Lack of discipline or fluke? Who do you blame. stats posted

[Packers4Glory]

The numbers are a little shocking, but consistent. Who do you blame?

Offensive penalty yards NFL

2007-rank #2 1006 yards (2nd worst in NFL)
2008-rank #1 984 yards (worst in NFL)
2009-rank #2 1057 yards


Defensive penalty yards NFL

2007-rank #1 908 yards (worst in NFL)
2008-rank #15 721 yards
2009-rank #5 914 yards


Last good year we had as far as penalties was 2006 when we were in the bottom half of the lg.


At what point do you hold the coaching staff accountable when it doesn't seem they are improving or holding the players responsible? That is a lot of yards in the hole to dig yourself out from over the course of a season. Come playoff time its absolutely brutal to overcome.

Nothing highlights my gripe like the personal foul by Williams following the Zombo roughing the passser. Zombo's wasn't intentional but Williams was absolutely absurd and we've seen many of these types of boneheaded penalties the past 4 seasons.

Bad thing now is we have developed a rep for penalties and we are going to be watched and called on more than our fair share.

[red]

i think every year for the past 3 years we've had this same thread and it always just dies because the team ends up winning

but i agree this is all coaching

[vince]

2010

Week 1
Packers / Eagles
2 Penalties = 15 yards / 10 Penalties = 80 yards

Week 2
Packers / Bills
4 Penalties = 35 Yards / 6 Penalties = 49 Yards

Week 3
Packers / Bears
18 Penalties = 152 Yards / 5 Penalties = 38 yards

2010
Packers / Opponents
22 Penalties = 202 Yards / 21 Penalties = 167 Yards

The Packers have cleaned up the penalties significantly until Monday night. Some people are calling for McCarthy's head. Let's see how it goes from here before throwing what could be a great season down the toilet by freaking out and firing the head coach shall we?

[Packers4Glory]

sorry 2 clean games is more of an anomaly at this juncture.

yeah we seem to win till its playoff time or vs an elite team. Then we spit the bit and shoot ourselves in the foot.

Last yr 4 of our 5 losses game vs elite teams. Yeah I consider Pitt elite because they were much better than their record indicated.

The only truly decent teams we beat were the Cowboys and Ravens. final vs AZ was a joke. playoffs vs AZ was a chokefest.

[HarveyWallbangers]

sorry 2 clean games is more of an anomaly at this juncture.

yeah we seem to win till its playoff time or vs an elite team. Then we spit the bit and shoot ourselves in the foot.

Last yr 4 of our 5 losses game vs elite teams. Yeah I consider Pitt elite because they were much better than their record indicated.

The only truly decent teams we beat were the Cowboys and Ravens. final vs AZ was a joke. playoffs vs AZ was a chokefest.

Elite teams are good. They win a lot. Is it a surprise that losses come against elite teams (e.g. teams that are better than you)? Is it better to lose to non-elite teams?

[Joemailman]

sorry 2 clean games is more of an anomaly at this juncture.

yeah we seem to win till its playoff time or vs an elite team. Then we spit the bit and shoot ourselves in the foot.

Last yr 4 of our 5 losses game vs elite teams. Yeah I consider Pitt elite because they were much better than their record indicated.

The only truly decent teams we beat were the Cowboys and Ravens. final vs AZ was a joke. playoffs vs AZ was a chokefest.

Give it a rest. Packers were down 17 points on the road and almost won the game. That's not choking. You seem to be posting here a lot since the loss to the Bears. You gonna be here when the Pack beats somebody "elite", which they will do?

[Packers4Glory]

sorry 2 clean games is more of an anomaly at this juncture.

yeah we seem to win till its playoff time or vs an elite team. Then we spit the bit and shoot ourselves in the foot.

Last yr 4 of our 5 losses game vs elite teams. Yeah I consider Pitt elite because they were much better than their record indicated.

The only truly decent teams we beat were the Cowboys and Ravens. final vs AZ was a joke. playoffs vs AZ was a chokefest.

Give it a rest. Packers were down 17 points on the road and almost won the game. That's not choking. You seem to be posting here a lot since the loss to the Bears. You gonna be here when the Pack beats somebody "elite", which they will do? almost. God you sound like a chicago fan of any sport. almost. good standards. I'll be quite please when this team finally beats an elite team.

[hoosier]

Give it a rest. Packers were down 17 points on the road and almost won the game. That's not choking. You seem to be posting here a lot since the loss to the Bears. You gonna be here when the Pack beats somebody "elite", which they will do?

God you sound like a chicago fan of any sport. almost. good standards. .

If Joe "sounds like a Chicago fan" what would that make you? :lol:

[Packers4Glory]

Give it a rest. Packers were down 17 points on the road and almost won the game. That's not choking. You seem to be posting here a lot since the loss to the Bears. You gonna be here when the Pack beats somebody "elite", which they will do?

God you sound like a chicago fan of any sport. almost. good standards. .

If Joe "sounds like a Chicago fan" what would that make you? :lol:

haha I sound like a fan w/ the high standards this team and fans should have. We ALMOST went to the super bowl a few years ago. what does almost get you other than a loss?

I don't expect them to win every game. There will be games where you get outplayed. But I can not stand a team that shoots itself in the dick and loses games they should have won...ie: TB last yr. Games like these have a way of biting you in the ass again when it comes to where you play in Jan.

I count possibly 5 extremely tough road games remaining on the schedule. 3 or 4 tough home games. I don't expect to win all those so it makes losing this game as a possible critical loss when it comes to HFA which should be the goal for the regular season.

[sharpe1027]

haha I sound like a fan w/ the high standards this team and fans should have. We ALMOST went to the super bowl a few years ago. what does almost get you other than a loss?

I don't expect them to win every game. There will be games where you get outplayed. But I can not stand a team that shoots itself in the dick and loses games they should have won...ie: TB last yr. Games like these have a way of biting you in the ass again when it comes to where you play in Jan.

I count possibly 5 extremely tough road games remaining on the schedule. 3 or 4 tough home games. I don't expect to win all those so it makes losing this game as a possible critical loss when it comes to HFA which should be the goal for the regular season.

Which would you prefer a team that was better and only lost because they beat themselves OR a team that was not better and could only win if the other team beat themselves.

I'll take the first any day of the week. Nobody's happy with the loss, but the sky isn't falling just yet.

[run pMc]

"We'll get that cleaned up."

:roll:

[mraynrand]

We ALMOST went to the super bowl a few years ago. what does almost get you other than a loss?

A far more exiting season than the Browns, the Bills, or any team that didn't win at least 13 games and make the playoffs (IOW, most of the league), a Divisional home win that will be fun to rewatch and reminisce about for - well, for the rest of our lives. It was pretty sweet. Even some parts of the NFCC game were pretty sweet. There were fans of 28 other teams that wished their team was playing in that game. That's more than just a loss.

[Packgator]

The numbers are a little shocking, but consistent. Who do you blame?

At what point do you hold the coaching staff accountable when it doesn't seem they are improving or holding the players responsible?

Lets say "we" decide to blame the coaching staff and hold them accountable. Then what? What is accomplished by doing so?

[SlimPickens]

"We'll get that cleaned up."

:roll:

It's f*cken pad level.

[Packgator]

I'll be quite please when this team finally beats an elite team.

Which team(s) on the remaining schedule qualifies as elite? Is there an elite team on the remaining schedule? Do the Jets, Vikings, Cowboys, Falcons, Patriots, or Bears qualify? If so.....how do the Eagles stack up against those teams? If not.....will the Packers play an entire season without playing an elite team? Maybe the Packers have already played (and beaten) the best team on their schedule. Who knows?

[ThunderDan]

Pretty soon we will be debating if Arod has "it" again like in 2008.

[denverYooper]

MrAR and ThunderDan are right. We Packers fans are spoiled as hell.

[bobblehead]

sorry 2 clean games is more of an anomaly at this juncture.

yeah we seem to win till its playoff time or vs an elite team. Then we spit the bit and shoot ourselves in the foot.

Last yr 4 of our 5 losses game vs elite teams. Yeah I consider Pitt elite because they were much better than their record indicated.

The only truly decent teams we beat were the Cowboys and Ravens. final vs AZ was a joke. playoffs vs AZ was a chokefest.

What about the Eagles. they were in the Playoffs last year and we beat them in their own backyard. They are 2-0 other than when they played an elite team like GB.

Wait...I know your answer. If Vick da Great (who couldn't crack a starting lineup or even get many offers for a contract until we KO'd Kolb) had been in the game we would have lost right?

You are a typical cynic. Anything good that the Packers do is a result of the other team sucking, and anything bad we do is a result of us sucking.

Just think, if the 2 penalties on one kickoff return by Hester had been called we win that game....2 non calls in a game where the flag happy refs managed to pull out the hanky quite a bit.....strange indeed.

[Packers4Glory]

sorry 2 clean games is more of an anomaly at this juncture.

yeah we seem to win till its playoff time or vs an elite team. Then we spit the bit and shoot ourselves in the foot.

Last yr 4 of our 5 losses game vs elite teams. Yeah I consider Pitt elite because they were much better than their record indicated.

The only truly decent teams we beat were the Cowboys and Ravens. final vs AZ was a joke. playoffs vs AZ was a chokefest.

What about the Eagles. they were in the Playoffs last year and we beat them in their own backyard. They are 2-0 other than when they played an elite team like GB.

Wait...I know your answer. If Vick da Great (who couldn't crack a starting lineup or even get many offers for a contract until we KO'd Kolb) had been in the game we would have lost right?

You are a typical cynic. Anything good that the Packers do is a result of the other team sucking, and anything bad we do is a result of us sucking.

Just think, if the 2 penalties on one kickoff return by Hester had been called we win that game....2 non calls in a game where the flag happy refs managed to pull out the hanky quite a bit.....strange indeed.

not true at all. However you seem to have that same look to blame everyone else like oh the refs didn't call a penalty..blah blah blah. I really didn't see anything to complain about on Hesters returns.

I hate Vick and had they prepared for Vick I don't think he'd have been nearly as effective.

I guess my gripe is I see the talent on this team, and the only thing stopping them from being great is themselves. I don't really see how you can look at the penalty numbers over the past 3 seasons and NOT see a problem. They are remarkably consistent. Now we are fighting a reputation for penalties and I believe that is a factor. we will get called for more nitpicky bullshit than what maybe the other team gets until we clean it up for real.

[hoosier]

sorry 2 clean games is more of an anomaly at this juncture.

yeah we seem to win till its playoff time or vs an elite team. Then we spit the bit and shoot ourselves in the foot.

Last yr 4 of our 5 losses game vs elite teams. Yeah I consider Pitt elite because they were much better than their record indicated.

The only truly decent teams we beat were the Cowboys and Ravens. final vs AZ was a joke. playoffs vs AZ was a chokefest.

What about the Eagles. they were in the Playoffs last year and we beat them in their own backyard. They are 2-0 other than when they played an elite team like GB.

Wait...I know your answer. If Vick da Great (who couldn't crack a starting lineup or even get many offers for a contract until we KO'd Kolb) had been in the game we would have lost right?

You are a typical cynic. Anything good that the Packers do is a result of the other team sucking, and anything bad we do is a result of us sucking.

Just think, if the 2 penalties on one kickoff return by Hester had been called we win that game....2 non calls in a game where the flag happy refs managed to pull out the hanky quite a bit.....strange indeed.

not true at all. However you seem to have that same look to blame everyone else like oh the refs didn't call a penalty..blah blah blah. I really didn't see anything to complain about on Hesters returns.

I hate Vick and had they prepared for Vick I don't think he'd have been nearly as effective.

I guess my gripe is I see the talent on this team, and the only thing stopping them from being great is themselves. I don't really see how you can look at the penalty numbers over the past 3 seasons and NOT see a problem. They are remarkably consistent. Now we are fighting a reputation for penalties and I believe that is a factor. we will get called for more nitpicky bullshit than what maybe the other team gets until we clean it up for real.

The most obvious problems that have plagued the Packers during McCarthy's regime are penalties, poor special teams play and inconsistent offensive line performance. During the first two games of this season it seemed as if they had the penalty problems as well as the special teams debacles corrected. Is the Bear game an aberration on both of those counts or a sign that the fixes were superficial? Only time will tell. I agree that the chronic problems are especially frustrating; from the outside it looks like they should be easy to fix and it is hard to understand why they persist (does the staff not recognize them, are they unable to teach fundamentals or are the players slow on the uptake?). But when I look at the Packers in the context of the entire league I see (a) they have had pretty good success over the last four years and (b) that things seem to be pointing up in general even if there are still a few bumps in the road. In the history of the NFL there are very, very few teams that have dominated a season from start to finish without letdowns, slumps and moments of instability. I still expect to see the Packers finish strong and make a deep playoff run.

[bobblehead]

sorry 2 clean games is more of an anomaly at this juncture.

yeah we seem to win till its playoff time or vs an elite team. Then we spit the bit and shoot ourselves in the foot.

Last yr 4 of our 5 losses game vs elite teams. Yeah I consider Pitt elite because they were much better than their record indicated.

The only truly decent teams we beat were the Cowboys and Ravens. final vs AZ was a joke. playoffs vs AZ was a chokefest.

What about the Eagles. they were in the Playoffs last year and we beat them in their own backyard. They are 2-0 other than when they played an elite team like GB.

Wait...I know your answer. If Vick da Great (who couldn't crack a starting lineup or even get many offers for a contract until we KO'd Kolb) had been in the game we would have lost right?

You are a typical cynic. Anything good that the Packers do is a result of the other team sucking, and anything bad we do is a result of us sucking.

Just think, if the 2 penalties on one kickoff return by Hester had been called we win that game....2 non calls in a game where the flag happy refs managed to pull out the hanky quite a bit.....strange indeed.

not true at all. However you seem to have that same look to blame everyone else like oh the refs didn't call a penalty..blah blah blah. I really didn't see anything to complain about on Hesters returns.

I hate Vick and had they prepared for Vick I don't think he'd have been nearly as effective.

I guess my gripe is I see the talent on this team, and the only thing stopping them from being great is themselves. I don't really see how you can look at the penalty numbers over the past 3 seasons and NOT see a problem. They are remarkably consistent. Now we are fighting a reputation for penalties and I believe that is a factor. we will get called for more nitpicky bullshit than what maybe the other team gets until we clean it up for real.

I have blamed the refs a lot lately, but I call it like I see it. When we lost to the Giants in the NFCC game the first thing I said was "well, we didn't deserve to be in the game. The refs kept it close".

I am starting to believe the NFL has gone the way of the NBA and the refs are either a) fucking awful or b) biased. Not sure which, but we have sure gotten hosed a lot the last 2 seasons. On the flip side we were on the plus side of the referees for about 10 years there when Brent was a big draw.