Why the negativity?

[CaliforniaCheez]

Some Packer fans have really taken to insulting Brett Favre.

Why? Why would any fan do this?

He's a retired player who spent all but his first and last season with the Packers.

He played more games as a Packer than any other Packer player and set a lot of records doing so. That ought to be worthy of some respect.

Some people perhaps have flown off the handle at the claim that the vikings want to sign him.

The vikings haven't signed him and what makes you think they will?

Have you no confidence in the vikings ability to screw things up?

Where is your common sense and good manners?

There is no reason to be insulting Brett Favre.

[Administrator]

The polarization is simple.

Fans have loyalty. Most of us understand that there is little loyalty on the part of our employers, but don't think about that the players are employed by the team, and don't have the same level of loyalty. They shouldn't have the same expectation either. They play a role and when they stop filling that role, they need to leave.

I have no problem with Favre still wanting to play, I'm disappointed in the fact he wants to play for the Vikings, and I'm really disappointed his motivations for playing are to get back at Ted Thompson.

But, Minnesota is not a football retirement destination, and the reports that he's looking for a house in Edina support his playing. The reports of reservations at the Midway Motor Lodge suggest he's playing.

We as Packer fans can just accept it, and move forward. I hope Favre doesn't further tarnish his legacy in Green Bay, but I suspect he will. Last season I rooted for him with the Jets, and wanted to see him successful. I can't and won't root for his success with the Vikings, because that impacts the success of the Packers.

[Fritz]

Some Packer fans have really taken to insulting Brett Favre.

Why? Why would any fan do this?

He's a retired player who spent all but his first and last season with the Packers.

He played more games as a Packer than any other Packer player and set a lot of records doing so. That ought to be worthy of some respect.

Some people perhaps have flown off the handle at the claim that the vikings want to sign him.

The vikings haven't signed him and what makes you think they will?

Have you no confidence in the vikings ability to screw things up?

Where is your common sense and good manners?

There is no reason to be insulting Brett Favre.

What makes me think the Vikings have signed him? Because given Favre's history, there's an iceberg. When he says "maybe" he'll sign to play this season, and he's had a casual conversation or two with the team, it most likely means they've already worked out the parameters of a contract and Favre is just waiting to make sure his arm is what he wants it to be. That's all that's holding any of it up. I think Favre has even intimated as much.

As for my confidence in the Vikings screwing things up, I am entirely confident they'll screw up - they're gonna sign Brett Favre.

Am I insulting Favre? I don't think so. I think he was a great player, though in truth he never became quite the player I'd hoped - I kept thinking he'd mature as he got older in terms on not making so many bad decisions, but he still makes a whole lot of ill-advised throws, some of which pay off, but, in the last year, more of which don't.

There have been no accounts of his working out intensely in the offseason, as he did before his last really good year in 2007. He has participated in no offseason camps, and though he knows the west coast offense you can't tell me it's exactly what the last west coast offense he ran for McCarthy was. So he's coming in with some learning to do having missed all the offseason stuff, he's not in top shape, and he doesn't have any experience with this group of receivers. My guess is he'll have some amazing plays, as he does, and he might get off to a good start based on sheer emotion and adrenaline. But he's not in top shape and I think he will fade in the second half of the season - as he has done, and this is statistically proven - in the last few years.

He was an entertaining, emotional, talented quarterback. From the QB's I've seen in my life, the second-best Packer QB ever, and a sure fire hall of famer. But many fans, because they're fans, feel betrayed by his seeming desire to get revenge on Ted Thompson (who of course runs the Green Bay Packers). It's an opinion thing. Favre has admitted that last year he came back partly for the wrong reasons. This year he says he just wants to play for a winner; I think he's still got revenge on his mind as well.

That's why, in part at least, people have gotten angry and have resorted to insults.

[falco]

The polarization is simple.

Fans have loyalty. Most of us understand that there is little loyalty on the part of our employers, but don't realize that the players are employed by the team. They serve a role and when they stop filling that role, they need to leave.

I have no problem with Favre still wanting to play, I'm disappointed in the fact he wants to play for the Vikings, and I'm really disappointed his motivations for playing are to get back at Ted Thompson.

But, Minnesota is not a football retirement destination, and the reports that he's looking for a house in Edina support his playing. The reports of reservations at the Midway Motor Lodge suggest he's playing.

We as Packer fans can just accept it, and move forward. I hope Favre doesn't further tarnish his legacy in Green Bay, but I suspect he will. Last season I rooted for him with the Jets, and wanted to see him successful. I can't and won't root for his success with the Vikings, because that impacts the success of the Packers.


This summarizes my feelings exactly. This is a complex and multi-layered issue, but admin has boiled it down perfectly here.

[prsnfoto]

It can't be helped it is much like politics the dumbest people in this world are far right and their buddies on the far left it is the sane people in the middle that make sense most of the time. I am a fulltime bartender at two sports bars and it cracks me up everyday when one guy wants Favre to break his "fucking" legs and he shouldn't be in the Packer Hall of Fame blah blah, then the next guy wants him to stick it to TT but he really is a "Packer Fan" and he likes the Pack first but he hopes Favre gets another SB blah blah. Me I have soul searched on this one and was mad at Brett at first then realized my emotions were drained when TT came to town. I just don't give a fuck either way I won't root for him or against him or as some on the right would say let God decide and some on the left would say let Karma decide my question is will they be OK with the outcome? Me I don't give a shit either way.

[falco]

The bottom line is Favre playing for the Vikings is a win for football fans everywhere... this whole thing couldn't have been scripted to make a more entertaining plot. The whole subplots Favre vs Rodgers, Favre vs TT, Childress vs McCarthy, etc are golden.

The only way this gets better is if the two teams somehow face each other in the playoffs.

Can anyone think of a more hyped showdown?

[PlantPage55]

The bottom line is Favre playing for the Vikings is a win for football fans everywhere... this whole thing couldn't have been scripted to make a more entertaining plot. The whole subplots Favre vs Rodgers, Favre vs TT, Childress vs McCarthy, etc are golden.

The only way this gets better is if the two teams somehow face each other in the playoffs.

Can anyone think of a more hyped showdown?

No, I certainly can't, but I'll tell you something straight out. I don't care. I don't care one little bit about potential "storylines" in the NFL. This isn't wrestling and I hate that the media sometimes wants to make it out to be that.

Give me tough, smash mouth football on the field and leave all of the storylines and off-the-field drama out of it. I could care less.

I want us to win a championship, whether it was a really wacky story-filled ride or not. That stuff bores me.

[falco]

The bottom line is Favre playing for the Vikings is a win for football fans everywhere... this whole thing couldn't have been scripted to make a more entertaining plot. The whole subplots Favre vs Rodgers, Favre vs TT, Childress vs McCarthy, etc are golden.

The only way this gets better is if the two teams somehow face each other in the playoffs.

Can anyone think of a more hyped showdown?

No, I certainly can't, but I'll tell you something straight out. I don't care. I don't care one little bit about potential "storylines" in the NFL. This isn't wrestling and I hate that the media sometimes wants to make it out to be that.

Give me tough, smash mouth football on the field and leave all of the storylines and off-the-field drama out of it. I could care less.

I want us to win a championship, whether it was a really wacky story-filled ride or not. That stuff bores me.

It's all entertainment, no matter how you look at it.

[rbaloha1]

Favre is my all time favorite football player. The negativity may be attributed to Favre's continual flip-flopping, whining and quest to get back at TT.

My hope is Favre returns to the Vikings and the Packers destroy the Vikes twice. Favre finally bows out hopefully gracefully and eventually returns as the prodigal son of Green Bay.

[woodbuck27]

Favre is my all time favorite football player. The negativity may be attributed to Favre's continual flip-flopping, whining and quest to get back at TT.

My hope is Favre returns to the Vikings and the Packers destroy the Vikes twice. Favre finally bows out hopefully gracefully and eventually returns as the prodigal son of Green Bay.

Hahaa. If your going to dream. Dream big. :D

I'm just going to enjoy history writing itself in this continuous saga. It's like a classic western shootout and certainly filled with drama. Packers Vs Vikings. I expect the best team will win and this isn't at all about Favre Vs anyone.

Brett Favre only wants to win another Super Bowl. That's the real story.

GO PACKERS!

[Lurker64]

Favre is my all time favorite football player. The negativity may be attributed to Favre's continual flip-flopping, whining and quest to get back at TT.

My hope is Favre returns to the Vikings and the Packers destroy the Vikes twice. Favre finally bows out hopefully gracefully and eventually returns as the prodigal son of Green Bay.

Hahaa. If your going to dream. Dream big. :D

I hope the Packers defeat the Vikings three times this year, the third time in the NFC Championship (where the Packers go on to crush the Patriots in the Superbowl) and none of the three games are particularly close, I hope that I win the jackpot in a multi-state lottery so I can afford superbowl tickets, and that I am bitten by a radioactive insect which gives me superpowers (awesome ones) and not cancer, and that this year I get to eat the most delicious sandwich ever wrought by the hands of man.

[bobblehead]

cali-

If you don't think or understand reasons to be hatin on favre these days you either a) have your head in the sand or b) are overstating your position.

I don't care which it is, and I understand the people who still idolize him, I just happen to be sick of his me first, I don't want to practice, MM and TT are being mean to me by holding me accountable attitude. If my 15 year old were acting like that I would sit him down and a explain to him what being an adult is all about. Since its a spoiled rich athlete the best I can do is bag on him in an open forum.

[bobblehead]

It can't be helped it is much like politics the dumbest people in this world are far right and their buddies on the far left it is the sane people in the middle that make sense most of the time. I am a fulltime bartender at two sports bars and it cracks me up everyday when one guy wants Favre to break his "fucking" legs and he shouldn't be in the Packer Hall of Fame blah blah, then the next guy wants him to stick it to TT but he really is a "Packer Fan" and he likes the Pack first but he hopes Favre gets another SB blah blah. Me I have soul searched on this one and was mad at Brett at first then realized my emotions were drained when TT came to town. I just don't give a fuck either way I won't root for him or against him or as some on the right would say let God decide and some on the left would say let Karma decide my question is will they be OK with the outcome? Me I don't give a shit either way.
PRS....please keep your opinions on the stupidity of the far left or the far right in the FYI room where I will feel more inclined to educate you on the damage the wishy washy just wanna get along please don't point out how I can't formulate an argument so I reside in the middle types have done.

[Fritz]

Favre is my all time favorite football player. The negativity may be attributed to Favre's continual flip-flopping, whining and quest to get back at TT.

My hope is Favre returns to the Vikings and the Packers destroy the Vikes twice. Favre finally bows out hopefully gracefully and eventually returns as the prodigal son of Green Bay.

I think it's too late for Favre to be able to have bowed out gracefully, no matter how he retires next time.

[CaptainD]

Remember Admin he asked !
1. I am a Green Bay Packer fan ..the team not a Brett Favre fan. He did not play defense or special teams let's not overvalue him.
2. I heard Favre talk about being a Green Bay Packer for life and that he never wanted to play for anyone else numerous times. Liar BS artist?
3. Along the same lines a tearful retirement press conference that was pure BS
4. After leaving he made it known through numerous sources he wants to stick it to the packers....if this doesn't bother you then it might be time to rethink who your team really is.
The list goes on and on,...when he was a packer he was a great player. He is no longer a member of the team and appears to want to play for arguably are biggest rival. He is fair game ....PERIOD

[The Shadow]

Some Packer fans have really taken to insulting Brett Favre.

Why? Why would any fan do this?

He's a retired player who spent all but his first and last season with the Packers.

He played more games as a Packer than any other Packer player and set a lot of records doing so. That ought to be worthy of some respect.

Some people perhaps have flown off the handle at the claim that the vikings want to sign him.

The vikings haven't signed him and what makes you think they will?

Have you no confidence in the vikings ability to screw things up?

Where is your common sense and good manners?

There is no reason to be insulting Brett Favre.

What makes me think the Vikings have signed him? Because given Favre's history, there's an iceberg. When he says "maybe" he'll sign to play this season, and he's had a casual conversation or two with the team, it most likely means they've already worked out the parameters of a contract and Favre is just waiting to make sure his arm is what he wants it to be. That's all that's holding any of it up. I think Favre has even intimated as much.

As for my confidence in the Vikings screwing things up, I am entirely confident they'll screw up - they're gonna sign Brett Favre.

Am I insulting Favre? I don't think so. I think he was a great player, though in truth he never became quite the player I'd hoped - I kept thinking he'd mature as he got older in terms on not making so many bad decisions, but he still makes a whole lot of ill-advised throws, some of which pay off, but, in the last year, more of which don't.
There have been no accounts of his working out intensely in the offseason, as he did before his last really good year in 2007. He has participated in no offseason camps, and though he knows the west coast offense you can't tell me it's exactly what the last west coast offense he ran for McCarthy was. So he's coming in with some learning to do having missed all the offseason stuff, he's not in top shape, and he doesn't have any experience with this group of receivers. My guess is he'll have some amazing plays, as he does, and he might get off to a good start based on sheer emotion and adrenaline. But he's not in top shape and I think he will fade in the second half of the season - as he has done, and this is statistically proven - in the last few years.

He was an entertaining, emotional, talented quarterback. From the QB's I've seen in my life, the second-best Packer QB ever, and a sure fire hall of famer. But many fans, because they're fans, feel betrayed by his seeming desire to get revenge on Ted Thompson (who of course runs the Green Bay Packers). It's an opinion thing. Favre has admitted that last year he came back partly for the wrong reasons. This year he says he just wants to play for a winner; I think he's still got revenge on his mind as well.

That's why, in part at least, people have gotten angry and have resorted to insults.

Bingo.

[falco]

Remember Admin he asked !
1. I am a Green Bay Packer fan ..the team not a Brett Favre fan. He did not play defense or special teams let's not overvalue him.
2. I heard Favre talk about being a Green Bay Packer for life and that he never wanted to play for anyone else numerous times. Liar BS artist?
3. Along the same lines a tearful retirement press conference that was pure BS
4. After leaving he made it known through numerous sources he wants to stick it to the packers....if this doesn't bother you then it might be time to rethink who your team really is.
The list goes on and on,...when he was a packer he was a great player. He is no longer a member of the team and appears to want to play for arguably are biggest rival. He is fair game ....PERIOD

You know, I never really thought about it before, but do you think its possible that Favre had gotten so mad at Thompson (drafting Rodgers, not getting Moss, not interviewing Mooch, etc) that he engineered his release from the Packers just to go to the Vikings?

Think about it...he played the same game with the Jets this offseason that he did with the Packers last offseason...asking for his outright release, etc.

[Fred's Slacks]

cali-

If you don't think or understand reasons to be hatin on favre these days you either a) have your head in the sand or b) are overstating your position.

I don't care which it is, and I understand the people who still idolize him, I just happen to be sick of his me first, I don't want to practice, MM and TT are being mean to me by holding me accountable attitude. If my 15 year old were acting like that I would sit him down and a explain to him what being an adult is all about. Since its a spoiled rich athlete the best I can do is bag on him in an open forum.

Great Post IMO.

:bclap:

[cpk1994]

Remember Admin he asked !
1. I am a Green Bay Packer fan ..the team not a Brett Favre fan. He did not play defense or special teams let's not overvalue him.
2. I heard Favre talk about being a Green Bay Packer for life and that he never wanted to play for anyone else numerous times. Liar BS artist?
3. Along the same lines a tearful retirement press conference that was pure BS
4. After leaving he made it known through numerous sources he wants to stick it to the packers....if this doesn't bother you then it might be time to rethink who your team really is.
The list goes on and on,...when he was a packer he was a great player. He is no longer a member of the team and appears to want to play for arguably are biggest rival. He is fair game ....PERIODExcellent summation. I agree.

[LP]

Remember Admin he asked !
1. I am a Green Bay Packer fan ..the team not a Brett Favre fan. He did not play defense or special teams let's not overvalue him.
2. I heard Favre talk about being a Green Bay Packer for life and that he never wanted to play for anyone else numerous times. Liar BS artist?
3. Along the same lines a tearful retirement press conference that was pure BS
4. After leaving he made it known through numerous sources he wants to stick it to the packers....if this doesn't bother you then it might be time to rethink who your team really is.
The list goes on and on,...when he was a packer he was a great player. He is no longer a member of the team and appears to want to play for arguably are biggest rival. He is fair game ....PERIOD

You know, I never really thought about it before, but do you think its possible that Favre had gotten so mad at Thompson (drafting Rodgers, not getting Moss, not interviewing Mooch, etc) that he engineered his release from the Packers just to go to the Vikings?

Think about it...he played the same game with the Jets this offseason that he did with the Packers last offseason...asking for his outright release, etc.

I think it is not only possible, but probable. With 100% support and encouragement from Darrel Bevell. I don't think they planned on the detour through New York though, which was why the Favre camp was so angry Ted wouldn't give Brett an outright release last year.

[woodbuck27]

Favre is my all time favorite football player. The negativity may be attributed to Favre's continual flip-flopping, whining and quest to get back at TT.

My hope is Favre returns to the Vikings and the Packers destroy the Vikes twice. Favre finally bows out hopefully gracefully and eventually returns as the prodigal son of Green Bay.

Hahaa. If your going to dream. Dream big. :D

I hope the Packers defeat the Vikings three times this year, the third time in the NFC Championship (where the Packers go on to crush the Patriots in the Superbowl) and none of the three games are particularly close, I hope that I win the jackpot in a multi-state lottery so I can afford superbowl tickets, and that I am bitten by a radioactive insect which gives me superpowers (awesome ones) and not cancer, and that this year I get to eat the most delicious sandwich ever wrought by the hands of man.

May all your dreams come true and you already possess Super Powers Lurker64 .

Sandwich. Fried egg, lettuce and ripe tomatoe and mayo on toasted whole wheat. Yummey. :D

GO! Pack GO!

[Fritz]

cali-

If you don't think or understand reasons to be hatin on favre these days you either a) have your head in the sand or b) are overstating your position.

I don't care which it is, and I understand the people who still idolize him, I just happen to be sick of his me first, I don't want to practice, MM and TT are being mean to me by holding me accountable attitude. If my 15 year old were acting like that I would sit him down and a explain to him what being an adult is all about. Since its a spoiled rich athlete the best I can do is bag on him in an open forum.

Great Post IMO.

:bclap:

Hey, you could bag on your 15 year old in an open forum too! :lol:

[Packman_26]

I could say that his on again-off again retire, unretire, re-retire,and un-re-retire are the reasons for my overall negativeity for Brett Favre. I'm sure that plays some part of it.
But I think this is the biggest reason:

"As difficult as it was going out and playing against the Raiders under the circumstances, (his fathers death) the way my teammates, coaches, and fans reacted made me realize, more than ever, just how much Green Bay and the Packers mean to me.
Its why I couldn't imagine playing for another team.
No way.
I'm so fortunate to be going into my fourteenth year. Who would've ever thought it? I wouldn't waste my time playing somewhere else. It doesn't matter how much money I was offered, either. I'm loved here in Green Bay, and I love Green Bay, too. If I went to another team I'm sure I'd step out onto the field for the first time, in someone else's uniform, and say to myself, What the hell are you doing? Get your butt out of here! It will never happen. This is where my family is. This is where my heart is. This is where I belong."
-Brett Favre, Favre 9/04, p65

[Fritz]

Ah, but in Favre's mind, one thing changed - "I'm loved here in Green Bay."

It seems increasingly clear that Brett Favre wants you to want him. He needs to be told he is loved. When he did not get enough of that from the Packers any more, he felt snubbed. Thus all bets were off in terms of his feelings toward the Packers.

[Packman_26]

I wish I could find quotes that I used to read that said something to the effect: "If I was traded it would be a dumb move for the other team. I wouldn't report".
Others said "If the Packers don't want me, I'll retire."
I have searched for the videos or articles online but couldn't find them. Surely someone else remembers these types of quotes.

As to "I'm loved in Green Bay", it surely doesn't sound as if he had any conditions on his statement.
In my eyes, its just a bold face lie. Does he have the right to go back on his word? Absolutely. I'm just saying in my case, I believed him.
This is probably a bad example but I can explain my standpoint. Lets say someone broke into your car. If its a stanger your angry, but not nearly as angry as if it was you best friend. The reason is expect more out of those close to you. I guess I expected more out of Brett Favre.

[woodbuck27]

Remember Admin he asked !
1. I am a Green Bay Packer fan ..the team not a Brett Favre fan. He did not play defense or special teams let's not overvalue him.
2. I heard Favre talk about being a Green Bay Packer for life and that he never wanted to play for anyone else numerous times. Liar BS artist?
3. Along the same lines a tearful retirement press conference that was pure BS
4. After leaving he made it known through numerous sources he wants to stick it to the packers....if this doesn't bother you then it might be time to rethink who your team really is.
The list goes on and on,...when he was a packer he was a great player. He is no longer a member of the team and appears to want to play for arguably are biggest rival. He is fair game ....PERIOD

Well posted. Clear. Your no longer a Brett Favre supporter. :D

You'd classify him in the same category as ' things to flush down the toilet '.

GO PACKERS!

[prsnfoto]

It can't be helped it is much like politics the dumbest people in this world are far right and their buddies on the far left it is the sane people in the middle that make sense most of the time. I am a fulltime bartender at two sports bars and it cracks me up everyday when one guy wants Favre to break his "fucking" legs and he shouldn't be in the Packer Hall of Fame blah blah, then the next guy wants him to stick it to TT but he really is a "Packer Fan" and he likes the Pack first but he hopes Favre gets another SB blah blah. Me I have soul searched on this one and was mad at Brett at first then realized my emotions were drained when TT came to town. I just don't give a fuck either way I won't root for him or against him or as some on the right would say let God decide and some on the left would say let Karma decide my question is will they be OK with the outcome? Me I don't give a shit either way.
PRS....please keep your opinions on the stupidity of the far left or the far right in the FYI room where I will feel more inclined to educate you on the damage the wishy washy just wanna get along please don't point out how I can't formulate an argument so I reside in the middle types have done.



I was relating real life to football people like you who see things only in black or white are the real problem in america. I am not wishsy washy no one can be right all the time, I simply have the brain cells to make informed choices based on common sense not emotion. Favre has done many things wrong as has TT, in your world I guess kill 'em both. As far as formulating an argument that is what stupid people do to make themselves feel like they are right, anyone can "formulate" doesn't mean the math is right.

[prsnfoto]

I could say that his on again-off again retire, unretire, re-retire,and un-re-retire are the reasons for my overall negativeity for Brett Favre. I'm sure that plays some part of it.
But I think this is the biggest reason:

"As difficult as it was going out and playing against the Raiders under the circumstances, (his fathers death) the way my teammates, coaches, and fans reacted made me realize, more than ever, just how much Green Bay and the Packers mean to me.
Its why I couldn't imagine playing for another team.
No way.
I'm so fortunate to be going into my fourteenth year. Who would've ever thought it? I wouldn't waste my time playing somewhere else. It doesn't matter how much money I was offered, either. I'm loved here in Green Bay, and I love Green Bay, too. If I went to another team I'm sure I'd step out onto the field for the first time, in someone else's uniform, and say to myself, What the hell are you doing? Get your butt out of here! It will never happen. This is where my family is. This is where my heart is. This is where I belong."
-Brett Favre, Favre 9/04, p65


The retirement bullshit has no excuse he needed to put a stop to that and there is no excusing Brett Favre. But the quote may also explain why he is so hurt he feels TT kicked him to the curb, though Brett needs to see he helped himself get there.

[Packnut]

Like I've stated here before. Every one of you who keep ripping Favre should be locked up in a room and forced to watch countless hours of game tape with clowns like Hunter, Campbell, Tagee, and all the other bozo's who QB'ed in the 70's and 80's.

Also, you guys are very selfish. Anyone of you who lived through that horror show should stop and think what it was like to be totally embarrassed for those of us who DID NOT LIVE IN WISCONSIN. You guys have NO FREAKIN IDEA how bad it was. The Packers were the biggest joke in the NFL for 2 decades. And for those of you who are younger and escaped that hell, stop and imagine what it would be like to be laughed at and ridiculed cause your team sucked so bad for so long.

Then came along Brett Favre and the laughing and embarrassment stopped. Yes, he was'nt alone in the Packer resurgence. There was Wolf, Holmgren and Reggie ect., but Favre was the biggest reason. He gave Packer fans back their team pride.

So you guys throw all that away because what, he hurt your feelings? He did'nt stay retired? Man, it's freakin ludicrous! You guys are like a person who gets divorced. They end up so bitter cause the marrige ended, that they toss out all the good things and end up concentrating on the negative stuff. It's very sad.

Hey, everyone is entittled to their own opinion, I get that. I also get just cause I like someone does'nt mean the rest of the world has to feel what I feel. But you guys have to have some understanding, why, to a few of us, you look like nothing but clowns.

Especially as Packer fans, to rip ANYONE who has the nickname " Bear Killer" is downright STUPID!

[Patler]

Like I've stated here before. Every one of you who keep ripping Favre should be locked up in a room and forced to watch countless hours of game tape with clowns like Hunter, Campbell, Tagee, and all the other bozo's who QB'ed in the 70's and 80's.

Also, you guys are very selfish. Anyone of you who lived through that horror show should stop and think what it was like to be totally embarrassed for those of us who DID NOT LIVE IN WISCONSIN. You guys have NO FREAKIN IDEA how bad it was. The Packers were the biggest joke in the NFL for 2 decades. And for those of you who are younger and escaped that hell, stop and imagine what it would be like to be laughed at and ridiculed cause your team sucked so bad for so long.

Nothing like overstating reality in an attempt to make a point.

Scott Hunter played in only aboutt 35 games for the Packers, and had about 450 attempts.
Rich Campbell played in only a handful of games.
Jerry Tagge played in a few more than Campbell, and had about 300 attempts.

On the other hand, Lynn Dickey was the starter for 8 of those years (1976, 1977 and 1980-1985), payed over 100 games and had about 3,000 attempts. QB was not the problem when Dickey was there. He racked up points and yardage with ease.

Majkowski was there from 1988-1992, but was injured off and on in 1990 and 1991, before getting hurt again and giving way to Favre in 1992. He played in 36 of the games of the '80s, and about as many in the 1990s. Even earned some league honors. Again, QB was not the problem when Majkowski played.

When Dickey was out in 1978 and 1979, David Whitehurst played. While Whitehurst was not a great QB by any stretch of the imagination, the team had a lot bigger problems than the play of Whitehurst.

I would enjoy watching the tapes of Dickey. I would enjoy watching the tapes of Majkowski. Both were very good QBs. I wouldn't even mind watching Whitehurst again.

The lean years for QBs in Green Bay were really only before Dickey came in 1976 and for one year (1986) between Dickey and Majkowski.

All in all the Packers have had capable QBs for the most part since 1976. They struggled when Majkowski was hurt, but most teams do when their starter is out.

[sharpe1027]

Like I've stated here before. Every one of you who keep ripping Favre should be locked up in a room and forced to watch countless hours of game tape with clowns like Hunter, Campbell, Tagee, and all the other bozo's who QB'ed in the 70's and 80's.

Also, you guys are very selfish. Anyone of you who lived through that horror show should stop and think what it was like to be totally embarrassed for those of us who DID NOT LIVE IN WISCONSIN. You guys have NO FREAKIN IDEA how bad it was. The Packers were the biggest joke in the NFL for 2 decades. And for those of you who are younger and escaped that hell, stop and imagine what it would be like to be laughed at and ridiculed cause your team sucked so bad for so long.

Then came along Brett Favre and the laughing and embarrassment stopped. Yes, he was'nt alone in the Packer resurgence. There was Wolf, Holmgren and Reggie ect., but Favre was the biggest reason. He gave Packer fans back their team pride.

So you guys throw all that away because what, he hurt your feelings? He did'nt stay retired? Man, it's freakin ludicrous! You guys are like a person who gets divorced. They end up so bitter cause the marrige ended, that they toss out all the good things and end up concentrating on the negative stuff. It's very sad.

Hey, everyone is entittled to their own opinion, I get that. I also get just cause I like someone does'nt mean the rest of the world has to feel what I feel. But you guys have to have some understanding, why, to a few of us, you look like nothing but clowns.

Especially as Packer fans, to rip ANYONE who has the nickname " Bear Killer" is downright STUPID!

What you say about Favre is generally true. That doesn't mean that the reasons for being pissed at Favre are any less true.

Favre gained our respect because of the things he did for the Packers organization. He has begun to lose it because of the things he has done to the Packers team, mostly for personal reasons.

If your best friend has a long history of standing behind you and you behind him, he deserves your respect. That doesn't mean that if he has an affair with your wife that you are "STUPID!" to be mad at him.

[bobblehead]

It can't be helped it is much like politics the dumbest people in this world are far right and their buddies on the far left it is the sane people in the middle that make sense most of the time. I am a fulltime bartender at two sports bars and it cracks me up everyday when one guy wants Favre to break his "fucking" legs and he shouldn't be in the Packer Hall of Fame blah blah, then the next guy wants him to stick it to TT but he really is a "Packer Fan" and he likes the Pack first but he hopes Favre gets another SB blah blah. Me I have soul searched on this one and was mad at Brett at first then realized my emotions were drained when TT came to town. I just don't give a fuck either way I won't root for him or against him or as some on the right would say let God decide and some on the left would say let Karma decide my question is will they be OK with the outcome? Me I don't give a shit either way.
PRS....please keep your opinions on the stupidity of the far left or the far right in the FYI room where I will feel more inclined to educate you on the damage the wishy washy just wanna get along please don't point out how I can't formulate an argument so I reside in the middle types have done.



I was relating real life to football people like you who see things only in black or white are the real problem in america. I am not wishsy washy no one can be right all the time, I simply have the brain cells to make informed choices based on common sense not emotion. Favre has done many things wrong as has TT, in your world I guess kill 'em both. As far as formulating an argument that is what stupid people do to make themselves feel like they are right, anyone can "formulate" doesn't mean the math is right.

Right...but your post begged a response and this isn't the place for that discussion. I love to talk politics and would love to probe this topic furher, but this isn't the place to bring it up. I am trying to restrain bringing politics into the packer area, but damn...you are making it hard for me.

BF brought this entirely on himself. That is my opinion. You are entitled to tell me I'm wrong, no problem, but point out why. Trying to play the "i'm in the middle game' because its the easy way out and somehow, in your mind, makes you seem intelligent. Tell me what exactly you think TT did wrong instead of blanket statements like "done many things wrong as has TT".

to further quote you: formulating an argument is what stupid people do?? Really, I thought stupid people declared both sides to blame and then said if you argue with me or formulate a reason why I am wrong you are stupid even though I didn't provide any evidence at all.

Why is TT wrong in how he handled this? What has he done wrong....and don't say drafting harrell #16 cuz you know that isn't what I'm talking about.

[cheesner]

Like I've stated here before. Every one of you who keep ripping Favre should be locked up in a room and forced to watch countless hours of game tape with clowns like Hunter, Campbell, Tagee, and all the other bozo's who QB'ed in the 70's and 80's.

Also, you guys are very selfish. Anyone of you who lived through that horror show should stop and think what it was like to be totally embarrassed for those of us who DID NOT LIVE IN WISCONSIN. You guys have NO FREAKIN IDEA how bad it was. The Packers were the biggest joke in the NFL for 2 decades. And for those of you who are younger and escaped that hell, stop and imagine what it would be like to be laughed at and ridiculed cause your team sucked so bad for so long.

Then came along Brett Favre and the laughing and embarrassment stopped. Yes, he was'nt alone in the Packer resurgence. There was Wolf, Holmgren and Reggie ect., but Favre was the biggest reason. He gave Packer fans back their team pride.

So you guys throw all that away because what, he hurt your feelings? He did'nt stay retired? Man, it's freakin ludicrous! You guys are like a person who gets divorced. They end up so bitter cause the marrige ended, that they toss out all the good things and end up concentrating on the negative stuff. It's very sad.

Hey, everyone is entittled to their own opinion, I get that. I also get just cause I like someone does'nt mean the rest of the world has to feel what I feel. But you guys have to have some understanding, why, to a few of us, you look like nothing but clowns.

Especially as Packer fans, to rip ANYONE who has the nickname " Bear Killer" is downright STUPID!

What you say about Favre is generally true. That doesn't mean that the reasons for being pissed at Favre are any less true.

Favre gained our respect because of the things he did for the Packers organization. He has begun to lose it because of the things he has done to the Packers team, mostly for personal reasons.

If your best friend has a long history of standing behind you and you behind him, he deserves your respect. That doesn't mean that if he has an affair with your wife that you are "STUPID!" to be mad at him.
Good response.

It is the foolish person that elevates their image of someone to such an extreme - that they just ignore any contrary evidence.

[The Shadow]

Like I've stated here before. Every one of you who keep ripping Favre should be locked up in a room and forced to watch countless hours of game tape with clowns like Hunter, Campbell, Tagee, and all the other bozo's who QB'ed in the 70's and 80's.

Also, you guys are very selfish. Anyone of you who lived through that horror show should stop and think what it was like to be totally embarrassed for those of us who DID NOT LIVE IN WISCONSIN. You guys have NO FREAKIN IDEA how bad it was. The Packers were the biggest joke in the NFL for 2 decades. And for those of you who are younger and escaped that hell, stop and imagine what it would be like to be laughed at and ridiculed cause your team sucked so bad for so long.

Then came along Brett Favre and the laughing and embarrassment stopped. Yes, he was'nt alone in the Packer resurgence. There was Wolf, Holmgren and Reggie ect., but Favre was the biggest reason. He gave Packer fans back their team pride.

So you guys throw all that away because what, he hurt your feelings? He did'nt stay retired? Man, it's freakin ludicrous! You guys are like a person who gets divorced. They end up so bitter cause the marrige ended, that they toss out all the good things and end up concentrating on the negative stuff. It's very sad.

Hey, everyone is entittled to their own opinion, I get that. I also get just cause I like someone does'nt mean the rest of the world has to feel what I feel. But you guys have to have some understanding, why, to a few of us, you look like nothing but clowns.

Especially as Packer fans, to rip ANYONE who has the nickname " Bear Killer" is downright STUPID!

Um, that certainly isn't exactly true. Off the top of my head, I remember the St. Louis game when his receivers unexpectedly ran the wrong routes 6 times, the Philly game where an unexpected wind gust forced his perfect pass to drift into the arms of an enemy safety, the loss to the Giants where McCarthy's terrible call required him to throw a wounded duck to a CB, and Holmgren's horrible Super Bowl gameplan which forced him to lose to a less talented team.
And there are many more embarrassing moments to go along with the good ones.

[Fritz]

Like I've stated here before. Every one of you who keep ripping Favre should be locked up in a room and forced to watch countless hours of game tape with clowns like Hunter, Campbell, Tagee, and all the other bozo's who QB'ed in the 70's and 80's.

Also, you guys are very selfish. Anyone of you who lived through that horror show should stop and think what it was like to be totally embarrassed for those of us who DID NOT LIVE IN WISCONSIN. You guys have NO FREAKIN IDEA how bad it was. The Packers were the biggest joke in the NFL for 2 decades. And for those of you who are younger and escaped that hell, stop and imagine what it would be like to be laughed at and ridiculed cause your team sucked so bad for so long.

Nothing like overstating reality in an attempt to make a point.

Scott Hunter played in only aboutt 35 games for the Packers, and had about 450 attempts.
Rich Campbell played in only a handful of games.
Jerry Tagge played in a few more than Campbell, and had about 300 attempts.

On the other hand, Lynn Dickey was the starter for 8 of those years (1976, 1977 and 1980-1985), payed over 100 games and had about 3,000 attempts. QB was not the problem when Dickey was there. He racked up points and yardage with ease.

Majkowski was there from 1988-1992, but was injured off and on in 1990 and 1991, before getting hurt again and giving way to Favre in 1992. He played in 36 of the games of the '80s, and about as many in the 1990s. Even earned some league honors. Again, QB was not the problem when Majkowski played.

When Dickey was out in 1978 and 1979, David Whitehurst played. While Whitehurst was not a great QB by any stretch of the imagination, the team had a lot bigger problems than the play of Whitehurst.

I would enjoy watching the tapes of Dickey. I would enjoy watching the tapes of Majkowski. Both were very good QBs. I wouldn't even mind watching Whitehurst again.

The lean years for QBs in Green Bay were really only before Dickey came in 1976 and for one year (1986) between Dickey and Majkowski.

All in all the Packers have had capable QBs for the most part since 1976. They struggled when Majkowski was hurt, but most teams do when their starter is out.

For reasons not entirely clear to me, Lynn Dickey is one of my all-time favorite Packers. I looked up his numbers a few months ago, and while they're not stunning, he had some weapons around him (Lofton/Jefferson) and that offense could put up points. Unfortunately, the defense was about as stout as a ninety-year-old man's penis, pre-Viagra.

And Majkowski was adored in Green Bay until he was hurt - the "Magik Man," right?

Favre was a wonderful quarterback and a charistmatic person. He was fantastic to watch, though frustrating as well. But he would've been only thought of as a little better than Dickey or Majkowski in the team's annals if he hadn't had the talent around him - both sides of the ball - that he did for a stretch of time.

In football, if you are very talented but play on a bad team for most or all of your career, you get some recognition but ultimately you get lost in the wash. It's not like baseball, where an individual can stand out more.

[Packman_26]

Like I've stated here before. Every one of you who keep ripping Favre should be locked up in a room and forced to watch countless hours of game tape with clowns like Hunter, Campbell, Tagee, and all the other bozo's who QB'ed in the 70's and 80's.

Also, you guys are very selfish. Anyone of you who lived through that horror show should stop and think what it was like to be totally embarrassed for those of us who DID NOT LIVE IN WISCONSIN. You guys have NO FREAKIN IDEA how bad it was. The Packers were the biggest joke in the NFL for 2 decades. And for those of you who are younger and escaped that hell, stop and imagine what it would be like to be laughed at and ridiculed cause your team sucked so bad for so long.

Then came along Brett Favre and the laughing and embarrassment stopped. Yes, he was'nt alone in the Packer resurgence. There was Wolf, Holmgren and Reggie ect., but Favre was the biggest reason. He gave Packer fans back their team pride.

So you guys throw all that away because what, he hurt your feelings? He did'nt stay retired? Man, it's freakin ludicrous! You guys are like a person who gets divorced. They end up so bitter cause the marrige ended, that they toss out all the good things and end up concentrating on the negative stuff. It's very sad.

Hey, everyone is entittled to their own opinion, I get that. I also get just cause I like someone does'nt mean the rest of the world has to feel what I feel. But you guys have to have some understanding, why, to a few of us, you look like nothing but clowns.

Especially as Packer fans, to rip ANYONE who has the nickname " Bear Killer" is downright STUPID!
I think you might actually have a point, but you are overgeneralizing. Some people have begun to discount what Favre did as a Packer after all of this. You right in that you shouldn't let his actions now take away from what he accomplished.
But there is another type of "Favre Hater", the ones that feel like they've been tricked. Favre was the guy that some of us thought wasn't like all of the "me first" athletes. We held him to a higher standard. When we saw what he really is, it tarnished his mystique.

[ThunderDan]

Also, you guys are very selfish. Anyone of you who lived through that horror show should stop and think what it was like to be totally embarrassed for those of us who DID NOT LIVE IN WISCONSIN. You guys have NO FREAKIN IDEA how bad it was. The Packers were the biggest joke in the NFL for 2 decades. And for those of you who are younger and escaped that hell, stop and imagine what it would be like to be laughed at and ridiculed cause your team sucked so bad for so long.



I think you forgot about Tampa Bay and Seattle.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Also, you guys are very selfish. Anyone of you who lived through that horror show should stop and think what it was like to be totally embarrassed for those of us who DID NOT LIVE IN WISCONSIN. You guys have NO FREAKIN IDEA how bad it was. The Packers were the biggest joke in the NFL for 2 decades. And for those of you who are younger and escaped that hell, stop and imagine what it would be like to be laughed at and ridiculed cause your team sucked so bad for so long.



I think you forgot about Tampa Bay and Seattle.

Pikers, all three.

New Orleans was the biggest joke...even their fans were wearing bags over their heads. "ain'ts."

[mraynrand]

Like I've stated here before. Every one of you who keep ripping Favre should be locked up in a room and forced to watch countless hours of game tape with clowns like Hunter, Campbell, Tagee, and all the other bozo's who QB'ed in the 70's and 80's.

Also, you guys are very selfish. Anyone of you who lived through that horror show should stop and think what it was like to be totally embarrassed for those of us who DID NOT LIVE IN WISCONSIN. You guys have NO FREAKIN IDEA how bad it was. The Packers were the biggest joke in the NFL for 2 decades. And for those of you who are younger and escaped that hell, stop and imagine what it would be like to be laughed at and ridiculed cause your team sucked so bad for so long.

Nothing like overstating reality in an attempt to make a point.

Scott Hunter played in only aboutt 35 games for the Packers, and had about 450 attempts.
Rich Campbell played in only a handful of games.
Jerry Tagge played in a few more than Campbell, and had about 300 attempts.

On the other hand, Lynn Dickey was the starter for 8 of those years (1976, 1977 and 1980-1985), payed over 100 games and had about 3,000 attempts. QB was not the problem when Dickey was there. He racked up points and yardage with ease.

Majkowski was there from 1988-1992, but was injured off and on in 1990 and 1991, before getting hurt again and giving way to Favre in 1992. He played in 36 of the games of the '80s, and about as many in the 1990s. Even earned some league honors. Again, QB was not the problem when Majkowski played.

When Dickey was out in 1978 and 1979, David Whitehurst played. While Whitehurst was not a great QB by any stretch of the imagination, the team had a lot bigger problems than the play of Whitehurst.

I would enjoy watching the tapes of Dickey. I would enjoy watching the tapes of Majkowski. Both were very good QBs. I wouldn't even mind watching Whitehurst again.

The lean years for QBs in Green Bay were really only before Dickey came in 1976 and for one year (1986) between Dickey and Majkowski.

All in all the Packers have had capable QBs for the most part since 1976. They struggled when Majkowski was hurt, but most teams do when their starter is out.

1984 was a drop off for Dickey, but the offense and Dickey was OK. '85 he was hurt half the time and noodle arm 'bounce pass' Jim Zorn even started. '87 and '88 were pretty damn lean too. Majkowski was green in '87 and just OK in '88. That's half a decade of marginal or below average play at the QB position.

[Zool]

That's half a decade of marginal or below average play at the QB position.

The Vikings and Bears would like to compare notes.

[Patler]

1984 was a drop off for Dickey, but the offense and Dickey was OK. '85 he was hurt half the time and noodle arm 'bounce pass' Jim Zorn even started. '87 and '88 were pretty damn lean too. Majkowski was green in '87 and just OK in '88. That's half a decade of marginal or below average play at the QB position.

Sure, when Dickey was hurt and didn't play the backups struggled, but that's not surprising. The Packers QB position was in good hands whenever Dickey took the field.

Majkowski was green in '87 and OK in '88 not unlike Favre in '92 and '93. Overall the teams of '92 and '93 were better than '87 and '88, so it didn't matter quite as much. I don't mind having a young QB and watching him grow. Once Majkowski got the job away from Wright, the team was in fine hands QB-wise. I could never understand the prolonged period of jumping back and forth between Wright and Majkowski.

I don't consider any of the Dickey years or the Majkowski years to be marginal or below average QB wise, even when Majkowski was growing into the job. That is part of the sport. I never felt like they needed to find another QB, they just needed to keep Dickey alive, and commit to Majkowski and forget Wright. Truth be told, Favre wasn't the Favre he became right from the start either. None of them are.

[mraynrand]

I don't consider any of the Dickey years or the Majkowski years to be marginal or below average QB wise, even when Majkowski was growing into the job. That is part of the sport.

You make some good observation - OK. I will just say that I disagree about the overall quality at the QB position. The QB play overall in '85 and '88 was below average, and it was abysmal 86 and 87. I didn't get to see a number of games in '92 and '93 so I can't speak to whether 'learning Favre' was better than 'learning Majkowski.' And to me it doesn't mean much to the point of whether the QBing was good, bad or marginal 85-88.

[ThunderDan]

Also, you guys are very selfish. Anyone of you who lived through that horror show should stop and think what it was like to be totally embarrassed for those of us who DID NOT LIVE IN WISCONSIN. You guys have NO FREAKIN IDEA how bad it was. The Packers were the biggest joke in the NFL for 2 decades. And for those of you who are younger and escaped that hell, stop and imagine what it would be like to be laughed at and ridiculed cause your team sucked so bad for so long.



I think you forgot about Tampa Bay and Seattle.

Pikers, all three.

New Orleans was the biggest joke...even their fans were wearing bags over their heads. "ain'ts."

I think its a toss up. Tampa Bay lost 26 games in a row. Of course they were the more recent expansion team.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Also, you guys are very selfish. Anyone of you who lived through that horror show should stop and think what it was like to be totally embarrassed for those of us who DID NOT LIVE IN WISCONSIN. You guys have NO FREAKIN IDEA how bad it was. The Packers were the biggest joke in the NFL for 2 decades. And for those of you who are younger and escaped that hell, stop and imagine what it would be like to be laughed at and ridiculed cause your team sucked so bad for so long.



I think you forgot about Tampa Bay and Seattle.

Pikers, all three.

New Orleans was the biggest joke...even their fans were wearing bags over their heads. "ain'ts."

I think its a toss up. Tampa Bay lost 26 games in a row. Of course they were the more recent expansion team.

Never wore bags!!!

[Fritz]

I would be remiss if I did not mention those Detroit Lions.

Folks here are starting to look back upon the Wayne Fontes era rather fondly...one reallyt good year - '92, I think? - where they did well until they got absolutely thumped by the 'Skins. They had another playoff year where Lomas Brown guaranteed a win against Philly, and the Leos got beaten to a pulp. Fontes's overall record is, I think, right around .500, but he's the best head coach they've had since Joe Schmidt, or maybe Don McCaffrey, who died on the job.

The Lions sucked in the 70's and the 80's, were decent for a period in the 90's, and have now fallen off a cliff.

[retailguy]

The Lions sucked in the 70's and the 80's, were decent for a period in the 90's, and have now fallen off a cliff.

I don't see a problem with this. William Clay Ford for President! My favorite NFL owner. He and Rex Grossman, my favorite NFL player... :P

[ThunderDan]

Also, you guys are very selfish. Anyone of you who lived through that horror show should stop and think what it was like to be totally embarrassed for those of us who DID NOT LIVE IN WISCONSIN. You guys have NO FREAKIN IDEA how bad it was. The Packers were the biggest joke in the NFL for 2 decades. And for those of you who are younger and escaped that hell, stop and imagine what it would be like to be laughed at and ridiculed cause your team sucked so bad for so long.



I think you forgot about Tampa Bay and Seattle.

Pikers, all three.

New Orleans was the biggest joke...even their fans were wearing bags over their heads. "ain'ts."

I think its a toss up. Tampa Bay lost 26 games in a row. Of course they were the more recent expansion team.

Never wore bags!!!

Just looked up 70-89 records:
Saints 109-183-4 36.8% winning %
Bucs 62-149-1 29.2% winning % (76-89)
Seahags 103-109 48.6% winning % (76-89)

I really don't remember Seattle being as good as a 500 team but obviously I remembered wrong.

Just because your fans wear bags doesn't mean your franchise is the worst.

[woodbuck27]

Like I've stated here before. Every one of you who keep ripping Favre should be locked up in a room and forced to watch countless hours of game tape with clowns like Hunter, Campbell, Tagee, and all the other bozo's who QB'ed in the 70's and 80's.

Also, you guys are very selfish. Anyone of you who lived through that horror show should stop and think what it was like to be totally embarrassed for those of us who DID NOT LIVE IN WISCONSIN. You guys have NO FREAKIN IDEA how bad it was. The Packers were the biggest joke in the NFL for 2 decades. And for those of you who are younger and escaped that hell, stop and imagine what it would be like to be laughed at and ridiculed cause your team sucked so bad for so long.

Nothing like overstating reality in an attempt to make a point.

Scott Hunter played in only aboutt 35 games for the Packers, and had about 450 attempts.
Rich Campbell played in only a handful of games.
Jerry Tagge played in a few more than Campbell, and had about 300 attempts.

On the other hand, Lynn Dickey was the starter for 8 of those years (1976, 1977 and 1980-1985), payed over 100 games and had about 3,000 attempts. QB was not the problem when Dickey was there. He racked up points and yardage with ease.

Majkowski was there from 1988-1992, but was injured off and on in 1990 and 1991, before getting hurt again and giving way to Favre in 1992. He played in 36 of the games of the '80s, and about as many in the 1990s. Even earned some league honors. Again, QB was not the problem when Majkowski played.

When Dickey was out in 1978 and 1979, David Whitehurst played. While Whitehurst was not a great QB by any stretch of the imagination, the team had a lot bigger problems than the play of Whitehurst.

I would enjoy watching the tapes of Dickey. I would enjoy watching the tapes of Majkowski. Both were very good QBs. I wouldn't even mind watching Whitehurst again.

The lean years for QBs in Green Bay were really only before Dickey came in 1976 and for one year (1986) between Dickey and Majkowski.

All in all the Packers have had capable QBs for the most part since 1976. They struggled when Majkowski was hurt, but most teams do when their starter is out.

Patler:

Packnut makes his point very well and I don't insinuate your bound for any hell, but ask yourself the answer to this question please.

If you had a choice then of being in ' media room hell ' and a choice of viewing the Lynn Dickey tapes over the Brett Favre tapes forever and all time?

Which would you prefer to watch for the rest of all time? My choice would be really easy. FAVRE.The absolute most exciting QB I ever saw in a Green Bay Packer uniform.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Also, you guys are very selfish. Anyone of you who lived through that horror show should stop and think what it was like to be totally embarrassed for those of us who DID NOT LIVE IN WISCONSIN. You guys have NO FREAKIN IDEA how bad it was. The Packers were the biggest joke in the NFL for 2 decades. And for those of you who are younger and escaped that hell, stop and imagine what it would be like to be laughed at and ridiculed cause your team sucked so bad for so long.



I think you forgot about Tampa Bay and Seattle.

Pikers, all three.

New Orleans was the biggest joke...even their fans were wearing bags over their heads. "ain'ts."

I think its a toss up. Tampa Bay lost 26 games in a row. Of course they were the more recent expansion team.

Never wore bags!!!

Just looked up 70-89 records:
Saints 109-183-4 36.8% winning %
Bucs 62-149-1 29.2% winning % (76-89)
Seahags 103-109 48.6% winning % (76-89)

I really don't remember Seattle being as good as a 500 team but obviously I remembered wrong.

Just because your fans wear bags doesn't mean your franchise is the worst.

Do you realize how much worse you have to be to play almost a full third more games and only be 7% better? Also, you are excluding the first 3 years of the Saints.

That is the point..the saints were longer suffering. The Buc made the playoffs in their 3rd season.

The Saints went 10 years before they were 500. They went 20 years before they had a winning season.

P.S. The Bucs first win...on the road...you guessed...THE SAINTS. Two coaches were fired because they lost to the Bucs in their second year...Stram and Coryell.

[CaliforniaCheez]

Let me remind some of you of a few facts.

1) Brett Favre has not signed a contract with the vikings.

2) He has not had a positive throwing test of the arm since the surgery. In the post surgery throwing he said he was not satisfied.

3) Other than the day at the high school, his release from the Jets, and his appearance on Joe Buck's show, Brett has not talked to the media.

4) No home in Minnesota has been purchased by Brett.


Do you believe and agree with every poster here?

Do you believe and agree with every blogger?

Any weirdo can have a 2 bit blog and make up anything he wants about Brett Favre. "Reporters" searching the web report what 2 bit bloggers say in their blogs as if it is "news". Other reporters report the reporters observation of a blog and suddenly there is a bad rumor.

It is amazing how blind the public is to this! Does no one read the story to learn what the source is? How many of the Brett Favre stories are attributed to unnamed sources?



If you want to be angry at Brett Favre and call him names, why not wait until he actually signs with another team.

He was cut by the Jets and is a free agent. Free to sign with any team.

Just because the vikings are all screwed up and are desperate for a QB doesn't mean Brett is going there.

Nobody knows if his arm will function anywhere near the level it used to perform.



If Brett does play for another team why not wait until he signs before insulting him?

[packrulz]

Cheez, I think you're in the denial phase. I'm not sure how the drama will play out, some players and fans in Minnesota don't think they need Favre. The first time he loses a game on an interception they'll be calling him out. I try to remember Brett as the gunslinging wild stallion he was, and Holmgrens "dream team" coaching staff, his career after the Packers will be forgotten. As for Dickey, he had a great arm but bad knees, he couldn't scramble at all, Majik was a great scrambler, and he beat the Bears which made him a fan favorite.

[Spaulding]

Let me remind some of you of a few facts.

1) Brett Favre has not signed a contract with the vikings.

2) He has not had a positive throwing test of the arm since the surgery. In the post surgery throwing he said he was not satisfied.

3) Other than the day at the high school, his release from the Jets, and his appearance on Joe Buck's show, Brett has not talked to the media.

4) No home in Minnesota has been purchased by Brett.


Do you believe and agree with every poster here?

Do you believe and agree with every blogger?

Any weirdo can have a 2 bit blog and make up anything he wants about Brett Favre. "Reporters" searching the web report what 2 bit bloggers say in their blogs as if it is "news". Other reporters report the reporters observation of a blog and suddenly there is a bad rumor.

It is amazing how blind the public is to this! Does no one read the story to learn what the source is? How many of the Brett Favre stories are attributed to unnamed sources?



If you want to be angry at Brett Favre and call him names, why not wait until he actually signs with another team.

He was cut by the Jets and is a free agent. Free to sign with any team.

Just because the vikings are all screwed up and are desperate for a QB doesn't mean Brett is going there.

Nobody knows if his arm will function anywhere near the level it used to perform.



If Brett does play for another team why not wait until he signs before insulting him?


I bolded the part where you referenced he was cut. Negative on that, he requested his release (then again maybe rumors) and then stated he was retiring. If he wouldn't have done that he'd still be a Jet and the starter for 2009.

Granted they are only rumors until proven true but so far the wind is blowing stink this way in the name of Brett in purple.

[Pugger]

It rubs fans the wrong way that BF wants to play for a hated divisional rival even if he hasn't signed yet. I seriously doubt these fans would be this ornery if BF was talking to any other team outside our division. I don't care that the old man wants to continue playing. If he wants to play I have no problem with that. But I do care that he is hell bent on going to MN so he can stick it to TT. If he sticks it to TT then he's sticking it to my favorite team, the Packers.

[sharpe1027]

Brett does play for another team why not wait until he signs before insulting him?

Why wait, clearly he wants to play for the Viqueens. For me, the rub is more about his desire to stick it to the Packers than just wanting to play for a contender. If that is all he wanted, I think he should have stayed with the Jets.

1.) Brett Favre told the Jets he was retired.
2.) Brett Favre waited until the Jets had showed signs of moving on to request his release.
3.) Brett Favre still claimed to be retired.
4.) Brett Favre soon talks with Viqueens, who confirm that they are talking.
5.) Brett Favre has surgery that is only necessary if he wants to play.
6.) Brett Favre has previously expressed interest in playing for the Viqueens.
7.) Brett Favre has stated he is motivated by an urge to get the Packers/TT.

2+2 still equals 4. Favre wants to play for a team in the Packer's division with the intent to stick it to the Packers. Any player that is out to make the Packers worse is going to catch my insults.

[Fritz]

Let me remind some of you of a few facts.

1) Brett Favre has not signed a contract with the vikings.

2) He has not had a positive throwing test of the arm since the surgery. In the post surgery throwing he said he was not satisfied.

3) Other than the day at the high school, his release from the Jets, and his appearance on Joe Buck's show, Brett has not talked to the media.

4) No home in Minnesota has been purchased by Brett.


Do you believe and agree with every poster here?

Do you believe and agree with every blogger?

Any weirdo can have a 2 bit blog and make up anything he wants about Brett Favre. "Reporters" searching the web report what 2 bit bloggers say in their blogs as if it is "news". Other reporters report the reporters observation of a blog and suddenly there is a bad rumor.

It is amazing how blind the public is to this! Does no one read the story to learn what the source is? How many of the Brett Favre stories are attributed to unnamed sources?



If you want to be angry at Brett Favre and call him names, why not wait until he actually signs with another team.

He was cut by the Jets and is a free agent. Free to sign with any team.

Just because the vikings are all screwed up and are desperate for a QB doesn't mean Brett is going there.

Nobody knows if his arm will function anywhere near the level it used to perform.



If Brett does play for another team why not wait until he signs before insulting him?

Here's a link that leads not to a blogger but to Lori Nickel and back from there to the Minneapolis Star Trib.

The obstacles to Favre's signing are getting smaller and smaller. And I won't slam him when he signs, but
I will be hoping the Packers' defense will slam him when they play.

[Packman_26]

Brett does play for another team why not wait until he signs before insulting him?

Why wait, clearly he wants to play for the Viqueens. For me, the rub is more about his desire to stick it to the Packers than just wanting to play for a contender. If that is all he wanted, I think he should have stayed with the Jets.

1.) Brett Favre told the Jets he was retired.
2.) Brett Favre waited until the Jets had showed signs of moving on to request his release.
3.) Brett Favre still claimed to be retired.
4.) Brett Favre soon talks with Viqueens, who confirm that they are talking.
5.) Brett Favre has surgery that is only necessary if he wants to play.
6.) Brett Favre has previously expressed interest in playing for the Viqueens.
7.) Brett Favre has stated he is motivated by an urge to get the Packers/TT.

2+2 still equals 4. Favre wants to play for a team in the Packer's division with the intent to stick it to the Packers. Any player that is out to make the Packers worse is going to catch my insults.
Well done. How can anyone believe that the Vikings weren't tampering with Favre last offseason?

[packrulz]

Mike Vandermause column: Favre saga no game for some fans
June 16, 2009

My ear still hurts after fielding a phone call from an angry Packers fan wanting to vent after Brett Favre all but declared his allegiance to the Minnesota Vikings during an HBO interview Monday.
Advertisement

The disillusioned caller used words like disgusting, selfish and scumbag to describe Favre. The man said he gave his undying support to Favre for 16 years, and in return, the quarterback “spits in our face.”

Favre left no doubt he will play for the Vikings if his surgically repaired arm cooperates, and it’s safe to say there will be a sizable contingent of Packers fans who never will forgive him. No amount of time will soothe the sting of Favre, formerly one of the most beloved Packers, joining forces with a bitter enemy.

“I don’t know what to tell them,” Favre said of fans feeling like they got kicked in the stomach. “Vince Lombardi went to the Washington Redskins, and his name’s on the trophy. We give that trophy out every year. I don’t hear too many people going, ‘That damn traitor, he went to Washington … ’ Now, time heals a lot of things, and I have nothing … but the highest regards for Green Bay, and I mean that sincerely.”

Favre’s reference to Lombardi was a bit of a stretch. Lombardi won five times as many NFL titles as Favre in Green Bay. Plus, the legendary coach didn’t jump to the archrival Chicago Bears, which would have been comparable to Favre playing for the Vikings.

But that’s beside the point. Why should Favre be forced to stay retired just to appease the purists and preserve his Packers legacy? The man wants to play football, and since this is a free country, why can’t he do what he wants without getting vilified?

You can question Favre’s motives, although HBO interviewer Joe Buck failed to ask him how much his desire to stick it to Packers General Manager Ted Thompson is playing into his infatuation with the Vikings.

“They chose to go in a different direction, and that’s OK,” said Favre of the Packers. “I chose to play again, and that’s OK.”

Actually, Favre wasn’t OK with the Packers leaving him behind last year, and he couldn’t hide his disdain for Thompson.

But Favre doesn’t deserve to be labeled a bad guy for wanting to play, and neither does Thompson for moving on after Favre announced his retirement in March 2008. Both Favre and Thompson have the right to make football decisions, whether popular or not.

As a result, the Packers-Vikings games this season will take on Armageddon-like status, and the Favre vs. Thompson battle will be highlighted.

If Favre leads the Vikings past the Packers, Thompson will be denounced for trading a Hall of Fame quarterback. If Favre struggles with injuries and ineffectiveness, he will be lambasted for overstaying his NFL welcome.

The stakes appear high, although Favre attempted to downplay the impact of his courtship with the Vikings. “It’s football,” he said. “It’s not life or death.”

That’s true, but he might change his perspective if he listens to some enraged fans.

— Mike Vandermause is sports editor of the Press-Gazette.

[MJZiggy]

The man wants to play football, and since this is a free country, why can’t he do what he wants without getting vilified?



Because in a free country, you are allowed to do what you want, but your actions bring the similarly free reactions of others. He's free to play, we're free to vilify him for it. It's really very simple.

[woodbuck27]

The man wants to play football, and since this is a free country, why can’t he do what he wants without getting vilified?



Because in a free country, you are allowed to do what you want, but your actions bring the similarly free reactions of others. He's free to play, we're free to vilify him for it. It's really very simple.

Bottom line as I see it.

It's unlikely Brett Favre can win long term any way you look at it. If he has that glory season and QB's the Vikings to a Super Bowl. The press and adulation will be incredible yet the cost. Maybe a majority of Packer fans will grow to hate him if that scenario becomes reality? Already he's hated by some Packer fans. I would be shocked if the polls revealed a majority of that emotion. Hate Favre!? Come on.

Alot of pressure is on Brett Favre. If he plays poorly he'll be ridiculed by Viking and Packer fans. I have always followed and enjoyed Brett Favre. As a fan I feel the pressure of his decisions. Where do I sit in all this? I feel that he must feel 100% ready to go physically able and confident or he has to stay retired. No matter what happens will he be the HOF QB that went too far? I believe right now there's alot of pressure on Brett Favre 'the man'. He still hasn't signed with any NFL team.

I (hope) hoped that Favre would remain retired.

GO PACKERS!

[GrnBay007]

From the above article....

Too bad both sides can't agree with the following statement and let the anger go.


But Favre doesn’t deserve to be labeled a bad guy for wanting to play, and neither does Thompson for moving on after Favre announced his retirement in March 2008. Both Favre and Thompson have the right to make football decisions, whether popular or not.

[packrulz]

The man wants to play football, and since this is a free country, why can’t he do what he wants without getting vilified?



Because in a free country, you are allowed to do what you want, but your actions bring the similarly free reactions of others. He's free to play, we're free to vilify him for it. It's really very simple.
Actually, the quote is from Mike Vandermause.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

The man wants to play football, and since this is a free country, why can’t he do what he wants without getting vilified?



Because in a free country, you are allowed to do what you want, but your actions bring the similarly free reactions of others. He's free to play, we're free to vilify him for it. It's really very simple.
Actually, the quote is from Mike Vandermause.

Zig didn't say it wasn't. She responded to the point.

What exactly is yours?

[ThunderDan]

Just looked up 70-89 records:
Saints 109-183-4 36.8% winning %
Bucs 62-149-1 29.2% winning % (76-89)
Seahags 103-109 48.6% winning % (76-89)

I really don't remember Seattle being as good as a 500 team but obviously I remembered wrong.

Just because your fans wear bags doesn't mean your franchise is the worst.

Do you realize how much worse you have to be to play almost a full third more games and only be 7% better? Also, you are excluding the first 3 years of the Saints.

That is the point..the saints were longer suffering. The Buc made the playoffs in their 3rd season.

The Saints went 10 years before they were 500. They went 20 years before they had a winning season.

P.S. The Bucs first win...on the road...you guessed...THE SAINTS. Two coaches were fired because they lost to the Bucs in their second year...Stram and Coryell.

You divide wins by total games played to get a winning percentage. It doesn't matter how many games you have played you aren't using the same demoninator. That way teams that have not played the same number of games can be compared.

For the Saints 109/296 = .368
For Tampa Bay 62/212 = .292

If Tampa Bay played 84 games to have the same number of total games at that winning percentage they should have won 25 more games and been 87/296 = .293 That's a full 22 wins less than the Saints.

I used 70-89 because the original poster said the Packers were the biggest joke in the 70s and 80s. So I went back the the beginning for the Saints and here is what I get:
121-212-5 for a .358 or 35.8% winning clip well above Tampa.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Just looked up 70-89 records:
Saints 109-183-4 36.8% winning %
Bucs 62-149-1 29.2% winning % (76-89)
Seahags 103-109 48.6% winning % (76-89)

I really don't remember Seattle being as good as a 500 team but obviously I remembered wrong.

Just because your fans wear bags doesn't mean your franchise is the worst.

Do you realize how much worse you have to be to play almost a full third more games and only be 7% better? Also, you are excluding the first 3 years of the Saints.

That is the point..the saints were longer suffering. The Buc made the playoffs in their 3rd season.

The Saints went 10 years before they were 500. They went 20 years before they had a winning season.

P.S. The Bucs first win...on the road...you guessed...THE SAINTS. Two coaches were fired because they lost to the Bucs in their second year...Stram and Coryell.

You divide wins by total games played to get a winning percentage. It doesn't matter how many games you have played you aren't using the same demoninator. That way teams that have not played the same number of games can be compared.

For the Saints 109/296 = .368
For Tampa Bay 62/212 = .292

If Tampa Bay played 84 games to have the same number of total games at that winning percentage they should have won 25 more games and been 87/296 = .293 That's a full 22 wins less than the Saints.

I used 70-89 because the original poster said the Packers were a joke in the 70s and 80s. So I went back the the beginning for the Saints and here is what I get:
121-212-5 for a .358 or 35.8% winning clip well above Tampa.

[/code]

I understand what you did, but it is just a false way of looking at it. The issue was being a joke.

Ask yourself..would you rather go 10 years till you are 500 or 3. Would you rather go 20 years till you are above 500 or 3?

Playoffs mean something as do SBs. You can suck like the pack did and still be able to cling to the glory years. The saints didn't have shit for 20 years. The Bucs went to 3 straight playoffs within their 6 years.

Winning percentage doesn't tell the story. Ty would more satsified and so would most fans going to the playoffs and having a worse percentage then not even going 500 for 20 years.

The reason they wore bags is because of the years of frustration. You don't wear bags..well, now you could as the precedent and the idea has been planted...if you have something in the past to cling to.

[SnakeLH2006]

Interesting topic as Snake has swayed several times since the Favre Crisis a year ago as it comes down to this:

The 5 Stages of Coping

1) Denial
-How the hell can the Pack not want a legend like Favre back? Brett can't really be gone can he?

2) Anger
-WTF? 2nd string? He had a beast year last year and was 2nd in MVP votes (2007).

3) Bargaining
-He's meeting with McCarthy. Maybe they can work it out.

4) Depression
-Damn. He's gone. Time to make a Brett Favre tribute video for Youtube (lol...Snake did that last year).

5) Acceptance
-He's been great for the Pack. Now he's just another great, exciting player I love to watch, albeit not for my Pack.

That's about how I look at it, except that #2 means something else for several on PR and they never got past it, instead of going for #5..... :shock: :roll: Snake is finally at peace and finds it humorous that so many still feel so strongly 1 way or the other. Time heals all wounds. TT is cool now in Snake's book and so is Brett. Do people bitch about it and hate someone this badly when players jump ships in baseball? Wade Boggs, Johnny Damon? Nope.

Who cares...just let the old bastard play if he wants. I enjoy seeing him play and could care less about the media BS. Whatever though....

[bobblehead]

http://msn.foxsports.com/other/pgStory?contentId=9776478&GT1=39002#sport=More Sports&photo=9776462

I thought this on MSN was appropriate for this thread. When the Jets were 8-3 the BF fans were taunting and those who were done with him were saying "wait until the end of the season."

Now the national media is getting shere some of us were last year.

[ThunderDan]

[quote="SnakeLH2006"]Interesting topic as Snake has swayed several times since the Favre Crisis a year ago as it comes down to this:

The 5 Stages of Coping

1) Denial
-How the hell can the Pack not want a legend like Favre back? Brett can't really be gone can he?

2) Anger
-WTF? 2nd string? He had a beast year last year and was 2nd in MVP votes (2007).

3) Bargaining
-He's meeting with McCarthy. Maybe they can work it out.

4) Depression
-Damn. He's gone. Time to make a Brett Favre tribute video for Youtube (lol...Snake did that last year).

5) Acceptance
-He's been great for the Pack. Now he's just another great, exciting player I love to watch, albeit not for my Pack.
[\quote]

I think I got to 5 pretty quickly when he was with the Jets.

[Fritz]

I'm just fascinated with the guy. It's like seeing a train wreck in slow motion.

[Zool]

Do people bitch about it and hate someone this badly when players jump ships in baseball? Wade Boggs, Johnny Damon? Nope.

Might want to ask a Red Sox fan about Clemens playing for the Yankees. Or maybe a Brewer fan about Molitor playing for the Twins.

[Patler]

Why the negativity? Because of what Favre had been built up to be in the eyes of the fans.

A large part of the Favre mystique is that he and the media convinced fans that somehow Favre was different than the typical professional athlete. He was portrayed as what fans want professional athletes to be, as in-love with the team they play for as the fans of the team are. Favre nurtured this image by:

- Distancing himself from the money aspect of professional sports.
- Criticizing team mates who didn't have a "team first" attitude in the way fans wanted.
- Suggesting he would never be a player who hangs on to an eroding career.
- Stating he would rather retire before his skills declined.
- Insisting he would never play for another team after the Packers.
- Humbling himself by saying that if the Packers decided they no longer wanted him, he would simply retire, taking the hint from them about where he and the team were at. This tied into his statements that he would never play for another team after the Packers.

Fans ate it up. Favre became that mythical pro athlete that fans desperately want, the one they think they would be if given the opportunity. Favre played the role and the media and the NFL promoted it at every opportunity.

Fans saw a crack in the facade last year with the way Favre interacted with the team. Continuing it yet again this year, conniving his way out of his contract with the Jets, and longing to play for a chief rival of the Packers has clearly demonstrated that the mythical Favre as he was portrayed to the fans was a sham. He was only a highly skilled performer, but otherwise no different than all the other athletes who have come and gone over the seasons.

Favre is not different than the rank and file professional athlete. He does not have the characteristics that the fans were lead to believe he had by himself, the media and the NFL. Some fans feel lied to and duped as a result; and yes, they are angry. We can say those fans were naive to begin with, but the brainwashing regarding Favre had gone on for years and years, and was nonstop.

That is the reason for the negativity.

[bobblehead]

Patler-

I would say not only the fans were brainwashed into believing BF was that guy, but so was Favre himself.

I believe that he believed everything he said when he said it. Things were going great and he was happy and he believed his own fairy tale.

It was easy when he was handed everything and nobody questioned him. Remember, the true test of character is doing the right thing when nobody is watching. BF failed that test because when he was expected to practice and like, you know, show up to OTA's and set an example for the young guys his fairy tale fell apart and he failed the character test.

The thing that steams me about it is that his '07 season proved that MM and TT were right. When he worked with their personal trainer in the offseason and came to OTA's (and accepted coaching about throwing it up for grabs) he responded with his best season in about 10 years. You would think he would have figured out it was worth it, but when the next offseason came he felt vindicated as Brent the Great so he could go back to sitting at home, doing nothing and showing up for training camp.

The real reason some of us have such vitriol towards him is that we saw him for what he was long ago, but dared not speak out for fear of the backlash. Now we feel vindicated and we are taking every opportunity to dig at those that were blind before. Is that mature on my/our part....probably not. What can I say, I try and pass that same character test of knowing I'm right should be good enough, but sometimes I fail it myself.

[mraynrand]

The thing that steams me about it is that his '07 season proved that MM and TT were right. When he worked with their personal trainer in the offseason and came to OTA's (and accepted coaching about throwing it up for grabs) he responded with his best season in about 10 years.

I would quibble a bit and say three years. Favre, under the duress of the end of his career became (or exposed himself as) a prima donna. It's a hard pill to swallow for Favre fans like me.

[pbmax]

- Humbling himself by saying that if the Packers decided they no longer wanted him, he would simply retire, taking the hint from them about where he and the team were at. This tied into his statements that he would never play for another team after the Packers.

... Favre is not different than the rank and file professional athlete. He does not have the characteristics that the fans were lead to believe he had by himself, the media and the NFL.... but the brainwashing regarding Favre had gone on for years and years, and was nonstop.
I had forgotten about that last item in Patler's list.

Another force at work here is the media's echo chamber effect. Many commentators bought into the hype as well. Overlooking evidence of his weaknesses (which were actually well chronicled until after the first MVP and the Vicodin rehab and in full display even in Holmgren's last year) he was judged by a standard where he was either successful or put in a position where success was not possible (he only threw those interceptions when he was behind late).

When his play began to decline and playoff success became more difficult, there was a tremendous backlash, first by fans (most of them from other teams tired of Favre, but also some Packer fans) that eventually transmitted to media commentators. Some were thoughtful and consistent (Dr. Z, although even Z tended to critique Favre by blaming the coverage and coaching) some were weather vanes of conventional wisdom (Cowherd).

But because everyone (including folks who reasonably concluded on this very board that some critics had gone way too far in the other direction) was reacting to the coverage, few were paying attention to his game, which had changed dramatically after his injuries in 99 and 00. Whether the thumb injury was the cause, or its timing just coincided with age and erosion of his ability to escape hits, I don't know.

But he was purely a pocket passer from that point of his career and he was in no mind to get crushed by hits as he threw. He developed and retained an uncanny ability to sense pressure and get the throw off before the hit. But the timing in the pocket did not always sync with his receivers being open or following his progression. Troy Aikman was done in by repeated shots to his head as he tried to throw on rhythm and timing by staying in the pocket, waiting for the proper time and then getting blasted. That stubbornness ended his career. Favre changed his game to survive. On JSO today you can see a picture of Favre knocked woozy by Kevin Greene in a Steeler's game in 95. He took fewer of those shots as he got older. Good for his health, not necessarily good for the team.

He was still a very effective QB as demonstrated by his resurgence with the OLine and Ahman Green in 01 and 02. And by his year in 07. But he wasn't the same QB as 95-97. He was at a level where he could be effectively replaced by a rookie starter; though that player was in his 4th year in the league and had been a 1st round pick. He wasn't terrible, but he was much closer to average. If he was a linebacker, no one would have minded him being replaced by a younger and cheaper player. But by 2008, no one paid attention to Brett Favre's game skills, they paid attention to his reputation. And that reputation was either a cause for rallying (people are too quick to write him off) or protest (overated and done). The overreaction was in part because fans could no longer agree on just how good a QB he actually was.

[sharpe1027]

Interesting topic as Snake has swayed several times since the Favre Crisis a year ago as it comes down to this:

The 5 Stages of Coping

1) Denial
-How the hell can the Pack not want a legend like Favre back? Brett can't really be gone can he?

2) Anger
-WTF? 2nd string? He had a beast year last year and was 2nd in MVP votes (2007).

3) Bargaining
-He's meeting with McCarthy. Maybe they can work it out.

4) Depression
-Damn. He's gone. Time to make a Brett Favre tribute video for Youtube (lol...Snake did that last year).

5) Acceptance
-He's been great for the Pack. Now he's just another great, exciting player I love to watch, albeit not for my Pack.

That's about how I look at it, except that #2 means something else for several on PR and they never got past it, instead of going for #5..... :shock: :roll: Snake is finally at peace and finds it humorous that so many still feel so strongly 1 way or the other. Time heals all wounds. TT is cool now in Snake's book and so is Brett. Do people bitch about it and hate someone this badly when players jump ships in baseball? Wade Boggs, Johnny Damon? Nope.

Who cares...just let the old bastard play if he wants. I enjoy seeing him play and could care less about the media BS. Whatever though....

A reasonable position. Personally, I have accepted the situation but not choose to forget everything that happened. To the extent that I dislike actions that are intended to hurt my favorite team, I dislike Favre's actions. Laugh at me if you must, but I'm not so sure my position is more humorous than your own. :wink:

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Interesting topic as Snake has swayed several times since the Favre Crisis a year ago as it comes down to this:

The 5 Stages of Coping

1) Denial
-How the hell can the Pack not want a legend like Favre back? Brett can't really be gone can he?

2) Anger
-WTF? 2nd string? He had a beast year last year and was 2nd in MVP votes (2007).

3) Bargaining
-He's meeting with McCarthy. Maybe they can work it out.

4) Depression
-Damn. He's gone. Time to make a Brett Favre tribute video for Youtube (lol...Snake did that last year).

5) Acceptance
-He's been great for the Pack. Now he's just another great, exciting player I love to watch, albeit not for my Pack.

That's about how I look at it, except that #2 means something else for several on PR and they never got past it, instead of going for #5..... :shock: :roll: Snake is finally at peace and finds it humorous that so many still feel so strongly 1 way or the other. Time heals all wounds. TT is cool now in Snake's book and so is Brett. Do people bitch about it and hate someone this badly when players jump ships in baseball? Wade Boggs, Johnny Damon? Nope.

Who cares...just let the old bastard play if he wants. I enjoy seeing him play and could care less about the media BS. Whatever though....

Snake, sometimes you write some smart stuff, but this time, not so much.

Neither Damon or Boggs ever was revered by the media, fans, etc....and acted like Favre..all the things patler wrote.

Fuck, why even bring up damon? By the time he got to the Sox it was his 3rd team. :oops:

Boggs: Man, he left at free agency...and yes, there were some fans pretty darn miffed. But, Boggs left after a subpar season..and his career was winding down. Again, Boggs isn't even in the same category as Favre...with the love, the adulation, nor the aspects of that Patler mentioned.

But, more importantly, in order for Boggs to stay..he had to be offered a contract. He wasn't. Duquette was reviled by Sox Nation..and when Boggs left the team was in turmoil as Jean Yawkey had just taken over.

[The Shadow]

Why the negativity? Because of what Favre had been built up to be in the eyes of the fans.

A large part of the Favre mystique is that he and the media convinced fans that somehow Favre was different than the typical professional athlete. He was portrayed as what fans want professional athletes to be, as in-love with the team they play for as the fans of the team are. Favre nurtured this image by:

- Distancing himself from the money aspect of professional sports.
- Criticizing team mates who didn't have a "team first" attitude in the way fans wanted.
- Suggesting he would never be a player who hangs on to an eroding career.
- Stating he would rather retire before his skills declined.
- Insisting he would never play for another team after the Packers.
- Humbling himself by saying that if the Packers decided they no longer wanted him, he would simply retire, taking the hint from them about where he and the team were at. This tied into his statements that he would never play for another team after the Packers.

Fans ate it up. Favre became that mythical pro athlete that fans desperately want, the one they think they would be if given the opportunity. Favre played the role and the media and the NFL promoted it at every opportunity.

Fans saw a crack in the facade last year with the way Favre interacted with the team. Continuing it yet again this year, conniving his way out of his contract with the Jets, and longing to play for a chief rival of the Packers has clearly demonstrated that the mythical Favre as he was portrayed to the fans was a sham. He was only a highly skilled performer, but otherwise no different than all the other athletes who have come and gone over the seasons.

Favre is not different than the rank and file professional athlete. He does not have the characteristics that the fans were lead to believe he had by himself, the media and the NFL. Some fans feel lied to and duped as a result; and yes, they are angry. We can say those fans were naive to begin with, but the brainwashing regarding Favre had gone on for years and years, and was nonstop.

That is the reason for the negativity.

Right on the mark.
Well put.

[cpk1994]

Why the negativity? Because of what Favre had been built up to be in the eyes of the fans.

A large part of the Favre mystique is that he and the media convinced fans that somehow Favre was different than the typical professional athlete. He was portrayed as what fans want professional athletes to be, as in-love with the team they play for as the fans of the team are. Favre nurtured this image by:

- Distancing himself from the money aspect of professional sports.
- Criticizing team mates who didn't have a "team first" attitude in the way fans wanted.
- Suggesting he would never be a player who hangs on to an eroding career.
- Stating he would rather retire before his skills declined.
- Insisting he would never play for another team after the Packers.
- Humbling himself by saying that if the Packers decided they no longer wanted him, he would simply retire, taking the hint from them about where he and the team were at. This tied into his statements that he would never play for another team after the Packers.

Fans ate it up. Favre became that mythical pro athlete that fans desperately want, the one they think they would be if given the opportunity. Favre played the role and the media and the NFL promoted it at every opportunity.

Fans saw a crack in the facade last year with the way Favre interacted with the team. Continuing it yet again this year, conniving his way out of his contract with the Jets, and longing to play for a chief rival of the Packers has clearly demonstrated that the mythical Favre as he was portrayed to the fans was a sham. He was only a highly skilled performer, but otherwise no different than all the other athletes who have come and gone over the seasons.

Favre is not different than the rank and file professional athlete. He does not have the characteristics that the fans were lead to believe he had by himself, the media and the NFL. Some fans feel lied to and duped as a result; and yes, they are angry. We can say those fans were naive to begin with, but the brainwashing regarding Favre had gone on for years and years, and was nonstop.

That is the reason for the negativity.

Right on the mark.
Well put.I second that. Well done. :bclap:

[gex]

Some fans feel lied to and duped as a result; and yes, they are angry. We can say those fans were naive to begin with.

Right on the mark.
Well put.I second that. Well done. :bclap:
I also 2nd that.

This is why, IMO, they still need to bash the man for doing nothing more than what he is paid to do.

They can't get over it.

[ThunderDan]

Some fans feel lied to and duped as a result; and yes, they are angry. We can say those fans were naive to begin with.

Right on the mark.
Well put.I second that. Well done. :bclap:
I also 2nd that.

This is why, IMO, they still need to bash the man for doing nothing more than what he is paid to do.

They can't get over it.

Way to take two sentences from Patler's original post that distorts Patler's post in the first place.

[Fritz]

First, kudos to Patler and the follow-up comments on Favre. Right on the mark, including the poster (who was it?) who noted that Favre really did believe the stuff he said when he said it - I agree; I don't think Favre deliberately lied. He just fooled himself well.

As to the original question of the post, here's another piece of evidence: when Favre was on that stupid Joe Buck show, he said it wouldn't be fair to the Vikes to make them wait on his decision, so he'd decide well before training camp.

Now, here's a quote from a Press Gazette article on Bevell going down to watch Favre throw:

"According to the report, Favre was encouraged by his throwing session in Hattiesburg, Miss., but told Vikings officials he might not announce his intentions until shortly before the team begins training camp on July 29 in Mankato, Minn."

Okay, first, yes, IF the report is true. Maybe it's not. But if it is - and I believe it is, because it's consistent with Favre's pattern of changing his story (I'm retiring...I'm not retiring....I'm retiring...I'm not retiring) - if it is true, then here is yet another example of Favre saying one thing as if it's concrete - of course I wouldn't wait that long and put the Vikes in a bind! - then turning around later and doing the opposite.

If he did all this deliberately, intentionally misleading people, I'd say he's an ass-hat. But I believe he believes what he says when he says it, and justifies his changes in action and attitude to himself as best he can. The funny thing is that he's become rather predictable, though many people do not seem to understand this.

That makes him self-deluded, and someone that should not be taken at his word. Someone to be very careful in dealing with. Someone not to be trusted.

[bobblehead]

Some fans feel lied to and duped as a result; and yes, they are angry. We can say those fans were naive to begin with.

Right on the mark.
Well put.I second that. Well done. :bclap:
I also 2nd that.

This is why, IMO, they still need to bash the man for doing nothing more than what he is paid to do.

They can't get over it.

Actually read my post:
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
The real reason some of us have such vitriol towards him is that we saw him for what he was long ago, but dared not speak out for fear of the backlash. Now we feel vindicated and we are taking every opportunity to dig at those that were blind before. Is that mature on my/our part....probably not. What can I say, I try and pass that same character test of knowing I'm right should be good enough, but sometimes I fail it myself.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
It has nothing to do with being betrayed by Favre, but it has everything to do with fan's reactions when I would point out these things in the past.

[sharpe1027]

First, kudos to Patler and the follow-up comments on Favre. Right on the mark, including the poster (who was it?) who noted that Favre really did believe the stuff he said when he said it - I agree; I don't think Favre deliberately lied. He just fooled himself well.

As to the original question of the post, here's another piece of evidence: when Favre was on that stupid Joe Buck show, he said it wouldn't be fair to the Vikes to make them wait on his decision, so he'd decide well before training camp.

Now, here's a quote from a Press Gazette article on Bevell going down to watch Favre throw:

"According to the report, Favre was encouraged by his throwing session in Hattiesburg, Miss., but told Vikings officials he might not announce his intentions until shortly before the team begins training camp on July 29 in Mankato, Minn."

Okay, first, yes, IF the report is true. Maybe it's not. But if it is - and I believe it is, because it's consistent with Favre's pattern of changing his story (I'm retiring...I'm not retiring....I'm retiring...I'm not retiring) - if it is true, then here is yet another example of Favre saying one thing as if it's concrete - of course I wouldn't wait that long and put the Vikes in a bind! - then turning around later and doing the opposite.

If he did all this deliberately, intentionally misleading people, I'd say he's an ass-hat. But I believe he believes what he says when he says it, and justifies his changes in action and attitude to himself as best he can. The funny thing is that he's become rather predictable, though many people do not seem to understand this.

That makes him self-deluded, and someone that should not be taken at his word. Someone to be very careful in dealing with. Someone not to be trusted.

Someone who understands what is right and wants to do the right thing, but when faced with the personal consequences of doing what is right, instead does the something different and then deludes himself with self-made justifications for his actions.

[cpk1994]

This is why, IMO, they still need to bash the man for doing nothing more than what he is paid to do.

They can't get over it.

It goes the other way too. Their are Favre fans that still need to bash TT for doing nothing more than what he is paid to do and that is make moves in the best interests of the Packers, which meant parting ways with Favre.

They can't get over it. Hell, Favre himself can't get over it.

[woodbuck27]

:!: Whoops. Duplicate post.

[woodbuck27]

This is why, IMO, they still need to bash the man for doing nothing more than what he is paid to do.

They can't get over it.

It goes the other way too. Their are Favre fans that still need to bash TT for doing nothing more than what he is paid to do and that is make moves in the best interests of the Packers, which meant parting ways with Favre.

They can't get over it. Hell, Favre himself can't get over it.

I just hope you'll think cpk1994. I don't run dashs in the shadows or go behind closed doors to set things on a better course.

Are you looking for or legitimizing an excuse cpk1994?

Who bashes TT on this forum cpk1994? Back yourself up or gather up your gang to assist you in that exercise. Bring on the posts from posters that slam TT. That backs up your statement of posters here at Packerrats that bash TT. Who are these posters that bash TT cpk1994? Back yourself up looking at posts over the past two months or stuff it please.

TT is like any GM and constantly being scrutinized as are the Head Coachs. That ability to survive that comes with the job description cpk1994.

Your a one trick pony cpk1994, like a CD that someone plays over and over. I'm thinking of ABBA. Your wearisome and a detrement to Packerrats. Get over yourself. I'm positive cpk1994 you've had that request before.

GO PACKERS!

[Tyrone Bigguns]

This is why, IMO, they still need to bash the man for doing nothing more than what he is paid to do.

They can't get over it.

It goes the other way too. Their are Favre fans that still need to bash TT for doing nothing more than what he is paid to do and that is make moves in the best interests of the Packers, which meant parting ways with Favre.

They can't get over it. Hell, Favre himself can't get over it.

Are you looking for or legitimizing an excuse cpk1994?

Who bashes TT on this forum cpk1995? Lay out the posts from posters that slam TT. That backs up your statement of posters here at Packerrats that bash TT. Who are these posters that bash TT cpk1994? Back yourself up looking at posts over the past two months or stuff it please.

Your a one trick pony cpk1994, like a CD that someone plays over and over. I'm thinking of ABBA. Your wearisome and a detrement to Packerrats. Get over yourself. I'm positive cpk1994 you've had that request before.

GO PACKERS!

Piss off. Regardless of CPK, there are/were plenty of TT bashers. For you to pretend there aren't is either stupidity or willfull blindness.

Your a one trick pony Woodbuck, like a CD that someone plays over and over. I'm thinking of Celine Dion. Your wearisome and a detrement to Packerrats. Get over yourself. I'm positive Woodbuck you've had that request before. (sic)

P.S. and you contribute to poor spelling and grammar.

[woodbuck27]

This is why, IMO, they still need to bash the man for doing nothing more than what he is paid to do.

They can't get over it.

It goes the other way too. Their are Favre fans that still need to bash TT for doing nothing more than what he is paid to do and that is make moves in the best interests of the Packers, which meant parting ways with Favre.

They can't get over it. Hell, Favre himself can't get over it.

Are you looking for or legitimizing an excuse cpk1994?

Who bashes TT on this forum cpk1995? Lay out the posts from posters that slam TT. That backs up your statement of posters here at Packerrats that bash TT. Who are these posters that bash TT cpk1994? Back yourself up looking at posts over the past two months or stuff it please.

Your a one trick pony cpk1994, like a CD that someone plays over and over. I'm thinking of ABBA. Your wearisome and a detrement to Packerrats. Get over yourself. I'm positive cpk1994 you've had that request before.

GO PACKERS!

Piss off. Regardless of CPK, there are/were plenty of TT bashers. For you to pretend there aren't is either stupidity or willfull blindness.

Your a one trick pony Woodbuck, like a CD that someone plays over and over. I'm thinking of Celine Dion. Your wearisome and a detrement to Packerrats. Get over yourself. I'm positive Woodbuck you've had that request before. (sic)

P.S. and you contribute to poor spelling and grammar.

Ohh the intimidation. :D

Your not worthy of my time Tyrone. . . but this to explain why I feel as I do. Your owed at least that respect. Do you imagine yourself bright and cool to hip Tyrone Bigguns, to post the gumbo that you recklessly submit here?

Look at your language in that post above Tyrone Bigguns. Classless garbage. Yet you imagine yourself a writer? Maybe you don't have the imagination or manners to express yourself with any better style mister? Is it ignorance? If so I can understand you. Otherwise I suggest that you have some class Tyrone. PLEASE TRY SOME CLASS.

Debate you Tyrone!? What would that accomplish for the good of Packerrats but no good. As far as my english grammer and spelling. I'd hold my own in terms of the slop you post.

The problem is this isn't a place to vent your obvious frustrations laddie. I'll suggest an alternative exercise Tyrone Bigguns. Go and find some great mountain and pound rocks off the face of it till you feel your arm coming free or your shoulder. Then while that arm is re-habing. Take some time to come to exact terms with your boring attempt at sarcastic pseudo-macho popcorn and sock blowing buddy system and turn to something approaching decency.

[cpk1994]

This is why, IMO, they still need to bash the man for doing nothing more than what he is paid to do.

They can't get over it.

It goes the other way too. Their are Favre fans that still need to bash TT for doing nothing more than what he is paid to do and that is make moves in the best interests of the Packers, which meant parting ways with Favre.

They can't get over it. Hell, Favre himself can't get over it.

I just hope you'll think cpk1994. I don't run dashs in the shadows or go behind closed doors to set things on a better course.

Are you looking for or legitimizing an excuse cpk1994?

Who bashes TT on this forum cpk1994? Back yourself up or gather up your gang to assist you in that exercise. Bring on the posts from posters that slam TT. That backs up your statement of posters here at Packerrats that bash TT. Who are these posters that bash TT cpk1994? Back yourself up looking at posts over the past two months or stuff it please.

TT is like any GM and constantly being scrutinized as are the Head Coachs. That ability to survive that comes with the job description cpk1994.

Your a one trick pony cpk1994, like a CD that someone plays over and over. I'm thinking of ABBA. Your wearisome and a detrement to Packerrats. Get over yourself. I'm positive cpk1994 you've had that request before.

GO PACKERS!

Re-Read my post. WHere did I ever mention this fourum in it? I said "Favre Fans", not Packerrats posters. And I know people personally who still believe TT should be fired for not bending over backwards and let Favre comeback and do whatever he wants.

Instead of finding excuses to attack me, I suggest a course in reading comprehension. I think that would be crucial in your job as a teacher.

[CaptainD]

Here we go again :beat:

[The Shadow]

"......And I know people personally who still believe TT should be fired for not bending over backwards and let Favre comeback and do whatever he wants. "

I've long thought that the folks who hysterically hate Ted Thompson have all had problems with strong father-figures somewhere in the past.