WAY TO PREDICTABLE!!!

[packers11]

I was literally yelling at my T.V. yesterday at M.M. because I knew that on first down the run was coming... It wasn't until today when I actually saw the damn report on rotoworld that it was as bad as I thought.

www.rotoworld.com


Ryan Grant had a ridiculous 17 carries on first down in Sunday's win over the Rams.

It's not easy to stuff the running game when you know what's coming. Grant managed just 34 yards on those 17 carries and that came against the Rams. The Packers are going to have to be a little more unpredictable if they are going to run on the Vikings in Week 4

I hope the media brings this to MM's attention so he is forced to switch it up a bit... :!:

[red]

its just a complete waste

the only time i saw grant get any yardage is when he ran as far away from the line, as fast as he could to the edge and just got the hell away from the big pile of o-linemen that builds up there

[Administrator]

Dont hold it against him too bad. He doesnt have a true starter at RB.

[mission]

What does that have to do not putting him in position to succeed. We couldn't be any more predictable on first down. Embarrassing.

[red]

alot of people seemed happy that grant finally had almost 100 yards and the running game seems to improve

these are just based on stats

rodgers had 38 of the yards on broken play scrambles

grant had 26 rushes for 99 yards. however 25 of those yards came on 5 carries on the last drive when the game is put away and we are just running out the clock.

that leaves 21 carries for 74 yards when the game counts. not good

its a double headed sword for us right now. you have to run the ball to open up the pass, but at this point we're just wasting downs by trying to run the ball because we have no holes for grant to run through

and the sad thing is it seems to be coming against just a 4 man rush, meaning even if you run play action you have 7 guys dropping into coverage leaving no one for rodgers to throw to

[Fritz]

And if McCarthy had called passes on ten of those seventeen, we'd be hearing about how he talks about establishing the run but doesn't commit to it.

Predictable.

[Tony Oday]

I am putting some of this on AR and not just the line. When there are 8 in the box we should be changing to a quick hit slant or something like that and watch DD and Jennings make something out of it. When there are 7 try to run the ball. Our O line dictates that we have to pass to set up the run. what I think we are missing is the slant...how many were thrown yesterday? That is a staple play in this offense I thought. I mean the 5 yard quick hit with some moves that turn into big gains.

[red]

I am putting some of this on AR and not just the line. When there are 8 in the box we should be changing to a quick hit slant or something like that and watch DD and Jennings make something out of it. When there are 7 try to run the ball. Our O line dictates that we have to pass to set up the run. what I think we are missing is the slant...how many were thrown yesterday? That is a staple play in this offense I thought. I mean the 5 yard quick hit with some moves that turn into big gains.

i think the problem with the slant is that the lb's don't have to rush and can just stand where they are which is right where the guys running the slants want to go

and anothe thing that was mentioned after the game. to run a good slant you need a partner to help screen or pick the guy covering you.

thats tuff to do when you only have 2 wr's on the field with everyone else trying to help the o-line block

[Gunakor]

I am putting some of this on AR and not just the line. When there are 8 in the box we should be changing to a quick hit slant or something like that and watch DD and Jennings make something out of it. When there are 7 try to run the ball. Our O line dictates that we have to pass to set up the run. what I think we are missing is the slant...how many were thrown yesterday? That is a staple play in this offense I thought. I mean the 5 yard quick hit with some moves that turn into big gains.

For 3 weeks in a row the defense has been sitting on those slants just waiting for Rodgers to throw it. Rodgers has done a fantastic job of taking what the defense gives him. If it isn't there, he's not going to try and force things. Watch the defense. Every team in the NFL knows by now what we'd like to do. They are all over those slants and have been every week. If it's not there I'd rather go elsewhere. Because, for all the things we have to complain about regarding this offense, we've avoided the killer mistakes. We haven't turned the ball over very often. That's kept us in games against quality teams, and will continue to keep us in games against whoever we line up against.

[packers11]

If he tries to run 17 times on first down with the Williams Wall in action, packers will be doomed this week...

I'm not asking for him to line up 5 wide every first down, but a big part of success is keeping the defense guessing... The packers don't have the offensive line to just plow through people even if they know its coming...

I agree with some posters above, back in 2007 a big part of the packers success was the Favre 5 yard slant which Jennings/Driver would bring to the house... (they did lead in YAC that year)

[sheepshead]

Dont hold it against him too bad. He doesnt have a true starter at RB.

Our running game was my biggest concern this off-season. There's plenty of season left however.

[Gunakor]

Dont hold it against him too bad. He doesnt have a true starter at RB.

Let's not forget that we don't have a true starter for at least 3 of 5 OL positions either. Let's not put the running game woes all on Grant. When he's found a crease to run through he's been able to turn it up for 4-8 yards, and we've seen that on rare occasion even this season.

[HarveyWallbangers]

If he tries to run 17 times on first down with the Williams Wall in action, packers will be doomed this week...

I'm not asking for him to line up 5 wide every first down, but a big part of success is keeping the defense guessing... The packers don't have the offensive line to just plow through people even if they know its coming...

I agree with some posters above, back in 2007 a big part of the packers success was the Favre 5 yard slant which Jennings/Driver would bring to the house... (they did lead in YAC that year)

Personally, I think we need to try to run it against Minnesota. You can't have Rodgers sitting back there getting hit all day either. Of course, they aren't going to run it 17 times on first down, but they better not abandon it. Minnesota actually looked a bit vulnerable the first two games against the run. Yesterday, they faced San Fran without Gore. San Fran really hasn't been running the ball that well. Take away the two runs by Gore for 80+ yards, and they've averaged about 2 yards/carry this year.

[pbmax]

I was literally yelling at my T.V. yesterday at M.M. because I knew that on first down the run was coming... It wasn't until today when I actually saw the damn report on rotoworld that it was as bad as I thought.

www.rotoworld.com


Ryan Grant had a ridiculous 17 carries on first down in Sunday's win over the Rams.

It's not easy to stuff the running game when you know what's coming. Grant managed just 34 yards on those 17 carries and that came against the Rams. The Packers are going to have to be a little more unpredictable if they are going to run on the Vikings in Week 4

I hope the media brings this to MM's attention so he is forced to switch it up a bit... :!:
OK all you junior Offensive Coordinators, tell me how many of those 17 runs were audibled to by the QB based on alignment. If you get it right, you can continue to criticize McCarthy. Get it wrong and you can join MOBB's thread and talk about how Favre is just like Michael Jordan.

[Bossman641]

I actually don't have a problem with the amount of first down runs yesterday. It would have been nice to get more yards out of it, but at least it kept the defense honest. I'd much rather complain about running too much then complain about 3 rushes in the entire second half, like last week.

Plus, all those rushing attempts led to a lot of play action.

[pbmax]

Warning: Actual Information (May Force You To Think Or Change Mind And Not Reinforce Previous Held Belief)!!!

Plays on First Down Through 3 Quarters and 2 Minutes 42 seconds:
1 Rodgers Scramble
12 Running Back Runs
11 Passes by QB
1 Kneel Down

Plays on First Down from 12:18 in 4th Quarter With Pack Leading 29-17:
5 Running Back Runs
0 Passes
1 Driver Run
2 Kneel Downs

[Fritz]

Geez PB, it looks like through the first three quarters and into the fourth, the Packers had a balanced attack - 12 runs, 11 passes, a scarmble and a kneel down. Then it appears that at the end of the game - the last 12 or so minutes, with a lead - the team tried to run the ball more.

Is that considered sound strategy in the NFL? Tohave a balanced attack but to emphasize the run toward the end of the game when you have a large lead?

[denverYooper]

Peebs, yer bringin' the heat today.

[red]

nice digging pb

[Brandon494]

And if McCarthy had called passes on ten of those seventeen, we'd be hearing about how he talks about establishing the run but doesn't commit to it.

Predictable.

Exactly, you just cant please some people. Running all those times finally did open up play action for the Driver TD.

[Noodle]

PB, that was a great post. Clinical and elegant.

I think even Patler will have to tip his hat to you on that one.

[DannoMac21]

Warning: Actual Information (May Force You To Think Or Change Mind And Not Reinforce Previous Held Belief)!!!

Plays on First Down Through 3 Quarters and 2 Minutes 42 seconds:
1 Rodgers Scramble
12 Running Back Runs
11 Passes by QB
1 Kneel Down

Plays on First Down from 12:18 in 4th Quarter With Pack Leading 29-17:
5 Running Back Runs
0 Passes
1 Driver Run
2 Kneel Downs

/thread

[mission]

I'm big enough to take back my comment and admit being "owned" :lol:

[pbmax]

PB, that was a great post. Clinical and elegant.

I think even Patler will have to tip his hat to you on that one.
High praise indeed!

[Noodle]

You know, I don't think anyone was owned, and PB didn't crow about it.

I'll admit when I heard the bare "ran 17 times on 1st down stat," I thought, WTF? Mix it up!

But then PB explained the meaning of the phrase "There are lies, damn lies, and statistics."

So no one got owned. Instead, we all got educated.

Thanks Perfesser PB!

[packers11]

that was some good researching pb... I just went what was off rotoworld...

I was happy with the win yesterday even though a lot of people were still pissed off...

Although i'm going to say its nice to see a balance, a lot of the first down runs were for 1/2 yards, leaving it 2-8/9... What ever happened to WR/RB screens, the packers do have "smaller/faster" o-linemen for something... Those can basically work like short little runs in themselves...

Once again, thanks for more info on those stats.

[MichiganPackerFan]

Warning: Actual Information (May Force You To Think Or Change Mind And Not Reinforce Previous Held Belief)!!!

Plays on First Down Through 3 Quarters and 2 Minutes 42 seconds:
1 Rodgers Scramble
12 Running Back Runs
11 Passes by QB
1 Kneel Down

Plays on First Down from 12:18 in 4th Quarter With Pack Leading 29-17:
5 Running Back Runs
0 Passes
1 Driver Run
2 Kneel Downs

Looks to me like they just cant manage to have a balanced run pass attack. 11 passes and 12 runs? why such a run-heavy offense?

Seriously, I don't think you need to average 5+ yards per carry for the running game to be effective. Just running the ball keeps a defense honest. Throwing on every single down (See NFC Championship, 2007 doesn't win games...

[Pugger]

Frankly I was glad MM didn't give up on the run yesterday. Yes, we didn't get a ton of yards but if you just abandon the run defenses will pin their ears back and blitz you and your QB to death (almost literally!). I hope MM does this again on Monday. Yes, MN is good against the run but you have to try to keep them honest...

Hey Michigan, GMTA!! :D

[The Shadow]

Could part of the answer lie in the tape he wants Minnesota to see this week?

[denverYooper]

Could part of the answer lie in the tape he wants Minnesota to see this week?

That's something I was wondering about also.

[packerbacker1234]

Dont hold it against him too bad. He doesnt have a true starter at RB.

He seemed to do just fine when he had a QB on the field that produced points without him.

Grant had a solid year last year, better then a lot of other "starting caliber" running backs.

A running back can only be so good. It's no surprise that grant looks great in the open against a defender, but often times can't run up the gut because there isn't a hole.

The OL is horrible. Grant can't do everything.