Rouse released

[KYPack]

GBP website announces that the Pack signed S Matt Giordano to the active roster, released S Aaron Rouse and signed T Dane Randolph to the practice squad. Ted Thompson, Executive Vice President, General Manager and Director of Football Operations, announced the transactions Wednesday.

Giordano , a fourth-round selection in the 2005 NFL Draft from California, he played in 55 games, including six starts, for the Colts. He will wear No. 47.


Whoa!

[ThunderDan]

Holy Batdung!!!

That completely surprised me. :shock:

[CaptainKickass]

WTF?


How the hell exactly... is Rouse worse than Bush @ safety?

I am perplexed.

.

[PackerTimer]

Holy Batdung!!!

That completely surprised me. :shock:

This is a surprise.

[Fritz]

So the team didn't bring in an extra safety...it brought in a replacement safety.

So the team believes Geordano (or whatever his name is) is better than Rouse.

Interesting.

Wasn't Dane Randolph on the practice squad here at some point? Or in camp?

[Tarlam!]

I wish Rouse all the best on his NFL journey and thank him for his services to my favourite football team.

We Are The Green Bay Packers!

[denverYooper]

Yowza!

[KYPack]

We Are The Green Bay Packers!

& We are changin' every day, it seems.

[Scott Campbell]

I wish they'd give Bigby an injury settlement.

[Tarlam!]

We Are The Green Bay Packers!

& We are changin' every day, it seems.

Two things are a definite in our world, KY: Taxes and Change. I can't garantee you anything else...'cept death, maybe.

[sharpe1027]

So the team didn't bring in an extra safety...it brought in a replacement safety.

So the team believes Geordano (or whatever his name is) is better than Rouse.

Interesting.

Wasn't Dane Randolph on the practice squad here at some point? Or in camp?

Rouse may have been a question mark in terms of his injury status, making the move easier to make.

[Waldo]

Rouse sucked.

Thank god.

Even if the guys that replace him suck, there is a chance that they might not in the future. Rouse will still suck in the future.

For being a "veteran", Rouse was a huge liability against the run and pass when in the game, his whole career.

[gbgary]

no more ROUSE TO THE HOUSE?

[Kiwon]

http://static.nfl.com/static/content/public/image/getty/headshot/G/I/O/GIO563610.jpg - IN http://static.nfl.com/static/content/public/image/getty/headshot/R/O/U/ROU320232.jpg - OUT

[KYPack]

Rouse sucked.

Thank god.

Even if the guys that replace him suck, there is a chance that they might not in the future. Rouse will still suck in the future.

For being a "veteran", Rouse was a huge liability against the run and pass when in the game, his whole career.

Yeah, Rouse had his problems to say the least.

A huge liability against the run and pass? Where did he excel? At the team buffet line?

But he started at S for us against the Bengals. Last week. We are cutting starters and replacing them with other teams' cast-offs. That ain't real cool.

I think the move was prompted by Tampa signing Corey Lynch from the Bengals PS. I'll gaurantee TT was looking at Lynch as well. He was a pretty good hand.

Rouse had the worst game of his pro career against Cincy. Chris Henry beat him by 3 strides on that fade to slant route in the end zone on Sunday. I think he was pretty good vs the run, but man, the guy could not cover.

[mmmdk]

Bye, bye Rouse!

Brett Swain can play emergency CB :roll: and Chuck can play safety. Not that such a puzzle in our secondary depth makes that much sense.

[Partial]

So we have zero healthy bodies that played safety during camp... Scary!

[packers11]

Collins needs to get back ASAP, why the fk didn't they keep Smith? :(

[PackerTimer]

Hopefully Bigby and Collins get healthy. We need those guys healthy back there.

[Waldo]

So we have zero healthy bodies that played safety during camp... Scary!

Bush played S all camp.

I'm pretty sure that Underwood took S snaps as well, splitting between CB and S.

Underwood was always pretty good against the run.

[Packgator]

http://indyfootballreport.com/index.php/archives/2640


Indianapolis Colts 2009 veteran breakdown: S Matt Giordano
Jul.21, 2009

So, when Giordano — a fourth-round selection by the Colts in the 2005 NFL Draft — tested the free-agent market this past offseason, he said he was far from disappointed when the best opportunity that arose was re-signing with the team that selected him:

My wife and I were ecstatic to be back. It was great to come back. I played four seasons here with the Colts. They drafted me and it’s always good to come back and be loyal to the team that trusted you first.

Giordano’s return further solidified an already-deep safety group, a unit that includes a pair of Pro Bowl selections – Bob Sanders (2005, 2007) and Antoine Bethea (2007) – as well as third-year veteran Melvin Bullitt, who started nine games last season.

Giordano, who has started six of 55 games in four seasons, has three career interceptions, and along with second-year veteran Jamie Silva, he gives the Colts unusual depth at the spot.

Said Giordano: We saw our depth last season. We saw it at safety, and we saw it at corner, and there shouldn’t be any worry, because we’re all experienced. We are very experienced and we should be a very solid group this year. These past few seasons we have established ourselves. Everybody is talented in their own ways, but we work well together. No matter who is in the game, we can execute together and that’s what counts.

Re-signing Giordano not only gave the Colts needed depth at the safety position, it marked the return of one of their top special teams players. Defensive tackle Darrell Reid and Giordano formed the core of the Indianapolis leadership group on special teams last season, and with Reid signing with the Denver Broncos, Giordano is the most experienced key returner on the unit.

Giordano in four seasons has 34 special teams tackles, and last season he had 26 tackles on defense and 13 on special teams.

Said Giordano: When we found out we were going to be back, I kind of thought, ‘You know, I need to step up and be more of a leader this year – not just by actions, but by being more vocal. It’s one thing to be voval, but I have to be a leader on and off the field and with the details – being on time to meetings and everything like that.

And while special teams is important, Giordano said it’s not his sole focus:

You can’t be satisfied. Things you’re somewhat good at you have to continue to improve. The things I feel like were more weaknesses, I put extra time in this year to make sure they’re my strengths. I’d say it’s going to be a great year if I improve on the things I’ve set out to improve on, and also if I expand my role as a special teams player, but msotly it will be a successful year if we’re hoisting that Super Bowl trophy one more time.

IFR Analysis: When the Colts re-signed Giordano this offseason, it was an important move in the same sense re-signing LBs Tyjuan Hagler and Freddy Keiaho were important moves. They are solid veteran players who may not necessarily be core-level, franchise player but who provide solid depth and experience within the system. Those sorts of signings are relatively rare in the free-agency/salary cap era of the NFL, but re-signing a player such as Giordano allows for continuity on special teams and in the reserve secondary that often is lacking. Giordano is one of the Colts’ fastest players and in addition to being a leader on special teams, he can play at a high level for a few games if injuries hit in the secondary.

Comments (1)

One Comment on “Indianapolis Colts 2009 veteran breakdown: S Matt Giordano”

July 22nd, 2009 at 2:00 pm

I’m suprised Matt did not get a chance to compete for a starting spot with another team.
Matt has played well when given his chance, behind a stable of Pro-Bowl Safeties.
Thrilled to have him on the roster, and I love the speed and hard hitting he brings to the team.

[Packgator]

Indy fans react to Giordano's release........

http://forum.colts.com/showthread.php?t=44449

[Patler]

Collins needs to get back ASAP, why the fk didn't they keep Smith? :(

Because they acquired Derrick Martin at the end of camp. People keep forgetting him. Smith out, Martin in; just like Rouse out, Giordano in.

[Partial]

So we have zero healthy bodies that played safety during camp... Scary!

Bush played S all camp.

I'm pretty sure that Underwood took S snaps as well, splitting between CB and S.

Underwood was always pretty good against the run.

I didn't know Underwood made the roster. I thought that was last year with Bush and he made the roster as a CB/ST this year?

[red]

i just don't get most if not all of tt's in season moves

hall and kuhn must be double teaming TT on a daily basis

[KYPack]

So we have zero healthy bodies that played safety during camp... Scary!

Bush played S all camp.

I'm pretty sure that Underwood took S snaps as well, splitting between CB and S.

Underwood was always pretty good against the run.

I didn't know Underwood made the roster. I thought that was last year with Bush and he made the roster as a CB/ST this year?

Underwood can't play safety. Shit, he is just beginning to learn the CB job. He's a year or so from being a back-up S, as well. he may have lined up there in Pre or on scout, but S in a league game?

No way.

He was in college last year at Cincy.

[Tarlam!]

Indy fans react to Giordano's release........

http://forum.colts.com/showthread.php?t=44449

Thanks for digging that up and posting it. Appreciate it.

[Waldo]

So we have zero healthy bodies that played safety during camp... Scary!

Bush played S all camp.

I'm pretty sure that Underwood took S snaps as well, splitting between CB and S.

Underwood was always pretty good against the run.

I didn't know Underwood made the roster. I thought that was last year with Bush and he made the roster as a CB/ST this year?

Underwood can't play safety. Shit, he is just beginning to learn the CB job. He's a year or so from being a back-up S, as well. he may have lined up there in Pre or on scout, but S in a league game?

No way.

He was in college last year at Cincy.

If he was so bad and raw, why is he on the 53 man roster?

CB isn't a big thieving position on the waiver market.

Underwood played both in college.

Either a guy can play or he can't. Raw players can play, they are just mistake prone.

We are still talking the backup to our backups.

Would he be a liability? Yup. Any more than Rouse? Probably not.

Upside that Rouse doesn't have? Yup.

He is certainly a more physical player than Rouse (despite his size) and a pretty good tackler. Good at covering? Not really, but has the physical upside to excel. Any worse than Rouse in coverage? He's probably better. If he has the good sense to not let anybody get behind him, chances are he's better than Rouse.

Keep in mind who the comparison point for Underwood is. It's not Nick Collins. It is Aaron Rouse, and honestly, I've been so unsold on Rouse for over a year, that I'd put Underwood on the field over him.

Same concept as Carroll vs. Dendy. Did Dendy suck? For sure. As much as Carrol? No. It was addition by subtraction. Cutting Carroll and bringing in a bunch of no name CB's for tryouts to fill out the depth and the PS is how we found Tramon. If they wouldn't have given up on Carroll and cut him after that Philly game, chances are Tramon would not be a Packer.

When you can identify that a guy is never going to be a player, cut him, there is no point in hanging on. Rouse sucked on ST anyway. Rouse was no better than a raw rookie on the field.

[Bossman641]

Very strange timing. I'm not sad to see Rouse gone, but the thought of Bush and still-learning-the-playbook Martin at safety has me worried.

Hurry back Collins

[rbaloha1]

Rouse looked too tentative at safety. Maybe should bulk-up and play as a dime lb.

[SkinBasket]

Hopefully Bigby and Collins get healthy. We need those guys healthy back there.

Hopefully Collins gets healthy and Bigby dies of his injuries so we can use his roster spot for someone who can play football.

[Waldo]

Rouse looked too tentative at safety. Maybe should bulk-up and play as a dime lb.

The concept of a dime linebacker is that he has to be able to cover, and be good enough to sniff out a draw or QB sneak and chase it down.

Maybe we should play Chillar at SS? Tampa has a linebacker that jumped back to play SS.

[pbmax]

Collins needs to get back ASAP, why the fk didn't they keep Smith? :(
Normally I would get on here and yell at you for not telling me who you would cut to keep him.

But since they just released one safety to sign another, its a great question. Why was Rouse on the roster ahead of Smith?

The only explanation would be that with all the injuries, they cannot afford a Safety who can only play near the LOS. They have to be able to do both. Or perhaps Collins is going to be gone longer than first anticipated and Special Teams considerations are out the door.

In answer to KYPack, I agree Rouse offerred something beyond what Waldo gives him credit for. He could play the run and hit somebody. But he was very awkward in the open field. Not exactly the guy you want as the last line of defense (run or pass) to make an open field tackle.

[pbmax]

So we have zero healthy bodies that played safety during camp... Scary!

Bush played S all camp.

I'm pretty sure that Underwood took S snaps as well, splitting between CB and S.

Underwood was always pretty good against the run.
Except that after every hard, awkward hit, he came out for a play or two. I wonder if he has gained any weight from 185 during the last three weeks?

[pbmax]

Collins needs to get back ASAP, why the fk didn't they keep Smith? :(

Because they acquired Derrick Martin at the end of camp. People keep forgetting him. Smith out, Martin in; just like Rouse out, Giordano in.
That doesn't cover the order of the moves. If the Martin/Smith move was straightforward a better player, then why was Rouse kept ahead of Smith?

The new guy has been available (on waivers or from PS) since roster cutdown. Something changed in the calculus of Rouse.

[Waldo]

Rouse was injured most of preseason and really didn't have a good chance to prove himself to Dom on the field.

Once he was finally healthy and had his chance to show what he could do....

They cut him.

[mraynrand]

I don't have the video of the game with me, but I'm pretty sure Rouse was involved in one of the special team fuck ups as well as the 3rd and 34 fuck up. Defensive coordinators have been fired for giving up 26 yards on a critical down, so why not a backup safety on 34? Giordano not only helps teams and safety, but he can bring in the best stuffed pizza there is.

http://www.viewpoints.com/images/review/2007/276/18/1191453797-08076_full.jpg

[FritzDontBlitz]

I am not understanding the logic of claiming you're short handed at a position, then signing one player at the position while releasing another. Giordano better be damn good, because there's no backup plan if he falters...

[pbmax]

I don't have the video of the game with me, but I'm pretty sure Rouse was involved in one of the special team fuck ups as well as the 3rd and 34 fuck up. Defensive coordinators have been fired for giving up 26 yards on a critical down, so why not a backup safety on 34? Giordano not only helps teams and safety, but he can bring in the best stuffed pizza there is.
Yes, and in Packer history that kind of swift decision making on coordinators (Donatell) brought us Bob Slowik, who was dumb enough to give Sherman the defense he was asking for.

Hopefully, this works out better.

[FritzDontBlitz]

I don't have the video of the game with me, but I'm pretty sure Rouse was involved in one of the special team fuck ups as well as the 3rd and 34 fuck up. Defensive coordinators have been fired for giving up 26 yards on a critical down, so why not a backup safety on 34? Giordano not only helps teams and safety, but he can bring in the best stuffed pizza there is.
Yes, and in Packer history that kind of swift decision making on coordinators (Donatell) brought us Bob Slowik, who was dumb enough to give Sherman the defense he was asking for.

Hopefully, this works out better.

Ouch.

[Waldo]

I don't have the video of the game with me, but I'm pretty sure Rouse was involved in one of the special team fuck ups as well as the 3rd and 34 fuck up. Defensive coordinators have been fired for giving up 26 yards on a critical down, so why not a backup safety on 34? Giordano not only helps teams and safety, but he can bring in the best stuffed pizza there is.

He was also the one that gave up Coles TD, and was supposed to be the deep safety on the fleaflicker.

I get a sense from a lot of people that dug in to the tape of the game (I don't have a copy of this one), that Rouse had a worse game than Carroll had against Philly, that a good % of Cincy's offense was generated by targeting Rouse in a variety of ways.

They way they targeted our LB's in their run fits with offensive lineman (which they did exceptionally well, including using the U-71 for extra oomph), tackling the runner becomes the responsibility of the SS. He is the extra hat.

[mraynrand]

I don't have the video of the game with me, but I'm pretty sure Rouse was involved in one of the special team fuck ups as well as the 3rd and 34 fuck up. Defensive coordinators have been fired for giving up 26 yards on a critical down, so why not a backup safety on 34? Giordano not only helps teams and safety, but he can bring in the best stuffed pizza there is.
Yes, and in Packer history that kind of swift decision making on coordinators (Donatell) brought us Bob Slowik, who was dumb enough to give Sherman the defense he was asking for.

Hopefully, this works out better.

I share your hope. Right now, the Packers would be a lot better off with a Mike Prior type who is assignment sure and knows how to tackle - in the defensive backfield and on special teams.

[Fritz]

There may also be - may - reasons we're not privy to that don't include talent or disciplkine or work ethic. What we might call "off the field" issues.

For example, maybe he brought crappy pizza to team meetings, while Giordano clearly has access to better 'za.

[Waldo]

Like I said, bring up Donatell for Slowick, however Carroll for Dendy is much more appropriate. This administration, same general area of the team (secondary), a player not a coach, and similar means of fixing the hole.

I think that most people agree that the team improved by cutting Carroll.

[Cheesehead Craig]

Hopefully Bigby and Collins get healthy. We need those guys healthy back there.

Hopefully Collins gets healthy and Bigby dies of his injuries so we can use his roster spot for someone who can play football.

OK, I lol'd here at work on that one.

[mraynrand]

I don't have the video of the game with me, but I'm pretty sure Rouse was involved in one of the special team fuck ups as well as the 3rd and 34 fuck up. Defensive coordinators have been fired for giving up 26 yards on a critical down, so why not a backup safety on 34? Giordano not only helps teams and safety, but he can bring in the best stuffed pizza there is.

He was also the one that gave up Coles TD, and was supposed to be the deep safety on the fleaflicker.

If I recall, that Coles TD was the one where Woodson released the WR to the safety and there was no safety there, he was looking for the run about a yard off the LOS.

Later, on a critical down, T. Will released the WR to the safety, and the safety was way late. To be fair to Rouse, this was noticeable through the entire preseason - when the defensive backfield was playing zone, the handoff of receivers from the corners to the safeties was marginal at best, leaving pretty big gaps. If there is no/reduced pass rush, that gets exposed right away.

[KYPack]

Collins needs to get back ASAP, why the fk didn't they keep Smith? :(
Normally I would get on here and yell at you for not telling me who you would cut to keep him.

But since they just released one safety to sign another, its a great question. Why was Rouse on the roster ahead of Smith?

The only explanation would be that with all the injuries, they cannot afford a Safety who can only play near the LOS. They have to be able to do both. Or perhaps Collins is going to be gone longer than first anticipated and Special Teams considerations are out the door.

In answer to KYPack, I agree Rouse offerred something beyond what Waldo gives him credit for. He could play the run and hit somebody. But he was very awkward in the open field. Not exactly the guy you want as the last line of defense (run or pass) to make an open field tackle.

I'll answer both you and Waldo in the same reply.

PB, Re Rouse: I was more making a joke than nailing Waldo back. I mean, a guy who is weak against the run and the pass at S? What is his area of functionality, exactly? Rouse was one of the worst peekers I've ever seen. Til he learns to read the keys and play his reads, he'll never be an NFL safety.

Underwood did play a little safety at UC, but it was mainly as a robber in an 8 in the box scheme. He deserves to be on the roster. Good instincts and raw talent. Green as goose shit as a corner. He is no NFL safety and won't be one this season. Even if we play him there.

[pbmax]

I don't have the video of the game with me, but I'm pretty sure Rouse was involved in one of the special team fuck ups as well as the 3rd and 34 fuck up. Defensive coordinators have been fired for giving up 26 yards on a critical down, so why not a backup safety on 34? Giordano not only helps teams and safety, but he can bring in the best stuffed pizza there is.

He was also the one that gave up Coles TD, and was supposed to be the deep safety on the fleaflicker.

If I recall, that Coles TD was the one where Woodson released the WR to the safety and there was no safety there, he was looking for the run about a yard off the LOS.

Later, on a critical down, T. Will released the WR to the safety, and the safety was way late. To be fair to Rouse, this was noticeable through the entire preseason - when the defensive backfield was playing zone, the handoff of receivers from the corners to the safeties was marginal at best, leaving pretty big gaps. If there is no/reduced pass rush, that gets exposed right away.
Unless the Packers are rushing more than five, in most of Capers schemes, there will be three across zone in the back. Not always, but generally. The most basic look is six in zone, four rush and one to decide what to do at the LOS.

So if Wood was 1 yard off the LOS, then I would think there should be someone behind him in the deep 1/3. Not just the single deep safety.

[denverYooper]

There may also be - may - reasons we're not privy to that don't include talent or disciplkine or work ethic. What we might call "off the field" issues.

For example, maybe he brought crappy pizza to team meetings, while Giordano clearly has access to better 'za.

...and Martin rolled a much tighter J. Rouse's were always canoeing and shit.

[KYPack]

I don't have the video of the game with me, but I'm pretty sure Rouse was involved in one of the special team fuck ups as well as the 3rd and 34 fuck up. Defensive coordinators have been fired for giving up 26 yards on a critical down, so why not a backup safety on 34? Giordano not only helps teams and safety, but he can bring in the best stuffed pizza there is.

He was also the one that gave up Coles TD, and was supposed to be the deep safety on the fleaflicker.

If I recall, that Coles TD was the one where Woodson released the WR to the safety and there was no safety there, he was looking for the run about a yard off the LOS.

Later, on a critical down, T. Will released the WR to the safety, and the safety was way late. To be fair to Rouse, this was noticeable through the entire preseason - when the defensive backfield was playing zone, the handoff of receivers from the corners to the safeties was marginal at best, leaving pretty big gaps. If there is no/reduced pass rush, that gets exposed right away.
Unless the Packers are rushing more than five, in most of Capers schemes, there will be three across zone in the back. Not always, but generally. The most basic look is six in zone, four rush and one to decide what to do at the LOS.

So if Wood was 1 yard off the LOS, then I would think there should be someone behind him in the deep 1/3. Not just the single deep safety.

Yer right, PB, but not on that play.

When they send 5 they play 3-3 in the back of the blitz. Two corners deep is called "sky", two safeties is 'cloud'.

This situation was some kind of Capers hybrid. The played 9 guys within a yard of the LOS with two safeties. At the snap, rouse went the wrong way and Coles was wide open for the six. On those two touchdowns on Rouse, he wasn't in the vicinity of the receiver.

It was bad and helped get the guy's ass cut.

[Guiness]

There may also be - may - reasons we're not privy to that don't include talent or disciplkine or work ethic. What we might call "off the field" issues.

For example, maybe he brought crappy pizza to team meetings, while Giordano clearly has access to better 'za.

Maybe he punched a coach?

[KYPack]

There may also be - may - reasons we're not privy to that don't include talent or disciplkine or work ethic. What we might call "off the field" issues.

For example, maybe he brought crappy pizza to team meetings, while Giordano clearly has access to better 'za.

Maybe he punched a coach?

You love that rumor, don't ya?

[pbmax]

There may also be - may - reasons we're not privy to that don't include talent or disciplkine or work ethic. What we might call "off the field" issues.

For example, maybe he brought crappy pizza to team meetings, while Giordano clearly has access to better 'za.

Maybe he punched a coach?
Poor Frtiz is going to get really confused again. :lol:

[Guiness]

WTF?


How the hell exactly... is Rouse worse than Bush @ safety?

I am perplexed.

.

I'm sure it's the ST thing again. Neither of them is what we want at safety, and Rouse doesn't play ST (or at least, not as well as Bush). I'm guessing the possibility that Rouse would develop into a starter is what they were hoping, but after this last game they decided no way.

[pbmax]

I don't have the video of the game with me, but I'm pretty sure Rouse was involved in one of the special team fuck ups as well as the 3rd and 34 fuck up. Defensive coordinators have been fired for giving up 26 yards on a critical down, so why not a backup safety on 34? Giordano not only helps teams and safety, but he can bring in the best stuffed pizza there is.

He was also the one that gave up Coles TD, and was supposed to be the deep safety on the fleaflicker.

If I recall, that Coles TD was the one where Woodson released the WR to the safety and there was no safety there, he was looking for the run about a yard off the LOS.

Later, on a critical down, T. Will released the WR to the safety, and the safety was way late. To be fair to Rouse, this was noticeable through the entire preseason - when the defensive backfield was playing zone, the handoff of receivers from the corners to the safeties was marginal at best, leaving pretty big gaps. If there is no/reduced pass rush, that gets exposed right away.
Unless the Packers are rushing more than five, in most of Capers schemes, there will be three across zone in the back. Not always, but generally. The most basic look is six in zone, four rush and one to decide what to do at the LOS.

So if Wood was 1 yard off the LOS, then I would think there should be someone behind him in the deep 1/3. Not just the single deep safety.

Yer right, PB, but not on that play.

When they send 5 they play 3-3 in the back of the blitz. Two corners deep is called "sky", two safeties is 'cloud'.

This situation was some kind of Capers hybrid. The played 9 guys within a yard of the LOS with two safeties. At the snap, rouse went the wrong way and Coles was wide open for the six. On those two touchdowns on Rouse, he wasn't in the vicinity of the receiver.

It was bad and helped get the guy's ass cut.
Thanks for the info KYP. Makes sense now.

I really have to think about putting a sacrificial lamb of a computer in the DMZ and just download the Bit Torrent of the game. Not having a DVR is really hindering my ability to waste time at work. :lol:

[Dabaddestbear]

Indy fans react to Giordano's release........

http://forum.colts.com/showthread.php?t=44449
Seems like a sweet and sour pickup for you guys. Fast on ST, but can't cover as a safety :?

[pbmax]

Indy fans react to Giordano's release........

http://forum.colts.com/showthread.php?t=44449
Seems like a sweet and sour pickup for you guys. Fast on ST, but can't cover as a safety :?
Just make sure the Bears send us a thank you note when you guys pick up Rouse, OK? :)

[Dabaddestbear]

I don't have the video of the game with me, but I'm pretty sure Rouse was involved in one of the special team fuck ups as well as the 3rd and 34 fuck up. Defensive coordinators have been fired for giving up 26 yards on a critical down, so why not a backup safety on 34? Giordano not only helps teams and safety, but he can bring in the best stuffed pizza there is.

http://www.viewpoints.com/images/review/2007/276/18/1191453797-08076_full.jpg
YES!!! You may just whoo some Chicago fans over with this pickup. :wink:
Some of the best Pizza in the Midwest!

[Dabaddestbear]

Indy fans react to Giordano's release........

http://forum.colts.com/showthread.php?t=44449
Seems like a sweet and sour pickup for you guys. Fast on ST, but can't cover as a safety :?
Just make sure the Bears send us a thank you note when you guys pick up Rouse, OK? :)
Please dont curse us with that. We have our own problems trying to find a solid free safety. But I think you guys may be using the Pizza guy when Capers want to send the safety on blitz, utilizing his speed.

[Patler]

Even if Giordano is no better than Rouse he may be more valuable than Rouse. Weren't they "hopeful" that Rouse could play this weekend, following a stinger on Sunday? The guy played only a little, but has been hurt a lot. When they needed him last year he was hurt, too.

[KYPack]

Even if Giordano is no better than Rouse he may be more valuable than Rouse. Weren't they "hopeful" that Rouse could play this weekend, following a stinger on Sunday? The guy played only a little, but has been hurt a lot. When they needed him last year he was hurt, too.

I was just about to ask the same question. With Rouse, it was hard to tell when he was hurt. He played about the same, injured as healthy. You'd imagine an injury settlement might pop up in this move.

They have to start Bush and Martin, don't they? I mean, Giordano is just off the boat, pun intended.

[pbmax]

Even if Giordano is no better than Rouse he may be more valuable than Rouse. Weren't they "hopeful" that Rouse could play this weekend, following a stinger on Sunday? The guy played only a little, but has been hurt a lot. When they needed him last year he was hurt, too.

I was just about to ask the same question. With Rouse, it was hard to tell when he was hurt. He played about the same, injured as healthy. You'd imagine an injury settlement might pop up in this move.

They have to start Bush and Martin, don't they? I mean, Giordano is just off the boat, pun intended.
Collins practiced according to JSO and Bedard.

Inspired by PFT Headline: Safety Dance (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HcOZ6xFxJqg)

[mmmdk]

I don't have the video of the game with me, but I'm pretty sure Rouse was involved in one of the special team fuck ups as well as the 3rd and 34 fuck up. Defensive coordinators have been fired for giving up 26 yards on a critical down, so why not a backup safety on 34? Giordano not only helps teams and safety, but he can bring in the best stuffed pizza there is.

http://www.viewpoints.com/images/review/2007/276/18/1191453797-08076_full.jpg

Stuffed pizza? WTF is that?? Kalories galore???

Best pizza in the world is found in southern Italy; Naples & Rome.

[Waldo]

Collins needs to get back ASAP, why the fk didn't they keep Smith? :(
Normally I would get on here and yell at you for not telling me who you would cut to keep him.

But since they just released one safety to sign another, its a great question. Why was Rouse on the roster ahead of Smith?

The only explanation would be that with all the injuries, they cannot afford a Safety who can only play near the LOS. They have to be able to do both. Or perhaps Collins is going to be gone longer than first anticipated and Special Teams considerations are out the door.

In answer to KYPack, I agree Rouse offerred something beyond what Waldo gives him credit for. He could play the run and hit somebody. But he was very awkward in the open field. Not exactly the guy you want as the last line of defense (run or pass) to make an open field tackle.

I'll answer both you and Waldo in the same reply.

PB, Re Rouse: I was more making a joke than nailing Waldo back. I mean, a guy who is weak against the run and the pass at S? What is his area of functionality, exactly? Rouse was one of the worst peekers I've ever seen. Til he learns to read the keys and play his reads, he'll never be an NFL safety.

Underwood did play a little safety at UC, but it was mainly as a robber in an 8 in the box scheme. He deserves to be on the roster. Good instincts and raw talent. Green as goose shit as a corner. He is no NFL safety and won't be one this season. Even if we play him there.

Paraphrasing:

Rouse - He currently sucks, and most likely he will forever suck.

Underwood - He currently sucks, there is a chance that one day he won't suck.

[KYPack]

Fair enough, Waldo.

I, too, like Underwood. He was nowhere for a bit at Ohio State and worked his way back into football at UC. Geat athlete, still green.

[sheepshead]

I love when TT makes a move that all the self aggrandizing NFL GM's didnt even contemplate.

[mission]

If you've never had Giordano's pizza then you're seriously missing out ... probably my favorite... anywhere. Ever. :worship:

(kinda like an in-n-out burger of pizza)

This Giordano guy sounds like an immediate improvement over Rouse. If he really was responsible for ALL of those plays suggested then I'm glad he's gone. Been saying he's a super liability in the defensive backfield and that his few flashes of ball vision are nothing more than a distraction from the truth.

They're saying this whiteboy has serious speed... maybe a bit tight in the hips but it's hard to really know when he's playing behind pro bowl safeties.

[rbaloha1]

Fair enough, Waldo.

I, too, like Underwood. He was nowhere for a bit at Ohio State and worked his way back into football at UC. Geat athlete, still green.

Sporting News loves this pick. The guy possesses long arms, athletic ability and speed. SN projects BU to be a future shutdown corner. Looked too tentative in preseason. Lets not give up on this kid.

[mmmdk]

If you've never had Giordano's pizza then you're seriously missing out ... probably my favorite... anywhere. Ever. :worship:

(kinda like an in-n-out burger of pizza)

Ok, thanx :)

[sheepshead]

I don't have the video of the game with me, but I'm pretty sure Rouse was involved in one of the special team fuck ups as well as the 3rd and 34 fuck up. Defensive coordinators have been fired for giving up 26 yards on a critical down, so why not a backup safety on 34? Giordano not only helps teams and safety, but he can bring in the best stuffed pizza there is.

http://www.viewpoints.com/images/review/2007/276/18/1191453797-08076_full.jpg

Nice, the Rush street store no less! I'm a Lou Malnatis guy myself, Giordano's a close second.

[Fritz]

There may also be - may - reasons we're not privy to that don't include talent or disciplkine or work ethic. What we might call "off the field" issues.

For example, maybe he brought crappy pizza to team meetings, while Giordano clearly has access to better 'za.

Maybe he punched a coach?

Maybe he punched a baby.

[Cheesehead Craig]

Stuffed pizza? WTF is that?? Kalories galore???

Best pizza in the world is found in southern Italy; Naples & Rome.

Had some in both of those cities, it was phenominal.

You know, they make a good pizza in NY too.

[Bossman641]

Collins practiced according to JSO and Bedard.

Thank god

The thought of Bush and Martin back there trying to coordinate the defense is terrifying.

[Brando19]

Wow. I'm very suprised they released Rouse.

[pbmax]

There may also be - may - reasons we're not privy to that don't include talent or disciplkine or work ethic. What we might call "off the field" issues.

For example, maybe he brought crappy pizza to team meetings, while Giordano clearly has access to better 'za.

Maybe he punched a coach?

Maybe he punched a baby.
Maybe he is dating Mike McCarthy's daughter?

[pbmax]

Wow. I'm very suprised they released Rouse.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, but where in the world is you favorite pizza?

[MichiganPackerFan]

Wow. I'm very suprised they released Rouse.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, but where in the world is you favorite pizza?

Really enjoy Giordano's but it's going to be a long time before I get back to Chicago...

I've found a couple local joints, one in MI one in VA that serve a good pie too. All stems from the crust: if that's not good, no topping or sauce can save it. While the deep dish is good, i think I almost like a good hand tossed better, with fresh sauce and toppings. As far as NY goes, I never need to eat a paper thin piece that has to be folded. Oh, Rouse sucked balls. What's to lose by replacing him?

[Tyrone Bigguns]

the best pizza in america is made right here in Phx. www.pizzeriabianco.com


So says: Bon Appetit, NYT, Oprah. james beard winning chef. Case closed.

Drawback: Only 7 pies on the menu, no parties over 10, 2 hour wait.

[KYPack]

the best pizza in america is made right here in Phx. www.pizzeriabianco.com


So says: Bon Appetit, NYT, Oprah. james beard winning chef. Case closed.

Drawback: Only 7 pies on the menu, no parties over 10, 2 hour wait.

Well sure.

You got all those guys in the witness protection program.

They're gonna want some good pie.

[Deputy Nutz]

the best pizza in america is made right here in Phx. www.pizzeriabianco.com


So says: Bon Appetit, NYT, Oprah. james beard winning chef. Case closed.

Drawback: Only 7 pies on the menu, no parties over 10, 2 hour wait.

Sounds like a downer.

[Deputy Nutz]

Collins needs to get back ASAP, why the fk didn't they keep Smith? :(
Normally I would get on here and yell at you for not telling me who you would cut to keep him.

But since they just released one safety to sign another, its a great question. Why was Rouse on the roster ahead of Smith?

The only explanation would be that with all the injuries, they cannot afford a Safety who can only play near the LOS. They have to be able to do both. Or perhaps Collins is going to be gone longer than first anticipated and Special Teams considerations are out the door.

In answer to KYPack, I agree Rouse offerred something beyond what Waldo gives him credit for. He could play the run and hit somebody. But he was very awkward in the open field. Not exactly the guy you want as the last line of defense (run or pass) to make an open field tackle.

I'll answer both you and Waldo in the same reply.

PB, Re Rouse: I was more making a joke than nailing Waldo back. I mean, a guy who is weak against the run and the pass at S? What is his area of functionality, exactly? Rouse was one of the worst peekers I've ever seen. Til he learns to read the keys and play his reads, he'll never be an NFL safety.

Underwood did play a little safety at UC, but it was mainly as a robber in an 8 in the box scheme. He deserves to be on the roster. Good instincts and raw talent. Green as goose shit as a corner. He is no NFL safety and won't be one this season. Even if we play him there.

Paraphrasing:

Rouse - He currently sucks, and most likely he will forever suck.

Underwood - He currently sucks, there is a chance that one day he won't suck.

Rouse is a combine guy, everyone loves a safety that is 6-3 220 pounds and can run and jump, but he was a disappointment at V-Tech for a reason, he has no instincts and can't contribute significantly in the pass or the run game. He does get lucky by guessing or getting lost in the QB's read, like in the Colts game last year.

[Bretsky]

So we have zero healthy bodies that played safety during camp... Scary!

Bush played S all camp.

I'm pretty sure that Underwood took S snaps as well, splitting between CB and S.

Underwood was always pretty good against the run.


Rouse may be sub par; he may suck. So does Bush.

And we're bringing in castaways to replace a guy who started last week. Scary crap. Apparently our well was pretty dry at Safety this year after the starters...if you count Bigby as one. Underwood was not too impressive.

Dam good thing we play the Rams

[Bretsky]

Collins needs to get back ASAP, why the fk didn't they keep Smith? :(
Normally I would get on here and yell at you for not telling me who you would cut to keep him.

But since they just released one safety to sign another, its a great question. Why was Rouse on the roster ahead of Smith?

In answer to KYPack, I agree Rouse offerred something beyond what Waldo .

:bclap: :bclap: :bclap: :bclap: :bclap:

[Waldo]

So we have zero healthy bodies that played safety during camp... Scary!

Bush played S all camp.

I'm pretty sure that Underwood took S snaps as well, splitting between CB and S.

Underwood was always pretty good against the run.


Rouse may be sub par; he may suck. So does Bush.

And we're bringing in castaways to replace a guy who started last week. Scary crap. Apparently our well was pretty dry at Safety this year after the starters...if you count Bigby as one. Underwood was not too impressive.

Dam good thing we play the Rams

Interesting that not only are the guys being brought in to replace Rouse and Smith both safeties, both are also noted ST players, namely gunners.

Would not surprise me at all if Bush is next, once Giordano is up to speed, Bush gets the axe and TT goes PS pilfering.

In fact, I would be mildly surprised if Bush is still a Packer as of week 9.

[digitaldean]

If Bush is still a Packer by week 9, then he must one helluva stash of incriminating photos on the Packer brass.... :lol:

[rbaloha1]

If Bush is still a Packer by week 9, then he must one helluva stash of incriminating photos on the Packer brass.... :lol:

I know I know pre season is overrated. Bush looked assignment sure in pre season.

[Partial]

I actually think Bush gets way more crap than he deserves. I think he's a very solid 5th corner and special teams dynamo.

I predict that Rouse is picked up by a 3-4 team. The odds are against it, though. I think he'd make a really good rover player. The Pack should have used his length to blitz off of the edge.

[Brando19]

Wow. I'm very suprised they released Rouse.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, but where in the world is you favorite pizza?


Michaelangelo's Pizza...I love it.

[mission]

I actually think Bush gets way more crap than he deserves. I think he's a very solid 5th corner and special teams dynamo.

I predict that Rouse is picked up by a 3-4 team. The odds are against it, though. I think he'd make a really good rover player. The Pack should have used his length to blitz off of the edge.

Why? Because "people say" he's unblockable as a gunner? Not to mention he's good for plenty of ST penalties and boneheaded plays whenever he has an opportunity. I can't seem to recall one play in the same league of plays that I remember Steve Tasker (a real special teams dynamo) making on the regular. Maybe you could help refresh my memory.

The whole question I've had has finally been flushed out here in this thread... yall finally came around. :)

Why was Rouse on the team ahead of Smith in the first place?

[Tyrone Bigguns]

the best pizza in america is made right here in Phx. www.pizzeriabianco.com


So says: Bon Appetit, NYT, Oprah. james beard winning chef. Case closed.

Drawback: Only 7 pies on the menu, no parties over 10, 2 hour wait.

Well sure.

You got all those guys in the witness protection program.

They're gonna want some good pie.

Naw, they are all at durant's.

"good friends, great steaks, and the best booze, are the necessities of life."

Jack Durant

[mmmdk]

Stuffed pizza? WTF is that?? Kalories galore???

Best pizza in the world is found in southern Italy; Naples & Rome.

Had some in both of those cities, it was phenominal.

You know, they make a good pizza in NY too.

Very cool, I've been to Naples once and Rome twice. My family & I were in Garda town (second trip) earlier this year but pizza ain't their strongest game - they make super bigoli with clam & squid plus other great fish dishes. Soups too.

NY has numerous great restaurants - even great curry dishes.

French food is overrated but local dishes from Provence are superb.

[mraynrand]

Steve Tasker got tossed out of his final game. Does Bush have to be a Steve Tasker to play teams. To be fair, you can't put up with a moron who gets motion penalties on teams, but Bush has been an effective teams guy. But let's be honest, should we be talking about this now. OK, say Collins and Rugby are healthy, we still are not set at safety. Shouldn't this have been addressed in the off season?? Who wants to dig up the 'available FA safeties' thread or the 'Safeties in the draft' thread. I don't care what TT thinks of Rugby, the position should have been upgraded.

[Partial]

I actually think Bush gets way more crap than he deserves. I think he's a very solid 5th corner and special teams dynamo.

I predict that Rouse is picked up by a 3-4 team. The odds are against it, though. I think he'd make a really good rover player. The Pack should have used his length to blitz off of the edge.

Why? Because "people say" he's unblockable as a gunner? Not to mention he's good for plenty of ST penalties and boneheaded plays whenever he has an opportunity. I can't seem to recall one play in the same league of plays that I remember Steve Tasker (a real special teams dynamo) making on the regular. Maybe you could help refresh my memory.

The whole question I've had has finally been flushed out here in this thread... yall finally came around. :)

Why was Rouse on the team ahead of Smith in the first place?

Him and Tracy White made a zillion big times special teams play in 2007. They're not needed any more, though, as Brett Swain is the real deal

[mission]

Steve Tasker got tossed out of his final game. Does Bush have to be a Steve Tasker to play teams. To be fair, you can't put up with a moron who gets motion penalties on teams, but Bush has been an effective teams guy. But let's be honest, should we be talking about this now. OK, say Collins and Rugby are healthy, we still are not set at safety. Shouldn't this have been addressed in the off season?? Who wants to dig up the 'available FA safeties' thread or the 'Safeties in the draft' thread. I don't care what TT thinks of Rugby, the position should have been upgraded.

No but to be called a "special teams dynamo" by Partial he better at least be in the same ballpark. :)

[KYPack]

Bush is a good troop and all, but he's a lunkhead.

He had two ST penalties last week fer chrisskes. They finally took him off the punt team so they could get the punt off.

[SkinBasket]

Him and Tracy White made a zillion big times special teams play in 2007. They're not needed any more, though, as Brett Swain is the real deal

2007....


2007...........


Great. Of course I cannot recall one great ST play from 2007. Maybe you could spark our memory. Give us one of those zillion plays so we have some hope.

[Partial]

Him and Tracy White made a zillion big times special teams play in 2007. They're not needed any more, though, as Brett Swain is the real deal

2007....


2007...........


Great. Of course I cannot recall one great ST play from 2007. Maybe you could spark our memory. Give us one of those zillion plays so we have some hope.

Eagles game.

[Fritz]

Bush is a good troop and all, but he's a lunkhead.

He had two ST penalties last week fer chrisskes. They finally took him off the punt team so they could get the punt off.

Yeah, for a guy whose offer from Tennessee was matched because he was so important to special teams, that's not so good - you have to pull him just to get the damn play off.

This is a weird season already. A solid victory over the Rams will make the world seem a little more normal.

[SkinBasket]

I'm totally on the Bush bandwagon now. Start him. He's obviously awesome. Or he was 2 years ago. For a day.

[Scott Campbell]

Bush is a good troop and all, but he's a lunkhead.

He had two ST penalties last week fer chrisskes. They finally took him off the punt team so they could get the punt off.

Yeah, for a guy whose offer from Tennessee was matched because he was so important to special teams, that's not so good - you have to pull him just to get the damn play off.

This is a weird season already. A solid victory over the Rams will make the world seem a little more normal.


Yeah, he got the penalties. But he's been the top ST gunner for a long time now.

[SkinBasket]

Bush is a good troop and all, but he's a lunkhead.

He had two ST penalties last week fer chrisskes. They finally took him off the punt team so they could get the punt off.

Yeah, for a guy whose offer from Tennessee was matched because he was so important to special teams, that's not so good - you have to pull him just to get the damn play off.

This is a weird season already. A solid victory over the Rams will make the world seem a little more normal.


Yeah, he got the penalties. But he's been the top ST gunner for a long time now.

He's great at being swallowed up by blockers.

[pbmax]

Bush is a good troop and all, but he's a lunkhead.

He had two ST penalties last week fer chrisskes. They finally took him off the punt team so they could get the punt off.

Yeah, for a guy whose offer from Tennessee was matched because he was so important to special teams, that's not so good - you have to pull him just to get the damn play off.

This is a weird season already. A solid victory over the Rams will make the world seem a little more normal.

Yeah, he got the penalties. But he's been the top ST gunner for a long time now.

He's great at being swallowed up by blockers.
There was a point of emphasis about the LOS this year. Does anyone remember? Did it have anything to do with Special Teams?

[Scott Campbell]

Bush is a good troop and all, but he's a lunkhead.

He had two ST penalties last week fer chrisskes. They finally took him off the punt team so they could get the punt off.

Yeah, for a guy whose offer from Tennessee was matched because he was so important to special teams, that's not so good - you have to pull him just to get the damn play off.

This is a weird season already. A solid victory over the Rams will make the world seem a little more normal.

Yeah, he got the penalties. But he's been the top ST gunner for a long time now.

He's great at being swallowed up by blockers.
There was a point of emphasis about the LOS this year. Does anyone remember? Did it have anything to do with Special Teams?


I thought it had to do with the linemen actually being within the correct distance of the line of scrimmage.

[Bretsky]

DOWN GOES ANOTHER TT draft pick

[Partial]

Bedard's latest article alludes to the fact that many vets thought Rouse didn't earn his keep, and that there are other players on the roster that are in a similar position.

Interesting read. Good to see Rodgers being a team leader, but I have to wonder how the teammates respond to him talking about younger guys when it's only his second year started. That said, good to see a positive message from him as opposed to Cutler.

http://www.jsonline.com/sports/packers/60885272.html

[Noodle]

Bedard's latest article alludes to the fact that many vets thought Rouse didn't earn his keep, and that there are other players on the roster that are in a similar position.

Interesting read. Good to see Rodgers being a team leader, but I have to wonder how the teammates respond to him talking about younger guys when it's only his second year started. That said, good to see a positive message from him as opposed to Cutler.

http://www.jsonline.com/sports/packers/60885272.html

I think there are only 7 guys on the 53-man roster with more time on the team than Rodgers -- Driver, Harris, Jenkins, Wells, Kampman, Clifton & Barnett.

So I'm thinking he's ok talking about the young guys.

But agree with your point about lauding his leadership.

[Pugger]

Wow. I'm very suprised they released Rouse.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, but where in the world is you favorite pizza?

I kinda like Bilotti's in DePere...

[channtheman]

Just in per ESPN, Aaron Rouse to the New York Giants.

[pbmax]

Just in per ESPN, Aaron Rouse to the New York Giants.
That tears it. If that defense picked him up, he obviously can't play.

[Cheesehead Craig]

Bush is a good troop and all, but he's a lunkhead.

He had two ST penalties last week fer chrisskes. They finally took him off the punt team so they could get the punt off.

Yeah, for a guy whose offer from Tennessee was matched because he was so important to special teams, that's not so good - you have to pull him just to get the damn play off.

This is a weird season already. A solid victory over the Rams will make the world seem a little more normal.


Yeah, he got the penalties. But he's been the top ST gunner for a long time now.

He's great at being swallowed up by blockers.

Somebody say swallow?

[pbmax]

Just in per ESPN, Aaron Rouse to the New York Giants.
That tears it. If that defense picked him up, he obviously can't play.
Wow, they lost a first round pick in his second year two games in to patella femoral arthritis. He went from starting the first two games this season to IR in just a couple of days without the normally dramatic on field injury. He hadn't been practicing and had been getting treatment since the preseason.

[Partial]

Just in per ESPN, Aaron Rouse to the New York Giants.

What a surprise that an agressive defense known for maximizing talents signs Goldberg. This guy would be a menace off the edge spearing the QB.

[falco]

Just in per ESPN, Aaron Rouse to the New York Giants.

What a surprise that an agressive defense known for maximizing talents signs Goldberg. This guy would be a menace off the edge spearing the QB.

what?

[rbaloha1]

Just in per ESPN, Aaron Rouse to the New York Giants.

The dude has talent. Needs to play in a confined area not in space. Still a big time hitter with big play ability.

[pbmax]

Just in per ESPN, Aaron Rouse to the New York Giants.

What a surprise that an agressive defense known for maximizing talents signs Goldberg. This guy would be a menace off the edge spearing the QB.
So he will excel at an illegal hit from the bench? :lol:

[Harlan Huckleby]

Bhawoh Jue
Michael Hawthorne
Todd Franz
Marques Anderson
Curtis Fuller
Joey Thomas
Mark Roman
Marviel Underwood
Marquand Manuel
Tyrone Culver
Anthony Smith
Aaron Rouse

http://www.undiscoveredscotland.co.uk/falkirk/muiravonsidegraveyard/images/graveyard-450.jpg

[Scott Campbell]

Bhawoh Jue
Michael Hawthorne
Todd Franz
Marques Anderson
Curtis Fuller
Joey Thomas
Mark Roman
Marviel Underwood
Marquand Manuel
Tyrone Culver
Anthony Smith
Aaron Rouse




Holy crap.

[mraynrand]

Bhawoh Jue
Michael Hawthorne
Todd Franz
Marques Anderson
Curtis Fuller
Joey Thomas
Mark Roman
Marviel Underwood
Marquand Manuel
Tyrone Culver
Anthony Smith
Aaron Rouse




Holy crap.

It reminds me of those graphics they used to run with Favre on one side and all the QBs another team went through on the other. But in this case, it's all the failed attempts to replace LeRoy. I miss that guy.

[Partial]

Rouse gone, but too late:

http://www.jsonline.com/sports/packers/60887977.html

[KYPack]

I had a list like that in mind, but was too lazy to do the work.

Thomas was a CB, but good job, dog that is blue,

[falco]

Thomas was a CB,

Well, they called him one at least...

[Tyrone Bigguns]

that list ain't right, cause if it is then TT went out and spent in FA

[pbmax]

Hawthorne was primarily a CB too. Cliff Cristl's favorite if I recall correctly.

I don't remember his spending much time at safety.

[Bossman641]

Hawthorne was primarily a CB too. Cliff Cristl's favorite if I recall correctly.

I don't remember his spending much time at safety.

He played a little safety while he was here. Not very well, but he did.

[Partial]

http://www.jsonline.com/sports/packers/61370612.html

[falco]

My gut feeling is that Martin has a chance to be good in this league... here's hoping Bigby doesn't even have to come back.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Being a safety for G.B. is like being a piano player for the Grateful Dead. Two year life expectancy.

I always thought CB was the toughest job to fill. Damn, I really thought Rouse would work out.

Wasn't Joey Thomas a tweener?

[Harlan Huckleby]

Hawthorne was primarily a CB too. Cliff Cristl's favorite if I recall correctly.

You are confusing Michael Hawthorne and Mike Hawkins, the texas wonderkind. Mr. August.

[SnakeLH2006]

All I know is that Skin must man-up and face the fact Bigby is "still" the default starter with Rouse gone. LOL. That sucks.

As a bigtime defender of Bigby, he's worthless injured..and Martin is out on an island. We are not doing good. Not at all. Skin and Snake pray for something out of Martin. :shock:

[MichiganPackerFan]

I had a list like that in mind, but was too lazy to do the work.

Same here.

[SkinBasket]

All I know is that Skin must man-up and face the fact Bigby is "still" the default starter with Rouse gone. LOL. That sucks.

Fuck. At this point I would "man up" if Bigby could play more than two games without his busted ass body giving out. How can a guy that slow hurt himself so much? He's like one of those old Buicks that grandma backs into a telephone pole at 2 MPH and all the trim and the bumpers fall off and the engine catches fire.

[Fritz]

Rouse was going to be gone somehow, some way. Many think he should have been cut and Smith kept, or - and I think this is even more the case - many felt that Smith should have been kept instead of trading for Martin.

If you see this as a choice - we coulda kept Smith, screw that Martin guy, what's up with that? - then here's a quote from a GBPG article today. The "him" is a reference to Martin:

"— and the Packers considered him an upgrade from Smith at safety."

So one way to see this is that this isn't really about Rouse vs. Smith.

Still, even if you still think Rouse should have been cut earlier, the bottom line is that you'd now have Smith/Martin instead of Giordano/Martin.

So, in the end, it's an interesting questions as to whether you think having Giordano instead of Smith is wrecking the season.

[Scott Campbell]

All I know is that Skin must man-up and face the fact Bigby is "still" the default starter with Rouse gone. LOL. That sucks.

Fuck. At this point I would "man up" if Bigby could play more than two games without his busted ass body giving out. How can a guy that slow hurt himself so much? He's like one of those old Buicks that grandma backs into a telephone pole at 2 MPH and all the trim and the bumpers fall off and the engine catches fire.



THink there will there be a sea of "Old Buick Bigby" signs popping up at Lambeau?

[pbmax]

Hawthorne was primarily a CB too. Cliff Cristl's favorite if I recall correctly.

You are confusing Michael Hawthorne and Mike Hawkins, the texas wonderkind. Mr. August.
Bossman may be right about Hawthorne at safety, but I am sure Cliff spent the better part of an entire season telling us that with a D backfield including Hawthorne starting at CB was doomed to failure.

In fact, he spent the next season dismissing any questions about CB by pointing out that at least Hawthorne wasn't here anymore, addition by subtraction.

[Partial]

All I know is that Skin must man-up and face the fact Bigby is "still" the default starter with Rouse gone. LOL. That sucks.

Fuck. At this point I would "man up" if Bigby could play more than two games without his busted ass body giving out. How can a guy that slow hurt himself so much? He's like one of those old Buicks that grandma backs into a telephone pole at 2 MPH and all the trim and the bumpers fall off and the engine catches fire.

Didn't you try and defend him when I called him injury prone?

[SkinBasket]

All I know is that Skin must man-up and face the fact Bigby is "still" the default starter with Rouse gone. LOL. That sucks.

Fuck. At this point I would "man up" if Bigby could play more than two games without his busted ass body giving out. How can a guy that slow hurt himself so much? He's like one of those old Buicks that grandma backs into a telephone pole at 2 MPH and all the trim and the bumpers fall off and the engine catches fire.

Didn't you try and defend him when I called him injury prone?

I have such a long and storied career of defending Bigby, I don't know how I couldn't have.

I think it's more likely, however, that you were making one of your irrational arguments about what constitutes "injury prone." If you can find it, I'll be happy to attempt to reconcile your perceived discrepancy.

[mraynrand]

All I know is that Skin must man-up and face the fact Bigby is "still" the default starter with Rouse gone. LOL. That sucks.

Fuck. At this point I would "man up" if Bigby could play more than two games without his busted ass body giving out. How can a guy that slow hurt himself so much? He's like one of those old Buicks that grandma backs into a telephone pole at 2 MPH and all the trim and the bumpers fall off and the engine catches fire.

Didn't you try and defend him when I called him injury prone?

I have such a long and storied career of defending Bigby, I don't know how I couldn't have.

I think it's more likely, however, that you were making one of your irrational arguments about what constitutes "injury prone." If you can find it, I'll be happy to attempt to reconcile your perceived discrepancy.

You need to leave Rugby alone. Didn't you know he blew up a couple of people in a Divisional game once?

[SkinBasket]

All I know is that Skin must man-up and face the fact Bigby is "still" the default starter with Rouse gone. LOL. That sucks.

Fuck. At this point I would "man up" if Bigby could play more than two games without his busted ass body giving out. How can a guy that slow hurt himself so much? He's like one of those old Buicks that grandma backs into a telephone pole at 2 MPH and all the trim and the bumpers fall off and the engine catches fire.

Didn't you try and defend him when I called him injury prone?

I have such a long and storied career of defending Bigby, I don't know how I couldn't have.

I think it's more likely, however, that you were making one of your irrational arguments about what constitutes "injury prone." If you can find it, I'll be happy to attempt to reconcile your perceived discrepancy.

You need to leave Rugby alone. Didn't you know he blew up a couple of people in a Divisional game once?

Don't forget the sausage he laid out during those couple preseason games that started the legend of the mighty hitting machine.

[mraynrand]

All I know is that Skin must man-up and face the fact Bigby is "still" the default starter with Rouse gone. LOL. That sucks.

Fuck. At this point I would "man up" if Bigby could play more than two games without his busted ass body giving out. How can a guy that slow hurt himself so much? He's like one of those old Buicks that grandma backs into a telephone pole at 2 MPH and all the trim and the bumpers fall off and the engine catches fire.

Didn't you try and defend him when I called him injury prone?

For the record, this 'injury prone' shit is tiresome. Most, if not all injuries are just sheer luck. Now I imagine you'll come back and give me all this shit about how a great athlete can avoid getting hit or that a better player doesn't get in situations that get him injured, blah, blah, blah, but I'm telling you, for the large part, everyone in the NFL is 'injury prone.' That's the reality of the game.

[mraynrand]

All I know is that Skin must man-up and face the fact Bigby is "still" the default starter with Rouse gone. LOL. That sucks.

Fuck. At this point I would "man up" if Bigby could play more than two games without his busted ass body giving out. How can a guy that slow hurt himself so much? He's like one of those old Buicks that grandma backs into a telephone pole at 2 MPH and all the trim and the bumpers fall off and the engine catches fire.

Didn't you try and defend him when I called him injury prone?

I have such a long and storied career of defending Bigby, I don't know how I couldn't have.

I think it's more likely, however, that you were making one of your irrational arguments about what constitutes "injury prone." If you can find it, I'll be happy to attempt to reconcile your perceived discrepancy.

You need to leave Rugby alone. Didn't you know he blew up a couple of people in a Divisional game once?

Don't forget the sausage he laid out during those couple preseason games that started the legend of the mighty hitting machine.

I thought that sausage was laid out by Harrell...

http://i453.photobucket.com/albums/qq254/mraynrand/harreldump.jpg

[KYPack]

Well, it's been sittin' on the DVR. I can't say you guys made me look, but I did it. I watched some of the tape from Sunday. We have to play Martin and Collins (if he can go) against St Lou.

When we played Rouse and Bush against the Bengals, it was like 9 on 13. Those two pricks basically helped the opposition. Rouse needed a clue. He was always out of position and when he did venture a guess and try to make a play, he was always wrong. The rawest rook on the PS would at least mange to make a correct play by accident once in awhile.

On the goal line TD to Henry, Rouse never moved. Henry pressed the fade and broke to the post. a subtle double move. Well, Henry should have run the fade, Rouse had no clue, never moved and it was wide open. instead, Henry busted to a nice post route and was equally wide open for 6. Rouse? He had the best seat in the house. He never covered either part of the route. He watched the whole deal from his "seat" on the goal line.

I can only imagine the groans from Capers and Perry when they watched the tape on Monday. It takes a lot for a position coach and the DC to admit their starter should actually be cut from the squad. But after what I saw, it was the only logical decision. Maybe somebody can find a job for Rouse. But it can't be starting at a safety spot on an NFL defense. He doesn't know the first thing about that job.

[Cleft Crusty]

Well, it's been sittin' on the DVR. I can't say you guys made me look, but I did it. I watched some of the tape from Sunday. We have to play Martin and Collins (if he can go) against St Lou.

When we played Rouse and Bush against the Bengals, it was like 9 on 13. Those two pricks basically helped the opposition. Rouse needed a clue. He was always out of position and when he did venture a guess and try to make a play, he was always wrong. The rawest rook on the PS would at least mange to make a correct play by accident once in awhile.

On the goal line TD to Henry, Rouse never moved. Henry pressed the fade and broke to the post. a subtle double move. Well, Henry should have run the fade, Rouse had no clue, never moved and it was wide open. instead, Henry busted to a nice post route and was equally wide open for 6. Rouse? He had the best seat in the house. He never covered either part of the route. He watched the whole deal from his "seat" on the goal line.

I can only imagine the groans from Capers and Perry when they watched the tape on Monday. It takes a lot for a position coach and the DC to admit their starter should actually be cut from the squad. But after what I saw, it was the only logical decision. Maybe somebody can find a job for Rouse. But it can't be starting at a safety spot on an NFL defense. He doesn't know the first thing about that job.

Good catch. Clefty saw the same thing on tape. McGinn blames Chillar for the 3rd and 34, but Rouse also was grossly late in pursuit and when he did arrive, proceded to overrun the play, get blocked, stay on the block, and not even slightly impede the runner. With the more lithe and instinctive Jenkins in pursuit, even a slight impedance of the runner would have stopped that conversion. Rouse was thoroughly horrible in that game. I believe Waldo compared it to Carroll at Philly in '06. That is being charitable.

[Waldo]

The rawest rook on the PS would at least mange to make a correct play by accident once in awhile.

Hence my reasoning when I brought up Underwood as a depth solution.

Even if the guy absolutely sucks and can't tackle nor cover, the only tasks he can effectively do are slow down the guy with the ball and stay in his zone, it would be a marked improvement over what we saw out of Rouse.

Too often the words "solid" and "decent" were used to describe the play of Rouse. I have no idea where people ever got that he's good against the run because it simply isn't true. And never has been.

I actually didn't stumble into Rouse's absolute horribleness against the run until I was doing a study of our run defense stats. Going back to the start of 2006, I charted our run defense performance, by calculating the difference between what we gave up to a team in YPC and what that team averaged on the season in YPC, on a game by game basis. My initial intent was to look at lineman and lineman injuries to see the effect, but I came away with a startling conclusion that I did not expect to find. Our run defense drastically declined when Bigby didn't play, or in games he only played a little early. Every game that Rouse saw significant action in was averaging an almost 2 YPC difference than games that Bigby was in. Most games with Bigby beat the average that the opponent ran for, it averaged out to just under 1 YPC better than they typically do. Rouse on the OTOH, when he was in the lineup we averaged 1 YPC worse than our opponent typically does, and almost never performed better than their season average.

I wish I had the study bookmarked, maybe I'll look for my spreadsheet so I can show you guys the results. I tried and tried and tried to find a correlation between our run D and lineman, and looked at the linebackers, and really could draw no conclusions. Apply the data set of which SS played the bulk of the game to the data, and the results fit like a glove.

I never considered Rouse good against the run, but I bought into the decent hype for a long time. (though I always been convinced that Pickett could play better pass coverage). Once I figured out just how bad Rouse was against the run, he had been #1 on my "guys that should never see the field" list. It is hard to judge run fits from tape for the secondary. Most defenses however are not fundamentally sound against the run unless one of the safeties augments the front 7, either in a contain or tackle role. Rouse was so utterly clueless, many didn't think that he was "at fault" on many plays simply because he wasn't struggling with his fits, he was nowhere to be found and people didn't even realize that Rouse was in fact supposed to be the one making the play. (often that is how it works in the secondary, the guy actually "at fault' is typically not the guy blamed, generally the guy hustling to cover for the guy that screwed up is the guy that is blamed by fans.)

Thank god we got rid of him. LIS, he was a Carroll level liability, and could not be hidden. It is addition by subtraction. Even if the guy that replaces him is terrible, if he simply is where he is supposed to be, he will be a huge improvement.

[Fritz]

The above post makes me feel better about Sunday...and even next Monday!

[Pugger]

The Giants must've been desparate to sign Rouse then... :shock:

[KYPack]

Waldo, you an I are having an argument that I ain't in. Underwood could probably play safety. He's tall, rangy, has good instincts, can cover and play the run. He's the anti-Rouse. Where I have the problem is timing. None of this will happen this season. He's a Rook and we need help in the back line this season. I assume that they will play Martin at that spot, hoping that Bigby will get well and be ready to play.

Which I think they will do. Underwood is the back-up at all the dime an nickel corner spots & I'll be happy if he learns those gigs this year.

Long term? Underwood may be the rare bird that can back-up at both safety and corner. That kind of guy is pure gold and can save a roster spot so we can have 4 TE's or 3 FB's or some other crazy deal. I like Underwood and actually saw him play last season for UCincy. He's a tough, instinctive guy who likes to get down and dirty. As opposed to Rouse, who really didn't cover or play the run for shit.

[Fritz]

The Giants must've been desparate to sign Rouse then... :shock:

Yes, Pugger, they were. Lost last year's #1 pick to injury and were already way thin at that point.

As was pointed out, 27 teams passed on Rouse before the Giants claimed him.

[Waldo]

Waldo, you an I are having an argument that I ain't in. Underwood could probably play safety..

I think that we are both talking the same thing, but from different angles.

I wholeheartedly agree that Underwood would most likely be absolutely awful out there.

My entire point was that even if that is the case, it may still be an improvement over Rouse.

Even then, no way would he even be considered to start even as a backup (which is where we are, Rouse "starting" was as an injury fill in for Bigby, not as a permanent position).

But he is still there. If we lose Collins, Bigby, Bush, Martin, there is still Underwood, and the new guy.

Most teams in the league are talking mega green when on their #5+ safeties, in fact, most teams don't even have that many. At that level of depth, there is no point in keeping someone that doesn't have a lot of potential to one day develop into a good one.

The general gist I guess of even why I brought him up. Yes, Rouse was that bad. You looked at the tape and confirmed what I said from the beginning of this thread. Rouse was that bad (this is not a phenomenon new to the Cincy game, he was that bad last year too, but almost nobody noticed), that his release is addition by subtraction, that even the rawest of the raw players isn't really a downgrade out there from him.

[rbaloha1]

Waldo, you an I are having an argument that I ain't in. Underwood could probably play safety. He's tall, rangy, has good instincts, can cover and play the run. He's the anti-Rouse. Where I have the problem is timing. None of this will happen this season. He's a Rook and we need help in the back line this season. I assume that they will play Martin at that spot, hoping that Bigby will get well and be ready to play.

Which I think they will do. Underwood is the back-up at all the dime an nickel corner spots & I'll be happy if he learns those gigs this year.

Long term? Underwood may be the rare bird that can back-up at both safety and corner. That kind of guy is pure gold and can save a roster spot so we can have 4 TE's or 3 FB's or some other crazy deal. I like Underwood and actually saw him play last season for UCincy. He's a tough, instinctive guy who likes to get down and dirty. As opposed to Rouse, who really didn't cover or play the run for shit.

Sporting News agrees with you. Underwood and Lee just need reps and experience.