What would the Packers have done?

[Patler]

A little what if to pass the time:

Assume that after the close call in 2007, Favre immediately said; "This team is close. I love it here. I want to play as long as I am able to, and I will be back in 2008 for sure." Then, assume he followed that up each season until now.

What would the Packers have done in 2008?
What about 2009?
Or this season?

[Tarlam!]

Well, I'm on record as saying I think TT and M3 had had enough of Bert and engineered it so that he would exit. I stand by that. I think they knew what they had in Rodgers and they knew they had to move. Another motivation - if they indeed, needed one.

[Patler]

Well, I'm on record as saying I think TT and M3 had had enough of Bert and engineered it so that he would exit. I stand by that. I think they knew what they had in Rodgers and they knew they had to move. Another motivation - if they indeed, needed one.

So what would they have done in 2008?
Traded him?
Started the season with him, but played Rodgers at any/every opportunity?
Benched him?

If they had made the decision to move on to Rodgers, how would they have handled Favre?

[Tarlam!]

Exactly as they did. They would have opened up the position to competition. Which is exactly what they did when Bert flip flopped. The reaction was predictable.

At least, that's how I have always seen it. They knew what they had in both QBs. They dealt with it like pros.

[Patler]

Exactly as they did. They would have opened up the position to competition. Which is exactly what they did when Bert flip flopped. The reaction was predictable.

At least, that's how I have always seen it. They knew what they had in both QBs. They dealt with it like pros.

You might be right, but that would have been real difficult. After all, Favre had a very good season in '07. How would they justify opening it up to competition if Favre had been committed to returning in '08?

I tend to think they would have given Favre another year, but would not have hesitated to use Rodgers at every opportunity. Every decent lead, every injury to Favre no matter how slight would have been used as an opportunity to play Rodgers. Then, if Favre was having an "off" day, in would come Rodgers again.

I tend to think it would have been a messy season.

Favre did them a favor by forcing their hand, I think.

[Brandon494]

Its no way they would have benched or traded Favre IF he was committed and said he was coming back for sure. They just got tired of the same shit he is doing right now and had to make a move. People can blame TT and MM all they want but Favre brought it on himself.

[get louder at lambeau]

Its no way they would have benched or traded Favre IF he was committed and said he was coming back for sure. They just got tired of the same shit he is doing right now and had to make a move. People can blame TT and MM all they want but Favre brought it on himself.

Yup. He could have stayed as long as he wanted, as long as he was an effective QB. So far he still is.

[ThunderDan]

A little what if to pass the time:

Assume that after the close call in 2007, Favre immediately said; "This team is close. I love it here. I want to play as long as I am able to, and I will be back in 2008 for sure." Then, assume he followed that up each season until now.

What would the Packers have done in 2008?
What about 2009?
Or this season?

That's a great couple of questions.

I don't see how they could have benched Favre in 2008. So you either had to trade him or play him. At that point there is no way TT and MM could have dumped Favre without major repercusions. He was still the teams icon and had not really done anything to really alienate the fans. So Favre starts in 2008 and ARod rides the pine. The Packers would have had the same record in 2008. Arod would get the lead time after time in the 4th Q only to have the D give it back up.

If Favre played like he did in 2009 for MN as the GB QB you have to think that we could have made the Super Bowl. MN would have been starting TJack or Sage and the Packers split if not take both games.

In 2010 we would have Favre, Flynn and Harrell. ARod would have jumped to find a place to play. Maybe just Flynn, Harrell and McNabb or someother QB as BF would have retired if we made the Super Bowl after the 2009 season.

[bobblehead]

Absolutely no question in my mind that if Bert played each year as well as he did in '07 he would still be our QB right now. MM and TT know that you only have a 4-6 year window to win in an organization before they move on, and no way would they have replaced a QB who played very good.

This is all assuming he did the minimum off season work they demanded, which is what ultimately sunk him in '08....he tried to play it so he could do nothing until camp started and TT and MM punked him.

[mraynrand]

I think they would have traded Arod to Jacksonville, along with their #30 draft pick to move up and grab Derrick Harvey.

[Fritz]

This is a good question. My guess would be they'd have played Favre in '08. The real decision would have come in '09. What to do?

Sign Arod to a big extension (if he'd accept) knowing he was your backup QB for the next year....or two....or three?

Trade one? Which one? The proven vet whose time might be winding down, but who is a legend in your organization? The very face of it? Or trade the young unproven guy, knowing he might become a superstar (since you'd had him in camp for a couple years) and you'd have no one to come in when Favre left?

I'm glad I'm not MM and TT.

And in fact, Patler, you are probably right - Favre did them a favre. But my guess is they'd preferred that he'd done it one year later.

[Pugger]

If memory serves Favre was slated to be our starting QB in 2008 after the conference championship game, right? If he had said right away the team was close (and it sure as hell was!) and he was eager to come back he would have been our starter. I believe it was Favre who wanted out of GB. Why else would a QB near the end of his career want to leave a team that just weeks ago was playing for a Super Bowl berth? I don't buy for one moment that TT and MM pushed him out the door. No GM or HC would bench their HOF QB after the season #4 had in 2007! I will say that once #4 "retired" the Packers took him at his word and passed the torch to Rodgers. Had Favre stayed as our starter I agree Rodgers would have played if Favre got hurt or we had a big lead (or were really getting beat badly).

[Brandon494]

For what its worth I'm glad how it worked out minus Favre playing for the damn Vikings. Rodgers will be the best QB in the league in 3-4 years imo.

[Tarlam!]

I don't buy for one moment that TT and MM pushed him out the door. No GM or HC would bench their HOF QB after the season #4 had in 2007! I will say that once #4 "retired" the Packers took him at his word and passed the torch to Rodgers. Had Favre stayed as our starter I agree Rodgers would have played if Favre got hurt or we had a big lead (or were really getting beat badly).

See, I honestly disagree. M3 and TT knew what they had in Rodgers, though nobody else did. They knew what they had in Bert, I mean the crappy side that we all got to know later. The side Chilly now has to deal with, the one that got what'shisface fired in NY.

They basically forced him out the door. Anyone remember the locker gift and 20 million severence package?

[Patler]

Its no way they would have benched or traded Favre IF he was committed and said he was coming back for sure. They just got tired of the same shit he is doing right now and had to make a move. People can blame TT and MM all they want but Favre brought it on himself.

Yup. He could have stayed as long as he wanted, as long as he was an effective QB. So far he still is.

But what would they have done with Rodgers?

Personally, I think they had decided that Favre could no longer take them all the way, and they would have found some way to make the transition, but it might have taken two seasons to complete.

They would have played Rodgers enough in 2008 to start a controversy, if he was at all effective, so they could have opened it up in 2009.

[Fritz]

I don't buy for one moment that TT and MM pushed him out the door. No GM or HC would bench their HOF QB after the season #4 had in 2007! I will say that once #4 "retired" the Packers took him at his word and passed the torch to Rodgers. Had Favre stayed as our starter I agree Rodgers would have played if Favre got hurt or we had a big lead (or were really getting beat badly).

See, I honestly disagree. M3 and TT knew what they had in Rodgers, though nobody else did. They knew what they had in Bert, I mean the crappy side that we all got to know later. The side Chilly now has to deal with, the one that got what'shisface fired in NY.

They basically forced him out the door. Anyone remember the locker gift and 20 million severence package?

This is where I disagree, Tar. Sure, they knew they had a keeper. But in the pressure of the NFL, with your team one bad pass from the Super Bowl, do you really think anyone - even TT with stones of ice - would ditch Brett Favre if he'd said he was eager to come back? I don't. I think they'd have brought him back for 08 for the big run. You THINK you know what you have in Rodgers, but you've got the SB dangling right in front of you with a HOF QB. If Favre had said he wanted to come back, he'd have been back. Now, 09 might have been another story...

[Pugger]

I don't buy for one moment that TT and MM pushed him out the door. No GM or HC would bench their HOF QB after the season #4 had in 2007! I will say that once #4 "retired" the Packers took him at his word and passed the torch to Rodgers. Had Favre stayed as our starter I agree Rodgers would have played if Favre got hurt or we had a big lead (or were really getting beat badly).

See, I honestly disagree. M3 and TT knew what they had in Rodgers, though nobody else did. They knew what they had in Bert, I mean the crappy side that we all got to know later. The side Chilly now has to deal with, the one that got what'shisface fired in NY.

They basically forced him out the door. Anyone remember the locker gift and 20 million severence package?

The lockerroom gift was AFTER he "retired" and from what I understand that $20 million package was in the works before 2007. You may be right and TT and MM got tired of the crap from Favre but I don't know if they would have kicked him to the curb had #4 not "retired" first. I honestly think Favre played the retirement card to get out of town. I suspect he didn't care for TT dismissing his personnel advice and didn't like MM actually tring to coach him and telling him what to do. No wonder he was hell-bent on joining the Vikes and Chilly the Enabler.

[Tarlam!]

I hear ya Pugger, Fritz. But they knew they had a procrastonater in Favre and wanted clarity. It was a contract year for A-Rod. Favre, by my own deduction, was becoming more eccentirc by the week and from what I've seen in GB pressers, that's not Packer People.

Also, that last throw against the Giants was vintage Favre and heartbreaking. I believe he didn't look the part that whole NFCCG. Cold and weathered, not wanting to be there.

As it was they copped enough crap from irate fans and woe be tied if Favre had of won the SB last season - the calls for TT's head would be unbearable.

I also look at the timetable they gave Favre to make his decision, the lack of ass-kissing the swiftness of the presser, the look on TT's face etc as an indictment for the "Master Plan".

[Bossman641]

I also look at the timetable they gave Favre to make his decision, the lack of ass-kissing the swiftness of the presser, the look on TT's face etc as an indictment for the "Master Plan".

But TT and MM were the ones telling Favre to make more time to make a decision. Also, they had scheduled a flight down there to welcome him back but Favre called and told them to forget it.

Gotta disagree Tar. There was no way that they kicked him out and there is no way they would have been able to force him out. If Favre had come back and stayed committed, Rodgers would be gone. No way would he still be riding the bench at this point.

[Tarlam!]

No worries, Bossman, none at all.

The way I remember it is that TT and M3 wanted an early decision so they could act in the draft. Or was it Bert that said he'd make a decision early? Something like that.

At any rate, no way M3 was gonna do the same summersaults as Chilly has, twice now. I agree Bert made it easy, but my hunch tells me he was done in GB. TT played him like a fiddle, all the while keeping the high ground. Still, remember the Favre Wars?

It would have been easier for all concerned if he dumps off to Grant instead of going to Driver, a couple of plays later they are in FG range and the Packers upset that Pats instead of the Giants. Would have been a perfect script and he'd still be a hero to all and not a traitor to half.

[falco]

It would have been easier for all concerned if he dumps off to Grant instead of going to Driver, a couple of plays later they are in FG range and the Packers upset that Pats instead of the Giants. Would have been a perfect script and he'd still be a hero to all and not a traitor to half.

Boy, that's an interesting point. Imagine how different the world would be.

[Fritz]

But going along with Patler's "what if?" idea, then if Favre had done that and teh Pack had won, and then gone to the Superbowl. What if...

1. The Pack played the Pats tight but in that game Favre throws a key intercept? Then what? Do you bring Favre back, after the usual vacillating, and probably lose Rodgers so you have that one-more-shot?

2. The Packers do win the SB. Then what do you do when Favre announces there's nothing more he can accomplish, wants to go out a winner, then starts hemming and hawing? Do you kow-tow to the guy who QB'd your team to a Super Bowl win?

For the long-term sake of the franchise, maybe it really all worked out for the best.

[Pugger]

But going along with Patler's "what if?" idea, then if Favre had done that and teh Pack had won, and then gone to the Superbowl. What if...

1. The Pack played the Pats tight but in that game Favre throws a key intercept? Then what? Do you bring Favre back, after the usual vacillating, and probably lose Rodgers so you have that one-more-shot?

2. The Packers do win the SB. Then what do you do when Favre announces there's nothing more he can accomplish, wants to go out a winner, then starts hemming and hawing? Do you kow-tow to the guy who QB'd your team to a Super Bowl win?

For the long-term sake of the franchise, maybe it really all worked out for the best.

Was 2008 Rodgers' last year on his original contract?

[retailguy]

But going along with Patler's "what if?" idea, then if Favre had done that and teh Pack had won, and then gone to the Superbowl. What if...

1. The Pack played the Pats tight but in that game Favre throws a key intercept? Then what? Do you bring Favre back, after the usual vacillating, and probably lose Rodgers so you have that one-more-shot?

2. The Packers do win the SB. Then what do you do when Favre announces there's nothing more he can accomplish, wants to go out a winner, then starts hemming and hawing? Do you kow-tow to the guy who QB'd your team to a Super Bowl win?

For the long-term sake of the franchise, maybe it really all worked out for the best.

Was 2008 Rodgers' last year on his original contract?

I don't think so. Coming out of Cal, Rodgers signed a 5 year, 7.7mil contract, so I think that took him through 2009.

Maybe there was a voidable year or something, I don't recall.

[ThunderDan]

But going along with Patler's "what if?" idea, then if Favre had done that and teh Pack had won, and then gone to the Superbowl. What if...

1. The Pack played the Pats tight but in that game Favre throws a key intercept? Then what? Do you bring Favre back, after the usual vacillating, and probably lose Rodgers so you have that one-more-shot?

2. The Packers do win the SB. Then what do you do when Favre announces there's nothing more he can accomplish, wants to go out a winner, then starts hemming and hawing? Do you kow-tow to the guy who QB'd your team to a Super Bowl win?

For the long-term sake of the franchise, maybe it really all worked out for the best.

Was 2008 Rodgers' last year on his original contract?

No he originally signed a 5 year $7.7M deal that could have gone to $24.5 M if he met performance goals (to be read: Started). He would have been under contract thru 2009.

[bobblehead]

I don't buy for one moment that TT and MM pushed him out the door. No GM or HC would bench their HOF QB after the season #4 had in 2007! I will say that once #4 "retired" the Packers took him at his word and passed the torch to Rodgers. Had Favre stayed as our starter I agree Rodgers would have played if Favre got hurt or we had a big lead (or were really getting beat badly).

See, I honestly disagree. M3 and TT knew what they had in Rodgers, though nobody else did. They knew what they had in Bert, I mean the crappy side that we all got to know later. The side Chilly now has to deal with, the one that got what'shisface fired in NY.

They basically forced him out the door. Anyone remember the locker gift and 20 million severence package?

The lockerroom gift was AFTER he "retired" and from what I understand that $20 million package was in the works before 2007. You may be right and TT and MM got tired of the crap from Favre but I don't know if they would have kicked him to the curb had #4 not "retired" first. I honestly think Favre played the retirement card to get out of town. I suspect he didn't care for TT dismissing his personnel advice and didn't like MM actually tring to coach him and telling him what to do. No wonder he was hell-bent on joining the Vikes and Chilly the Enabler.

I agree with all except he was trying to get out of town when he first retired....he was trying to get out of offseason work that MM and TT demanded. Prior to '07 they sent a personal trainer to Mississippi, that was in the news. They pretty much made sure he didn't show up to camp as out of shape as usual.

Favre didn't like that so he "retired". Maybe he believed it at the time, maybe not, but for damn sure he wasn't doing any offseason work. When he first said he was thinking about coming back MM was on board and wanted to send the trainer down there again, then BF said..."nevermind".

When he made it pretty obvious he was playing this game all summer until TC started, that is when TT sent him his locker....sort of a "fuck you if you want to play this game, we are done with you" move.

This whole ordeal was like you say. BF didn't like being coached and having a GM with convictions....and he really didn't like being told to stay in shape in the offseason.

[get louder at lambeau]

I don't buy for one moment that TT and MM pushed him out the door. No GM or HC would bench their HOF QB after the season #4 had in 2007! I will say that once #4 "retired" the Packers took him at his word and passed the torch to Rodgers. Had Favre stayed as our starter I agree Rodgers would have played if Favre got hurt or we had a big lead (or were really getting beat badly).

See, I honestly disagree. M3 and TT knew what they had in Rodgers, though nobody else did. They knew what they had in Bert, I mean the crappy side that we all got to know later. The side Chilly now has to deal with, the one that got what'shisface fired in NY.

They basically forced him out the door. Anyone remember the locker gift and 20 million severence package?

The lockerroom gift was AFTER he "retired" and from what I understand that $20 million package was in the works before 2007. You may be right and TT and MM got tired of the crap from Favre but I don't know if they would have kicked him to the curb had #4 not "retired" first. I honestly think Favre played the retirement card to get out of town. I suspect he didn't care for TT dismissing his personnel advice and didn't like MM actually tring to coach him and telling him what to do. No wonder he was hell-bent on joining the Vikes and Chilly the Enabler.

I agree with all except he was trying to get out of town when he first retired....he was trying to get out of offseason work that MM and TT demanded. Prior to '07 they sent a personal trainer to Mississippi, that was in the news. They pretty much made sure he didn't show up to camp as out of shape as usual.

Favre didn't like that so he "retired". Maybe he believed it at the time, maybe not, but for damn sure he wasn't doing any offseason work. When he first said he was thinking about coming back MM was on board and wanted to send the trainer down there again, then BF said..."nevermind".

When he made it pretty obvious he was playing this game all summer until TC started, that is when TT sent him his locker....sort of a "fuck you if you want to play this game, we are done with you" move.

This whole ordeal was like you say. BF didn't like being coached and having a GM with convictions....and he really didn't like being told to stay in shape in the offseason.

That's probably somewhere near the truth.