Pete Carroll agrees to coach Seattle

[Brando19]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/01/09/report-carroll-agrees-to-coach-seahawks/

Unless he drafts a QB...I don't think this will work out. What's the odds on him heading back to coach college in a couple years?

[Bretsky]

He had it made at USC; surprised he'd make this move but money talks

[mission]

I think he knows the USC athletic department has a hear-no, see-no attitude about certain things and that there's about to be some big drama in LA ...

He doesn't want his name around for that. I think he's actually a play-by-the-rules kind of guy but from the rumors I've heard, there's a lot of stuff going on out there. It's hard to control, it's Los Angeles.

This will allow him to get a chance under his own terms... if it doesn't work out, he can always make 5-6 mil a year coaching in the SEC.

[Bossman641]

I think he knows the USC athletic department has a hear-no, see-no attitude about certain things and that there's about to be some big drama in LA ...

He doesn't want his name around for that. I think he's actually a play-by-the-rules kind of guy but from the rumors I've heard, there's a lot of stuff going on out there. It's hard to control, it's Los Angeles.

This will allow him to get a chance under his own terms... if it doesn't work out, he can always make 5-6 mil a year coaching in the SEC.

I agree. I don't think he's gonna make it in the pros. He needed an out from USC with all the shit that's been going down there recently.

[Scott Campbell]

Anybody know a token minority candidate that they can trot out to satisfy the Rooney Rule?

[mission]

Anybody know a token minority candidate that they can trot out to satisfy the Rooney Rule?

I guess they're flying to Minneapolis today to interview Leslie Frazier for the job. Initially, he declined because he know it was just a technicality but I guess they made it real easy on him and he gave in. :lol:

[vince]

Leslie Frasier from Minny is heading to Seattle to be the Rooney puppet.

[Administrator]

Leslie Frasier from Minny is heading to Seattle to be the Rooney puppet.

Liewinski is in Minnesota, at least he was last night...

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/01/08/frazier-will-interview-with-seahawks-after-all/

[Fritz]

I heard some nimrod on Detroit radio yesterday whining about the Rooney rule and saying "Mike Tomlin was a nobody; he only got an interview in Pittsburgh because he's black."

Isn't Tomlin turning out okay as a coach?

Look, the group in power builds in advantages - the best jobs, the best educations, and on and on and on. Their children receive these advantages that others do not. You can do that crap "oh the color doesn't matter to me I want only the best qualified " but if one group has all the advantages, guess who's going to always be the best qualified???

As for Pete Carroll, I, like Bretsky, am surprised. I thought that dude was set for life at USC. I'm not sure why he'd want to come back to the NFL, unless he's convinced himself he needs to prove himself as an NFL coach.

We'll see how it goes.

[Joemailman]

The Rooney rule applies to front office jobs as well as head coaching jobs. I just wonder if it's still needed as far as coaches are concerned. Two of the last 3 Super Bowls were won by minority coaches. It will be 3 out of 4 if Indy wins it this year. Hard to believe that anyone still doubts whether minorities can coach.
I think the focus should probably be on promoting minority hiring in the front office.

[swede]

I think the focus should probably be on promoting minority hiring in the front office.

I think the focus should be on a color blind society. It's a shame to think that anyone would believe that the success of Mike Tomlin is due to the Rooney rule.

In the same fashion, any football organization that would overlook a quality front-office candidate because of skin color is doomed to fail, eventually, because of its own shortcomings. Contrived rules designed to make organizations look progressive wallpaper over real flaws as well as real progress.

[sheepshead]

I think the focus should probably be on promoting minority hiring in the front office.

I think the focus should be on a color blind society. It's a shame to think that anyone would believe that the success of Mike Tomlin is due to the Rooney rule.

In the same fashion, any football organization that would overlook a quality front-office candidate because of skin color is doomed to fail, eventually, because of its own shortcomings. Contrived rules designed to make organizations look progressive wallpaper over real flaws as well as real progress.

Well said. The sooner we stop talking about the color of a mans skin and look at his character the better off we'll be. (didnt someone say that once?)

[Fosco33]

Didn't he have a crappy NFL stint in the past? This wreaks of Saban-esqu...

Why not wait for the LA job? He'd have the town support at least. Hard part about LA - not many people who have money are from LA and generally support their hometown team.

[sheepshead]

Didn't he have a crappy NFL stint in the past? This wreaks of Saban-esqu...

Why not wait for the LA job? He'd have the town support at least. Hard part about LA - not many people who have money are from LA and generally support their hometown team.

The LA job?

[MJZiggy]

When the Vikings move and shitcan Childress.

[Scott Campbell]

It's a shame to think that anyone would believe that the success of Mike Tomlin is due to the Rooney rule.



+1

[Fosco33]

Didn't he have a crappy NFL stint in the past? This wreaks of Saban-esqu...

Why not wait for the LA job? He'd have the town support at least. Hard part about LA - not many people who have money are from LA and generally support their hometown team.

The LA job?

LA will have a team by 2011 or 12 - and presumably starting from near scratch even if it's a franchise move.

[Lurker64]

I heard some nimrod on Detroit radio yesterday whining about the Rooney rule and saying "Mike Tomlin was a nobody; he only got an interview in Pittsburgh because he's black."

Isn't Tomlin turning out okay as a coach?

Usually when you win a superbowl, you get a pass... at least for 3-4 years.

[Joemailman]

I think the focus should probably be on promoting minority hiring in the front office.

I think the focus should be on a color blind society. It's a shame to think that anyone would believe that the success of Mike Tomlin is due to the Rooney rule.

In the same fashion, any football organization that would overlook a quality front-office candidate because of skin color is doomed to fail, eventually, because of its own shortcomings. Contrived rules designed to make organizations look progressive wallpaper over real flaws as well as real progress.

Well said. The sooner we stop talking about the color of a mans skin and look at his character the better off we'll be. (didnt someone say that once?)

Clearly minority hiring in the NFL was a problem before the Rooney rule. There had been 7 minority head coaches in the entire history of the NFL prior to the Rooney rule. There are now 6, of which 3 are in the playoffs. Did minorities suddenly become more qualified in the last 6 years? As I said earlier, I'm not sure The Rooney Rule is needed anymore in the head coaching circles. Not because it was a bad idea, but because it worked. Minorities are now getting chances they weren't getting before. I think it makes sense to see if the same positive results can be achieved in the front office.

[sheepshead]

Didn't he have a crappy NFL stint in the past? This wreaks of Saban-esqu...

Why not wait for the LA job? He'd have the town support at least. Hard part about LA - not many people who have money are from LA and generally support their hometown team.

The LA job?

LA will have a team by 2011 or 12 - and presumably starting from near scratch even if it's a franchise move.

In Theory. I'm well aware of the desires.

[MJZiggy]

Clearly minority hiring in the NFL was a problem before the Rooney rule. There had been 7 minority head coaches in the entire history of the NFL prior to the Rooney rule. There are now 6, of which 3 are in the playoffs. Did minorities suddenly become more qualified in the last 6 years? As I said earlier, I'm not sure The Rooney Rule is needed anymore in the head coaching circles. Not because it was a bad idea, but because it worked. Minorities are now getting chances they weren't getting before. I think it makes sense to see if the same positive results can be achieved in the front office.

Exactly.

[ICU81MI]

I still don't get why this guy would leave SC. He has the world's most comfortable job. I agree with those who say something must be brewing. Didn't their BBall coach just leave too?

[Bossman641]

I still don't get why this guy would leave SC. He has the world's most comfortable job. I agree with those who say something must be brewing. Didn't their BBall coach just leave too?

The NCAA is currently investigating both the football and basketball programs under allegations that they don't run a clean program (McKnight and Bust, etc.). My feeling is that Carroll knows the hammer is about to dropped and figured it's a good time to get out.

[Joemailman]

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/322930-space-needled

But the question that is in everyone's mind is: why now?

Carroll has been offered NFL positions since he began winning BCS bowl games on an annual basis. He had interviews with the Miami Dolphins and Atlanta Falcons in recent years, but always turned them down. The reason for his hesitancy was no doubt his wish to remain in control of an extremely successful traditional power, one where he had the power to make all (or most) decisions in regard to the program. This is not the modus operandi in the NFL, which trends toward more bureaucratic coaching structures.

But now it appears that Carroll has changed his mind. There could be several reasons for this. At the forefront of most people's minds is no doubt the ongoing investigation into the Reggie Bush issue, for which the Trojans' program and the head coach have taken a lot of heat. Recent developments with Joe McKnight, the running back held out of the Emerald Bowl due to issues concerning his use of an SUV have only exacerbated concern within the program. Add to that the recent self-imposed sanctions on the basketball team--levied by AD Mike Garrett--and you have a picture of an athletic department in turmoil. Tensions between Garrett and Carroll have been well-publicized in recent weeks, so given the issues at hand, a departure at this time may be his best opportunity to get out relatively unscathed.

If the NCAA or the university itself comes down hard on the football program (unlikely), what would Carroll's legacy be at USC? Most of the nation would look at this move as a John Calipari-like situation: escaping when the opportunity suits you and leaving the program in the dust to pick up the pieces. But Carroll will always be viewed in Los Angeles (the red half, anyway) as a consummate winner and one of the most dynamic sporting figures the city has seen in recent memory. Without the NFL, USC is football in southern California--along with the contributions of the improving but perennially underwhelming Bruins.

From races with Will Farrell to sideline chest bumps, smiles, taunting, and gesticulating, Carroll has made an indelible mark on one of college football's most storied programs. The departure--which came so suddenly--is certain to raise many eyebrows given the suspicious context of the move. But no one can doubt that, at least where the playing field is concerned, Pete Carroll is leaving the college game a winner.

[swede]

Clearly minority hiring in the NFL was a problem before the Rooney rule. There had been 7 minority head coaches in the entire history of the NFL prior to the Rooney rule. There are now 6, of which 3 are in the playoffs. Did minorities suddenly become more qualified in the last 6 years? As I said earlier, I'm not sure The Rooney Rule is needed anymore in the head coaching circles. Not because it was a bad idea, but because it worked. Minorities are now getting chances they weren't getting before. I think it makes sense to see if the same positive results can be achieved in the front office.

Excellent points!

One wonders, was there a Rooney rule that forced NFL teams to start black quarterbacks? Perhaps black quarterbacks became a part of the NFL landscape because their utility and not their skin color made a difference to teams who had more of an interest in winning than scoring points with the Reverend Jesse Jackson.

I don't particularly care if my team ever hires a black GM or team president, unless, of course, they had a chance to hire an excellent minority candidate and chose not to based upon complexion. That would be really disappointing to me on two fronts.

It's funny how rarely political issues enter the realm of football. I rarely disagree with Ty on football stuff. Did the "Rooney Rule" change hearts and minds in the NFL? I'm open to the possibility that maybe it did. But, more often one sees that rule leading to the silly and regrettable theater of pretend interviews for minority "candidates" to positions that have already been filled.

I believe in the power of competition and the pure quest for excellence as a vehicle to eventually discard prejudices in favor of quality. If the league pushes for more minority hirings in the front offices of the NFL, and if that push succeeds, I will have a request of my own:

My kid is a white tailback. In the name of social decency can we push for more opportunities for white kids at tailback and cornerback?

[Iron Mike]

The sooner we stop talking about the color of a mans skin and look at his character the better off we'll be. (didnt someone say that once?)

This is as close as I could get:

Last May, in Addis Ababa, I convened a meeting of Heads of African States and Governments. In three days, the thirty-two nations represented at that Conference demonstrated to the world that when the will and the determination exist, nations and peoples of diverse backgrounds can and will work together. In unity, to the achievement of common goals and the assurance of that equality and brotherhood which we desire.On the question of racial discrimination, the Addis Ababa Conference taught, to those who will learn, this further lesson:
That until the philosophy which holds one race superior and another inferior is finally and permanently discredited and abandoned; That until there are no longer first-class and second-class citizens of any nation; That until the color of a man's skin is of no more significance than the color of his eyes; That until the basic human rights are equally guaranteed to all without regard to race; That until that day, the dream of lasting peace and world citizenship and the rule of international morality will remain but a fleeting illusion, to be pursued but never attained; And until the ignoble and unhappy regimes that hold our brothers in Angola, in Mozambique and in South Africa in subhuman bondage have been toppled and destroyed; Until bigotry and prejudice and malicious and inhuman self-interest have been replaced by understanding and tolerance and good-will; Until all Africans stand and speak as free beings, equal in the eyes of all men, as they are in the eyes of Heaven; Until that day, the African continent will not know peace. We Africans will fight, if necessary, and we know that we shall win, as we are confident in the victory of good over evil. – Haile Selassie I

[The Leaper]

The NCAA is currently investigating both the football and basketball programs under allegations that they don't run a clean program (McKnight and Bust, etc.). My feeling is that Carroll knows the hammer is about to dropped and figured it's a good time to get out.

I agree. I don't think Pete knows anything for certain...but USC has already had to slap themself on the wrist for basketball violations, and probably will be spanked harder by the NCAA after the season IMO.

The football program sort of escaped scutiny when they were the darlings of the NCAA. However, the bloom is starting to fade from the USC rose. They were not a very good football team by elite program standards this year...and they aren't going to be a title contender next year either. The trangressions of the past might not get them in trouble...but you have to think if they got away with it once, they would continue to do it.

I'm guessing Pete realizes the program is one whistle blower away from a lot of trouble...and that step became a lot more probable when the basketball program made some ridiculous errors.

He had a good run at USC...now he can grab some cash...give the NFL one last shot...and I'm guessing Pete may return to college again 3-4 years down the road if the NFL doesn't pan out.

[pbmax]

One wonders, was there a Rooney rule that forced NFL teams to start black quarterbacks? Perhaps black quarterbacks became a part of the NFL landscape because their utility and not their skin color made a difference to teams who had more of an interest in winning than scoring points with the Reverend Jesse Jackson.
Talent pool. If no one is training them, where are you going to find them to hire? If prior to the Rooney Rule there hadn't been similar protests about hiring minority assistants, there would not have been any candidates to hire for HC when the Rooney Rule was implemented. As the Detroit Lions have learned, Head Coaches don't grow on trees, ready to be plucked by anyone smart enough to look in the right spot.

As for your emotional call to hire quality over complexion (or to please the Reverend), that's a straw man argument. Teams, if they want to succeed, should cast their net far and wide, interview as many qualified candidates as they can find and pick the best one.

But as evidence that fails to happen on a regular basis, I give you your sham minority interviews. Both Snyder and Allen have demonstrated that teams hire for illogical reasons and do not seek the best candidate based on interviews and will go out of their way to pretend they do. Then they hire someone based on name, recognition and media splash.

So what the sham interviews demonstrate to me, is not the ineffectual nature of the Rooney Rule, its a demonstration of the illogical nature of hiring by poorly managed businesses.

[Fritz]

In my opinion, PB has written the truth. A most excellent post, my man.

[Guiness]

ok, slightly OT here, but why did Mora get punted? Was it because they already had a tacit agreement with Carrol?

Mora was groomed for the job, I'm surprised they never gave it to him.

[Fritz]

Here's my other question: if Schneider from Green Bay was going to be interviewed for the GM job, is that out the door now since Carroll is being hired? That is, does Carroll get the dual GM/coach role? It's hard to imagine that not being the case - how messed up would that be to hire your coach and then your GM? I mean, Carroll would know he's more important than the GM and the GM would have no control over the guy. Thus, if the draft comes and Carroll wants player A and the GM wants player B, wouldn't Carroll just go over the guy's head and talk to the big bosses and get his way?

It sounds like Seattle might be setting itself up in a very Daniel Snyder-like way.

[swede]

So what the sham interviews demonstrate to me, is not the ineffectual nature of the Rooney Rule, its a demonstration of the illogical nature of hiring by poorly managed businesses.

Well managed businesses, then, require no Rooney rule, yes? They do the right thing in the name of success.

Poorly managed businesses, as you clearly show, will make bad decisions despite the Rooney rule.

Where, then, is the power of a rule to make people do the right thing?

Pete Carrol has his job. The Kabuki dance of the Rooney rule is played out, and all is well,especially since Leslie Frazier is piling up those frequent flier miles. He should be able to take his wife somewhere nice.

[Guiness]

Here's my other question: if Schneider from Green Bay was going to be interviewed for the GM job, is that out the door now since Carroll is being hired? That is, does Carroll get the dual GM/coach role? It's hard to imagine that not being the case - how messed up would that be to hire your coach and then your GM? I mean, Carroll would know he's more important than the GM and the GM would have no control over the guy. Thus, if the draft comes and Carroll wants player A and the GM wants player B, wouldn't Carroll just go over the guy's head and talk to the big bosses and get his way?

It sounds like Seattle might be setting itself up in a very Daniel Snyder-like way.

Have to think they're giving Carrol the keys - he's going to get the dual role.

Two things occur to me. One, Seattle should know better, after they had to relieve Holmgren of the GM duties. Two, that Holmgren will be pissed that they trust Carrol, who has shown nothing, with a job they felt they had to take from him.

[LP]

[ Two, that Holmgren will be pissed that they trust Carrol, who has shown nothing, with a job they felt they had to take from him.

Might make for an interesting game if Cleveland and Seattle were to play next year.