Special Needs Mom

[packinpatland]

Sarah Palin and I are 'peers'.........we both have special needs kids...

This is unreal....but then, that was before she was where she is today.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3032553/

Sorry.......scroll down, view the video on Palin and Special Olympics.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I'd say that if a "special needs" Mom thought the state spent too much on special needs, then they probably were.

You're sourcing Keith Olberman now? Seriously?

[packinpatland]

I'd say that if a "special needs" Mom thought the state spent too much on special needs, then they probably were.

You're sourcing Keith Olberman now? Seriously?

She wasn't a special needs mom when she reduced the budget for the Special Olympics. She's been a special needs mom for a nano second....a few months.......let's discuss this in 20+ years.

I find Keith Olberman highly 'entertaining'...........much like Bill O'Reilly.

[Kiwon]

I'd say that if a "special needs" Mom thought the state spent too much on special needs, then they probably were.

You're sourcing Keith Olberman now? Seriously?

Ditto.

PIP, are you an Obama campaign worker or something?

Are you seriously suggesting Gov. Palin is callous towards families with "special needs" children?

[hoosier]

I'd say that if a "special needs" Mom thought the state spent too much on special needs, then they probably were.

You're sourcing Keith Olberman now? Seriously?

The link PIP posted was for something about Special Olympics, but it sounds like you're talking about funding for education (that's the context in which special needs is typically used). If that's the case, you should know that FEDERAL funding for special needs education is a complete joke. And it's far greater than state funding. To suggest otherwise you'd have to want to revert to warehousing kids in special ed classes that are really nothing more than glorified parking lots. Hopefully Palin will have her eyes opened as her new grandchild makes his/her way through the educational system.

[packinpatland]

I'd say that if a "special needs" Mom thought the state spent too much on special needs, then they probably were.

You're sourcing Keith Olberman now? Seriously?

Ditto.

PIP, are you an Obama campaign worker or something?

Are you seriously suggesting Gov. Palin is callous towards families with "special needs" children?

I am not saying she is callous. But I do liken her to Michael J. Fox......do you really think he gave a second thought to Parkinson's before he himself became afflicted?

[Scott Campbell]

I'd say that if a "special needs" Mom thought the state spent too much on special needs, then they probably were.

You're sourcing Keith Olberman now? Seriously?

Ditto.

PIP, are you an Obama campaign worker or something?

Are you seriously suggesting Gov. Palin is callous towards families with "special needs" children?

I am not saying she is callous. But I do liken her to Michael J. Fox......do you really think he gave a second thought to Parkinson's before he himself became afflicted?


Well, how much did you focus on special needs programs prior to having your child?

I imagine it's pretty common for people to get involved with such a cause after they or a loved one are affected.

[packinpatland]

I'd say that if a "special needs" Mom thought the state spent too much on special needs, then they probably were.

You're sourcing Keith Olberman now? Seriously?

The link PIP posted was for something about Special Olympics, but it sounds like you're talking about funding for education (that's the context in which special needs is typically used). If that's the case, you should know that FEDERAL funding for special needs education is a complete joke. And it's far greater than state funding. To suggest otherwise you'd have to want to revert to warehousing kids in special ed classes that are really nothing more than glorified parking lots. Hopefully Palin will have her eyes opened as her new grandchild makes his/her way through the educational system.

Where do I start?.......................
Forget it.......I've been fighting the special needs battle for over 20 years.
Few care until it's personal.

And not that it matters.....but it's her son, not her grandchild.

[packinpatland]

I'd say that if a "special needs" Mom thought the state spent too much on special needs, then they probably were.

You're sourcing Keith Olberman now? Seriously?

Ditto.

PIP, are you an Obama campaign worker or something?

Are you seriously suggesting Gov. Palin is callous towards families with "special needs" children?

I am not saying she is callous. But I do liken her to Michael J. Fox......do you really think he gave a second thought to Parkinson's before he himself became afflicted?


Well, how much did you focus on special needs programs prior to having your child?

I worked as an volunteer aid in the school system for alot of years, I also was one of the first workers for Special Olympics in our area. Also helped get Best Buddies started in the school system.
All this BEFORE by daughter became disabled at the age of 4.

[Scott Campbell]

I'd say that if a "special needs" Mom thought the state spent too much on special needs, then they probably were.

You're sourcing Keith Olberman now? Seriously?

Ditto.

PIP, are you an Obama campaign worker or something?

Are you seriously suggesting Gov. Palin is callous towards families with "special needs" children?

I am not saying she is callous. But I do liken her to Michael J. Fox......do you really think he gave a second thought to Parkinson's before he himself became afflicted?


Well, how much did you focus on special needs programs prior to having your child?

I worked as an volunteer aid in the school system for alot of years, I also was one of the first workers for Special Olympics in our area. Also helped get Best Buddies started in the school system.


I'm guessing that makes you the exception to the rule.

[packinpatland]

Geez.......thanks Scott.

[HowardRoark]

To suggest otherwise you'd have to want to revert to warehousing kids in special ed classes that are really nothing more than glorified parking lots. Hopefully Palin will have her eyes opened as her new grandchild makes his/her way through the educational system.

Has it been determined that Bristol's unborn child has special needs too?

[Scott Campbell]

Geez.......thanks Scott.


Sorry if I've offended. I didn't intend to. But I don't think most people get heavily involved with a cause until after they're affected.


Am I that off base? It wouldn't be the first time.

[packinpatland]

No offense taken.
You sure make a case tho, for why alot of parents of special needs kids aren't exactly thrilled with Palin 'using' her son, and making promises.

[Zool]

But I do liken her to Michael J. Fox......do you really think he gave a second thought to Parkinson's before he himself became afflicted?

See now thats callous. Guy had Parkinsons for quite a long time now actually. He was diagnosed in 91, but said nothing about it until 98.

[Scott Campbell]

No offense taken.
You sure make a case tho, for why alot of parents of special needs kids aren't exactly thrilled with Palin 'using' her son, and making promises.




I guess that's one way to look at it. Though it's pretty ugly and cynical. It'd be like accusing Obama of exploiting his race, or McCain of exploiting his POW experience. I choose not to go there.

[oregonpackfan]

Palin is hardly an advocate of children's concerns, be they special needs or others.

As Governor, she cut funding for a program to reduce high school dropouts. This program had a successful track record for years.

She also cut funding for a program to assist homeless teenage girls.

She has also stated that sex education programs in schools should be limited to abstinence-only programs.

[Freak Out]

Palin is hardly an advocate of children's concerns, be they special needs or others.

As Governor, she cut funding for a program to reduce high school dropouts. This program had a successful track record for years.

She also cut funding for a program to assist homeless teenage girls.

She has also stated that sex education programs in schools should be limited to abstinence-only programs.

She is the veto queen with the line item power here in AK. Thankfully the legislature overrode many of her outrageous budget cuts. Just because we have overflowing coffers is no reason to go hog wild but some of these programs are much needed.

[Kiwon]

Palin is hardly an advocate of children's concerns, be they special needs or others.

As Governor, she cut funding for a program to reduce high school dropouts. This program had a successful track record for years.

She also cut funding for a program to assist homeless teenage girls.

She has also stated that sex education programs in schools should be limited to abstinence-only programs.

And don't forget she had an 80% approval rating.

4 out of 5 Alaskans are cruel and heartless towards children. :roll:

[MJZiggy]

What's the percentage of Alaskans who are men again? Men aren't always known to think with their brains... :P

[packinpatland]

Palin is hardly an advocate of children's concerns, be they special needs or others.

As Governor, she cut funding for a program to reduce high school dropouts. This program had a successful track record for years.

She also cut funding for a program to assist homeless teenage girls.

She has also stated that sex education programs in schools should be limited to abstinence-only programs.

And don't forget she had an 80% approval rating.

4 out of 5 Alaskans are cruel and heartless towards children. :roll:

Had alot to do with those checks they got in the mail........that she increased..... :wink:

[packinpatland]

I worked as an volunteer aid in the school system for alot of years, I also was one of the first workers for Special Olympics in our area. Also helped get Best Buddies started in the school system.
All this BEFORE by daughter became disabled at the age of 4.


Just wanted to clarify......it wasn't Special Olympics that I workd on/with, it was Unified Games. The difference is special needs children buddyup with regular kids..........both of my older daughters participated the entire time they were age eligible.

[Kiwon]

PIP, I hope all parents of special needs kids, regardless of political affiliation, would condemn this kind of product.

Here's a T-shirt produced by sickos.

http://www.tshirthell.com/shirts/products/a1098/a1098_thumb.jpg

[packinpatland]

PIP, I hope all parents of special needs kids, regardless of political affiliation, would condemn this kind of product.

Here's a T-shirt produced by sickos.

http://www.tshirthell.com/shirts/products/a1098/a1098_thumb.jpg

Not just parents of special needs kids...............all human life form should condemn this type of 'product'.

Any idea where it came from?

[Tyrone Bigguns]

The shirt came from tshirthell.com. Hardly a political organization. I know quite a bit about them as they were a competitor of ours (former company).

They produce their own content, and user generated content...much of it bordering on very bad taste.

As usual...kiwon likes to play fast and loose with the rules. Guess Rush or whoever informs him didnt' bother to let him know about:

http://www.tshirthell.com/shirts/products/a1069/a1069_bm.gif

or this one:

http://www.tshirthell.com/shirts/products/a1030/a1030_thumb.jpg

or this one:

http://www.tshirthell.com/shirts/products/a927/a927_thumb.gif

Kiwon, you are such a sheep, it is almost painful watching you recycle garbage.

[Kiwon]

They produce their own content, and user generated content...much of it bordering on very bad taste.

Bad taste? How would you know?

[HowardRoark]

I always thought this was a classy one by the Moveon.org set:

http://thynkhard.tripod.com/BushSpecialOlympics.jpg

[Tyrone Bigguns]

C'mon howard, let's not pretend that both sides don't produce stupid shit.

But, here..in this forum..only one side perpetuates that kind of stuff..and it aint' the libs.

If it isn't kiwon posting the collage of Hillary..it is kiwon with this stupid tee shirt and accusing liberals of producing it.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

They produce their own content, and user generated content...much of it bordering on very bad taste.

Bad taste? How would you know?

I use your posts as an example.

[Maxie the Taxi]

Palin is hardly an advocate of children's concerns, be they special needs or others.

As Governor, she cut funding for a program to reduce high school dropouts. This program had a successful track record for years.

She also cut funding for a program to assist homeless teenage girls.

She has also stated that sex education programs in schools should be limited to abstinence-only programs.

Thanks for the info. I wasn't aware she did all this. Now I've got several more reasons to vote for her.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I love when liberals complain about education spending.

Since the early 1970s, inflation-adjusted federal spending per pupil has doubled. Over that period, student performance has not markedly improved. Under Bush, federal education spending has increased by 40%.

But the liberals have been using the same tired rhetoric for several decades. Let's spend more. Let's criticize any politician who has the guts to say what we are doing just isn't working.

Another issue where the Democrat's position sounds good to voters. Everybody is for spending more on our education, right? Even though that inevitably means taxes go up even further. It isn't working.

[HowardRoark]

I love when liberals complain about education spending.

Since the early 1970s, inflation-adjusted federal spending per pupil has doubled. Over that period, student performance has not markedly improved. Under Bush, federal education spending has increased by 40%.

But the liberals have been using the same tired rhetoric for several decades. Let's spend more. Let's criticize any politician who has the guts to say what we are doing just isn't working.

Another issue where the Democrat's position sounds good to voters. Everybody is for spending more on our education, right? Even though that inevitably means taxes go up even further. It isn't working.

Don't let the facts get in the way....change the premise.

http://i43.tower.com/cover-art/mm100357361/vision-anointed-thomas-sowell-paperback-cover.jpg

[Tyrone Bigguns]

I love when liberals complain about education spending.

Since the early 1970s, inflation-adjusted federal spending per pupil has doubled. Over that period, student performance has not markedly improved. Under Bush, federal education spending has increased by 40%.

But the liberals have been using the same tired rhetoric for several decades. Let's spend more. Let's criticize any politician who has the guts to say what we are doing just isn't working.

Another issue where the Democrat's position sounds good to voters. Everybody is for spending more on our education, right? Even though that inevitably means taxes go up even further. It isn't working.

I love it when conservs merely post Heritage foundation rhetoric.

"You can't call yourself a think tank if all your ideas are stupid."

[digitaldean]

The money supplied to schools is mis-managed.

I dealt professionally with many teachers that want to teach but are hamstrung by idiotic administrators (i.e., those who couldn't cut it teaching) that muck up the system with all sorts of politically correct initiatives or nonsensical guidelines that do not promote fundamental or technical skills necessary to succeed in the workplace.

In Wisconsin there appears to be a lack of common sense on how to allocate funds. Look at vouchers and the furor raised over them by the teacher's unions in Milwaukee.

MPS schools in general have only a 46% graduation rate - one of the worst in the nation.
http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=734527
While those attending voucher schools have a higher graduation rate.
http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=755102

[HarveyWallbangers]

I love it when conservs merely post Heritage foundation rhetoric.

"You can't call yourself a think tank if all your ideas are stupid."

Do you have a point?

[HowardRoark]

I love when liberals complain about education spending.

Since the early 1970s, inflation-adjusted federal spending per pupil has doubled. Over that period, student performance has not markedly improved. Under Bush, federal education spending has increased by 40%.

But the liberals have been using the same tired rhetoric for several decades. Let's spend more. Let's criticize any politician who has the guts to say what we are doing just isn't working.

Another issue where the Democrat's position sounds good to voters. Everybody is for spending more on our education, right? Even though that inevitably means taxes go up even further. It isn't working.

I love it when conservs merely post Heritage foundation rhetoric.

"You can't call yourself a think tank if all your ideas are stupid."


An ad hominem argument, also known as argumentum ad hominem (Latin: "argument to the man", "argument against the man") consists of replying to an argument or factual claim by attacking or appealing to a characteristic or belief of the person making the argument or claim, rather than by addressing the substance of the argument or producing evidence against the claim. The process of proving or disproving the claim is thereby subverted, and the argumentum ad hominem works to change the subject.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

I love it when conservs merely post Heritage foundation rhetoric.

"You can't call yourself a think tank if all your ideas are stupid."

Do you have a point?

Do i ever?

[HowardRoark]

I love it when conservs merely post Heritage foundation rhetoric.

"You can't call yourself a think tank if all your ideas are stupid."

Do you have a point?

Do i ever?

QFT

[Tyrone Bigguns]

I love it when conservs merely post Heritage foundation rhetoric.

"You can't call yourself a think tank if all your ideas are stupid."

Do you have a point?

Do i ever?

QFT

You have proven my point. Thanx!

[digitaldean]

Regarding special needs....

It comes to the same areas regarding any issue. One doesn't think or do as much about a topic unless they know, are related to or work with people that have a specific medical condition/disease or handicap.

I have an in-law that's a special needs person. I have a loved one with MS and another with the onset of Alzheimer's. I did not think as much about these issues until they've affected me.

To say Sarah Palin is a heartless idealogue that stamps out all redeeming social necessities is being disingenuous at best. I've done a cursory look at her record as governor.

Her record shows:
-She has helped create an online training program for developing marketable skills.
-Used technology to help improve care of those in remote/rural Alaskan towns.
-Any check over $1,000 written by Alaskan gov't is posted on the Div. of Finance website.
http://www.betanews.com/article/Where_does_Sarah_Palin_stand_on_technology_issues/1220649619
So there are two sides to every coin.....

I'm glad she's disagreeing with McCain on ANWR. She is still trying to convince McCain about drilling there. I want a Veep that isn't a robot for the party's/candidates talking points.

[sheepshead]

I'd say that if a "special needs" Mom thought the state spent too much on special needs, then they probably were.

You're sourcing Keith Olberman now? Seriously?

She wasn't a special needs mom when she reduced the budget for the Special Olympics. She's been a special needs mom for a nano second....a few months.......let's discuss this in 20+ years.

I find Keith Olberman highly 'entertaining'...........much like Bill O'Reilly.

You're the one!!

[packinpatland]

I'd say that if a "special needs" Mom thought the state spent too much on special needs, then they probably were.

You're sourcing Keith Olberman now? Seriously?

She wasn't a special needs mom when she reduced the budget for the Special Olympics. She's been a special needs mom for a nano second....a few months.......let's discuss this in 20+ years.

I find Keith Olberman highly 'entertaining'...........much like Bill O'Reilly.

You're the one!!

Not all together sure how you mean that......

[cpk1994]

I'm glad she's disagreeing with McCain on ANWR. She is still trying to convince McCain about drilling there. I want a Veep that isn't a robot for the party's/candidates talking points.McCain has already changed his tune and is now Pro-drilling in ANWR. He has been using it to beat Obama over the head with.

[MJZiggy]

They're playing a lot of commercials around here (we have a lot of private labs and NIH) saying the McCain is all for stem cell research. I wonder how long stem cell research would continue if anything ever happened to him?

[bobblehead]

They're playing a lot of commercials around here (we have a lot of private labs and NIH) saying the McCain is all for stem cell research. I wonder how long stem cell research would continue if anything ever happened to him?

Pretty sure he saw that episode of southpark where christopher reeves sucked the stem cells out of embryos so he could walk. Mccain is thinking he can beat back the grim reaper if he can suck some stem cells.

[SkinBasket]

They're playing a lot of commercials around here (we have a lot of private labs and NIH) saying the McCain is all for stem cell research. I wonder how long stem cell research would continue if anything ever happened to him?

Just long enough to resurrect his dead corpse, I'm sure, and return him to life as a zealot nazi zombie. Seriously, WTF? Oh, I forgot. You're "independent."

[MJZiggy]

The question isn't political leaning, it's that he is taking a stance that is obviously polar opposite to his running mate. Also considering that there may be a cure for Alzheimers in the stem cells perhaps I won't have to panic every time there's a word on the tip of my tongue and I can't get at it. That would be a nice thought...

[mraynrand]

The question isn't political leaning, it's that he is taking a stance that is obviously polar opposite to his running mate. Also considering that there may be a cure for Alzheimers in the stem cells perhaps I won't have to panic every time there's a word on the tip of my tongue and I can't get at it. That would be a nice thought...
Zig, you presumably have lots of useful neuronal cells that I can drag from your brain and use to treat people less fortunate. I'll be there to collect them tomorrow. Since there is the chance they might be useful for treatment, why shouldn't you let me use them?

[SkinBasket]

Well, there might be a cure for cancer in my seamen too, but when you strip away the politics from scientific funding, there's a lot you never knew about science. Unfortunately, the liberals aren't interested in my baby batter.

[MJZiggy]

The question isn't political leaning, it's that he is taking a stance that is obviously polar opposite to his running mate. Also considering that there may be a cure for Alzheimers in the stem cells perhaps I won't have to panic every time there's a word on the tip of my tongue and I can't get at it. That would be a nice thought...
Zig, you presumably have lots of useful neuronal cells that I can drag from your brain and use to treat people less fortunate. I'll be there to collect them tomorrow. Since there is the chance they might be useful for treatment, why shouldn't you let me use them?

It's not about people less fortunate, but nice try at spinning it. It's about using cord blood which is readily available since most parents don't think to store it and which is also loaded with stem cells and doing something useful with it. Skin, I gotta say that while your wife might have high hopes for your baby batter, there's never been any kind of research done that baby batter is good for much besides making babies as the cells only have half the genetic material needed. Sperm can be sperm, but stem cells can be anything (with the possible exception of sperm...)

Everyone's so quick to toss the idea out as they had been getting the cells from aborted fetuses, but guess what? The fetuses aren't any less dead now that the cells were left in them. They threw the baby out with the bath water, but if they'd have just thought about it a bit more, there are ways around the problem. My problem with Palin is that she'll never see that. She has her mind firmly closed from what I can see.

[mraynrand]

The question isn't political leaning, it's that he is taking a stance that is obviously polar opposite to his running mate. Also considering that there may be a cure for Alzheimers in the stem cells perhaps I won't have to panic every time there's a word on the tip of my tongue and I can't get at it. That would be a nice thought...
Zig, you presumably have lots of useful neuronal cells that I can drag from your brain and use to treat people less fortunate. I'll be there to collect them tomorrow. Since there is the chance they might be useful for treatment, why shouldn't you let me use them?

It's not about people less fortunate, but nice try at spinning it. It's about using cord blood which is readily available since most parents don't think to store it and which is also loaded with stem cells and doing something useful with it. Skin, I gotta say that while your wife might have high hopes for your baby batter, there's never been any kind of research done that baby batter is good for much besides making babies as the cells only have half the genetic material needed. Sperm can be sperm, but stem cells can be anything (with the possible exception of sperm...)

Everyone's so quick to toss the idea out as they had been getting the cells from aborted fetuses, but guess what? The fetuses aren't any less dead now that the cells were left in them. They threw the baby out with the bath water, but if they'd have just thought about it a bit more, there are ways around the problem. My problem with Palin is that she'll never see that. She has her mind firmly closed from what I can see.

Someone with Alzheimer's isn't less fortunate? My, you're cynical.

Cord blood stem cells is completely different from embryonic stem cells.

I like your Brave New World of scientists hanging around abortion clinics to harvest stem cells from developing humans destroyed in the name of 'choice.'

I think we should be able to use your brain cells for research. I promise to give you the kind of anesthetic to put you into a dreamless sleep before I blenderize your brain to get the cells. It won't hurt at all - certainly no more than harvesting stem cells from a three month old tossed into the dumpster out back of an abortion clinic. Why are your brain cells any more precious than those from 3 month old humans?

[MJZiggy]

Because I happen to still be alive. The sad fact is that abortion is legal and like it or not, people do it. It's better to throw them in the dumpster and let that little life be a complete waste? Nothing you do is going to bring them back and comparing taking the cells from a dead fetus to taking them from a living, functioning (sometimes) adult is a little silly. Besides, already formed adult cells will never offer the benefits that stem cells will.

[mraynrand]

Besides, already formed adult cells will never offer the benefits that stem cells will.

ahh, now you're both a world-famous scientist and a fortune teller. Tell me, molecular and cellular biology sage, how do you know that adult cells will 'never' offer the same benefits as stem cells? Which adult cells? Which stem cells?

[mraynrand]

Nothing you do is going to bring them back and comparing taking the cells from a dead fetus to taking them from a living, functioning (sometimes) adult is a little silly.

It doesn't really work that way. Cellular degeneration starts instantly following death, so to effectively harvest cells from a fetus requires that you start dissecting the baby essentially while it's still alive. Also, if you want specific cells, they you can't just toss the baby in the blender like a normal abortion, you'd have to deliver it as alive as possible and then start a careful dissection to get the cells you want. Where do you think the type of coordinated effort you would need to extract cells from a developing baby would lead?

[HowardRoark]

Because I happen to still be alive.

That seems to be the crux of the macro-debate. What about harvesting from real old people who's life doesn't have much value anymore......or is just a pain in the ass?

And then, what about healthy middle age pains in the asses?

[mraynrand]

Because I happen to still be alive.

That seems to be the crux of the macro-debate. What about harvesting from real old people who's life doesn't have much value anymore......or is just a pain in the ass?

And then, what about healthy middle age pains in the asses?

I have a new van that I purchased, that I painted up with the logo "STEM CELL VAN." I drive around Cleveland looking for homeless people that no one will miss anyways. I lure 'em in with an alcoholic beverage (which is actually an elixer to loosen up cell adhesion) and then I harvest stem cells. It's a two-fer - just like using aborted babies - I clean up the streets and provide stem cells to cure Alzheimers. It's easier than just collecting homicide victims, since I don't have to worry about lead contamination.

[MJZiggy]

Besides, already formed adult cells will never offer the benefits that stem cells will.

ahh, now you're both a world-famous scientist and a fortune teller. Tell me, molecular and cellular biology sage, how do you know that adult cells will 'never' offer the same benefits as stem cells? Which adult cells? Which stem cells?

Stem cells are valuable because they can be any kind of cell in the body. Adult cells are already differentiated. And don't get all snarky with me. I'm trying to have a discussion here and your comments about fortune telling and world class science are a bit silly as are suggesting that we just kill off functioning adults. If when Alzheimers takes my father, they can have his brain for research as far as I'm concerned and, yes, it is in my will and in my living will that my organs be harvested and what's left go to research, so, yes, in theory I've already donated my brain cells for harvest if they can find any worth taking...Woe be to the person who gets my myopic eyeballs...