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LL2
10-30-2008, 09:44 AM
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/10/26/AR2008102602505.html

This is very interesting. Many Americans are afraid of the government control that will begin if Obama becomes president. There was a sound bite that was played on the John and Cisco show on Chicago's 560 AM (http://560wind.townhall.com/) of Obama talking about how he believes individual's have the right to own guns but supports legislative restrictions on ownership. I'm paraphrasing, but if you have the time to listen to the second hour of the John and Cisco show you will be able to hear it.

Gun Sales Thriving In Uncertain Times

By Fredrick Kunkle
Washington Post Staff Writer
Monday, October 27, 2008; A01


Americans have cut back on buying cars, furniture and clothes in a tough economy, but there's one consumer item that's still enjoying healthy sales: guns. Purchases of firearms and ammunition have risen 8 to 10 percent this year, according to state and federal data.

Several variables drive sales, but many dealers, buyers and experts attribute the increase in part to concerns about the economy and fears that if Sen. Barack Obama of Illinois wins the presidency, he will join with fellow Democrats in Congress to enact new gun controls. Obama has said that he believes in an individual right to bear arms but that he also supports "common-sense safety measures."

"Even though [Obama] has a lot going for him, he's not very pro-gun," said Paul Pluff, a spokesman for Massachusetts-based Smith & Wesson, which has reported higher sales. Gun enthusiasts are "going to go out and get [firearms] while they still can."

Gun purchases have also been climbing because of the worsening economy, which fuels fears of crime and civil disorder, industry sources and specialists said.

"Generally, we know that hard economic times always result in firearm sales," said James M. Purtilo of Silver Spring, who publishes the Tripwire Newsletter.

Gary Kleck, a researcher at Florida State University's College of Criminology and Criminal Justice whose work was cited in the District's recent Supreme Court gun-control case, said that although there are no scientific studies linking gun sales and economic conditions, people often buy firearms during periods of uncertainty. People often buy weapons because of concerns about personal safety or government actions to limit access to firearms, causing spikes in sales, Kleck said.

Industry experts and law enforcement officials point to several examples over the years. In 1994, there was a rush to buy guns when President Bill Clinton pushed for a ban on military-style semiautomatic rifles. Handgun sales jumped last year after the massacre at Virginia Tech as some worried about personal protection and others feared sweeping restrictions on handguns, pushing applications for concealed gun permits in Virginia alone up 60 percent. People also rushed to buy guns after the 1992 riots in Los Angeles and the breakdown of order in New Orleans after Hurricane Katrina.

Bob Leyshion, who visited a gun shop in Manassas recently, said the economic crisis and Obama's lead in the polls were on his mind.

"People are preparing for catastrophe right now," said Leyshion, 55, of Nokesville. "It's insurance. With the stock market crash and people out of work, and the illegal aliens in this area, the probability of civil disorder is very high."

Gun owners haven't been especially thrilled about the prospect of Sen. John McCain in the White House. They see the Arizona Republican as less of a threat than Obama, but they are still angry over McCain's support for certain gun-control measures in the past, such as requiring purchasers at gun shows to undergo background checks.

Gun owners said McCain's moose-hunting running mate, Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin, is far more likely to champion Second Amendment rights.

"The industry and sportsmen have not been in love with McCain, but the selection of Palin wiped that all away," said Anthony Aeschliman, a spokesman for the National Shooting Sports Foundation.

More than three dozen interviews with gun dealers and buyers in Virginia and Maryland and with experts nationwide indicated that the increase in gun sales appears to be driven predominantly by concerns about the presidential election and the economy.

Gun buyers were more likely to say they were responding to the political situation than to the economy, and all but three people said they feared that Obama would restrict gun rights. Two who indicated that they would support Obama anyway said their concerns about the economy and health care outweighed those about gun rights.

Most buyers who emphasized the economy said they thought the worsening situation could lead to an increase in crime and jeopardize their safety. A few said they were buying guns as an investment.

"Look at the political situation and the financial situation," said Fred Russell, owner of Russell's Gun Emporium in Hagerstown, Md. "It's common sense. People are scared."

Brad, 42, and Margaret Marcus, 47, who were at a Fairfax County shooting range recently with their two children for weekly target practice, said they sped up the purchase of two semiautomatic rifles that had been banned during the Clinton administration because they feared they could become illegal again if Obama wins. The couple, who run an online retailing business from their Ashburn home, said they viewed Obama's remarks about protecting the Second Amendment as campaign trail "pandering."

"I think right now people are scared Obama is going to take their rights away," said Margaret Marcus, who was carrying a Glock 19 9mm semiautomatic pistol under a blue jean jacket embroidered with "Winnie the Pooh" characters. "He's definitely anti-gun, despite what you see in the mainstream media."

Law enforcement and industry data and anecdotal reports show that guns are selling well this year. In 2008, there were 8.4 million background checks from Jan. 1 to Sept. 28, compared with 7.7 million in the same period last year, a 9 percent increase, according to the FBI's National Instant Criminal Background Check System.

The increase is also notable because it follows a heavy year for gun purchases, which industry officials and experts link to the Virginia Tech shootings in April 2007 and a burgeoning housing market crisis. NICS checks show a 20 percent increase in April 2007, compared with the previous year.

This year's jump is a continuation of a trend that began in 2006, about the time the housing bubble popped in parts of the nation, and remained steady last year as the political season began to take shape and the housing crisis grew. It is also a bigger jump than the average annual increases of about 5 percent or less typical since instant background checks began in 1998.

Federal tax data also show that quarterly excise taxes collected on sales of firearms and ammunition have increased about 10 percent this year, compared with last year, according to the National Shooting Sports Foundation.

Gunmakers see the same trend. "We're ahead of last year," said Pluff, of Smith & Wesson. "There's a few things that drive the market, and one of them is political elections."

On a recent weekend, a crowd of lookers and buyers milled around in the Virginia Arms Co. in Manassas. Some were shopping for large-capacity magazines, or clips, that attach to firearms and hold additional rounds of ammo. Those were banned during the Clinton administration and became legal again when the ban expired.

"I'm looking for gun clips because I got the funny feeling that prices are going to rise, or they're going to be banned," said Wayne Heglar, 48, who lives in Aldie and builds custom motorcycles. Heglar said he also planned to stock up on ammo.

"When the Democrats are in office, it seems like anti-gunners come out of the woodwork," Heglar said. He said he expected Obama to use tax law to restrict gun ownership. "A bullet will be a luxury," he said.

At Clark Brothers Gun Shop in Warrenton, a sign over the door says: "Experts Agree . . . Gun Control Works!" Underneath are photos of Hitler, Stalin, Fidel Castro and Libyan leader Moammar Gaddafi. There are also posters that criticize Obama's record on guns.

Steve Clark, the shop's owner, said customers have been buying weapons they fear would be restricted and that have been before, such as Colt AR-15s, semiautomatic rifles that go for $1,100.

"What I hear a lot is fear that Barack will win the election and tax everything to the point that you can't afford anything," said salesman Eugene Proko, 51.

packinpatland
10-30-2008, 09:58 AM
How many more times do we need this to happen?

http://www.courant.com/community/news/ec/hc-ap-gunaccident-1027,0,7933566.story

WESTFIELD, Mass. - An 8-year-old boy died after accidentally shooting himself in the head while firing an Uzi submachine gun under adult supervision at a gun fair.

The boy lost control of the weapon while firing it Sunday at the Machine Gun Shoot and Firearms Expo at the Westfield Sportsman's Club, Police Lt. Lawrence Valliere said. Police identified the child Monday as Christopher Bizilj of Ashford, Conn.

Christopher was with a certified instructor and "was shooting the weapon down range when the force of the weapon made it travel up and back toward his head, where he suffered the injury," a police statement said. Police called it a "self-inflicted accidental shooting."

The boy was taken to Baystate Medical Center where he died.

The boy's father, Dr. Charles Bizilj, met with the school's crisis team this morning. Two school psychologists are meeting with teachers and students in classrooms and additional counseling will be available during the week.

Lanza said teachers and administrators who knew Christopher described him as "a super kid."

"Everybody likes him and he was a good student," he said. "It's absolutely tragic."

Dr. Bizilj is the medical director of emergency and critical care at Johnson Memorial Hospital in Stafford. He joined the hospital in 1989 as an emergency department physician.

"The Johnson Memorial Corporation family is deeply saddened and our thoughts and prayers are with the Bizilj family," a hospital spokeswoman said.

Although the death appears to be an accident, police and the Hampden district attorney's office were investigating, officials said.

District Attorney William Bennett declined to comment until the investigation was complete.

"We are going to review all the circumstance regarding what happened, who was involved, what authorities they may or may not have had, who was supervising," Bennett said.

It is legal for children to fire a weapon if they have permission from a parent or legal guardian and are supervised by a properly certified and licensed instructor, Lt. Hipolito Nunez said.

Those conditions were met in this case, he said. He declined to release the supervisor's name.

The club said on its Web site that the event, run in conjunction with C.O.P Firearms and Training, is "all legal and fun" and people would be allowed to fire weapons at vehicles, pumpkins and other targets.

Officials with the private club and the firearms group could not be reached for comment. A message left on a club answering machine was not returned. The C.O.P. group's machine clicked off without taking a message.

The sportsman's club was founded in 1949 and describes itself on its Web site as an organization that promotes "the interest of legal sport with rod, gun, and bow and arrow, both directly and through training."

It has eight firing ranges as well as archery and fishing facilities located on 375 acres in Westfield, about 100 miles west of Boston.

Funeral arrangements are pending.

SkinBasket
10-30-2008, 10:02 AM
nevermind

sheepshead
10-30-2008, 10:06 AM
How many more times do we need this to happen?

http://www.courant.com/community/news/ec/hc-ap-gunaccident-1027,0,7933566.story

WESTFIELD, Mass. - An 8-year-old boy died after accidentally shooting himself in the head while firing an Uzi submachine gun under adult supervision at a gun fair.

The boy lost control of the weapon while firing it Sunday at the Machine Gun Shoot and Firearms Expo at the Westfield Sportsman's Club, Police Lt. Lawrence Valliere said. Police identified the child Monday as Christopher Bizilj of Ashford, Conn.

Christopher was with a certified instructor and "was shooting the weapon down range when the force of the weapon made it travel up and back toward his head, where he suffered the injury," a police statement said. Police called it a "self-inflicted accidental shooting."

The boy was taken to Baystate Medical Center where he died.

The boy's father, Dr. Charles Bizilj, met with the school's crisis team this morning. Two school psychologists are meeting with teachers and students in classrooms and additional counseling will be available during the week.

Lanza said teachers and administrators who knew Christopher described him as "a super kid."

"Everybody likes him and he was a good student," he said. "It's absolutely tragic."

Dr. Bizilj is the medical director of emergency and critical care at Johnson Memorial Hospital in Stafford. He joined the hospital in 1989 as an emergency department physician.

"The Johnson Memorial Corporation family is deeply saddened and our thoughts and prayers are with the Bizilj family," a hospital spokeswoman said.

Although the death appears to be an accident, police and the Hampden district attorney's office were investigating, officials said.

District Attorney William Bennett declined to comment until the investigation was complete.

"We are going to review all the circumstance regarding what happened, who was involved, what authorities they may or may not have had, who was supervising," Bennett said.

It is legal for children to fire a weapon if they have permission from a parent or legal guardian and are supervised by a properly certified and licensed instructor, Lt. Hipolito Nunez said.

Those conditions were met in this case, he said. He declined to release the supervisor's name.

The club said on its Web site that the event, run in conjunction with C.O.P Firearms and Training, is "all legal and fun" and people would be allowed to fire weapons at vehicles, pumpkins and other targets.

Officials with the private club and the firearms group could not be reached for comment. A message left on a club answering machine was not returned. The C.O.P. group's machine clicked off without taking a message.

The sportsman's club was founded in 1949 and describes itself on its Web site as an organization that promotes "the interest of legal sport with rod, gun, and bow and arrow, both directly and through training."

It has eight firing ranges as well as archery and fishing facilities located on 375 acres in Westfield, about 100 miles west of Boston.

Funeral arrangements are pending.

Google the number of murders in Chicago, Barrys district. Entirely run by Dems. That Hudson girls nephew. This is what Barry has planned for us?? swell!

packinpatland
10-30-2008, 10:10 AM
Perhaps you should ask that question of the NRA.
An Uzi submachine gun.................come on, show me where any one needs one.

mraynrand
10-30-2008, 10:33 AM
Sounds a bit like natural selection. What moron would let his 8 year old fire an Uzi? I didn't let my son use mine until he was 15 - and then only to shoot ground squirrels in the yard - or to help in stealing beer from a garage down the block.

SkinBasket
10-30-2008, 10:34 AM
Perhaps you should ask that question of the NRA.
An Uzi submachine gun.................come on, show me where any one needs one.

A toilet... come on show me where any one needs one.

Zool
10-30-2008, 10:38 AM
Perhaps you should ask that question of the NRA.
An Uzi submachine gun.................come on, show me where any one needs one.

A toilet... come on show me where any one needs one.

Yeah thats the same fucking thing. Assuming you hit people over the heads with toilets with the intent of "protecting your family".

Tard.

SkinBasket
10-30-2008, 10:41 AM
Perhaps you should ask that question of the NRA.
An Uzi submachine gun.................come on, show me where any one needs one.

A toilet... come on show me where any one needs one.

Yeah thats the same fucking thing. Assuming you hit people over the heads with toilets with the intent of "protecting your family".

Tard.

The argument isn't about killing people with toilets. The argument is about needing something. I propose we also do away with vehicles. They are very dangerous. And electricity. Refrigerators and fire are on my watch list.

SkinBasket
10-30-2008, 10:47 AM
The point being (for our slower witted friend[s]) that if the threshold for eliminating something is that it's dangerous and not necessary, you've got a big job ahead of you being outraged about the continued existence of those things which fit said criteria.

HowardRoark
10-30-2008, 10:48 AM
I propose we also do away with vehicles.

Yesterday's news.....

http://www.typicallyspanish.com/spain/uploads/1/al_gore.jpg

Zool
10-30-2008, 10:56 AM
The point being (for our slower witted friend[s]) that if the threshold for eliminating something is that it's dangerous and not necessary, you've got a big job ahead of you being outraged about the continued existence of those things which fit said criteria.

Fuckin A man. I've got 3 ICBM's at my place right now. When the Russians invade a la Red Dawn, I'll be ready.

Lets legalize meth too.

SkinBasket
10-30-2008, 10:58 AM
Lets legalize meth too.

We can work on that after getting the toilets banned.

Freak Out
10-30-2008, 11:29 AM
I grew up in a completely different world than the kid in Boston but I was hunting at his age. I had a 22 and would shoot the heads off of spruce grouse in the woods around my house. I was raised by a guy that grew up hunting in Alaska and did the same thing when he was my age. He taught me firearm safety and subsistence hunting "rules"and I respected him and followed those rules. The father of this kid as well as the person who had the Uzi at the firearms shoot are fucking idiots and should have never allowed the kid to shoot the thing. It's easy to loose control of a fully automatic weapon for an adult let alone a 8 year old. Sad story.

Deputy Nutz
10-30-2008, 12:16 PM
I grew up in a completely different world than the kid in Boston but I was hunting at his age. I had a 22 and would shoot the heads off of spruce grouse in the woods around my house. I was raised by a guy that grew up hunting in Alaska and did the same thing when he was my age. He taught me firearm safety and subsistence hunting "rules"and I respected him and followed those rules. The father of this kid as well as the person who had the Uzi at the firearms shoot are fucking idiots and should have never allowed the kid to shoot the thing. It's easy to loose control of a fully automatic weapon for an adult let alone a 8 year old. Sad story.

I agree, and they should be thrown in jail and made an example of, instead of the gun.

People like Packinpatland just don't understand that. It is easier to blame a simple piece of machinery than it is to throw the goddamn book at retards that get on the news and cry a river but always failing to mention their own stupidity and lack of judgment.

Do I think an UZI or a Tech-9 are important and needed? Hell no, I certainly can't use the thing for hunting, and it isn't like they are supremely accurate enough to use in home protection. They are small arms that provide a shit load of fire power for a short range, but as soon as some liberal passes enough litigation to ban weapons like these I will find myself in the woods with a single shot woodsmen rifle instead of my Browning BAR semi-auto 30-06. Slippery slope, at least thats what all the abortion leftist say, and gosh darn it I believe in that and I believe in the slippery slope effect for guns as well.

retailguy
10-30-2008, 12:28 PM
Perhaps you should ask that question of the NRA.
An Uzi submachine gun.................come on, show me where any one needs one.

So, under your logic, anything that is dangerous without a "defined purpose" should be banned. Ok, who gets to "define" the "defined purpose"?

I want to "define" the purpose for alcohol, specifically WINE. I propose that more kids are killed each year from unsupervised consumption of WINE, than are killed by an uzi each year.

I "define" that WINE should be banned. Immediately. Too many children are dying because they haven't been to appropriate "wine safety classes", nor have they waited the requisite number of years for legal wine consumption.

After all, it's the FAULT of the WINE, not the process/procedure/laws that are already in place...

HowardRoark
10-30-2008, 12:32 PM
come on, show me where any one needs one.

Hell, we’re plotting the succession as we speak. They might come in handy when we storm Alaska.

Freak Out
10-30-2008, 12:36 PM
come on, show me where any one needs one.

Hell, we’re plotting the succession as we speak. They might come in handy when we storm Alaska.

You stay the fuck out of here Roark...there is only room for one perfect example of the virtuous human male.

packinpatland
10-30-2008, 01:24 PM
Perhaps you should ask that question of the NRA.
An Uzi submachine gun.................come on, show me where any one needs one.

So, under your logic, anything that is dangerous without a "defined purpose" should be banned. Ok, who gets to "define" the "defined purpose"?

I want to "define" the purpose for alcohol, specifically WINE. I propose that more kids are killed each year from unsupervised consumption of WINE, than are killed by an uzi each year.

I "define" that WINE should be banned. Immediately. Too many children are dying because they haven't been to appropriate "wine safety classes", nor have they waited the requisite number of years for legal wine consumption.

After all, it's the FAULT of the WINE, not the process/procedure/laws that are already in place...

I've searched and searched I can't find anything that has been written about the redeemable value of an Uzi..........



Wine was created from the beginning to make men joyful, and not to make men drunk. Wine drunk with moderation is the joy of soul and the heart.
Ecclesiastes 31:35-36

Eat thy bread with joy, and drink thy wine with a merry heart.
Ecclesiastes 9:7

He makes grass grow for the cattle,
and plants for man to cultivate-
bringing forth food from the earth:
wine that gladdens the heart of man,
oil to make his face shine,
and bread that sustains his heart.
The trees of the Lord are well watered,
the cedars of Lebanon that he planted.
Psalm 104

Drink no longer water, but use a little wine for thy stomach's sake and thine often infirmities.
Timothy 5:23

He who loves not wine, women and song remains a fool his whole life long.
Martin Luther, German theologian, (1483-1546)
Beer is made by men, Wine by God.
Martin Luther, German founder of Lutheranism, (1483-1546)

Who does not love wine, women, and song, remains a fool his whole life long.
Martin Luther, German founder of Lutheranism, (1483-1546)

Wine is at the head of all medicines; where wine is lacking, drugs are necessary.
The Talmud

retailguy
10-30-2008, 02:00 PM
I've searched and searched I can't find anything that has been written about the redeemable value of an Uzi..........



Again, I reiterate. WHO gets to define "redeeming value"? It would seem that an Uzi, in the hands of someone whom society views as "responsible" causes NO harm and no threat.

Under the constitution, which I've lived under since birth, I was granted several personal "freedoms". With those freedoms come "responsibility". I can handle the "responsibility" so that kind of negates your "redeemable value" perspective.

As to wine, if it's killing kids, the benefit is far outweighed by the detriment. It is humorous the lengths we will go to in order to keep something we enjoy and don't find dangerous. All those bible verses you talk about talk about the "use" of wine in a "responsible sense". There are also several verses where it talks about people who use wine in a "non-responsible" fashion. Curious that you didn't cite those, as they back the UZI argument quite well.... :idea:

I don't even own a gun, and don't want one. That being said, I've never seen a gun that killed someone, every gun that was "involved" in killing someone had a person behind it.... I am on your side with regard to holding those fingers on the trigger responsible, as I am in holding those who provide/buy alchohol to minors responsible, but banning? STUPID.

I reiterate AGAIN. WHO gets to decide? YOU? ME? The chosen one? WHO? It is really a simple question.

I would maintain that "I" need to define what is appropriate in my life. I'm not excited about "The chosen One" or anyone else doing so. I'll take the responsibility that comes with the freedom to choose, and am willing to suffer the repercussions of a poor choice. What say you?

packinpatland
10-30-2008, 02:10 PM
Like you, I don't own a gun. My husband, father, brother,brother-in-laws, siter-in-law do. I have freezer that is half full of venison and moose meat. I am not advocating doing away with guns. I just don't see why we need those kinds (Uzi) of guns.

retailguy
10-30-2008, 02:17 PM
Like you, I don't own a gun. My husband, father, brother,brother-in-laws, siter-in-law do. I have freezer that is half full of venison and moose meat. I am not advocating doing away with guns. I just don't see why we need those kinds (Uzi) of guns.

And I don't see why we need those "kinds" of wine that appeal to children.


Where does this stop, and again, WHO gets to make that call?

SkinBasket
10-30-2008, 02:26 PM
Like you, I don't own a gun. My husband, father, brother,brother-in-laws, siter-in-law do. I have freezer that is half full of venison and moose meat. I am not advocating doing away with guns. I just don't see why we need those kinds (Uzi) of guns.

As nutz pointed out. All guns are rather simple mechanisms and they can all kill you. Just like all knives can kill you. Should we also legislate the maximum blade length, shape, and sharpness on all knives? Should any knife that falls outside of the 'useful' measurements be destroyed and their possession made illegal?

Zool
10-30-2008, 02:27 PM
I believe that line was drawn when fully automatic weapons were outlawed for the public.

Deputy Nutz
10-30-2008, 03:44 PM
I believe that line was drawn when fully automatic weapons were outlawed for the public.

And the next step, ban on semi-autos, bastards.

mraynrand
10-30-2008, 03:55 PM
A lawn mower can kill as well. I have pictures to prove it. Oh, GOD Dad, I'm SORRY!

MJZiggy
10-30-2008, 06:02 PM
Perhaps you should ask that question of the NRA.
An Uzi submachine gun.................come on, show me where any one needs one.

A toilet... come on show me where any one needs one.

Yeah thats the same fucking thing. Assuming you hit people over the heads with toilets with the intent of "protecting your family".

Tard.

The argument isn't about killing people with toilets. The argument is about needing something. I propose we also do away with vehicles. They are very dangerous. And electricity. Refrigerators and fire are on my watch list.

When my son was 8, I didn't let him drive lest he kill someone (or himself) with the car. I didn't let him wire things lest he electrocute himself. I don't see the real problem with the fridge, though I taught him not to climb in and he's not allowed to play with fire. While no, I really don't see the need for people to have Uzis, there is a real difference between between necessity and stupidity. The gun may be legal, but that was an absolutely idiotic thing to do with it.

retailguy
10-30-2008, 08:35 PM
but that was an absolutely idiotic thing to do with it.

WE AGREE ON SOMETHING! Praise the Lord.

I absolutely think that having an 8 year old fire an automatic weapon is CRIMINAL.

But why take the gun away from other law abiding people, because an occasional idiot can't be responsible? Isn't that also criminal in a different way?:?:

I can't get this question answered, nor, can I get the question answered of WHO is to make these decisions? Last I checked, we didn't have a dictator.

SkinBasket
10-30-2008, 09:11 PM
Perhaps you should ask that question of the NRA.
An Uzi submachine gun.................come on, show me where any one needs one.

A toilet... come on show me where any one needs one.

Yeah thats the same fucking thing. Assuming you hit people over the heads with toilets with the intent of "protecting your family".

Tard.

The argument isn't about killing people with toilets. The argument is about needing something. I propose we also do away with vehicles. They are very dangerous. And electricity. Refrigerators and fire are on my watch list.

When my son was 8, I didn't let him drive lest he kill someone (or himself) with the car. I didn't let him wire things lest he electrocute himself. I don't see the real problem with the fridge, though I taught him not to climb in and he's not allowed to play with fire. While no, I really don't see the need for people to have Uzis, there is a real difference between between necessity and stupidity. The gun may be legal, but that was an absolutely idiotic thing to do with it.

And like your examples an uzi, or any other sub-machine gun, was not made to be fired by an 8 year old. Just as cars are not designed to be driven by 8 year olds. Just like you don't see many 8 year old electricians mucking about. It's not the mechanism being used that is at fault, it is how it is being used. As you say, "that was an absolutely idiotic thing to do with it." Someone is using it in an idiotic fashion. The it is not using the person.

MJZiggy
10-30-2008, 09:48 PM
Skin, quit fighting with me, I'm agreeing with you. I don't personally see the need for an Uzi, but I haven't said anything abouat banning them either. The person who put the thing in the hands of an 8-year-old should be...I can't even think of what should happen to him.

RG, I seem to recall another thing we agreed on--actually a couple things.

Has anyone with the actual power to take guns away from anyone suggested doing it?

And lastly, in the article about gun ownership on the rise, that was a Post article and all the shops were around here, but what the article failed to mention was that DC just lifted a gun ban which in itself will inflate the market a bit I would think.

bobblehead
10-30-2008, 09:53 PM
Perhaps you should ask that question of the NRA.
An Uzi submachine gun.................come on, show me where any one needs one.

So, under your logic, anything that is dangerous without a "defined purpose" should be banned. Ok, who gets to "define" the "defined purpose"?

I want to "define" the purpose for alcohol, specifically WINE. I propose that more kids are killed each year from unsupervised consumption of WINE, than are killed by an uzi each year.

I "define" that WINE should be banned. Immediately. Too many children are dying because they haven't been to appropriate "wine safety classes", nor have they waited the requisite number of years for legal wine consumption.

After all, it's the FAULT of the WINE, not the process/procedure/laws that are already in place...

stop using logic and rational thought to ruin a perfectly emotional arguement.

bobblehead
10-30-2008, 09:58 PM
I've searched and searched I can't find anything that has been written about the redeemable value of an Uzi..........



Wine was created from the beginning to make men joyful, and not to make men drunk. Wine drunk with moderation is the joy of soul and the heart.
Ecclesiastes 31:35-36



See, if we could count on people to drink in "moderation" it would be fine...but how many times do I have to read a story about a business man who had one too many glasses of wine and ran over a 9 year old before we outlaw it?? Alchohol kills far far more people in america than guns do....away with alchohol I say.

PS..the purpose of guns in the constitution is to fight an oppressive leadership...the very kind that wants to take my guns...for that I NEED high power weaponry.