Can Packer Rats be saved?

[VegasPackFan]

I am not so sure.

Every thread seems to devolve into the same tired arguments about Ted Thompson/Brett Favre. This place always had great football talk, analysis and insight, along with good, spirited debate.

I find myself visiting less and less often. I was one of the guys that came along for the ride from JSO to the Christian site to here. I am seriously wondering if we will ever get back to the cool stuff that made it fun to read this every day.

I almost have to chuckle as each thread goes down the toilet. It is so predictable and old.

[Rastak]

I am not so sure.

Every thread seems to devolve into the same tired arguments about Ted Thompson/Brett Favre. This place always had great football talk, analysis and insight, along with good, spirited debate.

I find myself visiting less and less often. I was one of the guys that came along for the ride from JSO to the Christian site to here. I am seriously wondering if we will ever get back to the cool stuff that made it fun to read this every day.

I almost have to chuckle as each thread goes down the toilet. It is so predictable and old.


It can, issue a statement to all involved and if it gets ignored....OUT you go.

It sounded like Mad warned Tank, you create puppet accounts you get booted. He did, he get's booted.

[Deputy Nutz]

I had to stop the bickering, I am not changing how I feel I have just decided to not talk or write about it on here. Nobody is changing their minds and for everyone that chooses the "I told you so" argument regardless of side there are 100s of reasons why it matters or doesn't matter.

The only thing that we fools can know for certain is that Brett Favre is a New York Jet. Aaron Rodgers is the starting QB for the Packers. The Packers are 4-5. The Jets are 6-3.

The bottom line, this isn't just PackerRats. Many internet Packer forums are entertaining this same argument as we speak.

So I assume this thread will get blown up with the argument at around post 12.

[Freak Out]

I am not so sure.

Every thread seems to devolve into the same tired arguments about Ted Thompson/Brett Favre. This place always had great football talk, analysis and insight, along with good, spirited debate.


There is some very good football stuff going on here......you just have to be willing to sort through the BS sometimes to find it. The TT vs Favre stuff will go on for this season and into next if he plays well......oh well.

[GrnBay007]

PR is just fine.

I don't understand how anyone could think there would NOT be Favre talk this season, being his first season not with the Packers. Even if he had stayed retired there would have been talk and comparisons....it's just what happens when a player like Favre hands off the torch to a new QB. I'd be surprised if you could find a Packer forum out there that's not experiencing the same thing. However, I do wish posters would be more respectful, and not slobber all over the situation, so to speak. (from either point of view)

[mraynrand]

I am not so sure.

Every thread seems to devolve into the same tired arguments about Ted Thompson/Brett Favre. This place always had great football talk, analysis and insight, along with good, spirited debate.

I find myself visiting less and less often. I was one of the guys that came along for the ride from JSO to the Christian site to here. I am seriously wondering if we will ever get back to the cool stuff that made it fun to read this every day.

I almost have to chuckle as each thread goes down the toilet. It is so predictable and old.

Did you notice that our place kicker missed a 52 yarder with time running out. How come when Longwell or any other of those Viking kickers need a long FG in the piece of crap dome to win a game THEY hit is but our guy, who normally kicks on a crappy surface shanks a relatively easy kick. COME ON! MAKE THE KICK. 5-4 vs. 4-5 - the psychological difference is overwhelming. Oh. well, I just need a long walk to clear my head. I think I will only pee on trees in the yards of Viking fans.

[packinpatland]

I live next door to one :lol:

[Harlan Huckleby]

PR is just fine.

It is fine for Favre fans now, Favre is up, Packers/Rodgers down.

A few weeks ago when the situation was reversed, you were threatening to quit! :lol:

The amount of taunting by Favre Fans recently has been over the top. I recently became a Favre Fan myself, so I'm happy now, too.

Go Jets!

[MOBB DEEP]

PR is just fine.

I don't understand how anyone could think there would NOT be Favre talk this season, being his first season not with the Packers. Even if he had stayed retired there would have been talk and comparisons....it's just what happens when a player like Favre hands off the torch to a new QB. I'd be surprised if you could find a Packer forum out there that's not experiencing the same thing. However, I do wish posters would be more respectful, and not slobber all over the situation, so to speak. (from either point of view)


qft

i wonder what will happen if brett has bad game on thursday. will people start threads about how great a decison tt and the gang made regarding lord favre.....? its not like the die-hard favre fans out-number the tt apologists.

i recall several posters coming into the brett/jet thread bashing him (personally i can take the ribbing/rubbing in face b/c favre's not my blood kin). but now that the packs struggling theyre no where to be found. i dont see anything wrong with banter; folks just shouldnt be rude, name call or take this place too seriously imo

its the only game on so i imagine more folk around here will be tuning in and hopefully cheering for our qb from jan 08

[BZnDallas]

I am not so sure.

Every thread seems to devolve into the same tired arguments about Ted Thompson/Brett Favre. This place always had great football talk, analysis and insight, along with good, spirited debate.

I find myself visiting less and less often. I was one of the guys that came along for the ride from JSO to the Christian site to here. I am seriously wondering if we will ever get back to the cool stuff that made it fun to read this every day.

I almost have to chuckle as each thread goes down the toilet. It is so predictable and old.

Did you notice that our place kicker missed a 52 yarder with time running out. How come when Longwell or any other of those Viking kickers need a long FG in the piece of crap dome to win a game THEY hit is but our guy, who normally kicks on a crappy surface shanks a relatively easy kick. COME ON! MAKE THE KICK. 5-4 vs. 4-5 - the psychological difference is overwhelming. Oh. well, I just need a long walk to clear my head. I think I will only pee on trees in the yards of Viking fans.


my roommate is a Viking fan... maybe i'll go pee on his pillow!...

[MOBB DEEP]

PR is just fine.

It is fine for Favre fans now, Favre is up, Packers/Rodgers down.

A few weeks ago when the situation was reversed, you were threatening to quit! :lol:

The amount of taunting by Favre Fans recently has been over the top. I recently became a Favre Fan myself, so I'm happy now, too.

Go Jets!

lol

[Harlan Huckleby]

but now that the packs struggling theyre no where to be found

I think most people have lost interest in the story.

I really am rooting for Favre now, time heals all wounds.

[MOBB DEEP]

but now that the packs struggling theyre no where to be found

I think most people have lost interest in the story.

I really am rooting for Favre now, time heals all wounds.

HH, u REALLY think that if pack was doing great and favre was struggling "they" wouldnt be screaming from the mountaintop? thers only like 4 die hard disciples of the Lord and they "ruin" the forum??

out of courtesy, im never startn another favre thread but will post on a favre thread because i havent lost interest in him just yet

[GrnBay007]

PR is just fine.

It is fine for Favre fans now, Favre is up, Packers/Rodgers down.

A few weeks ago when the situation was reversed, you were threatening to quit! :lol:

The amount of taunting by Favre Fans recently has been over the top. I recently became a Favre Fan myself, so I'm happy now, too.

Go Jets!

You have that all wrong hun, I was not quiting PR....I was quiting my worthless, going nowhere, senseless conversation with you!! Big difference!

and...

I don't taunt!

[Harlan Huckleby]

I don't taunt!

I know you don't.

but I do!

Mobb, we've already had weeks where Favre has been down, Packers/Rodgers cruising. And there has been some noise from the TT apologists, as we like to call them. But lets be honest, the taunting from us Favre fans - you, me, gex, paco and GRBRulz, etc. has been greater.

[The Shadow]

It's gotten worse lately, no question.
So many folks are more interested in things having little to do with the Packers.

[MadtownPacker]

Your right Shadow, it has gotten worse. As a poster who does join in a lot of football discussion can you say you have helped the situation? You have taken jabs just like many other either for one side or the other?

If posters want it to get better they need to start with themselves. Dont think Im trying to call you out specifically cuz none of us here are angels. I just dont see how to stop it without zapping accounts and then where is the line drawn? Removing a avatar turns into a civil rights issue here so locking someone out would only be worse outrage. I think it is just a reflection of the inconsiderate and ignorant world we are becoming. Hopefully someone nukes us soon so we dont have to worry about it. Until the what are we gonna do? Public hangings? Vote people off the island? You guys say what to do and that is how we will do it. I'm to the point where I really dont give damn anymore.

[red]

once a week we vote someone off the island, no matter what

just to keep everyone on their toes

[Bretsky]

I think a lack of courtesy have been consistently displayed by both sides of the argument.

I was just as irritated about the Anti Favre Group weeks ago when AROD was the greatest thing since sliced bread as I am now with the Pro Favre group who is seizing the opportunity to return the favors.


A wise man once said the greater person is the one who can let the opposition have the last word.

[falco]

I think a lack of courtesy have been consistently displayed by both sides of the argument.

I was just as irritated about the Anti Favre Group weeks ago when AROD was the greatest thing since sliced bread as I am now with the Pro Favre group who is seizing the opportunity to return the favors.


I wise man once said the greater person is the one who can let the opposition have the last word.

i will, thank you very much

[The Shadow]

Your right Shadow, it has gotten worse. As a poster who does join in a lot of football discussion can you say you have helped the situation? You have taken jabs just like many other either for one side or the other?

If posters want it to get better they need to start with themselves. Dont think Im trying to call you out specifically cuz none of us here are angels. I just dont see how to stop it without zapping accounts and then where is the line drawn? Removing a avatar turns into a civil rights issue here so locking someone out would only be worse outrage. I think it is just a reflection of the inconsiderate and ignorant world we are becoming. Hopefully someone nukes us soon so we dont have to worry about it. Until the what are we gonna do? Public hangings? Vote people off the island? You guys say what to do and that is how we will do it. I'm to the point where I really dont give damn anymore.

Well, lately whenever I'm ready to learn what the current thinking is on the team and the site comes up, it's prominently featuring two or three threads
on the same old nonsense - and that is a bit like waving a red flag in front of a bull. No doubt about it, I'm as guilty as anyone. At my advanced age, I should know better than to again stick my 2 cents in (since it's likely that anyone who visits regularly already knows what are various positions are already) but, like Michael Corleone, "just when I'm trying to get out, they suck me back in again!"
I will attempt a better job of resisting the urge to jab.
Ok?

[Deputy Nutz]

See I was wrong. It only took 8 posts before Harlan was stirring with his stick.

[mraynrand]

Did anyone notice it is getting colder each day? Good thing I have a nice thick coat.

[mraynrand]

can we ever get back to the good old days of debating whether Sherman was a bad or horrible GM?

[mraynrand]

Does anyone have a homeopathic treatment for fleas?

[Freak Out]

Does anyone have a homeopathic treatment for fleas?

For you...? I would say take a long swim in the La Brea Tar pits.

[mission]

Your right Shadow, it has gotten worse. As a poster who does join in a lot of football discussion can you say you have helped the situation? You have taken jabs just like many other either for one side or the other?

If posters want it to get better they need to start with themselves. Dont think Im trying to call you out specifically cuz none of us here are angels. I just dont see how to stop it without zapping accounts and then where is the line drawn? Removing a avatar turns into a civil rights issue here so locking someone out would only be worse outrage. I think it is just a reflection of the inconsiderate and ignorant world we are becoming. Hopefully someone nukes us soon so we dont have to worry about it. Until the what are we gonna do? Public hangings? Vote people off the island? You guys say what to do and that is how we will do it. I'm to the point where I really dont give damn anymore.

YES. WE. CAN!

[SnakeLH2006]

:lol: :lol: Wow this has to be either a drunken topic or a joke topic as winning cures all ills.

Personally I have always liked TT as GM (other than the Brett debacle which was HUGE in my mind), yet I for one (like others) did rip TT for a bit this summer for that. I for one, never glorified Brett being greater than the greater good of GB or even Arod (I like him as person and QB) for that matter.

I haven't been on in a few days, but who is praising Lord Favre over PR's purpose of the Green Bay Packers discussion site? I haven't heard it and think AR has been even better than Brett thus far (coming from a big Brett fan, but lessening in the last month) that is a big statement.

I think with time ARod will be a great QB for our team, yet it's interesting to see Brett play yet, I for one have moved on (months ago). There is more to our 4-5 start than even Brett could do to mediate. Would we be 5-4, doubtful, with the numerous injuries (poor coaching, yep I said it) and poor FA signings or lackthereof to our squad in 2008. Many have underwhelmed on both the OL and DL and that is the core issue...not our QB.

This forum is fine as I'm part of 2 others. I remember Packerrats heyday about 2 years ago and it was fucking interesting and hell entertaining to see the "insiders" Joe Arrigo and Randolph dole out these HUGE updates, rumors daily, but with the callouts and subsequent defections on D-Day (aka Joe's and Randolph's FACT of a Packer trade up for Reggie Bush and the like) that forum is non-existent with posters on a consistent basis cuz no one with a Packer mind gives a shit. At least on here (been here since the beginning) peeps even now give their thoughts without being blind sheep as opinions drive a good forum, right or wrong.

We all have our takes, but is this forum headed downhill, oh HELL NO. We just have to win. 4-5 sucks but imagine what PR would have been like in 2005 if it had been around for that 4-12 debacle. The civil war would have been over Favre/Sherman/etc. Now there is blood....let that be a history lesson. Go Pack. Winning cures all ailments in Packerland.

[cpk1994]

PR is just fine.

I don't understand how anyone could think there would NOT be Favre talk this season, being his first season not with the Packers. Even if he had stayed retired there would have been talk and comparisons....it's just what happens when a player like Favre hands off the torch to a new QB. I'd be surprised if you could find a Packer forum out there that's not experiencing the same thing. However, I do wish posters would be more respectful, and not slobber all over the situation, so to speak. (from either point of view)


qft

i wonder what will happen if brett has bad game on thursday. will people start threads about how great a decison tt and the gang made regarding lord favre.....? its not like the die-hard favre fans out-number the tt apologists.

i recall several posters coming into the brett/jet thread bashing him (personally i can take the ribbing/rubbing in face b/c favre's not my blood kin). but now that the packs struggling theyre no where to be found. i dont see anything wrong with banter; folks just shouldnt be rude, name call or take this place too seriously imo

its the only game on so i imagine more folk around here will be tuning in and hopefully cheering for our qb from jan 08This is quite ironic of you. The only ones making thread or bumping old ones is you, Paco, and Gex. I haven't seen any Favre threads saying TT was right, True, the Favre bashers go into the Favre thread, but thats becuase that is what that thread is for, Brett talk. They actually keep it there, you and your two boys don't.

[Fritz]

It's the analysis I crave, and the ability to share a forum with fellow Packer fans. Living here in Detroit, I don't get to make that connection often. So Packerrats has been a boon for me.

However, I am like others tired of the bashing. For me, it's not even so much the pro/anti-Favre threads or the pro/anti-TT threads - it's the devolving into posters attacking each other like junior high schoolers. I think there are legitimate discussions to be had on both topics - and in fact I, who am a huge TT supporter, have been wondering lately if TT's seeming inability to put together a cohesive, effective offensive line will be the downfall of his tenure.

So I don't mind debating those topics. But let's debate the topics, and stop with the name calling.

As Rodney King so famously said, "Can't we all just get along?"

So what the hell is wrong with this offensive line? And why can't the defense stop the run?

[cpk1994]

It's the analysis I crave, and the ability to share a forum with fellow Packer fans. Living here in Detroit, I don't get to make that connection often. So Packerrats has been a boon for me.

However, I am like others tired of the bashing. For me, it's not even so much the pro/anti-Favre threads or the pro/anti-TT threads - it's the devolving into posters attacking each other like junior high schoolers. I think there are legitimate discussions to be had on both topics - and in fact I, who am a huge TT supporter, have been wondering lately if TT's seeming inability to put together a cohesive, effective offensive line will be the downfall of his tenure.

So I don't mind debating those topics. But let's debate the topics, and stop with the name calling.

As Rodney King so famously said, "Can't we all just get along?"

So what the hell is wrong with this offensive line? And why can't the defense stop the run?Wow, you live amongst Lion fans? Then again, they are in no position to trash talk so I guess it can't be too bad. :lol:

[MOBB DEEP]

PR is just fine.

I don't understand how anyone could think there would NOT be Favre talk this season, being his first season not with the Packers. Even if he had stayed retired there would have been talk and comparisons....it's just what happens when a player like Favre hands off the torch to a new QB. I'd be surprised if you could find a Packer forum out there that's not experiencing the same thing. However, I do wish posters would be more respectful, and not slobber all over the situation, so to speak. (from either point of view)


qft

i wonder what will happen if brett has bad game on thursday. will people start threads about how great a decison tt and the gang made regarding lord favre.....? its not like the die-hard favre fans out-number the tt apologists.

i recall several posters coming into the brett/jet thread bashing him (personally i can take the ribbing/rubbing in face b/c favre's not my blood kin). but now that the packs struggling theyre no where to be found. i dont see anything wrong with banter; folks just shouldnt be rude, name call or take this place too seriously imo

its the only game on so i imagine more folk around here will be tuning in and hopefully cheering for our qb from jan 08This is quite ironic of you. The only ones making thread or bumping old ones is you, Paco, and Gex. I haven't seen any Favre threads saying TT was right, True, the Favre bashers go into the Favre thread, but thats becuase that is what that thread is for, Brett talk. They actually keep it there, you and your two boys don't.

cp, i stated on brett/jet thread that since detractors were coming there and provoking us loyalists that i would begin to start favre threads at will (and i remember either harlan or bretszky sorta "ok'n" it)

remember, its not a RULE to keep all things favre in one thread but out of courtesy we would. whats to be expected when folk feel hoodwinked?

even still, i feel that the threads ive started have basically been harmless; but i culd be wrong and apologize if so. personally, i dont care who bashes favre (i laugh whether i agree or not). same at JSO which were truly the good ol days. folk would bicker there too remember but it was a overall jolly time imho. why so much angst here? i miss tank and others' tom foolery. even the racist-acting posters (wifey and i were laughn HARD at some of the racial slurs we heard while watchn mississippi burning last week - naacp = nig, apes, alligators, coons and possum) and moneyguy, etc

now the point u made about me and my two boys is a good one; we're a SMALL segment so i think we're being made scapegoats for folks' inner self being mad at tt. ok, thats kinda stupid and corny.

but, seriously, i dont want to be the cause of anyone's displeasure and WONT CREATE ANY MORE FAVRE THREADS! unless he makes it to afccg. i realize i dont post the most profound things but im not interested in all the details of some franchise im not affiliated with. i dont knock those who like the draft, fa, etc and actually learn alot readin u gals and guys' posts. we're all different so get in where u fit in....

but lighten up folks. the great joyce meyers and charles stanley preach about how the spirit/soul benefits GREATLY from laughter and maintaining a light heart

[Cheesehead Craig]

So what the hell is wrong with this offensive line? And why can't the defense stop the run?
To me, we brought in the ZBS under Jagodzinski who left after a year and we haven't had anyone who understood the system as well as he did and thus couldn't teach it properly or get someone who could see what OL could best run the system. MM is being too stubborn in keeping the system without the right teachers on board or any true idea on getting the correct players in who can run it.

As for the DL, I gotta think it's scheme/coaching. The DL and LBs don't swarm to the ball and they just seem to not attack as much as other teams do.

Just my opinions.

[MOBB DEEP]

So what the hell is wrong with this offensive line? And why can't the defense stop the run?
To me, we brought in the ZBS under Jagodzinski who left after a year and we haven't had anyone who understood the system as well as he did and thus couldn't teach it properly or get someone who could see what OL could best run the system. MM is being too stubborn in keeping the system without the right teachers on board or any true idea on getting the correct players in who can run it.

As for the DL, I gotta think it's scheme/coaching. The DL and LBs don't swarm to the ball and they just seem to not attack as much as other teams do.

Just my opinions.



WRONG THREAD

[Fritz]

Posters wiser than me have commented on the fact that the ZBS is complex and includes power blocking plays as well. Still, I am not a fan of the running plays employed, and it's one of the few things I miss of the Sherman tenure.

I was reminded of this on the Grant touchdown run in the Minny game. It looked like a throwback play - pitch it to the running back and watch him slice between defenders. I don't know if that's zone blocking or not zone blocking, but I do miss the kinds of running plays the Pack used to run - the one - what was it, U-71? - where an extra o-lineman was in the game as a tight end?

I don't advocate ditching the zone scheme mid-season, but I wonder if it'd be effective if you ditched it after the season. I can't imagine that the current group of o-linemen - who are supposedly drafted to "fit" the ZBS - could be much worse blocking the old ways.

[cpk1994]

PR is just fine.

I don't understand how anyone could think there would NOT be Favre talk this season, being his first season not with the Packers. Even if he had stayed retired there would have been talk and comparisons....it's just what happens when a player like Favre hands off the torch to a new QB. I'd be surprised if you could find a Packer forum out there that's not experiencing the same thing. However, I do wish posters would be more respectful, and not slobber all over the situation, so to speak. (from either point of view)


qft

i wonder what will happen if brett has bad game on thursday. will people start threads about how great a decison tt and the gang made regarding lord favre.....? its not like the die-hard favre fans out-number the tt apologists.

i recall several posters coming into the brett/jet thread bashing him (personally i can take the ribbing/rubbing in face b/c favre's not my blood kin). but now that the packs struggling theyre no where to be found. i dont see anything wrong with banter; folks just shouldnt be rude, name call or take this place too seriously imo

its the only game on so i imagine more folk around here will be tuning in and hopefully cheering for our qb from jan 08This is quite ironic of you. The only ones making thread or bumping old ones is you, Paco, and Gex. I haven't seen any Favre threads saying TT was right, True, the Favre bashers go into the Favre thread, but thats becuase that is what that thread is for, Brett talk. They actually keep it there, you and your two boys don't.

cp, i stated on brett/jet thread that since detractors were coming there and provoking us loyalists that i would begin to start favre threads at will (and i remember either harlan or bretszky sorta "ok'n" it)

remember, its not a RULE to keep all things favre in one thread but out of courtesy we would. whats to be expected when folk feel hoodwinked?

even still, i feel that the threads ive started have basically been harmless; but i culd be wrong and apologize if so. personally, i dont care who bashes favre (i laugh whether i agree or not). same at JSO which were truly the good ol days. folk would bicker there too remember but it was a overall jolly time imho. why so much angst here? i miss tank and others' tom foolery. even the racist-acting posters (wifey and i were laughn HARD at some of the racial slurs we heard while watchn mississippi burning last week - naacp = nig, apes, alligators, coons and possum) and moneyguy, etc

now the point u made about me and my two boys is a good one; we're a SMALL segment so i think we're being made scapegoats for folks' inner self being mad at tt. ok, thats kinda stupid and corny.

but, seriously, i dont want to be the cause of anyone's displeasure and WONT CREATE ANY MORE FAVRE THREADS! unless he makes it to afccg. i realize i dont post the most profound things but im not interested in all the details of some franchise im not affiliated with. i dont knock those who like the draft, fa, etc and actually learn alot readin u gals and guys' posts. we're all different so get in where u fit in....

but lighten up folks. the great joyce meyers and charles stanley preach about how the spirit/soul benefits GREATLY from laughter and maintaining a light heartYou aren't really the main part of the problem. Paco and Gex are. But you have have started threads when you first agreed to keep it in the Favre thread and have bumped threads that really served no purpose. However, you do have a humor to you and are nowhere near as bad as Paco and Gex. I probably should have made that clearer instead of lumping you three together. I do want to have spirited discussion. but I do get riled into a frenzy by those two especially when one of them openly admits to being a troll. I have never had a problem with you and only have pointed out some of your absuridties. If I have seemed to be harsh towards you, I apologize. You are better than them.

[sharpe1027]

Posters wiser than me have commented on the fact that the ZBS is complex and includes power blocking plays as well. Still, I am not a fan of the running plays employed, and it's one of the few things I miss of the Sherman tenure.

I was reminded of this on the Grant touchdown run in the Minny game. It looked like a throwback play - pitch it to the running back and watch him slice between defenders. I don't know if that's zone blocking or not zone blocking, but I do miss the kinds of running plays the Pack used to run - the one - what was it, U-71? - where an extra o-lineman was in the game as a tight end?

I don't advocate ditching the zone scheme mid-season, but I wonder if it'd be effective if you ditched it after the season. I can't imagine that the current group of o-linemen - who are supposedly drafted to "fit" the ZBS - could be much worse blocking the old ways.

They've been running for over 4 yards a carry the past several games. It is the passing blocking that has gone south, nothing to do with the ZBS, IMO.

[GBRulz]

This is quite ironic of you. The only ones making thread or bumping old ones is you, Paco, and Gex. I haven't seen any Favre threads saying TT was right, True, the Favre bashers go into the Favre thread, but thats becuase that is what that thread is for, Brett talk. They actually keep it there, you and your two boys don't.

Unfortunately, the thread didn't work out the way it was planned, but don't sit and call out a couple of people for posting outside of it when you and a few other Favre haters started your own Favre threads as well, (negative, of course) when it was to your benefit. Mostly, I'm referring to the whole Detroit game planning soap opera.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I don't think PackerRats can be saved, we're all doomed. It's the economy, stupid. People are all tense and worked up because they know the end is near.

[GBRulz]

I don't think PackerRats can be saved, we're all doomed. It's the economy, stupid. People are all tense and worked up because they know the end is near.

Think the gov't will bail us out?

[Harlan Huckleby]

you go girl

[retailguy]

I don't think PackerRats can be saved, we're all doomed. It's the economy, stupid. People are all tense and worked up because they know the end is near.

Think the gov't will bail us out?

Madtown and I are wildly filling out forms to "tap into" a piece of the $700b bailout plan. Our status to be recognized as a bank is almost complete. We would have been approved a day or two ago, except American Express got their application in first.

Madtown - that guy.... He made me buy lunch again. <sigh> Now he's at the mall, picking out all the things he's going to buy with money.... Buy silver stock, right now. He's particularly infatuated with the big silver chains...

[Gunakor]

cp, i stated on brett/jet thread that since detractors were coming there and provoking us loyalists that i would begin to start favre threads at will (and i remember either harlan or bretszky sorta "ok'n" it)

remember, its not a RULE to keep all things favre in one thread but out of courtesy we would. whats to be expected when folk feel hoodwinked?


Wouldn't it just be easier to keep both praise AND criticism of Favre in the Favre thread? That meaning, all Favre debate goes on in there, and nothing from either side of the Favre issue come out in other threads? That way, people that would rather just stay away from the issue entirely can do so. You can't just expect a place to post your side without debate from the other. This is an internet forum, after all. I suggest that we keep EVERYTHING Favre related - both from the Favre supporters AND detractors - in one thread. Again, so that those people who would like to move on entirely don't have to read ANYTHING about Favre, either pro or con.

If your issue is that you don't have a place to post in support of Favre without debate or controversy, I feel bad for you. But grow some thicker skin already. That is what an internet forum is for - to debate. If people want to keep Favre related topics in the Favre thread, then they should ALL go there. Not just the pro-Favre comments, but ALL the Favre comments.

[cpk1994]

This is quite ironic of you. The only ones making thread or bumping old ones is you, Paco, and Gex. I haven't seen any Favre threads saying TT was right, True, the Favre bashers go into the Favre thread, but thats becuase that is what that thread is for, Brett talk. They actually keep it there, you and your two boys don't.

Unfortunately, the thread didn't work out the way it was planned, but don't sit and call out a couple of people for posting outside of it when you and a few other Favre haters started your own Favre threads as well, (negative, of course) when it was to your benefit. Mostly, I'm referring to the whole Detroit game planning soap opera.I personally have never started a negative Favre thread. I rarely ever start threads to begin with unless I am linking an ESPN story. But a negative Favre thread? Never.

[SkinBasket]

I don't think PackerRats can be saved, we're all doomed. It's the economy, stupid. People are all tense and worked up because they know the end is near.

I'm going to cut off your big toes, then slowly hammer nails dipped in hooker discharge into your body until you expire. Finally, I'll relieve my tension all over your dead buttocks.

[Deputy Nutz]

I don't think PackerRats can be saved, we're all doomed. It's the economy, stupid. People are all tense and worked up because they know the end is near.

Think the gov't will bail us out?

Madtown and I are wildly filling out forms to "tap into" a piece of the $700b bailout plan. Our status to be recognized as a bank is almost complete. We would have been approved a day or two ago, except American Express got their application in first.

Madtown - that guy.... He made me buy lunch again. <sigh> Now he's at the mall, picking out all the things he's going to buy with money.... Buy silver stock, right now. He's particularly infatuated with the big silver chains...

Is lunch whipped cream and strawberries for you two romantic fools?

[MOBB DEEP]

This is quite ironic of you. The only ones making thread or bumping old ones is you, Paco, and Gex. I haven't seen any Favre threads saying TT was right, True, the Favre bashers go into the Favre thread, but thats becuase that is what that thread is for, Brett talk. They actually keep it there, you and your two boys don't.

Unfortunately, the thread didn't work out the way it was planned, but don't sit and call out a couple of people for posting outside of it when you and a few other Favre haters started your own Favre threads as well, (negative, of course) when it was to your benefit. Mostly, I'm referring to the whole Detroit game planning soap opera.



crazy how that whole matt millen thing just went away SO fast

i blieve it was BF4MVP or HH that said it would. i thought soap would last longer myself

[Cheesehead Craig]

So what the hell is wrong with this offensive line? And why can't the defense stop the run?
To me, we brought in the ZBS under Jagodzinski who left after a year and we haven't had anyone who understood the system as well as he did and thus couldn't teach it properly or get someone who could see what OL could best run the system. MM is being too stubborn in keeping the system without the right teachers on board or any true idea on getting the correct players in who can run it.

As for the DL, I gotta think it's scheme/coaching. The DL and LBs don't swarm to the ball and they just seem to not attack as much as other teams do.

Just my opinions.

WRONG THREAD
Nope, he asked a question and I gave him my answer. Nothing wrong with that.

[wist43]

I took a necessary leave of absence for too long, but I did notice that the tone has changed on here quite a bit.

I think it's true that there isn't nearly as much debate as there used to be, b/c a lot of the "desenters", or those who classified themselves as "realists" were pushed out, in part b/c the Pack went 13-3 last year, and b/c of the overall tone of the Thompson cheerleaders became increasingly shrill.

I haven't weighed in on the Favre "debate", and I'm a middle of the roader wrt Thompson, even if I am more critical than not.... although ultimately, I think I have to fall into the detractor catagory b/c I don't think they'll ever win a championship with him at the helm - but I digress :)

My answer is... PR is just fine :D

[Deputy Nutz]

I took a necessary leave of absence for too long, but I did notice that the tone has changed on here quite a bit.

I think it's true that there isn't nearly as much debate as there used to be, b/c a lot of the "desenters", or those who classified themselves as "realists" were pushed out, in part b/c the Pack went 13-3 last year, and b/c of the overall tone of the Thompson cheerleaders became increasingly shrill.

I haven't weighed in on the Favre "debate", and I'm a middle of the roader wrt Thompson, even if I am more critical than not.... although ultimately, I think I have to fall into the detractor catagory b/c I don't think they'll ever win a championship with him at the helm - but I digress :)

My answer is... PR is just fine :D

I agree with the Thompson statement. Thompson wants to put a cost effective product out on the field that most likely will never be the class of the NFL. I have backed Thompson with most of his moves, I have even given him the benefit of the doubt with Harrell, but he certainly won't make that bold move that will put this team over the top. You can only get so young.

[MOBB DEEP]

So what the hell is wrong with this offensive line? And why can't the defense stop the run?
To me, we brought in the ZBS under Jagodzinski who left after a year and we haven't had anyone who understood the system as well as he did and thus couldn't teach it properly or get someone who could see what OL could best run the system. MM is being too stubborn in keeping the system without the right teachers on board or any true idea on getting the correct players in who can run it.

As for the DL, I gotta think it's scheme/coaching. The DL and LBs don't swarm to the ball and they just seem to not attack as much as other teams do.

Just my opinions.

WRONG THREAD
Nope, he asked a question and I gave him my answer. Nothing wrong with that.

was only joking

[RashanGary]

I don't think you two understand where Thompson is going with this, but time will be the ultimate judge.

We'll see. Certainly, Rome was not built in a day. For all of Ron Wolfs greatness, he only won ONE SB in career as an NFL GM. It's not something that will happen every year. To build a team, I believe it requires many years of good decisions building on each other. Eventually, the stars align, but to try to force it is to sell your team short by limiting yoru opportities. Last year was a little lucky, but this team is still ascending from a pretty low starting point. Many pieces are in place while they are going to need stronger offensive and defensive lineman

For all of the "sky is falling" rhetoric, I believe the Packers will be 5-5 after this week and in playoff contention heading into the easist part of their schedule and I think they'll compete for the playoffs until the very end. I still think they have a strong shot at making it. They are the youngest team in the NFL with a first year starting QB. They're poised to lock up several key core players as well as improve while several promising young ones enter the primes of their careers. To judge this team now, on the bottom of what I believe is going to be a rather impressive upswing, would be foolish. Such is life on a message board when those who don't understand want answers before they are available.

[Cheesehead Craig]

So what the hell is wrong with this offensive line? And why can't the defense stop the run?
To me, we brought in the ZBS under Jagodzinski who left after a year and we haven't had anyone who understood the system as well as he did and thus couldn't teach it properly or get someone who could see what OL could best run the system. MM is being too stubborn in keeping the system without the right teachers on board or any true idea on getting the correct players in who can run it.

As for the DL, I gotta think it's scheme/coaching. The DL and LBs don't swarm to the ball and they just seem to not attack as much as other teams do.

Just my opinions.

WRONG THREAD
Nope, he asked a question and I gave him my answer. Nothing wrong with that.

was only joking
Oh... very well then. Carry on good chap.

[superfan]

Well, I don't post here much anymore, but I do check in from time to time. There are four main reasons why I come to PR:

1. Breaking news about the Pack and the NFL. Example: earlier today, a coworker told me that he heard Barnett was out for the year, which I had not yet heard (I live in a vaccuum). First, I went to packers.com to confirm and found nothing on the home page. Next, I came here - boom, there it was on the first page, Barnett out for season. Our posters here make this site a very reliable and timely source of information.

2. Detailed analysis/breakdown of the Pack and football in general - There is some great discussion here that is not equaled elsewhere on the web. I'll name some names here, not meaning to exclude other valued posters - Patler, Harvey Wallbangers, Lurker64, Bretsky - you guys in particular come to mind when I think of inspired posters who really offer terrific insight into the game. There are countless other solid contributors, but you guys IMO are the cream of the crop.

3. Camaraderie - I know and have met a number of great people on this site (even the unthinkable - a great Vikings fan :shock: :lol: ) and this site is a terrific resource for meeting Packer fans in my area.

4. Humor/Fun - I also visit this site to get a fun take from people on the Packers and life in general. There are a number of people that make it enjoyable to visit this site. Missing a bunch of posters here, but the initial list that comes to mind is Skinbasket, Deputy Nutz, Partial, Tarlam!, 007, GBRulz, Fritz, MJZiggy, MadtownPacker (best when he is on a rampage), FritzDon'tBlitz (what happened to that guy?), Scott Campbell (has he really been banned? if so, unfortunate from an entertainment perspective, big SC fan), Idle Threat, HarlanHuckleby, and last but certainly not least, the immortal Cleft Crusty. Not saying everyone mentioned here is the next George Carlin, but as a sum, a fantastic group of personalities who keep bringing me back.

Is the site doomed? No, but it would be nice to see much less of the Favre - Rodgers - TT - Sherman etc. love/hate fest.

[Deputy Nutz]

I don't think you two understand where Thompson is going with this, but time will be the ultimate judge.

We'll see. Certainly, Rome was not built in a day. For all of Ron Wolfs greatness, he only won ONE SB in career as an NFL GM. It's not something that will happen every year. To build a team, I believe it requires many years of good decisions building on each other. Eventually, the stars align, but to try to force it is to sell your team short by limiting yoru opportities. Last year was a little lucky, but this team is still ascending from a pretty low starting point. Many pieces are in place while they are going to need stronger offensive and defensive lineman

For all of the "sky is falling" rhetoric, I believe the Packers will be 5-5 after this week and in playoff contention heading into the easist part of their schedule and I think they'll compete for the playoffs until the very end. I still think they have a strong shot at making it. They are the youngest team in the NFL with a first year starting QB. They're poised to lock up several key core players as well as improve while several promising young ones enter the primes of their careers. To judge this team now, on the bottom of what I believe is going to be a rather impressive upswing, would be foolish. Such is life on a message board when those who don't understand want answers before they are available.

I am not saying the sky is falling, I think they way the roster is set, 2008 was to go more towards .500, maybe 9-7 than towards the expectation 13-3 of last year.

Rodgers has performed pretty much like expected, some good games, some bad games, and couple of games in the middle. The outcome of the season is not going to rest completely on his shoulders, but he is the QB of the Packers, and Quarterbacks are one player out of 22 starters on the field, but they are the only ones that win totals are attributed to.

Anyways, I certainly am not completely complaining about the job Thompson has done, although the defensive line which was once a very impressive unit for the Packers, is it a rebuilding year for the defensive line? I don't know, but running out guys like Thompson, and Montgomery at defensive end and again counting on an a repaired Justin Harrell makes me nervous for a team that was a game away from the Super Bowl last year.

The wide receiver corps doesn't look like the best unit on the Packers, but in the NFL like it did last year. Why? The quarterback? The offensive line? Play calling? Thompson keeps adding pieces to this unit but now it isn't carrying the offense like imagined. Jennings had big numbers earlier in the year, but now teams have taken him away for the time being. Nelson has been ok as a rookie, Jones is hurt, and Martin has been disappointing. Driver is still a threat with the ball in his hand, I am sure he wishes he could catch more balls on the run but it just hasn't happened enough.

The offensive line is in big trouble once again, sure Darren Colledge has made strides, but now Clifton is drifting towards the end of his career, Spitz seems to be struggling, and Wells simply isn't powerful enough to hold up in the middle. Tauscher is the one consistent after a slow start and he probably isn't going to be resigned in the off season. Since Thompson's first year as GM he has not rebuilt the offensive line, nor has he built adequate depth.

The best unit possibly in football is the secondary. Now with Al Harris back they not only hold the defense together, they point more points on the board than the Packers offensive running game. Thompson has done a good job at keeping a good mix of veterans and building his depth so once Harris and Woodson are gone Williams, Blackmon, and Lee will hopefully be ready. A lot of really good football players in this group.

At linebacker Thompson has done a decent job and even taking Hawk at the 5th selection in the 2006 draft shows that he was dedicated to improving the position. His only signing in free agency this year was Brandon Chillar who needs to see the field. Thompson has invested a lot in the Linbacker unit, but what I still don't get why they are under utilized, or if they are under performing. Why does Poppinga still get chances to take bad angles, miss tackles, and looks clueless in coverage, while Chillar sits on the bench. Goofy and I can't say that I put the blame on Thompson for the lack of playmaking from this unit. Barnett is out for the year, but he was having his worst season since his second year in the league. Thompson gave Barnett the long term contract and so far Barnett hasn't responded, his play slipped in 2008.

Finally the running game, more like the begining of 2007 than at the end of last. There just isn't any consistency. Running backs more than any other position need training camp to get their timing and vision down. Well it has taken Grant two months to get going, and it isn't really all that dominating. He is close to breaking some runs, but that extra gear that he had last year doesn't seem to be there. Brandon Jackson is the third down back, he is doing a better job catching the ball this year and does have some untapped potential. He is a project, and for that matter Grant is still a very young player. We might have seen his potential alread, but is inexperiance is something that shows with his inconsistency this year. Thompson has brought both of them in, if he were to get a grade on the position in 2008, it would be a "C-".

[Partial]

I don't think you two understand where Thompson is going with this, but time will be the ultimate judge.

We'll see. Certainly, Rome was not built in a day. For all of Ron Wolfs greatness, he only won ONE SB in career as an NFL GM. It's not something that will happen every year. To build a team, I believe it requires many years of good decisions building on each other. Eventually, the stars align, but to try to force it is to sell your team short by limiting yoru opportities. Last year was a little lucky, but this team is still ascending from a pretty low starting point. Many pieces are in place while they are going to need stronger offensive and defensive lineman

For all of the "sky is falling" rhetoric, I believe the Packers will be 5-5 after this week and in playoff contention heading into the easist part of their schedule and I think they'll compete for the playoffs until the very end. I still think they have a strong shot at making it. They are the youngest team in the NFL with a first year starting QB. They're poised to lock up several key core players as well as improve while several promising young ones enter the primes of their careers. To judge this team now, on the bottom of what I believe is going to be a rather impressive upswing, would be foolish. Such is life on a message board when those who don't understand want answers before they are available.

Competing for the 5 or 6 seed is pretty unacceptable in my opinion. We were a young, blossoming team that made the NFC championship game last year. In theory, we should have improved. We definitely are not as good of a team, despite the individual talent likely being greater.

[Partial]

Good breakdown Nutz. I agree.

[MOBB DEEP]

I don't think you two understand where Thompson is going with this, but time will be the ultimate judge.

We'll see. Certainly, Rome was not built in a day. For all of Ron Wolfs greatness, he only won ONE SB in career as an NFL GM. It's not something that will happen every year. To build a team, I believe it requires many years of good decisions building on each other. Eventually, the stars align, but to try to force it is to sell your team short by limiting yoru opportities. Last year was a little lucky, but this team is still ascending from a pretty low starting point. Many pieces are in place while they are going to need stronger offensive and defensive lineman

For all of the "sky is falling" rhetoric, I believe the Packers will be 5-5 after this week and in playoff contention heading into the easist part of their schedule and I think they'll compete for the playoffs until the very end. I still think they have a strong shot at making it. They are the youngest team in the NFL with a first year starting QB. They're poised to lock up several key core players as well as improve while several promising young ones enter the primes of their careers. To judge this team now, on the bottom of what I believe is going to be a rather impressive upswing, would be foolish. Such is life on a message board when those who don't understand want answers before they are available.

I am not saying the sky is falling, I think they way the roster is set, 2008 was to go more towards .500, maybe 9-7 than towards the expectation 13-3 of last year.

Rodgers has performed pretty much like expected, some good games, some bad games, and couple of games in the middle. The outcome of the season is not going to rest completely on his shoulders, but he is the QB of the Packers, and Quarterbacks are one player out of 22 starters on the field, but they are the only ones that win totals are attributed to.

Anyways, I certainly am not completely complaining about the job Thompson has done, although the defensive line which was once a very impressive unit for the Packers, is it a rebuilding year for the defensive line? I don't know, but running out guys like Thompson, and Montgomery at defensive end and again counting on an a repaired Justin Harrell makes me nervous for a team that was a game away from the Super Bowl last year.

The wide receiver corps doesn't look like the best unit on the Packers, but in the NFL like it did last year. Why? The quarterback? The offensive line? Play calling? Thompson keeps adding pieces to this unit but now it isn't carrying the offense like imagined. Jennings had big numbers earlier in the year, but now teams have taken him away for the time being. Nelson has been ok as a rookie, Jones is hurt, and Martin has been disappointing. Driver is still a threat with the ball in his hand, I am sure he wishes he could catch more balls on the run but it just hasn't happened enough.

The offensive line is in big trouble once again, sure Darren Colledge has made strides, but now Clifton is drifting towards the end of his career, Spitz seems to be struggling, and Wells simply isn't powerful enough to hold up in the middle. Tauscher is the one consistent after a slow start and he probably isn't going to be resigned in the off season. Since Thompson's first year as GM he has not rebuilt the offensive line, nor has he built adequate depth.

The best unit possibly in football is the secondary. Now with Al Harris back they not only hold the defense together, they point more points on the board than the Packers offensive running game. Thompson has done a good job at keeping a good mix of veterans and building his depth so once Harris and Woodson are gone Williams, Blackmon, and Lee will hopefully be ready. A lot of really good football players in this group.

At linebacker Thompson has done a decent job and even taking Hawk at the 5th selection in the 2006 draft shows that he was dedicated to improving the position. His only signing in free agency this year was Brandon Chillar who needs to see the field. Thompson has invested a lot in the Linbacker unit, but what I still don't get why they are under utilized, or if they are under performing. Why does Poppinga still get chances to take bad angles, miss tackles, and looks clueless in coverage, while Chillar sits on the bench. Goofy and I can't say that I put the blame on Thompson for the lack of playmaking from this unit. Barnett is out for the year, but he was having his worst season since his second year in the league. Thompson gave Barnett the long term contract and so far Barnett hasn't responded, his play slipped in 2008.

Finally the running game, more like the begining of 2007 than at the end of last. There just isn't any consistency. Running backs more than any other position need training camp to get their timing and vision down. Well it has taken Grant two months to get going, and it isn't really all that dominating. He is close to breaking some runs, but that extra gear that he had last year doesn't seem to be there. Brandon Jackson is the third down back, he is doing a better job catching the ball this year and does have some untapped potential. He is a project, and for that matter Grant is still a very young player. We might have seen his potential alread, but is inexperiance is something that shows with his inconsistency this year. Thompson has brought both of them in, if he were to get a grade on the position in 2008, it would be a "C-".



good post

[MOBB DEEP]

Is the site doomed? No, but it would be nice to see much less of the Favre - Rodgers - TT - Sherman etc. love/hate fest.


sherman lol

[RashanGary]

I don't really agree with your post, at least not the tone of it. I see a playoff competitive team, not living up to expectations that were set by a little bit of a fluky season. I see a team that has far more young, promising players than old, declining ones. I see a team that is just beginning a strong upward pattern into the elite teams in the NFL. I see a 24 year old QB who is probably going to win more games that the HOFer did in two of his last three seasons here. If we're judging just on wins and only the QB, he's certainly holding his own. Acctually he's living up the play of the HOFer that came before him if you want to use the last three years. I don't think you expected at all.


You're banging your drum now. All of the Thompson doubters are. I'll simply say, this is the beginning. This is when Thompsons young core is young. He will not go younger. He just had nothing to start with, so like Parcells in Miami, he went young. Just like the new GM in Tennessee. It will get better and I'll be here to remind you that you never saw it coming. By then you'll be jumping on board, saying you knew it all along.

[Deputy Nutz]

the team is 4-5. The questions are more than deserved. All you tell me is that the team is young, great they are young but I am not totally thrilled with the young talent on this team outside of the secondary. Sorry to burst your bubble but tell me one "young" player that is meeting expectations, or even exceeding them? Rodgers, maybe, Jennings was, but he can't seem to get on the same page with his qb and is struggling with a coverage shift.

I will grant you that Aaron Rodgers is playing to expectations. I actually had higher expectations for him. I thought with his receiver core he would have more games like in Detroit. His stat line is ok, but he has been unsteady the last two weeks. Again I thought he would gel better with receivers and tight ends since he has been in the system for three years.

I guess if all you are looking for is optimism you can point to the young roster and all the possibilities. I certainly don't go around bragging that the Packers are the youngest team and in fact 4-5 is right where they should be.

[Partial]

I don't really agree with your post, at least not the tone of it. I see a playoff competitive team, not living up to expectations that were set by a little bit of a fluky season. I see a team that has far more young, promising players than old, declining ones. I see a team that is just beginning a strong upward pattern into the elite teams in the NFL. I see a 24 year old QB who is probably going to win more games that the HOFer did in two of his last three seasons here. If we're judging just on wins and only the QB, he's certainly holding his own. Acctually he's living up the play of the HOFer that came before him if you want to use the last three years. I don't think you expected at all.


You're banging your drum now. All of the Thompson doubters are. I'll simply say, this is the beginning. This is when Thompsons young core is young. He will not go younger. He just had nothing to start with, so like Parcells in Miami, he went young. Just like the new GM in Tennessee. It will get better and I'll be here to remind you that you never saw it coming. By then you'll be jumping on board, saying you knew it all along.

I don't think anybody doubts TT. He clearly has a knack for finding some talent. Whether that talent matures or not is up to the player.

A-Rod is playing like ass. 4 out of 7 have been awful. 4 out of the last 5 have been awful. QB rating does not always tell tale.

[HarveyWallbangers]

4 out of the last 5 have been awful. QB rating does not always tell tale.

Whatever.

[bobblehead]

QB rating does not always tell tale.

unless favre puts up a high QB rating.

[SkinBasket]

4 out of the last 5 have been awful. QB rating does not always tell tale.

Whatever.

Whatever yourself. Partial studies game film. Partial doesn't believe in numbers. He believes in "it."

[Harlan Huckleby]

His only signing in free agency this year was Brandon Chillar who needs to see the field. Thompson has invested a lot in the Linbacker unit, but what I still don't get why they are under utilized, or if they are under performing. Why does Poppinga still get chances to take bad angles, miss tackles, and looks clueless in coverage, while Chillar sits on the bench.

Chillar has not been under-utilized, he's played about the same amount this season as Poppinga or Hawk. He was inactive last week because of injury, memories are short.

I'll answer why Poppinga takes bad angles, misses tackles, and looks clueless in coverage: because he doesn't. You saw a couple bad plays sometime in the past that have stuck in your mind, so you decided Poppinga stinks and that's your story and you're sticking to it. I see him reacting well on the field, and teams are not particularly running against his side. If anybody in the linebacking corps has looked inept recently it has been Hawk, but you developed your crush on him a while back, and you're standing by your man.

[RashanGary]

I have no problem with criticisms of this years team. I make them myself. I think you're harder on a 24 year old, first year starter at QB (that happens to be playing better than most QB's in the NFL right now) than you should be. I also think statements like "we're never going to win the big one because TT will not put us over the top", are short sighted. Saying this team has problems and saying this team has problems that will never be fixed are two very different things.

Again, beat your little drum. I'll be here when the evidence is in. If I'm wrong I'll say it. If you're wrong I'll remind you.

[SkinBasket]

I'll answer why Poppinga takes bad angles, misses tackles, and looks clueless in coverage: because he doesn't. You saw a couple bad plays sometime in the past that have stuck in your mind, so you decided Poppinga stinks and that's your story and you're sticking to it. I see him reacting well on the field, and teams are not particularly running against his side.

You're dumb. I'm the one who's always hated Poppinga. As far as I can remember, nutz has always been rather neutral on the fuck-up.

Poppinga is not good. You, like others, decided some time ago that he was a likable guy while simultaneously forgetting what an capable LB at that position plays like. He has no ability to cover or rush, and he's had plenty of time to develop in those areas but hasn't. Sure he runs into the RB every now and again, but for every time that happens, he getting bogged down in the line 3 times, usually because he has no instinct for where the play is going, so he just runs into someone.

[Harlan Huckleby]

he's no pash rusher, but his coverage has gotten better.

I think he's strong against the run, gets off blocks.

[SkinBasket]

he's no pash rusher, but his coverage has gotten better.

I think he's strong against the run, gets off blocks.

Yeah, he's much better at covering that vacant patch of field he ends up in more plays than not. I think you feel he's better in coverage because we do everything humanly possible to make sure he's not covering anyone.

Against the run, he's a body. Sometimes he's in the right place. Sometimes he's not. Almost all the time, he doesn't know the difference.

[Fritz]

I was a Poppinga fan early on, but this year he does not appear to have stepped up his game at all. He's whiffed on several tackles, and for a guy whose specialty is supposed to be run defense, that's not good.

[Gunakor]

the team is 4-5. The questions are more than deserved. All you tell me is that the team is young, great they are young but I am not totally thrilled with the young talent on this team outside of the secondary. Sorry to burst your bubble but tell me one "young" player that is meeting expectations, or even exceeding them? Rodgers, maybe, Jennings was, but he can't seem to get on the same page with his qb and is struggling with a coverage shift.

I will grant you that Aaron Rodgers is playing to expectations. I actually had higher expectations for him. I thought with his receiver core he would have more games like in Detroit. His stat line is ok, but he has been unsteady the last two weeks. Again I thought he would gel better with receivers and tight ends since he has been in the system for three years.

I guess if all you are looking for is optimism you can point to the young roster and all the possibilities. I certainly don't go around bragging that the Packers are the youngest team and in fact 4-5 is right where they should be.


He's been unsteady the last two weeks, granted. But look who he was playing. He was playing two of the better defenses in the entire league. Those guys get paid too, ya know. When you match up against a defensive line that's a helluva lot better than your offensive line, your QB is going to struggle. That's happened 2 weeks in a row now, the same 2 weeks you complain about our QB being unsteady. You aren't gonna win them all. Sometimes you meet an opponent that matches up well against your biggest weakness, which has been the case the past 2 weeks. The fact that we've lost those 2 games by just 4 points combined suggests that maybe things aren't as bad as one would like to believe.

[RashanGary]

Good points, Gunakor. Good post.

[Cheesehead Craig]

Nutz, that was one of the best posts I've seen out of you or anyone around here in a while. Well done man!

:bclap: :bclap: :bclap:

[Deputy Nutz]

His only signing in free agency this year was Brandon Chillar who needs to see the field. Thompson has invested a lot in the Linbacker unit, but what I still don't get why they are under utilized, or if they are under performing. Why does Poppinga still get chances to take bad angles, miss tackles, and looks clueless in coverage, while Chillar sits on the bench.

Chillar has not been under-utilized, he's played about the same amount this season as Poppinga or Hawk. He was inactive last week because of injury, memories are short.

I'll answer why Poppinga takes bad angles, misses tackles, and looks clueless in coverage: because he doesn't. You saw a couple bad plays sometime in the past that have stuck in your mind, so you decided Poppinga stinks and that's your story and you're sticking to it. I see him reacting well on the field, and teams are not particularly running against his side. If anybody in the linebacking corps has looked inept recently it has been Hawk, but you developed your crush on him a while back, and you're standing by your man.

Harlan, Poppinga was absolutely horrible last week, he took to long to get off blocks, and then instead of recovering appropriately and getting in to position he lunges at the back just about the time the running back is past him. He got torn up against the Vikings, and he got his ass handed to him against the Cowboys. Both teams that pound the rock.

Chillar has not played as much as Hawk. He played most of the snaps against Indy and filled in for Poppinga against teams that would have two tight end or a have three wide as their base set on first down.

[Deputy Nutz]

the team is 4-5. The questions are more than deserved. All you tell me is that the team is young, great they are young but I am not totally thrilled with the young talent on this team outside of the secondary. Sorry to burst your bubble but tell me one "young" player that is meeting expectations, or even exceeding them? Rodgers, maybe, Jennings was, but he can't seem to get on the same page with his qb and is struggling with a coverage shift.

I will grant you that Aaron Rodgers is playing to expectations. I actually had higher expectations for him. I thought with his receiver core he would have more games like in Detroit. His stat line is ok, but he has been unsteady the last two weeks. Again I thought he would gel better with receivers and tight ends since he has been in the system for three years.

I guess if all you are looking for is optimism you can point to the young roster and all the possibilities. I certainly don't go around bragging that the Packers are the youngest team and in fact 4-5 is right where they should be.


He's been unsteady the last two weeks, granted. But look who he was playing. He was playing two of the better defenses in the entire league. Those guys get paid too, ya know. When you match up against a defensive line that's a helluva lot better than your offensive line, your QB is going to struggle. That's happened 2 weeks in a row now, the same 2 weeks you complain about our QB being unsteady. You aren't gonna win them all. Sometimes you meet an opponent that matches up well against your biggest weakness, which has been the case the past 2 weeks. The fact that we've lost those 2 games by just 4 points combined suggests that maybe things aren't as bad as one would like to believe.

Things are as bad as 4-5 gets. Rodgers seemed to play just fine against the Vikes in week one. Passed well. What separates really good QBs from average QBs is not what they do when protection is good, but how they handle pressure. Rodgers has not handled the blitz well, and he has not handled pressure of the edge or from the middle. When he does get the ball off it is usually poorly thrown.

The Titans are good football team on defense in every part of the game. The Vikings pass defense is terrible.

Again, I point to two safeties in one game by one player. Not good.

Also, I keep hearing the offensive line is performing poorly, well who is responsible for that? Thompson certainly has not put a unit together that has performed consistently since his arrival in Green Bay. At stretches last year the unit did a good job in pass pro, but again nobody really wants to talk about last year, it was a fluke, so I guess the offensive line play was also a fluke last year. Thompson's roll as a GM last year I guess that was a fluke as well, he better give his award back.

[Partial]

4 out of the last 5 have been awful. QB rating does not always tell tale.

Whatever.

How can you argue that? Go look at the film, the numbers, etc. I'm not being a Rodgers slammer here. Legitimately, his numbers without a doubt have decreased significantly since Detroit. I'm chalking it up to game film being available and people beginning to recognize that he doesn't handle the blitz like a vet yet.

He played a poor game at Dallas. Didn't lead the team to the Endzone.

He played a poor game against Tampa. 3 turnovers, looked bad, lost game.

He played great against ATL but still lost.

He played conservative against Tennessee and couldn't get anything going. He looked pretty bad, and he led the offense to only one score.

This week he looked awful. He took two safeties, 4 sacks, didn't throw the ball down the field, etc, and again, led the offense to only one score.

The proof is in the pudding Harv. I'm being 100% neutral in this stance.

[Partial]

QB rating does not always tell tale.

unless favre puts up a high QB rating.

:lol: He's playing below expectations but I think he's starting to play a little better. The opposite trend of what Aaron has had in recent weeks. Then again, I am judging that from third party statement on Favres play. I haven't watched him in weeks.

[MOBB DEEP]

QB rating does not always tell tale.

unless favre puts up a high QB rating.

BINGO!

[MOBB DEEP]

QB rating does not always tell tale.

unless favre puts up a high QB rating.

Then again, I am judging that from third party statement on Favres play. I haven't watched him in weeks.

SPORTS BAR!!

[arcilite]

Partial, you crack me up dude.

Rodgers is awful...because you've watched game film?


lol wat

are you kidding me

[Bretsky]

To me PR is just fine

Membership has grown incredibly. The more posters the more potential spats we're bound to have at times

We went through a lot with the TT hate and TT love and we're by that
Went through more with the BF hate and BF love and we're working through that

A few posters left and we picked up some great quality posters.

I browse multiple Packer boards

This is still hands down the best one

[Deputy Nutz]

To me PR is just fine

Membership has grown incredibly. The more posters the more potential spats we're bound to have at times

We went through a lot with the TT hate and TT love and we're by that
Went through more with the BF hate and BF love and we're working through that

A few posters left and we picked up some great quality posters.

I browse multiple Packer boards

This is still hands down the best one

You're the best.

[Harlan Huckleby]

get a room

[MOBB DEEP]

get a room

HH, y the heck arent u posting in brett thread? u said u were down with the cause now...SIGH..

turncoat

[Bretsky]

get a room


I want to be back on Favre's side

Can you switch again ?

[MOBB DEEP]

get a room


I want to be back on Favre's side

Can you switch again ?

no switch hittn allowed in football

[MOBB DEEP]

favres headn to nfl total acess podium in a golf cart

[Bretsky]

get a room


I want to be back on Favre's side

Can you switch again ?

no switch hittn allowed in football



Actually I've always been on Favre's side; I just have a hard time agreeing with HH :lol:

[MOBB DEEP]

Oh