Republicans ask Supreme Court to halt recount

[Harlan Huckleby]

I laughed when I heard on the radio that attorneys for Norm Coleman had asked the Minnesota Supreme Court to intervene in the recount. They wanted the current count to be halted (since it is not going their way), and have it redone again from the beginning.

In another thread, Bobblehead was arguing what good-sports the Republicans are by nature. Not like the legalistic, sore-losers from the Democrat (sic) party.

:P

here is a newer article, the report I heard was from two days ago, altho i couldn't be bothered to read it myself
http://www.myfoxtwincities.com/myfox/pages/News/Detail?contentId=8139121&version=1&locale=EN-US&layoutCode=TSTY&pageId=3.2.1

[MJZiggy]

I also read this morning that the recount is finished with Franken up by 255 votes, but the Republicans want them to refuse to certify the results and not seat anyone until ALL legal cases are complete.

[sheepshead]

Just keep counting till the democrat wins. Trunks of cars, under pews....keep 'em comin'!

[Harlan Huckleby]

Just keep counting till the democrat wins. Trunks of cars, under pews....keep 'em comin'!

Why is a state controlled by a Rebublican governor going to these lengths to commit this fraud? There always did seem to be something a little unsavory about that Pawlenty guy.

[MJZiggy]

Just keep counting till the democrat wins. Trunks of cars, under pews....keep 'em comin'!

They already did that. Now the Republican for some reason wants to count some more...Go figure.

[Joemailman]

I can't believe it. No way would the Republicans go to the Supreme Court to stop a recount.

[texaspackerbacker]

This has been a blatant attempt by the Dems to steal the election, and it is showing signs of being successful. The Minnesota State Legislature and the U.S. Congress are likely to be complicit in this. The only hope for justice is apparently the U.S. Supreme Court.

[pacfan]

The only hope for justice is apparently the U.S. Supreme Court.

Yeah!!

let the court decide the legislative functions, formalism be damned-we need justice!!!

[Harlan Huckleby]

This has been a blatant attempt by the Dems to steal the election, and it is showing signs of being successful. The Minnesota State Legislature and the U.S. Congress are likely to be complicit in this. The only hope for justice is apparently the U.S. Supreme Court.


Heee heee heee. How do you reckon the Minnesota Legislature pulled off this swindle? :lol: The recounting is supervised by the MN Secretary of State, it's a Republican administration in MN.

This is too funny. Well, maybe it will eventually get to YOUR Supreme Court, and they will again set things right.

[Harlan Huckleby]

http://images.dawgsports.com/images/admin/Stuart_Smalley_sitting.jpg


Does this look like a man who would steal an election? I think not.

[HowardRoark]

The recounting is supervised by the MN Secretary of State, it's a Republican administration in MN.

Mark Ritchie is a lunatic DFLer. He is not a Republican. I live up here and don't follow the story....it's a joke; statistically impossible. But I guess that's typical when it comes to the Left......throw away science.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Republican governor and Coleman. Everything else is pretty much liberal up here. Coleman winning a recount (after two electronic counts gave him the lead) was a longshot. About as unlikely as if the recount had taken place in Illinois.

[Harlan Huckleby]

The recounting is supervised by the MN Secretary of State, it's a Republican administration in MN.

Mark Ritchie is a lunatic DFLer. He is not a Republican. I live up here and don't follow the story....it's a joke; statistically impossible. But I guess that's typical when it comes to the Left......throw away science.


OK, I just assumed the Gov appointed those positions.

Its really hard for me to believe that the people doing the counting across the state are cheating.
Are the number swings really statisitically unlikely? If the swings are hundreds in millions, perhaps not.

The result will be scrutinized, the press will have a look at the ballots, and academics are gonna crunch the numbers very carefully looking for suspicious trends. Lots of whistle blowers will be looking to make a name for themselves.

[sheepshead]

Just keep counting till the democrat wins. Trunks of cars, under pews....keep 'em comin'!

Why is a state controlled by a Rebublican governor going to these lengths to commit this fraud? There always did seem to be something a little unsavory about that Pawlenty guy.

Governors sign bills, they dont decide elections.

[mraynrand]

I will pee on Al Franken's leg.

[SkinBasket]

Just keep counting till the democrat wins. Trunks of cars, under pews....keep 'em comin'!

They already did that. Now the Republican for some reason wants to count some more...Go figure.

Go figure. This is exactly how we saw this playing out. Recount and literally find more votes until you have the numbers you want, then declare the results as perfect. The will of the voter has been divined!!

Again, I recommend this rather dispassionate article to anyone who thinks this recount has much legitimacy behind it as compared to the mechanical vote: http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,470892,00.html

There's plenty of reason for the results of the Canvassing Board to be questioned. Unless of course your only concern is getting a comedian in office instead of counting real votes in a consistent and effective manner.

[mraynrand]

Again, I recommend this rather dispassionate article to anyone who thinks this recount has much legitimacy behind it as compared to the mechanical vote: http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,470892,00.html.

Since this story is from Fox news, it is automatically invalidated. Media Matters explained it all to me.

[Zool]

Go figure. This is exactly how we saw this playing out. Recount and literally find more votes until you have the numbers you want, then declare the results as perfect. The will of the voter has been divined!!

Again, I recommend this rather dispassionate article to anyone who thinks this recount has much legitimacy behind it as compared to the mechanical vote: http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,470892,00.html

There's plenty of reason for the results of the Canvassing Board to be questioned. Unless of course your only concern is getting a comedian in office instead of counting real votes in a consistent and effective manner.

Whats worse, a joker or a crook?

[mraynrand]

Go figure. This is exactly how we saw this playing out. Recount and literally find more votes until you have the numbers you want, then declare the results as perfect. The will of the voter has been divined!!

Again, I recommend this rather dispassionate article to anyone who thinks this recount has much legitimacy behind it as compared to the mechanical vote: http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,470892,00.html

There's plenty of reason for the results of the Canvassing Board to be questioned. Unless of course your only concern is getting a comedian in office instead of counting real votes in a consistent and effective manner.

Whats worse, a joker or a crook?

How about both?

http://image.guardian.co.uk/sys-images/Arts/Arts_/Pictures/2007/12/18/Joker460.jpg

[pacfan]

Go figure. This is exactly how we saw this playing out. Recount and literally find more votes until you have the numbers you want, then declare the results as perfect. The will of the voter has been divined!!

Again, I recommend this rather dispassionate article to anyone who thinks this recount has much legitimacy behind it as compared to the mechanical vote: http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,470892,00.html

There's plenty of reason for the results of the Canvassing Board to be questioned. Unless of course your only concern is getting a comedian in office instead of counting real votes in a consistent and effective manner.

Whats worse, a joker or a crook?

A professional wrestler?

[texaspackerbacker]

This has been a blatant attempt by the Dems to steal the election, and it is showing signs of being successful. The Minnesota State Legislature and the U.S. Congress are likely to be complicit in this. The only hope for justice is apparently the U.S. Supreme Court.


Heee heee heee. How do you reckon the Minnesota Legislature pulled off this swindle? :lol: The recounting is supervised by the MN Secretary of State, it's a Republican administration in MN.

This is too funny. Well, maybe it will eventually get to YOUR Supreme Court, and they will again set things right.

Yeah. Howard beat me to it.

Most states if not all elect the Sec. of State separately from the governor.

[Harlan Huckleby]

you have no evidence of foul play, the ballotting will be more scrutinized than any vote in recent history. All you got is a big bowl of sour grapes.

[sheepshead]

Funny Business in Minnesota
In which every dubious ruling seems to help Al Franken.


Strange things keep happening in Minnesota, where the disputed recount in the Senate race between Norm Coleman and Al Franken may be nearing a dubious outcome. Thanks to the machinations of Democratic Secretary of State Mark Ritchie and a meek state Canvassing Board, Mr. Franken may emerge as an illegitimate victor.
[Review & Outlook] AP

Mr. Franken started the recount 215 votes behind Senator Coleman, but he now claims a 225-vote lead and suddenly the man who was insisting on "counting every vote" wants to shut the process down. He's getting help from Mr. Ritchie and his four fellow Canvassing Board members, who have delivered inconsistent rulings and are ignoring glaring problems with the tallies.

Under Minnesota law, election officials are required to make a duplicate ballot if the original is damaged during Election Night counting. Officials are supposed to mark these as "duplicate" and segregate the original ballots. But it appears some officials may have failed to mark ballots as duplicates, which are now being counted in addition to the originals. This helps explain why more than 25 precincts now have more ballots than voters who signed in to vote. By some estimates this double counting has yielded Mr. Franken an additional 80 to 100 votes.

This disenfranchises Minnesotans whose vote counted only once. And one Canvassing Board member, State Supreme Court Justice G. Barry Anderson, has acknowledged that "very likely there was a double counting." Yet the board insists that it lacks the authority to question local officials and it is merely adding the inflated numbers to the totals.

In other cases, the board has been flagrantly inconsistent. Last month, Mr. Franken's campaign charged that one Hennepin County (Minneapolis) precinct had "lost" 133 votes, since the hand recount showed fewer ballots than machine votes recorded on Election Night. Though there is no proof to this missing vote charge -- officials may have accidentally run the ballots through the machine twice on Election Night -- the Canvassing Board chose to go with the Election Night total, rather than the actual number of ballots in the recount. That decision gave Mr. Franken a gain of 46 votes.
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Meanwhile, a Ramsey County precinct ended up with 177 more ballots than there were recorded votes on Election Night. In that case, the board decided to go with the extra ballots, rather than the Election Night total, even though the county is now showing more ballots than voters in the precinct. This gave Mr. Franken a net gain of 37 votes, which means he's benefited both ways from the board's inconsistency.

And then there are the absentee ballots. The Franken campaign initially howled that some absentee votes had been erroneously rejected by local officials. Counties were supposed to review their absentees and create a list of those they believed were mistakenly rejected. Many Franken-leaning counties did so, submitting 1,350 ballots to include in the results. But many Coleman-leaning counties have yet to complete a re-examination. Despite this lack of uniformity, and though the state Supreme Court has yet to rule on a Coleman request to standardize this absentee review, Mr. Ritchie's office nonetheless plowed through the incomplete pile of 1,350 absentees this weekend, padding Mr. Franken's edge by a further 176 votes.
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COMMENTARY

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Both campaigns have also suggested that Mr. Ritchie's office made mistakes in tabulating votes that had been challenged by either of the campaigns. And the Canvassing Board appears to have applied inconsistent standards in how it decided some of these challenged votes -- in ways that, again on net, have favored Mr. Franken.

The question is how the board can certify a fair and accurate election result given these multiple recount problems. Yet that is precisely what the five members seem prepared to do when they meet today. Some members seem to have concluded that because one of the candidates will challenge the result in any event, why not get on with it and leave it to the courts? Mr. Coleman will certainly have grounds to contest the result in court, but he'll be at a disadvantage given that courts are understandably reluctant to overrule a certified outcome.

Meanwhile, Minnesota's other Senator, Amy Klobuchar, is already saying her fellow Democrats should seat Mr. Franken when the 111th Congress begins this week if the Canvassing Board certifies him as the winner. This contradicts Minnesota law, which says the state cannot award a certificate of election if one party contests the results. Ms. Klobuchar is trying to create the public perception of a fait accompli, all the better to make Mr. Coleman look like a sore loser and build pressure on him to drop his legal challenge despite the funny recount business.

Minnesotans like to think that their state isn't like New Jersey or Louisiana, and typically it isn't. But we can't recall a similar recount involving optical scanning machines that has changed so many votes, and in which nearly every crucial decision worked to the advantage of the same candidate. The Coleman campaign clearly misjudged the politics here, and the apparent willingness of a partisan like Mr. Ritchie to help his preferred candidate, Mr. Franken. If the Canvassing Board certifies Mr. Franken as the winner based on the current count, it will be anointing a tainted and undeserving Senator.

[Harlan Huckleby]

IF these accusations are legitimate, Coleman will prevail in a legal challenge.

Don't hold your breath, that Wall Street Journal rant is a one-sided account.

[HarveyWallbangers]

The recount is pretty fraudulent. I'd rather have an election decided by machines over the political machines. Partisan politics are just too damn ugly. It's too bad. Norm is a political snake. He'll pander to whatever group gets him elected. However, I probably dislike Al Franken more than any political candidate I've ever witnessed. He's just not a very good person. Bring back Jesse the Body.

[bobblehead]

I laughed when I heard on the radio that attorneys for Norm Coleman had asked the Minnesota Supreme Court to intervene in the recount. They wanted the current count to be halted (since it is not going their way), and have it redone again from the beginning.

In another thread, Bobblehead was arguing what good-sports the Republicans are by nature. Not like the legalistic, sore-losers from the Democrat (sic) party.

:P

here is a newer article, the report I heard was from two days ago, altho i couldn't be bothered to read it myself
http://www.myfoxtwincities.com/myfox/pages/News/Detail?contentId=8139121&version=1&locale=EN-US&layoutCode=TSTY&pageId=3.2.1

Did you miss my entire point? Am I that hard to read?? When Republicans lose on election day they concede and congratulate the opposition. I admit that after Al Franken lies cheats and steals his way to the lead they just might be inclined to turn to the courts to put an end to it....oh yea, your definition of a good sport is letting the other side lie cheat and steal and then rolling over. Sometimes I wonder if reading comprehension is a complete lost art.

[bobblehead]

Here HH this is what has happened, I'll let you be the judge. I'm copying from my own email to a friend:

Election night, Franken is down 725 votes. Before any hand recount ever started "election officials" corrected "typos" and swung 519 votes in Frankens favor. when 93% of the recount was done coleman still led by 295 votes. The state secretary decided that one county by the campus where coleman had gained 46 votes (franken technically lost 46 votes) would go back to election night results since the ballot total wasn't the same. Somehow after losing on election night...losing with 93% of the recount done....Franken is ahead now. Explain that one in statistical terms.

More facts. 2004 the washington state governors race was won by the republican. 5 days later 10,000 ballots were "found" and favored the dem. After a full hand recount including those ballots the republican won by 42 votes. the same county then found several provisional ballots (number isn't documented) and a 3rd recount ensued at which point the democrat won and the election was certified.

Records showed more mail in ballots counted than had ever been requested. Damn fox news, must be all there fault.

Oh by the way. the guy advising franken is the same guy who was head of the washington state DNC at the time...Paul Berendt.

These are facts and they are shady...if you can't admit that then what can I tell you.

[bobblehead]

The recounting is supervised by the MN Secretary of State, it's a Republican administration in MN.

Mark Ritchie is a lunatic DFLer. He is not a Republican. I live up here and don't follow the story....it's a joke; statistically impossible. But I guess that's typical when it comes to the Left......throw away science.


OK, I just assumed the Gov appointed those positions.

Its really hard for me to believe that the people doing the counting across the state are cheating.
Are the number swings really statisitically unlikely? If the swings are hundreds in millions, perhaps not.

The result will be scrutinized, the press will have a look at the ballots, and academics are gonna crunch the numbers very carefully looking for suspicious trends. Lots of whistle blowers will be looking to make a name for themselves.

Hold on, just got to this doosie...hard to believe they are cheating...more facts for you:

In 1974 in New Hampshire Paul Wyman won an election. The democrat demanded a recount and lost again. The republican was declared the winner and sent to DC. the senate refused to seat him (democratic controlled). They sent him back to New Hampshire for another election. Republicans were disgusted and didnt' cheat enough and lost the new election.

In 1985 similar situation in Indiana. Republican won, won a recount, democratic house refused to seat him and did their "own" recount. they declared the democrat the winner by 4 votes and seated him. You see a pattern here.

My personal experience here. In 1998 Nevada race House rep. John Ensign ran against harry reid. Ensign lost by 200 votes (approximately I can't find the exact number). Ensign conceded and congratulated Reid declining a hand recount. Gee, imagine that.

yea, not likely that they would cheat or do anything shady.

[bobblehead]

you have no evidence of foul play, the ballotting will be more scrutinized than any vote in recent history. All you got is a big bowl of sour grapes.

And once again...I'm the guy who wanted republicans to lose because they lost their soul. Sour grapes?? Not likely as I am glad we took a bath. However I wanted to lose elections legitimately.

[Harlan Huckleby]

bobblehead, all your examples of election foul-play are of democrats screwing republicans.

Is it possible that you are repeating the accounts you hear from right-leaning media? It sounds like you live in an echo chamber of conservative opinion.

I get what you republicans are saying: the dems are unethical scoundrals and are stealing the election. End of story.

There is nothing that can happen in this situation that you would accept if the Dem wins. Do you suggest that there should not be a recount? Can you imagine a situation in an election this close where there are not accusations of fraud?

There will be intense scrutiny. (All of which means nothing to you, since you simply assume dems are crooked and control all the levers. ) But the legal challenges will go forward, all the statisical evidence will be be there, surely some people will squeel if they are aware of "funny business". Isn't this far better than a partisian Supreme Court just declaring "its over, everybody go home."

[bobblehead]

bobblehead, all your examples of election foul-play are of democrats screwing republicans.

Is it possible that you are repeating the accounts you hear from right-leaning media? It sounds like you live in an echo chamber of conservative opinion.

I get what you republicans are saying: the dems are unethical scoundrals and are stealing the election. End of story.

There is nothing that can happen in this situation that you would accept if the Dem wins. Do you suggest that there should not be a recount? Can you imagine a situation in an election this close where there are not accusations of fraud?

There will be intense scrutiny. (All of which means nothing to you, since you simply assume dems are crooked and control all the levers. ) But the legal challenges will go forward, all the statisical evidence will be be there, surely some people will squeel if they are aware of "funny business". Isn't this far better than a partisian Supreme Court just declaring "its over, everybody go home."

The reason is one sided is because no one can cite me an example of a republican losing on election day, losing a hand count and getting a seat.

Yes, I am against hand recounts...I firmly believe in letting the machine count and ending it...I always have, this isn't new. Everyone admits that machines do mundane tasks without error better than people do, its a fact. I would feel the same way if Franken had won, on election night without "found" ballots, by 1 vote.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Yes, I am against hand recounts...I firmly believe in letting the machine count and ending it...I always have, this isn't new.

Fine, maybe there should be no recounts. But the rules are the rules. And no need to mention some case in 1974 where some Democrat did the nasty to some Republican, implying that history is repeating itself.

Lets talk Florida 2000, that's always fun. The electronic voting machines in the richer, REpublican districts had a less than 1% error rate. Around 10% of ballots were disqualified in districts with crude technology.

Did this gross injustice piss you off?

The Supreme Court agreed to act on the recount there because it said the recount wasn't being done uniformily. Violation of Equal Protection Clause. Well, arguably true. But the entire election process was even MORE unequal, how the hell do you disqualify just the recount!?

I like your idea of no recounts. Or put another way, it should all be done electronicly, and if a vote is somehow ambiguous, it is simply excluded in all cases. So no opportunity for recount. This policy is not perfectly fair, but probably it is more fair than the messiness of recounts.

[mraynrand]

It's not to hard. Openess and uniformity. Recounts in close elections should conform with the conditions established prior to the election - uniformly across the voting region. Voting should require some not overly burdensome standard of registration that takes place well before the day of the election and be well advertised. Ballots should be uniform as well. This will never happen. Repubs typically try to make it harder to vote in the first place and Dems try to get more people to vote even if they are voting fraudulently, voting multiple times or are dead.

If the MN recount is done correctly and uniformly, Franken will probably win by less than 50 votes. I'm not happy about that, but if it's done properly, then at least it won't look like a stolen election, like in WA in 2004, etc. etc.

[Harlan Huckleby]

The numbers I saw today are that FRanken is ahead by 250 votes out of about 3 million cast.

The recount swung about 300 net votes from the initial total. This is a tiny number, nothing suspicious in this change on face value.

I'm sure there was bias somewhere, in some cases, in the recount. Maybe enough to make a difference. But I don't see anyway to deal with it other than to fight it out in court, as Coleman will do, ballot by ballot. Its an imperfect process where the margin of victory is less than the margin of error.

[sheepshead]

25 precincts had more votes than registered voters.

[Harlan Huckleby]

25 precincts had more votes than registered voters.

If true then Coleman's legal challenges will sail through. Coleman will get the keys to his office back.

Or this could be just a misleading bit of half-truth bouncing around the right wing media-sphere.

We'll see which is the case.

[SkinBasket]

Harlan, if you think the courts are any more apolitical than the other political mechanisms at that level, you're a bigger fool than even I thought possible. I'm guessing Minnesota is similar to Wisconsin in that it's courts are filled to the gills with crazy, egomaniacal, partisan, and just plain terrible judges that don't have the intellect to match their delusions of power.

[Freak Out]

Do you guys "re-elect" your State Superior court judges in Wisco and Minn?

[Harlan Huckleby]

Harlan, if you think the courts are any more apolitical than the other political mechanisms


:lol: So the courts are part of the crooked, anti-Republican conspiracy.

a three judge panel is going to evaluate Coleman's case. The panel will be appointed by Chief Justice Eric Magnuson, who himself is an apointee of the the Republican Governor.

Something very fishy in Minnesota, indeed! The Republicans are pulling the levers and packing the panel. :P

[sheepshead]

25 precincts had more votes than registered voters.

If true then Coleman's legal challenges will sail through. Coleman will get the keys to his office back.

Or this could be just a misleading bit of half-truth bouncing around the right wing media-sphere.

We'll see which is the case.

Could be, i heard it from ORielly and Hannity last night!

[Harlan Huckleby]

I find O'Reilly to be pretty reliable. Hannity - not so much.

[SkinBasket]

Harlan, if you think the courts are any more apolitical than the other political mechanisms


:lol: So the courts are part of the crooked, anti-Republican conspiracy.


No conspiracy. Just plenty of second hand experience with state judges. They aren't the golden beacons of justice you make them out to be. I'm pretty sure you actually know that, but it doesn't fit with your conspiracy nonsense.

[Harlan Huckleby]

well, the panel of judges are being named by a republican appointee, so they are your crooks this time.

[bobblehead]

Why do you find it no big deal that machines had him losing by 700+ votes on election night, but by the time the recount started it was down to 100-? I have problems with recounts...period. I think if you can't fill out a ballot properly then tough shit...and obviously I had the same feeling when Elian Gonzalez cost Al Gore the presidency. Al Gore lost on election night, but was trying to steal it.

Democrats don't like losing, the ends justify the means. I have seen it over and over. I won $50 from a naive democrat guy I know because we bet on this recount. I gave him 2:1 that Franken would win the hand count. He has the same advisor that headed up the Washington state recount..I see a pattern, maybe you don't.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Why do you find it no big deal that machines had him losing by 700+ votes on election night, but by the time the recount started it was down to 100-?

I don't know the details. I don't trust the facts as presented by editorial writers or posters. There is much editing of the "facts" going on. I will trust what the 3 judge panel determines. If Coleman has a real case, he'll prevail.


Democrats don't like losing, the ends justify the means. I have seen it over and over.

FL 2000 was the ultimate ends-justifies-the-means job by the Republicans.

Nasty, nasty people those republicans. Worse than FAvre apologists.

[texaspackerbacker]

What are you talking about, Harlan?

The Republicans CLEARLY won Florida. The recount was limited to three Dem-dominated counties and yielded the Dems a bunch of really shaky/probably bogus additions. Numerous military absentee votes apparently went uncounted that would have been strongly for Bush; All the rest of the counties--where recounts would undoubtedly would have helped Bush--were NOT recounted. And with all of that, Bush STILL had more votes than Gore.

The stealing of the election would have been if the Supreme Court had ruled for Gore.

The Dems, as was said, pulled off a steal of the Washington governor's race--"keep recounting until it comes out the way you want, and then quit", and they seem on the verge of doing the same in Minnesota. Hopefully, the Supreme Court will derail this blatantly dishonest Dem effort.

[Harlan Huckleby]

The Republicans CLEARLY won Florida.

According to the election rules, yes, the Republicans won FL, and would have won it without the Supreme Court intervention. I know this from a thorough study done by New York Times/Miami Herald after the election. I accept their conclusion.

I'm still eternally pissed that the SC acted in such a partisian manner.

And the rules, such as they were, horribly disenfranchised Dem voters. In a fair election, with modern voting technology across the state, Gore would have easily won Florida.

[SkinBasket]

I'm still eternally pissed that the SC acted in such a partisian manner.

Well you should be upset at the left leaning members for siding with the Florida SC's raping of the Constitution in the name of winning an election for the Democrat. Good for you Harlan.


And the rules, such as they were, horribly disenfranchised Dem voters. In a fair election, with modern voting technology across the state, Gore would have easily won Florida.

Ahhh. The poor dumb voter angle. When in doubt...

[Harlan Huckleby]

Florida SC's raping of the Constitution .

The Supreme Court rebuked the Florida Supreme Court in a very narrow sense. I agree the U.S. Supreme Court had a defensible position, seen in isolation. But the big picture screams a political intervention.

That Supreme Court was famously allergic to appling the Equal Protection Clause in other cases. (Conservatives are not so big on all that equality business.) But they jumped-in to correct the lack of statewide uniformity of the recount process. This inequality paled in comparison to the election itself. Ballots from poor districts were rejected by a factor of 10-to-1 compared to rich districts. The richer areas had electronic voting. The Supreme Court jumped in with Equal Protection only where it benefited the Republicans.

You frequently repeat the myth that the Florida Supreme Court was found wildly out of line. Nothing could be further from the truth. But it seems to make you feel good, and I'm in favor of that, so keep it up.

[SkinBasket]

We're not having this discussion again. I like the Constitution and uniformity in regulation and enforcement of rules and laws. You like getting the desired result in an election after the fact via whatever means necessary. Potayto. Potahto.

[Harlan Huckleby]

that's me, alright.

The good Dems of MN are doing the Lord's work.

[SkinBasket]

that's me, alright.

Well, you know. You can put lipstick on a pig... [giggles, laughter, applause]... but it's still a pig.

Although that's not really fair. You were absolutely viscously heartbroken when Hillary was rejected by your fellow lefty Americans.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I actually was not heartbroken about Hillary. Well, no, that's not true, I was heartbroken. But it wasn't losing a political war that drove me to dementia, I am used to my preferred candidate losing. I was just as upset about the left's treatment of McCain and Palin as I was disgusted by the Hillary bashing. It was the dominance of Howard Dean types in the Dem party that left me homeless and muttering to myself.

[bobblehead]

I don't know the details. I don't trust the facts as presented by editorial writers or posters.

Hard to argue with that.

[texaspackerbacker]

The Republicans CLEARLY won Florida.

According to the election rules, yes, the Republicans won FL, and would have won it without the Supreme Court intervention. I know this from a thorough study done by New York Times/Miami Herald after the election. I accept their conclusion.

I'm still eternally pissed that the SC acted in such a partisian manner.

And the rules, such as they were, horribly disenfranchised Dem voters. In a fair election, with modern voting technology across the state, Gore would have easily won Florida.

The Supreme Court didn't so much intervene as it did settle the issue--and prevent the Dems from stealing Florida, and hence, the election--DESPITE what you and the NY Times/Miami Herald acknowledge was a legitimate Bush victory. Take away the Supreme Court "intevention" and you have the Washington governor race and possibly the Franken theft of the Minnesota Senate seat.

And what in the hell are you talking about with this unfairness and disenfranchisement crap? The only disenfranchisement I have even heard suggested was the denying of military absentee ballots which were mailed on time but didn't arrive until after the election.