Cliff Christl: FRIDAY Camp Report, Aug. 4, 2006, 7:13 p.m.

[OKC PackerFan]

Brett gets a thumbs down.

Cliff Christl:
Packer Insider

FRIDAY, Aug. 4, 2006, 7:13 p.m.
Camp Report, Aug. 4

THUMBS UP

If there’s one position where the Packers can feel better about their depth now than when they started training camp eight days ago, it’s probably cornerback. Third-year men Ahmad Carroll and Jason Horton, and second-year man Mike Hawkins all seem to be improved over a year ago. They get beat here and there, but they’re seldom getting flat-out burned and they’ve been even more noticeable for making plays on the ball.

Let’s let Kurt Schottenheimer, secondary coach, give his assessment. “Ahmad is really becoming a good player,” he said. “He takes more reps than anybody and he’s competing all the time. Jason Horton is such a good athlete. He’s had some injuries, but you see him out here. He has excellent ball skills, very good anticipation, good instincts. He just needs to be consistent. I think he’s going to be a player like Al Harris in time. Mike Hawkins, we’ve been extremely pleased with, particularly the first three days of this camp and the last two. He’s getting his hands on balls. Technique getting better. You can tell he’s a kid who has a lot of confidence, but just lacks experience.”

A year ago, Hawkins was so raw, but such an exceptional athlete, it was almost like a freak show. Now, he’s starting to look like a football player. “We’re deep,” said Schottenheimer. And there might not be another position where depth is more important.

THUMBS DOWN

It’s maybe nothing to be alarmed about at this point. He’s working with new receivers and they don’t have their timing down pat. He also still makes some throws that might look routine for him, but that other quarterbacks couldn’t make. A prime example was a strike he threw down the middle to tight end Tory Humphrey in a team period Friday. He also hit rookie wide receiver Greg Jennings on a 40-yard strike in another team drill.

But Brett Favre hasn’t had one of those days yet where he’s been on fire and nothing hits the ground. And that’s unusual eight days into training camp. Friday might have been Favre’s best practice yet, so maybe this is an ill-timed thumbs down. He completed 7 of 9 in 11-on-11 and 9 of 14 in 7-on-7, but there were a fair share of short tosses to backs and tight ends that make those numbers somewhat misleading.

Here’s Favre’s stats in team and 7-on-7 periods for the entire camp: 114 completions in 211 attempts, or 54%, with nine interceptions. Favre’s lowest completion percentage in 14 years with the Packers is 57.3 in 1999. Is Favre in a sharper decline at age 36 than maybe most people think? Until he has one of those days where he wows everybody again on the practice field, it’s a question that begs to be asked.

INJURY REPORT

Guard William Whitticker (hamstring), cornerback Charles Woodson (hip) and Hawkins (knee) dropped out of practice late.

Cornerback Al Harris and tight end Zac Alcorn returned to practice.

Rookie wide receiver Leo Bookman, who missed five practices earlier, was out again with an ankle injury. Bubba Franks (knee), Chad Clifton (knee), Najeh Davenport (calf), Arliss Beach (head) and Patrick Dendy (ankle) remained sideline.

ODDS & ENDS

Punting from their own three-yard line with a slight breeze at their backs, Jon Ryan averaged 58.8 yards and B.J. Sander 50 yards on six punts each.

Despite coming out and getting extra work before practice catching punts from a Jugs machine, Cory Rodgers dropped two more and Greg Jennings also bungled two.

Rookie receiver Chris Francies made a nice catch of a high Aaron Rodgers’ pass on a slant pattern in seven-on-seven. … Backs Samkon Gado and A.J. Cooper both beat linebacker A.J. Hawk to make catches across the middle, also in seven-on-seven.

Rookie running back Ben Brown dropped another easy pass.

ON THIS DAY

Aug. 5, 1977 – The Packers announced the hiring of Pete Marasco as assistant director of player personnel. Marasco, 38, was scouting coordinator for the New York Jets for the past two years. Marasco and his brother, Carl, gained notoriety as two of the first draftniks, annually compiling the Marasco Ratings of the top college football prospects. Their list was published annually by Pro Football Weekly.

SCHEDULE SATURDAY

The Packers’ annual Family Night scrimmage will be held in Lambeau Field. The players will take the field at 6:30 p.m. and the scrimmage will start at 7:30. The event is sold out.

[BallHawk]

So is Christl taking training camp statistics seriously?

[PaCkFan_n_MD]

I really like carroll now. Next year I think him and woodson start.

[MadtownPacker]

NEXT YEAR???????

Carroll is gonna be starting sometime this season if not when the season starts.

[Bretsky]

only if it's by injury :wink:

[gbpackfan]

I like to read Chrisl's reports, but sometimes he bashes someone or some unit on one day and praises them the next day. People have good days and bad days, I'll wait to watch the games to make up my mind about who can play and who stinks.

[mraynrand]

MrAynRand camp notes:

SERIOUS WORRIES
Chad Clifton - you know, veteran O-linemen (and D-linemen to some degree) are notorious for having 'nagging injuries' that kep them out of camp. Some guys even 'retired' every year to get out of practicing in the stifling heat. But with a new coach and system, you kinda get the sense that Clifton would be out there getting his reps. With marginal tackle Barry out and serviceable tackle Klemm out (remember his fine work in the Carolina game last year), I get the shivers thinking about the instability at this spot. Junius Coston is working out here, I take it, but that sounds a little desperate. Is there a Wilkerson to be found on the NFL scrap heap by the highly effective Pro-personnel department?

Brett Favre - I don't care what people write abot Favre in camp. THere's no doubt in my mind that Favre is just a good 'ole southern boy with exceptional physical attributes for football and a Champion's drive to compete and win. But truth be told - he's not got a lot og grey matter in the brain case to spare. You can see Favre's eyes sort of glaze over when McCarthy starts talking technical, just like in those classic reels with Holmgren grilling Favre in the film room. Everyone knows in the back of their mind that Favre's skills must diminish at some point. If you're like me, you don't want to see it happen while he's still playing. But here's hoping that the problems Favre seems to be having in training camp are all of the "do I really have to go to school?" variety and not "I've lost the missile launcher arm" variety. I'm just a bit nervous that it might be the latter.

Charles Woodson - What if Carroll is better and beats out Woodson for starting cornerback? From my perspective, this would be great. Having Woodson as a nickle back and/or as a possibility for safety with an emerging Carroll would seem to be the absolute best thing that could happen. But could Woodson stomach it? Would he become a team cancer? Stay tuned.

[Deputy Nutz]

This is all getting to be a bit much. First it was the OTAs with who was there and who wasn't, how guys were performing in walk through practices.

Now we have reporters actually keeping a running stat on completed passes during 7 on 7 drills!

As fans and media I think we have all stepped outside reality. I am going back to my Star Wars Comic book for a while.

[the_idle_threat]

NEXT YEAR???????

Carroll is gonna be starting sometime this season if not when the season starts.


http://www.crack-pipes.com/crack-pipe.jpg

[Bretsky]

Hands down you always come up with awesome pics; do you have a 500GB Hard Drive with about 10,000 pictures stored for every occasion ?

[Scott Campbell]

Charles Woodson - What if Carroll is better and beats out Woodson for starting cornerback? From my perspective, this would be great. Having Woodson as a nickle back and/or as a possibility for safety with an emerging Carroll would seem to be the absolute best thing that could happen. But could Woodson stomach it? Would he become a team cancer? Stay tuned.

This raises an interesting question. If Woodson does get beat out, would we cut him with Horton and Hawkins looking this good. Charles didn't get much of a signing bonus, and we'd save a ton of money by cutting him before the season started. But what the heck would we do with it? Can you really carry that much money forward?

I look forward to all your replies. Especially Patler's.

[Scott Campbell]

Hands down you always come up with awesome pics; do you have a 500GB Hard Drive with about 10,000 pictures stored for every occasion ?

Google images.

[the_idle_threat]

Hands down you always come up with awesome pics; do you have a 500GB Hard Drive with about 10,000 pictures stored for every occasion ?

Naw ... all the pics on my hard drive are for a single purpose ... :mrgreen:

I just do Image searches on yahoo.

[mraynrand]

This raises an interesting question. If Woodson does get beat out, would we cut him with Horton and Hawkins looking this good. Charles didn't get much of a signing bonus, and we'd save a ton of money by cutting him before the season started. But what the heck would we do with it? Can you really carry that much money forward?

I look forward to all your replies. Especially Patler's.

I don't know the answer for sure, but I'm going to guess because if I'm wrong Patler will correct me in about five seconds with six paragraphs of detailed budget information. I anticipate a multi-paged, self-referential, custom-made capology Excel file.

Anyway, if Woodson is cut, his signing bonus will all count right away. That's my guess.

[Homer Jay]

I'm glad I'm not the only one who shook my head at the passing "stats" kept by Christl. Does he also keep receiving yards totals for the receivers? Seems to me like he's trying a bit too hard to find something to write.

[the_idle_threat]

This raises an interesting question. If Woodson does get beat out, would we cut him with Horton and Hawkins looking this good. Charles didn't get much of a signing bonus, and we'd save a ton of money by cutting him before the season started. But what the heck would we do with it? Can you really carry that much money forward?

I look forward to all your replies. Especially Patler's.

I don't know the answer for sure, but I'm going to guess because if I'm wrong Patler will correct me in about five seconds with six paragraphs of detailed budget information. I anticipate a multi-paged, self-referential, custom-made capology Excel file.

Anyway, if Woodson is cut, his signing bonus will all count right away. That's my guess.

I'm almost certian you are right that the signing bonus counts all at once. However, it's my understanding that we will be on the hook for nothing else. According to the following JSO article (http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=420529):


Woodson could get $10 million in first year

By TOM SILVERSTEIN
tsilverstein@journalsentinel.com
Posted: May 3, 2006

The seven-year contract free agent cornerback Charles Woodson signed with the Packers is worth $39.03 million and features first-year compensation of around $10 million.

Woodson received a $4 million signing bonus and a $4,356,250 roster bonus to go along with a $1.5 million base salary this season, according to a source with access to NFL Players Association salary data. Woodson will have to play in all 16 games to get the entire roster bonus, but he will still get around $4 million of it just by being on the team.

If Woodson plays in all 16 games this year he will net $9.9 million, which is approximately what he made last season as the Oakland Raiders’ franchise player. Woodson’s deal is worth $16.28 million over three years and $20.7 million over four, not counting yearly escalators that could increase the value of the deal based on Pro Bowl honors.

The Packers chose to structure the deal so that they absorb a good chunk of the salary cap responsibility this year and not as much in later years. In 2006, Woodson counts $6.7 million against the cap and in ‘07 only $3.48 million.

In addition to the signing and roster bonuses this year, Woodson has a roster bonus of $1, 337,500 due next year and roster bonuses of $337,500 due in each succeeding year. He also has a workout bonus of $53,080 in ’06 and workout bonuses of $100,000 in each succeeding year.

Woodson’s base salaries after 2006 are as follows: $1.25 million in ’07, $3.25 million in ’08, $4 million in ’09, $5 million in ’10, $5.5 million in ’11 and $6.5 million in ’12.


... Woodson's signing bonus is $4 million and his '06 cap number is $6.7 million, resulting in a $2.7 million savings to the 2006 cap if he fails to make the roster. Presumably, the roster bonuses vanish if he fails to make the roster.

If this is correct, then the Packers have nothing to lose by cutting Woodson if he flops big-time in TC. If he makes the final roster, however, the accelerated cap hit doubles overnight if we cut him in the first year.

Of course if I'm wrong, I'm about to get bitch-slapped by our good friend Patler. :mrgreen:

[LEWCWA]

You guys must really be bored! CW is not getting cut, and he is not takeing a seat behind the midget!! The midget will be a decent nickle corner this year!!! Maybe next year we can induct him into the Packer Hall!

[RashanGary]

Woodson will not be cut. They gave him 10 up front. He was supposed to earn that over 3 years. I hope he works hard for these last 3 years here. He strikes me as a bit of a lazy person but that is just a complete guess.

[woodbuck27]

This is all getting to be a bit much. First it was the OTAs with who was there and who wasn't, how guys were performing in walk through practices.

Now we have reporters actually keeping a running stat on completed passes during 7 on 7 drills!

As fans and media I think we have all stepped outside reality. I am going back to my Star Wars Comic book for a while.


Exactly Dr. Nutz.

Alot of Favre's picks are on pass's to WR's that couldn't pass the grade up here in the CFL. :mrgreen:

GO PACKERS !

[woodbuck27]

I'l toss this in here:

Though it hasn't been a major complaint, a couple of receivers said they've had a little trouble seeing the ball late at the night practices because of the temporary lights at Clarke Hinkle Field.

"They're not stadium lights. Stadium lights are high and light the whole stadium," receiver Donald Driver said.

"This has some dark spots. You can be running and think you can see the ball, but you really can't."

Driver and Marc Boerigter said they haven't had any drops because of the lighting, however.

"The angle of the lights are kind of at eye level and the corners are kind of dark by the end zone there," Boerigter said.

"You have to concentrate more on it. There's been times when you're out there and somebody breaks and the ball's on top of you. But it isn't a big deal."

It's the Lights! :mrgreen:

[RIPackerFan]

Didn't they say at the beginning of camp - all the recievers (except for Driver and Jennings) had the drops. I have to believe that, along with learning a new offence in the first week, is causing the "bad stats".

[MJZiggy]

Hmmm, the lights make it harder to see the ball so you have to concentrate really hard. This is a problem (for anyone but Christl) because...?

[Scott Campbell]

Woodson will not be cut. They gave him 10 up front. He was supposed to earn that over 3 years. I hope he works hard for these last 3 years here. He strikes me as a bit of a lazy person but that is just a complete guess.

They didn't give him 10 up front according to Silverstein. He got 4 up front. It'd be a lot easier to swallow hard and admit a mistake with only $4M to swallow this year, considering his roster bonus alone will account for the same hit to the cap. That is if he doesn't pan out.

Be assured that I hope he does pan out.

[PaCkFan_n_MD]

NEXT YEAR???????

Carroll is gonna be starting sometime this season if not when the season starts.

Sorry mad, but carroll is not better than woodson or harris. If theres no injury to woodson or harris, carroll is our nickel CB. Do u really think woodson or harris wouldn't become a TO if they were benched for carroll?

[Willard]

We finally get depth at CB that we have been lacking since the McKenzie defection and now some of you want to cut Charles Woodson?!?!? :shock:

Don't you realize how often NFL defenses need 3 CBs on the field at the same time? The third CB is extremely important to our pass defense. Last year we ranked in the top10 only against #1 receivers. We sucked against #2 and #3 receivers because Carroll struggled (until the end of the season), and we had no experience at #3.

What is wrong with you people? I swear you act like you are writing the damn checks out to Woodson yourself!

[Scott Campbell]

You lost me. Who wants to cut him?

The hypothetical question posed was CAN we cut him - IF he sucks. That doesn't mean anybody wants to cut him, or wants him to suck.

I think the only thing wrong with us people is your interpretation of what was written.

[HarveyWallbangers]

What I found funny is that Brett got a thumbs down on what may have been his best practice so far. It's like he was all set to give him the thumbs down no matter what he did.

[Willard]

You lost me. Who wants to cut him?

The hypothetical question posed was CAN we cut him - IF he sucks. That doesn't mean anybody wants to cut him, or wants him to suck.

I think the only thing wrong with us people is your interpretation of what was written.

OK, well then....thats better....I'm glad you came around to my way of thinking..... :oops: :wink:

[FritzDontBlitz]

What I found funny is that Brett got a thumbs down on what may have been his best practice so far. It's like he was all set to give him the thumbs down no matter what he did.

i thought i was the only one who noticed that....