Guys I feel bad for the most...

[packers11]

Woodson / Driver...

I wanted the packers to win the Superbowl Esp before Driver leaves GB... 2-3 year window max :(

[Brando19]

Yeah, I agree. Next year may be the year!

[retailguy]

Yeah, I agree. Next year may be the year!

not with this OL.

[Fritz]

Well, Driver did not have his best game today. Had he not fumbled on the second possession, this game may have turned out differently.

And he'll be back next year god willing. So I don't feel worse for him than anyone else. I like him, don't get me wrong. I just see next year as the year. If they can get that defense to improve on the pass rush.

[packers11]

oh... and Ahman Green

[Brando19]

Yeah, I agree. Next year may be the year!

not with this OL.

Exactly..that's why we shit can a few and bring some FA's in.

[Joemailman]

Harris and Kampman. I'm sure they're thinking this game might have been different if they could have been out there. I'm thinking that too.

[retailguy]

Yeah, I agree. Next year may be the year!

not with this OL.

Exactly..that's why we shit can a few and bring some FA's in.

are we firing ted? :whist: I mean, with the FA talk, we must be. :twisted:

[BallHawk]

Harris and Kampman. I'm sure they're thinking this game might have been different if they could have been out there. I'm thinking that too.

Harris, definitely. He was missed. Kampy, I'm not so sure. He woulda been just another liability in coverage.

[digitaldean]

I feel bad for Kampy and Al. Somewhat for DD also.

DD had a subpar game overall. We need to upgrade our O-line and secondary depth.

Coaching-wise, I think MM better look at how the D calls were going. Warner had a clean jersey and made 87% of his passes. Above average QB's riddled our secondary. Some of that was WITH Al Harris in there.

We know that TT isn't a wheeler-dealer in FA. But if he tries doing it all in the draft, that won't work either. He must realize that there is a very narrow window of opportunity. This team today had the chances, but they failed to execute when needed. Plus handing AZ 14 pts. off TO's hamstrung us.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Love how Retail Guy is all over the place after a loss.

[Joemailman]

Packnut should be here any minute.

[retailguy]

Love how Retail Guy is all over the place after a loss.

I had the day off. Been here everyday for a long time.... not much to say usually with all you know it alls! You guys can't shut up and hear a different point.

And you know, Harv. I do like to be right. This team was not ready. AZ was pissed, and played like it.

Sad part is we'd have won with a better game plan. That I didn't see coming.

[SkinBasket]

Yeah, I agree. Next year may be the year!

not with this OL.

Exactly..that's why we shit can a few and bring some FA's in.

because we've seen so many FA OL acquisitions work out so well? If an OL is on the FA market, he's not worth whatever he's asking.

[The Leaper]

There won't be anything game changing in FA this year...teams can use both the franchise and transition tags, and fewer young players will be eligible for FA.

Unless we trade for some people (i.e. using Kampman) we aren't likely to find any experienced help for this team. It'll be draftees to the rescue in 2010.

[ThunderDan]

I think all teams get 3 tags this year.

[denverYooper]

I love Dud but he didn't help his cause by fumbling early.

[packerbacker1234]

Kampman.


His days in GB are done. the rest probably will be back next season.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Love how Retail Guy is all over the place after a loss.

Good call.

Ty noted this in another thread. 2 months of solid GB victories and he isn't anywhere to be found. Amazing coincidence.

[PA Pack Fan]

Woodson / Driver...

I wanted the packers to win the Superbowl Esp before Driver leaves GB... 2-3 year window max :(

I don't feel bad for either one. Both guys played terribly, especially driver. You don't drop balls and fumble in the playoffs, period.

[mraynrand]

Love how Retail Guy is all over the place after a loss.

I had the day off. Been here everyday for a long time.... not much to say usually with all you know it alls! You guys can't shut up and hear a different point.

And you know, Harv. I do like to be right. This team was not ready. AZ was pissed, and played like it.

Sad part is we'd have won with a better game plan. That I didn't see coming.

I find this post difficult to accept without some complaint. The frustrating Packers from Green Bay accumulated 45 points, came back from a 21 point deficit, set records on offense, and were about 3 feet from winning with a truly sublime effort and yet it seems as though you prefer to focus on a bad game plan. I believe this to be an inaccurate analysis, at least on offense. Also, if you please sir, desist from overgeneralizations in characterizing your fellow posters as 'know it alls.' I also suggest humbly that you not demand that we shut up and hear a different point, as though we are unwilling to consider alternative perspectives. Please state your opinion and we - or at least I - would be happy to respectfully argue the point, in a contrite, forthright manner, befitting this fine website and in keeping with the collegial spirit present throughout the world of internet sports websites, where namecalling and poor language is conspicuously absent, except here, on Packerrats.

Edited for civility at 10:18 AM.

[mraynrand]

My heart is bleeding for Driver. He will have to live forever without a Superbowl ring. Really, the tears are flowing from my eyes.

[Administrator]

Love how Retail Guy is all over the place after a loss.

I had the day off. Been here everyday for a long time.... not much to say usually with all you know it alls! You guys can't shut up and hear a different point.

And you know, Harv. I do like to be right. This team was not ready. AZ was pissed, and played like it.

Sad part is we'd have won with a better game plan. That I didn't see coming.

What an annoying bed wetter. Fucking Packers ring up 45 points, come back from a 21 point deficit, set records on offense, were about 3 feet from winning and this tool talks about a bad game plan. You suck.

This was completely uncalled for. Probably on both sides, but mraynrand, the guy caught a lot of crap last week too. FWIW, I wasn't thrilled with the 1st half game plan, 2nd half was much better on both coaching and execution.

[mraynrand]

Love how Retail Guy is all over the place after a loss.

I had the day off. Been here everyday for a long time.... not much to say usually with all you know it alls! You guys can't shut up and hear a different point.

And you know, Harv. I do like to be right. This team was not ready. AZ was pissed, and played like it.

Sad part is we'd have won with a better game plan. That I didn't see coming.

What an annoying bed wetter. Fucking Packers ring up 45 points, come back from a 21 point deficit, set records on offense, were about 3 feet from winning and this tool talks about a bad game plan. You suck.

This was completely uncalled for. Probably on both sides, but mraynrand, the guy caught a lot of crap last week too. FWIW, I wasn't thrilled with the 1st half game plan, 2nd half was much better on both coaching and execution.

It was called for: "You guys can't shut up and hear a different point." You dish it out, you better be prepared to take it. And Bigguns is right - the guy was MIA for 8 weeks of wins and comes in here to wet the bed after a loss. Go ahead and ban me if you like but I'm not taking his shit.

[Administrator]

Love how Retail Guy is all over the place after a loss.

I had the day off. Been here everyday for a long time.... not much to say usually with all you know it alls! You guys can't shut up and hear a different point.

And you know, Harv. I do like to be right. This team was not ready. AZ was pissed, and played like it.

Sad part is we'd have won with a better game plan. That I didn't see coming.

What an annoying bed wetter. Fucking Packers ring up 45 points, come back from a 21 point deficit, set records on offense, were about 3 feet from winning and this tool talks about a bad game plan. You suck.

This was completely uncalled for. Probably on both sides, but mraynrand, the guy caught a lot of crap last week too. FWIW, I wasn't thrilled with the 1st half game plan, 2nd half was much better on both coaching and execution.

It was called for: "You guys can't shut up and hear a different point." You dish it out, you better be prepared to take it. And Bigguns is right - the guy was MIA for 8 weeks of wins and comes in here to wet the bed after a loss. Go ahead and ban me if you like but I'm not taking his shit.

Then talk about what you believe and stop name calling. He posted a lot yesterday, but few posts even inferred name calling.

Why would I ban you? That's ridiculous, but stop with the juvenile name calling, I thought you were smarter than that.

[mraynrand]

He posted a lot yesterday, but few posts even inferred name calling.


not much to say usually with all you know it alls!


You guys can't shut up and hear a different point.

[Administrator]

He posted a lot yesterday, but few posts even inferred name calling.


not much to say usually with all you know it alls!


You guys can't shut up and hear a different point.

where did he call someone a "bed wetter" or a "tool"? Do you honestly think most of the folks in this forum are open to hearing a different opinion than the one they come in here with?

Did you read all the over-confident posts last week? Did you read the names and riducule he got last week? I remember "negative nancy" off the top of my head, and long involved discussions regarding bigby and OL.

Maybe you should go back an reread those. Could you post quotes from those too? Whether you agree with him or not, he had some valid points, and was "out to lunch" on others. SO WHAT?

Lets stop with the name calling and stick to the issues.

[Patler]

He posted a lot yesterday, but few posts even inferred name calling.


not much to say usually with all you know it alls!


You guys can't shut up and hear a different point.

where did he call someone a "bed wetter" or a "tool"? Do you honestly think most of the folks in this forum are open to hearing a different opinion than the one they come in here with?

Did you read all the over-confident posts last week? Did you read the names and riducule he got last week? I remember "negative nancy" off the top of my head, and long involved discussions regarding bigby and OL.

Maybe you should go back an reread those. Could you post quotes from those too? Whether you agree with him or not, he had some valid points, and was "out to lunch" on others. SO WHAT?

Lets stop with the name calling and stick to the issues.

So is a "tool" or "bed wetter" worse than a "know it all". Why do you defend one and criticize the other? In my mind, none are appropriate, and all lead away from meaningful discussion, just as we have seen here.

No disrespect intended, but I think some of us have a difficult time understanding how you will react to given comments, given situations. Perhaps a thread to discuss it, rather than thread-jacking this one, would be appropriate?

[mraynrand]

He posted a lot yesterday, but few posts even inferred name calling.


not much to say usually with all you know it alls!


You guys can't shut up and hear a different point.

where did he call someone a "bed wetter" or a "tool"? Do you honestly think most of the folks in this forum are open to hearing a different opinion than the one they come in here with?

Did you read all the over-confident posts last week? Did you read the names and riducule he got last week? I remember "negative nancy" off the top of my head, and long involved discussions regarding bigby and OL.

Maybe you should go back an reread those. Could you post quotes from those too? Whether you agree with him or not, he had some valid points, and was "out to lunch" on others. SO WHAT?

Lets stop with the name calling and stick to the issues.

Hey, I read all the overconfident posts. Go look in the prediction thread for the game and see who fit the
You guys can't shut up and hear a different point. description.

Like I said, I reacted to someone name calling in this thread. I probably shouldn't have done it, but I did. I'm done.



Back to the thread: I'm still crying for Donald Driver. Anyone have a tissue?

[Administrator]

He posted a lot yesterday, but few posts even inferred name calling.


not much to say usually with all you know it alls!


You guys can't shut up and hear a different point.

where did he call someone a "bed wetter" or a "tool"? Do you honestly think most of the folks in this forum are open to hearing a different opinion than the one they come in here with?

Did you read all the over-confident posts last week? Did you read the names and riducule he got last week? I remember "negative nancy" off the top of my head, and long involved discussions regarding bigby and OL.

Maybe you should go back an reread those. Could you post quotes from those too? Whether you agree with him or not, he had some valid points, and was "out to lunch" on others. SO WHAT?

Lets stop with the name calling and stick to the issues.

So is a "tool" or "bed wetter" worse than a "know it all". Why do you defend one and criticize the other? In my mind, none are appropriate, and all lead away from meaningful discussion, just as we have seen here.

No disrespect intended, but I think some of us have a difficult time understanding how you will react to given comments, given situations. Perhaps a thread to discuss it, rather than thread-jacking this one, would be appropriate?

Neither is better, would prefer that they both disappear. However, I have to work with what I've got.

I'm coming in from the outside. I don't know either one of these posters, other than their reputation here.

I also know from other sites that I posted on in the past that this site has a well deserved reputation for "not discussing issues" but instead attacking the character of the poster. I'm trying to unwind that little by little.

There may be a certain truth to "know it all", but I hope no truth to "bedwetter" or "tool".

This thread is as good as any other, I'd guess. Sometimes I just go PM and leave the quote alone, then I sometimes get public or private criticism of "he didn't do anything about that quote". Can't win, Patler.

I don't take any disrespect. I just want to keep guys like you around. There has to have been times where you and others like you were 'frustrated' about the lack of discussion. The good posters, who are able to resist name calling or personal insults or complaints about the validity or lack thereof in their posts are also the first ones to move along and post somewhere else.

Gotta stop the crap somehow and I certainly don't have license to the best method to do that. Point taken.

[mraynrand]

He posted a lot yesterday, but few posts even inferred name calling.


not much to say usually with all you know it alls!


You guys can't shut up and hear a different point.

where did he call someone a "bed wetter" or a "tool"? Do you honestly think most of the folks in this forum are open to hearing a different opinion than the one they come in here with?

Did you read all the over-confident posts last week? Did you read the names and riducule he got last week? I remember "negative nancy" off the top of my head, and long involved discussions regarding bigby and OL.

Maybe you should go back an reread those. Could you post quotes from those too? Whether you agree with him or not, he had some valid points, and was "out to lunch" on others. SO WHAT?

Lets stop with the name calling and stick to the issues.

So is a "tool" or "bed wetter" worse than a "know it all". Why do you defend one and criticize the other? In my mind, none are appropriate, and all lead away from meaningful discussion, just as we have seen here.

No disrespect intended, but I think some of us have a difficult time understanding how you will react to given comments, given situations. Perhaps a thread to discuss it, rather than thread-jacking this one, would be appropriate?

Neither is better, would prefer that they both disappear. However, I have to work with what I've got.

I'm coming in from the outside. I don't know either one of these posters, other than their reputation here.

I also know from other sites that I posted on in the past that this site has a well deserved reputation for "not discussing issues" but instead attacking the character of the poster. I'm trying to unwind that little by little.

There may be a certain truth to "know it all", but I hope no truth to "bedwetter" or "tool".

This thread is as good as any other, I'd guess. Sometimes I just go PM and leave the quote alone, then I sometimes get public or private criticism of "he didn't do anything about that quote". Can't win, Patler.

I don't take any disrespect. I just want to keep guys like you around. There has to have been times where you and others like you were 'frustrated' about the lack of discussion. The good posters, who are able to resist name calling or personal insults or complaints about the validity or lack thereof in their posts are also the first ones to move along and post somewhere else.

Gotta stop the crap somehow and I certainly don't have license to the best method to do that. Point taken.

Rather than PM you (which I've never done and isn't my style), I'll put this in the open forum: Next time you see an offensive post by me or someone else, just PM and ask them to delete/modify the post. Then I'll do what I'm going to do right now.

[Administrator]

Hey, I read all the overconfident posts. Go look in the prediction thread for the game and see who fit the
You guys can't shut up and hear a different point. description.

Like I said, I reacted to someone name calling in this thread. I probably shouldn't have done it, but I did. I'm done.



Back to the thread: I'm still crying for Donald Driver. Anyone have a tissue?

My discussion with you was not a validation of him. Appreciate the explanation.

I enjoy your spirited discussion of issues and frequently find your points thought provoking. I purposely don't post in FYI, but I do read your stuff. Sometimes it makes me think. Sometimes retailguy makes me think, and sometimes not so much.

[mission]

We're all grown ups here. Can we carry on please?

[Harlan Huckleby]

We're all grown ups here. Can we carry on please?

Ballhawk is not a grown up, I think he's 12 or 13.

[mission]

We're all grown ups here. Can we carry on please?

Ballhawk is not a grown up, I think he's 12 or 13.

Well he's grown up since being 6 years old or so. (eh eh?)

Then again, he did lose us the game yesterday.

[pbmax]

Yeah, I agree. Next year may be the year!

not with this OL.

Exactly..that's why we shit can a few and bring some FA's in.

because we've seen so many FA OL acquisitions work out so well? If an OL is on the FA market, he's not worth whatever he's asking.
Ladies and Gentleman, your 2009 Philadelphia Eagles and Chicago Bears!

I feel bad for Logan Mankins. Had T2 not screwed up and drafted him rather than Aaron Rodgers, he would have had his Super Bowl with Sherman already instead of suffering with Belicheck.

[Administrator]

Ladies and Gentleman, your 2009 Philadelphia Eagles and Chicago Bears!

I feel bad for Logan Mankins. Had T2 not screwed up and drafted him rather than Aaron Rodgers, he would have had his Super Bowl with Sherman already instead of suffering with Belicheck.

Was the 2009 Bengals OL a failure too? I think they were pretty successful with their acquisitions especially in the run blocking arena. They made Benson look like a pro bowler... not an easy feat. If a GM like Mike Brown can patch a hole or two using Free Agency, can't we expect that out of Ted Thompson, who is clearly a very good GM, and makes Mike Brown look like Matt Millen?

All free agent acquistions aren't bad. We surely can't populate the entire line with Free Agents, but couldn't we "plug" one guy in? Would that be unreasonable?

[retailguy]

He posted a lot yesterday, but few posts even inferred name calling.


not much to say usually with all you know it alls!


You guys can't shut up and hear a different point.

Not sure where to start here. I guess I'll start by saying to rand that these comments were not meant for you and if you took them that way, I do apologize.

Next, admin, I will refrain from any further attacking posts, and do please know that these comments were not directed at any particular person individually. Other than a couple of sarcastic comments directed at esoxx and thunder dan in the game thread, I was trying to not call folks names. I did have several snide comments and names including the negative nancey comment directed at me last week and was resisting the urge to fight back.

I haven't posted much recently for two reasons. First, I enjoyed the wins, but second, I didn't see the improvment during the wins to the things I've been complaining about all season. I don't like the OL, and while they play better in spurts, they still don't play well, as evidenced yesterday. I happen to believe that if you spend dedicated time analyzing game video, it's easy to craft a plan to get pressure on these guys. Always has been, and I believe it always will be.

So, since my views aren't widely shared, I have kept quiet. Yesterday, I thought I had an opening based on how we played to talk about that, but true to form, the excuses started freely flowing. Again. I haven't read anywhere today where someone, who made a bold prediction last week, stepped up and said "I blew it". That's what my last comment from above meant. I saw, and continue to see, a bunch of excuses, and no owning of comments, or worse excuses as to why their comment was correct, except for this or that....

Let's be clear - I AM HERE EVERYDAY. I do not leave. I will not leave. I have not changed my viewpoint. It remains consistent. I will continue to post less because I cause disruption with my viewpoint. Anyone who reads threads today will see tyrone and harvey chasing me around the forum last night and today talking about me personally instead of my views. I can't control that, but don't like the dissention, so I keep quiet.

I'm going to step away for a few days from posting and let the chicken littles settle down. I'll let the "negative nancy" comment slide without response, and further, I'll let all the conflicting opinion from last week about my worry related to AZ being pissed off go too. I don't know about you, but yesterday I saw a pissed off coaching staff and a pissed off team give us everything they had...

I'm not leaving, and I'll continue to be here reading and sometimes shaking my head in disbelief.

As much as it pains me to say - GO COWBOYS & GO SAINTS.

[RashanGary]

Yeah, I agree. Next year may be the year!

not with this OL.

You mean the OL that put up 45 points with a 26 year old QB?

Yeah, they suck. Find a new drum, retail. Yours is broke. That was 2005.

[ThunderDan]

Next, admin, I will refrain from any further attacking posts, and do please know that these comments were not directed at any particular person individually. Other than a couple of sarcastic comments directed at esoxx and thunder dan in the game thread, I was trying to not call folks names. I did have several snide comments and names including the negative nancey comment directed at me last week and was resisting the urge to fight back.



Leave me out of this. Just because I didn't bail when we were 4-4 and lost to TB and wouldn't call the game over when ARI was up 21 points.

If that is being a Packer fan I don't know what is. You support your team through the good games and the bad.

[Smidgeon]

Yeah, I agree. Next year may be the year!

not with this OL.

You mean the OL that put up 45 points with a 26 year old QB?

Yeah, they suck. Find a new drum, retail. Yours is broke. That was 2005.

RG probably means the OL from 2009 through the first 8 games when they were playing to set the all time NFL sack record. That's my guess at least.

[MichiganPackerFan]

Harris and Kampman. I'm sure they're thinking this game might have been different if they could have been out there. I'm thinking that too.

Harris, definitely. He was missed. Kampy, I'm not so sure. He woulda been just another liability in coverage.

Harris would have made a HUGE difference. Not one receiver was bumped off his route the entire game. Except Woodson of course on the two uncalled offensive pass interference calls.

[MichiganPackerFan]

And for the record, I'm a fan of each of the aforementioned tool, bed wetter and know-it-all posters.