Next year

[HarveyWallbangers]

We get some OT(s) and CB(s) in offseason and this team is a Super Bowl favorite in 2010. Wait'll next year!

[retailguy]

We get some OT(s) and CB(s) in offseason and this team is a Super Bowl favorite in 2010. Wait'll next year!

I thought there was nothing wrong with the OL? I don't understand.

[Brandon494]

We get some OT(s) and CB(s) in offseason and this team is a Super Bowl favorite in 2010. Wait'll next year!

I'm sorry but we will never be a SB favorite with MM as the HC.

[ThunderDan]

We get some OT(s) and CB(s) in offseason and this team is a Super Bowl favorite in 2010. Wait'll next year!

I thought there was nothing wrong with the OL? I don't understand.

Age, Cliify and Tausch are old. Need to find their replacement ASAP and get that Barbre guy off the roster. I don't know if his head will ever be right again after the first couple of weeks.

[retailguy]

We get some OT(s) and CB(s) in offseason and this team is a Super Bowl favorite in 2010. Wait'll next year!

I thought there was nothing wrong with the OL? I don't understand.

Age, Cliify and Tausch are old. Need to find their replacement ASAP and get that Barbre guy off the roster. I don't know if his head will ever be right again after the first couple of weeks.

I'd happily keep tausch & cliffy over spitz, wells, colledge, giancomi and barbre.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Our OTs played well enough to win (once Tauscher was resigned). They battled but they are old. What's your point? I didn't say the OTs were bad this year, but we need to find a replacement for them this offseason. And as far as I'm concerned, you are as bad as any of the pro-Favre and anti-Favre baiters. Your number of posts is staggering after a loss. After a win, not so much. Of course, you'll whine about somebody calling you out on it.

[retailguy]

Our OTs played well enough to win (once Tauscher was resigned). They battled but they are old. What's your point? I didn't say the OTs were bad this year, but we need to find a replacement for them this offseason. And as far as I'm concerned, you are as bad as any of the pro-Favre and anti-Favre baiters. Your number of posts is staggering after a loss. After a win, not so much. Of course, you'll whine about somebody calling you out on it.

whatever Harv. I posted many times last week after a convincing win, and was laughed at a ridiculed, by you among the other fools.

Most of the time it is pointless to waste my time because you guys "know it all". Maybe we should bump some of the "over positive" quotes from last week?

[Freak Out]

This team should only get better right? Without Al and Kampy we still make the playoffs and take the division champ to OT.

[esoxx]

We get some OT(s) and CB(s) in offseason and this team is a Super Bowl favorite in 2010. Wait'll next year!

I'm sorry but we will never be a SB favorite with MM as the HC.

Not hard to figure out how you voted in one of the two polls I started. :lol:

[Bretsky]

there are plenty of coaching staffs below ours out there. I've always thought MM was decent and still do. Capers sucked today but he is an above average DC. I think his life of work shows that.

[HarveyWallbangers]

To me, playoff games are a coin flip. Did Thompson give McCarthy, Capers, etc. enough players to make them a Super Bowl favorite? Probably not, but I'm convinced there was enough talent to compete for it. (And it's young.) Did McCarthy, Capers, etc. do the best coaching job in this game? No, but I think we have a darn good coaching staff. Did the players do enough? Close, but they made some mistakes. Just one of those things. People can talk about our defense, but in the second half of the season (after getting acclimated to the scheme) we had two bad games against two great QBs whose teams play the same defensive scheme that we do. They play against that defense every day. Conversely, are Pittsburgh and Arizona poor defenses that should give up 36 and 45 points to us? No. I do think we got hurt by 3 of our top 5 corners getting injured. Two teams that have a good QB, deep receiving corps, and a coaching staff that really knows our defensive scheme exposed our pass defense. Jarret Bush was supposed to be a special team's player and backup safety. He ended up playing in the nickel. I wish we had somebody different, but I don't know how many teams go 6 deep at corner. So, what do we need to do next year? Stay the course. Add some young OTs and some corners that can play right away. Improve the special teams. We need a punter. I like Blackmon as a returner, but he hasn't stayed healthy, so they likely need to go in another direction. Fortunately, I don't think we have a lot of holes to fill.

[CaliforniaCheez]

1) Harris and Woodson are aging. A quality CB is the highest priority. Better can be found than Blackmon, Bush, and Lee.

2) Defensive line depth. The Packers were lucky both Jolly and Jenkins were healthy this season. They may not be next season. There are better 3-4 guys to be had than Harrell and Montgomery.

3) Clifton is gone. Lang may or may not be the replacement. There is a hole in the roster and a slipping Tauscher (who for years never had a holding call) will require quality depth.

4) Safety depth. They need a good #3 who can challenge Collins and Bigby for playing time. The Packers lack depth there.

5) RB Grant is the runner and Jackson as a 3rd down back could be better. An RB to share the load and be an injury replacement is needed. Quality depth that can challenge the starter is needed. If he is a good return man it would be a huge bonus.

6) They may not need to draft one but the Packers need a better punter.

7) I am okay with Havner at #3 TE (ST and LB emergency depth helps) and Finley as the #1 TE. Donald Lee has too many drops. An OT can always be a blocking TE. A better TE could be found.

8) A good fast return man that will take off running instead of dancing around with the ball.

9) A young QB for the practice squad with some potential for moving up in the future.

10) A Center? He may be a practice squad guy but somebody that can handle it on an as needed basis.


That is my top 10. I hope the top 5 are addressed in the draft. Perhaps the top 2 addressed twice. RB's are cheap and can be found easier than punters.

[Smidgeon]

1) Harris and Woodson are aging. A quality CB is the highest priority. Better can be found than Blackmon, Bush, and Lee.

2) Defensive line depth. The Packers were lucky both Jolly and Jenkins were healthy this season. They may not be next season. There are better 3-4 guys to be had than Harrell and Montgomery.

3) Clifton is gone. Lang may or may not be the replacement. There is a hole in the roster and a slipping Tauscher (who for years never had a holding call) will require quality depth.

4) Safety depth. They need a good #3 who can challenge Collins and Bigby for playing time. The Packers lack depth there.

5) RB Grant is the runner and Jackson as a 3rd down back could be better. An RB to share the load and be an injury replacement is needed. Quality depth that can challenge the starter is needed. If he is a good return man it would be a huge bonus.

6) They may not need to draft one but the Packers need a better punter.

7) I am okay with Havner at #3 TE (ST and LB emergency depth helps) and Finley as the #1 TE. Donald Lee has too many drops. An OT can always be a blocking TE. A better TE could be found.

8) A good fast return man that will take off running instead of dancing around with the ball.

9) A young QB for the practice squad with some potential for moving up in the future.

10) A Center? He may be a practice squad guy but somebody that can handle it on an as needed basis.


That is my top 10. I hope the top 5 are addressed in the draft. Perhaps the top 2 addressed twice. RB's are cheap and can be found easier than punters.

1) Jury's still out on Lee. Could be his injuries are because he needed a couple years to fill out his frame and adjust to the physicality of the NFL. It happens.

2) D-Line had good (but I agree not great) depth with Raji and maybe Wynn. As for 3-4 fits, Harrell is the prototypical build (apparently). His problem isn't fit for the scheme, but staying on the field. Personally, I don't expect him to stay healthy, but I am guessing that a full year of just focusing on his health and getting his body into the best possible shape will bring him back to be effective in D-line rotation.

3) Depending on what LTs are available, Clifton might come back as a backup or a patch. Same with Tausch.

4) Agreed. Except with the insinuation that Collins should be taken off the field. I like him as a player a lot. Doesn't make a lot of mistakes. I think this year they used him more as the final defense because of the inconsistency (due to injuries) in the SS position than in years past.

5) Less worried about RB than other positions. Grant is serviceable and (as long as he doesn't get injured) can man the spot for another year. He patches a hole effectively. He isn't a top-tier RB, but there are so few of them out there and I'd definitely prefer him over some of the others. After all, GB is a passing team with top-tier talents in Jennings, Rodgers, and Finley.

6) Absolutely agree. But at the same time, when their offense is clicking, they don't really use the punter.

7) As far as #2 TEs go, I think Lee is pretty good. Finley will be a great #1 and Havner a very effective #3. But for #2, Lee is good. Sure he drops passes, but you could do a lot worse for a #2 TE.

8) I will counter and say ST blocking that gives the KR lanes to run in.

9) Don't think we have to worry about this one. TT seems to constantly be checking out QBs. I imagine he'll draft another one late round this year.

10) I think GB is set with centers with Spitz, Deitrich-Smith, and/or Wells. Maybe even in that order. Don't know where DS fits, but I think he'll only get better.

I didn't pick on this list because I don't like what you said. Your post just made me think. Good ideas.

[Bossman641]

One thing that I haven't seen discussed in detail anywhere is how the lack of a CBA will effect the free agents this year.

My gut feeling is that the FA class this year will be trash as younger guys like Collins who would be FA's this year won't hit the market. I would expect the only free agents to be older players.

[RashanGary]

To me, playoff games are a coin flip. Did Thompson give McCarthy, Capers, etc. enough players to make them a Super Bowl favorite? Probably not, but I'm convinced there was enough talent to compete for it. (And it's young.) Did McCarthy, Capers, etc. do the best coaching job in this game? No, but I think we have a darn good coaching staff. Did the players do enough? Close, but they made some mistakes. Just one of those things. People can talk about our defense, but in the second half of the season (after getting acclimated to the scheme) we had two bad games against two great QBs whose teams play the same defensive scheme that we do. They play against that defense every day. Conversely, are Pittsburgh and Arizona poor defenses that should give up 36 and 45 points to us? No. I do think we got hurt by 3 of our top 5 corners getting injured. Two teams that have a good QB, deep receiving corps, and a coaching staff that really knows our defensive scheme exposed our pass defense. Jarret Bush was supposed to be a special team's player and backup safety. He ended up playing in the nickel. I wish we had somebody different, but I don't know how many teams go 6 deep at corner. So, what do we need to do next year? Stay the course. Add some young OTs and some corners that can play right away. Improve the special teams. We need a punter. I like Blackmon as a returner, but he hasn't stayed healthy, so they likely need to go in another direction. Fortunately, I don't think we have a lot of holes to fill.


Nice post, Harv. That was a tough loss. It's not all bad though. They played really well in some areas, kept putting out fires as the season went on and have really identified their weaknesses. They sure looked like they belonged on the field with the defending NFC champs and hopefully this clinic Arizona put on, along with the Pittsburgh and Minnesota losses, serve as great teaching tools for how to shore up our defense. I'm proud of those guys, proud of the coaches. McCarthy has really impressed me in the 2nd half of the season. Just a really good season overall, and a fun ride as a fan.

[Deputy Nutz]

Really this team did a nice job at the end of the year, and going on the road in the playoffs is no easy task. I really hold no real fault with Thompson, and McCarthy is the coach so I am sure you can blame him some for the defeat.

This team's real weakness on Sunday and really against all teams they lost to is that without generating a pass rush this secondary has a very difficult time holding up which isn't all that different than any other secondary in the NFL.

The Packers need to improve their pass rush outside of #52, and they need a starting safety to go along with Collins. guys like Blackmon and Pat Lee are always injured and can't be counted on for the needed depth in the secondary.

[CaliforniaCheez]

One thing that I haven't seen discussed in detail anywhere is how the lack of a CBA will effect the free agents this year.

My gut feeling is that the FA class this year will be trash as younger guys like Collins who would be FA's this year won't hit the market. I would expect the only free agents to be older players.

College, Collins, Jolly and others can wait.

Pickett and Kampmann can't. Those decisions are important. Pickett has to stay. Not sure what Tauscher's status is but he deserves to stay.



Often when I mention positions, people get all defensive about the starters and ignore the rest of the 53 roster positions.

[Deputy Nutz]

One thing that I haven't seen discussed in detail anywhere is how the lack of a CBA will effect the free agents this year.

My gut feeling is that the FA class this year will be trash as younger guys like Collins who would be FA's this year won't hit the market. I would expect the only free agents to be older players.

College, Collins, Jolly and others can wait.

Pickett and Kampmann can't. Those decisions are important. Pickett has to stay. Not sure what Tauscher's status is but he deserves to stay.



Often when I mention positions, people get all defensive about the starters and ignore the rest of the 53 roster positions.

Kampman is gone. Pickett would be nice to have because of rotation purposes, but he isn't the starter going into next year.

[Smidgeon]

One thing that I haven't seen discussed in detail anywhere is how the lack of a CBA will effect the free agents this year.

My gut feeling is that the FA class this year will be trash as younger guys like Collins who would be FA's this year won't hit the market. I would expect the only free agents to be older players.

College, Collins, Jolly and others can wait.

Pickett and Kampmann can't. Those decisions are important. Pickett has to stay. Not sure what Tauscher's status is but he deserves to stay.



Often when I mention positions, people get all defensive about the starters and ignore the rest of the 53 roster positions.

Kampman is gone. Pickett would be nice to have because of rotation purposes, but he isn't the starter going into next year.

Why isn't he a starter going into next year? He holds the nose better than Raji and allows Raji to come in on passing downs. I would keep him for the base 3-4 and just that.

[ThunderDan]

Really this team did a nice job at the end of the year, and going on the road in the playoffs is no easy task. I really hold no real fault with Thompson, and McCarthy is the coach so I am sure you can blame him some for the defeat.

This team's real weakness on Sunday and really against all teams they lost to is that without generating a pass rush this secondary has a very difficult time holding up which isn't all that different than any other secondary in the NFL.

The Packers need to improve their pass rush outside of #52, and they need a starting safety to go along with Collins. guys like Blackmon and Pat Lee are always injured and can't be counted on for the needed depth in the secondary.

Spot on!

[ThunderDan]

One thing that I haven't seen discussed in detail anywhere is how the lack of a CBA will effect the free agents this year.

My gut feeling is that the FA class this year will be trash as younger guys like Collins who would be FA's this year won't hit the market. I would expect the only free agents to be older players.

College, Collins, Jolly and others can wait.

Pickett and Kampmann can't. Those decisions are important. Pickett has to stay. Not sure what Tauscher's status is but he deserves to stay.



Often when I mention positions, people get all defensive about the starters and ignore the rest of the 53 roster positions.

Kampman is gone. Pickett would be nice to have because of rotation purposes, but he isn't the starter going into next year.

Not sure on the Pickett thought. I wouldn't mind letting Raji get another year rotating and being in on passing downs. The kids what 22 or 23 and plays well. Just wait until he is 28 and has grown into his frame.

[HarveyWallbangers]

OFFENSE - very similar

1995 7th in yards; 6th in points
2009 6th in yards; 3rd in points

QB - eerily similar

1995 Brett Favre, 5th NFL season, 26 years old, 63 comp %, 4413 yards, 38 TDs, 13 int
2009 Aaron Rodgers, 5th NFL season, 26 years old, 64.7 comp %, 4434 yards, 30 TDs, 7 int

RB - Dorsey emerged on the scene; his clone is relatively the same age

1995 Dorsey Levens, #25, 25 years old
2009 Ryan Grant, #25, 26 years old

WR/TE - some weapons to work with on offense

1995 Robert Brooks, Keith Jackson, Mark Chmura
2009 Greg Jennings, Donald Driver, Jermichael Finley, James Jones, Jordy Nelson

OL - non-descript OL that had some veterans mixed with some young guys--none of them world beaters

DEFENSE - Both had defenses that were starting to emerge with veteran coordinators (Shurmur, Capers).

1995 14th in yards, 4th in points, 12th in sacks
2009 2nd in yards; 7th in points, 11th in sacks

Both had front 7s that were starting to show promise, solid LBs, one dynamic safety, solid starting corners with little depth behind them.

SPECIAL TEAMS - Both had decent kickers with good leg strength who were coming off down years. Jacke made 73.9 % of his FGs in 1995. Crosby made 75.0 % of his FGs in 2009. I believe both had bad punters and a return game that was pretty anemic.

What did Wolf do in the offseason? He mostly stayed the course. He had a good draft, signed a veteran defensive player in Eugene Robinson, and grabbed Desmond Howard off the scrapheap. I'd like to see a veteran OT signed (and just for Skin, perhaps a upgrade at safety), have a good draft where corner is addressed, and sign a good return man and punter.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Forgot to add. Both teams led by younger, offensive-minded coaches. Both are kind of hard-nosed but considered player's coaches. Also, both QBs played well in the playoff game that they lost on the road in a high scoring game--but both made a crucial mistake late in the game.

[MichiganPackerFan]

"safety depth"? What team has "safety depth". Having TWO safeties IS safety depth. Going three deep is like having three fullbacks. OH. Wait....

Seriously, need depth at CB and if need be, one can slide inside and fill the second safety spot...

[Joemailman]

Better in my opinion to have three quality safeties, in case of injury, one of whom can play in sub packages when injuries are not a problem.