!

I agree.

There is too much 'abstinence' only education goin on in schools these days.

[MJZiggy]

Well, you could, but then you wouldn't be a conservative. Didn't you hear? It's abstinence only and if you have sex and get pregnant then you should get married whether there's any reason for you to be married or not.

[texaspackerbacker]

Hopefully, arcilite, leftist that he is, is NOT as SHALLOW as a lot of pathetic individuals in here, whehter they show up once in a while as lefties or righties.

The INCIPID merit less respect even than those sincerely on the wrong side of the spectrum.

Don't be too quick to call me a leftist.

I prefer the term independent.

I own lots of guns and love going hunting and i like to be fiscally conservative.

but i also support abortion.

I also supported Bush in 2000 and 2004. I thought Kerry was a dweeb.

I guess it's time to trot out MY position on abortion again. Apologies to anybody who read this before.

What is it, 40 or 50 million total by now since Roe v. Wade? Enough of those would have been voting age by 2000 and 2004 to make up the difference in the election and swing it to Gore and/or Kerry--Why would people who would otherwise have been aborted fetuses vote Dem/lib? Why does anybody vote Dem/lib? The solid majority of abortions occur among the same demographic of people who tend to vote liberal--stupid immoral trash--no offense to any chronic Dem/lib voters in the forum. You're probably exceptions to the rule :P

So while I tend to oppose abortion, I also tend to look at the big picture. Flushing all of America down the toilet of liberalism would have been worse than 40 some million dead babies--mostly from ya'all's kind of families.

[mraynrand]

Well, you could, but then you wouldn't be a conservative. Didn't you hear? It's abstinence only and if you have sex and get pregnant then you should get married whether there's any reason for you to be married or not.

And of course the liberal alternative is to either blenderize the 'tissue' before it can generate an EEG pattern or any other arbitrary designation for 'human life' you choose to assuage your guilt - or what the fuck, why not just toss the screaming piece of human filth out the window(That's what you meant by the 'Broken Window' theory as applied to baby killin' right?), even after it's 'born' (Most scientists agree that there really is no actual 'time of birth' just as there is really no 'time of conception'). After all, what is 'time' anyway? It's pretty elusive, so why worry.

Hey Zig, why are you more valuable than a 6 month old baby about to be shredded and tossed in the dumpster?

[HowardRoark]

Hey Zig, why are you more valuable than a 6 month old baby about to be shredded and tossed in the dumpster?

Because she is a proven non-criminal. The 6 month old baby could become a criminal.

[MJZiggy]

Well, you could, but then you wouldn't be a conservative. Didn't you hear? It's abstinence only and if you have sex and get pregnant then you should get married whether there's any reason for you to be married or not.

And of course the liberal alternative is to either blenderize the 'tissue' before it can generate an EEG pattern or any other arbitrary designation for 'human life' you choose to assuage your guilt - or what the fuck, why not just toss the screaming piece of human filth out the window(That's what you meant by the 'Broken Window' theory as applied to baby killin' right?), even after it's 'born' (Most scientists agree that there really is no actual 'time of birth' just as there is really no 'time of conception'). After all, what is 'time' anyway? It's pretty elusive, so why worry.

Hey Zig, why are you more valuable than a 6 month old baby about to be shredded and tossed in the dumpster?

Obviously you've never paid attention the many times abortion has come up here. I am not a fan of late term abortion and don't think it should be legal. I think that once the baby is viable, it should be delivered and adopted, not aborted.

In my post, I was speaking to sex education, not abortion. Even if you're pro-choice, I think that girls should be educated on the alternatives to abortion and the risks. I have known people who see abortion as a method of birth control and that makes me sad, not only because of the children that were lost, but because each successive abortion comes with it's own medical risks and abortion does do damage to the uterus, so that when the girl eventually does want to have a baby, she is at higher risk for uterine rupture. Abortion is legal, but it should be a dead-last choice. There are just too many people out there desperate for babies.

Arclite mentioned that abortion reduces crime which is a reference to a theory in a book called Freakonomics Twenty years after abortion became legal, crime across the country dramatically dropped after it was projected to become much worse not better. The authors of the book suggest that an alternate reason for the drop is that all the babies that were unwanted and would have been mistreated and grown up to be criminals were aborted rather than born.

The Broken Window theory (which has nothing to do with abortion you sick fuck) is the original method of crime reduction that was started in the NYC subway system and spread nationwide. The theory states that if you keep the physical space of an area in good condition (fix the broken windows--or in the case of the subways, clean the grafitti) and crack down on petty gateway crimes (in the case of the subway system it was fare beating and turnstile jumping) that a sense of order will be achieved (and it was) that is a natural deterrent to crime.

A little itchy on the trigger finger there aren't you Ayn...

[mraynrand]

Obviously you've never paid attention the many times abortion has come up here.


Obviously.
http://www.packerrats.com/ratchat/viewtopic.php?t=14444&highlight=drilling+alska

[mraynrand]

I was speaking to sex education, not abortion. Even if you're pro-choice, I think that girls should be educated on the alternatives to abortion and the risks. .

The alternative(s)? The risks are obvious - you will have annoying, precious brat(s), or delinquent malcontent(s) for the rest of your life.

[MJZiggy]

I didn't even post in that thread. Why don't you try one of the many I've posted to in which I state that I am no fan of abortion but think it should be absolutely outlawed after 20 weeks (which usually starts a huge discussion about 21 weeks and 19 weeks that I don't care to repeat).

[mraynrand]

The Broken Window theory (which has nothing to do with abortion you sick fuck) is the original method of crime reduction that was started in the NYC subway system and spread nationwide. The theory states that if you keep the physical space of an area in good condition (fix the broken windows--or in the case of the subways, clean the grafitti) and crack down on petty gateway crimes (in the case of the subway system it was fare beating and turnstile jumping) that a sense of order will be achieved (and it was) that is a natural deterrent to crime.

What did that have to do with abortion? You mentioned it in response to abortion - you sick fuck

The exchange:

"arcilite": "Well, there are statistics to back up this theory: Abortion reduces crime. Which is another reason i like it"

Zig: "I'm not completely sold on the Freakonomics take on that one, though I found it completely fascinating. I lean a little bit toward the Broken Window philosophy there."

[mraynrand]

I didn't even post in that thread. Why don't you try one of the many I've posted to in which I state that I am no fan of abortion but think it should be absolutely outlawed after 20 weeks (which usually starts a huge discussion about 21 weeks and 19 weeks that I don't care to repeat).

The argument against 20 is in that thread. You don't want to start a discussion about 19 or 21 because you'll have to admit that 20 is completely arbitrary.

[MJZiggy]

The Broken Window theory (which has nothing to do with abortion you sick fuck) is the original method of crime reduction that was started in the NYC subway system and spread nationwide. The theory states that if you keep the physical space of an area in good condition (fix the broken windows--or in the case of the subways, clean the grafitti) and crack down on petty gateway crimes (in the case of the subway system it was fare beating and turnstile jumping) that a sense of order will be achieved (and it was) that is a natural deterrent to crime.

What did that have to do with abortion? You mentioned it in response to abortion - you sick fuck

The exchange:

"arcilite": "Well, there are statistics to back up this theory: Abortion reduces crime. Which is another reason i like it"

Zig: "I'm not completely sold on the Freakonomics take on that one, though I found it completely fascinating. I lean a little bit toward the Broken Window philosophy there."

You're like off this morning or something. Abortion reduces crime is a direct reference to the theory in Freakonomics. I just told you that. I don't completely buy the theory that it was the legalization of abortion that led to the reduction in crime that I just freaking explained to you.

[mraynrand]

The Broken Window theory (which has nothing to do with abortion you sick fuck) is the original method of crime reduction that was started in the NYC subway system and spread nationwide. The theory states that if you keep the physical space of an area in good condition (fix the broken windows--or in the case of the subways, clean the grafitti) and crack down on petty gateway crimes (in the case of the subway system it was fare beating and turnstile jumping) that a sense of order will be achieved (and it was) that is a natural deterrent to crime.

What did that have to do with abortion? You mentioned it in response to abortion - you sick fuck

The exchange:

"arcilite": "Well, there are statistics to back up this theory: Abortion reduces crime. Which is another reason i like it"

Zig: "I'm not completely sold on the Freakonomics take on that one, though I found it completely fascinating. I lean a little bit toward the Broken Window philosophy there."

You're like off this morning or something. Abortion reduces crime is a direct reference to the theory in Freakonomics. I just told you that. I don't completely buy the theory that it was the legalization of abortion that led to the reduction in crime that I just freaking explained to you.

But then you brought up the Broken Window theory out of nowhere.

[MJZiggy]

I was speaking to sex education, not abortion. Even if you're pro-choice, I think that girls should be educated on the alternatives to abortion and the risks. .

The alternative(s)? The risks are obvious - you will have annoying, precious brat(s), or delinquent malcontent(s) for the rest of your life.

The alternatives to abortion are effective birth control in the first place (if you think you're going to preach abstinence and think that hormone raged teenagers in a society that preaches sex are going to keep their hands off of each other, you're dreaming). Then if they do become pregnant, the alternative is to adopt the "annoying, precious brat" who will be less likely to become a delinquent malcontent as he has parents who wanted him, then you don't have him for the rest of your life, you haven't damaged yourself, and people who do want him will have the baby they are desperate for.

[MJZiggy]

I didn't even post in that thread. Why don't you try one of the many I've posted to in which I state that I am no fan of abortion but think it should be absolutely outlawed after 20 weeks (which usually starts a huge discussion about 21 weeks and 19 weeks that I don't care to repeat).

The argument against 20 is in that thread. You don't want to start a discussion about 19 or 21 because you'll have to admit that 20 is completely arbitrary.

Who gives a damn if it's arbitrary. A doctor can look at a fetus and determine if it's viable or not. Make the limit 20 weeks and if the doc decides it has to wait a week, then they wait a week to be sure. She's been pregnant for 20 weeks, another won't kill her.

[mraynrand]

I didn't even post in that thread. Why don't you try one of the many I've posted to in which I state that I am no fan of abortion but think it should be absolutely outlawed after 20 weeks (which usually starts a huge discussion about 21 weeks and 19 weeks that I don't care to repeat).

The argument against 20 is in that thread. You don't want to start a discussion about 19 or 21 because you'll have to admit that 20 is completely arbitrary.

Who gives a damn if it's arbitrary. A doctor can look at a fetus and determine if it's viable or not. Make the limit 20 weeks and if the doc decides it has to wait a week, then they wait a week to be sure. She's been pregnant for 20 weeks, another won't kill her.

WTF?

[HowardRoark]

Arclite mentioned that abortion reduces crime which is a reference to a theory in a book called Freakonomics Twenty years after abortion became legal, crime across the country dramatically dropped after it was projected to become much worse not better. The authors of the book suggest that an alternate reason for the drop is that all the babies that were unwanted and would have been mistreated and grown up to be criminals were aborted rather than born.

The irony of this of course is that our own fresh faced golden boy (nothing intended by the word), Barack Obama would have perfectly fit the profile of someone who should have been aborted. The guy was a “mistake”, his father had no use for him, he had to live on food stamps for awhile, and lastly (and by far the worst of them all); he ended up being raised by his grandparents. And they were white. Not only white, but “typical white folks.” The kind of people who might actually have the gall to be a little nervous when approached by a group of young men who should have been aborted, but somehow made it through the gauntlet of “Women’s rights”….i.e. pregnancy.

I always get a chuckle out of the naïve rubes on the Right who say such things as, “but that fetus that you chose to abort could have grown up and found a cure for cancer….or maybe he would have been President!!” Silly people.

[HowardRoark]

What is it, 40 or 50 million total by now since Roe v. Wade? Enough of those would have been voting age by 2000 and 2004 to make up the difference in the election and swing it to Gore and/or Kerry--Why would people who would otherwise have been aborted fetuses vote Dem/lib? Why does anybody vote Dem/lib? The solid majority of abortions occur among the same demographic of people who tend to vote liberal--stupid immoral trash--no offense to any chronic Dem/lib voters in the forum. You're probably exceptions to the rule :P

So while I tend to oppose abortion, I also tend to look at the big picture. Flushing all of America down the toilet of liberalism would have been worse than 40 some million dead babies--mostly from ya'all's kind of families.

Wouldn’t it be much more efficient to just find the list of the people who vote for Democrats and just kill them?

[Freak Out]

I support thermonuclear warfare because it reduces crime.

:)

Abortion will go away when all humans are dead or sterile. Criminalize it all you want but it will never stop. It's that simple.
As a nation we need to use all the knowledge and $$$ we have available to reduce unwanted pregnancies instead of turning away from something because some believe it promotes teenage sex or promiscuity.
Move out of the dark ages America.

[MJZiggy]

You've just brought up an interesting question: if abortion has been legal since the 70's, through two terms of Reagan, a term of Bush and two terms of Bush the scary, why is it even part of a discussion of Presidential politics? It's been legal for 30 years through 3 republican administrations and they haven't even been able to shoot down late term abortion (and now I'm hearing of abortion foes that don't want late term abortion legislation to pass because they wouldn't then be able to use the more graphic images to make their cases???? wtf)

Either way, Freak is right. criminalize it, Villify it, demonize it, it's still gonna happen and it wouldn't be such an issue if we prevented the pregnancies in the first place.

[SkinBasket]

why is it even part of a discussion of Presidential politics?

Typically it isn't. At least until the dem candidate claims Roe v Wade will be threatened by the election of a republican, or the appointment of a conservative justice. Just the usual demagoguery. No big deal.

[arcilite]

If you outlaw abortions, only outlaws will have abortions.

[Cheesehead Craig]

It's time for the Gallup Poll numbers:

Obama leads by 9 pts 51-42. Obama has led in the Gallup Poll for a month straight.

10 days left until the election.

[SkinBasket]

Obama leads by 9 pts 51-42. Obama has led in the Gallup Poll for a month straight.

Does he get extra points for that like in NASCAR?

[mraynrand]

I support thermonuclear warfare because it reduces crime.

:)

Abortion will go away when all humans are dead or sterile. Criminalize it all you want but it will never stop. It's that simple.
As a nation we need to use all the knowledge and $$$ we have available to reduce unwanted pregnancies instead of turning away from something because some believe it promotes teenage sex or promiscuity.
[b]Move out of the dark ages America.[\b]

Ahh, I didn't realize I was against abortion because it promotes promiscuity. I thought I just didn't like the idea of putting babies in blenders. I'm glad that's cleared up.

Were there more abortions in the dark ages?

[Cheesehead Craig]

Obama leads by 9 pts 51-42. Obama has led in the Gallup Poll for a month straight.

Does he get extra points for that like in NASCAR?

He does get a couple cases of Budweiser.

[Joemailman]

There are a number of myths that are perpetrated when discussing the abortion issue. One is that overturning Roe v. Wade would outlaw all abortions in this country. It would not. It would be a state by state situation. Another is that if you elect Republicans to the Presidency, they will appoint justices who will overturn Roe v. Wade. Since the RVW decision was handed down, 12 new justices have been appointed to the Supreme Court. Nine of those by Republicans. Yet RVW is still the law of the land. Yet another is that McCain wants to outlaw abortions in this country. In the third debate with Obama, McCain said this on RVW: MCCAIN: I thought it was a bad decision. I think there were a lot of decisions that were bad. I think that decisions should rest in the hands of the states. Saying that the decision should rest with the states is a long way from the goal many Conservatives have of outlawing abortion completely.

The problem with the anti-abortion movement is that that they put the cart before the horse. I don't think you can outlaw abortion when half the country thinks it should be legal. What needs to be done first is to convince the vast majority of Americans (at least 75%) that legalized abortion is wrong. Only then can you hope to outlaw it. However, no President, Democratic or Republican, has tried to use the office of the President to change minds on abortion. However, once again millions of Americans will again vote for a Republican for President because of theeir misguided belief that he wants to outlaw abortion in this country. If McCain is then elected, you won't hear him discuss it, just as Bush doesn't discuss it.

[MJZiggy]

One is that overturning Roe v. Wade would outlaw all abortions in this country. It would not. It would be a state by state situation. Another is that if you elect Republicans to the Presidency, they will appoint justices who will overturn Roe v. Wade. Since the RVW decision was handed down, 12 new justices have been appointed to the Supreme Court. Nine of those by Republicans. Yet RVW is still the law of the land.

This was exactly the point I was trying to make.

[packinpatland]

IF RVW were ever overturned, and IF each state were to make it illegal, (yes, I know that's a stretch), how in the world could it be enforced and what would the penalties be?

[MJZiggy]

The other question is do you penalize the patient or the "doctor?"

Ayn, you know the best way to prevent abortion is to prevent the pregnancy in the first place, yet conservatives are typically against teaching sex ed which is how you teach kids contraception so that they don't create the baby that ends up blenderized...

[texaspackerbacker]

What is it, 40 or 50 million total by now since Roe v. Wade? Enough of those would have been voting age by 2000 and 2004 to make up the difference in the election and swing it to Gore and/or Kerry--Why would people who would otherwise have been aborted fetuses vote Dem/lib? Why does anybody vote Dem/lib? The solid majority of abortions occur among the same demographic of people who tend to vote liberal--stupid immoral trash--no offense to any chronic Dem/lib voters in the forum. You're probably exceptions to the rule :P

So while I tend to oppose abortion, I also tend to look at the big picture. Flushing all of America down the toilet of liberalism would have been worse than 40 some million dead babies--mostly from ya'all's kind of families.

Wouldn’t it be much more efficient to just find the list of the people who vote for Democrats and just kill them?

When you're right, you're right, Howard.

Remember 1964 when there was that Goldwater billboard that said "In Your Heart, You Know He's Right", and the Dems put up one right next to it that said, "Yeah, Extreme Right".

[texaspackerbacker]

If you outlaw abortions, only outlaws will have abortions.

That probably accounts for about 89.3% of the abortions now.

[mraynrand]

One is that overturning Roe v. Wade would outlaw all abortions in this country. It would not. It would be a state by state situation. Another is that if you elect Republicans to the Presidency, they will appoint justices who will overturn Roe v. Wade. Since the RVW decision was handed down, 12 new justices have been appointed to the Supreme Court. Nine of those by Republicans. Yet RVW is still the law of the land.

This was exactly the point I was trying to make.

I think you're both right about this. Most supremes honor stare decisis (stick with precedent), except notably Clarence Thomas, so RVW is unlikely to be overturned by a McCain appointee. And even if it were, most states wouldn't outlaw abortions, and even those that altered their laws would only add certain restrictions, not put through a complete ban. And as far as I'm concerned, I wouldn't want that.

I think the underlying issue is so important that it is essential to convince people that human life, from conception to natural death, should be valued and protected as much as possible. I'd like to convince people not to have abortions because they see it as destructive to a human being. A good way to start is to just be honest about what an abortion is - not couch it in euphemisms and distracting language. It's ending human development. If you want a woman's right to an abortion to trump the developing life, just say so. It's almost NEVER about a woman's health, so stop calling it a health issue. And from the other side, if you want someone to have an abortion, the best way to guarantee it is to stigmatize the person so that they are more likely to end the life than keep it and put it up for adoption. Sure, an unplanned pregnancy isn't a good thing, but if you treat people like they've ruined their lives, they're going to be more likely to choose to hide it and destroy the baby. etc.

[MJZiggy]

Ayn, I know you lean conservative, but you're no sheep, so better to ask. Do you follow the party line on sex ed in schools?

[mraynrand]

Ayn, I know you lean conservative, but you're no sheep, so better to ask. Do you follow the party line on sex ed in schools?

I think they should just teach the biology and about birth control. Teaching stuff like two mommies and two daddies are the same as a mommy and daddy shouldn't be in schools. Parents should be involved in the curriculum and be able to decline.

[MJZiggy]

To me two mommies and two daddies is not sex education, but more social commentary aimed at reducing homophobia, but you're probably right--parents should be able to decide what their children are taught and if they want them homophobic, it's their kids. I think the ones who need that kind of education are the ones who actually HAVE two mommies or two daddies.

[SkinBasket]

So you're assuming all kids are homophobics by default and need re-education and rehabilitation at the taxpayer's expense?

I like to fuck goats. Where's the stories for the kids for that? I don;t want them growing up being afraid of me because I'm different.

[MJZiggy]

So you're assuming all kids are homophobics by default and need re-education and rehabilitation at the taxpayer's expense?

I like to fuck goats. Where's the stories for the kids for that? I don;t want them growing up being afraid of me because I'm different.

No, I'm saying that homophobics will teach their kids homophobia. Tolerant parents (and bars) will teach tolerance. When I say that the only kids who need education on the topic are kids with gay parents, it is so they learn how to deal with kids that are taught by homophobes.

[HowardRoark]

So you're assuming all kids are homophobics by default and need re-education and rehabilitation at the taxpayer's expense?

I like to fuck goats. Where's the stories for the kids for that? I don;t want them growing up being afraid of me because I'm different.

No, I'm saying that homophobics will teach their kids homophobia. Tolerant parents (and bars) will teach tolerance. When I say that the only kids who need education on the topic are kids with gay parents, it is so they learn how to deal with kids that are taught by homophobes.

What about the kids who who have parents who are homophobes, don't they need to be taught about the intolerance of the people who are not homophobes?

[Freak Out]

So you're assuming all kids are homophobics by default and need re-education and rehabilitation at the taxpayer's expense?

I like to fuck goats. Where's the stories for the kids for that? I don;t want them growing up being afraid of me because I'm different.

Do you wear a condom? Was it a Billy?

[texaspackerbacker]

Ziggy, what makes you think the "conservative party line" is nothing more than abstinence? In Texas, which is arguably one of the more "conservative" states, the curriculum is comprehensive--at least in a heterosexual sense.

As aynrand said or implied, there's nothing wrong with equal portions of "don't do it" and "be careful if you do". It's just when you get into the liberal perspective of the moral equivalency of homosexuality that the line is crossed.

And as Skinbasket implied, there indeed ARE things morally equivalent to homosexuality: bestiality, pedophilia, etc. Those things, however, don't seem to have caught the favor of sick damn leftists (although supposedly, Nancy Pelosi is pretty tight with the NAMBLA crowd in San Francisco--I guess pro-homosexuality trumps anti-pedophilia).

[Deputy Nutz]

mraynrand, if you say "blender" one more time I am going to shove one so far up your ass you're going to have to call the Maytag man to perform a rectal abortion.

[SkinBasket]

mraynrand, if you say "blender" one more time I am going to shove one so far up your ass you're going to have to call the Maytag man to perform a rectal abortion.

How about blended drink refreshment center?

[MJZiggy]

Ziggy, what makes you think the "conservative party line" is nothing more than abstinence? In Texas, which is arguably one of the more "conservative" states, the curriculum is comprehensive--at least in a heterosexual sense.

As aynrand said or implied, there's nothing wrong with equal portions of "don't do it" and "be careful if you do". It's just when you get into the liberal perspective of the moral equivalency of homosexuality that the line is crossed.

And as Skinbasket implied, there indeed ARE things morally equivalent to homosexuality: bestiality, pedophilia, etc. Those things, however, don't seem to have caught the favor of sick damn leftists (although supposedly, Nancy Pelosi is pretty tight with the NAMBLA crowd in San Francisco--I guess pro-homosexuality trumps anti-pedophilia).

Have you ever listened to your VP candidate? She stood next to her pregnant daughter and proclaimed that we should teach abstinence only in our schools (about the same time, her presidential candidate proclaimed he didn't know too much about those things). That was the first issue I had with her.

Also, homosexuality infers mutual consent. Neither pedophilia nor bestiality have that consent thing going for them. Why are you so interested in what other people do in their bedrooms anyway? What business is it of yours what consenting adults decide to sleep together? Your personal opinion aside, the government should not be deciding morality, hence the separation of church and state stuff. Which means that teaching abstinence only because that is the moral thing to do winds you up with a lot of pregnant teens who are now stigmatized (and according to Rand who is quite possibly right on this one, more likely to have abortions).

[Zool]

mraynrand, if you say "blender" one more time I am going to shove one so far up your ass you're going to have to call the Maytag man to perform a rectal abortion.

How about blended drink refreshment center?

Thats what I was thinking. Turn his ass upside down and put him to work.

[HowardRoark]

the government should not be deciding morality

QFT

[mraynrand]

mraynrand, if you say "blender" one more time I am going to shove one so far up your ass you're going to have to call the Maytag man to perform a rectal abortion.

Hi Nutz! Blender.

[Joemailman]

mraynrand, if you say "blender" one more time I am going to shove one so far up your ass you're going to have to call the Maytag man to perform a rectal abortion.

Hi Nutz! Blender.

I'll be with you as soon as I'm finished reading.

http://wwwimage.cbsnews.com/images/2003/09/23/image574678x.jpg

[sheepshead]

I was sent this, but most of the information I have already read. Maybe you are concerned, maybe not, but I think you should at least give it some thought, as I have. Some will not read it, and some will, but may not believe. Others may read it, but really don't care. Sally in Amarillo.

To All My Friends, this is long, but every important, please take the time to read it.

This election has me very worried. So many things to consider. About a year ago I would have voted for Obama. I have changed my mind three times since then. I watch all the news channels, jumping from one to another. I must say this drives my husband crazy. But, I feel if you view MSNBC, CNN, and Fox News, you might get some middle ground to work with. About six months ago, I started thinking, where did all the money for Obama come from? I have four daughters who went to College, and we were middle class, and money was tight. We (including my girls) worked hard and there were lots of student loans.

I started looking into Obama's life.

Around 1979 Obama started college at Occidental in California. He is very open about his two years at Occidental, he tried all kinds of drugs and was wasting his time but, even though he had a brilliant mind, did not apply himself to his studies. 'Barry' (that was the name he used all his life) during this time had two roommates, Muhammad Hasan Chandoo and Wahid Hamid, both from Pakistan. During the summer of 1981, after his second year in college, he made a 'round the world' trip. Stopping to see his mother in Indonesia, next Hyderabad in India, three weeks in Karachi, Pakistan where he stayed with his roommate's family, then off to Africa to visit his father's family. My question - Where did he get the money for this trip? Nether I, nor any one of my children would have had money for a trip like this when they where in college. When he came back he started school at Columbia University in New York. It is at this time he wants everyone to call him Barack - not Barry. Do you know what the tuition is at Columbia? It's not cheap to say the least! Where did he get money for tuition? Student Loans? Maybe. After Columbia, he went to Chicago to work as a Community Organizer for $12,000 a year. Why Chicago? Why not New York? He was already living in New York.

By 'chance' he met Antoin 'Tony' Rezko, born in Aleppo Syria, and a real estate developer in Chicago. Rezko has been convicted of fraud and bribery this year. Rezko, was named 'Entrepreneur of the Decade' by the Arab-American Business and Professional Association'. About two years later, Obama entered Harvard Law School. Do you have any idea what tuition is for Harvard Law School? Where did he get the money for Law School? More student loans, or did he save enough of his $12,000 annual salary to afford his his Harvard Law degree? After Law school, he went back to Chicago. Rezko offered him a job, which he turned down. But, he did take a job with Davis, Miner, Barnhill & Galland. Guess what? They represented 'Rezar' which is Rezko's firm. Rezko was one of Obama's first major financial contributors when he ran for office in Chicago. In 2003, Rezko threw an early fundraiser for Obama which Chicago Tribune reporter David Mendelland claims was instrumental in providing Obama with 'seed money' for his U.S. Senate race. In 2005, Obama purchased a new home in Kenwoood District of Chicago for $1.65 million (less than asking price). With ALL those Student Loans - Where did he get the money for the property? On the same day Rezko's wife, Rita, purchased the adjoining empty lot for full price. The London Times reported that Nadhmi Auchi, an Iraqi-born Billionaire loaned Rezko $3.5 million three weeks before Obama's new home was purchased. Obama met Nadhmi Auchi many times with Rezko.


Now, we have Obama running for President. Valerie Jarrett, was Michele Obama's boss. She is now Obama's chief advisor and he does not make any major decisions without talking to her first. Where was Jarrett born? Ready for this? Shiraz, Iran! Do we see a pattern here? Or am I going crazy?

On May 10, 2008 The Times reported, Robert Malley, advisor to Obama, was 'sacked' after the press found out he was having regular contacts with 'Hamas', which controls Gaza and is connected with Iran. This past week, buried in the back part of the papers, Iraqi newspapers reported that during Obama's visit to Iraq, he asked their leaders to do nothing about the war until after he is elected, and he will 'Take care of things'.

Oh, and by the way, remember the college roommates that where born in Pakistan? They are in charge of all those 'small' Internet campaign contributions for Obama. Where is that money coming from? The poor and middle class in this country? Or could it be from the Middle East?

And the final bit of news. On September 7, 2008, The Washington Times posted a verbal slip that was made on 'This Week' with George Stephanapoulos. Obama on talking about his religion said, 'My Muslim faith'. When questioned, 'he made a mistake'. Some mistake!

All of the above information I got on line. If you would like to check it - Wikipedia, encyclopedia, Barack Obama; Tony Rezko; Valerie Jarrett: Daily Times - Obama visited Pakistan in 1981; The Washington Times - September 7, 2008; The Times May 10, 2008.

Now the BIG question - If I found out all this information on my own, Why haven't all of our 'intelligent' members of the press been reporting this?

A phrase that keeps ringing in my ear - 'Beware of the enemy from within'!!!

[arcilite]

I was sent this, but most of the information I have already read. Maybe you are concerned, maybe not, but I think you should at least give it some thought, as I have. Some will not read it, and some will, but may not believe. Others may read it, but really don't care. Sally in Amarillo.

To All My Friends, this is long, but every important, please take the time to read it.

This election has me very worried. So many things to consider. About a year ago I would have voted for Obama. I have changed my mind three times since then. I watch all the news channels, jumping from one to another. I must say this drives my husband crazy. But, I feel if you view MSNBC, CNN, and Fox News, you might get some middle ground to work with. About six months ago, I started thinking, where did all the money for Obama come from? I have four daughters who went to College, and we were middle class, and money was tight. We (including my girls) worked hard and there were lots of student loans.

I started looking into Obama's life.

Around 1979 Obama started college at Occidental in California. He is very open about his two years at Occidental, he tried all kinds of drugs and was wasting his time but, even though he had a brilliant mind, did not apply himself to his studies. 'Barry' (that was the name he used all his life) during this time had two roommates, Muhammad Hasan Chandoo and Wahid Hamid, both from Pakistan. During the summer of 1981, after his second year in college, he made a 'round the world' trip. Stopping to see his mother in Indonesia, next Hyderabad in India, three weeks in Karachi, Pakistan where he stayed with his roommate's family, then off to Africa to visit his father's family. My question - Where did he get the money for this trip? Nether I, nor any one of my children would have had money for a trip like this when they where in college. When he came back he started school at Columbia University in New York. It is at this time he wants everyone to call him Barack - not Barry. Do you know what the tuition is at Columbia? It's not cheap to say the least! Where did he get money for tuition? Student Loans? Maybe. After Columbia, he went to Chicago to work as a Community Organizer for $12,000 a year. Why Chicago? Why not New York? He was already living in New York.

By 'chance' he met Antoin 'Tony' Rezko, born in Aleppo Syria, and a real estate developer in Chicago. Rezko has been convicted of fraud and bribery this year. Rezko, was named 'Entrepreneur of the Decade' by the Arab-American Business and Professional Association'. About two years later, Obama entered Harvard Law School. Do you have any idea what tuition is for Harvard Law School? Where did he get the money for Law School? More student loans, or did he save enough of his $12,000 annual salary to afford his his Harvard Law degree? After Law school, he went back to Chicago. Rezko offered him a job, which he turned down. But, he did take a job with Davis, Miner, Barnhill & Galland. Guess what? They represented 'Rezar' which is Rezko's firm. Rezko was one of Obama's first major financial contributors when he ran for office in Chicago. In 2003, Rezko threw an early fundraiser for Obama which Chicago Tribune reporter David Mendelland claims was instrumental in providing Obama with 'seed money' for his U.S. Senate race. In 2005, Obama purchased a new home in Kenwoood District of Chicago for $1.65 million (less than asking price). With ALL those Student Loans - Where did he get the money for the property? On the same day Rezko's wife, Rita, purchased the adjoining empty lot for full price. The London Times reported that Nadhmi Auchi, an Iraqi-born Billionaire loaned Rezko $3.5 million three weeks before Obama's new home was purchased. Obama met Nadhmi Auchi many times with Rezko.


Now, we have Obama running for President. Valerie Jarrett, was Michele Obama's boss. She is now Obama's chief advisor and he does not make any major decisions without talking to her first. Where was Jarrett born? Ready for this? Shiraz, Iran! Do we see a pattern here? Or am I going crazy?

On May 10, 2008 The Times reported, Robert Malley, advisor to Obama, was 'sacked' after the press found out he was having regular contacts with 'Hamas', which controls Gaza and is connected with Iran. This past week, buried in the back part of the papers, Iraqi newspapers reported that during Obama's visit to Iraq, he asked their leaders to do nothing about the war until after he is elected, and he will 'Take care of things'.

Oh, and by the way, remember the college roommates that where born in Pakistan? They are in charge of all those 'small' Internet campaign contributions for Obama. Where is that money coming from? The poor and middle class in this country? Or could it be from the Middle East?

And the final bit of news. On September 7, 2008, The Washington Times posted a verbal slip that was made on 'This Week' with George Stephanapoulos. Obama on talking about his religion said, 'My Muslim faith'. When questioned, 'he made a mistake'. Some mistake!

All of the above information I got on line. If you would like to check it - Wikipedia, encyclopedia, Barack Obama; Tony Rezko; Valerie Jarrett: Daily Times - Obama visited Pakistan in 1981; The Washington Times - September 7, 2008; The Times May 10, 2008.

Now the BIG question - If I found out all this information on my own, Why haven't all of our 'intelligent' members of the press been reporting this?

A phrase that keeps ringing in my ear - 'Beware of the enemy from within'!!!
'
At least do basic fact checking before you post silly chain letters:

http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/money.asp

[sheepshead]

Im not really worried about his tuition. Its all the other stuff I find scary.

[arcilite]

Im not really worried about his tuition. Its all the other stuff I find scary.


yeah. like hes muslim!

[Deputy Nutz]

mraynrand, if you say "blender" one more time I am going to shove one so far up your ass you're going to have to call the Maytag man to perform a rectal abortion.

Hi Nutz! Blender.

Now you are in big, big Trouble.

[sheepshead]

Im not really worried about his tuition. Its all the other stuff I find scary.


yeah. like hes muslim!

All I'll say is you wont find people like this in John McCain, Sarah Palins or even Joe Bidens circle of friends and associates.

[hoosier]

I was sent this, but most of the information I have already read. Maybe you are concerned, maybe not, but I think you should at least give it some thought, as I have. Some will not read it, and some will, but may not believe. Others may read it, but really don't care. Sally in Amarillo.

To All My Friends, this is long, but every important, please take the time to read it.

This election has me very worried. So many things to consider. About a year ago I would have voted for Obama. I have changed my mind three times since then. I watch all the news channels, jumping from one to another. I must say this drives my husband crazy. But, I feel if you view MSNBC, CNN, and Fox News, you might get some middle ground to work with. About six months ago, I started thinking, where did all the money for Obama come from? I have four daughters who went to College, and we were middle class, and money was tight. We (including my girls) worked hard and there were lots of student loans.

I started looking into Obama's life.

Around 1979 Obama started college at Occidental in California. He is very open about his two years at Occidental, he tried all kinds of drugs and was wasting his time but, even though he had a brilliant mind, did not apply himself to his studies. 'Barry' (that was the name he used all his life) during this time had two roommates, Muhammad Hasan Chandoo and Wahid Hamid, both from Pakistan. During the summer of 1981, after his second year in college, he made a 'round the world' trip. Stopping to see his mother in Indonesia, next Hyderabad in India, three weeks in Karachi, Pakistan where he stayed with his roommate's family, then off to Africa to visit his father's family. My question - Where did he get the money for this trip? Nether I, nor any one of my children would have had money for a trip like this when they where in college. When he came back he started school at Columbia University in New York. It is at this time he wants everyone to call him Barack - not Barry. Do you know what the tuition is at Columbia? It's not cheap to say the least! Where did he get money for tuition? Student Loans? Maybe. After Columbia, he went to Chicago to work as a Community Organizer for $12,000 a year. Why Chicago? Why not New York? He was already living in New York.

By 'chance' he met Antoin 'Tony' Rezko, born in Aleppo Syria, and a real estate developer in Chicago. Rezko has been convicted of fraud and bribery this year. Rezko, was named 'Entrepreneur of the Decade' by the Arab-American Business and Professional Association'. About two years later, Obama entered Harvard Law School. Do you have any idea what tuition is for Harvard Law School? Where did he get the money for Law School? More student loans, or did he save enough of his $12,000 annual salary to afford his his Harvard Law degree? After Law school, he went back to Chicago. Rezko offered him a job, which he turned down. But, he did take a job with Davis, Miner, Barnhill & Galland. Guess what? They represented 'Rezar' which is Rezko's firm. Rezko was one of Obama's first major financial contributors when he ran for office in Chicago. In 2003, Rezko threw an early fundraiser for Obama which Chicago Tribune reporter David Mendelland claims was instrumental in providing Obama with 'seed money' for his U.S. Senate race. In 2005, Obama purchased a new home in Kenwoood District of Chicago for $1.65 million (less than asking price). With ALL those Student Loans - Where did he get the money for the property? On the same day Rezko's wife, Rita, purchased the adjoining empty lot for full price. The London Times reported that Nadhmi Auchi, an Iraqi-born Billionaire loaned Rezko $3.5 million three weeks before Obama's new home was purchased. Obama met Nadhmi Auchi many times with Rezko.


Now, we have Obama running for President. Valerie Jarrett, was Michele Obama's boss. She is now Obama's chief advisor and he does not make any major decisions without talking to her first. Where was Jarrett born? Ready for this? Shiraz, Iran! Do we see a pattern here? Or am I going crazy?

On May 10, 2008 The Times reported, Robert Malley, advisor to Obama, was 'sacked' after the press found out he was having regular contacts with 'Hamas', which controls Gaza and is connected with Iran. This past week, buried in the back part of the papers, Iraqi newspapers reported that during Obama's visit to Iraq, he asked their leaders to do nothing about the war until after he is elected, and he will 'Take care of things'.

Oh, and by the way, remember the college roommates that where born in Pakistan? They are in charge of all those 'small' Internet campaign contributions for Obama. Where is that money coming from? The poor and middle class in this country? Or could it be from the Middle East?

And the final bit of news. On September 7, 2008, The Washington Times posted a verbal slip that was made on 'This Week' with George Stephanapoulos. Obama on talking about his religion said, 'My Muslim faith'. When questioned, 'he made a mistake'. Some mistake!

All of the above information I got on line. If you would like to check it - Wikipedia, encyclopedia, Barack Obama; Tony Rezko; Valerie Jarrett: Daily Times - Obama visited Pakistan in 1981; The Washington Times - September 7, 2008; The Times May 10, 2008.

Now the BIG question - If I found out all this information on my own, Why haven't all of our 'intelligent' members of the press been reporting this?

A phrase that keeps ringing in my ear - 'Beware of the enemy from within'!!!
'
At least do basic fact checking before you post silly chain letters:

http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/money.asp


Im not really worried about his tuition. Its all the other stuff I find scary.

Too funny!! Muttonhead gets busted for posting a hoax email and he doesn't even seem to get that he's been outed!

[sheepshead]

lol oh never mind

[Cheesehead Craig]

The last Gallup poll today is stating that Obama will win 55-44%.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/111703/Final-Presidential-Estimate-Obama-55-McCain-44.aspx