Barbre preparing to compete at new spot: RT

[RashanGary]

Barbre Preparing To Compete At New Spot: RT


by Mike Spofford, Packers.com
posted 05/21/2009

Last year at this time, one of the storylines along the Packers' offensive line was the pending competition between Allen Barbre and Daryn Colledge for the starting left guard spot.

(more) http://www.packers.com/news/stories/2009/05/21/1/

[RashanGary]

I know McCarthy was raving about Giacomini last year. He said, "Ask Aaron Kampman if he's improved". Giacomini has had offseason surgery though. At the very least, he's not going to be able to make the physical gains that are so instrumental to young lineman taking that next step. Probably he'll be better from a technique and consistency standpoint, but that injury might have set him back a year.

Barbre has been working hard in the offseason program for three years now. He's had no injury set backs. He's had three 2 full years in the same offense and is going on his third. It is a new position he's working at, but with the full offseason to prepare for the change and already knowing the terminology, he should have a legit shot to take the bull by the horns. 3rd year guys groomed have to be better than rookies, don't they?


Best case sinerio

Clifton has one more solid year protecting the blind side, giving the Packers enough time to groom a ready to play replacement

Colledge takes yet another step into the "no worry" club

Spitz locks down the center job, bringing a little more strength to the interior

Sitton becomes our 2nd best run blocking lineman after the new RT

Barbre becomes our most dominate run blocking lineman and he's teamed up with Sitton, making the right side the dominate running side

[HarveyWallbangers]

Best case sinerio

Clifton has one more solid year protecting the blind side, giving the Packers enough time to groom a ready to play replacement

Colledge takes yet another step into the "no worry" club

Spitz locks down the center job, bringing a little more strength to the interior

Sitton becomes our 2nd best run blocking lineman after the new RT

Barbre becomes our most dominate run blocking lineman and he's teamed up with Sitton, making the right side the dominate running side

I agree. That's the best case scenario. Then again, who knows with Breno. If he takes a huge step and starts at RT, who's to say he won't be solid. I'd be pretty happy if the OL shook out like that though. I'm intrigued by T.J. Lang. He might be able to compete as a rookie. Meredith seems more like a developmental prospect.

[RashanGary]

To me, it's key to lock Colledge and Spitz up right now. We don't want to start all over with rookies and first year players next year.

It would be nice to go into next season with Colledge, Spitz, Sitton and whoever wins at RT locked down and ready to roll. It will help the transition at LT that much more. I don't ever want a situation like Sherman created 5 years ago.

[CaptainD]

I know McCarthy was raving about Giacomini last year. He said, "Ask Aaron Kampman if he's improved". Giacomini has had offseason surgery though. At the very least, he's not going to be able to make the physical gains that are so instrumental to young lineman taking that next step. Probably he'll be better from a technique and consistency standpoint, but that injury might have set him back a year.

Barbre has been working hard in the offseason program for three years now. He's had no injury set backs. He's had three 2 full years in the same offense and is going on his third. It is a new position he's working at, but with the full offseason to prepare for the change and already knowing the terminology, he should have a legit shot to take the bull by the horns. 3rd year guys groomed have to be better than rookies, don't they?


Best case sinerio

Clifton has one more solid year protecting the blind side, giving the Packers enough time to groom a ready to play replacement

Colledge takes yet another step into the "no worry" club

Spitz locks down the center job, bringing a little more strength to the interior

Sitton becomes our 2nd best run blocking lineman after the new RT

Barbre becomes our most dominate run blocking lineman and he's teamed up with Sitton, making the right side the dominate running side

One of the guys at another forum was telling us how Breno was getting owned by Jeremy Thompson last pre-season.. I think Barbe has a shot at being the RT. Nice Post !

[Farley Face]

Barbre Preparing To Compete At New Spot: RT


by Mike Spofford, Packers.com
posted 05/21/2009

Last year at this time, one of the storylines along the Packers' offensive line was the pending competition between Allen Barbre and Daryn Colledge for the starting left guard spot.

(more) http://www.packers.com/news/stories/2009/05/21/1/

That the Packers own website has ran this and the vid covering his workouts shows me they (the team) has high hopes for him. I believe the team has some control over the content of packers.com, so if they felt he was on the fringe they wouldn't be showcasing him like this.

How serious was Breno's surgery? I thought it was a fairly minor (not my surgery so easy to say minor) ankle surgery. It may be holding him out of some offseason lifting but is he expected to miss OTA work? Hopefully not, I'd like to see these two battle it out for the RT spot.

[RashanGary]

I get the same impression about Packers.com being on the same page with the Packers football people. If the coaches think a guy is having a good offseason, they'll find a way to get him some pub. I'd say it's pretty safe to say they think Barbre has a big time shot at being a big time player. Tramon Williams got some of that pub last year or the year before I think.


As far as Breno Giacomini, I got the same impression as you. It was a minor surgery that he should recover from in time for all work. Kampman has had some similar scopes where they just cleaned up his knee. He never missed a beat. Breno is a young guy though. He needs those first couple of off seasons to gain the strength. If he can't work out, I think we might not really see his full potential. Barbre on the other hand, he should be in prime physical condition and mentally ready to handle the starting gig on the outside where he can use his athleticism.

[RashanGary]

Barbre's best position might end up being RT. He's very athletic and is said to be one of the best Packer lineman in the one on one pass rushing/pass protection drills. In the pass game, OT's tend to have a lot of one on one battles on the outside. It seems to play to one of his strengths.

He also seems to be a bit of a slow learner (wonderlic extremely low). Tackle would be a spot where he would get less confusing stunts and blitzes. Also, if he ever does have a mental gaffe, at least Rodgers should see it coming as opposed to the left side where Rodgers would get blind sided.

He's a very strong guy, especially for his size. It would be nice to have a guy on the right side who could combine with Sitton to get a strong push.



Now we just have to hope he gets it. It seems like it could work out well, might be one of the big pleasant surprises of the season. It would be great to replace Tausch seamlessly. It would make replacing the LT not seem so burdensome.

[Farley Face]

I get the same impression about Packers.com being on the same page with the Packers football people. If the coaches think a guy is having a good offseason, they'll find a way to get him some pub. I'd say it's pretty safe to say they think Barbre has a big time shot at being a big time player. Tramon Williams got some of that pub last year or the year before I think.


As far as Breno Giacomini, I got the same impression as you. It was a minor surgery that he should recover from in time for all work. Kampman has had some similar scopes where they just cleaned up his knee. He never missed a beat. Breno is a young guy though. He needs those first couple of off seasons to gain the strength. If he can't work out, I think we might not really see his full potential. Barbre on the other hand, he should be in prime physical condition and mentally ready to handle the starting gig on the outside where he can use his athleticism.

My worry about Barbre has been the mental aspects. All reports I've read is he is not all that bright. Will the move to the right side (mostly a lefty with us to this point) and to tackle be more than he can handle? I think I've read the mental aspects are actually easier as a tackle than as a guard. Can anyone confirm?

[RashanGary]

ND, if he's around, knows a lot about the OL.

What say you, ND? Tackle less mentally demanding?

[Farley Face]

ND, if he's around, knows a lot about the OL.

What say you, ND? Tackle less mentally demanding?

Yeah, I was going to call on ND as well but I haven't seen him on here much lately. Hopefully he will chime in, he has much knowledge that I respect on this specific topic.

[Lurker64]

I don't know nearly as much about OL play as ND does, but it's my understanding that in the ZBS Left Guard is probably the most mentally demanding position, while Right Tackle is probably the least mentally demanding position as the assignments are anything but complicated. We basically either want a guy at RT who can maul (and Barbre has that potential) or a guy who can play mistake free football (which could be any of these guys, if they spend the whole offseason focusing on RT).

[Farley Face]

I don't know nearly as much about OL play as ND does, but it's my understanding that in the ZBS Left Guard is probably the most mentally demanding position, while Right Tackle is probably the least mentally demanding position as the assignments are anything but complicated. We basically either want a guy at RT who can maul (and Barbre has that potential) or a guy who can play mistake free football (which could be any of these guys, if they spend the whole offseason focusing on RT).

I rewatched the Tenn game from last year the other day and focused most of my attention on the O-line. If you remember, that is the game Cliffy went out really early, Colledge moved over to LT and Sitton played RG. Sitton was a mauling beast, I swear (editors note: I am no O line expert but I know what a Tenn D linemen looks like on his back). If Barbre and he team up and can road grate like that on a consistent basis we will be in great shape.

Has Barbre shown these same traits at the pro level, maybe in a preseason game I don't have DVR'd or during practices I haven't attended?? Or is it all speculation at this point?

He seems to fit the mold and he has been granted the time to develop.

[Packman_26]

Barbre reminds me of Mike Wahle. If I remember correctly, Wahle got moved around a lot early and finally caught on after a couple of years. I hope he can do the same.

[sharpe1027]

My confidence in Clifton has been shaken after last year. I hope I am wrong, but I have a feeling he won't be our starting tackle for the full year. Not sure where that leaves them as Colledge would be the best replacement there.

[falco]

It would be nice to see some combination of Spitz, Colledge and the young guys emerge as our starting five for the next several years.

[Guiness]

ND, if he's around, knows a lot about the OL.

What say you, ND? Tackle less mentally demanding?

My impression was always that LT and C required the quickest thinking.

Center because of the need to make line calls based on DL alignment. And I seem to remember seeing an article looking at Wonderlific scores, and LT was the second highest average after QB.

[rbaloha1]

The o-line is in good shape. Young and talented quality depth.

Barbre should be ready. Thru competition a solid rt shall emerge.

[bobblehead]

The thing that throws me about this, and I'm also no expert, but College is long and fluid like a tackle is supposed to be, and Babre is tight and nasty like a guard is supposed to be. There are two kinds of athletes, fast and powerful vs. fluid and intuitive. I consider Tackles to be the latter, and college fits that. I guess the staff is so high on colleges athletic ability that they really want to keep him at the position that requires everything.

But still, the length and fluidity college possesses screams OT to me. I still would have drafted Oher and groomed him for cliffy's replacement, moved College to RT and let the chips fall where they may otherwise. I really worry about LT in the future as I really think Cliffy is near the end of the line. I still have John Michaels nightmares and remember the search for an LT for so long.

For this year, I hope Cliffy is solid, college steps up again, spitz grabs hold of center, Sitton is a grader, and someone emerges as our new RT.

[Gunakor]

The thing that throws me about this, and I'm also no expert, but College is long and fluid like a tackle is supposed to be, and Babre is tight and nasty like a guard is supposed to be. There are two kinds of athletes, fast and powerful vs. fluid and intuitive. I consider Tackles to be the latter, and college fits that. I guess the staff is so high on colleges athletic ability that they really want to keep him at the position that requires everything.

But still, the length and fluidity college possesses screams OT to me. I still would have drafted Oher and groomed him for cliffy's replacement, moved College to RT and let the chips fall where they may otherwise. I really worry about LT in the future as I really think Cliffy is near the end of the line. I still have John Michaels nightmares and remember the search for an LT for so long.

For this year, I hope Cliffy is solid, college steps up again, spitz grabs hold of center, Sitton is a grader, and someone emerges as our new RT.

I guess my hope for this year is that Colledge can play RT and they can stick Lang in at LG. Lang is built similar to Sitton, and I feel both could be outstanding guards at this level. I know MM has stated he isn't considering moving Colledge to RT this year, but I think he should.

And I'm still hoping Wells can win the competition at center. I know he's small, and isn't as physically gifted as I'd want at center. But he's so fundamentally sound, and is top notch when it comes to making correct line calls. Don't get me wrong, I like Spitz and wouldn't be disappointed if he were the starting center either. I just think the OL as a unit would preform better with Wells.

[Waldo]

The thing that throws me about this, and I'm also no expert, but College is long and fluid like a tackle is supposed to be, and Babre is tight and nasty like a guard is supposed to be.

Colledge isn't very long, his reach is only 33", which is on the fringe of being adequate at LT. But he does have LT feet, being one of 3 guys (Clifton, Colledge, Meredith) on the team that do. Length isn't an absolute requirement for a LT, but it helps, whereas feet are a must. Clifton and Meredith both have longer arms than Colledge.

I doubt MM wants to move Sitton, I think he learned his lesson with Spitz and wants to keep him in the position he can be elite at, not simply adequate. Sitton could top out as slightly better than Tausher at RT, but he could be an elite RG. I think that it is the same way with Lang. Lang could be an adequate, or even better RT (his physical T tools are a hair better than Sitton's), but an elite G. Lang is mean as hell on the field and very wide for his size, much like Sitton.

If Lang comes to play I think that Colledge gets moved into the RT battle. Colledge could excel on the right side. He is by far our best lineman in space, whereas Sitton is our best in a phone booth, Clifton is still our best 1 on 1 pass blocker.

If any lineman on our team is going to own an elite end in pass pro, Clifton is that guy, but Meredith has it in him (I don't think Colledge would ever be elite at it, adequate however).

If any lineman is going to pancake a DT, Sitton is that guy, though Lang has it in him.

If any lineman is going to pancake a LB, Colledge is that guy, though Barbre has it in him.

It really depends on what skill set MM wants to emphasize at RT. If he wants a road grader than will plow open holes for the back, Breno is probably the best guy. If he wants a guy that will keep the rushers out, Meredith is probably the best fit. In between those opposite ends of the spectrum are Barbre, Colledge and Lang, with Lang being more road grader and Barbre being more pass protector, Colledge is kinda in the middle. Though if we want to do more outside running and screen type stuff, Colledge is the guy to play RT, I think he blends the skill sets the best of our group.

However for Colledge to move to RT, Lang would have to step up in a big way at LG.

[SnakeLH2006]

My confidence in Clifton has been shaken after last year. I hope I am wrong, but I have a feeling he won't be our starting tackle for the full year. Not sure where that leaves them as Colledge would be the best replacement there.

Snake agrees. I find it sad, but true that blue-chip LT's don't start for 12 years as draft guys like to say, but he's been dropping hard over the last 2 seasons. No longer a top-notch LT. Some clammor for Colledge, but again not a fan as an LT or even a starter.

Sounds like Barbre can be a player if he can do it mentally, but that is hopeful. Breno? C'mon, has that dude played a snap yet? For some to assume he's gonna compete to start at RT is futile. TJ Lang...some hope there as Tauch did it as a 7th rounder. Hopefully Lang is half the man/player.

Snake still sees plenty of weakness (our OL is poor) but hopefully MM quits throwing guys at 80 spots and just settles on an OL or this shit won't gell. Arod is agile enough and had a great first season, so I ain't worried about him, just that if that OL is shaky (turnover) again, that the running game will be poor again. We really need some stability there on OL.

[Fritz]

This is the year that, barring major injuries, we find out how well TT has drafted on the offensive line. No excuses for Colledge, Spitz, or Barbre, and even Sitton needs to live up to the hype and expectation.

This be the year.

[bobblehead]

This is the year that, barring major injuries, we find out how well TT has drafted on the offensive line. No excuses for Colledge, Spitz, or Barbre, and even Sitton needs to live up to the hype and expectation.

This be the year.

I still have some hope for Tony Moll even. I think he is underrated. He was actually maulling super mario in the run game before the make believe holding call.