Peyton Manning

[Harlan Huckleby]

I'm not a big Peyton Manning fan, he seems kinda arrogant, like the class president with the charmed life. But I recently learned of the extent of his behind-the-scenes charity work, I might have to reevaluate my position.

Christian Athletes for Kids (http://www.hulu.com/watch/1603/saturday-night-live-united-way)

[MJZiggy]

Life lessons both on and off the field...

[MadtownPacker]

I'm not a big Peyton Manning fan, he seems kinda arrogant, like the class president with the charmed life. But I recently learned of the extent of his behind-the-scenes charity work, I might have to reevaluate my position.

Christian Athletes for Kids (http://www.hulu.com/watch/1603/saturday-night-live-united-way)If "reevaluate" is the White way of saying you fucked up then cool but you judging a book by it's cover aint no surprise.

[Harlan Huckleby]

be patient with me, I'm not as deep as you.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Heee heee. It's no great feat to fool a stupid mexican, but I enjoy it just the same, like pulling the wings off of a fly. It's the simple pleasures in life that really count.

[Fritz]

I'm not a big Peyton Manning fan, he seems kinda arrogant, like the class president with the charmed life. But I recently learned of the extent of his behind-the-scenes charity work, I might have to reevaluate my position.

Christian Athletes for Kids (http://www.hulu.com/watch/1603/saturday-night-live-united-way)If "reevaluate" is the White way of saying you fucked up then cool but you judging a book by it's cover aint no surprise.

Hey, I like this.

"Man, I really re-evaluated that play."

"Shit, I drank way too much. I'm really re-evaluated."

I'm going to re-evaluate my vocabulary with this.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I guess my setup was too heartfelt, it even fooled the white people (except Ziggy who has feminine, witch-like powers of intuition.) Click on the link, Fritz.

[sheepshead]

If he continues he'll knock Montana off everyone's list. One thing I admire is his ability to not take himself too seriously off the field (he obviously takes his work seriously). A stark difference from whats-his-name that used to play for us and his number is between 3 and 5.

[Noodle]

I remember seeing this when it came out and thinking, "Man, maybe that Manning dude is ok after all." One of my all time favorites.

And nice lable on the link, Blue Dog. I saw that and just blew it off until I saw your note to Fritz.

[MichiganPackerFan]

Pretty damn funny, Blue

[Fritz]

I just liked Mad's comment, that's all.

I guess I really re-evaluated that time.

[Harlan Huckleby]

someone shoot me.

[wist43]

I have a lot of respect for Manning...

Yes, he has been blessed with all of the ingredients to be uber-successful; but, I know that he worked his ass off to achieve, and he is a decent man.

To be that gifted, accomplished, and successful... I would imagine it would be hard not to be arrogant - that said, perhaps envy can taint ones view.

I think he carries himself pretty well...

Go Saints :D

[MJZiggy]

You didn't click the link, did you wist? :lol:

[red]

thats exactly how i picture manning

i'm pretty sure that was all real

guy just seems like a grade A dick

[MJZiggy]

I don't think he'd have spoofed it if it hit too close to home...

[red]

I don't think he'd have spoofed it if it hit too close to home...

i don't think it was a spoof

i'm pretty sure they just put him with a bunch of kids and rolled the cameras to see what happened

[MJZiggy]

I don't think he'd have spoofed it if it hit too close to home...

i don't think it was a spoof

i'm pretty sure they just put him with a bunch of kids and rolled the cameras to see what happened

It was a Saturday Night Live skit.

[red]

I don't think he'd have spoofed it if it hit too close to home...

i don't think it was a spoof

i'm pretty sure they just put him with a bunch of kids and rolled the cameras to see what happened

It was a Saturday Night Live skit.

yes i know ziggy, i was making a funny

[wist43]

You didn't click the link, did you wist? :lol:

What, you don't think that kid didn't deserve to be sent to the "penalty box" for 20 minutes???

Quality mentoring... am I missing something??? :huh:

[channtheman]

You didn't click the link, did you wist? :lol:

What, you don't think that kid didn't deserve to be sent to the "penalty box" for 20 minutes???

Quality mentoring... am I missing something??? :huh:

WHY IS THE DOOR OPEN?!

[MadtownPacker]

someone shoot me.If not for these stupid laws....

I finally clicked on the link (It's dangerous clicking on anything Harlan post) and yeah that was some good stuff you stupid perro.

[MadtownPacker]

Great work you jinxing mutt. Nice way to use your Midas touch. Moron. :lol:

[Packers4Ever]

If he continues he'll knock Montana off everyone's list. One thing I admire is his ability to not take himself too seriously off the field (he obviously takes his work seriously). A stark difference from whats-his-name that used to play for us and his number is between 3 and 5.



I see Manning had no trouble making the same play in N.O. that BF did

at the end of the Viking's game ~ interception !!

[Jimx29]

walking off the field and not shaking anyone's hands from N.O. showed me he's just another self centered egomaniac.

[hoosier]

walking off the field and not shaking anyone's hands from N.O. showed me he's just another self centered egomaniac.

Did you happen to read his explanation of what was going through his mind?

[Harlan Huckleby]

walking off the field and not shaking anyone's hands from N.O. showed me he's just another self centered egomaniac.

Did you happen to read his explanation of what was going through his mind?

He had a diarrhea attack?

I'm not gonna crucify him for taking flight, but not buying any explanations either.

[hoosier]

walking off the field and not shaking anyone's hands from N.O. showed me he's just another self centered egomaniac.

Did you happen to read his explanation of what was going through his mind?

He had a diarrhea attack?

I'm not gonna crucify him for taking flight, but not buying any explanations either.

No need to buy since Manning is not trying to sell anything. But you weren't the one who seemed to think that his walking off proved anything either. So I guess you just really wanted to get your diarrhea remark in.

[Joemailman]

Although Favre playing for the Vikings is not something I've wanted to see, one good thing (in my opinion) is that Favre is making it hard for Manning to break his records for passing yards and TD passes.

Right now Favre is about 130 TD passes and 19,000 passing yards ahead of Manning. If Favre retires this year, Manning needs 4-5 years to catch him. Manning will be 34 next season, so he would have to play at a high level until he is 37-38 to catch Favre. If Favre comes back and has another big year in 2010, then Manning must play well until he is 38-39. Manning has had some knee problems in the past, although he seems pretty healthy right now.

[hoosier]

Although Favre playing for the Vikings is not something I've wanted to see, one good thing (in my opinion) is that Favre is making it hard for Manning to break his records for passing yards and TD passes.

Right now Favre is about 130 TD passes and 19,000 passing yards ahead of Manning. If Favre retires this year, Manning needs 4-5 years to catch him. Manning will be 34 next season, so he would have to play at a high level until he is 37-38 to catch Favre. If Favre comes back and has another big year in 2010, then Manning must play well until he is 38-39. Manning has had some knee problems in the past, although he seems pretty healthy right now.

When they have both been retired for a few years I think history will judge that Manning was the better of the two QBs, regardless of who holds what records. Even if Manning never comes close to Favre's display of durability (or his displays of emotion...), Manning has one clear edge over Favre: he has generally been able to make big plays while avoiding the propensity for killer mistakes.

[Joemailman]

Although Favre has become known for the "killer mistakes" in the playoffs, Manning has had his own failures. 4 times in 22 playoff games, Favre's teams have lost where the offense produced fewer than 20 points. With Manning, it is 7 in 18. Maybe Favre's failures have been more dramatic, but Manning has been no better overall.

As for the regular season, Favre has averaged about 17 INT's per season. Manning 15. Not a huge difference.

It is likely both will be remembered as great quarterbacks who nonetheless had their postseason failures. Some will suggest that puts them behind guys like Starr, Montana, and perhaps Brady.

[Brandon494]

Don't understand all the hate on Manning, he has been nothing but a class act his whole career. Guess some just hate because they know he will break some of Favre's records.

[Packers4Ever]

Don't understand all the hate on Manning, he has been nothing but a class act his whole career. Guess some just hate because they know he will break some of Favre's records.


Brandon, I really don't think it's a case of 'hate on Manning' - as you said, he's been a class act for years. I think he was suffering a huge
disappointment over the loss of their game - understandably - and he simply had a hard time not showing it plus extremely upset with himself.
Not a good exhibit for the youngsters though, I agree. Hey you just can't win them all !

[GrnBay007]

Don't understand all the hate on Manning, he has been nothing but a class act his whole career. Guess some just hate because they know he will break some of Favre's records.

I don't hate Manning. But a "class act"? What year was it he threw his O-line under the bus during a post game interview? Don't remember, but many were cutting him down at that point.

Dang people, they are human!! Sometimes you are going to see a HUMAN, NON-PERFECT response from these people.

To say the hate on Manning is because he WILL break Favre's records is kinda funny. Maybe he will, maybe he won't....but is anyone really that much of a freak to hate on the guy because he might break those records? I think you are making more out of it then what's really there.

Records are made and some, if not all will be broken eventually. Whatever records are broken, and whoever does it gains my respect because it shows they are of the elite in whatever sport they participate in. Funny how some try so hard to ignore and discount what Favre has done in and for the NFL.

[Guiness]

I didn't see anything in the way of an explanation from Manning - I'm actually curious, what did he say?

[Gunakor]

Don't understand all the hate on Manning, he has been nothing but a class act his whole career. Guess some just hate because they know he will break some of Favre's records.

I don't hate Manning. But a "class act"? What year was it he threw his O-line under the bus during a post game interview? Don't remember, but many were cutting him down at that point.

My memory is a bit hazy, so I don't remember him cutting down his OL, but I do remember his profound comments about his "idiot kicker" a few years back when Vanderjagt was still a Colt. He's far from a class act IMO.

Does anybody here recall Manning ever publicly accepting responsibility for any of his mistakes the same way he publicly blames others for theirs?

[GrnBay007]

I do remember his profound comments about his "idiot kicker" a few years back when Vanderjagt was still a Colt. He's far from a class act IMO.



haha forgot about that one!!

[pbmax]

Well, the idiot kicker, whether he had a point or not, was talking out of school. So he had it coming. Or certainly should have expected it. The liquored up part was a particularly nice touch by Manning.

After a game against the Steelers, he said he wanted to be a good teammate so he could say much, but we had some protection problems. Had he said only one of either of those clauses, nobody would have blinked.

As for not shaking hands, he and Wayne both went immediately off the field. During his postgame presser, he said they were already setting up the podium and it was time for the Saints to have the field and celebrate. He said he would call both Brees and Payton.

[pbmax]

In this case, Manning need not make a face or throw someone under the bus, his GM has taken care of that:

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/02/10/polian-says-offensive-line-was-outplayed-pretty-decisively/

[Brandon494]

Don't understand all the hate on Manning, he has been nothing but a class act his whole career. Guess some just hate because they know he will break some of Favre's records.

I don't hate Manning. But a "class act"? What year was it he threw his O-line under the bus during a post game interview? Don't remember, but many were cutting him down at that point.

My memory is a bit hazy, so I don't remember him cutting down his OL, but I do remember his profound comments about his "idiot kicker" a few years back when Vanderjagt was still a Colt. He's far from a class act IMO.

Does anybody here recall Manning ever publicly accepting responsibility for any of his mistakes the same way he publicly blames others for theirs?

Manning prob takes care of his O-line more than anyone in the league. I remember watching a pre SB clip about the Colts O-line and how closed they were to Manning. I did find this article mentioning a few things from the clip. http://www.nola.com/superbowl/index.ssf/2010/02/indianapolis_colts_offensive_l.html

Also do you even remember what that "idiot kicker" said? If you did you wouldnt be saying Manning is far from a class act because "idiot" was prob the nicest word you could have used there. How the hell is a kicker going to call one of the greastest QBs to ever play the game soft?

[Gunakor]

Don't understand all the hate on Manning, he has been nothing but a class act his whole career. Guess some just hate because they know he will break some of Favre's records.

I don't hate Manning. But a "class act"? What year was it he threw his O-line under the bus during a post game interview? Don't remember, but many were cutting him down at that point.

My memory is a bit hazy, so I don't remember him cutting down his OL, but I do remember his profound comments about his "idiot kicker" a few years back when Vanderjagt was still a Colt. He's far from a class act IMO.

Does anybody here recall Manning ever publicly accepting responsibility for any of his mistakes the same way he publicly blames others for theirs?

Manning prob takes care of his O-line more than anyone in the league. I remember watching a pre SB clip about the Colts O-line and how closed they were to Manning. I did find this article mentioning a few things from the clip. http://www.nola.com/superbowl/index.ssf/2010/02/indianapolis_colts_offensive_l.html

Also do you even remember what that "idiot kicker" said? If you did you wouldnt be saying Manning is far from a class act because "idiot" was prob the nicest word you could have used there. How the hell is a kicker going to call one of the greastest QBs to ever play the game soft?

A classy person would have said nothing in retort at all.

[Guiness]

Well, I will say that I've had a beer or two with the 'idiot kicker' And that a)he's a good guy. and b) He seems to be widely panned, but before anyone does that they should look into his road to the league and realize the guy paid his dues, and was a pretty good player.

[Brandon494]

Don't understand all the hate on Manning, he has been nothing but a class act his whole career. Guess some just hate because they know he will break some of Favre's records.

I don't hate Manning. But a "class act"? What year was it he threw his O-line under the bus during a post game interview? Don't remember, but many were cutting him down at that point.

My memory is a bit hazy, so I don't remember him cutting down his OL, but I do remember his profound comments about his "idiot kicker" a few years back when Vanderjagt was still a Colt. He's far from a class act IMO.

Does anybody here recall Manning ever publicly accepting responsibility for any of his mistakes the same way he publicly blames others for theirs?

Manning prob takes care of his O-line more than anyone in the league. I remember watching a pre SB clip about the Colts O-line and how closed they were to Manning. I did find this article mentioning a few things from the clip. http://www.nola.com/superbowl/index.ssf/2010/02/indianapolis_colts_offensive_l.html

Also do you even remember what that "idiot kicker" said? If you did you wouldnt be saying Manning is far from a class act because "idiot" was prob the nicest word you could have used there. How the hell is a kicker going to call one of the greastest QBs to ever play the game soft?

A classy person would have said nothing in retort at all.

So he is a classless player because his kicker got drunk and called him out and Manning responded by calling him an idiot. Wow what a jackass :roll:

[pbmax]

No, the kicker is panned because he spoke out about both his coach and teammates in trying to explain why they had had repeated playoff failures. He said nothing that thousands of other people haven't said (tightened up, choked, something along those lines) but it is different when a teammate does it.

Vanderjagt also suffered because he a) was a kicker and is not viewed the same as an offensive lineman or LB, b) not long after this incident he was hurt and started to have trouble kicking and c) he did not seem to realize that a player saying these things publicly was going to come back and bite him in the butt. It was predictable.

None of that proves that he really is an "idiot", or that he was "drunk" (I think it was a radio interview) or that he is a bad guy. But he took a huge step to the forefront when he made his statement publicly and got blasted by the fallout. Probably not what he intended.

[Scott Campbell]

Don't understand all the hate on Manning, he has been nothing but a class act his whole career. Guess some just hate because they know he will break some of Favre's records.

I don't hate Manning. But a "class act"? What year was it he threw his O-line under the bus during a post game interview? Don't remember, but many were cutting him down at that point.

My memory is a bit hazy, so I don't remember him cutting down his OL, but I do remember his profound comments about his "idiot kicker" a few years back when Vanderjagt was still a Colt. He's far from a class act IMO.

Does anybody here recall Manning ever publicly accepting responsibility for any of his mistakes the same way he publicly blames others for theirs?

Manning prob takes care of his O-line more than anyone in the league. I remember watching a pre SB clip about the Colts O-line and how closed they were to Manning. I did find this article mentioning a few things from the clip. http://www.nola.com/superbowl/index.ssf/2010/02/indianapolis_colts_offensive_l.html

Also do you even remember what that "idiot kicker" said? If you did you wouldnt be saying Manning is far from a class act because "idiot" was prob the nicest word you could have used there. How the hell is a kicker going to call one of the greastest QBs to ever play the game soft?

A classy person would have said nothing in retort at all.


So would a doormat. Vanderwhatchamacallit was in idiot kicker. Peyton was right to speak up and put that guy in his place.

[Scott Campbell]

No, the kicker is panned because he spoke out about both his coach and teammates in trying to explain why they had had repeated playoff failures. He said nothing that thousands of other people haven't said (tightened up, choked, something along those lines) but it is different when a teammate does it.

Vanderjagt also suffered because he a) was a kicker and is not viewed the same as an offensive lineman or LB, b) not long after this incident he was hurt and started to have trouble kicking and c) he did not seem to realize that a player saying these things publicly was going to come back and bite him in the butt. It was predictable.

None of that proves that he really is an "idiot", or that he was "drunk" (I think it was a radio interview) or that he is a bad guy. But he took a huge step to the forefront when he made his statement publicly and got blasted by the fallout. Probably not what he intended.


I'm old school. Kickers should be seen and not heard.

[hoosier]

No, the kicker is panned because he spoke out about both his coach and teammates in trying to explain why they had had repeated playoff failures. He said nothing that thousands of other people haven't said (tightened up, choked, something along those lines) but it is different when a teammate does it.

Vanderjagt also suffered because he a) was a kicker and is not viewed the same as an offensive lineman or LB, b) not long after this incident he was hurt and started to have trouble kicking and c) he did not seem to realize that a player saying these things publicly was going to come back and bite him in the butt. It was predictable.

None of that proves that he really is an "idiot", or that he was "drunk" (I think it was a radio interview) or that he is a bad guy. But he took a huge step to the forefront when he made his statement publicly and got blasted by the fallout. Probably not what he intended.


I'm old school. Kickers should be neither seen nor heard.

Fixed.

[Gunakor]

Don't understand all the hate on Manning, he has been nothing but a class act his whole career. Guess some just hate because they know he will break some of Favre's records.

I don't hate Manning. But a "class act"? What year was it he threw his O-line under the bus during a post game interview? Don't remember, but many were cutting him down at that point.

My memory is a bit hazy, so I don't remember him cutting down his OL, but I do remember his profound comments about his "idiot kicker" a few years back when Vanderjagt was still a Colt. He's far from a class act IMO.

Does anybody here recall Manning ever publicly accepting responsibility for any of his mistakes the same way he publicly blames others for theirs?

Manning prob takes care of his O-line more than anyone in the league. I remember watching a pre SB clip about the Colts O-line and how closed they were to Manning. I did find this article mentioning a few things from the clip. http://www.nola.com/superbowl/index.ssf/2010/02/indianapolis_colts_offensive_l.html

Also do you even remember what that "idiot kicker" said? If you did you wouldnt be saying Manning is far from a class act because "idiot" was prob the nicest word you could have used there. How the hell is a kicker going to call one of the greastest QBs to ever play the game soft?

A classy person would have said nothing in retort at all.


So would a doormat. Vanderwhatchamacallit was in idiot kicker. Peyton was right to speak up and put that guy in his place.

He was also the most accurate FG kicker in NFL history. Not bad for an idiot.

Manning could have just blown it off. Or at the very least handled it privately, out of public view.

[pbmax]

No, the kicker is panned because he spoke out about both his coach and teammates in trying to explain why they had had repeated playoff failures. He said nothing that thousands of other people haven't said (tightened up, choked, something along those lines) but it is different when a teammate does it.

Vanderjagt also suffered because he a) was a kicker and is not viewed the same as an offensive lineman or LB, b) not long after this incident he was hurt and started to have trouble kicking and c) he did not seem to realize that a player saying these things publicly was going to come back and bite him in the butt. It was predictable.

None of that proves that he really is an "idiot", or that he was "drunk" (I think it was a radio interview) or that he is a bad guy. But he took a huge step to the forefront when he made his statement publicly and got blasted by the fallout. Probably not what he intended.


I'm old school. Kickers should be neither seen nor heard.

Fixed.
Back in the day, kickers had to play another position too. Like Left Tackle. If Lou Groza criticized his QB, Manning would have had to listen or Groza would have let Big Daddy Lipscomb crush his kidney.

[Gunakor]

Don't understand all the hate on Manning, he has been nothing but a class act his whole career. Guess some just hate because they know he will break some of Favre's records.

I don't hate Manning. But a "class act"? What year was it he threw his O-line under the bus during a post game interview? Don't remember, but many were cutting him down at that point.

My memory is a bit hazy, so I don't remember him cutting down his OL, but I do remember his profound comments about his "idiot kicker" a few years back when Vanderjagt was still a Colt. He's far from a class act IMO.

Does anybody here recall Manning ever publicly accepting responsibility for any of his mistakes the same way he publicly blames others for theirs?

Manning prob takes care of his O-line more than anyone in the league. I remember watching a pre SB clip about the Colts O-line and how closed they were to Manning. I did find this article mentioning a few things from the clip. http://www.nola.com/superbowl/index.ssf/2010/02/indianapolis_colts_offensive_l.html

Also do you even remember what that "idiot kicker" said? If you did you wouldnt be saying Manning is far from a class act because "idiot" was prob the nicest word you could have used there. How the hell is a kicker going to call one of the greastest QBs to ever play the game soft?

A classy person would have said nothing in retort at all.

So he is a classless player because his kicker got drunk and called him out and Manning responded by calling him an idiot. Wow what a jackass :roll:

What proof do you have that Vanderjagt was actually drunk when he said that?

Besides, Manning isn't the greatest big game QB. I'd have called him out right after the game where he threw 6 INT's to the Chargers, at home, in a playoff game. I think Vanderjagt was still their kicker that year, I can't remember. He threw the killer game icing INT to the Saints in the SB this year too, which only further validates what Vanderjagt said. Manning is more responsible for the Colts playoff failures than Vanderjagt was, that much is certain. So there was some truth to what Vanderjagt said. Maybe Manning should have just kept his mouth shut and played better in big games.

[swede]

I feel compelled to add something here: if he succeeds in precipitating another 254 pages of posts Manning will have caught and surpassed another one of Favre's records.

[Maxie the Taxi]

I feel compelled to add something here: if he succeeds in precipitating another 254 pages of posts Manning will have caught and surpassed another one of Favre's records.

LOL :D :D :D

[Brandon494]

Don't understand all the hate on Manning, he has been nothing but a class act his whole career. Guess some just hate because they know he will break some of Favre's records.

I don't hate Manning. But a "class act"? What year was it he threw his O-line under the bus during a post game interview? Don't remember, but many were cutting him down at that point.

My memory is a bit hazy, so I don't remember him cutting down his OL, but I do remember his profound comments about his "idiot kicker" a few years back when Vanderjagt was still a Colt. He's far from a class act IMO.

Does anybody here recall Manning ever publicly accepting responsibility for any of his mistakes the same way he publicly blames others for theirs?

Manning prob takes care of his O-line more than anyone in the league. I remember watching a pre SB clip about the Colts O-line and how closed they were to Manning. I did find this article mentioning a few things from the clip. http://www.nola.com/superbowl/index.ssf/2010/02/indianapolis_colts_offensive_l.html

Also do you even remember what that "idiot kicker" said? If you did you wouldnt be saying Manning is far from a class act because "idiot" was prob the nicest word you could have used there. How the hell is a kicker going to call one of the greastest QBs to ever play the game soft?

A classy person would have said nothing in retort at all.

So he is a classless player because his kicker got drunk and called him out and Manning responded by calling him an idiot. Wow what a jackass :roll:

What proof do you have that Vanderjagt was actually drunk when he said that?

Besides, Manning isn't the greatest big game QB. I'd have called him out right after the game where he threw 6 INT's to the Chargers, at home, in a playoff game. I think Vanderjagt was still their kicker that year, I can't remember. He threw the killer game icing INT to the Saints in the SB this year too, which only further validates what Vanderjagt said. Manning is more responsible for the Colts playoff failures than Vanderjagt was, that much is certain. So there was some truth to what Vanderjagt said. Maybe Manning should have just kept his mouth shut and played better in big games.

Dude I don't know what your trying to prove here. Its a reason the Colts didn't win a SB until they got rid of Vanderjagt. Yea he was once the most accurate kicker in the game but choked almost every year in the playoffs. Its also a reason Manning just won the MVP award and Vanderjagt can't even get a job in the CFL.

I don't know if he was drunk or not but what I do know is as a kicker you don't call out of QB or your head coach like he did. Also the comments came after a 41-0 lost to the Jets so its not like Manning was the only one who had a bad game. I know your just hating on Manning because you dislike him but get your facts straight. Maybe Vanderjagt should have just kept his mouth shut, ever think of that?

[pbmax]

Dude I don't know what your trying to prove here. Its a reason the Colts didn't win a SB until they got rid of Vanderjagt. Yea he was once the most accurate kicker in the game but choked almost every year in the playoffs. Its also a reason Manning just won the MVP award and Vanderjagt can't even get a job in the CFL.

I don't know if he was drunk or not but what I do know is as a kicker you don't call out of QB or your head coach like he did. Also the comments came after a 41-0 lost to the Jets so its not like Manning was the only one who had a bad game. I know your just hating on Manning because you dislike him but get your facts straight. Maybe Vanderjagt should have just kept his mouth shut, ever think of that?
Can you explain how he choked in 2003? Why must he be unclutch as well as too outspoken?


Vanderjagt had a spectacular 2003 season, becoming the first kicker in the league's history to go an entire season, including the playoffs, without missing a field goal or point-after attempt. (In 1998, Gary Anderson was perfect in the regular season, but missed a field goal attempt in the playoffs.) In the process, he made his first Pro Bowl and was named first team All-Pro. He finished the regular season 37 for 37 in field goals and 46 for 46 in PATs. He was also perfect on 3 field-goal attempts and 12 PATs in the postseason.

[hoosier]

No, the kicker is panned because he spoke out about both his coach and teammates in trying to explain why they had had repeated playoff failures. He said nothing that thousands of other people haven't said (tightened up, choked, something along those lines) but it is different when a teammate does it.

Vanderjagt also suffered because he a) was a kicker and is not viewed the same as an offensive lineman or LB, b) not long after this incident he was hurt and started to have trouble kicking and c) he did not seem to realize that a player saying these things publicly was going to come back and bite him in the butt. It was predictable.

None of that proves that he really is an "idiot", or that he was "drunk" (I think it was a radio interview) or that he is a bad guy. But he took a huge step to the forefront when he made his statement publicly and got blasted by the fallout. Probably not what he intended.


I'm old school. Kickers should be neither seen nor heard.

Fixed.
Back in the day, kickers had to play another position too. Like Left Tackle. If Lou Groza criticized his QB, Manning would have had to listen or Groza would have let Big Daddy Lipscomb crush his kidney.

Good point. Manning would have toned things down considerably if he knew what was good for him. Would he get a pass with "frickin' kicker"?

[Brandon494]

Dude I don't know what your trying to prove here. Its a reason the Colts didn't win a SB until they got rid of Vanderjagt. Yea he was once the most accurate kicker in the game but choked almost every year in the playoffs. Its also a reason Manning just won the MVP award and Vanderjagt can't even get a job in the CFL.

I don't know if he was drunk or not but what I do know is as a kicker you don't call out of QB or your head coach like he did. Also the comments came after a 41-0 lost to the Jets so its not like Manning was the only one who had a bad game. I know your just hating on Manning because you dislike him but get your facts straight. Maybe Vanderjagt should have just kept his mouth shut, ever think of that?
Can you explain how he choked in 2003? Why must he be unclutch as well as too outspoken?


Vanderjagt had a spectacular 2003 season, becoming the first kicker in the league's history to go an entire season, including the playoffs, without missing a field goal or point-after attempt. (In 1998, Gary Anderson was perfect in the regular season, but missed a field goal attempt in the playoffs.) In the process, he made his first Pro Bowl and was named first team All-Pro. He finished the regular season 37 for 37 in field goals and 46 for 46 in PATs. He was also perfect on 3 field-goal attempts and 12 PATs in the postseason.

Like I said "almost" every season. :wink:

I do like how the very next season though he ran his mouth again about New England.


After the Colts routed the Denver Broncos in the wild-card round of the 2004 playoffs, he told reporters that the Colts' opponents in the next round of the playoffs, the New England Patriots, were "ripe for the picking," and also said "I think they're not as good as the beginning of the year and not as good as last year" (when they won the Super Bowl). Patriots safety Rodney Harrison fired back at him in an interview, calling him "Vanderjerk". Harrison's teammate, linebacker Willie McGinest, was more temperate in his response, but noted that "there's going to be a whole bunch of plays when he's not going to be out there [on the field]. The rest of his guys will be out there dealing with it." The Patriots eventually defeated the Colts 20-3 and went on to win Super Bowl XXXIX.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Personally, I don't care what Manning said about Vanderjagt.

I do think Manning has mostly underwhelmed in the playoffs. I don't rate QBs solely on regular season stats or championships. It has to be a combination. Right now, I'd rank Manning with Marino and Favre. All three had great regular season numbers, but they failed more often than not in the playoffs.

My top QBs remain Montana, Unitas, Graham, and Elway. After those four, I'd bunch the big winners that played on great teams (Brady, Bradshaw, Starr) with Favre, Manning, and Marino.

[pbmax]

I feel compelled to add something here: if he succeeds in precipitating another 254 pages of posts Manning will have caught and surpassed another one of Favre's records.
You could do that if you start to compare Manning to Brady. :lol:

Long before there was the Favre effect on message boards, there were irrational Manning versus Brady threads.

[pbmax]

I do like how the very next season though he ran his mouth again about New England.


After the Colts routed the Denver Broncos in the wild-card round of the 2004 playoffs, he told reporters that the Colts' opponents in the next round of the playoffs, the New England Patriots, were "ripe for the picking," and also said "I think they're not as good as the beginning of the year and not as good as last year" (when they won the Super Bowl). Patriots safety Rodney Harrison fired back at him in an interview, calling him "Vanderjerk". Harrison's teammate, linebacker Willie McGinest, was more temperate in his response, but noted that "there's going to be a whole bunch of plays when he's not going to be out there [on the field]. The rest of his guys will be out there dealing with it." The Patriots eventually defeated the Colts 20-3 and went on to win Super Bowl XXXIX.

He did indeed run his mouth. But that loss, like the one in 2003 cannot be laid at his feet.

[pbmax]

Personally, I don't care what Manning said about Vanderjagt.

I do think Manning has mostly underwhelmed in the playoffs. I don't rate QBs solely on regular season stats or championships. It has to be a combination. Right now, I'd rank Manning with Marino and Favre. All three had great regular season numbers, but they failed more often than not in the playoffs.

My top QBs remain Montana, Unitas, Graham, and Elway. After those four, I'd bunch the big winners that played on great teams (Brady, Bradshaw, Starr) with Favre, Manning, and Marino.
If you want a mix of regular season and playoff success, why Elway in the top 5? Until the entire team was remade to de-emphasize his importance (while cheating on the salary cap), he could not beat the NFC and his biggest post-season accomplishments were beating the Browns, who were not world beaters during that time. They were also coached by Schottenheimer, which gave Elway an unfair advantage. :lol:

I think Elway and Marino were the same performer (one with better legs, one with a better release and reading ability) but only one got a chance with an entirely different team. Elway with Shanahan was like Favre with the Vikings, he seemed like the last piece of a near championship team.

[gbgary]

manning is a bit of a DH. always has been, always will be. sure his commercials and other tv stuff is funny but that's the credit of the writers...not manning. he always shows his true colors.

[Gunakor]

Maybe Vanderjagt should have just kept his mouth shut, ever think of that?

Maybe, but Manning was the bigger man, was he not? Wasn't he the one the team looked up to? Wasn't he the one that was supposed to be setting the example? I'm not defending what Vanderjagt said, I'm criticizing what Manning said. Understand the difference.

I know you're just defending him because you like him, but get your facts straight. Manning is not the greatest big game QB, same as Vanderjagt isn't the greatest big game kicker. And to just play the "He's a kicker, he shouldn't be allowed to talk" card is horseshit, since a quarterback - especially in today's NFL - is no more a football player than a kicker. Both positions are filled to the brim with whiny, panzy assed cowards who are both afraid to hit and afraid of getting hit. Both can win or lose games on one play. Both are soft. Both Manning and Vanderjagt were equally responsible for the Colts playoff failures. Both were equally as wrong in going in front of a camera calling each other out. Both were one of the best ever at their position. Neither is a class act. That includes Manning. THAT is what I'm trying to prove here.

All you have said repeatedly is that Manning was classy and justified simply because Vanderjagt is classless and wrong. Am I getting that right? Is it too difficult to understand that two people with little to no class can have an interaction with each other, and that both of those people could be wrong?

[Patler]

I don't know what it is about Manning, but listening to him in interviews always gives me an odd impression. While he mostly says the right things, if you listen to audio versions or watch video rather than read transcripts, there often seems to be a lack of sincerity in what he says, or an overtone of sarcasm. He comes across to me as being very well-coached in how to handle the media. Consequently, I often feel that he is hiding his true feelings about the matters being discussed.

There isn't anything specific I can point to, just the impression that I get. He comes across as falsely humble. It's the way he says things, his tone and mannerisms. I always feel it is just an act.

I very well could be wrong about him.

[Brandon494]

Maybe Vanderjagt should have just kept his mouth shut, ever think of that?

Maybe, but Manning was the bigger man, was he not? Wasn't he the one the team looked up to? Wasn't he the one that was supposed to be setting the example? I'm not defending what Vanderjagt said, I'm criticizing what Manning said. Understand the difference.

I know you're just defending him because you like him, but get your facts straight. Manning is not the greatest big game QB, same as Vanderjagt isn't the greatest big game kicker. And to just play the "He's a kicker, he shouldn't be allowed to talk" card is horseshit, since a quarterback - especially in today's NFL - is no more a football player than a kicker. Both positions are filled to the brim with whiny, panzy assed cowards who are both afraid to hit and afraid of getting hit. Both can win or lose games on one play. Both are soft. Both Manning and Vanderjagt were equally responsible for the Colts playoff failures. Both were equally as wrong in going in front of a camera calling each other out. Both were one of the best ever at their position. Neither is a class act. That includes Manning. THAT is what I'm trying to prove here.

All you have said repeatedly is that Manning was classy and justified simply because Vanderjagt is classless and wrong. Am I getting that right? Is it too difficult to understand that two people with little to no class can have an interaction with each other, and that both of those people could be wrong?

I never said I liked Manning or that he was a class act. All Im saying is your reason that you gave for Manning being classless is BS.

Now your trying to tell me that QBs are no more football players then kickers, which has to be one of the funniest things I've ever read. I'm just going to stop talking on this subject because I really don't care anymore.

[Brandon494]

I don't know what it is about Manning, but listening to him in interviews always gives me an odd impression. While he mostly says the right things, if you listen to audio versions or watch video rather than read transcripts, there often seems to be a lack of sincerity in what he says, or an overtone of sarcasm. He comes across to me as being very well-coached in how to handle the media. Consequently, I often feel that he is hiding his true feelings about the matters being discussed.

There isn't anything specific I can point to, just the impression that I get. He comes across as falsely humble. It's the way he says things, his tone and mannerisms. I always feel it is just an act.

I very well could be wrong about him.

You can say that about almost every top player in the league, especially the QBs.

[Patler]

I don't know what it is about Manning, but listening to him in interviews always gives me an odd impression. While he mostly says the right things, if you listen to audio versions or watch video rather than read transcripts, there often seems to be a lack of sincerity in what he says, or an overtone of sarcasm. He comes across to me as being very well-coached in how to handle the media. Consequently, I often feel that he is hiding his true feelings about the matters being discussed.

There isn't anything specific I can point to, just the impression that I get. He comes across as falsely humble. It's the way he says things, his tone and mannerisms. I always feel it is just an act.

I very well could be wrong about him.

You can say that about almost every top player in the league, especially the QBs.

No, I can't say that about many others. It is a feeling or impression that I get from Manning that I do not get when watching others.

This is not something that I hope to convince anyone about. Nor do I expect you to understand it. After all, it is my personal impression from watching Manning that differs from what I get watching most others. He strikes me as a phoney "team guy".

I can't think of another player from whom I get a similar impression. There are many who clearly are self-absorbed, egotistical blow-hards, but they are not phoneys. Its clear what they are.

For you fans of the "Leave It To Beaver" show, Manning around reporters strikes me as Eddie Haskell around adults. "Yes Mrs. Cleaver." "Thank you Mrs. Cleaver." "Why Mrs. Cleaver, I would love to watch little Theodore for you. He is such a wonderful little fellow."

[pbmax]

I can't think of another player from whom I get a similar impression. There are many who clearly are self-absorbed, egotistical blow-hards, but they are not phoneys. Its clear what they are.

For you fans of the "Leave It To Beaver" show, Manning around reporters strikes me as Eddie Haskell around adults. "Yes Mrs. Cleaver." "Thank you Mrs. Cleaver." "Why Mrs. Cleaver, I would love to watch little Theodore for you. He is such a wonderful little fellow."
Yes, I get the same impression. And Eddie Haskell is a very good comparison, though not even Manning is that eager to please. I have always thought that it stemmed from a sense of entitlement, or birthright. The virtue of being supremely talented and the son of an NFL QB.

Many other players, on the other hand, who act selfish, entitled or self-absorbed seem to do so out of tremendous insecurity or defensiveness. I may be projecting my impression onto his thought process, but I agree I had a similar reaction. And I confess, if I was second-generation elite athletic talent, I would be even more wary of the media than a Johnny come lately. At a young age, you see first hand how the media can affect your parent or family.

For instance, I thought this same thing when watching Barry Bonds deal with the media. He is not eager to do the right thing like Manning, but his contempt and wish to do without them is evident.

[GrnBay007]

I never said I liked Manning or that he was a class act.



Really? I would have sworn that's where this whole debate started.



Don't understand all the hate on Manning, he has been nothing but a class act his whole career. Guess some just hate because they know he will break some of Favre's records.

Once again, these people are human and no more perfect than any one of us. I'm sure they say things they regret just like we all sometimes do....difference is millions of fans hear and criticize their remarks.

[Brandon494]

I never said I liked Manning or that he was a class act.



Really? I would have sworn that's where this whole debate started.



Don't understand all the hate on Manning, he has been nothing but a class act his whole career. Guess some just hate because they know he will break some of Favre's records.

Once again, these people are human and no more perfect than any one of us. I'm sure they say things they regret just like we all sometimes do....difference is millions of fans hear and criticize their remarks.

Guessing your one of the fans who don't like him because he will break some of Favre's records. I understand he is human, but to call him classless because he responded to a big mouth kicker doesn't make him jackass like some are trying to make him to be.

[Patler]

Well, I for one could not care less if Manning breaks every one of Favre's records. In fact, I could not care less that Favre even has any records, or that any other player has an individual record. They mean absolutely nothing to me. It matters not who holds them.

Yet, I still have that feeling about Manning.........

[Gunakor]

I never said I liked Manning or that he was a class act.



Really? I would have sworn that's where this whole debate started.



Don't understand all the hate on Manning, he has been nothing but a class act his whole career. Guess some just hate because they know he will break some of Favre's records.

Once again, these people are human and no more perfect than any one of us. I'm sure they say things they regret just like we all sometimes do....difference is millions of fans hear and criticize their remarks.

Guessing your one of the fans who don't like him because he will break some of Favre's records. I understand he is human, but to call him classless because he responded to a big mouth kicker doesn't make him jackass like some are trying to make him to be.

A big mouth quarterback calling out a big mouth kicker through the media makes that quarterback as big a jackass as the kicker is.

To remain classy, keep it behind closed doors. Keep it out of the media. Don't speak your mind in front of a camera. Otherwise you are as guilty as the one you're calling out.

This isn't about who's gonna break who's records. I'm absolutely not a Favre fan, and I hope it's Aaron Rodgers that ends up breaking all of those records rather than Manning. I wish Favre never broke any of those records in the first place, or that breaking those records amounted to more playoff wins while he was here. I don't like Favre at all. Thing is, I don't like Manning at all either because he's an arrogant fuck just the same.

This is simply about derogatory statements being made about a teammate in front of a camera. Vanderjagt did it, he's an asshole. Manning did it, he's just as big an asshole. 2 wrongs don't make a right. They are both arrogant fucks where the words class and act don't belong in the same descriptive sentence. You want to see class? Check out our boy. That's class.

[Gunakor]

Now your trying to tell me that QBs are no more football players then kickers, which has to be one of the funniest things I've ever read.

LOL, what's so funny about it? How many times to you see a quarterback laying out to try and tackle a linebacker that's just intercepted said quarterback's pass? About as many times as you see a kicker making any kind of effort to tackle a kick returner that's gotten past the coverage team. Any time a quarterback gets sacked he's looking for a flag, same goes for any kicker who gets hit. They're both skirt wearin, panzy assed, pussy positions with very few exceptions.

Football is a collision sport, and any player that shies away from collisions ain't no football player. Should have been a tennis player. Or a bowler. Or ran track. Or something. In the meantime, Manning and 90% of his fellow quarterbacks will just keep campaigning for more flags to be thrown because linebackers keep trying to tackle them at the knees. And Joseph Addai and 90% of his fellow runningbacks should be laughing hysterically at them for being such pussies. I hope this clears things up.

[GrnBay007]

This isn't about who's gonna break who's records. I'm absolutely not a Favre fan, and I hope it's Aaron Rodgers that ends up breaking all of those records rather than Manning. I wish Favre never broke any of those records in the first place, or that breaking those records amounted to more playoff wins while he was here. I don't like Favre at all. Thing is, I don't like Manning at all either because he's an arrogant fuck just the same.



Hang with me Gun!! We can work on your anger/hate for BF. :P LOL

[GrnBay007]

How many times to you see a quarterback laying out to try and tackle a linebacker that's just intercepted said quarterback's pass? About as many times as you see a kicker making any kind of effort to tackle a kick returner that's gotten past the coverage team. Any time a quarterback gets sacked he's looking for a flag, same goes for any kicker who gets hit. They're both skirt wearin, panzy assed, pussy positions with very few exceptions.




BF did. :oops:

In defense of all QB's. Because they are looking for a flag doesn't necessarily mean they a "pansy". It would be dumb not to look for and try to influence the refs for a penalty. Helps your team.

[Gunakor]

This isn't about who's gonna break who's records. I'm absolutely not a Favre fan, and I hope it's Aaron Rodgers that ends up breaking all of those records rather than Manning. I wish Favre never broke any of those records in the first place, or that breaking those records amounted to more playoff wins while he was here. I don't like Favre at all. Thing is, I don't like Manning at all either because he's an arrogant fuck just the same.



Hang with me Gun!! We can work on your anger/hate for BF. :P LOL

I'm sure that anger will dissipate 5 years after BF retires for good and is standing at a podium in Canton. But you know me by now - if it isn't beneficial for Green Bay and the Packers, I'm not a fan.

[Gunakor]

How many times to you see a quarterback laying out to try and tackle a linebacker that's just intercepted said quarterback's pass? About as many times as you see a kicker making any kind of effort to tackle a kick returner that's gotten past the coverage team. Any time a quarterback gets sacked he's looking for a flag, same goes for any kicker who gets hit. They're both skirt wearin, panzy assed, pussy positions with very few exceptions.




BF did. :oops:

In defense of all QB's. Because they are looking for a flag doesn't necessarily mean they a "pansy". It would be dumb not to look for and try to influence the refs for a penalty. Helps your team.

Well, that's one of the few exceptions I was talking about. Favre would get hit and start jawing with the guy that hit him rather than the officials. Then pat him on the helmet and huddle back up for the next play. That's what a football player should do. But for every quarterback like Brett Favre, there's 3 skirt wearing panzies.

Aaron Rodgers wasn't bitching at the officials after the helmet to helmet, or the facemask. Sure it would have helped his team, and by today's rules a flag should have been thrown. But try to tell the Kenny Stablers and the Joe Namaths of NFL lore that anything illegal happened to Rodgers on either of those plays and they'll laugh in your face. Stabler and Namath were football players who played quarterback. Manning is a quarterback who plays football. There's a huge difference.

[GrnBay007]

How many times to you see a quarterback laying out to try and tackle a linebacker that's just intercepted said quarterback's pass? About as many times as you see a kicker making any kind of effort to tackle a kick returner that's gotten past the coverage team. Any time a quarterback gets sacked he's looking for a flag, same goes for any kicker who gets hit. They're both skirt wearin, panzy assed, pussy positions with very few exceptions.




BF did. :oops:

In defense of all QB's. Because they are looking for a flag doesn't necessarily mean they a "pansy". It would be dumb not to look for and try to influence the refs for a penalty. Helps your team.

Well, that's one of the few exceptions I was talking about. Favre would get hit and start jawing with the guy that hit him rather than the officials. Then pat him on the helmet and huddle back up for the next play. That's what a football player should do. But for every quarterback like Brett Favre, there's 3 skirt wearing panzies.



I can feel the shift coming....u DO still have some love left for the old boy!! LOL :P :wink:

[pbmax]

BF did. :oops:
Recently?

[GrnBay007]

BF did. :oops:
Recently?

Yep

[PlantPage55]

You want to see class? Check out our boy. That's class.

Indeed. Even Aaron Rodgers seems like he could be kind of cocky and he could easily just be reading you the "safe" answers to media questions, but all of his actions and body language tics tell me that he is a good guy. He's confident, but accepts blame. He knows he isn't perfect. He knows that when something goes wrong, that it is a team effort to correct it or learn from it.

Look at the way that Peyton turns beet-red with fury when something goes wrong. Look at the way he can flip out on his linemen or WRs from time to time.

Aaron shouldn't be afraid to grab the reins, but I think he accomplishes more by being humble and accepting blame than by trying to scare his team into performing better for him.

[Brandon494]

Now your trying to tell me that QBs are no more football players then kickers, which has to be one of the funniest things I've ever read.

LOL, what's so funny about it? How many times to you see a quarterback laying out to try and tackle a linebacker that's just intercepted said quarterback's pass? About as many times as you see a kicker making any kind of effort to tackle a kick returner that's gotten past the coverage team. Any time a quarterback gets sacked he's looking for a flag, same goes for any kicker who gets hit. They're both skirt wearin, panzy assed, pussy positions with very few exceptions.

Football is a collision sport, and any player that shies away from collisions ain't no football player. Should have been a tennis player. Or a bowler. Or ran track. Or something. In the meantime, Manning and 90% of his fellow quarterbacks will just keep campaigning for more flags to be thrown because linebackers keep trying to tackle them at the knees. And Joseph Addai and 90% of his fellow runningbacks should be laughing hysterically at them for being such pussies. I hope this clears things up.

Have you ever played football?

QB is the most important position in football, I'm not going to even waste my time arguing about this.

[Brandon494]

You want to see class? Check out our boy. That's class.

Oh you mean like when ARod said GB fans need to get on board or keep their mouth shut?

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/34045-aaron-rodgers-tells-fans-to-get-on-board-or-shut-up

Guess he is classless too huh? :lol:

[Gunakor]

Now your trying to tell me that QBs are no more football players then kickers, which has to be one of the funniest things I've ever read.

LOL, what's so funny about it? How many times to you see a quarterback laying out to try and tackle a linebacker that's just intercepted said quarterback's pass? About as many times as you see a kicker making any kind of effort to tackle a kick returner that's gotten past the coverage team. Any time a quarterback gets sacked he's looking for a flag, same goes for any kicker who gets hit. They're both skirt wearin, panzy assed, pussy positions with very few exceptions.

Football is a collision sport, and any player that shies away from collisions ain't no football player. Should have been a tennis player. Or a bowler. Or ran track. Or something. In the meantime, Manning and 90% of his fellow quarterbacks will just keep campaigning for more flags to be thrown because linebackers keep trying to tackle them at the knees. And Joseph Addai and 90% of his fellow runningbacks should be laughing hysterically at them for being such pussies. I hope this clears things up.

Have you ever played football?

QB is the most important position in football, I'm not going to even waste my time arguing about this.

If a quarterback is a football player then why can't we hit them at the knees like any other player on the field?

[Gunakor]

You want to see class? Check out our boy. That's class.

Oh you mean like when ARod said GB fans need to get on board or keep their mouth shut?

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/34045-aaron-rodgers-tells-fans-to-get-on-board-or-shut-up

Guess he is classless too huh? :lol:

That's like Nick Barnett saying either you're with us or against us. What's so derogatory about what either said?

[Brandon494]

I'm just going to agree to disagree

[pbmax]

BF did. :oops:
Recently?

Yep
So you're going to do this the hard way, is that it? :lol:
OK, WHICH game did he go hard after the guy who intercepted the ball?

[Brandon494]

BF did. :oops:
Recently?

Yep
So you're going to do this the hard way, is that it? :lol:
OK, WHICH game did he go hard after the guy who intercepted the ball?

Not sure about making a tackle after an INT but he did put a pretty good block on Patrick Willis early in the season.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Have you ever played football?

I was set to be a defensive back for the Badgers but Darrin Charles took my scholarship.

[Scott Campbell]

Have you ever played football?

I was set to be a defensive back for the Badgers but Darrin Charles took my scholarship.



Did you happen to go to Georgetown? Or as it's better known - UW Stevens Point?

[Fritz]

BF did. :oops:
Recently?

Yep
So you're going to do this the hard way, is that it? :lol:
OK, WHICH game did he go hard after the guy who intercepted the ball?

Not sure about making a tackle after an INT but he did put a pretty good block on Patrick Willis early in the season.

His blocks were usually illegal - throwing himself at guys' knees.

[packerbacker1234]

I get the argument: QB's have all these special rules that pretty much makes any contact on them illegal - that doesn't mean they are on the same level as kickers.

Kickers, generally, don't even have a THREAT of getting hit. On top of that QB's touch the ball on every offensive play save FG's and punts. I agree that QB's have some pretty panzy rules made for them... but then you see games like when favre was getting beat down against teh saints and it is a nice reminder: This is football, and yes, QB's can be hit. As long as their name isn't Peyton Manning.

[Brandon494]

You mean Tom Brady?