Unofficial and Uninformed Defensive Coordinator Speculation

[pbmax]

So, who will it be? If Sanders is removed, is there a candidate like Fritz Shurmur floating around for M3? Post all possible candidates here so we can look back in October next year and say, yes, we saw it coming.

Jauron stays in Buffalo and JJ says Wade Phillips is staying. I hope the Cowboys game against the Packers is in December next year :lol: Whatever disappointment was felt in Philly has gone by the wayside, at least temporarily, and Andy Reid is staying which means Jim Johnson is staying as well.

We had Mangenius let go by the Jets, but he is getting head coach interviews. Romeo Crennel is available but he is considering staying with the Browns in some capacity. Marinelli and his squad of relatives is available. Ted Cotrell is available. If the Packers hire him, I might start to root for the Lions.

Slowik is available as Teflon Shanahan has been let go.

I am sure there are more. What else are you going to do for the three hours you will be at work today? :lol: Make a list.

[sheepshead]

Somehow, I dont think it'll be a big name guy. A promotion, internal or external.

[pbmax]

Moss is interviewing with the Chiefs supposedly. I can't get excited about him given the fall of the linebacker play this year, even though that might have as much to do about the DTs than our LBs.

He did coach under Haslett, who learned in Pittsburgh. I like that lineage.

[CaptainKickass]

Bring back Bates!

What the hell is that guy doing these days anyway?

[texaspackerbacker]

We need somebody who is beyond criticism by the know-nothings who are out to get Sanders. The only name I saw mentioned like that is Fritz Shurmur.

[swede]

Considering MM already took the rather unusual step of having one guy be an assistant HC while at the same time being a position coach under a coordinator, I'd say Winston Moss is a strong possibility for internal promotion to DC. I think MM must have a lot of regard for the guy.

That'd be a win-win because the players would get the consistency of a familiar face while still getting the kick-in-the-pants coaching change they deserve.

Despite the fourth quarter swoons, I think our defense is more bent than broken and Moss may have more leadership ability than vanilla Bob.

[TennesseePackerBacker]

I don't think we see a change this year. Maybe Stock gets canned, but I just don't know if they are ready to give up on Sanders. The defense was really good last year, and expected to be a top 10 defense this year. Early injuries really blew up Sanders scheme and hurt players just weren't them selves, i.e. Hawk, Harris, Bigby.

For the record, I'm no fan of the vanilla schemes and would love to see a Rex Ryan or Jim Johnson coaching the Packers D. Under the right circumstances and personel I believe Sanders scheme works pretty well.

[swede]

We need somebody who is beyond criticism by the know-nothings who are out to get Sanders. The only name I saw mentioned like that is Fritz Shurmur.

I've left Fritz a message but he hasn't gotten back to me yet.

[SkinBasket]

If Sanders is removed, is there a candidate like Fritz Shurmur floating around for M3?

Fritz Shurmur would be an upgrade at this point. Honestly, I don't know enough about each potential candidate's defensive philosophy and background to know who would bring a style to GB that fits our cover corners, good but confused LBs, and shitty DL. I just don't want Moss. Not because he's partially responsible for Poppinga playing like a retard, but because I want them to cut the cord and start clean. Keeping Moss would also mean the possibility that Schottenheimer would stay. Ick.

But since this thread is about uninformed speculation, I will root for Crennel because he's big, looks mean, and black people are more intimidating in positions of power than white people. Look at this, his team photo looks more like a mug shot, and I'm not just saying that because he's black:

http://z.about.com/d/cleveland/1/0/W/T/-/-/browns-crennel.jpg

See this DMX mug shot as evidence:

http://www.celossip.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/06/dmx-mug-shot.jpg

Or Rampage Jackson:

http://assets.sbnation.com/imported_assets/12889/jackson_20quinton_20071508.h2.jpg

[pbmax]

We need somebody who is beyond criticism by the know-nothings who are out to get Sanders. The only name I saw mentioned like that is Fritz Shurmur.
I loved Fritz and miss the mad scientist badly. The fact that he had the balls to use the Eagle defense with the Rams against the 49ers when he was running out of D Lineman made him one of my favorites before he came to the Packers.

[Fritz]

I can't root for Crennel, because he runs, I think, the 3-4 and it would be a huge mistake to try to switch schemes so radically when you're trying to get to the top of the mountain sooner rather than later.

Marinelli and his son-in-law would be a mistake. He seems like a good guy but he's awfully bull headed and just as vanilla as Bob. Plus he just runs that soft-zone stuff - doesn't play to our corners' strengths.

I'd be fine with Winston Moss taking over. Sounds like he might be enough change for this group while keeping the scheme.

Barring that, isn't there some obscure d-line coach or linebackers coach under Jim Johnson in Philly that we could pluck to run that crazy blitz scheme here?

[pbmax]

Correction, Winston Moss will be interviewing with the Rams, not the Chiefs.

Additions to the list:

Jim Haslett
Mike Nolan
Gregg Williams
And the Greg Something who was recently fired as Syracuse coach. The man who blitzed the weak safety and beat the Packers in the second Super Bowl. The man who was partially responsible for Mike Sherman hiring both Donatell and Bob Slowik. Greg Robinson.

[pbmax]

Barring that, isn't there some obscure d-line coach or linebackers coach under Jim Johnson in Philly that we could pluck to run that crazy blitz scheme here?
Wasn't that what John Harbaugh was doing before Baltimore?

[Packnut]

We need somebody who is beyond criticism by the know-nothings who are out to get Sanders. The only name I saw mentioned like that is Fritz Shurmur.
I loved Fritz and miss the mad scientist badly. The fact that he had the balls to use the Eagle defense with the Rams against the 49ers when he was running out of D Lineman made him one of my favorites before he came to the Packers.

Yep, he was one of a kind. He understood the concept of playing defense. Un-like Sanders, he knew how to put the right guys in the right place. Any idiot who really believe Sanders is doing a good job should look no farther than what a guy like Fritz did in order to realize how STUPID the keep Sanders opinion is!

[pbmax]

I don't know about mean. If he had a beard, he would look like Black Santa Claus.



If Sanders is removed, is there a candidate like Fritz Shurmur floating around for M3?

But since this thread is about uninformed speculation, I will root for Crennel because he's big, looks mean, and black people are more intimidating in positions of power than white people. Look at this, his team photo looks more like a mug shot, and I'm not just saying that because he's black:

http://z.about.com/d/cleveland/1/0/W/T/-/-/browns-crennel.jpg

[Fritz]

He actually looks like a kindly dude to me.

Now that we're on this topic, shouldn't the number one requirement be to hire a guy who looks mean and nasty?

Oh, and when are the Packers going to find a fiery ST coach here?

[SkinBasket]

Fine!

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f220/triberocks4/Sidelines/1201RomeoCrennel.jpg

Is that better? I tried to find more, but in most of his sideline pics, he just looks more sad than angry...

[]{ilr]3]

Bring back Bates!

What the hell is that guy doing these days anyway?

I thought he was with the Denver Bronco's as a assistant HC and SloWITT was the DC.

[Zool]

Fine!

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f220/triberocks4/Sidelines/1201RomeoCrennel.jpg

Is that better? I tried to find more, but in most of his sideline pics, he just looks more sad than angry...

I like his jugs. Im guessing 50D

[Fritz]

Now that MM is clearly established as a HC, it'd be great to bring ol Bates back. He'll fire up the troops!

[Pugger]

And I thought Bates wasn't employed? :?: I say no to Bates (plus with the way he was passed over for HC I doubt he'll be asked - too awkward). I'm not all that wild about Bate's defensive scheme anyway. I don't think it matches our personnel all that well. Moss might not be a bad choice, if indeed MM decides to make a change. We don't really know if he will employ a more aggressive style of D than Sanders if he is the DC do we?

[wist43]

Do they change schemes??? Can't see them switching to a 3-4... current scheme is too passive up front; lacks an attack mentality.

Front seven needs an infusion of talent - as has been said, "the Packers don't scare anyone".

[HarveyWallbangers]

Considering MM already took the rather unusual step of having one guy be an assistant HC while at the same time being a position coach under a coordinator, I'd say Winston Moss is a strong possibility for internal promotion to DC. I think MM must have a lot of regard for the guy.

That'd be a win-win because the players would get the consistency of a familiar face while still getting the kick-in-the-pants coaching change they deserve.

Despite the fourth quarter swoons, I think our defense is more bent than broken and Moss may have more leadership ability than vanilla Bob.

Agreed. I know some (Bretsky) don't like coaches without championship experience, but not all coaches are put in ideal situations. Fritz Shurmur is a great example. Before coming to Green Bay, he coached for the Detroit Lions, New England Patriots, Los Angeles Rams, and Arizona Cardinals. None of them won a title while he was with them. Most of his teams didn't come close to winning a title.

[Fritz]

Do they change schemes??? Can't see them switching to a 3-4... current scheme is too passive up front; lacks an attack mentality.

Front seven needs an infusion of talent - as has been said, "the Packers don't scare anyone".

I would like to see an ass-kickin' screaming d-coordinator. That sh_t doesn't necessarily work, but it makes me feel good, anyway.

At least let's get one of those guys for ST coach.

[rbaloha1]

Any one with a 4-3 pedigree, good blitz packages along with a scheme that allows players to play without thinking too much.

[Bretsky]

A LIST- Cream of the Crop
Mike Nolan
Greg Williams

B LIST for Better than we have
Jim Haslett
Romeo Crennell

The Whatever List for we're happy with the guys we got and/or MM doesn't have the stones to go outside our box

Bob Sanders
Winston Moss
Robert Dunn

[CaptainKickass]

{ilr]3]
Bring back Bates!

What the hell is that guy doing these days anyway?

I thought he was with the Denver Bronco's as a assistant HC and SloWITT was the DC.

If Shanahan got canned - and Bates was working for Denver - doesn't that mean he's available? Can anyone confirm Bates employment?

[Farley Face]

M3 is dragging his feet to wait out the result of the Moss interview in St. Loo. If Moss misses out on that opportunity M3 whacks Sanders and slides Moss in to DC.

[MJZiggy]

If Sanders needs whacking, it should happen regardless of how Moss does in St. Louis.

[Farley Face]

And I thought Bates wasn't employed? :?: I say no to Bates (plus with the way he was passed over for HC I doubt he'll be asked - too awkward). I'm not all that wild about Bate's defensive scheme anyway. I don't think it matches our personnel all that well. Moss might not be a bad choice, if indeed MM decides to make a change. We don't really know if he will employ a more aggressive style of D than Sanders if he is the DC do we?

I think it would be a safe assumption. Moss tutored in NO w/ Haslett who ran a more aggressive 4-3.

[Farley Face]

If Sanders needs whacking, it should happen regardless of how Moss does in St. Louis.

I see your point, but mine was he would wait to announce the promotion at roughly the same time as the whacking. Fire Sanders today, Moss goes to the Rams, now you are scrambling for a DC and an Ast. HC/LB coach. Just my own speculation in the spirit the thread was started.

[pbmax]

Bates left last year and gave way to Slowik in Denver. The Denver D coordinator post is a back hole.

I am not convinced by Gregg Williams. He ran Gibbs defense in Washington, so that is a reasonably good reference, but his stock has been sliding since his days as the Buffalo coach. And Jacksonville, which has had good defenses, pitched him.

What I really want is for Jerry Jones to panic that Jason Garrett might leave for Detroit, fire Wade Phillips and then we snatch him up. He has run 3-4 and 4-3 and did a good job for a D minded boss in Schottenheimer while in San Diego. he is the closest candidate to Shurmur I can find so far.

Usually waiting for Jerry to overreact is a good bet, but so far he has just fired his Special Teams coach Bruce Read.

[Jimx29]

I say hire from within.
I'm confident that there are more than a few members here that are more competent than Sanders

[Bretsky]

If Sanders needs whacking, it should happen regardless of how Moss does in St. Louis.

I see your point, but mine was he would wait to announce the promotion at roughly the same time as the whacking. Fire Sanders today, Moss goes to the Rams, now you are scrambling for a DC and an Ast. HC/LB coach. Just my own speculation in the spirit the thread was started.


Scrambling ? Moss has never been a DC before and there are better candidates out there. We can really only judge Moss by the LB's play at this point.

[pbmax]

If Sanders needs whacking, it should happen regardless of how Moss does in St. Louis.

I see your point, but mine was he would wait to announce the promotion at roughly the same time as the whacking. Fire Sanders today, Moss goes to the Rams, now you are scrambling for a DC and an Ast. HC/LB coach. Just my own speculation in the spirit the thread was started.


Scrambling ? Moss has never been a DC before and there are better candidates out there. We can really only judge Moss by the LB's play at this point.
You know, this raises a good point. If McCarthy knew now, or sometime near the end of the season that Sanders had to go, he would have had a clear incentive to make the move early so that he could include Moss in his search. Since he seems not to have done this, he is either cold-blooded or has no current intention of moving Sanders.

[The Leaper]

I do not prefer to hire from within...I think that is a bad strategy when your defense had so many failings across the board. Clearly, new blood is needed to spice things up.

[Bretsky]

If Sanders needs whacking, it should happen regardless of how Moss does in St. Louis.

I see your point, but mine was he would wait to announce the promotion at roughly the same time as the whacking. Fire Sanders today, Moss goes to the Rams, now you are scrambling for a DC and an Ast. HC/LB coach. Just my own speculation in the spirit the thread was started.


Scrambling ? Moss has never been a DC before and there are better candidates out there. We can really only judge Moss by the LB's play at this point.
You know, this raises a good point. If McCarthy knew now, or sometime near the end of the season that Sanders had to go, he would have had a clear incentive to make the move early so that he could include Moss in his search. Since he seems not to have done this, he is either cold-blooded or has no current intention of moving Sanders.


This is what I'm thinking as well. If MM didn't realize the change needed to be made at season's end I wonder if his emotions are stronger than his intelligence. I'd think he'd act boldly. Every day of waiting may mean a candidate is lost.

On the other hand, I clearly am not a fan of Winston Moss as our DC. We might as well keep Sanders if we are staying with our own staff. Vanilla Man can't be much worse. Moss has no experience there and I didn't see much improvement from the position he coaches.

It could also be possible that part of MM's delay may have to do with not really wanting Moss as the DC either.

[MJZiggy]

The piece of information that we don't have that would make discussions on whether to hire from within is whether Moss buys into Sanders' defensive philosophy or whether he has to play his guys that way because of someone else's scheme.

If Moss wants to rule the roost differently than the current attitude, then the continuity and the respect that he already has from the players might be enough to move the team in the right direction.

[Bretsky]

The piece of information that we don't have that would make discussions on whether to hire from within is whether Moss buys into Sanders' defensive philosophy or whether he has to play his guys that way because of someone else's scheme.

If Moss wants to rule the roost differently than the current attitude, then the continuity and the respect that he already has from the players might be enough to move the team in the right direction.


If he doesn't buy into the philosophy and MM want to change the philosophy then we have some very qualified candidates to choose from. The LB's were far from impressive even when healthy this year

While I may be wrong I HIGHLY doubt Moss gets the Rams job; if you recall per new rules one minority candidate has to be interviewed.

[Partial]

A LIST- Cream of the Crop
Mike Nolan
Greg Williams

B LIST for Better than we have
Jim Haslett
Romeo Crennell

The Whatever List for we're happy with the guys we got and/or MM doesn't have the stones to go outside our box

Bob Sanders
Winston Moss
Robert Dunn

I agree with this list. One could probably put Marinelli in the cream of the crop too imo. I'm not super interested in his scheme, though.

[Partial]

The piece of information that we don't have that would make discussions on whether to hire from within is whether Moss buys into Sanders' defensive philosophy or whether he has to play his guys that way because of someone else's scheme.

If Moss wants to rule the roost differently than the current attitude, then the continuity and the respect that he already has from the players might be enough to move the team in the right direction.


If he doesn't buy into the philosophy and MM want to change the philosophy then we have some very qualified candidates to choose from. The LB's were far from impressive even when healthy this year

While I may be wrong I HIGHLY doubt Moss gets the Rams job; if you recall per new rules one minority candidate has to be interviewed.

JSO speculated though that MM wouldn't make a move until Friday at the earliest if I remember correctly. I think we'll see Sanders let go tomorrow.

[pack4to84]

A LIST- Cream of the Crop
Mike Nolan
Greg Williams

B LIST for Better than we have
Jim Haslett
Romeo Crennell

The Whatever List for we're happy with the guys we got and/or MM doesn't have the stones to go outside our box

Bob Sanders
Winston Moss
Robert Dunn
http://www.bigcatcountry.com/2008/6/30/561577/jacksonville-jaguars-defen
Greg Williams defense Philosophy The Buddy Ryan Effect

Last week, we discussed the history, philosophy, and possible effects of introducing Gregg Williams to the Jacksonville Jaguars. One name that comes up with any research into Gregg Williams is his tutelage under Buddy Ryan. Ryan is best known for developing the defense that would define the 1985 Chicago Bears, the 46 defense. Fans of the Philadelphia Eagles, Houston Oilers, and Arizona Cardinals might disagree with that statement, of course, but the legacy of Ryan is in his approach to defenses. Gregg Williams is considered a disciple of Ryan, though he only technically worked under Ryan in 1993 with the Oilers. Though their time together was short, Williams defensive career is centered on emulating and developing the concepts established by Buddy Ryan. The "attack style" reputation of the Jaguars new defensive coordinator is ripped straight from the playbook of Ryan.

[mission]

I would love Gregg Williams but it wont happen ...

[pbmax]

I would love Gregg Williams but it wont happen ...
I think there is a reason he is unemployed. His style has not been as successful recently as it was early in his career. What I need to know about him, is he adaptable?

Remember that every defensive coordinator ever hired has been touted as being more aggressive and they all promise to get after the Quarterback. I prefer success to any specific philosophy.

[Bretsky]

I would love Gregg Williams but it wont happen ...
I think there is a reason he is unemployed. His style has not been as successful recently as it was early in his career. What I need to know about him, is he adaptable?

Remember that every defensive coordinator ever hired has been touted as being more aggressive and they all promise to get after the Quarterback. I prefer success to any specific philosophy.



I remember at this year's beginning there was talk of new blitzing schemes and packages that would pressure the QB more; I don't think anybody would try to argue they worked

I just want new blood in there from the outside; I'm not sure I'll be that fussy if it occurs

[pbmax]

I remember at this year's beginning there was talk of new blitzing schemes and packages that would pressure the QB more; I don't think anybody would try to argue they worked

I just want new blood in there from the outside; I'm not sure I'll be that fussy if it occurs
They did more blitzing this year and they had to. They even got better at it towards the end, unless it was the level of competition that helped. But it wasn't enough, I agree. And since we seem to play zone like clowns in a Volkswagon, it didn't help that if we failed to get home there were two people wide open.

[The Shadow]

I would love Gregg Williams but it wont happen ...
I think there is a reason he is unemployed. His style has not been as successful recently as it was early in his career. What I need to know about him, is he adaptable?

Remember that every defensive coordinator ever hired has been touted as being more aggressive and they all promise to get after the Quarterback. I prefer success to any specific philosophy.



I remember at this year's beginning there was talk of new blitzing schemes and packages that would pressure the QB more; I don't think anybody would try to argue they worked

I just want new blood in there from the outside; I'm not sure I'll be that fussy if it occurs


That was a major part of the defensive failings - outside of the Woodson corner blitz, there was nothing effective there at all.
Love to see an outsider brought in with a few new ideas.

[pbmax]

2008 - 27 sacks, 8 by non-lineman (29.6%)

2007 - 36 sacks, 4.5 by non-lineman (12.5%)

[Joemailman]

{ilr]3]
Bring back Bates!

What the hell is that guy doing these days anyway?

I thought he was with the Denver Bronco's as a assistant HC and SloWITT was the DC.

If Shanahan got canned - and Bates was working for Denver - doesn't that mean he's available? Can anyone confirm Bates employment?

With Shanahan being fired, does that mean Slowik is available? :five:

[Packers4Ever]

We need somebody who is beyond criticism by the know-nothings who are out to get Sanders. The only name I saw mentioned like that is Fritz Shurmur.

I've left Fritz a message but he hasn't gotten back to me yet.

I'm sorry, Swede, but I believe he never will. To my recollection, Fritz went out
to Seattle with Holmgren (in about '98?) for about a year, became ill and passed away from cancer. He was a much-loved DL coach and is still missed by many here.

[swede]

We need somebody who is beyond criticism by the know-nothings who are out to get Sanders. The only name I saw mentioned like that is Fritz Shurmur.

I've left Fritz a message but he hasn't gotten back to me yet.

I'm sorry, Swede, but I believe he never will. To my recollection, Fritz went out
to Seattle with Holmgren (in about '98?) for about a year, became ill and passed away from cancer. He was a much-loved DL coach and is still missed by many here.

Bless your heart. Your kind and gentle style make me sorry to behave so badly in here. I did of course love Fritz and his cerebral yet down-to-earth way. And I am fully aware of his too-early demise.

My comment was a sarcastic tweak.

Have a pleasant evening. :)

[Sparkey]

2008 - 27 sacks, 8 by non-lineman (29.6%)

2007 - 36 sacks, 4.5 by non-lineman (12.5%)

So 19 sacks by the 08 Dline (Kampman had 9.5 alone) and 31.5 by the 07 Dline. That is a huge drop-off from the line and it doesn't even take into account the decrease in hurries and qb hits that are not a sack.

Plus, as much as everyone wants more blitzing, every blitzer means one less guy in coverage. Blitz on a play when they run a quick 3 step slant and you have zero chance of getting the qb but a damn good shot at giving up a big play.

I really believe the drop in production is entirely on the line and the lack of pressure. Regardless of who's responsible, it is an area that needs to be addressed. If not 09 will be a repeat of 08.

[cpk1994]

We need somebody who is beyond criticism by the know-nothings who are out to get Sanders. The only name I saw mentioned like that is Fritz Shurmur.

I've left Fritz a message but he hasn't gotten back to me yet.

I'm sorry, Swede, but I believe he never will. To my recollection, Fritz went out
to Seattle with Holmgren (in about '98?) for about a year, became ill and passed away from cancer. He was a much-loved DL coach and is still missed by many here.I to miss him. But its ironic thaat as people mention him as being more aggressive and creative, at one point in GB, he was derieded for not being agressive enough and being labeled "No Blitz" Fritz.

[Fritz]

For my own sake, I just want a mean, nasty-looking guy who will stare down some ding-dong defensive lineman who just jumped offside on third and five, or will get up into a guy's face and scream at him after his stupid personal foul penalty.

That's all I want. A screamer. A mean bastard.

So his defense will play the same way. Mean.

[cpk1994]

For my own sake, I just want a mean, nasty-looking guy who will stare down some ding-dong defensive lineman who just jumped offside on third and five, or will get up into a guy's face and scream at him after his stupid personal foul penalty.

That's all I want. A screamer. A mean bastard.

So his defense will play the same way. Mean.Too bad Wayne Simmons is no longer living. :cry:

[Fritz]

Exactly.

And really, I'm not sure there's any evidence that a mean, screaming coach is any more effective than a quiet one. But it makes me feel like he's doing a good job.

[SkinBasket]

I'm with frutz.

[SkinBasket]

I mean fritz.

[pbmax]

Possibly available from Tampa Bay, not that anyone has advocated for the Tampa scheme (via PFT):

Larry Coyer and Casey 'Gus' Bradley


Coyer, who came to Tampa Bay in 2007 after being fired as the Denver Broncos’ defensive coordinator, spent one year as the Buccaneers’ defensive line coach before being shifted to a new role under coach Jon Gruden prior to this season.

Coyer’s contract was scheduled to expire in the next few weeks, an iffy status shared by tight ends coach Bob Casullo and linebackers coach Casey “Gus” Bradley, according to the Tribune.

[vince]

Here's a list of up-and-comers with a lot of potential. I know nothing about any of these guys, but Sean McDermott sticks out to me... Chuck Cecil is interesting just because of his human assassin persona among Packer fans...

http://www.packerupdate.com/pu/2009/01/top-10-coordinatorsinwaiting.html

TOP 10 COORDINATORS-IN-WAITING
If Bob Sanders is relieved of his duties, the Packers will be in the market for a new defensive coordinator. While names like former head coaches Mike Nolan, Gregg Williams and Jim Haslett are sure to be bandied about, we asked a scout for another team to give us the names of currently employed position coaches who appear ready to take the next step. Here are one man’s list of the league's top 10 potential defensive coordinators:

THE TOP 5

1) TODD BOWLES (DBs/Miami) - "Bowles, 45, is a former NFL player who has coached for Bill Parcells in both Dallas and Miami. He is regarded as a hard worker and a good teacher. The thing I really like about him is that he's not wedded to one specific system. He can coach either the 4-3 or the 3-4. He also has ties to the Green Bay organization. He worked in the personnel department under Ron Wolf (and alongside Ted Thompson) in the mid-90s.”

2) SEAN MCDERMOTT (DBs/Philadelphia) - "McDermott, 34, is the perfect choice if you're looking to find the next [Giants DC] Steve Spagnuolo. He's worked under Jim Johnson for 10 years. I also like the fact that he's coached multiple positions. His resume is very similar to those of Spagnuolo and [Ravens HC] John Harbaugh. That's a good selling point.”

3) SAL SUNSERI (DL/Carolina) - "Sunseri, 49, has been flying under the radar in Carolina, but he does an excellent job year after year. He's a fiery-type of coach who gets the most out of his players. He worked with Mike McCarthy at Pitt in the late 80s. I'm not sure if the two are still friendly, but that prior relationship can't hurt."

4) CHUCK CECIL (DBs/Tennessee) - "Cecil, 44, would make a lot of sense. He played for the Packers from ‘88 to ‘92 and he'd get a strong recommendation from Titans GM Mike Reinfeldt, who happens to be very close with Thompson. Cecil is an extremely intense coach who would give any defense an instant identity. His only real negative is a reckless driving incident from earlier in the year."

5) ALAN WILLIAMS (DBs/Indy) - “Tony Dungy thinks the world of this young man, and that’s good enough for me. Williams, 39, is soft-spoken, but he works hard and relates extremely well to his players. Does that sound familiar? I’m not sure what McCarthy thinks of the Cover-2 scheme, but it’s something to think about considering that Charles Woodson and Al Harris won’t be around forever.”

THE NEXT 5

6) KEITH BUTLER (LBs/Pittsburgh) - “Butler, 52, has worked under Dick LeBeau for the past six years, so he’s 3-4 all the way. That’s probably one of the reasons why he hasn’t gotten hired as a coordinator yet. He’s a terrific position coach who's more than ready for the next challenge."

7) DARREN PERRY (DBs/Oakland) - “Perry, 40, has been an excellent defensive backs coach for years. What I like about him is his varied resume. He worked under LeBeau in Pittsburgh and under Rob Ryan in Oakland. Talk about learning two totally different schemes from two totally different teachers.”

8) PEPPER JOHNSON (DL/New England) - “Johnson, 44, played linebacker under Bill Belichick with the Giants and has coached defense under him for the past eight years in New England. He’s done an equally impressive job of developing youngsters and improving veterans. Like Butler, his biggest drawback is his background in the 3-4.”

9) JOE WOODS (DBs/Minnesota) - "Woods, 38, has done a nice job with the Vikings after coming over from Tampa Bay in 2006. He reminds me of [Steelers HC] Mike Tomlin. He may need a little more experience, but he's going to be at or near the top of every team's wish list in a year or two."

10) BILL SHERIDAN (LBs/Giants) - "Sheridan, 49, has only been in the NFL for four years, but he's already earned a solid reputation around the league. His unit continues to perform at a pretty high level despite suffering a number of key injuries and free agent defections over the past few seasons."

Winston Moss, 42, the Packers' current assistant head coach/linebackers, didn't make the list. "Moss certainly has the potential to be a quality coordinator," said the scout. "He knows the game and he's a good motivator. But I don't think his resume is quite as strong as some of the other position coaches. Working directly under Ron Zook, Rick Venturi and Sanders doesn't overly excite me. It wouldn't be a surprise to see Moss get the job in Green Bay, but in my opinion, there are a number of better candidates."

[Bossman641]

Sean McDermott sounds like the type of guy I would be after.

[Partial]

Pepper Johnson sounds intriguing to me. WWBBD :D

[HarveyWallbangers]

Good find, vince.


1) TODD BOWLES (DBs/Miami) - "Bowles, 45, is a former NFL player who has coached for Bill Parcells in both Dallas and Miami. He is regarded as a hard worker and a good teacher. The thing I really like about him is that he's not wedded to one specific system. He can coach either the 4-3 or the 3-4. He also has ties to the Green Bay organization. He worked in the personnel department under Ron Wolf (and alongside Ted Thompson) in the mid-90s.”

2) SEAN MCDERMOTT (DBs/Philadelphia) - "McDermott, 34, is the perfect choice if you're looking to find the next [Giants DC] Steve Spagnuolo. He's worked under Jim Johnson for 10 years. I also like the fact that he's coached multiple positions. His resume is very similar to those of Spagnuolo and [Ravens HC] John Harbaugh. That's a good selling point.”

4) CHUCK CECIL (DBs/Tennessee) - "Cecil, 44, would make a lot of sense. He played for the Packers from ‘88 to ‘92 and he'd get a strong recommendation from Titans GM Mike Reinfeldt, who happens to be very close with Thompson. Cecil is an extremely intense coach who would give any defense an instant identity. His only real negative is a reckless driving incident from earlier in the year."

I'd be disappointed if Sanders is retained. I'm not adverse to Winston Moss, but the three above are intriguing to me.

[SkinBasket]

Chuck's not black and fat, but I'll take him for the massive nostalgia factor. At one point I told people he was my real dad for a year or two.

[Patler]

1) TODD BOWLES (DBs/Miami) - "Bowles, 45, is a former NFL player who has coached for Bill Parcells in both Dallas and Miami. He is regarded as a hard worker and a good teacher. The thing I really like about him is that he's not wedded to one specific system. He can coach either the 4-3 or the 3-4. He also has ties to the Green Bay organization. He worked in the personnel department under Ron Wolf (and alongside Ted Thompson) in the mid-90s.”


4) CHUCK CECIL (DBs/Tennessee) - "Cecil, 44, would make a lot of sense. He played for the Packers from ‘88 to ‘92 and he'd get a strong recommendation from Titans GM Mike Reinfeldt, who happens to be very close with Thompson. Cecil is an extremely intense coach who would give any defense an instant identity. His only real negative is a reckless driving incident from earlier in the year."


Chuck Cecil an intense coach? Gee, who would have thought? :lol:

Bowles sounds interesting. Coaches who have flexibility are often the innovators of the next "new" philosophy. A new wrinkle in a defense (or offense for that matter) can often get the upper hand at least for a few seasons. That might make for an interesting transition.

[The Shadow]

Ok, time to trot out my Chuck Cecil story (my apologies to longtime Rats who have heard this one before :
I am looking at a handwritten note, dated 5-5-88, from then-GM Tom Braatz, thanking me for my earlier pre-draft letter regarding Cecil.
In my younger days, did a little scouting, and wrote to Braatz, informing him that Cecil (and his style of play) was worth taking a hard look at for the Packer's secondary.
The note mentions that "Blades, Gruber, and Dixon were gone when we picked" (on their board). "We did get Chuck Cecil for you. Thanks for your insight into the draft."
Just a trivial little incident, but whenever Cecil's name crops up, I feel warm and fuzzy.

[Bretsky]

THANKS FOR THE LIST

Some nice prospects on there, and I agree several more qualified than Moss.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I don't think MM will change defensive coordinators.

The defense was fine in 2007. Did Sanders get stupid in 2008?

You can't scheme-around Alfred Malone & Jermey Thompson on the defensive line. Hawk had a very down year, perhaps due to injury, but also due to diminished line play. No Barnett.

Maybe Sanders should get a raise because of the excellent and improved play of the secondary.

[Bretsky]

I don't think MM will change defensive coordinators.

The defense was fine in 2007. Did Sanders get stupid in 2008?

You can't scheme-around Alfred Malone & Jermey Thompson on the defensive line. Hawk had a very down year, perhaps due to injury, but also due to diminished line play. No Barnett.

Maybe Sanders should get a raise because of the excellent and improved play of the secondary.


The defense was terrible in 06 before the last three puffcakes we faced on offense the final three games of the year; the press was writing about his release back then as well.

I fully supported the Corey Williams trade; nobody, including me, realized how much we would miss him.

Guys like C Williams, Jolly, Pickett, Jenkins..........they are all much better as a group instead of individuals. We had nobody who could give us what Williams did as part of that group last year.

Our predictable schemes just made the problems worse

[Harlan Huckleby]

Our predictable schemes just made the problems worse

They don't have a linebacker in that group who is any good at blitzing. What kind of scheme can overcome this?

you say predictable schemes, but the secondary was solid. they were doing something right.

in training camp, Hunter had emerged as the new secret weapon, the surprise blitzer/pash rusher. He turned out to crap in real games. What does that say about the other options?

They don't have any pass rushers anywhere in the front seven, except for Kampman. THAT is the problem. KGB died. Jenkins died. Hopes for the season died.

[Iron Mike]

Just a trivial little incident, but whenever Cecil's name crops up, I feel warm and fuzzy.

http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z55/daynperry/785519484_m.gif

[vince]

Here's Fritz' man...

http://www.theloveofsports.com/images/uploads/large/ChuckCecil1.jpg

[pbmax]

Is it just me or did that entire blurb about Chuck Cecil seem to imply that the two best qualifications for Defensive Coordinator are being intense and friends with the GM's buddy? I am pretty sure this is how Jerry and Danny operate, not a team with any sense. Cecil may be the next Tom Landry, but this blurb tells me nothing.

[Bretsky]

Our predictable schemes just made the problems worse

They don't have a linebacker in that group who is any good at blitzing. What kind of scheme can overcome this?

you say predictable schemes, but the secondary was solid. they were doing something right.

in training camp, Hunter had emerged as the new secret weapon, the surprise blitzer/pash rusher. He turned out to crap in real games. What does that say about the other options?

They don't have any pass rushers anywhere in the front seven, except for Kampman. THAT is the problem. KGB died. Jenkins died. Hopes for the season died.


How about stunts on the DL or be the LB's ? How about a new look or occasional wrinkle ? If we have limited talent it makes it even more important that we are less Vanilla ?

[Packers4Ever]

We need somebody who is beyond criticism by the know-nothings who are out to get Sanders. The only name I saw mentioned like that is Fritz Shurmur.

I've left Fritz a message but he hasn't gotten back to me yet.

I'm sorry, Swede, but I believe he never will. To my recollection, Fritz went out
to Seattle with Holmgren (in about '98?) for about a year, became ill and passed away from cancer. He was a much-loved DL coach and is still missed by many here.

Bless your heart. Your kind and gentle style make me sorry to behave so badly in here. I did of course love Fritz and his cerebral yet down-to-earth way. And I am fully aware of his too-early demise.

My comment was a sarcastic tweak.

Have a pleasant evening. :)

Not to worry, you didn't behave badly at all, just having a little fun.
Fritz was loved by many, it's too bad the good ones can't be recycled. But then we'd have to have a Poll first and commentary from each poster on the
candidate, and then..........

Never mind....... :wink:

[pbmax]

Just Do It

Your team, the team you built and drafted and PAID, deserves better than this. The players YOU drafted throttled the Eagles, but the inept coaching held them back. How could any staff fail to appreciate what you have done by stocking the offense with so many talented players eager to get the ball and show what they can do?

He would fix this. Him, his ego and his need to get all the media attention without treating anyone halfway decent. But he wanted out. He was tired, health problems and a recent divorce to heal. You are magnanimous and let him go. To save himself and find some peace. Then he turns up in Miami and takes some of the coaches and player personnel with him.

Doesn't matter. You are still here to draft and sign the checks. Al Davis (he's still alive behind those glasses right Jr.?, Stephen?) proved you don't need a great head coach. Just good coordinators. Even he approved of Jason Garrett, even if he wouldn't work with him. And tubby had been a great D coordinator in Schenectady or wherever he coached before.

He would have pushed Barber's buttons to make the little girl play on his owie toe. He would have called him a she, a Lion or a mincy little WR. He would have healed Pretty Boy's pinkie by threatening to take away the blonde twist.

You can't be expected to be everywhere all the time. You can make the money, build the stadium, make time for the ladies and chat with Berman, but you can't babysit the CB to be sure he doesn't throw a temper tantrum with the off duty police. You need a qualified coach who can keep these half wits in line. He could do it. Maybe the Colorado guy can. Then Tubby can go away and stop embarrassing everyone. The other guy looks like a rat, but at least he keeps his tan year round. He would round the offense into shape and teach little Jason how a man keeps the employees performing, not whining. Then you wouldn't have to do EVERYTHING.

And that would show HIM who was boss. You replaced the hairdo with the bootlegger and still won. You can replace the mean one with the tan one and win again. Even better, the tuna can didn't beat the Giants when it mattered, didn't go all the way. The tan has been there more recently. The tan has also beaten the hooded one in the junior conference. As long as we don't run into the Christian in the Super Bowl, we'll be fine with tan. And Christian is supposed to retire this year, to spend more time with the family. Little late, no? Wait, did I say that out loud? No?! Good. Everything is fine. Call the tan one and let tubby know by courier pigeon.

C'mon Jerry. You know you want to. Let Phillips go.

Shanahan To Dallas? via PFT (http://www.profootballtalk.com/2009/01/03/shanahan-to-dallas/)

[Iron Mike]

Moss is interviewing with the Chiefs supposedly. I can't get excited about him given the fall of the linebacker play this year, even though that might have as much to do about the DTs than our LBs.

He did coach under Haslett, who learned in Pittsburgh. I like that lineage.

So let's send Moss to KC and take Gunther Cunningham in trade.....the guy came up with some good defenses when he had something to work with.

[wpony]

I cant remember who brought up his name in here a few pages ago and cant find it now but I think that Rod Marinelli might be a good one he had nothing to work with in Detroit and even there started to tighten up there D some and look what he did with Tampa for all those yrs he would be worth a look at any way

[Joemailman]

Our predictable schemes just made the problems worse

They don't have a linebacker in that group who is any good at blitzing. What kind of scheme can overcome this?

you say predictable schemes, but the secondary was solid. they were doing something right.

in training camp, Hunter had emerged as the new secret weapon, the surprise blitzer/pash rusher. He turned out to crap in real games. What does that say about the other options?

They don't have any pass rushers anywhere in the front seven, except for Kampman. THAT is the problem. KGB died. Jenkins died. Hopes for the season died.

I think it's hard to tell if the Packers have LB's who can blitz or not because the scheme doesn't lend itself to blitzing. The LB's usually line up about 5 yards off the line of scrimmage and bunched in the middle. It's an alignment that relies on the front four providing the pass rush.

[Bossman641]

Our predictable schemes just made the problems worse

They don't have a linebacker in that group who is any good at blitzing. What kind of scheme can overcome this?

you say predictable schemes, but the secondary was solid. they were doing something right.

in training camp, Hunter had emerged as the new secret weapon, the surprise blitzer/pash rusher. He turned out to crap in real games. What does that say about the other options?

They don't have any pass rushers anywhere in the front seven, except for Kampman. THAT is the problem. KGB died. Jenkins died. Hopes for the season died.

I think it's hard to tell if the Packers have LB's who can blitz or not because the scheme doesn't lend itself to blitzing. The LB's usually line up about 5 yards off the line of scrimmage and bunched in the middle. It's an alignment that relies on the front four providing the pass rush.

I HATE our blitz scheme - if you can you even call it that.

9 times out of 10, it will be a delayed blitz and one of the LB's will run into a mass of bodies. Watch the Ravens and Chargers, they overload one side and always get a guy through.

The delayed blitz just seems so counter-productive to me. If the goal of a blitz is to make the QB get rid of the ball quickly why would you want to give him a second or two to find a guy before you even send the LB blitzing.

[Partial]

Anyone else thinking VB is here to stay? One would think they would have gotten rid of him already if they were going to.

[Lurker64]

Anyone else thinking VB is here to stay? One would think they would have gotten rid of him already if they were going to.

There's no need to rush a decision on which coaches to let go. Usually the head coaches get fired right away, and the coordinators trickle out as the postseason progresses. That somebody hasn't been fired yet is no indication that they will be.

It's better to take your time and make the right decision than to rush. They're not going to run out of assistant coaches, after all.

[Pacopete4]

how awkward to you think it is for coaches in the office right now not knowing about their job status

[pbmax]

Moss is interviewing with the Chiefs supposedly. I can't get excited about him given the fall of the linebacker play this year, even though that might have as much to do about the DTs than our LBs.

He did coach under Haslett, who learned in Pittsburgh. I like that lineage.

So let's send Moss to KC and take Gunther Cunningham in trade.....the guy came up with some good defenses when he had something to work with.
I had the wrong team in this post, Moss is interviewing with the Rams. But is Gunther still coaching with Herm there? Two completely different defensive backgrounds.

[Iron Mike]

Moss is interviewing with the Chiefs supposedly. I can't get excited about him given the fall of the linebacker play this year, even though that might have as much to do about the DTs than our LBs.

He did coach under Haslett, who learned in Pittsburgh. I like that lineage.

So let's send Moss to KC and take Gunther Cunningham in trade.....the guy came up with some good defenses when he had something to work with.
I had the wrong team in this post, Moss is interviewing with the Rams. But is Gunther still coaching with Herm there? Two completely different defensive backgrounds.

http://www.kcchiefs.com/coach/gunther_cunningham/

[MJZiggy]

how awkward to you think it is for coaches in the office right now not knowing about their job status

About the same as the rest of America at the moment...

[pbmax]

Marinelli is in Seattle, not clear for what job. Marshall, the current D coordinator, might be on the way out.