Peter Schrager's top 99 NFL players for '09

[oregonpackfan]

Peter Schrager lists his top 99 NFL players for the upcoming season.

The only Packer to make the list was Charles Woodson at #58.

While I agree with the majority of his lists, there are a number I do not agree with him. He lists QB Tony Romo as #28!--a highly overrated ranking, IMO.

http://www.comcast.net/slideshow/sports-nfltop99/1/

[Scott Campbell]

Jennings, Kampman, Rodgers - all should be right on the bubble.

[packer4life]

its an absolute atrocity that ARod is not anywhere on this list...I'll take him on my team over devin hester in a heartbeat

[SnakeLH2006]

Jennings, Kampman, Rodgers - all should be right on the bubble.

Kampy has been a proven beast for years, but I can see how he slides out of the top 99 with a position change. But Jennings and ARod should be there not only for their strong 2008 seasons, but as young stars that most likely are just getting better. Wouldn't bet against either for having insane stat years as leaders for the 2009 Pack. Kinda a shit list from the link to omit those two.

[Partial]

It's the top stars of 2009. Not the top future stars who are playing in 2009 and could get better later on in their careers :P

[SnakeLH2006]

It's the top stars of 2009. Not the top future stars who are playing in 2009 and could get better later on in their careers :P

No shit. Read my post. Both are better in 2009 at their positions than Kampy will be at his in 2009. All 3 are good, but Snake's guess is that Kampy regresses slightly with a new position but still gets 8 sacks. Arod wins 10 games and throws for 35 TDs and Jennings gets 95 catches 16 Td's. Those guys with their upside move ahead of Kampy. What was your point?

[Guiness]

How Jennings doesn't make it is beyond me.

Some other names you have to shake your head at. How is Forte on the list? TJ Housh is a reach. And Cassel. Gimme a break. Jake Long and Matt Ryan? Good last year - but one of the 99 best players in the league? How many games did Kris Jenkins miss?

Then, of course, Cutler at 31...I think he just put down 99 names he remembered, or watched TSN and wrote down the first 99 football players they named, scratching Favre off the list 'cause he's retired.

[BF4MVP]

How Jennings doesn't make it is beyond me.

Some other names you have to shake your head at. How is Forte on the list? TJ Housh is a reach. And Cassel. Gimme a break. Jake Long and Matt Ryan? Good last year - but one of the 99 best players in the league? How many games did Kris Jenkins miss?

Then, of course, Cutler at 31...I think he just put down 99 names he remembered, or watched TSN and wrote down the first 99 football players they named, scratching Favre off the list 'cause he's retired.
Housh averaged 9.8 yards a catch last year. He's a very average, overrated receiver.

Cutler has been overrated his entire career.

hahahahahahaha that list is a fucking joke.

Rodgers? Jennings? Hello...Anyone who has watched those two play would know they belong on the list. Especially since Rodgers is better than Cutler....

[hoosier]

Reggie Bush is another one who has no business being on any top 99 list. If he hadn't been drafted 1st overall, I mean 2nd overall, he would never even show up on peoples radar screens.

I can see leaving Rodgers off, since he has only been a starting NFL QB for one year and his team's record was noticeably worse than the previous year. But leaving Kampmann off is dumb, and leaving Jennings off instead of Housh is probably just a reflection of Housh's 15 minutes of free agency fame last winter--his name was etched in Schrager's memory for at least six months.

Moral of the story: Pete Schrager gets his knowledge of the NFL from watching ESPN highlights and scanning power polls.

[Partial]

Reggie Bush is a dynamic playmaker. Offensive coaches salivate at the mere thought of having a premiere talent like him to use in a multitude of ways. He's definitely top 99 in my opinion.

[SnakeLH2006]

Reggie Bush is a dynamic playmaker. Offensive coaches salivate at the mere thought of having a premiere talent like him to use in a multitude of ways. He's definitely top 99 in my opinion.

Actually, Snake agrees. Bush has a nasty case of hype vs. expected results (I mean really, is he supposed to be a 2000 yard a year RB?). He was hyped (and after seeing him in college, I was VERY excited at seeing the next Barry Sanders with pass-catching ability to boot), but really, that hype is hard to live up to. Bush is what he is, a beast. Dude gets an unfair rap from his draft hype, but look at him fill up stats at RB, receiving (gonna give you almost 100 catches a year) and on ST. He puts some stats up and is very dangerous, so easily a top 99 player. An average RB, an excellent pass-catcher, and an insane PR/KR guy that can take it to the house on any play. He's a tough guy, a team guy, and a special talent you won't find on many, if any rosters. Devin Hester is the hype clown.

Anyone remember this game on MNF...Snake does...Wow:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=epKm8UAt2Rw

As far as Cutler...Ya..Dude needs to have a winning team in college or the pros first. Not excited bout that guy, and not to sad to see him on the Bears.

Housh?? That's a joke. Yeah, he catches lots of balls, so did 5 guys from the old Run-N-Shoot ATL offense from the early 90's, but hard to think of their names. Jennings WINS games, and makes outstanding plays/catches/TD's to give our O hope. I doubt any NFL GM would take Housh over Jennings right now.

[SnakeLH2006]

BTW, to make it clear with the other 2 guys. Cutler is prick/hasn't won shit. That's why he's not a top 99.

Housh is a good player, but dime a dozen. Guys like Jennings that win games..those are the types to keep. What has Cutler done to will his team some wins, or Housh? Just saying, but both those guys are just guys.

[hoosier]

Reggie Bush is a dynamic playmaker. Offensive coaches salivate at the mere thought of having a premiere talent like him to use in a multitude of ways. He's definitely top 99 in my opinion.

Bush's contributions on offense have diminished progressively from year 1 to year 3. His role in the running game has been mediocre at best (12 tds, 3.7 career yards per carry, only one run of more than 40 yards in his career), and his role in the Saints passing game has slipped from 2006 (88 receptions, 742 yards) to last year (52, 440). Granted, he has missed ten games in the last two years due to injury, but his inability to stay on the field hurts his team. He had a nice year last year returning punts, but if that's his primary contribution then putting him among the top players in the league is a stretch.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Bush is not a top 99 player. That would put him, on average, as the 3rd best player on each team. I can think of at least 3 or 4 Packers (Rodgers, Jennings, Kampman, Woodson) I would take over him, a handful of Bears (Forte, Cutler, Harris, Briggs, Urlacher, Tillman) and Vikings (Peterson, Hutchinson, Kevin Williams, Allen, Winfield) over him. Detroit might be the only team that he would be one of the three best players on. We haven't even gotten to the likes of New England (Brady, Moss, Mankins, Seymour, Wilfork) and Pittsburgh (Big Ben, Parker, Smith, Harrison, Farrior, Polamalu). I don't think he's even close to the top 99. Sure, he's good in his role, but he's just not big enough to carry a big load (see the injuries and ineffective running inside), and that's a huge downgrade.

[Cheesehead Craig]

One would think that a top 99 player would have at least 1 All-Pro selection or have won something in their career.

I can see why A-Rod is not on there given the W-L of last year. I don't agree with it, but understand it. Jennings not on there is a joke.

He's got the top 5 correct, IMO. You can argue their order all you like, but all of them are in the top 5 in some order.

There's a bunch of Ravens defenders on that list and deservedly so.

[pbmax]

Reggie Bush is a dynamic playmaker. Offensive coaches salivate at the mere thought of having a premiere talent like him to use in a multitude of ways. He's definitely top 99 in my opinion.

Actually, Snake agrees. Bush has a nasty case of hype vs. expected results (I mean really, is he supposed to be a 2000 yard a year RB?). He was hyped (and after seeing him in college, I was VERY excited at seeing the next Barry Sanders with pass-catching ability to boot), but really, that hype is hard to live up to. Bush is what he is, a beast. Dude gets an unfair rap from his draft hype, but look at him fill up stats at RB, receiving (gonna give you almost 100 catches a year) and on ST. He puts some stats up and is very dangerous, so easily a top 99 player. An average RB, an excellent pass-catcher, and an insane PR/KR guy that can take it to the house on any play. He's a tough guy, a team guy, and a special talent you won't find on many, if any rosters. Devin Hester is the hype clown.

Anyone remember this game on MNF...Snake does...Wow:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=epKm8UAt2Rw
Bush has 24 TDs in 3 seasons. 4 of those are punt returns. At 8 TDs per season, it looks like a nice number (active players only):

LaDainian Tomlinson (29)....17.63
Maurice Jones-Drew (23).....13.33
Shaun Alexander (31)........12.44
Randy Moss (31).............12.36
Clinton Portis (27).........10.86
Terrell Owens (35).........10.85
Marion Barber (25)..........10.50
Larry Johnson (29)..........10.17
Marvin Harrison (36).........9.85
Brian Westbrook (29).........9.43
Brandon Jacobs (26)..........9.25
Larry Fitzgerald (25)........9.20
Edgerrin James (30)..........9.10
Steven Jackson (25)..........8.80
Antonio Gates (28)...........8.50
But 3 years into his career, his top end isn't going to get higher. And given that he has lost games to injury in two of three seasons, this number will go down over his career. There are 10 running backs on this list and 5 receivers with better averages. Harrison and Alexander may not play this season. If he is on the list, it should be at the back end. Otherwise, its based on the hope he will be healthy.

[Pack-man]

The real arguments should be that both Rodgers and Jennings should be on the list. There are 13 QB's on the list and 14 WR. I would say that Rodgers is a top 12 QB. Can't believe that there are 14 WR's better than Jennings.

[hoosier]

The more I think about it the more the absence of Rodgers from this list is a head-scratcher. The guy has Matt Cassel in his top 70. Rodgers had a better year statistically and has more physical talent. The only explanation for ranking Cassel well above Rodgers is team record. If Cassel had a lot to do with the Patriot's 11-5 record, fine. I am doubtful.

[KYPack]

How Jennings doesn't make it is beyond me.

Some other names you have to shake your head at. How is Forte on the list? TJ Housh is a reach. And Cassel. Gimme a break. Jake Long and Matt Ryan? Good last year - but one of the 99 best players in the league? How many games did Kris Jenkins miss?

Then, of course, Cutler at 31...I think he just put down 99 names he remembered, or watched TSN and wrote down the first 99 football players they named, scratching Favre off the list 'cause he's retired.
Housh averaged 9.8 yards a catch last year. He's a very average, overrated receiver.

Cutler has been overrated his entire career.

hahahahahahaha that list is a fucking joke.

Rodgers? Jennings? Hello...Anyone who has watched those two play would know they belong on the list. Especially since Rodgers is better than Cutler....

Housh is not overrated. You guys are underrating him. Yes Greg Jennings belongs, ARod, too. I don't claim to know who gets bumped, but some of the guys that are mentioned are decent bump candidates.

Housh runs the tough routes, the slants, digs, and sluggo's. He's a great blocker and doesn't shy away from contact. When Carson is (was) his QB, his YPC was respectable. Ryan Fitzpatrick could only throw the ball about 9.8 yards. Housh has averaged 12 - 13 ypc with Palmer tossing to him.

One top 100 you NFC freaks can't toss him off is all-time leading receivers. His 507 catches put him 99th on that list. He's the 23rd ATLR of active players.

[hoosier]

How about this. I think most of us think we see mistakes on Schrager's list, but what is the worst mistake of all (omission, under-ranking or over-ranking)? I think one of the worst of all is the over-ranking of Eli Manning at #17. He probably shouldn't be on this list in the first place, and definitely should not be anywhere near the top 20, above players like Seymour and Kevin Williams.

[pbmax]

How about this. I think most of us think we see mistakes on Schrager's list, but what is the worst mistake of all (omission, under-ranking or over-ranking)? I think one of the worst of all is the over-ranking of Eli Manning at #17. He probably shouldn't be on this list in the first place, and definitely should not be anywhere near the top 20, above players like Seymour and Kevin Williams.
I don't know, PFT is speculating that Manning will get the biggest contract in the league when he re-signs with the Giants. If even close to true, the Giants might disagree.

[hoosier]

How about this. I think most of us think we see mistakes on Schrager's list, but what is the worst mistake of all (omission, under-ranking or over-ranking)? I think one of the worst of all is the over-ranking of Eli Manning at #17. He probably shouldn't be on this list in the first place, and definitely should not be anywhere near the top 20, above players like Seymour and Kevin Williams.
I don't know, PFT is speculating that Manning will get the biggest contract in the league when he re-signs with the Giants. If even close to true, the Giants might disagree.

If they do that I think they're making a mistake. Manning has become a good QB for the team they have right now, primarily because he has learned how not to make mistakes. But the Giants don't win because of stellar QB play, they win with their running game and their defense. To pay a QB like Eli huge bucks will presumably mean (unless there's no cap) that those $$ have to come from somewhere else--namely, they won't be able to invest as much in the offensive line and the defense, which is where their bread is buttered.

I can think of at least seven QBs playing in the NFL right now that I would rather have over Eli: his brother, Brady, Brees, Big Ben, Rivers, McNabb, Romo, and possibly Ryan and Rodgers (I'll let them do it for more than a season before calling them better). Aside from Peyton, Brady, Brees and Big Ben, I don't think any of these have definitely proven themselves worthy of building a championship team around (Rivers, Ryan and Rodgers are close).

[Partial]

Bush is not a top 99 player. That would put him, on average, as the 3rd best player on each team. I can think of at least 3 or 4 Packers (Rodgers, Jennings, Kampman, Woodson) I would take over him, a handful of Bears (Forte, Cutler, Harris, Briggs, Urlacher, Tillman) and Vikings (Peterson, Hutchinson, Kevin Williams, Allen, Winfield) over him. Detroit might be the only team that he would be one of the three best players on. We haven't even gotten to the likes of New England (Brady, Moss, Mankins, Seymour, Wilfork) and Pittsburgh (Big Ben, Parker, Smith, Harrison, Farrior, Polamalu). I don't think he's even close to the top 99. Sure, he's good in his role, but he's just not big enough to carry a big load (see the injuries and ineffective running inside), and that's a huge downgrade.

I love how you state everything as a definitive fact. Says who he's not a top 99 player? You? Who are you? This site, in their opinion, thinks he is, and they're more credible than you, so... Perhaps you should try saying something like this.

"I think ___ (is/is not) ____, because ____ does _____ imo.

I think your list of players is by and large BS. Downgrading for Bush for not being able to run up the middle is unfair. Don't run him up the middle, then. That's the same thing as saying that Kampman isn't a great player because he sucks in coverage. The obvious solution is to take him out of coverage.

Why ignore matchups and using a player in a specific way? Guys like Bush and Westbrook have success because they are used in a specific manner according to matchups that doesn't necessarily correspond to a traditional running back role.

[Scott Campbell]

They left off Vince Young.

[pbmax]

Guys like Bush and Westbrook have success because they are used in a specific manner according to matchups that doesn't necessarily correspond to a traditional running back role.
Westbrook has been the team's primary ball carrier for three seasons. Bush will be in a RBBC again, this year with Pierre Thomas. And Thomas will get the bulk of the carries.

The only thing in common is injuries and the occasional (for Westbrook) deployment at WR.

How this makes Bush among the top 99 players, though, will require another post.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

It's the top stars of 2009. Not the top future stars who are playing in 2009 and could get better later on in their careers :P

Really? How can the Packers have a top 5 receiving core and not one in the 99? Our blue chip weapons. Seems like you are arguing against yourself now.

I thought Jennings was a top receiver.

Steve Smith, Andre Johnson, Moss, SANTONIO HOLMES, Ochocinco, Hester, Calvin Johnson, Brandon Marshall, Roddy White, Terrell, Housh, Welker, Q, Wayne, and Fitz.

Ty will take out Hester. That is 15 wrs consider better than jennings. No packer TE, no packer RB.

All that talent around arod. :roll:

Amazing how non homers view things.

[pbmax]

At 99 players, almost 2 teams we are a lot light on the OL and a little light on the DL.

8 O Lineman and 16 D lineman (and that includes Suggs and Ware but not Harrison-why? went with first impression with hybrids)

[HarveyWallbangers]

I love how you state everything as a definitive fact. Says who he's not a top 99 player? You? Who are you? This site, in their opinion, thinks he is, and they're more credible than you, so... Perhaps you should try saying something like this.

Funny coming from a guy who will offer up his opinion on just about every football topic yet doesn't know how to throw a football. Hey, it's all our opinion. I didn't see you prefacing your comments on Vince Young, Aaron Rodgers, Julius Peppers, and many other topics with "just my opinion." Also, I'm not convinced Peter Schrager is any more knowledgeable than most of the fans on here who have a couple of football insider accounts. He's not a scout. He's a hack who perhaps has a journalism degree. If this came from somebody like Gosselin or McGinn, it would carry more weight. The guy even wrote this "And my apologies to the fine men at Football Outsiders, but I left the abacus at home for this one."

[th87]

Never heard of him.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

I love how you state everything as a definitive fact. Says who he's not a top 99 player? You? Who are you? This site, in their opinion, thinks he is, and they're more credible than you, so... Perhaps you should try saying something like this.

Funny coming from a guy who will offer up his opinion on just about every football topic yet doesn't know how to throw a football. Hey, it's all our opinion. I didn't see you prefacing your comments on Vince Young, Aaron Rodgers, Julius Peppers, and many other topics with "just my opinion." Also, I'm not convinced Peter Schrager is any more knowledgeable than most of the fans on here who have a couple of football insider accounts. He's not a scout. He's a hack who perhaps has a journalism degree. If this came from somebody like Gosselin or McGinn, it would carry more weight. The guy even wrote this "And my apologies to the fine men at Football Outsiders, but I left the abacus at home for this one."

I couldn't agree more. What we all should take is, assuming he is neutral or has a limited bias, a perspective on our talent.

[Partial]

I love how you state everything as a definitive fact. Says who he's not a top 99 player? You? Who are you? This site, in their opinion, thinks he is, and they're more credible than you, so... Perhaps you should try saying something like this.

Funny coming from a guy who will offer up his opinion on just about every football topic yet doesn't know how to throw a football. Hey, it's all our opinion. I didn't see you prefacing your comments on Vince Young, Aaron Rodgers, Julius Peppers, and many other topics with "just my opinion." Also, I'm not convinced Peter Schrager is any more knowledgeable than most of the fans on here who have a couple of football insider accounts. He's not a scout. He's a hack who perhaps has a journalism degree. If this came from somebody like Gosselin or McGinn, it would carry more weight. The guy even wrote this "And my apologies to the fine men at Football Outsiders, but I left the abacus at home for this one."

Harv, don't be a little bitch. The fact is I have a fucking good arm. Don't ignore the fact the fact that my buddy Ry and I were throwing ~40 yard bombs after the game... get real jag...

Let's make a youtube video of you and I throwing for everyone to see from the PR game this fall. Having everyone laugh at you as you're crushed by a fat man will be glorious. I'm 100% positive that I can out throw you.

Man up and put your money where your mouth is. This kind of bullshit is a prime example of why this forum is going to hell. Way to go, Harv.

[Zool]

I love how you state everything as a definitive fact. Says who he's not a top 99 player? You? Who are you? This site, in their opinion, thinks he is, and they're more credible than you, so... Perhaps you should try saying something like this.

Funny coming from a guy who will offer up his opinion on just about every football topic yet doesn't know how to throw a football. Hey, it's all our opinion. I didn't see you prefacing your comments on Vince Young, Aaron Rodgers, Julius Peppers, and many other topics with "just my opinion." Also, I'm not convinced Peter Schrager is any more knowledgeable than most of the fans on here who have a couple of football insider accounts. He's not a scout. He's a hack who perhaps has a journalism degree. If this came from somebody like Gosselin or McGinn, it would carry more weight. The guy even wrote this "And my apologies to the fine men at Football Outsiders, but I left the abacus at home for this one."

Harv, don't be a little bitch. The fact is I have a fucking good arm. Don't ignore the fact the fact that my buddy Ry and I were throwing ~40 yard bombs after the game... get real jag...

Let's make a youtube video of you and I throwing for everyone to see from the PR game this fall. Having everyone laugh at you as you're crushed by a fat man will be glorious. I'm 100% positive that I can out throw you.

Man up and put your money where your mouth is. This kind of bullshit is a prime example of why this forum is going to hell. Way to go, Harv.

Again I'm confused. Who has the bigger penis?

[Scott Campbell]

How much you wanna make a bet I can throw a football over them mountains?... Yeah... Coach woulda put me in fourth quarter, we would've been state champions. No doubt. No doubt in my mind.

http://www.beaubergeron.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/uncle-rico-picture.jpg

[Gunakor]

I love how you state everything as a definitive fact. Says who he's not a top 99 player? You? Who are you? This site, in their opinion, thinks he is, and they're more credible than you, so... Perhaps you should try saying something like this.

Funny coming from a guy who will offer up his opinion on just about every football topic yet doesn't know how to throw a football. Hey, it's all our opinion. I didn't see you prefacing your comments on Vince Young, Aaron Rodgers, Julius Peppers, and many other topics with "just my opinion." Also, I'm not convinced Peter Schrager is any more knowledgeable than most of the fans on here who have a couple of football insider accounts. He's not a scout. He's a hack who perhaps has a journalism degree. If this came from somebody like Gosselin or McGinn, it would carry more weight. The guy even wrote this "And my apologies to the fine men at Football Outsiders, but I left the abacus at home for this one."

Harv, don't be a little bitch. The fact is I have a fucking good arm. Don't ignore the fact the fact that my buddy Ry and I were throwing ~40 yard bombs after the game... get real jag...

Let's make a youtube video of you and I throwing for everyone to see from the PR game this fall. Having everyone laugh at you as you're crushed by a fat man will be glorious. I'm 100% positive that I can out throw you.

Man up and put your money where your mouth is. This kind of bullshit is a prime example of why this forum is going to hell. Way to go, Harv.

Talk about completely missing the point of a post...

[KYPack]

How much you wanna make a bet I can throw a football over them mountains?... Yeah... Coach woulda put me in fourth quarter, we would've been state champions. No doubt. No doubt in my mind.



Lemme guess. Darrin Charles got behind you and Partial threw him a TD strike.

[Partial]

I love how you state everything as a definitive fact. Says who he's not a top 99 player? You? Who are you? This site, in their opinion, thinks he is, and they're more credible than you, so... Perhaps you should try saying something like this.

Funny coming from a guy who will offer up his opinion on just about every football topic yet doesn't know how to throw a football. Hey, it's all our opinion. I didn't see you prefacing your comments on Vince Young, Aaron Rodgers, Julius Peppers, and many other topics with "just my opinion." Also, I'm not convinced Peter Schrager is any more knowledgeable than most of the fans on here who have a couple of football insider accounts. He's not a scout. He's a hack who perhaps has a journalism degree. If this came from somebody like Gosselin or McGinn, it would carry more weight. The guy even wrote this "And my apologies to the fine men at Football Outsiders, but I left the abacus at home for this one."

Harv, don't be a little bitch. The fact is I have a fucking good arm. Don't ignore the fact the fact that my buddy Ry and I were throwing ~40 yard bombs after the game... get real jag...

Let's make a youtube video of you and I throwing for everyone to see from the PR game this fall. Having everyone laugh at you as you're crushed by a fat man will be glorious. I'm 100% positive that I can out throw you.

Man up and put your money where your mouth is. This kind of bullshit is a prime example of why this forum is going to hell. Way to go, Harv.

Talk about completely missing the point of a post...

No, Harv is trying to show my lack of credibility and he has said that I can't throw a football multiple times. I want him to shut the fuck up, man up, and put his money where his mouth is. So many people here talk a big game without any ability whatsoever to back it up.

I've called him out and am up for the challenge. Let's see if he will be a big enough man to do the same.

[Scott Campbell]

:lol:

[Scott Campbell]

No, Harv is trying to show my lack of credibility and he has said that I can't throw a football multiple times.


Go get em P!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oybY3KBaQHM

[Zool]

Harv should drive all the way to Milwaukee to have a football throwing contest. Good idea.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

I love how you state everything as a definitive fact. Says who he's not a top 99 player? You? Who are you? This site, in their opinion, thinks he is, and they're more credible than you, so... Perhaps you should try saying something like this.

Funny coming from a guy who will offer up his opinion on just about every football topic yet doesn't know how to throw a football. Hey, it's all our opinion. I didn't see you prefacing your comments on Vince Young, Aaron Rodgers, Julius Peppers, and many other topics with "just my opinion." Also, I'm not convinced Peter Schrager is any more knowledgeable than most of the fans on here who have a couple of football insider accounts. He's not a scout. He's a hack who perhaps has a journalism degree. If this came from somebody like Gosselin or McGinn, it would carry more weight. The guy even wrote this "And my apologies to the fine men at Football Outsiders, but I left the abacus at home for this one."

Harv, don't be a little bitch. The fact is I have a fucking good arm. Don't ignore the fact the fact that my buddy Ry and I were throwing ~40 yard bombs after the game... get real jag...

Let's make a youtube video of you and I throwing for everyone to see from the PR game this fall. Having everyone laugh at you as you're crushed by a fat man will be glorious. I'm 100% positive that I can out throw you.

Man up and put your money where your mouth is. This kind of bullshit is a prime example of why this forum is going to hell. Way to go, Harv.

Talk about completely missing the point of a post...

Gunakor,

Unfortunately, you are missing the point. Partial didnt' miss the point, he willfully avoided it. :wink:

[MJZiggy]

I love how you state everything as a definitive fact. Says who he's not a top 99 player? You? Who are you? This site, in their opinion, thinks he is, and they're more credible than you, so... Perhaps you should try saying something like this.

Funny coming from a guy who will offer up his opinion on just about every football topic yet doesn't know how to throw a football. Hey, it's all our opinion. I didn't see you prefacing your comments on Vince Young, Aaron Rodgers, Julius Peppers, and many other topics with "just my opinion." Also, I'm not convinced Peter Schrager is any more knowledgeable than most of the fans on here who have a couple of football insider accounts. He's not a scout. He's a hack who perhaps has a journalism degree. If this came from somebody like Gosselin or McGinn, it would carry more weight. The guy even wrote this "And my apologies to the fine men at Football Outsiders, but I left the abacus at home for this one."

Harv, don't be a little bitch. The fact is I have a fucking good arm. Don't ignore the fact the fact that my buddy Ry and I were throwing ~40 yard bombs after the game... get real jag...

Let's make a youtube video of you and I throwing for everyone to see from the PR game this fall. Having everyone laugh at you as you're crushed by a fat man will be glorious. I'm 100% positive that I can out throw you.

Man up and put your money where your mouth is. This kind of bullshit is a prime example of why this forum is going to hell. Way to go, Harv.

You do realize that there were people around while you were doing that...keep in mind, part of throwing is hitting your target...

[ThunderDan]

Harv, don't be a little bitch. The fact is I have a fucking good arm. Don't ignore the fact the fact that my buddy Ry and I were throwing ~40 yard bombs after the game... get real jag...

Let's make a youtube video of you and I throwing for everyone to see from the PR game this fall. Having everyone laugh at you as you're crushed by a fat man will be glorious. I'm 100% positive that I can out throw you.

Man up and put your money where your mouth is. This kind of bullshit is a prime example of why this forum is going to hell. Way to go, Harv.

Can I put $1,000 down on myself against Partial???

[Partial]

Can I put $1,000 down on myself against Partial???

Absolutely. Show up in October and put your money where your mouth is. We'll video tape that slaughtering too.


You do realize that there were people around while you were doing that...keep in mind, part of throwing is hitting your target...

So you're saying I'm inaccurate now? Don't be a DFC. Where are the positive remarks? Thanks again Ziggy for furthering the gang type behavior and driving these forums down the toilet.

[falco]

what is a DFC?

[MJZiggy]

Can I put $1,000 down on myself against Partial???

Absolutely. Show up in October and put your money where your mouth is. We'll video tape that slaughtering too.


You do realize that there were people around while you were doing that...keep in mind, part of throwing is hitting your target...

So you're saying I'm inaccurate now? Don't be a DFC. Where are the positive remarks? Thanks again Ziggy for furthering the gang type behavior and driving these forums down the toilet.

DFC...Yes, please define it for the boys. It's such an appropriate response to what I said...for years people have been excusing your behavior because you're just a kid and we were all young and stupid once. You're not a kid anymore, yet you still attack others with VERY little or no provocation at all. Recall that the original comment came from someone who saw you throw, and who was summarily personally attacked. I was merely reminding you that it might be a good idea to temper your boastfulness as there are many who've seen your handiwork and as I recall, not everything in the vicinity of your throws remained unscathed (the item in question wasn't the random artifact you think it was--it meant something). Yet I was referred to as a DFC...Now about that definition?

[falco]

DFC...Yes, please define it for the boys. It's such an appropriate response to what I said...for years people have been excusing your behavior because you're just a kid and we were all young and stupid once. You're not a kid anymore, yet you still attack others with VERY little or no provocation at all. Recall that the original comment came from someone who saw you throw, and who was summarily personally attacked. I was merely reminding you that it might be a good idea to temper your boastfulness as there are many who've seen your handiwork and as I recall, not everything in the vicinity of your throws remained unscathed (the item in question wasn't the random artifact you think it was--it meant something). Yet I was referred to as a DFC...Now about that definition?

For the record, I know exactly what it is. And this is an example of what passes for acceptable around here now, while standard internet forum fare is considered bannable.

[Partial]

DFC...Yes, please define it for the boys. It's such an appropriate response to what I said...for years people have been excusing your behavior because you're just a kid and we were all young and stupid once. You're not a kid anymore, yet you still attack others with VERY little or no provocation at all. Recall that the original comment came from someone who saw you throw, and who was summarily personally attacked. I was merely reminding you that it might be a good idea to temper your boastfulness as there are many who've seen your handiwork and as I recall, not everything in the vicinity of your throws remained unscathed (the item in question wasn't the random artifact you think it was--it meant something). Yet I was referred to as a DFC...Now about that definition?

For the record, I know exactly what it is. And this is an example of what passes for acceptable around here now, while standard internet forum fare is considered bannable.

Oh bull, get off your high horse. I've never once heard anyone getting banned for anything of the sort. Zig has been probable the biggest provoker around here for the past month or two and quite frankly I'm tired of it. I've given up on this forum other than when somebody calls me out.... yet are unwilling to be a fucking man and walk the walk...

Zig, Harv has seen me throw, which is exactly the point. He's trying to create some lie about me. He knows better, and is just trying to start a flame war.

Perhaps you should take MJ's advice and start with the man in the mirror when criticizing others behavior. You've brought nothing to this forum but trying to drive a wedge for about a month or two now.

[Scott Campbell]

Don't be a DFC.


:shock:

:no:

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Don't be a DFC.

Fighting back with love
Fighting back with LOVE!
No price is high enough
To take my soul, to take my soul
To take my soul

It's funny how they shoot you down
when your hands are held up high

GOING OUT IN A BLAZE OF GLORY

[falco]

:roll:

[Tyrone Bigguns]

:roll:

Who you rolling your eyes at?

[falco]

:roll:

Who you rolling your eyes at?

I meant to roll them at Partial, but was too lazy to hit the quote button.

This whole conversation is beyond ridiculous.

[falco]

Perhaps you should take MJ's advice and start with the man in the mirror when criticizing others behavior. You've brought nothing to this forum but trying to drive a wedge for about a month or two now.

Partial, I'd be interested to know what you are referring to here. I'm not afraid to speak my mind here, but I certainly don't intentionally create problems.

[ThunderDan]

Can I put $1,000 down on myself against Partial???

Absolutely. Show up in October and put your money where your mouth is. We'll video tape that slaughtering too.


You do realize that there were people around while you were doing that...keep in mind, part of throwing is hitting your target...

So you're saying I'm inaccurate now? Don't be a DFC. Where are the positive remarks? Thanks again Ziggy for furthering the gang type behavior and driving these forums down the toilet.

I'll come up in October and watch the game at Stadium View with friends. You better have a grand cash on you when I show up.

[Partial]

Partial, I'd be interested to know what you are referring to here. I'm not afraid to speak my mind here, but I certainly don't intentionally create problems.

I was referencing Ziggy, and MJ was a reference to Michael Jackson, not herself. I can see where thats confusing.

[MJZiggy]

I didn't criticize, P. I asked you to recall carefully as others were there to witness your claim. What was that definition of DFC again? I'm not sure everyone understood it.

Could you please show me this grand wedge I've driven, but first the definition so we're all on the same page here. Thanks.

[Partial]

I didn't criticize, P. I asked you to recall carefully as others were there to witness your claim. What was that definition of DFC again? I'm not sure everyone understood it.

Could you please show me this grand wedge I've driven, but first the definition so we're all on the same page here. Thanks.

So what have you contributed? I don't see any unique football opinions coming out of you.

[MJZiggy]

Then you're not reading. The definition? Why so hesitant to give it? Take pride in your ideas! This one was a great contribution to the forum and everyone should know exactly what it was!

[HarveyWallbangers]

Zig, Harv has seen me throw, which is exactly the point. He's trying to create some lie about me. He knows better, and is just trying to start a flame war.

My bad. Partial actually has a cannon for an arm.

[Partial]

Then you're not reading. The definition? Why so hesitant to give it? Take pride in your ideas! This one was a great contribution to the forum and everyone should know exactly what it was!

dumb fucking cunt. What do I care? Your actions are a direct reflection of this lately.

[MJZiggy]

Then you're not reading. The definition? Why so hesitant to give it? Take pride in your ideas! This one was a great contribution to the forum and everyone should know exactly what it was!

dumb fucking cunt. What do I care? Your actions are a direct reflection of this lately.

Proof? I'd like to see this giant wedge. Let's do this: You find all the arguments that I've supposedly started, and I'll find all the ones you've started and let's compare wedges, shall we? We can look at interesting things like how many people each of us fights with and how long said flame wars last. How 'bout that?

[HarveyWallbangers]

Then you're not reading. The definition? Why so hesitant to give it? Take pride in your ideas! This one was a great contribution to the forum and everyone should know exactly what it was!

dumb fucking cunt. What do I care? Your actions are a direct reflection of this lately.

Not cool. You may not want to come to the PR game after this meltdown.

[woodbuck27]

Then you're not reading. The definition? Why so hesitant to give it? Take pride in your ideas! This one was a great contribution to the forum and everyone should know exactly what it was!

dumb fucking cunt. What do I care? Your actions are a direct reflection of this lately.

Not cool. You may not want to come to the PR game after this meltdown.

Is this post 'any cooler' HarveyWallbangers ? An implied threat? Can't be. Maybe you just mean that Partial will have to drink on the other side of the bar/ soda stand from you and those acceptable to you?

I suggest that you all chill and give Partial an opportunity to at least offer some apology to MJ. There's alot of emotions running too hot @ Packerrats of late.

Isn't it time to return to being football fans first?

[HarveyWallbangers]

Is this post 'any cooler' HarveyWallbangers ? An implied threat? Can't be. Maybe you just mean that Partial will have to drink on the other side of the bar/ soda stand from you and those acceptable to you?

I suggest that you all chill and give Partial an opportunity to at least offer some apology to MJ. There's alot of emotions running too hot @ Packerrats of late.

Isn't it time to return to being football fans first?

Come on, Woody! I just know that you, of all people, aren't the type that thinks it's cool to slur a gal like that. I don't care how emotional you get. That just ain't right. I'm not threatening anybody, but I know that if Partial were to say anything like that at a Rats gatherting, I wouldn't be the only one who would have a big problem with it.

[woodbuck27]

Is this post 'any cooler' HarveyWallbangers ? An implied threat? Can't be. Maybe you just mean that Partial will have to drink on the other side of the bar/ soda stand from you and those acceptable to you?

I suggest that you all chill and give Partial an opportunity to at least offer some apology to MJ. There's alot of emotions running too hot @ Packerrats of late.

Isn't it time to return to being football fans first?

Come on, Woody! I just know that you, of all people, aren't the type that thinks it's cool to slur a gal like that. I don't care how emotional you get. That just ain't right. I'm not threatening anybody, but I know that if Partial were to say anything like that at a Rats gatherting, I wouldn't be the only one who would have a big problem with it.

NO Harvey. I take it further. It's not a male Vs female thing.

It's not cool to slur anyone that's a member of Packerrats. I totally disagree with language unbecoming of any sort. Yet we all read it from posters here more and more as a matter of course.

There are certainly a few times I've contained myself to not extend the ungentlemanly act of cussing a poster out and there is one poster here I'd really enjoy a run at but I remain within limits or composed. I've had my battles Harvey and dealt with lots of insult. Felt prejudice. It comes with the territory I just assume.

Bottom line on this issue in this thread. I'll bet that Partial will make an apology soon.

I'll also say this. Of any women I've observed post MJ can certainly hand it back with a style that's effective. Partial should simply apologize. He will. :D

[Scott Campbell]

Then you're not reading. The definition? Why so hesitant to give it? Take pride in your ideas! This one was a great contribution to the forum and everyone should know exactly what it was!

dumb fucking cunt. What do I care? Your actions are a direct reflection of this lately.

Not cool.


+1

[Bossman641]

Then you're not reading. The definition? Why so hesitant to give it? Take pride in your ideas! This one was a great contribution to the forum and everyone should know exactly what it was!

dumb fucking cunt. What do I care? Your actions are a direct reflection of this lately.

Way out of line Partial.

[Partial]

Ummm... Why is it out of line? How is it any different at all from any of the hateful things people have said to me :roll:

Zig hasn't contributed anything, not one damn thing, to this forum in months. All she does is stir the pot.

[Scott Campbell]

Ummm... Why is it out of line?




Against my better judgment, I'll agree with Woody. Damn P, just apologize to her already.

[SkinBasket]

Then you're not reading. The definition? Why so hesitant to give it? Take pride in your ideas! This one was a great contribution to the forum and everyone should know exactly what it was!

dumb fucking cunt. What do I care? Your actions are a direct reflection of this lately.

Not cool. You may not want to come to the PR game after this meltdown.

That wouldn't be "manning up" would it? Remember, Partial doesn't say anything here he wouldn't be willing to say in person. I would love to post the video of what happens after he's man enough to say this to her face.

On a related note, did anyone watch True Blood two weeks ago when that guy pressed his silver cross against the blond vampire's face?

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Ummm... Why is it out of line? How is it any different at all from any of the hateful things people have said to me :roll:

Zig hasn't contributed anything, not one damn thing, to this forum in months. All she does is stir the pot.

So, if we find one thing she has contributed, then you will man up and admit what an ass you are?

[Partial]

While I agree that I'm an ass, I don't see how what I did is any different than half of you guys calling me retarded, dumb, etc over the past month.

Ziggy can handle it. She likes to sling around insults, etc, so she had better be prepared to handle it.

[HarveyWallbangers]

While I agree that I'm an ass, I don't see how what I did is any different than half of you guys calling me retarded, dumb, etc over the past month.

Ziggy can handle it. She likes to sling around insults, etc, so she had better be prepared to handle it.

I guess young men no longer realize what an insult it is to a woman to be called what you called ziggy. Sad really. I hope it's just you and not the entire generation.

[Partial]

While I agree that I'm an ass, I don't see how what I did is any different than half of you guys calling me retarded, dumb, etc over the past month.

Ziggy can handle it. She likes to sling around insults, etc, so she had better be prepared to handle it.

I guess young men no longer realize what an insult it is to a woman to be called what you called ziggy. Sad really. I hope it's just you and not the entire generation.

And it's any less offensive to be called retarded? Get real Harv. Both are extremely degrading. It's all a matter of perspective.

[Scott Campbell]

It's not a matter of perspective. This isn't about you being called retarded.

You got your feelings hurt over your rocket like arm.

[SkinBasket]

Looks like we moved on to Stage 2: Playing Victim to Excuse Behavior earlier than previous episodes. Maybe Zig can take that as some kind of apology, or least some kind of regret.

[Patler]

While I agree that I'm an ass, I don't see how what I did is any different than half of you guys calling me retarded, dumb, etc over the past month.

Ziggy can handle it. She likes to sling around insults, etc, so she had better be prepared to handle it.

I guess young men no longer realize what an insult it is to a woman to be called what you called ziggy. Sad really. I hope it's just you and not the entire generation.

And it's any less offensive to be called retarded? Get real Harv. Both are extremely degrading. It's all a matter of perspective.

Partial;

An adult apologizes for his/her transgressions whether or not he/she feels wronged in other situations. A child attempts to excuse his/her actions based on what others did to them.

Your wrongful or hurtful acts are never excused by how you may feel others have treated you, especially in the distant relationship of something like this, where you have a chance to reflect on what you write, and even a chance to "take it back" through use of the edit button.

[Deputy Nutz]

I am willing to bet that at the Packerrat game, my arm will be deemed the greatest of all Packerrat Rocket Arms. In fact, if the admin had balls, he would create a very grand trophy for the Packerrat with the greatest of Rocket arms.

Partial, as I once heard in a very famous movie with several oscar nominations and winning several Golden Globes, "Stay Classy San Diego." you of course being San Diego.

[Patler]

Ummm... Why is it out of line? How is it any different at all from any of the hateful things people have said to me :roll:

Zig hasn't contributed anything, not one damn thing, to this forum in months. All she does is stir the pot.

OK Partial, I will call your bluff. And its not that Ziggy can't defend herself, because she certainly can. But I like a board based in reality, not fantasy and absurd accusations. Here are samples of Ziggy's postings just the last couple weeks (let alone "months"). Read these and explain your accusation:


I'm still trying to understand Stock's reasoning on that one. If TT hadn't found Kapinos, during the season, we'd have been completely screwed.


Blackmon will stick around if for no other reason than his ST abilities. Always have to remember that third aspect. That said, I think he may stick around at corner as well.







Michael Vick killed dogs and there was a huge outcry. Rae Carruth took 2 human lives and it was barely a blip on the radar of the world.

I remember a lot of coverage about Carruth. But with Carruth it seemed pretty clear what his fate would be from the day he skipped out on bail. He would be going to prison for a long time. With Vick there was an initial concern that he would get only a slap on the wrist. Once Carruth was sentenced to a minimum of 20 years people felt a certain amount of justice, although I am sure it will resurface when a parole hearing is held. NFL fans knew he would never be back, Vick of course might be.

On a side note, wasn't there only one death? Didn't they save the baby, but with significant health problems? I think only the mother died, but I could be wrong.

If you are an NFL fan you knew all about the Carruth case. Otherwise it would be a mystery to about 95% of the rest of the population. There were no Rae Carruth chew toys etc.....The Vick case was much more wide spread. The point I'm trying to make is how people seem to value the lives of dogs more than people when it comes to their outrage. People are dying daily from gang violence but I don't see nearly as many people outraged by that as were by Vick killing dogs. I have friends who couldnt care less about sports who knew tons of details about the case. When I asked them what they thought should be done about the Detroit and DC murder rates, they pretty much said nothing.

I think that's because it's easier to have a point to focus your rage upon--say Vick rather than a generalized notion of whoever it might be that's killing folks. The other thing to consider is that "hang 'em" is an easy answer whereas figuring out what to do about DC and Detriot murder rates would take some analysis into the causes and possible solutions, intellect, and psychological skill.


THE QB ISN'T EVERYTHING!!!!!!!!!

Good Lord, it's a team sport. Dilfer went to a SuperBowl remember...


Is it a trend of star QBs, or are the QBs stars for having won Super Bowls? Put a stellar QB on a team with a crappy WR corps and see how much success he has and then have him hit free agency and move to a team with a better set of WRs or a better line or killer RBs and see how much more success he has. Suddenly he's "broken out" and is a "star QB." Don't kid yourself.



And by the way, I'm thinking it will truly depend on what they want the #3 receiver to do. I see Jones as being a more finesse receiver and Nelson able to absorb and blow off a hit. The #3 decision will ultimately depend on how they decide to use #3 in this offense. I think the bigger question is whether this is the year Jennings fully supplants Driver in the #1 spot.

[Administrator]

I'm going to lock this thread.

Partial, it is clear that you owe Ziggy an apology. I will re-open this thread for that apology if you contact me by PM.

I could not agree with the sentiment and the posts expressed by Patler anymore than I do. He nailed it. There is nothing else that needs to be said here.

Please see the other Romper Room thread for my complete thoughts on this entire thread.