Will Kampman succeed at linebacker?

[Harlan Huckleby]

the arguments were already made in another thread:
http://www.packerrats.com/ratchat/viewtopic.php?t=16544&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=40

I don't see Kampman being as good at LB as he has been at DE. Don't have any evidence, really just a hunch. He was good at using leverage and movement against a big tackle, that was his specialty. I think the DE position is his best fit, and he is unlikely to play at such a high level at another position.

[rbaloha1]

Agreed.

Kampy is an impact 4-3 end that needs to rush the qb every passing down. Requiring Kampy to drop into coverage is not a great idea.

A G-bay sportswriter was optimistic about Kampy playing olb due to Greg Ellis at Dallas. The writer claims Kampy is a better athlete than Ellis thus the conversion to olb should not be a problem. LOL!

IMO Kampy is a one gap 3-4 dt.

[Partial]

I think Kampman will be a very good 3-4 OLB. I think Julius Peppers was born to play our other 3-4 OLB spot. I also think we're a top 10 defense next year as a result!

[HarveyWallbangers]

IMO Kampy is a one gap 3-4 dt.

What?

[steve823]

kevin green bro. hes a great coach and will help him transition to it..so ya he will suceed

[Harlan Huckleby]

kevin green bro. hes a great coach and will help him transition to it..so ya he will suceed

will he ever be as good as his pro-bowl years at DE?

possibly, but I say the odds are against it.

[sharpe1027]

kevin green bro. hes a great coach and will help him transition to it..so ya he will suceed

will he ever be as good as his pro-bowl years at DE?

possibly, but I say the odds are against it.

True, but the odds are against him ever being that good again, even in a 4-3.

Is the question 4-3 Kamp vs. 3-4 Kamp or old Kamp vs. young Kamp?

I voted yes in that he will succeed. I don't know how to fairly compare his effectiveness between the two positions.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I voted yes in that he will succeed. I don't know how to fairly compare his effectiveness between the two positions.

WEll, you set the bar lower than the question intended. I said "just as effective." That would mean just as much QB pressure, no weaknesses. Kampman was good at all phases of the game at DE. Will coverage be a weakness in his game at LB? Quite likely.

[texaspackerbacker]

I'm still not completely convinced they will move Kampman to OLB. I could see him bulking back a little bit--he was more effective with the more weight anyway--and stay at DE in the 3-4.

I voted true, though, because I think it's 60/40 he does play OLB, and if he does, I think he will handle it and be effective--against all odds, just like when people originally didn't think he was athletic enough to be a top quality pass rusher in the 4-3.

[Partial]

kevin green bro. hes a great coach and will help him transition to it..so ya he will suceed

will he ever be as good as his pro-bowl years at DE?

possibly, but I say the odds are against it.

He'll probably be better. He will be doing about the same amount of rushing the passer, but he won't have to beat a tackle play after play. A good amount of the time he will have a TE to beat, an RB to beat, or best case scenario, a guard that is dropping back trying to catch him from behind the tackle, opening up a huge hole for the LE to get to the QB.

IF they land a capable pass rusher at the other OLB spot, and the DL stays healthy, I think he'll be more effective.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I could see him bulking back a little bit--he was more effective with the more weight anyway--and stay at DE in the 3-4.

OK, but you can't just flip a switch and "bulk up." Well, I've demonstrated that ability, but I think we're talking more muscle mass here. They have to commit one way or another NOW, I should think.

[sharpe1027]

I voted yes in that he will succeed. I don't know how to fairly compare his effectiveness between the two positions.

WEll, you set the bar lower than the question intended. I said "just as effective." That would mean just as much QB pressure, no weaknesses. Kampman was good at all phases of the game at DE. Will coverage be a weakness in his game at LB? Quite likely.

An interesting way to look at it.

If he is able to get anywhere near the same amount of pressure, while at the same time breaking up some passes, wouldn't he be more effective even if pass coverage was a weakness?

Not unlike a comparing the effectiveness of a WR that is forced to return kicks. That WR may suck at returning kicks and therefore has a weakness because he is asked to do something else. Does that mean he is any less effective even if he gets the same amounts of catches/yards/tds?

[Waldo]

I think he's going to get better. His natural position is LB, not DE.

[mission]

Let's be honest. Kampman hasn't been exactly DOMINANT for us on defense. He has got his sacks in bunches but I don't see him as a guy that opposing offenses really worry about. Sometimes he has just been plain silent and I see more creative scheming finding a way to create mismatches for him.

I agree with Waldo in that I think he'll be actually better than at 4-3 D and be more involved in making plays around the line of scrimmage.

DE is more than just end-of-season sack numbers.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Kampman had a down year in 2008 because the whole defense was down.

You can't ask for much more from a DE than what Kampman delivers. He's very good against the run, they usually don't run at him. He's not a dominant pass rusher, but he's very good.

[mission]

Kampman had a down year in 2008 because the whole defense was down.

You can't ask for much more from a DE than what Kampman delivers. He's very good against the run, they usually don't run at him. He's not a dominant pass rusher, but he's very good.

Either way, like I said.

Partial actually makes good points in this thread. He's going to be facing all sorts of different matchups that he should be favored even better against.

[BallHawk]

I think Kampman will be a very good 3-4 OLB. I think Julius Peppers was born to play our other 3-4 OLB spot. I also think we're a top 10 defense next year as a result!

Dude, you're pimping him more than his goddamn agent is. Chill, we're not going to get him.

[Joemailman]

I like Kampman's chances. His entire career he's been proving wrong those who said he lacks the athletic ability to be a standout. I sure didn't think he'd become one of the top DE's in the league when he first came out of Iowa. He looked like a high effort/average ability guy. Some guys just have the ability to make the adjustments that are needed.

[pack4to84]

I think he will have 15 sacks next year. With him lineup wide if the OT swings out to block him it opens the door for another rusher to fill the gap he left. So most OLB would be blocked by RB or FB. I like Kampton chances vs RB/FB's.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I like Kampman's chances. His entire career he's been proving wrong those who said he lacks the athletic ability to be a standout.

Tauscher is another guy who came from nowhere and became a good starting right tackle. That doesn't mean he would be just as good at left tackle.

Cullen Jenkins made himself into an excellent defensive end and tackle. He would just be OK as a nose guard.

[Partial]

I like Kampman's chances. His entire career he's been proving wrong those who said he lacks the athletic ability to be a standout.

Tauscher is another guy who came from nowhere and became a good starting right tackle. That doesn't mean he would be just as good at left tackle.

Cullen Jenkins made himself into an excellent defensive end and tackle. He would just be OK as a nose guard.

But that is because of physical limitations. Kampman's workout numbers support his ability to play the position as they fall in line with many of the great OLBs.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Of course he can. He lettered 3 times in bball and 4 times in track in high school. :roll:

[Lurker64]

I think the fact that "Kampman has played Linebacker before" points more to his ability to play a hybrid OLB/DE position than do his workout numbers, as impressive as they are.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

I think the fact that "Kampman has played Linebacker before" points more to his ability to play a hybrid OLB/DE position than do his workout numbers, as impressive as they are.

I acknowledge that point, however the last time he played LB was soph year at Iowa...in a conference and team not known for their speedy LBs.

You, me, or anybody else knows/remembers how he covered backs/TEs or how he operated in space.

That isn't to say he can't do it.

[Guiness]

I think the fact that "Kampman has played Linebacker before" points more to his ability to play a hybrid OLB/DE position than do his workout numbers, as impressive as they are.

Agreed, but I think at least some of the point here is that he has the necessary tools to succeed.

While I'll be the first to say that having the tools does not guarantee anything, not having the tools does guarantees you can't succeed - they act as a gatekeeper, so to speak.

Yes, I know some guys 'play fast' and certainly instincts and such matter, but there's a point at which you just can't compete.

And of course I know there are always those individuals who defy all explanation - Theoren Fleury, the 5'5" 155lb NHL center, Spud Webb, who won the NBA slam dunk contest at 5'6". But the Justin Beaver's of the world are a lot more common.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I acknowledge that point, however the last time he played LB was soph year at Iowa...in a conference and team not known for their speedy LBs. .

when I was a sophomore is high school, i wrestled in the 138 pound class. I floated like a butterfly, stung like a bee.

People change, people change.

[rbaloha1]

Kampy is older, bigger and stiffer. Playing olb is going to be tough at this stage of his career.

[Patler]

Some of you seem to think Kampman will have to cover like a safety, or like a 4-3 LBer. He won't be asked to do that. Basically, on occasion he will be asked to cover a limited area and pick up a TE who is probably no faster that he is. He will not be expected to run the field with the better TEs of the league. His best coverage tool might be the contact he can make in the first five yards. Does anyone think that Kampman won't be able to throw off their timing with a good solid hit on the TE early in a play?

[mission]

The only coverage he'll have to do is situations where he plays the 5-7 yard hook to curl zone or flats... something with another backer coming and him dropping back. He's not gonna line up head on with a guy and have to turn his hips and run lol

[Joemailman]

Kampy is older, bigger and stiffer. Playing olb is going to be tough at this stage of his career.

Actually, he's about 10-15 pounds lighter than he was when he was younger. Only his wife knows if he's stiffer.

[Pugger]

I don't think Kampy is going anywhere. I think they'll leave him right where he is.

[rbaloha1]

I don't think Kampy is going anywhere. I think they'll leave him right where he is.

Lets hope.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I don't think Kampy is going anywhere. I think they'll leave him right where he is.

Lets hope.

You can hope. I don't. To play 3-4 DE, he'll likely have to put on 35 pounds. To play 3-4 OLB, he's at the correct weight. Like others have said, his coverage responsibilities will be limited. I'm not that worried about Kampman as a 3-4 OLB. A 3-4 OLB is basically a roving pass rusher that is asked to play zone coverage on a limited basis, especially the OLB who is your best guy at rushing the passer.

[rbaloha1]

I don't think Kampy is going anywhere. I think they'll leave him right where he is.

Lets hope.

You can hope. I don't. To play 3-4 DE, he'll likely have to put on 35 pounds. To play 3-4 OLB, he's at the correct weight. Like others have said, his coverage responsibilities will be limited. I'm not that worried about Kampman as a 3-4 OLB. A 3-4 OLB is basically a roving pass rusher that is asked to play zone coverage on a limited basis, especially the OLB who is your best guy at rushing the passer.

Hope meaning Kampy stays at de and bulks up. Kampy is on record saying he likes playing one position.

Pure speculation on coverage responsibilities. Each time Kampy is in coverage is less opportunities for a premier pass rusher sacking a qb.

[DonHutson]

Kampy is an impact 4-3 end that needs to rush the qb every passing down. Requiring Kampy to drop into coverage is not a great idea.

Other than the occaisonal change up, rushing the passer is exactly what he will be doing on almost every play.

Except now he will have be able to move around more and pick his spots, and correct me if I'm wrong but I suspect he will have less responsibility v. the run on most plays. He should be able to pick a spot, tee off, and go.

I'm not saying Kampman will be as good as DeMarcus Ware, but Ware doesn't get 20 sacks every year by chasing TE's around all day. That's just not the role Kampman will be asked to fill.

He was a pass rusher before. He's a pass rusher now.

[rbaloha1]

Kampy is an impact 4-3 end that needs to rush the qb every passing down. Requiring Kampy to drop into coverage is not a great idea.

Other than the occaisonal change up, rushing the passer is exactly what he will be doing on almost every play.

Except now he will have be able to move around more and pick his spots, and correct me if I'm wrong but I suspect he will have less responsibility v. the run on most plays. He should be able to pick a spot, tee off, and go.

I'm not saying Kampman will be as good as DeMarcus Ware, but Ware doesn't get 20 sacks every year by chasing TE's around all day. That's just not the role Kampman will be asked to fill.

He was a pass rusher before. He's a pass rusher now.

If this is indeed Kampy's role of glorified de end playing olb then Kampy succeeds.

[DonHutson]

If this is indeed Kampy's role of glorified de end playing olb then Kampy succeeds.

It's all assumption until we see the D in action.

But I think many of the people that are worried about Kampman as a LB are thinking of guys like Hawk and Chillar, when you should probably be remembering guys like Bryce Paup, Tony Bennett, and Tim Harris.

[Gunakor]

I don't think Kampy is going anywhere. I think they'll leave him right where he is.

Lets hope.

You can hope. I don't. To play 3-4 DE, he'll likely have to put on 35 pounds. To play 3-4 OLB, he's at the correct weight. Like others have said, his coverage responsibilities will be limited. I'm not that worried about Kampman as a 3-4 OLB. A 3-4 OLB is basically a roving pass rusher that is asked to play zone coverage on a limited basis, especially the OLB who is your best guy at rushing the passer.

Hope meaning Kampy stays at de and bulks up. Kampy is on record saying he likes playing one position.

Pure speculation on coverage responsibilities. Each time Kampy is in coverage is less opportunities for a premier pass rusher sacking a qb.

3-4 DE's don't rack up sack totals. They are there to plug gaps and stop the interior run. The sacks primarily go to the OLB's in a 3-4. His strength as a pass rusher would be better utilized as a OLB in a 3-4 than as a DE. Each time Kampy lines up as a 3-4 DE is less opportunities for a premier pass rusher sacking a QB as well, at least if he's doing the job a 3-4 DE is supposed to be doing anyway.

[DonHutson]

3-4 DE's don't rack up sack totals. They are there to plug gaps and stop the interior run. The sacks primarily go to the OLB's in a 3-4. His strength as a pass rusher would be better utilized as a OLB in a 3-4 than as a DE. Each time Kampy lines up as a 3-4 DE is less opportunities for a premier pass rusher sacking a QB as well, at least if he's doing the job a 3-4 DE is supposed to be doing anyway.

Exactly. But they might move him up to a 3-4 end on rare occasions just to cause confusion. I'm sure he'll step up and put his hand on the ground as more of a 4-3 style end on many occasions. He'll probably drop back into coverage from both formations once in awhile, just to mix it up even more.

That's what McCarthy is talking about when he says the 3-4 can provide more looks and more options. That's the advantage to this D. However, whenever Kampman (or anyone else) excercises one of these options, everybody else needs to pick that up and adjust appropriately. If not executed properly, that will be the major disadvantage of this scheme.

Kampman doesn't worry me. Whether the rest of the D can react accordingly and pick up all the subtleties, does worry me some. We ran a fairly uncomplicated scheme before and there was still confusion. I'm going to hope that was a failing of the coaches, which prompted this change. But if that was a chronic failure of the players, that may not bode well.

[DonHutson]

I floated like a butterfly, stung like a bee.

People change, people change.

Now it just stings when he pees. Changes, indeed.

:wink:

[MadScientist]

Anyone know how often there is a zone blitz on vs rushing the ROLB in a typical game from Caper's past? If not, how about the Steelers this year?

[SnakeLH2006]

I think Tim Harris was pretty good for a similar type player in the very early 90's. Kampy was prob. only 265 last year anyway, and has good football quickness and exceptional instincts. He's obviously too small to be a 290 lb. DE that the 3-4 calls for, so all bets are off as he'll most likely be a pass rushing LB that stuffs the TE on occasion. Good luck though Kampy.