the_idle_threat
07-29-2006, 01:21 AM
Position-by-position: Secondary
Secondary the top off-season investment
By BOB McGINN
http://www.jsonline.com/graphics/sports/art/mugs/1bobmcginn.jpg
Green Bay - Charles Woodson for Joey Thomas. Marquand Manuel for Mark Roman.
Entering training camp a year ago, the Green Bay Packers were starting Thomas at left cornerback and Roman at strong safety in a secondary that performed dreadfully in 2004. Expecting to improve a unit with Thomas and Roman in the lineup only invited incredulity.
Thomas lost his job in camp and was gone by midseason. Roman started every game, mostly be default, and played almost as poorly as he had the year before. General manager Ted Thompson's decision Thursday to jettison Roman was overdue.
It also was Thompson's call this spring to dip into unrestricted free agency and sign both Woodson and Manuel. The tariff to attract Woodson from Oakland was $39.034 million over seven years, including $9.9 million guaranteed, and $10 million over five years ($3 million guaranteed) to get Manuel out of Seattle.
Adding the aging, beat-up Woodson for a king's ransom was a precipitous gamble. Also, Thompson bypassed more than a dozen available safeties with more starting experience for the comparably inexperienced Manuel, who was never a full-fledged starter during a four-year career that began in Cincinnati.
By opening the checkbook and taking a chance, however, the Packers finally have legitimate hope in the secondary. When their people predict the unit will play well, their optimism these days is grounded in realism.
"I would anticipate the group being very good," defensive coordinator Bob Sanders said. "A lot like the linebackers, there's a lot of talented young guys that got some pretty good experience and need to keep coming."
Roles are all but settled. It'll be Woodson and Al Harris at cornerback, Manuel at strong safety and Nick Collins at free safety. In the nickel package, Sanders said Woodson will move inside to the slot, with Ahmad Carroll replacing him outside.
The battle for the fourth and fifth cornerback berths finds an unusually large number of capable candidates, according to cornerbacks coach Lionel Washington. He should know. Washington has been helping coach the secondary for eight seasons, one short of the club record held by Dick Jauron from 1986-'94.
"We've got a lot of talent back there," Washington said, referring to cornerback. "If they stay healthy and improve, we're going to have to make some tough decisions."
The backups at safety might be unproven, but at least someone like Roman, who proved he couldn't play, no longer is around to muck up the depth chart.
Four years ago last month, Pro Football Weekly ranked Woodson as the best cornerback in the National Football League. Two years ago, he was No. 4. Last year, he was No. 9. Today, he is No. 21.
Injuries, including two broken legs in the last three years, and some off-field problems have hurt his performance level. The last of his three selections to the Pro Bowl was the '01 season. He had 10 interceptions in his first three seasons, seven in the last five.
After a decent showing in the post-draft minicamp, Woodson irritated the Packers by blowing off the rest of their off-season program. Coach Mike McCarthy dispatched Washington to get a read.
"He wasn't in the best shape at the minicamp, but I saw him two weeks ago and he will be ready," said Washington. "I think he still can do it. Age won't even matter."
Woodson, 29, has been prone to double-moves over the years but also anticipates well and can outmuscle some receivers. He's a fierce tackler, effective slot blitzer and still probably fast enough to match up with most receivers.
"Until he got hurt last year he was our best defensive player," one Raiders personnel man said. "He was the most physical corner in the league for years. He's had some bad breaks with that leg. At this point I'd move him to free safety. He'd be an all-pro."
Harris, ranked No. 12 by PFW, might have played even a bit better than that for the first 12 games before finishing on a rather poor note. He will be 32 in December and isn't happy about his contract, but the Packers love his professionalism and don't expect him to slip any time soon.
"He knows if there's a real fast receiver he's not going to be as aggressive," Washington said. "Because if he misses, his chances of him catching up aren't that great. He understands his opponent."
Carroll took a small step last season toward becoming a suitable starter and then, after his position was assigned to Woodson, didn't seem to pout and apparently improved some more.
"You'll see," said Washington. "I don't want to say too much about him right now. I think the kid has really started to mature. He's really coming on. I think his adjustment to the ball has improved big-time."
Secondary coach Kurt Schottenheimer, who helped coach Carroll as a rookie before spending last year in St. Louis, said, "He may be the best corner on this team in a couple years. The way Ahmad has handled this whole thing has been very exciting. Ahmad Carroll has been beat up about as much as a guy can be beat up. I'm impressed and proud of him."
Mike Hawkins added 8 pounds to his string-bean frame, which the coaches hope will translate into more tenacious coverage and less timid tackling. He will be pushed by rookie Will Blackmon, holdover Jason Horton and Patrick Dendy.
"Blackmon has great ball skills because he played wide receiver," said Washington. "Horton's strength is playing the ball downfield. Dendy is playing his techniques better and is really improved."
Collins made almost no big plays as a rookie but didn't give up many, either. He's fast, a hard hitter and appears to think well enough on his feet. With a proven communicator like Manuel directing traffic next to him, his impact might increase.
"He's more physical than Roman," one Seahawks official said, referring to Manuel. "He attacks the line of scrimmage. You wouldn't say he's a great athlete but he plays with intensity. One thing you could say was his weakness would be ball skills."
Manuel struck Schottenheimer, as well as the staff in Seattle, as a committed individual with a focus on team.
Unless the Packers sign a veteran, the top candidates for the backup safety jobs would be Marviel Underwood, rookie Tyrone Culver and returnee Atari Bigby.
Asked to compare this personnel to what he left behind after being dismissed by Mike Sherman, Schottenheimer said, "The (Mike) McKenzie thing made things a little bit fuzzy. Where we were then and where we are now, hell, we're going to be better."
They couldn't be any worse.
*************************
At a Glance
The 15 defensive backs on the Green Bay roster as training camp begins. Each player is listed with height, weight, age, how acquired and college. Acquisition categories: UFA means unrestricted free agent, T means trade, D1 means first-round draft choice and FA means free agent.
Cornerbacks at a Glance
Player Ht. Wt. Age Acquired College
CHARLES WOODSON
6-1
205 29
UFA-'06
Michigan
Named to start in 1999 and 2001 Pro Bowls, and was named a backup in ’00. Finished Raiders’ career with 396 tackles, 17 interceptions, five sacks and three TDs.
AL HARRIS
6-1
185 32
T-'03
Texas A&M-Kingsville
Played 96% of the snaps in ’03, 99% in ’04 and 97% in ’05. Allowed 13 1/2 plays of 20 yards or more and three TD passes in ’03, 14 1/2 and eight TD passes in ’04 and 81/2 and two TD passes in ’05, his finest season.
AHMAD CARROLL
5-9 1/2
190 22
D1-'04
Arkansas
Led the defense in penalties for the second straight year with nine. Also, led the team by giving up 9 1/2 plays of 20 yards or more.
MIKE HAWKINS
6-1 1/2
187 27
D5-'05
Oklahoma
Played 16% of the downs, mostly as the No. 3 corner from Week 8 on after the release of Joey Thomas. Allowed just one-half play of 20 yards or more and one TD pass.
WILL BLACKMON
6- 1/2
198 21
D4-'06
Boston College
The 14th cornerback selected in the draft. At the combine, he worked with the wide receivers, the position he played in ’05. Scored 31 on the Wonderlic, ran 4.47 and had jumps of 41 inches (vertical) and 11-1 (broad jump).
JASON HORTON
6-0
190 26 FA-'04
North Carolina A&T
On the field for 44 snaps in ’04 and 104 in ’05. Went on injured reserve with torn shoulder two days after allowing a 35-yard go route to Minnesota’s Marcus Robinson. It probably was the team’s most costly mental mistake of the season.
PATRICK DENDY
6-0
190 24
FA-'05
Rice
Started 29 of 42 games at Rice but didn’t play any football in ’04. Promoted from the Packers’ practice squad to active roster for final eight games of ’05 and got in on 13 snaps from scrimmage.
THERRIAN FONTENOT
5-11
187 24
FA-'05
Fresno State
Caught the Packers’ eye during August ’05 workouts against Buffalo as a Bills rookie free agent. Spent most of ’05 on the Packers’ practice squad. Defended nine passes as nickel back for Rhein Fire in NFL Europe League this spring.
JERRON WISHOM
5-11 1/2
197 24
FA-'05
Louisiana Tech
Undrafted rookie cut by Houston last August, then spent nine weeks on the Packers’ practice squad and six weeks on roster. Played 30 snaps as No. 4 cornerback.
Safeties at a Glance
NICK COLLINS
5-11
200 22 D2-'05
Bethune-Cookman
Played 95% of the downs. Finished fourth on team in tackles (95) and second in missed tackles (19). Allowed merely four plays of 20 yards or more, and two TD passes.
MARQUAND MANUEL
6-0
209 27 UFA-'06
Florida
Drafted in sixth round by Bengals, for whom he started eight games in ’02 and one game in ’03 before being cut. Claimed by Seattle in September 2004, he started 10 regular-season and three playoff games in ’05.
MARVIEL UNDERWOOD
5-10 1/2
197 24 D4-'05
San Diego State
Played 212 snaps from scrimmage, serving as the dime safety in the last 12 games. Never made a play or even deflected a pass until forcing NFL MVP Shaun Alexander of Seattle to fumble in Week 16. Led special teams in tackles with 23 but had little impact.
TYRONE CULVER
6-1
200 23 D6-'06
Fresno State
Two-year starter with 178 tackles, five interceptions and four sacks in four-year career. Scored 16 on the Wonderlic, ran 40 in 4.55 and had a 39½-inch vertical jump.
ATARI BIGBY
5-10 1/2
211 24
FA-'05
Central Florida
Started for Amsterdam in NFL Europe this spring, leading team in tackles (61) and posting one interception. Packers experimented with him at linebacker during ’05 practice-squad stint. Scored 23 on the Wonderlic.
TRA BOGER
6-0
210 23 FA-'06
Tulane
Started 30 of 50 games over five years. Finished with nine interceptions, seven forced fumbles, two sacks and 10 tackles for loss.
Secondary the top off-season investment
By BOB McGINN
http://www.jsonline.com/graphics/sports/art/mugs/1bobmcginn.jpg
Green Bay - Charles Woodson for Joey Thomas. Marquand Manuel for Mark Roman.
Entering training camp a year ago, the Green Bay Packers were starting Thomas at left cornerback and Roman at strong safety in a secondary that performed dreadfully in 2004. Expecting to improve a unit with Thomas and Roman in the lineup only invited incredulity.
Thomas lost his job in camp and was gone by midseason. Roman started every game, mostly be default, and played almost as poorly as he had the year before. General manager Ted Thompson's decision Thursday to jettison Roman was overdue.
It also was Thompson's call this spring to dip into unrestricted free agency and sign both Woodson and Manuel. The tariff to attract Woodson from Oakland was $39.034 million over seven years, including $9.9 million guaranteed, and $10 million over five years ($3 million guaranteed) to get Manuel out of Seattle.
Adding the aging, beat-up Woodson for a king's ransom was a precipitous gamble. Also, Thompson bypassed more than a dozen available safeties with more starting experience for the comparably inexperienced Manuel, who was never a full-fledged starter during a four-year career that began in Cincinnati.
By opening the checkbook and taking a chance, however, the Packers finally have legitimate hope in the secondary. When their people predict the unit will play well, their optimism these days is grounded in realism.
"I would anticipate the group being very good," defensive coordinator Bob Sanders said. "A lot like the linebackers, there's a lot of talented young guys that got some pretty good experience and need to keep coming."
Roles are all but settled. It'll be Woodson and Al Harris at cornerback, Manuel at strong safety and Nick Collins at free safety. In the nickel package, Sanders said Woodson will move inside to the slot, with Ahmad Carroll replacing him outside.
The battle for the fourth and fifth cornerback berths finds an unusually large number of capable candidates, according to cornerbacks coach Lionel Washington. He should know. Washington has been helping coach the secondary for eight seasons, one short of the club record held by Dick Jauron from 1986-'94.
"We've got a lot of talent back there," Washington said, referring to cornerback. "If they stay healthy and improve, we're going to have to make some tough decisions."
The backups at safety might be unproven, but at least someone like Roman, who proved he couldn't play, no longer is around to muck up the depth chart.
Four years ago last month, Pro Football Weekly ranked Woodson as the best cornerback in the National Football League. Two years ago, he was No. 4. Last year, he was No. 9. Today, he is No. 21.
Injuries, including two broken legs in the last three years, and some off-field problems have hurt his performance level. The last of his three selections to the Pro Bowl was the '01 season. He had 10 interceptions in his first three seasons, seven in the last five.
After a decent showing in the post-draft minicamp, Woodson irritated the Packers by blowing off the rest of their off-season program. Coach Mike McCarthy dispatched Washington to get a read.
"He wasn't in the best shape at the minicamp, but I saw him two weeks ago and he will be ready," said Washington. "I think he still can do it. Age won't even matter."
Woodson, 29, has been prone to double-moves over the years but also anticipates well and can outmuscle some receivers. He's a fierce tackler, effective slot blitzer and still probably fast enough to match up with most receivers.
"Until he got hurt last year he was our best defensive player," one Raiders personnel man said. "He was the most physical corner in the league for years. He's had some bad breaks with that leg. At this point I'd move him to free safety. He'd be an all-pro."
Harris, ranked No. 12 by PFW, might have played even a bit better than that for the first 12 games before finishing on a rather poor note. He will be 32 in December and isn't happy about his contract, but the Packers love his professionalism and don't expect him to slip any time soon.
"He knows if there's a real fast receiver he's not going to be as aggressive," Washington said. "Because if he misses, his chances of him catching up aren't that great. He understands his opponent."
Carroll took a small step last season toward becoming a suitable starter and then, after his position was assigned to Woodson, didn't seem to pout and apparently improved some more.
"You'll see," said Washington. "I don't want to say too much about him right now. I think the kid has really started to mature. He's really coming on. I think his adjustment to the ball has improved big-time."
Secondary coach Kurt Schottenheimer, who helped coach Carroll as a rookie before spending last year in St. Louis, said, "He may be the best corner on this team in a couple years. The way Ahmad has handled this whole thing has been very exciting. Ahmad Carroll has been beat up about as much as a guy can be beat up. I'm impressed and proud of him."
Mike Hawkins added 8 pounds to his string-bean frame, which the coaches hope will translate into more tenacious coverage and less timid tackling. He will be pushed by rookie Will Blackmon, holdover Jason Horton and Patrick Dendy.
"Blackmon has great ball skills because he played wide receiver," said Washington. "Horton's strength is playing the ball downfield. Dendy is playing his techniques better and is really improved."
Collins made almost no big plays as a rookie but didn't give up many, either. He's fast, a hard hitter and appears to think well enough on his feet. With a proven communicator like Manuel directing traffic next to him, his impact might increase.
"He's more physical than Roman," one Seahawks official said, referring to Manuel. "He attacks the line of scrimmage. You wouldn't say he's a great athlete but he plays with intensity. One thing you could say was his weakness would be ball skills."
Manuel struck Schottenheimer, as well as the staff in Seattle, as a committed individual with a focus on team.
Unless the Packers sign a veteran, the top candidates for the backup safety jobs would be Marviel Underwood, rookie Tyrone Culver and returnee Atari Bigby.
Asked to compare this personnel to what he left behind after being dismissed by Mike Sherman, Schottenheimer said, "The (Mike) McKenzie thing made things a little bit fuzzy. Where we were then and where we are now, hell, we're going to be better."
They couldn't be any worse.
*************************
At a Glance
The 15 defensive backs on the Green Bay roster as training camp begins. Each player is listed with height, weight, age, how acquired and college. Acquisition categories: UFA means unrestricted free agent, T means trade, D1 means first-round draft choice and FA means free agent.
Cornerbacks at a Glance
Player Ht. Wt. Age Acquired College
CHARLES WOODSON
6-1
205 29
UFA-'06
Michigan
Named to start in 1999 and 2001 Pro Bowls, and was named a backup in ’00. Finished Raiders’ career with 396 tackles, 17 interceptions, five sacks and three TDs.
AL HARRIS
6-1
185 32
T-'03
Texas A&M-Kingsville
Played 96% of the snaps in ’03, 99% in ’04 and 97% in ’05. Allowed 13 1/2 plays of 20 yards or more and three TD passes in ’03, 14 1/2 and eight TD passes in ’04 and 81/2 and two TD passes in ’05, his finest season.
AHMAD CARROLL
5-9 1/2
190 22
D1-'04
Arkansas
Led the defense in penalties for the second straight year with nine. Also, led the team by giving up 9 1/2 plays of 20 yards or more.
MIKE HAWKINS
6-1 1/2
187 27
D5-'05
Oklahoma
Played 16% of the downs, mostly as the No. 3 corner from Week 8 on after the release of Joey Thomas. Allowed just one-half play of 20 yards or more and one TD pass.
WILL BLACKMON
6- 1/2
198 21
D4-'06
Boston College
The 14th cornerback selected in the draft. At the combine, he worked with the wide receivers, the position he played in ’05. Scored 31 on the Wonderlic, ran 4.47 and had jumps of 41 inches (vertical) and 11-1 (broad jump).
JASON HORTON
6-0
190 26 FA-'04
North Carolina A&T
On the field for 44 snaps in ’04 and 104 in ’05. Went on injured reserve with torn shoulder two days after allowing a 35-yard go route to Minnesota’s Marcus Robinson. It probably was the team’s most costly mental mistake of the season.
PATRICK DENDY
6-0
190 24
FA-'05
Rice
Started 29 of 42 games at Rice but didn’t play any football in ’04. Promoted from the Packers’ practice squad to active roster for final eight games of ’05 and got in on 13 snaps from scrimmage.
THERRIAN FONTENOT
5-11
187 24
FA-'05
Fresno State
Caught the Packers’ eye during August ’05 workouts against Buffalo as a Bills rookie free agent. Spent most of ’05 on the Packers’ practice squad. Defended nine passes as nickel back for Rhein Fire in NFL Europe League this spring.
JERRON WISHOM
5-11 1/2
197 24
FA-'05
Louisiana Tech
Undrafted rookie cut by Houston last August, then spent nine weeks on the Packers’ practice squad and six weeks on roster. Played 30 snaps as No. 4 cornerback.
Safeties at a Glance
NICK COLLINS
5-11
200 22 D2-'05
Bethune-Cookman
Played 95% of the downs. Finished fourth on team in tackles (95) and second in missed tackles (19). Allowed merely four plays of 20 yards or more, and two TD passes.
MARQUAND MANUEL
6-0
209 27 UFA-'06
Florida
Drafted in sixth round by Bengals, for whom he started eight games in ’02 and one game in ’03 before being cut. Claimed by Seattle in September 2004, he started 10 regular-season and three playoff games in ’05.
MARVIEL UNDERWOOD
5-10 1/2
197 24 D4-'05
San Diego State
Played 212 snaps from scrimmage, serving as the dime safety in the last 12 games. Never made a play or even deflected a pass until forcing NFL MVP Shaun Alexander of Seattle to fumble in Week 16. Led special teams in tackles with 23 but had little impact.
TYRONE CULVER
6-1
200 23 D6-'06
Fresno State
Two-year starter with 178 tackles, five interceptions and four sacks in four-year career. Scored 16 on the Wonderlic, ran 40 in 4.55 and had a 39½-inch vertical jump.
ATARI BIGBY
5-10 1/2
211 24
FA-'05
Central Florida
Started for Amsterdam in NFL Europe this spring, leading team in tackles (61) and posting one interception. Packers experimented with him at linebacker during ’05 practice-squad stint. Scored 23 on the Wonderlic.
TRA BOGER
6-0
210 23 FA-'06
Tulane
Started 30 of 50 games over five years. Finished with nine interceptions, seven forced fumbles, two sacks and 10 tackles for loss.