Time to Ponder: Was AR given a big contract too soon?

[packerbacker1234]

Look, this season isn't solely on AR. He has good stats, and with any semblence of a consistent defense, could have more wins.

However, there are four BIG things he has to step up and prove to garner the money, and contract, he got.

- Have a winning season.
- Make the playoffs.
- Win in the playoffs.
- Complete a late game winning drive under 2 minutes to win.

It's not all on him, and I think for a first year starter he has done well: But he clearly has not performed well enough to get payed like and elite QB. He has yet to have a winning season, and he hasn't come through in the clutch, despite several chances. I mention that, because a guy like Matt Ryan and Joe Flacco seem to be able to do that just now, and they are rookie first year starters.

[Pacopete4]

Look, this season isn't solely on AR. He has good stats, and with any semblence of a consistent defense, could have more wins.

However, there are four BIG things he has to step up and prove to garner the money, and contract, he got.

- Have a winning season.
- Make the playoffs.
- Win in the playoffs.
- Complete a late game winning drive under 2 minutes to win.

It's not all on him, and I think for a first year starter he has done well: But he clearly has not performed well enough to get payed like and elite QB. He has yet to have a winning season, and he hasn't come through in the clutch, despite several chances. I mention that, because a guy like Matt Ryan and Joe Flacco seem to be able to do that just now, and they are rookie first year starters.


You make some great points. Did we sign him too early, maybe? But I do know this.. he looks like he can become a good QB in this league so I think I'd rather have him signed now for a little less, than to pay him top dollar in two years if he does become a star. I think there was very little risk in his contract because most of the money was up front and we had money to use this year since we were so far below the cap... it just made sense a the time.

[red]

i do think we signed him pretty quick. he only had a few good games under his belt when we gave him top dollar

however, when a qb has a 2:1 td to INT ratio it should mean he's pretty decent

he just needs a lot of work on the 2 minute drill. he has all the other tools you would want in a qb

if we were to have a redo on the new contract, and do the same thing today, i would be fine with it

[arcilite]

Nope, his contract is cap and team friendly

[Merlin]

I think some things this season were done specifically by Thompson to throw things in Bret's face. The contract was one of them. I think it was too early to approach a contract with Rodgers and they were better off seeing him actually perform for a season. I don't think it affected his play but I do think paying that much for a QB on a losing team is ridiculous. His stats aren't "awesome", they are okay, good for a first year starter, 13M per year good? Not if we don't win games.

[ThunderDan]

Is this thread a joke?

The answer is no. We locked up a good QB. If you told me Brett's replacement would do this well in his first season I would have been extatic.

[Gunakor]

I think some things this season were done specifically by Thompson to throw things in Bret's face. The contract was one of them. I think it was too early to approach a contract with Rodgers and they were better off seeing him actually perform for a season. I don't think it affected his play but I do think paying that much for a QB on a losing team is ridiculous. His stats aren't "awesome", they are okay, good for a first year starter, 13M per year good? Not if we don't win games.

It's not 13 million per year. His cap cost this year was higher than it will be in the next few years, a tact TT often uses when extending players to keep this team out of the mess Sherman left us with. Here's the real scoop on his contract.


This season, he will make $12.9 million – that’s $320,000 of his original $680,000 base salary already paid under his old contract plus $12.58 million in new money to be paid the rest of the season, a sum that is guaranteed.

It means Rodgers will be paid more this season than his predecessor, Brett Favre, who will be paid $12 million by the New York Jets.

Rodgers also is guaranteed a $7.42 million roster bonus due next March, bringing the total guaranteed money to $20 million.

Because of next year’s guaranteed roster bonus, Rodgers has another relatively large salary-cap figure for next season of $9,652,500, even though his base salary will be only $680,000. Under the contract he signed as a rookie in 2005, his cap number for 2009 would have been $1,852,500.

Rodgers’ base salaries for the five new seasons will be: $6 million in 2010, $7.25 million in 2011, $8 million in 2012, $9.25 million in 2013 and $10.5 million in 2014.

The deal contains annual workout bonuses of $500,000 beginning in 2009. The salary-cap numbers beginning in 2010 are his annual base salary plus the $500,000 roster bonuses.


http://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/article/20081104/PKR01/81104193/1058

[Carolina_Packer]

If he was the reason the Packers aren't winning as they should be, given the talent they can field, then I might be inclined the think they signed him to a long-term deal too soon. But, he has performed pretty admirably under the circumstances, despite the overall record. If he could just play defense, I guess the Packers would be better off.

[Partial]

I think it was done with some false motives in mind. Let's keep in mind that TT was extremely adamant about seeing a second strong season from Javon Walker before showing him the money. While that deal looks good in retrospect, this is a 180 from TT's approach back then.

[Merlin]

I think some things this season were done specifically by Thompson to throw things in Bret's face. The contract was one of them. I think it was too early to approach a contract with Rodgers and they were better off seeing him actually perform for a season. I don't think it affected his play but I do think paying that much for a QB on a losing team is ridiculous. His stats aren't "awesome", they are okay, good for a first year starter, 13M per year good? Not if we don't win games.

It's not 13 million per year. His cap cost this year was higher than it will be in the next few years, a tact TT often uses when extending players to keep this team out of the mess Sherman left us with. Here's the real scoop on his contract.


This season, he will make $12.9 million – that’s $320,000 of his original $680,000 base salary already paid under his old contract plus $12.58 million in new money to be paid the rest of the season, a sum that is guaranteed.

It means Rodgers will be paid more this season than his predecessor, Brett Favre, who will be paid $12 million by the New York Jets.

Rodgers also is guaranteed a $7.42 million roster bonus due next March, bringing the total guaranteed money to $20 million.

Because of next year’s guaranteed roster bonus, Rodgers has another relatively large salary-cap figure for next season of $9,652,500, even though his base salary will be only $680,000. Under the contract he signed as a rookie in 2005, his cap number for 2009 would have been $1,852,500.

Rodgers’ base salaries for the five new seasons will be: $6 million in 2010, $7.25 million in 2011, $8 million in 2012, $9.25 million in 2013 and $10.5 million in 2014.

The deal contains annual workout bonuses of $500,000 beginning in 2009. The salary-cap numbers beginning in 2010 are his annual base salary plus the $500,000 roster bonuses.


http://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/article/20081104/PKR01/81104193/1058

I don't see that changing Thompson's motive of the contract. The contract is excessive for a first year starting QB before the season is over. As I said I don't think that affected Rodgers play but I do think the motives for that contract were underhanded.

[Gunakor]

I think it was done with some false motives in mind. Let's keep in mind that TT was extremely adamant about seeing a second strong season from Javon Walker before showing him the money. While that deal looks good in retrospect, this is a 180 from TT's approach back then.

Maybe there was a seperate reason outside of football that TT wanted another year to gauge Walker's value. Or maybe TT is a prophet.

Or maybe TT has had more time to see Rodgers than he had with Walker, and decided based on what he saw that this was the right move.

[Pacopete4]

I think it was done with some false motives in mind. Let's keep in mind that TT was extremely adamant about seeing a second strong season from Javon Walker before showing him the money. While that deal looks good in retrospect, this is a 180 from TT's approach back then.

Maybe there was a seperate reason outside of football that TT wanted another year to gauge Walker's value. Or maybe TT is a prophet.

Or maybe TT has had more time to see Rodgers than he had with Walker, and decided based on what he saw that this was the right move.


maybe he really is a snake... :twisted:

[Patler]

I think some things this season were done specifically by Thompson to throw things in Bret's face. The contract was one of them. I

Do you really think a highly paid executive, who has a job coveted by many in his profession, would make a 10s of millions of dollars decision just to spite Brett Favre?

Unbelievable. Absolutely unbelievable.

[]{ilr]3]

I think all the team problems are because MM got Married and had Children :lol:

[Patler]

I think it was done with some false motives in mind. Let's keep in mind that TT was extremely adamant about seeing a second strong season from Javon Walker before showing him the money. While that deal looks good in retrospect, this is a 180 from TT's approach back then.

TT didn't know Walker. He had been on the job only a matter of a few off-season months when Walker made his demands. On the other hand, TT has been around Rodgers for 3 years and presumably knows him quite well.

[Partial]

I think some things this season were done specifically by Thompson to throw things in Bret's face. The contract was one of them. I

Do you really think a highly paid executive, who has a job coveted by many in his profession, would make a 10s of millions of dollars decision just to spite Brett Favre?

Unbelievable. Absolutely unbelievable.

No, but he could do it to make himself look better. Likewise, for example, in the Dallas game, instead of trying to get back in the game, they keep dumping the ball off on short passes and take a 10 minute drive down the field simply to pad stats..

[Gunakor]

I think some things this season were done specifically by Thompson to throw things in Bret's face. The contract was one of them. I think it was too early to approach a contract with Rodgers and they were better off seeing him actually perform for a season. I don't think it affected his play but I do think paying that much for a QB on a losing team is ridiculous. His stats aren't "awesome", they are okay, good for a first year starter, 13M per year good? Not if we don't win games.

It's not 13 million per year. His cap cost this year was higher than it will be in the next few years, a tact TT often uses when extending players to keep this team out of the mess Sherman left us with. Here's the real scoop on his contract.


This season, he will make $12.9 million – that’s $320,000 of his original $680,000 base salary already paid under his old contract plus $12.58 million in new money to be paid the rest of the season, a sum that is guaranteed.

It means Rodgers will be paid more this season than his predecessor, Brett Favre, who will be paid $12 million by the New York Jets.

Rodgers also is guaranteed a $7.42 million roster bonus due next March, bringing the total guaranteed money to $20 million.

Because of next year’s guaranteed roster bonus, Rodgers has another relatively large salary-cap figure for next season of $9,652,500, even though his base salary will be only $680,000. Under the contract he signed as a rookie in 2005, his cap number for 2009 would have been $1,852,500.

Rodgers’ base salaries for the five new seasons will be: $6 million in 2010, $7.25 million in 2011, $8 million in 2012, $9.25 million in 2013 and $10.5 million in 2014.

The deal contains annual workout bonuses of $500,000 beginning in 2009. The salary-cap numbers beginning in 2010 are his annual base salary plus the $500,000 roster bonuses.


http://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/article/20081104/PKR01/81104193/1058

I don't see that changing Thompson's motive of the contract. The contract is excessive for a first year starting QB before the season is over. As I said I don't think that affected Rodgers play but I do think the motives for that contract were underhanded.

His motive was locking down a young talented QB to be our starter for the forseeable future at a lower cost than he'd pay during the offseason. His motive was paying out a majority of Rodgers' signing bonuses on this year's payroll to get it off the books while we have gobs of money under the cap to play with. It's an accounting move, a brilliant one at that. 13 million this year means he won't be above 10 million again until 2013, meaning we have more to play with in coming seasons to build a contender around him. You can accuse TT of a lot of things, but overpaying isn't one of them.

In a couple years, Rodgers' yearly salary will be very, very average amongst NFL QB's. 6 million in 2010. I'll bet nearly half of the QB's in the NFL right now make at least 6 million this season. That's not outrageous, even for a first year starter. And by then, he'll be in his 3rd year starting, working for 6 million per season. It's fair.

[Patler]

I think some things this season were done specifically by Thompson to throw things in Bret's face. The contract was one of them. I

Do you really think a highly paid executive, who has a job coveted by many in his profession, would make a 10s of millions of dollars decision just to spite Brett Favre?

Unbelievable. Absolutely unbelievable.

No, but he could do it to make himself look better. Likewise, for example, in the Dallas game, instead of trying to get back in the game, they keep dumping the ball off on short passes and take a 10 minute drive down the field simply to pad stats..

THOMPSON did that in the Dallas game? When and how? I didn't realize Thompson was calling the plays.

Have you ever coached at any level in any sport? You should always try to take something positive out of a game if at all possible. If your team has struggled all game long, putting together a meaningless drive to score meaningless points can have value as something to build on. If it develops even a hint of confidence it has value. It has nothing to do with padding stats and everything to do with team development.

[Partial]

I think some things this season were done specifically by Thompson to throw things in Bret's face. The contract was one of them. I

Do you really think a highly paid executive, who has a job coveted by many in his profession, would make a 10s of millions of dollars decision just to spite Brett Favre?

Unbelievable. Absolutely unbelievable.

No, but he could do it to make himself look better. Likewise, for example, in the Dallas game, instead of trying to get back in the game, they keep dumping the ball off on short passes and take a 10 minute drive down the field simply to pad stats..

THOMPSON did that in the Dallas game? When and how? I didn't realize Thompson was calling the plays.

Have you ever coached at any level in any sport? You should always try to take something positive out of a game if at all possible. If your team has struggled all game long, putting together a meaningless drive to score meaningless points can have value as something to build on. If it develops even a hint of confidence it has value. It has nothing to do with padding stats and everything to do with team development.

MM did it obviously. Just saying that they want those two have a vested interested in making sure Rodgers has the best stats possible this year as well as the best public image.

[Patler]

Just saying that they want those two have a vested interested in making sure Rodgers has the best stats possible this year as well as the best public image.

Ridiculous. They could not care less about any player's individual stats, especially at that point of the season.
If MM was really trying to pad Rodgers' stats, why does he run so much inside the 10 yard line? It would be a no-braining to just pass, pass, pass and get Rodgers 30+ TDs for the season.

[Partial]

Just saying that they want those two have a vested interested in making sure Rodgers has the best stats possible this year as well as the best public image.

Ridiculous. They could not care less about any player's individual stats, especially at that point of the season.
If MM was really trying to pad Rodgers' stats, why does he run so much inside the 10 yard line? It would be a no-braining to just pass, pass, pass and get Rodgers 30+ TDs for the season.

I'm not saying they do; I'm saying it's a not impossible. They without a doubt have a vested interest for the sake of their own hides after the off-season.

[GrnBay007]

It would be a no-braining to just pass, pass, pass and get Rodgers 30+ TDs for the season.

Is he confident that would work? ...just wondering. Maybe not.

[Patler]

It would be a no-braining to just pass, pass, pass and get Rodgers 30+ TDs for the season.

Is he confident that would work? ...just wondering. Maybe not.

Well, running down there hasn't been too effective either! :lol:

My point was, if he was really interested in padding Rodgers stats he would pass inside the 10 yard line a lot more than he does.

[cpk1994]

I think some things this season were done specifically by Thompson to throw things in Bret's face. The contract was one of them. I think it was too early to approach a contract with Rodgers and they were better off seeing him actually perform for a season. I don't think it affected his play but I do think paying that much for a QB on a losing team is ridiculous. His stats aren't "awesome", they are okay, good for a first year starter, 13M per year good? Not if we don't win games.

It's not 13 million per year. His cap cost this year was higher than it will be in the next few years, a tact TT often uses when extending players to keep this team out of the mess Sherman left us with. Here's the real scoop on his contract.


This season, he will make $12.9 million – that’s $320,000 of his original $680,000 base salary already paid under his old contract plus $12.58 million in new money to be paid the rest of the season, a sum that is guaranteed.

It means Rodgers will be paid more this season than his predecessor, Brett Favre, who will be paid $12 million by the New York Jets.

Rodgers also is guaranteed a $7.42 million roster bonus due next March, bringing the total guaranteed money to $20 million.

Because of next year’s guaranteed roster bonus, Rodgers has another relatively large salary-cap figure for next season of $9,652,500, even though his base salary will be only $680,000. Under the contract he signed as a rookie in 2005, his cap number for 2009 would have been $1,852,500.

Rodgers’ base salaries for the five new seasons will be: $6 million in 2010, $7.25 million in 2011, $8 million in 2012, $9.25 million in 2013 and $10.5 million in 2014.

The deal contains annual workout bonuses of $500,000 beginning in 2009. The salary-cap numbers beginning in 2010 are his annual base salary plus the $500,000 roster bonuses.


http://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/article/20081104/PKR01/81104193/1058

I don't see that changing Thompson's motive of the contract. The contract is excessive for a first year starting QB before the season is over. As I said I don't think that affected Rodgers play but I do think the motives for that contract were underhanded.CHrist does everythinghave to be a shot at Favre with you. It was wise to give Aaron an extension, especially after all the shit that Favre pulled. A bump in pay for handling all the distractions and crap from the diva like a true professional is a small price to pay, especially considering the cap friendly structure. You really need to get over the Favre thing. Its really tired.

[th87]

Yes, too soon. TT and MM don't actually make educated guesses and do what's best for the organization. They and the nefarious board are out to destroy this team, just to stick it to us loyal fans. They're hiding under your bed too.

[packerbacker1234]

Yes, too soon. TT and MM don't actually make educated guesses and do what's best for the organization. They and the nefarious board are out to destroy this team, just to stick it to us loyal fans. They're hiding under your bed too.

Everyone wants to win, including the people making the decisions. The sarcasm here is rediculous.

However, TT = 4 years, one winning season, sent Favre packing during htat span, while all he did was lodge another winning season under his belt, while the packers got their second losing season in 4 years, with onl;y really one good season in there, a season in which Favre played at a MVP level.

For the "mess" Mike Sherman screated (TT was here for the last year of MS, when he went 4-12), Mike Sherman actually had one of the best win loss records of any head coach in packers history. Say what you want, but MS was winning. He couldn't get it done int he playoffs, but regular season his teams were usually money.

Maybe it was off old talent, but he was head coach for what, 5 seasons? You don't consistently win over 5 seasons without doing some things right, even if it looks bad on paper.

Anyways, the point of this was saying Rodgers is getting payed like a top flight QB. You think tony Romo would of gotten the money he got if he didn't take the cowboy's to the playoffs? Stats don't matter.

Look at Tyler Thigpen: His stats are even BETTER then AR given the time span he played, and I guarentee he doesn't get a star studded contract, and he may not even start next season. Why? His play wasn't producing WINS. As I said, the losses are never solely on one player, but AR isn't getting it done when the real super stars step to the forefront. Say what you want, but hte reason we fell in love with Favre so fast was because in the clutch, he came through right away. We didn't have to wait a couple seasons, he did it on the very first game he got major playing time in, even before his first start. Pretty easy to fall in love when you get it done int he clutch the first time people see you.

AR is getting payed too much. You think that money up front approach is going to work? After next season, he'll try to renegotiate the contract again to get payed more.

It was a silly move. You don't do stuff like this until you see the outcome of the season. He has had a good season for af rist year starter,. and it's not reasonable to ask him to do what Favre does because he is not Favre. Howeve rhte reason it's brought up, is because it COULD of been #4.

Now #4 looks like he is going back to the playoffs on another team, while the packers are finishing just ahead of a winless team in the division. It's not solely on Rodgers, but this team is mostly exactly the same as last seasons.

The difference? Rodgers isn't getting it done in the clutch like #4 did last year to save a lot of our games.

[Zool]

Yes, too soon. TT and MM don't actually make educated guesses and do what's best for the organization. They and the nefarious board are out to destroy this team, just to stick it to us loyal fans. They're hiding under your bed too.

Everyone wants to win, including the people making the decisions. The sarcasm here is rediculous.

Is he really being more ridiculous than a poster suggesting that a contract was signed to show up Favre? Christ people, they are TRYING to lose games. They arent specifically telling the team to go ahead in the 4th just to crush the fans hopes by letting up yet another late score. Sometimes I just hate coming to this place.

[ThunderDan]

Everyone wants to win, including the people making the decisions. The sarcasm here is rediculous.

However, TT = 4 years, one winning season, sent Favre packing during htat span, while all he did was lodge another winning season under his belt, while the packers got their second losing season in 4 years, with onl;y really one good season in there, a season in which Favre played at a MVP level.



Is that really how you think? If that is the case thank goodness we got rid of Favre. He was the QB for three years of those years and only had one winning season. :oops: :P

[sharpe1027]

Back to the original topic.

Rodger's contract eats up a lot of the extra salary this year and saves cap over the next several years. It seems that most of the guaranteed money is up front, so they can cut him if he sucks and not be in complete cap hell. If he isn't worth his price tag in several years, renegotiate, trade or cut him.

There should be little problem with the deal whether you think Rodgers is the answer or not.

Of course if you are looking for any reason to bash TT, then by all means complain away. You may want to make sure you are consistent since one of the more common complaints about TT is that he doesn't use all of his cap money. Rodgers' contract a long ways towards that end. Also, after next year, the deal is effectively a FA signing that will be paying well under market value even if Rodgers doesn't get any better than he is now.

[Gunakor]

Back to the original topic.

Rodger's contract eats up a lot of the extra salary this year and saves cap over the next several years. It seems that most of the guaranteed money is up front, so they can cut him if he sucks and not be in complete cap hell. If he isn't worth his price tag in several years, renegotiate, trade or cut him.

There should be little problem with the deal whether you think Rodgers is the answer or not.

Of course if you are looking for any reason to bash TT, then by all means complain away. You may want to make sure you are consistent since one of the more common complaints about TT is that he doesn't use all of his cap money. Rodgers' contract a long ways towards that end. Also, after next year, the deal is effectively a FA signing that will be paying well under market value even if Rodgers doesn't get any better than he is now.

The guaranteed portion of his deal is paid off completely after next season. Starting in 2010, it would cost us nothing to cut him or trade him.

[bobblehead]

I think we have to add a cookoo emoticon so I can respond to some of the posts around here.

[mngolf19]

{ilr]3]I think all the team problems are because MM got Married and had Children :lol:

Actually, I was thinking the better question. Did the Packers extend MM too soon?