The Official We got bent over by the officials thread

[esoxx]

First of all, I realize that complaing about the officiating will come across as sour grapes and we should have made our own breaks, shouldn't have gotten down like we did, etc, al..

HOWEVAH,

Last play, obvious facemask!!!!!

Sorry, but when a team has scored 45 points and you get the 15 yd facemask penalty... you are on the way to the win. When did you see Kapinos on the field, they weren't going to stop the Pack from there.

Again....accuse me of sour grapes and focus on the other things they could of, should have done in the game.

That's a red herring.

They get the call they should have got (did you see the "roughing" call against Warner by Jenkins, but can't see Rodgers facemask being rearranged???), and the Packers are moving on to New Orleans.

Fuckin' refs! :x

[SkinBasket]

No two ways about it. We got fucked... again. I'll let others decide if that cost us the game or not, but we got fucked.

[packerbacker1234]

1. Facemask occur before or after the int/fumble
2. The bigger question, is if Rodgers Helemt was touched by a defender at all prior to the int/fumble. If it was, thats illegally touching of the QB, which overrides the play.

Minmally, the play should of been reviewed. The fact it wasn't leaves a lot of what if's on the table, and when it's a play of that magnitude, they need to review to make sure it's right. SOmeone upstairs didn't do their job. That was an impossible call to make live action.

[Sparkey]

His facemask was grabbed prior to losing the ball. The defender then yanked on it and pulled him down, never letting go. Should have been a 15 yard PF with Packers ball at the 40!

[mmmdk]

I think games are called differently during playoffs.

90-95% of the time that would've been called a facemask during regular season. Playoffs are called somewhat differently. Go figure as I can't !

Packers killed themselves on D but the none call on AR [facemask] won't get much media or that's my guess.

[Bossman641]

Sorry, but I can't place the blame on anyone but the defense. Although those missed calls were obviously huge

[green_bowl_packer]

Fitzgerald push-off on Woodson in the endzone? There were other calls too.

[Sparkey]

If you can call the penalty on Jenkins for touching Warners helmet, then YOU HAVE TO CALL that last facemask.

[mngolf19]

His facemask was grabbed prior to losing the ball. The defender then yanked on it and pulled him down, never letting go. Should have been a 15 yard PF with Packers ball at the 40!

On the fumble/int play it was after the ball was knocked loose. The defender hit the ball and grabbed Rodgers mask with the same hand. I don't know if that negates the penalty or not.

[mmmdk]

If you can call the penalty on Jenkins for touching Warners helmet, then YOU HAVE TO CALL that last facemask.

Crap! That actually makes it worse. Game has been played; so back on the horse is only remedy.

[esoxx]

His facemask was grabbed prior to losing the ball. The defender then yanked on it and pulled him down, never letting go. Should have been a 15 yard PF with Packers ball at the 40!

On the fumble/int play it was after the ball was knocked loose. The defender hit the ball and grabbed Rodgers mask with the same hand. I don't know if that negates the penalty or not.

Why would it matter if the ball was already knocked loose (if it was)? OL/DL are called for hands to the face type penalties for same type thing and they don't have the ball at all. :?:

[Brandon494]

If you can call the penalty on Jenkins for touching Warners helmet, then YOU HAVE TO CALL that last facemask.

OFT, should have been holding on Jenkins that play.

[mngolf19]

His facemask was grabbed prior to losing the ball. The defender then yanked on it and pulled him down, never letting go. Should have been a 15 yard PF with Packers ball at the 40!

On the fumble/int play it was after the ball was knocked loose. The defender hit the ball and grabbed Rodgers mask with the same hand. I don't know if that negates the penalty or not.

Why would it matter if the ball was already knocked loose (if it was)? OL/DL are called for hands to the face type penalties for same type thing and they don't have the ball at all. :?:

I'm not sure it does make a difference. I'm asking too. But we do see all kinds of things happen once a ball comes loose that wouldn't be allowed prior so..... don't know.

[ND72]

1. If you call illegal touching of the helmet on Warner, YOU HAVE TO call it later.

2. Fitzgerald's running over of Woodson is proof in the pudding that this is a Offensive Star driven league.

3. I don't care if it's sour grapes, but we straight up got screwed. Twice in OT Rodgers gets hit in the helmet, NO F'n call!?!

[SkinBasket]

3. I don't care if it's sour grapes, but we straight up got screwed. Twice in OT Rodgers gets hit in the helmet, NO F'n call!?!

It's been well established during the regular season that helmet to helmet hits on Rodgers aren't penalties. There's precedent for this.

[ND72]

3. I don't care if it's sour grapes, but we straight up got screwed. Twice in OT Rodgers gets hit in the helmet, NO F'n call!?!

It's been well established during the regular season that helmet to helmet hits on Rodgers aren't penalties. There's precedent for this.

Good point. He needs to whine to the officials more evidently.

[ThunderDan]

3. I don't care if it's sour grapes, but we straight up got screwed. Twice in OT Rodgers gets hit in the helmet, NO F'n call!?!

It's been well established during the regular season that helmet to helmet hits on Rodgers aren't penalties. There's precedent for this.

Good point. He needs to whine to the officials more evidently.

What he really needs is a SB ring like Manning, Manning, Warner and Brady.

Hey, that could be a law firm.

[TravisWilliams23]

I certainly hope these group of officials don't get another playoff
game this year. There were so many missed calls.

At least one of Fitzgerald's TD's should have been offensive pass
interference. The final series no helmet to helmet and the non-call
of the last play face mask were totally bullshit non-calls.

None of the announcers would touch any of the missed calls. I think
maybe the NFL has ordered them to keep any official bashing off
the air. What else could explain the non-comments?

I always hate to put the outcome on officiating, but this was in fact
decided by numerous bad non-calls.

[Fosco33]

1. If you call illegal touching of the helmet on Warner, YOU HAVE TO call it later.

2. Fitzgerald's running over of Woodson is proof in the pudding that this is a Offensive Star driven league.

3. I don't care if it's sour grapes, but we straight up got screwed. Twice in OT Rodgers gets hit in the helmet, NO F'n call!?!

They actually missed another PF when a defender hit Rodgers (as he side stepped the sack and threw a complete pass to Finley - which also garnered the PI).

[Freak Out]

Clearly the fix was in.

[Scott Campbell]

I hated the officiating today, but kept thinking that despite all the crap calls, we got severely outplayed and didn't deserve to win.

[Fosco33]

I hated the officiating today, but kept thinking that despite all the crap calls, we got severely outplayed and didn't deserve to win.
+1

[packers11]

http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcnorth/post/_/id/8719/did-missed-face-mask-cost-the-packers

I'm surprised a media site would even dare report about it

[channtheman]

No two ways about it. We got fucked... again. I'll let others decide if that cost us the game or not, but we got fucked.

Agreed. And yeah we gave up those points, so what. The refs, AGAIN, couldn't just fucking call the game how it should be called. BTW, Rodgers got butt fucked two plays in a row there. First a helmet to helmet, then the facemask.

[channtheman]

Fitzgerald push-off on Woodson in the endzone? There were other calls too.

Yeah Fitzgerald had TWO offensive pass interference calls that weren't called on BOTH of his TD's. Cards probably still score but still, the refs fucked up. And then I'll add this: Giaordiana (whatever his name is, the safety) retaliated and hit a Cardinal and got flagged. 2 or 3 of those happened against the Packers and no calls.

[pbmax]

Whatever you may think about the calls, no way was the fix in by the broadcasters. They would have paid handsomely for a shot at Vikes/Pack III.

[bobblehead]

You all forgot the dude that decided to shove finley while he was laying on the ground. Ref standing 5 feet away, finley jumped up looking for a flag, but hitting a guy well after the play isn't a penalty anymore than Fitz flattening Woodsen, Warner taking his helmet off on the field to yell at his teammate, or hitting rodgers helmet to helmet.

I will say we set the tone for the loss with our 2 immediate turnovers, but when your guys battle all the way back it would be nice to get a fair call.

PS...forgot to mention the only reason Jenkins slapped warner in the head is he was being obscenly held and back pedalling to warner with a guy grabbing his jersey.

[Smidgeon]

Fitzgerald push-off on Woodson in the endzone? There were other calls too.

Yeah Fitzgerald had TWO offensive pass interference calls that weren't called on BOTH of his TD's. Cards probably still score but still, the refs fucked up. And then I'll add this: Giaordiana (whatever his name is, the safety) retaliated and hit a Cardinal and got flagged. 2 or 3 of those happened against the Packers and no calls.

Except for those two "incidents" with Fitzgerald, has Woodson ever fallen down twice on routes like that? They weren't "he slipped on the field" or "he dove for the ball" moments. I think he kept sitting up expecting to see flags after those moves to see TDs instead...

[Harlan Huckleby]

The two non-calls on the final series of the game weren't flagrant. I didn't see Rogers head get twisted by the face mask, which is usually when the refs notice it. The helmet-to-helmet was a little more nasty, but its the sort of play that gets called about half the time.

I would say the Packers got screwed, but gently, with ample lubrication.

[pbmax]

You all forgot the dude that decided to shove finley while he was laying on the ground. Ref standing 5 feet away, finley jumped up looking for a flag, but hitting a guy well after the play isn't a penalty anymore than Fitz flattening Woodsen, Warner taking his helmet off on the field to yell at his teammate, or hitting rodgers helmet to helmet.

I will say we set the tone for the loss with our 2 immediate turnovers, but when your guys battle all the way back it would be nice to get a fair call.

PS...forgot to mention the only reason Jenkins slapped warner in the head is he was being obscenly held and back pedalling to warner with a guy grabbing his jersey.
That might have been legit. Was Finley down by contact or not? Usually if there is a question, officials will allow additional contact. The replay didn't show how he went down and there was no sound to indicate a whistle.

[Guiness]

That might have been legit. Was Finley down by contact or not? Usually if there is a question, officials will allow additional contact. The replay didn't show how he went down and there was no sound to indicate a whistle.

Thanks for the reminder of that one bobble, I'd forgotten, but noticed it at the time. The one on Finley was bs.

The way I saw it, the play was well over, and it should have been an unsportmanlike or taunting call - similar to the one Chillar got a while back.

IIRC, this is how it went.

Finley was sitting on his butt, didn't even have the ball anymore; it was lying on the ground beside him. Cardinal player comes over, I thought he was going to give Finley a hand and help him up, instead he shoves his shoulder pad. Not hard, but gives him a shove.

If the player thought the play was still live, he would've picked up the ball, not made contact.

Finley looks over at the ref who was pretty much standing right there and shrugs. Ref does nothing.

[Smidgeon]

That might have been legit. Was Finley down by contact or not? Usually if there is a question, officials will allow additional contact. The replay didn't show how he went down and there was no sound to indicate a whistle.

Thanks for the reminder of that one bobble, I'd forgotten, but noticed it at the time. The one on Finley was bs.

The way I saw it, the play was well over, and it should have been an unsportmanlike or taunting call - similar to the one Chillar got a while back.

IIRC, this is how it went.

Finley was sitting on his butt, didn't even have the ball anymore; it was lying on the ground beside him. Cardinal player comes over, I thought he was going to give Finley a hand and help him up, instead he shoves his shoulder pad. Not hard, but gives him a shove.

If the player thought the play was still live, he would've picked up the ball, not made contact.

Finley looks over at the ref who was pretty much standing right there and shrugs. Ref does nothing.

I have no problem with that non-call. Finley initiated that one. He was tackled and didn't even give the defender a chance to stand up before he started pushing him off his legs and trying to yank away. I'm sure words were spoken. I think the refs did a good job of letting a minor retaliation get by.

[Guiness]

Fitzgerald push-off on Woodson in the endzone? There were other calls too.

Yeah Fitzgerald had TWO offensive pass interference calls that weren't called on BOTH of his TD's. Cards probably still score but still, the refs fucked up. And then I'll add this: Giaordiana (whatever his name is, the safety) retaliated and hit a Cardinal and got flagged. 2 or 3 of those happened against the Packers and no calls.

+1 to the bolded. We got some bad calls, but truth is that Arizona failed to score on 2 possessions, one of which was a missed, very makeable, field goal.

[bigcoz75]

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/story/12768056/wildcard-judgements-officials-screw-pack-pats-miss-seymour

[mngolf19]

One thing mentioned on the radio today. On the last play, there is only 1 official that is following the QB and he wouldn't have seen a face mask due to following the loose ball at that point. Also, had the face mask been called it still would have been Cards ball in Pack territory with 15 tacked on. Just not an immediate TD as it played out.

[ThunderDan]

One thing mentioned on the radio today. On the last play, there is only 1 official that is following the QB and he wouldn't have seen a face mask due to following the loose ball at that point. Also, had the face mask been called it still would have been Cards ball in Pack territory with 15 tacked on. Just not an immediate TD as it played out.

I am not sure on that. ARI didn't have possesion of the ball when the facemasked occured.

I agree 100% to your statement if ARI had the ball in their hands at the time.

[Guiness]

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/story/12768056/wildcard-judgements-officials-screw-pack-pats-miss-seymour

Wow, two mentions of the refs bad calls yesterday.

I know a lot of stuff goes uncalled during a game, but with the emphasis on QB's and protecting them, I'm really surprised at the ones the Cards got away with on Rodgers.

[bigcoz75]

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/These-refs-will-never-be-accused-of-coddling-the?urn=nfl,212716

Popular topic today

[red]

i guess we did get the shaft

doesn't matter at this point, we're done and there's no way to fix it

all we can do now is sit back and relax and hope someone drags that worthless fucking ref out of his house in the middle of the night and burns him at the stake

[channtheman]

That might have been legit. Was Finley down by contact or not? Usually if there is a question, officials will allow additional contact. The replay didn't show how he went down and there was no sound to indicate a whistle.

Thanks for the reminder of that one bobble, I'd forgotten, but noticed it at the time. The one on Finley was bs.

The way I saw it, the play was well over, and it should have been an unsportmanlike or taunting call - similar to the one Chillar got a while back.

IIRC, this is how it went.

Finley was sitting on his butt, didn't even have the ball anymore; it was lying on the ground beside him. Cardinal player comes over, I thought he was going to give Finley a hand and help him up, instead he shoves his shoulder pad. Not hard, but gives him a shove.

If the player thought the play was still live, he would've picked up the ball, not made contact.

Finley looks over at the ref who was pretty much standing right there and shrugs. Ref does nothing.

I have no problem with that non-call. Finley initiated that one. He was tackled and didn't even give the defender a chance to stand up before he started pushing him off his legs and trying to yank away. I'm sure words were spoken. I think the refs did a good job of letting a minor retaliation get by.

My problem with the no call there is Giardiano did the same thing in the game (hit a Card in the shoulder pad) and was immediately flagged.

[mngolf19]

From rule book:

OFFICIALS' JURISDICTIONS, POSITIONS, AND DUTIES

Referee—General oversight and control of game. Gives signals for all fouls and is final authority for rule interpretations. Takes a position in backfield 10 to 12 yards behind line of scrimmage, favors right side (if quarterback is right-handed passer). Determines legality of snap, observes deep back(s) for legal motion. On running play, observes quarterback during and after handoff, remains with him until action has cleared away, then proceeds downfield, checking on runner and contact behind him. When runner is downed, Referee determines forward progress from wing official and, if necessary, adjusts final position of ball.

On pass plays, drops back as quarterback begins to fade back, picks up legality of blocks by near linemen. Changes to complete concentration on quarterback as defenders approach. Primarily responsible to rule on possible roughing action on passer and if ball becomes loose, rules whether ball is free on a fumble or dead on an incomplete pass.


And the ball was considered a "loose ball" meaning no team had possession therefore any penalty that occurred during that time would have no affect on the determination of who gets the ball. The way we know it was considered a "loose ball" is due to the fact it was called a fumble and not an int.

[bobblehead]

You all forgot the dude that decided to shove finley while he was laying on the ground. Ref standing 5 feet away, finley jumped up looking for a flag, but hitting a guy well after the play isn't a penalty anymore than Fitz flattening Woodsen, Warner taking his helmet off on the field to yell at his teammate, or hitting rodgers helmet to helmet.

I will say we set the tone for the loss with our 2 immediate turnovers, but when your guys battle all the way back it would be nice to get a fair call.

PS...forgot to mention the only reason Jenkins slapped warner in the head is he was being obscenly held and back pedalling to warner with a guy grabbing his jersey.
That might have been legit. Was Finley down by contact or not? Usually if there is a question, officials will allow additional contact. The replay didn't show how he went down and there was no sound to indicate a whistle.

finley was down and had set the football aside if I remember right, the guy who tackled him was likely the same one that decided to shove him about 4 seconds after the play and everyone else was standing around.

[bobblehead]

From rule book:

OFFICIALS' JURISDICTIONS, POSITIONS, AND DUTIES

Referee—General oversight and control of game. Gives signals for all fouls and is final authority for rule interpretations. Takes a position in backfield 10 to 12 yards behind line of scrimmage, favors right side (if quarterback is right-handed passer). Determines legality of snap, observes deep back(s) for legal motion. On running play, observes quarterback during and after handoff, remains with him until action has cleared away, then proceeds downfield, checking on runner and contact behind him. When runner is downed, Referee determines forward progress from wing official and, if necessary, adjusts final position of ball.

On pass plays, drops back as quarterback begins to fade back, picks up legality of blocks by near linemen. Changes to complete concentration on quarterback as defenders approach. Primarily responsible to rule on possible roughing action on passer and if ball becomes loose, rules whether ball is free on a fumble or dead on an incomplete pass.


And the ball was considered a "loose ball" meaning no team had possession therefore any penalty that occurred during that time would have no affect on the determination of who gets the ball. The way we know it was considered a "loose ball" is due to the fact it was called a fumble and not an int.

which was the wrong call...arm was clearly moving forward. If ARod isn't facemasked he likely doesn't kick the ball back up to be intercepted. Look, I'm sour grapes about the whole game being officiated for shit, not that one play.

[mraynrand]

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/These-refs-will-never-be-accused-of-coddling-the?urn=nfl,212716

Popular topic today

From the article:
"First, on second-and-10, Rodgers dumped the ball off to Jarrett Bush(notes) on a play that went for about 15 yards. We actually did see a flag there, but it was for holding on the Packers, not the blatant helmet-to-helmet hit Rodgers took after getting rid of the ball."



Jarrett Bush?

Lot of credibility there.

[channtheman]

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/These-refs-will-never-be-accused-of-coddling-the?urn=nfl,212716

Popular topic today

From the article:
"First, on second-and-10, Rodgers dumped the ball off to Jarrett Bush(notes) on a play that went for about 15 yards. We actually did see a flag there, but it was for holding on the Packers, not the blatant helmet-to-helmet hit Rodgers took after getting rid of the ball."



Jarrett Bush?

Lot of credibility there.

I saw that too. Probably thought the number read 24 and have no clue about anything so they just put his name in there. Credibility or not though, there were 3 penalties on Rodgers, helmet to helmet, then a hand to the face, then a facemask. For none of those to be called is just amazing.

[hoosier]

I think Charles Woodson, when asked about the questionable non-call on Fitzgerald, said it best: "It is what it is. I don't cry about those things. Could they have called it? Probably. But I just give those guys credit. They made the plays they needed to make. And that's the bottom line."

[ThunderDan]

Well... I did the research and if a facemask was called it should have been the Packers ball plus 15 yards.

Here it is:
Article 3 A Loose Ball is a live ball that is not in player possession, i.e., any kick, pass,
or fumble. A loose ball that has not yet struck the ground is In Flight. A loose ball (either
during or after flight) is considered in possession of team (offense) whose player
kicked, passed, or fumbled. It ends when a player secures possession or when

Article 13 When a defensive foul occurs during a running play (3-27-2) and the run
in which the foul occurs is followed by a change of possession, the spot of enforcement
is the spot of the foul and ball reverts to offensive team. See 14-1-12- Exc. 5.
Exceptions:
1) When the spot of a foul is in advance of the spot where the offensive player lost
possession, the spot of enforcement is the spot where player possession was lost
and the ball reverts to offensive team.
2) When the spot of a foul by the defense is at, behind, or beyond the line of scrimmage,
and such foul incurs a penalty that results in the offensive team being short
of the line, the ball will be advanced to the previous spot.
Note: When there are multiple fouls by the defense, enforcement should benefit the offense
the most.
A.R. 14.19 Second-and-10 on A30. Runner A1 goes to the A40 where he fumbles and B1 recovers.
During A1’s run, B2 held on the line of scrimmage (A30).
R uling : Penalize from the spot of the foul on change of possession. A’s ball firstand-
10 on A35.
A.R. 14.20 Second-and-10 on A30. Runner A1 goes to the A40 where he fumbles and B1 recovers.
During A1’s run, B2 held on the A45.
Ruling: Enforce from the spot where the offensive player A1 lost possession as the foul
was in advance of where player A1 lost possession. If Team A had been the only one to
foul, Team B would refuse the penalty and keep the ball. A’s ball first-and-10 on A45.
A.R. 14.21 Second-and-10 on A30. Quarterback A1 scrambles to A20, fumbles and B1 recovers.
During A1’s scramble, B2 holds at A22.
Ruling: A’s ball first-and-10 on A30. See 14-1-13-Exc. 2.

So change of possesion doesn't occur until the ARI player has control of the ball. Therefore the ball reverts back to the Packers.

See what the internet and 15 minutes will find ya!

[MichiganPackerFan]

3. I don't care if it's sour grapes, but we straight up got screwed. Twice in OT Rodgers gets hit in the helmet, NO F'n call!?!

It's been well established during the regular season that helmet to helmet hits on Rodgers aren't penalties. There's precedent for this.

Good point. He needs to whine to the officials more evidently.


OH! You're talking about the "Warner Whine" it DOES work for him....

[MichiganPackerFan]

That might have been legit. Was Finley down by contact or not? Usually if there is a question, officials will allow additional contact. The replay didn't show how he went down and there was no sound to indicate a whistle.

Thanks for the reminder of that one bobble, I'd forgotten, but noticed it at the time. The one on Finley was bs.

The way I saw it, the play was well over, and it should have been an unsportmanlike or taunting call - similar to the one Chillar got a while back.

IIRC, this is how it went.

Finley was sitting on his butt, didn't even have the ball anymore; it was lying on the ground beside him. Cardinal player comes over, I thought he was going to give Finley a hand and help him up, instead he shoves his shoulder pad. Not hard, but gives him a shove.

If the player thought the play was still live, he would've picked up the ball, not made contact.

Finley looks over at the ref who was pretty much standing right there and shrugs. Ref does nothing.

I have no problem with that non-call. Finley initiated that one. He was tackled and didn't even give the defender a chance to stand up before he started pushing him off his legs and trying to yank away. I'm sure words were spoken. I think the refs did a good job of letting a minor retaliation get by.

But the same thing happened early in the game when the Cards player initiated and we were flagged for the the shove and 15 yards. THe refs established precedent on how they were going to call the game. They called identical infractions for AZ, but not for GB on numerous occasions.

[MichiganPackerFan]

From rule book:

...

I'm not overly concerned with the technicalities of the rule book. THe officials determine how they are going to call the game. If they set precedent by calling something one way, the must follow that precedent in identical situations the other way. This can't be a home team gets the calls league, its not the NBA. If the calls are missed consistently or called strictly on both sides of the ball, its still mostly a fair competition (provided it doesn't clearly benefit or hinder one team's style of play). If they are enforced against one team only, it's clearly not fair competition.

[Pugger]

Check this out.

http://www.espnmilwaukee.com/audiovault/homer.php

Listen to the interview with Bill Carollo. He talks about several of the calls in Sunday's game.

But my main beef is the amount of abuse Rodgers had endured this year. The facemask is just one. That helmet to helmet non-call on Sunday was ridiculous and it isn't the first time defenders got away with this crap. It happened last month in Pittsburgh too. I was under the impression the league was into protecting QBs but I guess if you aren't a Peyton Manning or Tom Brady those rules just don't apply. :roll:

[Pugger]

oops! :oops:

[MadtownPacker]

I would say the Packers got screwed, but gently, with ample lubrication.Well well, look what we have here. Thought this bitch was dead. Nothing good ever happens for me.

[Joemailman]

Check this out.

http://www.espnmilwaukee.com/audiovault/homer.php

Listen to the interview with Bill Carollo. He talks about several of the calls in Sunday's game.

But my main beef is the amount of abuse Rodgers had endured this year. The facemask is just one. That helmet to helmet non-call on Sunday was ridiculous and it isn't the first time defenders got away with this crap. It happened last month in Pittsburgh too. I was under the impression the league was into protecting QBs but I guess if you aren't a Peyton Manning or Tom Brady those rules just don't apply. :roll:

The marquee guys always get protected more. I can remember early in Favre's career feeling he didn't get protected like Montana and Marino. That changed over time. Arod isn't quite there yet, although this game may have gotten him closer.

[VegasPackFan]

I am far more pissed about the non call on the helmet to helmet hit on second down than anything else that happened that night. There is just no technicality or anything else to excuse not making that call. If that correct call is made the down and distance is completely different and the game goes down a different path.

BUT! If Rodgers makes the first down throw connection none of this matters and we are talking about one of the greatest performances ever. He would have finished with 5 TD passes and 500 yds in the game.

The fact that he missed that last throw actually brings me some level of comfort. I was at the game that night, and we didnt get to see the replays and such at the time. I kept saying, "well, if Rodgers hits Jennings on that first play it would have been over".

Re-watched the game on tv last night and Aikman clearly stated that he felt the refs missed the helmet to helmet call on that play. So dont say they glossed over it because they didnt.