Rodgers' Toughness

[Kiwon]

Remember all the hand wringing a couple of years ago over concerns that A-Rod was not physically tough enough to last a season?

There were reasons, of course. It did seem like he got hurt every time he entered a game as a fill-in for Farve. But last season, he answered all the critics and had a great "rookie" season. He proved he's a real pro, even playing hurt.

So I was disturbed to see how many hits he took yesterday. Of course, that was mainly the result of the Bears' aggressive D and the shoddy play of the Pack's O-line.

But what else was going on? Is Rodgers not as elusive as Farve? Were the routes, especially in the first half, too long? Did he hold the ball too long? Not enough shot gun and roll-outs?

Rodgers won't last the whole season if yesterday was indicative of the next 15 games.

[CaptainKickass]

All I know is that I was constantly yelling at Arod (ok, yelling at the TV) to STEP THE HELL UP in the pocket.

Yeah Ogunleye was speed rushing past Barbre, but there were at least a half dozen snaps where Arod was looking to throw but just didn't step up or side step into the damn pocket to buy himself that extra second or 2.

Arod WAS doing all of that in the pre-season games. Dude looked like he had the "6th sense" and was able to feel the pressure and just take a step or 2 to deliver the ball. I did not see that from him at all last night.

.

[MOBB DEEP]

All I know is that I was constantly yelling at Arod (ok, yelling at the TV)

lol

[HarveyWallbangers]

He didn't have a chance on many of those Barbre whiffs. He mostly got blasted when he ran out of the pocket. I think he was mostly trying to do what he could to let guys get open. And they did come open. Unfortunately, he was usually pressured as he threw it. Personally, I don't think you can do much evaluation on it. Barbre got whipped so badly, so soon on many of those plays that it would have been hard for Rodgers to do anything. (The play where he got the safety was his responsibility though.)

Think of the plays to Driver. If Driver catches the first one, people would be praising Rodgers for hanging tough and looking downfield. On the other play to Driver, he did the same thing but just had to get rid of the ball quicker than he wanted. I'm not worried. Rodgers showed last year he can make plays down the field in those same situations.

[Partial]

My only complaint about his toughness was the slide at the end of the game, but even that isn't a huge gripe. He ran through it and took the third on the previous third down so it was just a little strange to me. He's pretty damn big now so I doubt he will shy away from contact.

[Dabaddestbear]

All I know is that I was constantly yelling at Arod (ok, yelling at the TV) to STEP THE HELL UP in the pocket.

Yeah Ogunleye was speed rushing past Barbre, but there were at least a half dozen snaps where Arod was looking to throw but just didn't step up or side step into the damn pocket to buy himself that extra second or 2.

Arod WAS doing all of that in the pre-season games. Dude looked like he had the "6th sense" and was able to feel the pressure and just take a step or 2 to deliver the ball. I did not see that from him at all last night.

.
If you listened to and saw Rodgers in his post game he explained that the Bears had a new defense that he hasnt seen before that was taking away the slants. I believe that had a lot to do with him stepping up in the pocket. He normally is doing that when he is hitting someone on the slant, but since the Bears took that away he chose to keep rolling out.

[boiga]

I was quite happy to see the slide actually. He had two defenders converging on him at top speed and slid underneath the hit. He didn't have a chance of getting the first. If he'd dived, he'd have gotten sandwiched between them and snapped into two pieces.

I'd rather have third and 1 than Flynn trying to make that TD pass as a substitute.

[Noodle]

Interesting thread, Kiwon, especially your comparison of the type of hits Rodgers took compared to Favre.

Now, I'm mostly remembering Favre for the last 8 years or so, but I really can't recall him getting lit up in the way Urlacher just drilled Rodgers. Favre was uncommonly good at avoiding that kind of blow, and I'd like to see Rodgers develop that skill set over the next few years.

I'd rather have my qb be the slippery eel rather than the stout oak. Because in the NFL, there's always going to be a bigger, badder oak.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I was quite happy to see the slide actually. He had two defenders converging on him at top speed and slid underneath the hit. He didn't have a chance of getting the first. If he'd dived, he'd have gotten sandwiched between them and snapped into two pieces.

I'd rather have third and 1 than Flynn trying to make that TD pass as a substitute.

Exactly. He's made some dumb moves in the past to try to gain extra yards (and got blasted). I could see if he had to beat one guy, but there was no way he was going to run over two Bear defenders coming in to destroy him. I think Collinsworth missed the boat on that one.

[Kiwon]

I was quite happy to see the slide actually. He had two defenders converging on him at top speed and slid underneath the hit. He didn't have a chance of getting the first. If he'd dived, he'd have gotten sandwiched between them and snapped into two pieces.

I'd rather have third and 1 than Flynn trying to make that TD pass as a substitute.

Exactly. He's made some dumb moves in the past to try to gain extra yards (and got blasted). I could see if he had to beat one guy, but there was no way he was going to run over two Bear defenders coming in to destroy him. I think Collinsworth missed the boat on that one.

Yeah, CC was wrong there. A-Rod's not going to bowl over two guys flying toward him.

Besides, Rodgers is so smart he planned to scramble for 9 yards and then throw the winning 50-yard TD pass on 3rd and 1.

Brett who? :P

[Scott Campbell]

Now, I'm mostly remembering Favre for the last 8 years or so, but I really can't recall him getting lit up in the way Urlacher just drilled Rodgers. Favre was uncommonly good at avoiding that kind of blow, and I'd like to see Rodgers develop that skill set over the next few years.


Favre avoided the big hit yesterday, but he looked SLOW. Somebody is going to crush him.

[bobblehead]

Interesting thread, Kiwon, especially your comparison of the type of hits Rodgers took compared to Favre.

Now, I'm mostly remembering Favre for the last 8 years or so, but I really can't recall him getting lit up in the way Urlacher just drilled Rodgers. Favre was uncommonly good at avoiding that kind of blow, and I'd like to see Rodgers develop that skill set over the next few years.

I'd rather have my qb be the slippery eel rather than the stout oak. Because in the NFL, there's always going to be a bigger, badder oak.

If Uhrlacher hit favre like that there would have been a flag.

[Scott Campbell]

But what else was going on? Is Rodgers not as elusive as Favre?


He's a better runner, but he's not as elusive as Favre WAS. Even Favre's spidey sense can't save him from his 40 year old legs anymore.

[oregonpackfan]

Agreed.

[Cheesehead Craig]

I was quite happy to see the slide actually. He had two defenders converging on him at top speed and slid underneath the hit. He didn't have a chance of getting the first. If he'd dived, he'd have gotten sandwiched between them and snapped into two pieces.

I'd rather have third and 1 than Flynn trying to make that TD pass as a substitute.

Exactly. He's made some dumb moves in the past to try to gain extra yards (and got blasted). I could see if he had to beat one guy, but there was no way he was going to run over two Bear defenders coming in to destroy him. I think Collinsworth missed the boat on that one.

Like Collinsworth ever went over the middle and took a hit. I get a kick out of him going after other players to do what he wouldn't.

[mraynrand]

Interesting thread, Kiwon, especially your comparison of the type of hits Rodgers took compared to Favre.

Now, I'm mostly remembering Favre for the last 8 years or so, but I really can't recall him getting lit up in the way Urlacher just drilled Rodgers. Favre was uncommonly good at avoiding that kind of blow, and I'd like to see Rodgers develop that skill set over the next few years.

I'd rather have my qb be the slippery eel rather than the stout oak. Because in the NFL, there's always going to be a bigger, badder oak.

If Uhrlacher hit favre like that there would have been a flag.

AARP would have filed a complaint too.

[gbgary]

Interesting thread, Kiwon, especially your comparison of the type of hits Rodgers took compared to Favre.

Now, I'm mostly remembering Favre for the last 8 years or so, but I really can't recall him getting lit up in the way Urlacher just drilled Rodgers. Favre was uncommonly good at avoiding that kind of blow, and I'd like to see Rodgers develop that skill set over the next few years.

I'd rather have my qb be the slippery eel rather than the stout oak. Because in the NFL, there's always going to be a bigger, badder oak.

If Uhrlacher hit favre like that there would have been a flag.

AARP would have filed a complaint too.

:lol:

[Pugger]

Interesting thread, Kiwon, especially your comparison of the type of hits Rodgers took compared to Favre.

Now, I'm mostly remembering Favre for the last 8 years or so, but I really can't recall him getting lit up in the way Urlacher just drilled Rodgers. Favre was uncommonly good at avoiding that kind of blow, and I'd like to see Rodgers develop that skill set over the next few years.

I'd rather have my qb be the slippery eel rather than the stout oak. Because in the NFL, there's always going to be a bigger, badder oak.

If Uhrlacher hit favre like that there would have been a flag.

AARP would have filed a complaint too.

:rs: :lol:

[MichiganPackerFan]

If Uhrlacher hit favre like that there would have been a flag.

Not necessarily. Urlacher is a cheap shot artist. He hit farve with a solid shot well after he was out of bounds a couple seasons back and no flag. Urlacher is allowed his typical cheap shots like Shaq is allowed routine travelling and player control fouls.

[Deputy Nutz]

I was quite happy to see the slide actually. He had two defenders converging on him at top speed and slid underneath the hit. He didn't have a chance of getting the first. If he'd dived, he'd have gotten sandwiched between them and snapped into two pieces.

I'd rather have third and 1 than Flynn trying to make that TD pass as a substitute.

Exactly. He's made some dumb moves in the past to try to gain extra yards (and got blasted). I could see if he had to beat one guy, but there was no way he was going to run over two Bear defenders coming in to destroy him. I think Collinsworth missed the boat on that one.

He slid and gained nine yards, if he would have tucked and rolled he would have gotten the first down by plenty. Was it worth it, hind sight says no, but if they would have failed on 3rd down and 4th down to get the first everyone would be slandering Rodgers and calling him a pussy.

[HarveyWallbangers]

He slid and gained nine yards, if he would have tucked and rolled he would have gotten the first down by plenty. Was it worth it, hind sight says no, but if they would have failed on 3rd down and 4th down to get the first everyone would be slandering Rodgers and calling him a pussy.

Did you ever call out Favre when he did this a lot late in his career? I didn't. Maybe if he had one guy to beat or if he ran out of bounds when he had a chance to pick up the extra yard. This was entirely different. Look at the replay. He actually got a good spot. He slid two yards short. With those two Bears coming at him like they were, I think it's far from a given that he gets the first down.

[cheesner]

Interesting thread, Kiwon, especially your comparison of the type of hits Rodgers took compared to Favre.

Now, I'm mostly remembering Favre for the last 8 years or so, but I really can't recall him getting lit up in the way Urlacher just drilled Rodgers. Favre was uncommonly good at avoiding that kind of blow, and I'd like to see Rodgers develop that skill set over the next few years.

I'd rather have my qb be the slippery eel rather than the stout oak. Because in the NFL, there's always going to be a bigger, badder oak.
In Favre's early years he would take some big hits, and occassionally give out a few. In fact, in his first few years he would generally start a game erratically. He would overthrow receivers and throw bullets when an easy catchable pass would have worked. It seemed he needed to get his bell rung for him to settle down and play well. When watching with my buddies we would actually cheer when Brett got blasted because we knew he would then start lighting it up.

Anyone else remember it that way?

[Cheesehead Craig]

I was quite happy to see the slide actually. He had two defenders converging on him at top speed and slid underneath the hit. He didn't have a chance of getting the first. If he'd dived, he'd have gotten sandwiched between them and snapped into two pieces.

I'd rather have third and 1 than Flynn trying to make that TD pass as a substitute.

Exactly. He's made some dumb moves in the past to try to gain extra yards (and got blasted). I could see if he had to beat one guy, but there was no way he was going to run over two Bear defenders coming in to destroy him. I think Collinsworth missed the boat on that one.

He slid and gained nine yards, if he would have tucked and rolled he would have gotten the first down by plenty. Was it worth it, hind sight says no, but if they would have failed on 3rd down and 4th down to get the first everyone would be slandering Rodgers and calling him a pussy.

Nope. Look at the replay, the Bears defenders were already in front of the first down marker when he started his slide. Not a chance in hell that he gets that first down unless he suddenly morphed into Adrian Peterson.

[mraynrand]

He slid and gained nine yards, if he would have tucked and rolled he would have gotten the first down by plenty. Was it worth it, hind sight says no, but if they would have failed on 3rd down and 4th down to get the first everyone would be slandering Rodgers and calling him a pussy.

Did you ever call out Favre when he did this a lot late in his career? I didn't. Maybe if he had one guy to beat or if he ran out of bounds when he had a chance to pick up the extra yard. This was entirely different. Look at the replay. He actually got a good spot. He slid two yards short. With those two Bears coming at him like they were, I think it's far from a given that he gets the first down.

http://s453.photobucket.com/albums/qq254/mraynrand/?action=view&current=favrebailout.flv

[gbgary]

if he would have tucked and rolled he would have gotten the first down by plenty.


if he'd have tucked and rolled they'd have killed him. they dove in leading with their helmets.


i was one of those that though he was going to be fragile. he's proven otherwise. he's got heart too.

[Little Whiskey]

i was one of those that though he was going to be fragile. he's proven otherwise. he's got heart too.

+1

[MOBB DEEP]

2...

[chain_gang]

I don't think rodgers makes it if he dives forward. Honestly if he would've stayed up it looked like he would've be decapitated. I'll take a 3rd and 1 rather than 3 and inches, if it means our QB is IR'd in week 1.

Favre has done a lot worse than this, and no one has really questioned his toughness. Remember the 2004 Packer/Vike Playoff game in Lambeau? This is a playoff game mind you.

Here ya go...

Go to 2:11 and see...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jxAQPupmxLQ

[MOBB DEEP]

Redic imho to compare aaron's and favre's toughness; thats the biggest thing favre is known for the past 20 years...

aaron is tough enough on own merit and much faster and atletic than brett coulda ever hoped to be

[Deputy Nutz]

He slid and gained nine yards, if he would have tucked and rolled he would have gotten the first down by plenty. Was it worth it, hind sight says no, but if they would have failed on 3rd down and 4th down to get the first everyone would be slandering Rodgers and calling him a pussy.

Did you ever call out Favre when he did this a lot late in his career? I didn't. Maybe if he had one guy to beat or if he ran out of bounds when he had a chance to pick up the extra yard. This was entirely different. Look at the replay. He actually got a good spot. He slid two yards short. With those two Bears coming at him like they were, I think it's far from a given that he gets the first down.

I wasn't calling it a bad decision to slide, my point is that Packer Nation would be pissed right now if a 50 yard completion didn't happen on 3rd and 1 and they didn't get the first down and the game ended in a Bears victory, a key sticking point would be that Rodgers didn't sell out .

I didn't mention anything about Favre, but since you did, you can bet your bottom dollar that at 25 years old Brett Favre wasn't sliding a yard in front of a first down marker with the game on the line like that.

[Kiwon]

I don't think rodgers makes it if he dives forward. Honestly if he would've stayed up it looked like he would've be decapitated. I'll take a 3rd and 1 rather than 3 and inches, if it means our QB is IR'd in week 1.

Favre has done a lot worse than this, and no one has really questioned his toughness. Remember the 2004 Packer/Vike Playoff game in Lambeau? This is a playoff game mind you.

Here ya go...

Go to 2:11 and see...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jxAQPupmxLQ

Yeah, Farve was terrible that game.

LOL, the "mooning" incident. Remember all the righteous indignation that Moss took? I was one of the offended. Now 5 years later it seems as funny as offensive.

[Patler]

I didn't mention anything about Favre, but since you did, you can bet your bottom dollar that at 25 years old Brett Favre wasn't sliding a yard in front of a first down marker with the game on the line like that.

Hard to know for sure, Favre didn't have the option of sliding to avoid a hit, so the mentality was to get what you could, because they would nail you on the ground anyway. How many young QBs do that now? Most coaches implore their QBs not to sell out their health in that situation.

On the flip side, if he had put his head down to try and get the extra yard, and FUMBLED, many on here would call him an idiot for doing it on 2nd down. Or if he got blasted between both defenders, and hurt his shoulder like last year, again many would chastise him for being foolish.

It was only second down. If you can't pick up a first down with 3rd and 1, I wouldn't pin the blame on Rodgers for not have pretended he was a fullback on 2nd down.

If it were a playoff game, the Super Bowl, or even just 4th down (maybe 3rd) that would be different.