woodbuck27
08-03-2006, 03:06 PM
Posted August 3, 2006
It's time to put up or shut up for CB Carroll
By Pete Dougherty
pdougher@greenbaypressgazette.com
Ahmad Carroll has been the new Terrell Buckley: small, fast, cocky, high strung, mistake prone and a lightning rod.
The question is whether Carroll, unlike Buckley, can recover from a bad start to his career as a first-round cornerback with the Green Bay Packers and win over his coaches, teammates and fans.
Carroll, a third-year pro, has been humbled some by two years of NFL struggles and the Packers' decision this past offseason to spend big on free agent Charles Woodson to replace him as a starter. But in training camp, he's remained the loud, smack-talking player on the field he was his first two seasons, so he's not likely to get the benefit of the doubt from observers inside and outside the organization.
He's won the praise, however, of the Packers' new coaching staff for strides this offseason and his performance in training camp. Whether it's empty promise or the progression from liability to asset will be revealed come the regular season in his role as the team's nickel cornerback.
"(Cornerbacks coach) Lionel (Washington) and myself may be the only two," said secondary coach Kurt Schottenheimer, "but we feel very strongly about Ahmad Carroll. I couldn't be more pleased with him."
Carroll's performance as nickel back could be crucial to the Packers' pass defense precisely because they signed Woodson to a deal that includes about $10 million in first-year bonuses and salary. If Woodson performs anywhere near the level of his pay, he and Al Harris could form one of the top starting cornerback duos in the NFL. That, in turn, would put a target on Carroll's back, because offenses probably will game plan to attack him in three- and four-receiver sets rather than either of the starters.
Schottenheimer saw that dynamic in 1997, when he was in his third season as the Kansas City Chiefs' secondary coach. He had one of the best starting cornerback tandems in the NFL with James Hasty and Dale Carter. Mark McMillan was the nickel back.
After that season, Schottenheimer broke down all the man-to-man coverages and counted the pass attempts to each of those cornerbacks' man. He remembers Hasty having 45 throws to his man, Carter 55 to his and McMillan about 100 to his.
"That's why you have to have quality people," Schottenheimer said.
Carroll has been a lightning rod of criticism for a combination of factors. The biggest is that he was a first-round pick who had a terrible time with penalties and getting beat in coverage his first 1½ years in the league. He showed some improvement down the stretch last season, but continued to turn off some people within the organization who viewed him as immature and resistant to coaching.
He did nothing to help himself this offseason when he was arrested on misdemeanor chargers after a run-in with police at a bar in Fayetteville, Ark.
More to the point, Carroll's behavior on the field during offseason practices and in training camp often do little to suggest to he's matured much. In practice, his celebrations continue to be demonstrative and loud when he makes a play.
"I try to tell him to tone it down a little bit," said Harris, "especially in practice, because the plays you make in practice you're supposed to make."
At least some within the Packers write that off to Carroll's youth  though he's a third-year pro, he turns 23 Friday. The NFL, however, is full of young players who aren't as demonstrative as Carroll.
Carroll wasn't available for comment during the abbreviated time the locker room was open to reporters Wednesday. Though he's far from universally liked, there are no obvious signs he's a divisive figure. Harris calls him a close friend.
"He can be annoying sometimes," Harris said, "but I love him to death, and I'd do anything for him. That's the honest truth."
Even with Carroll's celebrations and trash talking, Schottenheimer and Harris argue he has matured in the last year.
"He's listening to Speedy (Washington)," Harris said. "This whole situation is humbling, when you go from a No. 1 corner to the third corner. That's all it is, you just have to humble yourself. I think he's done that."
Schottenheimer says it's shown in Carroll's work ethic. He said Carroll has taken the most snaps among cornerbacks in training camp, and is the first to volunteer if someone asks for rest.
"If he goes out this year and has a lot of problems, then people are going to be on his butt," Schottenheimer said. "But I'm seeing a kid maturing as an NFL player. Does he still talk? Yeah, he still talks. That's what he's going to do."
Carroll has had a decent start to training camp, including a good read to make one of the five interceptions quarterback Brett Favre threw on Monday.
But Wednesday, he had a forgettable day in which he was beaten badly at least four times during one-on-one and team drills. In one-on-ones in the red zone, Donald Driver smoked him on a slant for an easy touchdown from Favre, and on Carroll's next turn, Marc Boerigter beat him along the sidelines for another touchdown. In the next team drill, two receivers who probably won't make the team  Chris Francies and Chad Lucas  beat him on fade routes.
Schottenheimer acknowledged Carroll's rough day and attributed it to hitting the training-camp wall. Besides leading the cornerbacks in snaps, he returns kickoffs in every practice.
That explanation won't placate some critics, but Schottenheimer predicts Carroll will win most of them over.
"I'll go on the record saying this: They're going to like him a lot in the future," Schottenheimer said. "He's 22 years old, tomorrow or in the next couple days he'll be 23 years old, and he's going to be in this league a long time."
It's time to put up or shut up for CB Carroll
By Pete Dougherty
pdougher@greenbaypressgazette.com
Ahmad Carroll has been the new Terrell Buckley: small, fast, cocky, high strung, mistake prone and a lightning rod.
The question is whether Carroll, unlike Buckley, can recover from a bad start to his career as a first-round cornerback with the Green Bay Packers and win over his coaches, teammates and fans.
Carroll, a third-year pro, has been humbled some by two years of NFL struggles and the Packers' decision this past offseason to spend big on free agent Charles Woodson to replace him as a starter. But in training camp, he's remained the loud, smack-talking player on the field he was his first two seasons, so he's not likely to get the benefit of the doubt from observers inside and outside the organization.
He's won the praise, however, of the Packers' new coaching staff for strides this offseason and his performance in training camp. Whether it's empty promise or the progression from liability to asset will be revealed come the regular season in his role as the team's nickel cornerback.
"(Cornerbacks coach) Lionel (Washington) and myself may be the only two," said secondary coach Kurt Schottenheimer, "but we feel very strongly about Ahmad Carroll. I couldn't be more pleased with him."
Carroll's performance as nickel back could be crucial to the Packers' pass defense precisely because they signed Woodson to a deal that includes about $10 million in first-year bonuses and salary. If Woodson performs anywhere near the level of his pay, he and Al Harris could form one of the top starting cornerback duos in the NFL. That, in turn, would put a target on Carroll's back, because offenses probably will game plan to attack him in three- and four-receiver sets rather than either of the starters.
Schottenheimer saw that dynamic in 1997, when he was in his third season as the Kansas City Chiefs' secondary coach. He had one of the best starting cornerback tandems in the NFL with James Hasty and Dale Carter. Mark McMillan was the nickel back.
After that season, Schottenheimer broke down all the man-to-man coverages and counted the pass attempts to each of those cornerbacks' man. He remembers Hasty having 45 throws to his man, Carter 55 to his and McMillan about 100 to his.
"That's why you have to have quality people," Schottenheimer said.
Carroll has been a lightning rod of criticism for a combination of factors. The biggest is that he was a first-round pick who had a terrible time with penalties and getting beat in coverage his first 1½ years in the league. He showed some improvement down the stretch last season, but continued to turn off some people within the organization who viewed him as immature and resistant to coaching.
He did nothing to help himself this offseason when he was arrested on misdemeanor chargers after a run-in with police at a bar in Fayetteville, Ark.
More to the point, Carroll's behavior on the field during offseason practices and in training camp often do little to suggest to he's matured much. In practice, his celebrations continue to be demonstrative and loud when he makes a play.
"I try to tell him to tone it down a little bit," said Harris, "especially in practice, because the plays you make in practice you're supposed to make."
At least some within the Packers write that off to Carroll's youth  though he's a third-year pro, he turns 23 Friday. The NFL, however, is full of young players who aren't as demonstrative as Carroll.
Carroll wasn't available for comment during the abbreviated time the locker room was open to reporters Wednesday. Though he's far from universally liked, there are no obvious signs he's a divisive figure. Harris calls him a close friend.
"He can be annoying sometimes," Harris said, "but I love him to death, and I'd do anything for him. That's the honest truth."
Even with Carroll's celebrations and trash talking, Schottenheimer and Harris argue he has matured in the last year.
"He's listening to Speedy (Washington)," Harris said. "This whole situation is humbling, when you go from a No. 1 corner to the third corner. That's all it is, you just have to humble yourself. I think he's done that."
Schottenheimer says it's shown in Carroll's work ethic. He said Carroll has taken the most snaps among cornerbacks in training camp, and is the first to volunteer if someone asks for rest.
"If he goes out this year and has a lot of problems, then people are going to be on his butt," Schottenheimer said. "But I'm seeing a kid maturing as an NFL player. Does he still talk? Yeah, he still talks. That's what he's going to do."
Carroll has had a decent start to training camp, including a good read to make one of the five interceptions quarterback Brett Favre threw on Monday.
But Wednesday, he had a forgettable day in which he was beaten badly at least four times during one-on-one and team drills. In one-on-ones in the red zone, Donald Driver smoked him on a slant for an easy touchdown from Favre, and on Carroll's next turn, Marc Boerigter beat him along the sidelines for another touchdown. In the next team drill, two receivers who probably won't make the team  Chris Francies and Chad Lucas  beat him on fade routes.
Schottenheimer acknowledged Carroll's rough day and attributed it to hitting the training-camp wall. Besides leading the cornerbacks in snaps, he returns kickoffs in every practice.
That explanation won't placate some critics, but Schottenheimer predicts Carroll will win most of them over.
"I'll go on the record saying this: They're going to like him a lot in the future," Schottenheimer said. "He's 22 years old, tomorrow or in the next couple days he'll be 23 years old, and he's going to be in this league a long time."