Bedard's Roster

[pbmax]

Bedard's Roster (http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/sports/56999417.html)

He has 26 on offense, 24 on defense and 3 specialists.

He has 6 DEs, 8 LBs and 10 DBs(5 CBs, 5 Safetys).

Does anyone else expect these numbers to hold up?

[Tyrone Bigguns]

fix your link old man...needs a .html :wink:

http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/sports/56999417.html

[Lurker64]

No way they cut Lansanah, he's the only player other than Hawk who has played at the Buck ILB spot. Eight LBs is too few, too. I wouldn't be surprised to see 10 with Lansanah and Jones rounding out the 8 he has.

To make up for it, cut Brohm, Sutton, or Rouse.

[pbmax]

No way they cut Lansanah, he's the only player other than Hawk who has played at the Buck ILB spot. Eight LBs is too few, too. I wouldn't be surprised to see 10 with Lansanah and Jones rounding out the 8 he has.

To make up for it, cut Brohm, Sutton, or Rouse.
Yes, his roster has Havner as the backup Buck unless there is a secret understanding that Bishop could do it without having lined up there during the preseason.

Four RBs bascially is costing them another backer. They might keep 4 RBs, but it'll come at the expense of a DB I think.

[pbmax]

One other note. Meredith does not look ready yet. If Bedard is right about 9 lineman with no Moll, then Colledge is gameday LT backup.

If Lang spent no time at LT, then cutting Moll means Colledge IS the LT backup.

Dietrich-Smith looked like he can be a center in the NFL. It was against 2s and 3s, but he looked pretty good.

[KYPack]

These were my cuts from the other post, not that I think that's significant

1 Brett Swain
2. JaRon Harris
3. Evan Dietrich-Smith
4. Alfred Malone
5. Andrew Hartline
6. Dean Muhtadi
7. Brad Jones
8 Stryker Sulak
9. Trevor Ford
10. Joe Porter
11. Michael Montgomery T
12. Kory Hall T
13. Kole Heckendorf
14. Jake Allen
15. Evan Moore
16. Ronald Talley
17. DeShawn Wynn
18 Kregg Lumpkin
19 Durrant Brooks
20 Tony Moll T

IR
Pat Lee
Aaron Rouse
Justin Harrell

Brooks, Harris and Sulak have already been cut so I have to do 3 more.
Peprah
Obizor (I like him)
Havner The third cut is where I get pissy. I hate this Havner kid. I know he won't be cut, but I'm cutting him bc I think he is a shitty TE and a non-entity as a LB.

Bedard kept 4 RB's I'll keep Wynn and Sutton and say bye bye to the Lump.
I thought Toribio earned a spot. Raji is out for a bit, I think they have to keep a rotation

One thing I wonder about is can they keep 3 on the IR? Lee would be a stretch, I think Rouse and Harrell would make some sense, but it may be grabbing at straws.

PS
Dietrich-Smith
Lumpy
Toribio
Jones
Obiozor
Underwood
Hartline

That probably makes sense. If that's the PS, I'm cutting Underwood and PSing him.

What's everybody else think?

[pbmax]

Vandermause at Press Gazette (http://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/article/20090903/PKR07/90903187/1058/PKR01)

Vandermause at GBPG has some differences with Bedard:

Havner is gone, just two TEs. Nine linebackers (and no Havner) leaves Lansanah* and Jones on the roster. He keeps the 4 RBs due to Jackson injury and 10 DBs (Rouse and Lee make it). He keeps Moll over Meredith who he hopes to get on PS. Given the way Meredith did not pass block in this game, I think this is more likely than I did a week ago.

*Edit: Vandermause did not have Lansanah making it, just Jones. Thanks to Bob Dobbs.

[pbmax]

These were my cuts from the other post, not that I think that's significant

1 Brett Swain
2. JaRon Harris
3. Evan Dietrich-Smith
4. Alfred Malone
5. Andrew Hartline
6. Dean Muhtadi
7. Brad Jones
8 Stryker Sulak
9. Trevor Ford
10. Joe Porter
11. Michael Montgomery T
12. Kory Hall T
13. Kole Heckendorf
14. Jake Allen
15. Evan Moore
16. Ronald Talley
17. DeShawn Wynn
18 Kregg Lumpkin
19 Durrant Brooks
20 Tony Moll T

IR
Pat Lee
Aaron Rouse
Justin Harrell

Brooks, Harris and Sulak have already been cut so I have to do 3 more.
Peprah
Obizor (I like him)
Havner The third cut is where I get pissy. I hate this Havner kid. I know he won't be cut, but I'm cutting him bc I think he is a shitty TE and a non-entity as a LB.

Bedard kept 4 RB's I'll keep Wynn and Sutton and say bye bye to the Lump.
I thought Toribio earned a spot. Raji is out for a bit, I think they have to keep a rotation

One thing I wonder about is can they keep 3 on the IR? Lee would be a stretch, I think Rouse and Harrell would make some sense, but it may be grabbing at straws.

PS
Dietrich-Smith
Lumpy
Toribio
Jones
Obiozor
Underwood
Hartline

That probably makes sense. If that's the PS, I'm cutting Underwood and PSing him.

What's everybody else think?

You are lubed up like Snake at 3 AM aren't you KY? :lol:

Also, your presence at the game explains why we finish with the Titans every preseason.

[pbmax]

One thing I wonder about is can they keep 3 on the IR? Lee would be a stretch, I think Rouse and Harrell would make some sense, but it may be grabbing at straws.

PS
Dietrich-Smith
Lumpy
Toribio
Jones
Obiozor
Underwood
Hartline

That probably makes sense. If that's the PS, I'm cutting Underwood and PSing him.

What's everybody else think?
I would love to get Dietrich-Smith on PS. I think he can play center and maybe guard. Lumpy is good insurance esp. if his shoulder heals. One of Jones or Obiozor will be on the roster in my guess, but if they can keep both, I'd be happy. I hope Meredith sticks as we need a LT prospect beside our Left Guard.

I am disappointed that Giacomini has struggled so much in pass protection.

[BobDobbs]

Vandermouse's roster is pretty much what I was thinking. Except that he did not keep Lansannah. I would at the expense of Brad Jones. I take the guy that is more likely to see the field.

Also, I might IR Pat Lee to keep Underwood on the roster, but maybe that's because I'm frustrated with him right now. Either way, one of them is buried down the chart.

I saw KYP had Rouse on IR. I hadn't heard his injury is all that bad. I could see those three on IR, but it's kind of a scorched earth policy. I think we'd only be leaving him inactive for a couple of weeks.

After watching tonites game I'm pretty underwhelmed with our backup RBs. Especially seeing what Tennessee has going on. Unless I know that B Jack is out for awhile. I might just cut Sutton and Lumpkin and keep Havner or Meredith on the roster.

That's rash though. I don't think TT will do it.

[Waldo]

No way they cut Lansanah, he's the only player other than Hawk who has played at the Buck ILB spot. Eight LBs is too few, too. I wouldn't be surprised to see 10 with Lansanah and Jones rounding out the 8 he has.

To make up for it, cut Brohm, Sutton, or Rouse.
Yes, his roster has Havner as the backup Buck unless there is a secret understanding that Bishop could do it without having lined up there during the preseason.

Four RBs bascially is costing them another backer. They might keep 4 RBs, but it'll come at the expense of a DB I think.

He played it today when he was out there with Barnett (possibly a little with Chillar too).

I won't be able to say for sure how much time he got there until it is televised on the NFLN and I can put it to tape, but I definitely saw him play buck today.

[Waldo]

Here's my final roster guess:

QB (3): Rodgers, Flynn, Brohm
RB (3): Grant, Jackson, Wynn
FB (2): Hall, Johnson
WR (5): Driver, Jennings, Jones, Nelson, Martin
TE (2): Finley, Lee
OL (10): Clifton, Colledge, Spitz, Sitton, Barbre, Meredith, Lang, Wells, Giacomini, Dietrich-Smith
DL (6): Jenkins, Pickett, Jolly, Raji, Wynn, Toribio
OLB (5): Kampman, Matthews, Poppinga, Jones, Thompson
ILB (4): Hawk, Barnett, Bishop, Lansanah
S (4): Killswitch, Collins, Bigby, Bush
CB (6): Harris, Woodson, Williams, Blackmon, Underwood, Lee

LS: Goode
K: Crosby
P: Kapinos

Traded - Chillar (possibly swap Bishop with Chillar here and in the roster), Kuhn

PS - Swain, Heckendorf, Lumpkin, Moore, Obiozor, Tally, Muhtadi, Porter

IR - Harrell

I think that we try to swing a trade for Dietrich-Smith, when we fail, we keep him. He is the bubble guy that will go if we need to call up reinforcements from the PS. If Lumpkin doesn't make it to the PS, Sutton is the 2nd choice.

I could definitely see Monty kept and one of Underwood/Lee getting cut and hopefully taking Porter's spot on the PS.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Thompson's rosters are always unbalanced after these cuts, so don't be surprised when he carries two TEs (if he deems Havner isn't worthy) or ten LBs. At least, not until cuts made by other teams.

[Harlan Huckleby]

OL (10): Clifton, Colledge, Spitz, Sitton, Barbre, Meredith, Lang, Wells, Giacomini, Dietrich-Smith .

I see three guys here who aren't ready too play. That's too many projects to carry.

I have a hunch Moll is going to make the roster even though he is everybody's favorite cut.

[HarveyWallbangers]

QB (3): Rodgers, Flynn, Brohm
RB (3): Grant, Jackson, Wynn
FB (2): Hall, Johnson
WR (5): Driver, Jennings, Jones, Nelson, Martin
TE (2): Finley, Lee
OL (10): Clifton, Colledge, Spitz, Sitton, Barbre, Wells, Lang, Giacomini, Meredith
DL (6): Jenkins, Pickett, Jolly, Raji, Wynn, Montgomery
OLB (5): Kampman, Matthews, Thompson, Poppinga, Jones
ILB (5): Hawk, Barnett, Chillar, Bishop, Lansanah
S (4): Collins, Smith, Bigby, Bush
CB (6): Harris, Woodson, Williams, Blackmon, Underwood, Lee
ST (3): Crosby, Kapinos, Goode

Depending on the severity of Jackson's injury, Sutton or Lumpkin probably have to stay. If so, I'm having a hard time determining who they cut. Maybe they cut both, see who is cut from other teams at RB--which would buy them some time to work out a trade.

[Brohm]

I'd try to PS Sutton and Lumpkin regardless. Been mentioned a few times that RB is one of the more talented positions in the NFL (quantity and quality). Try to get them both on the PS and keep some more valuable players on the roster (development, 3rd FB, whatever)

[vince]

* I think Sutton has made the team, even over Wynn, who I think may also be kept, even though he's not on my roster.
* I think Martin is a question mark. He didn't help himself tonight, although we know about his body of work, which isn't that impressive either frankly. I saw somewhere where someone suggested keeping only 4 receivers on the 53-man, along with Swain and Heck on the PS to be available in case of injury - and then the 3 fullbacks for Special Teams or 4 RBs, I thought that was interesting, and something I wouldn't be too surprised to see MM and TT do, although I'm not projecting it here.
* Meredith is not ready for primetime (neither is Lang, although he's farther along than Meredith), and if someone else wants to put him on their active roster, more power to 'em. I don't see that happening. Lang is a regular game-day inactive unless injuries belittle the o-line. I'm no Moll fan, but I think he's needed just because he's NFL-ready and can play multiple spots in a pinch.
* Underwood is also not ready for primetime - on many levels. He needs to build up his body and get much better in both run support and pass defense. The ultimate PS candidate.
* While I don't think Brohm played as well as his numbers would indicate, I think he did do well enough to secure his spot, especially in light of Flynn's questionable status. I've been a Brohm critic, and I hope I'm ultimately wrong about him, although he still has a long way to go IMO.
* I think Havner played his way onto the team showing reliable hands and flexibility to contribute in all 3 areas if necessary.
* On a positive note, I've been critical of both Montgomery and Jolly as well going into this season. I think both of them have proven me wrong to some extent thus far with good camps. Kudos to both of them for outplaying my expectations.
* Lansanah and Lee are my last guys in. I think Lee has the ability, but his injuries and lack of practice time have hurt his chances.
* Defensively, the bottom end of the CB position (and NT depending on the status of Raji) scares me the most, on D although Bush does add some insurance because I think he'd be improved in zone coverage scheme if called upon to play corner. Hopefully our top guys can stay healthy.
* Offensively, the bottom of the o-line is the scariest, particularly in pass protection, although I think there are guys who will develop there.
* I know many are down on Rouse mostly because of his poor angles in run support, but I think he's a tough cut. Maybe an IR candidate along with Harrell.

QB (3): Rodgers, Flynn, Brohm
RB (3): Grant, Jackson, Sutton
FB (2): Hall, Johnson
WR (4): Driver, Jennings, Jones, Nelson, Martin
TE (3): Finley, Lee, Havner
OL (9): Clifton, Colledge, Spitz, Sitton, Barbre, Wells, Lang, Giacomini, Moll

DL (6): Jenkins, Pickett, Jolly, Raji, Wynn, Montgomery
OLB (4): Kampman, Matthews, Thompson, Poppinga
ILB (5): Hawk, Barnett, Chillar, Bishop, Lansanah
S (4): Collins, Smith, Bigby, Bush
CB (5): Harris, Woodson, Williams, Blackmon, Lee

ST (3): Crosby, Kapinos, Goode

PS (8): 2 of Heckendorf, Swain and Allen, plus Meredith, Deitrich-Smith, Toribio, Jones, Obiozor, Underwood

* Swain is the guy I'd be least surprised to see lost to another team.

[packrulz]

TT is shopping Moll, Wells, Peprah, Rouse, and maybe Kuhn, that would make the cuts easier. I could see trading for a TE or punter. I'd like to keep both Lumpy and Sutton. http://www.jsonline.com/sports/packers/57139907.html

[Lurker64]

* Defensively, the bottom end of the CB position (and NT depending on the status of Raji) scares me the most

I wouldn't be at all surprised to see Toribio beat out Montomery for the last DL spot. Toribio has certainly played well enough to consider a roster spot, and he makes the numbers work out pretty nicely as you have your defensive line depth chart as:

RDE: Jenkins, J. Wynn.
NT: PIckett, Toribio, Raji
LDE: Raji, Jolly (possibly Montgomery, if he's kept)

That makes the #2 guy at ever DL position at least somewhat competent, which is reassuring.

I don't think Raji has played anywhere near enough at NT in camp to feel comfortable with him as the backup. It's his eventual position, but it's certainly not his current position.

[vince]

* Defensively, the bottom end of the CB position (and NT depending on the status of Raji) scares me the most

I wouldn't be at all surprised to see Toribio beat out Montomery for the last DL spot. Toribio has certainly played well enough to consider a roster spot, and he makes the numbers work out pretty nicely as you have your defensive line depth chart as:

RDE: Jenkins, J. Wynn.
NT: PIckett, Toribio, Raji
LDE: Raji, Jolly (possibly Montgomery, if he's kept)

That makes the #2 guy at ever DL position at least somewhat competent, which is reassuring.

I don't think Raji has played anywhere near enough at NT in camp to feel comfortable with him as the backup. It's his eventual position, but it's certainly not his current position.
I wouldn't mind that Lurk, although the DL rotation in this last game wouldn't seem to indicate that. And Montgomery, cast and all, has played decent. Toribio has also held up in the middle and gotten some penetration (far better than Muhtadi, who's long gone.) Not sure how much learning or additional experience Raji would need at NT to be serviceable either. He may well be as good as or better than Toribio at NT already. I could also see Wynn being sent to the practice squad, rather than Monty cut, in the event that Toribio is kept on the 53-man day 1. In any event, I think Toribio sticks with the team at least on the practice squad in case of emergency and for more development.

[Scott Campbell]

I wouldn't be at all surprised to see Toribio beat out Montomery for the last DL spot.


Where did we get him? I don't remember reading much about him this summer.

[vince]

He signed with Miami last year as an undrafted rookie, and made their practice squad. But they released him toward the end of the year and we picked him up right away and put him on our practice squad. He's still a "first year" guy and would be PS eligible yet.

[Fritz]

I really like Waldo's projected roster, but I also acknowledge Harlan's very good point that in going with that set of offensive linemen, you're taking the same risk you did last year by keeping Flynn/Brohm as backups to Rodgers: you're keeping guys who frankly are not ready, and you're hoping you get lucky on the injury front.

But what KY wrote here hit me because I agree so strongly: "Havner The third cut is where I get pissy. I hate this Havner kid. I know he won't be cut, but I'm cutting him bc I think he is a shitty TE and a non-entity as a LB." I'd rather keep two tight ends and use the extra spot to hang on to a guy who might otherwise get snapped up by another team - the Lions are going to suck anyway this year, so they could afford to keep a guy like Underwood or Meredith if they become available.

I wish we knew more about the severity of Jackson's sprain. If he's going to be back in two or three weeks, I would keep Wynn (he can block) and cut both Lumpkin and Sutton. I guess I'm not as impressed with Sutton as some others. If his role would be primarily third down or change-of-pace, then his biggest responsibility, it seems, would be to pick up blitzers.

So - I'd keep only two tight ends and three halfbacks, and use those two extra spots to keep younger talent, whether it be Underwood or Lee or Meredith or Jones or Obiozor. You could use the practice squad if you have an injury to a running back, and if a TE gets hurt, Havner may well be on your PS, and isn't Bubba Franks still floating around?

[Scott Campbell]

He signed with Miami last year as an undrafted rookie, and made their practice squad. But they released him toward the end of the year and we picked him up right away and put him on our practice squad. He's still a "first year" guy and would be PS eligible yet.



Ahhh. Thanks Vince.

[pbmax]

Isn't the Havner experiment basically an attempt to keep him for special teams? He looked like he had decent hands. My suspicion is that the coaches went through all that trouble for a reason. But I confess KYPack/Fritz's point makes sense. Why keep him if there is better talent to be had at positions of need?

Was he that good at Special Teams?

[Waldo]

I really like Waldo's projected roster, but I also acknowledge Harlan's very good point that in going with that set of offensive linemen, you're taking the same risk you did last year by keeping Flynn/Brohm as backups to Rodgers: you're keeping guys who frankly are not ready, and you're hoping you get lucky on the injury front.

Not really, the only one that is "ready" that is cut is Moll; Moll is terrible. He is no better than Lang or Giacomini at this point.

You can cover the whole line if Breno and Wells are the game day actives, and with some in-game shuffling.

Lang is ready to play as a backup IMO, same as Dietrich-Smith. Dietrich-Smith is better than Preston was, Preston started for the Bills last year. Of course neither of those options would be needed unless one of the game day guys is pressed into full time service, so really they are the backups to the backups.

Meredith is the one that truly isn't ready to see the field at all.

It should be said that between Meredith, Lang, Wells, Dietrich-Smith, and Giacomini, we have an entire backup line to work together on scout team without any risk of losing any of them. At some point you have to keep your best 53, and if any position is close, keep the more valuable/harder to fill position. You can always snag a RB off someone else's PS in an emergency and press him into service right away (like we did with Herron). An OL? Good luck.

[ThunderDan]

* I think Sutton has made the team, even over Wynn, who I think may also be kept, even though he's not on my roster.
* I think Martin is a question mark. He didn't help himself tonight, although we know about his body of work, which isn't that impressive either frankly. I saw somewhere where someone suggested keeping only 4 receivers on the 53-man, along with Swain and Heck on the PS to be available in case of injury - and then the 3 fullbacks for Special Teams or 4 RBs, I thought that was interesting, and something I wouldn't be too surprised to see MM and TT do, although I'm not projecting it here.
* Meredith is not ready for primetime (neither is Lang, although he's farther along than Meredith), and if someone else wants to put him on their active roster, more power to 'em. I don't see that happening. Lang is a regular game-day inactive unless injuries belittle the o-line. I'm no Moll fan, but I think he's needed just because he's NFL-ready and can play multiple spots in a pinch.
* Underwood is also not ready for primetime - on many levels. He needs to build up his body and get much better in both run support and pass defense. The ultimate PS candidate.
* While I don't think Brohm played as well as his numbers would indicate, I think he did do well enough to secure his spot, especially in light of Flynn's questionable status. I've been a Brohm critic, and I hope I'm ultimately wrong about him, although he still has a long way to go IMO.
* I think Havner played his way onto the team showing reliable hands and flexibility to contribute in all 3 areas if necessary.
* On a positive note, I've been critical of both Montgomery and Jolly as well going into this season. I think both of them have proven me wrong to some extent thus far with good camps. Kudos to both of them for outplaying my expectations.
* Lansanah and Lee are my last guys in. I think Lee has the ability, but his injuries and lack of practice time have hurt his chances.
* Defensively, the bottom end of the CB position (and NT depending on the status of Raji) scares me the most, on D although Bush does add some insurance because I think he'd be improved in zone coverage scheme if called upon to play corner. Hopefully our top guys can stay healthy.
* Offensively, the bottom of the o-line is the scariest, particularly in pass protection, although I think there are guys who will develop there.
* I know many are down on Rouse mostly because of his poor angles in run support, but I think he's a tough cut. Maybe an IR candidate along with Harrell.

QB (3): Rodgers, Flynn, Brohm
RB (3): Grant, Jackson, Sutton
FB (2): Hall, Johnson
WR (4): Driver, Jennings, Jones, Nelson, Martin
TE (3): Finley, Lee, Havner
OL (9): Clifton, Colledge, Spitz, Sitton, Barbre, Wells, Lang, Giacomini, Moll

DL (6): Jenkins, Pickett, Jolly, Raji, Wynn, Montgomery
OLB (4): Kampman, Matthews, Thompson, Poppinga
ILB (5): Hawk, Barnett, Chillar, Bishop, Lansanah
S (4): Collins, Smith, Bigby, Bush
CB (5): Harris, Woodson, Williams, Blackmon, Lee

ST (3): Crosby, Kapinos, Goode

PS (8): 2 of Heckendorf, Swain and Allen, plus Meredith, Deitrich-Smith, Toribio, Jones, Obiozor, Underwood

* Swain is the guy I'd be least surprised to see lost to another team.

I agree with you that Meredith and Underwood are going to the practice squad. Both looked horrible last nigh and I would not want them on the field in any situation. Maybe a year on the PS gives them the seasoning they need to figure it out.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I agree with you that Meredith and Underwood are going to the practice squad. Both looked horrible last nigh and I would not want them on the field in any situation. Maybe a year on the PS gives them the seasoning they need to figure it out.

The problem is you can't assume they'll make the practice squad. If the Thompson/McCarthy think they have starter potential down the road, they'll find a way to protect them. There are teams that aren't deep at those positions and have room to keep a developmental type on the roster.

I'm not sure what other teams think of these guys, but we'll know what Thompson/McCarthy think of them by what he does with the roster.

[ThunderDan]

I agree with you that Meredith and Underwood are going to the practice squad. Both looked horrible last nigh and I would not want them on the field in any situation. Maybe a year on the PS gives them the seasoning they need to figure it out.

The problem is you can't assume they'll make the practice squad. If the Thompson/McCarthy think they have starter potential down the road, they'll find a way to protect them. There are teams that aren't deep at those positions and have room to keep a developmental type on the roster.

I'm not sure what other teams think of these guys, but we'll know what Thompson/McCarthy think of them by what he does with the roster.

After last nights game I don't think that will be a problem. If you are a team who drafted a 5th rounder as a project why pick up the Packers 6th and 7th round projects that looked like turds the night before?

[ThunderDan]

Last night Meredith went to a spot and set. It didn't matter what the play call was or what the DE was doing. The DE just rushed deeper 2 or 3 times and had free shots at Brohm. DE wasn't even touched.

[RashanGary]

Clifton/Colledge/Spitz/Sitton/Barbre
Wells, Giacomini, Dietrich, Lang, Moll

If we keep 10, we keep Moll. If we like a guy at another position better than we like Moll at OL, then I could see going 9. If we go 9, I think Moll and Meredith are on the outside. I was impressed with Wells this preseason. He can start in the NFL right now and be really solid. I'd only trade him if we got a 3rd round pick or a player just as good (with just as good of a contract, at a position of higher need), translation - I don't think I'd trade Wells.

[sharpe1027]

Clifton/Colledge/Spitz/Sitton/Barbre
Wells, Giacomini, Dietrich, Lang, Moll

If we keep 10, we keep Moll. If we like a guy at another position better than we like Moll at OL, then I could see going 9. If we go 9, I think Moll and Meredith are on the outside.

Do you keep a guy that has proven over time that he can't cut it? Or do you take a guy that looks even worse, but hasn't played enough to say for certain he will never be a starter?

Tough decisions. :lol:

[RashanGary]

Clifton/Colledge/Spitz/Sitton/Barbre
Wells, Giacomini, Dietrich, Lang, Moll

If we keep 10, we keep Moll. If we like a guy at another position better than we like Moll at OL, then I could see going 9. If we go 9, I think Moll and Meredith are on the outside.

Do you keep a guy that has proven over time that he can't cut it? Or do you take a guy that looks even worse, but hasn't played enough to say for certain he will never be a starter?

Tough decisions. :lol:

Yeah. The more I think about it, the more I think it's 9 and keep another player at another position. I don't dislike Moll as much as many here. He only played one season of OL in college, never played it his whole life. He's had some good moments starting in the NFL, and some inconsistent ones. It took Colledge three years to become a good player and he played OL his whole life. I don't know, I'm not convinced he's a bad player but if they like someone better at another position, I'd be OK cutting Moll even though I think he'll be a solid NFL backup or spot starter for a long time.

[sharpe1027]

Yeah. The more I think about it, the more I think it's 9 and keep another player at another position. I don't dislike Moll as much as many here. He only played one season of OL in college, never played it his whole life. He's had some good moments starting in the NFL, and some inconsistent ones. It took Colledge three years to become a good player and he played OL his whole life. I don't know, I'm not convinced he's a bad player but if they like someone better at another position, I'd be OK cutting Moll even though I think he'll be a solid NFL backup or spot starter for a long time.

Colledge had his ups and downs, but you could see an overall progression in his play. I don't think it is a good comparison.

My main problem with Moll is that he seems to have regressed rather than improve. sure he's had lots of experience, but I think that's all the more reason to get rid of him, since it doesn't seem to have made much of a difference. I don't think he has it in him, he is just to damn inconsistent.

[Harlan Huckleby]

TT is shopping Moll, Wells, Peprah, Rouse, and maybe Kuhn,

Who would trade for Peprah or Moll? Rouse has more value to the Packers then another team, Packers are weak at safety.

Maybe Kuhn has some value.

[sharpe1027]

TT is shopping Moll, Wells, Peprah, Rouse, and maybe Kuhn,

Who would trade for Peprah or Moll? Rouse has more value to the Packers then another team, Packers are weak at safety.

Maybe Kuhn has some value.

I guess it can't hurt to try. I bet the Bills would consider Moll a potential upgrade. Their line is terrible.

[Fritz]

I agree with you that Meredith and Underwood are going to the practice squad. Both looked horrible last nigh and I would not want them on the field in any situation. Maybe a year on the PS gives them the seasoning they need to figure it out.

The problem is you can't assume they'll make the practice squad. If the Thompson/McCarthy think they have starter potential down the road, they'll find a way to protect them. There are teams that aren't deep at those positions and have room to keep a developmental type on the roster.

I'm not sure what other teams think of these guys, but we'll know what Thompson/McCarthy think of them by what he does with the roster.

After last nights game I don't think that will be a problem. If you are a team who drafted a 5th rounder as a project why pick up the Packers 6th and 7th round projects that looked like turds the night before?

Because your turds looked worse than the Packers' turds.

Look, some teams, like the Lions (and apparently the Bills?) are just going to suck this year. The Lions have drafted some projects, sure, but guys like Meredith and Underwood might be players in two or three years, and so the Lions can afford to keep them on the 53 man roster. The guys the Lions might keep instead would be retreads or projects with less upside.

You've got to find a way to keep talent, in my opinion. Miami has a darn serviceable tight end now that the Packers tried to keep on the practice squad last year.

Now, I still think that it's risky keeping so many guys not ready to play. Moll, for all his crappiness, will make fewer mistakes than Meredith.

[vince]

There'll be new guys with the same or better potential coming in next year. This shit happens when the team builds itself up like it has. You lose some guys with "potential." I'm pretty confident we're not talking about Jermichael Finley potential here with either Underwood or Meredith.

I also am beginning to think that Clifton may have a couple years left in him. If he continues to play well and stays healthy this season after getting cleaned up everywhere, I'm sticking with Cliffy over Meredith next year. Otherwise, Colledge may well move out and Lang step in anyway. There's questionable room for Meredith even beyond this year - not to mention the possibility of some big horse being drafted early next draft who'd be better anyway.

[HarveyWallbangers]

There'll be new guys with the same or better potential coming in next year. This shit happens when the team builds itself up like it has. You lose some guys with "potential." I'm pretty confident we're not talking about Jermichael Finley potential here with either Underwood or Meredith.

I also am beginning to think that Clifton may have a couple years left in him. If he continues to play well and stays healthy this season after getting cleaned up everywhere, I'm sticking with Cliffy over Meredith next year. Otherwise, Colledge may well move out and Lang step in anyway. There's questionable room for Meredith even beyond this year - not to mention the possibility of some big horse being drafted early next draft who'd be better anyway.

True, but isn't Colledge a FA after this year?

[pack4to84]

Here's my final roster guess:

QB (2): Rodgers, Flynn,
RB (4): Grant, Jackson, Wynn, Sutton
FB (2): Hall, Johnson
WR (5): Driver, Jennings, Jones, Nelson, Martin
TE (2): Finley, Lee
OL (10): Clifton, Colledge, Spitz, Sitton, Barbre, Meredith, Lang, Wells, Giacomini, Dietrich-Smith
DL (6): Jenkins, Pickett, Jolly, Raji, Wynn, Toribio
OLB (5): Kampman, Matthews, Poppinga, Jones, Thompson
ILB (4): Hawk, Barnett, Bishop, Lansanah
S (4): Smith, Collins, Bigby, Bush
CB (6): Harris, Woodson, Williams, Blackmon, Underwood, Lee

LS: Goode
K: Crosby
P: Kapinos

Trades Chillar and kuhn

[vince]

There'll be new guys with the same or better potential coming in next year. This shit happens when the team builds itself up like it has. You lose some guys with "potential." I'm pretty confident we're not talking about Jermichael Finley potential here with either Underwood or Meredith.

I also am beginning to think that Clifton may have a couple years left in him. If he continues to play well and stays healthy this season after getting cleaned up everywhere, I'm sticking with Cliffy over Meredith next year. Otherwise, Colledge may well move out and Lang step in anyway. There's questionable room for Meredith even beyond this year - not to mention the possibility of some big horse being drafted early next draft who'd be better anyway.

True, but isn't Colledge a FA after this year?
Good point. I'm presuming we use some cap space to lock up Colledge and Spitz in the near future. That may not happen though, which would leave some serious holes.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Mike at GBPG had a similar roster to mine, but he predicts that Lee and Underwood (along with Harrell and perhaps Peprah) will get put on IR.

http://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/ic/blogs/insider/index.shtml

If so, that will open up the roster a little bit. Perhaps Sutton or Lumpkin (because of Jackson's injury) and Havner (because of his special teams play) find a way onto the roster then. If Lee and Underwood are put on IR, then I'd have to take Rouse over Lansanah because it would leave the Packers short in the secondary.

Quarterbacks (3)
Aaron Rodgers, Matt Flynn, Brian Brohm

Running backs (6)
Ryan Grant, Korey Hall, Brandon Jackson, DeShawn Wynn, Tyrell Sutton, Quinn Johnson

Receivers (5)
Greg Jennings, Donald Driver, James Jones, Jordy Nelson, Ruvell Martin

Tight ends (3)
Donald Lee, Jermichael Finley, Spencer Havner

Offensive line (9)
Chad Clifton, Daryn Colledge, Jason Spitz, Josh Sitton, Allen Barbre, Scott Wells, Breno Giacomini, T.J. Lang, Jamon Meredith

Defensive line (6)
Johnny Jolly, Ryan Pickett, Cullen Jenkins, B.J. Raji, Jarius Wynn, Michael Montgomery

Linebacker (9)
Aaron Kampman, Nick Barnett, A.J. Hawk, Clay Matthews, Brady Poppinga, Brandon Chillar, Jeremy Thompson, Desmond Bishop, Brad Jones

Defensive back (9)
Charles Woodson, Al Harris, Nick Collins, Atari Bigby, Tramon Williams, Will Blackmon, Anthony Smith, Jarrett Bush, Aaron Rouse

Specialists (3)
Mason Crosby, Jeremy Kapinos, Brett Goode

IR (4)
Justin Harrell, Patrick Lee, Charlie Peprah, Brandon Underwood

It looks like battles between Sutton and Lumpkin (RB), Hall and Kuhn (FB), Meredith and Moll (OL), Havner and Lansanah (ST). I see RB and TE being two positions that the Packers will be looking closely elsewhere at cuts.

[KYPack]

Is there a limit to the number of players you can IR?

Underwood has a 2 -4 week injury at the most, do you have to have a relatively severe injury?

[HarveyWallbangers]

Is there a limit to the number of players you can IR?

Underwood has a 2 -4 week injury at the most, do you have to have a relatively severe injury?

I'm not sure exactly. I've always thought it's up to the team and player's discretion. I've seen guys with minor injuries put on IR. Some get released later in the year. Underwood and Lee might see the benefit of another year of development while getting their full salary.

[pbmax]

For IR, you just need to be injured at the time of the designation. The problem used to be that teams would stash healthy prospects on that list. Length of injury is not considered. If Meredith had had the good sense to go down in a heap, he could have saved Tony Moll's job.

As for Colledge and FA, making a roster call on just that is tough. If there is no new CBA or extension, the rules in 2010 mean he and the rest of the class will be RFAs. Neither T2 nor any other GM will know this prior to cutdowns.

[pbmax]

Where is Patler to point out that I had this wrong!?


Andrew Brandt at National Football Post (http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/The-harsh-truth-about-cutdown-day.html)[/b]]This is also the time when players are placed on reserve/injured with injuries that are, uh, season-ending. Officially, the team doctor has to certify that the injury is “major,” which qualifies it for a minimum six-week time frame and can leave the upper time limit indefinite. As to confirming the veracity of such injuries, the league has spot-checkers who appear at team headquarters to check on them. However, this seldom happens; in my nine years with the Packers, I encountered one spot-checker.

[KYPack]

Could you put 3 guys on it?

I doubt GB will do that, but it could be done, no?

[pbmax]

Could you put 3 guys on it?

I doubt GB will do that, but it could be done, no?
I think so. I have not heard of a limit before.

[SnakeLH2006]

Bedard is worse than 90% of the Rat Posters. He sucks much fucking ass....and then some. Fuck JSO.

[packrulz]

Mike at GBPG had a similar roster to mine, but he predicts that Lee and Underwood (along with Harrell and perhaps Peprah) will get put on IR.

http://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/ic/blogs/insider/index.shtml

If so, that will open up the roster a little bit. Perhaps Sutton or Lumpkin (because of Jackson's injury) and Havner (because of his special teams play) find a way onto the roster then. If Lee and Underwood are put on IR, then I'd have to take Rouse over Lansanah because it would leave the Packers short in the secondary.

Quarterbacks (3)
Aaron Rodgers, Matt Flynn, Brian Brohm

Running backs (6)
Ryan Grant, Korey Hall, Brandon Jackson, DeShawn Wynn, Tyrell Sutton, Quinn Johnson

Receivers (5)
Greg Jennings, Donald Driver, James Jones, Jordy Nelson, Ruvell Martin

Tight ends (3)
Donald Lee, Jermichael Finley, Spencer Havner

Offensive line (9)
Chad Clifton, Daryn Colledge, Jason Spitz, Josh Sitton, Allen Barbre, Scott Wells, Breno Giacomini, T.J. Lang, Jamon Meredith

Defensive line (6)
Johnny Jolly, Ryan Pickett, Cullen Jenkins, B.J. Raji, Jarius Wynn, Michael Montgomery

Linebacker (9)
Aaron Kampman, Nick Barnett, A.J. Hawk, Clay Matthews, Brady Poppinga, Brandon Chillar, Jeremy Thompson, Desmond Bishop, Brad Jones

Defensive back (9)
Charles Woodson, Al Harris, Nick Collins, Atari Bigby, Tramon Williams, Will Blackmon, Anthony Smith, Jarrett Bush, Aaron Rouse

Specialists (3)
Mason Crosby, Jeremy Kapinos, Brett Goode

IR (4)
Justin Harrell, Patrick Lee, Charlie Peprah, Brandon Underwood

It looks like battles between Sutton and Lumpkin (RB), Hall and Kuhn (FB), Meredith and Moll (OL), Havner and Lansanah (ST). I see RB and TE being two positions that the Packers will be looking closely elsewhere at cuts.
This looks about right but I'd rather let Havner and Lansanah go, let Kuhn backup at TE, keep Lumpy, and put Sutton on the PS, keep Lee active, he needs the reps. There's a lot of good rookie RB's this year, I really doubt any team would claim Sutton since he's short and slow. I think Underwood would stick on the PS too.
Practice Squad: Sutton, Underwood, Swain, Toribio, Obiozor, Evan Dietrich-Smith.

[Fritz]

That's a fantasy practice squad, I think. From most accounts, such as Bedard's, Obiozor wouldn't last five minutes after being cut.

[pbmax]

Bedard has updated his roster.

He has Lumpkin making it with Sutton over Wynn, who had a lackluster 2.9 YPC in preseason. Says he knows this will cost them pass blocking on 3rd down.

Joe Porter is your fifth CB as he now has Lee going on IR and Underwood cut or given an injury settlement.

Rouse gets the call of Peprah. Bedard's says his latest info on Peprah's injury (from last week) is that the cause is still unknown.

Also warns that the scout who brought Brad Jones to the Packers attention (Lenny McGill) is now the assistant to the assistant traveling secretary in defense deficient Denver (actually he is the Asst. Director of College Scouting).

[Fritz]

Joe Porter, though. Why him?

[pbmax]

Tom Pelissero's 53 from the Green Bay Pres Gazette (http://www.packersnews.com/ic/blogs/insider/2009/09/pelisseros-53.html)

QB
Now (3): Rodgers*, Flynn, Brohm.

RUNNING BACKS
Now (5): Grant*, Jackson, Wynn, Hall*, Johnson.

RECEIVERS
Now (5): Jennings*, Driver*, Nelson, Jones, Martin.

TIGHT ENDS
Now (3): Lee*, Finley, Havner/waivers.

OFFENSIVE LINE
Now (9): LT Clifton*, LG Colledge*, C Spitz*, RG Sitton*, RT Barbre*, Wells, Lang, Giacomini, Meredith.

DEFENSIVE LINE
Now (6): LE Jolly*, NT Pickett*, RE Jenkins*, Raji, Montgomery, Wynn.

LINEBACKERS
Now (9): LOLB Kampman*, MILB Hawk*, WILB Barnett*, ROLB Poppinga*, Matthews, Thompson, Chillar, Bishop, Jones.

DEFENSIVE BACKS
Now (10): CB Harris*, CB Woodson*, FS Collins*, SS Bigby*, Smith, Williams, Blackmon, Bush, Rouse, Lee/waivers.

SPECIALISTS
Now (3): K Crosby, LS Goode, P Kapinos.

PRACTICE SQUAD
Sutton, Lumpkin, Swain, Dietrich-Smith, Toribio, Talley, Lansanah and Underwood.

[pbmax]

Joe Porter, though. Why him?
For the fifth CB spot, he is assuming that neither Lee nor Underwood will be ready early enough. If they keep four, Blackmon is a depth chart #4 and he is injured. That would leave the backup job to Jarret Bush.

Basically he thinks they need a healthy body more than they need J BUsh at CB anytime soon :lol:

[mraynrand]

That's a fantasy practice squad, I think. From most accounts, such as Bedard's, Obiozor wouldn't last five minutes after being cut.

Too bad he didn't suffer a severe injury in the final preseason game - you could have stashed him on IR.

[pbmax]

This blog roster from Rob Demovsky (http://www.packersnews.com/ic/blogs/insider/2009/09/demovskys-53.html) probably breaks the questions down the best. First are his guarantees, then the battles for the last spots.


Demovsky's 53
When compiling a mock 53-man roster, one thing that can’t be known is which players will be available on the waiver wire or via trade. General Manager Ted Thompson has typically made a move or two on the day of the final cuts or the day after.

But taking the current 75-man roster and trimming it to 53 shouldn’t be that difficult. In fact, at first glance, there are probably 49 players almost assured of a spot, barring a trade.

Here are those 49:

Quarterbacks (3)
Aaron Rodgers, Matt Flynn, Brian Brohm

Running backs (4)
Ryan Grant, Brandon Jackson, DeShawn Wynn, Quinn Johnson

Receivers (5)
Greg Jennings, Donald Driver, James Jones, Jordy Nelson, Ruvell Martin

Tight ends (2)
Donald Lee, Jermichael Finley

Offensive line (8)
Chad Clifton, Daryn Colledge, Jason Spitz, Josh Sitton, Allen Barbre, Scott Wells, Breno Giacomini, T.J. Lang,

Defensive line (6)
Johnny Jolly, Ryan Pickett, Cullen Jenkins, B.J. Raji, Michael Montgomery, Jarius Wynn

Linebacker (9)
Aaron Kampman, Nick Barnett, A.J. Hawk, Brady Poppinga, Brandon Chillar, Clay Matthews, Jeremy Thompson, Desmond Bishop, Brad Jones

Defensive back (9)
Al Harris, Charles Woodson, Tramon Williams, Will Blackmon, Nick Collins, Atari Bigby, Anthony Smith, Aaron Rouse, Jarrett Bush

Specialists (3)
Mason Crosby, Jeremy Kapinos, Brett Goode.

The remaining four roster spots probably come from this pool of players: CB Pat Lee, CB Brandon Underwood, S Charlie Peprah, RB Tyrell Sutton, RB Kregg Lumpkin, FB John Kuhn, FB Korey Hall, LB/TE Spencer Havner, G/T Tony Moll, DE Justin Harrell.

Lee (knee), Underwood (stinger), Peprah (knee) and Harrell (back) are strong candidates for injured reserve, so take them out of the mix.

The injuries in the defensive backfield could complicate things, but the guess here is they'll have enough healthy bodies for the opener from that group of nine.

One of the two fullbacks will make it. It’s a close call, but give the nod to Hall.

That leaves three spots. Another halfback could stick, especially if Jackson’s ankle injury would keep him out of the regular-season opener against Chicago. Sutton gets the nod over Lumpkin.

That leaves two spots. Havner has been a regular on all the No. 1 special teams, and his value as a three-way player gets him a spot.

Now the last spot. It has to be an offensive lineman. The question here is whether they think Meredith would be claimed by another team. If so, they have to keep him instead of Moll. But Meredith isn’t NFL ready. Like many linemen, he needs a year to develop. If they think no one would put Meredith on a roster, then they could sneak him through to the practice squad and keep Moll. But Moll’s salary ($1.01 million) seems awfully high for a backup.

As with Bedard, this roster guess presumes no trades or waiver pickups.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Get rid of Giacomini and try luck with the NFL scrap heap.

[Fritz]

That's a fantasy practice squad, I think. From most accounts, such as Bedard's, Obiozor wouldn't last five minutes after being cut.

Too bad he didn't suffer a severe injury in the final preseason game - you could have stashed him on IR.

Uhhh....he did. It was, uh, a, uh, . . . . head injury. Yeah, that's the ticket.

Sigh. Ted could learn from us.

[Tarlam!]

Get rid of Giacomini and try luck with the NFL scrap heap.

Yeah right, and in-so-doing have Wisconsin declare war on Brazil. You have a lot to learn about world piece, Blue Dog.

[KYPack]

Get rid of Giacomini and try luck with the NFL scrap heap.

Jocko is a LOOOOONG way from playing NFL OT against vets. He's the kind of guy you kept in the 70's. Nowadays, if you keep Breno, you are probably just training him for another team.

[pbmax]

EH! Wrong thread. :oops:

[Fritz]

Get rid of Giacomini and try luck with the NFL scrap heap.

Jocko is a LOOOOONG way from playing NFL OT against vets. He's the kind of guy you kept in the 70's. Nowadays, if you keep Breno, you are probably just training him for another team.

Why, KY? Are you saying that if he's kept and gets better, if Barbe works out at RT you'll lose Giacomini anyway? I'm not quite sure what you're saying and if you're agreeing with Harlan that he should be ditched.